Comments be like "this wouldn't have happened if you shifted properly." No kidding haha! A fellow misses *one* shift in 15 years of driving tons of different manual transmissions, and y'all tell me I'm clueless. 😂 Thinking it'll never happen to you is a bit arrogant; sometimes people make mistakes. Happy Friday everyone, enjoy your weekend!
These people have a case of inflated ego - remember guys, don't try to constantly prove yourselves on every little thing. Instead of acting like smartasses on every occasion possible, try to engage in conversation in a more chill and polite way with your fellow people, even if online.
Yep it is. If you try to do a money shift with that car you really have to force it in the gear. I think it's how they make make sure that car with smal engines like mine 0.8l NA don't get damaged by a money shift.
Been there done that. I was on track and money shifted my S2000 from the top of 3rd to second mid corner. Engine saw north of 11,500 RPM. I did a full inspection of the pistons and valve retainers afterwards and got lucky. The engine is still running strong to this day!
I built a b18 ek9 that the owner ended up doing that to once. Smoked a little afterwards, think it bounced a valve and damaged a stem seal but otherwise ran perfect. Hondas are good engines.
The classic Japanese street racer technique to avoid the money shift is to use a reverse grip on the shifter once you hit 3rd gear. You hook your shifting hand backwards by rotating it out (palm away from your body instead of facing it). That way if you accidentally shift to the wrong gear you'll go to 6th by accident instead of 2nd. Killing your lap time is no where near as bad as killing your wallet!
@@naksitanantalapochai4010 .... their gearboxes aren't backwards either. Wow they really just do it to be cool and it just works that way for us. I guess it would prevent losing a race from an accidental upshift but risk a money shift.
That's what I do and it really helps a lot. Also to not death grip the shifter because that will definitely make you mess up. Be loose and direct with it.
A slipper clutch is also a viable solution. Its a purely mechanical system used on motorbikes - when torque is the correct direction it acts as a normal clutch. But when torque goes the other way the clutch automatically (and rapidly) opens. The idea is to prevent rear wheel slip on corner entry as you downshift. It's considerably more of a problem on motorbikes, and the solution came long before electronic control for everything. Technically we aren't so worried about rear wheel slip, but back torque is what is destroying the engine so its simply a different purpose for the same action. Probably a relatively cheap solution with little development required to implement
good idea. but I wonder if implementing a system like that could backfire if the clutch were to spontaneously fail (no longer transfer power to the transmission and wheels). but I don't know. engineers have overcome some serious technical limitations before!
@@nup5 It's a pretty simple system. Very, very similar to that in a limited slip differential. Essentially just a ramp and some springs. Otherwise its an entirely conventional clutch with entirely predictable results. They've been in use for over a decade on production sports bikes now, and obviously longer than that for race bikes. I've one on my own bike built 2007. So its not like an untested or experimental technique, its going to be the most tested and likely most reliable way to solve the issue in my opinion.
@@CaliByGreg Theres a number of reasons it could be, but ultimately I think its just a matter of timing. When slipper clutches started to become popular on motorbikes the race cars were already using semi automatic gearboxes, complex ECUs, and electronic assists. So naturally that moves to the sports cars and renders a slipper clutch largely useless. I think most car manufacturers care more for performance than money shifts anyway, and adding a few hundred dollars to the price to eliminate a problem customers aren't thinking about isn't on their mind. Then when they did care to prevent it you already had all the electronic assists so it was an easy matter of adding a little code. Maybe in a different universe they transfer to cars. It would likely take a different clutch material, but sports cars already use a more grippy material to make the clutch smaller anyway. Flywheel wouldn't affect it at all. I wouldn't think the size of the clutch would make much difference. The massively higher torque from a car motor might, but there's a lot of different clutch materials able to provide more grip to counteract that. They're just typically not used as much as they're more "on or off" and thus harder to smoothly pull away from the lights with. Personally I found no difference after a few days of use but it sounds like older people find it harder to learn.
Bro, you are the goat. In a world where no one wants to take responsibility for anything, not only did you do this but you made a whole video explaining what you did and all the consequences and repercussions of it! MAD RESPECT FOR YOU!! All these clowns here acting like they never done this before are just keyboard warriors. Drive manual cars long enough and this happens!! I only drive a lowly Si and ive been there done that! Good stuff man!!
well, considering my car literally doesn't allow me to shift into first gear from any other gear unless im below 10 kph, i'd say i've never done it, and with higher gears it's pretty easy to feel the direction the stick is going in so I don't somehow accidentally shift into 2nd from 3rd.
You could analyze the audio frequencies to figure out the RPM reached by the engine. Should be relatively easy to eye-ball it looking at the spectrogram.
To all the commenters about "proper shifting." - s*it happens. We all probably stalled a manual transmission, we all have made some mistakes. He could've just disguised this video as another educational one, but he included his mistake and recovery, so be glad for his humility and cut him some slack.
Yes, the rev limiter works for only upshifting and/or full throttle conditions while in lower gears. I'm fairly sure that shifting to a lower gear by accident has happened to almost everyone who has been driving manual transmission cars for many years as I have.
I don't recall it ever happening to me, and I have many years in cars (roughly 60% manual, by milage) motorcycles (100% pedal shift, 0% auto) and large goods vehicles (100% manual, with splitters and range changers thrown in to make things more interesting). I have reached over a million miles on each of those, as I spent a large portion of my working life driving or riding for a living. I've never heard the term in the UK, but as we sit on the right and shift with our left hand, the tendency is to pull towards us so that may make it much rarer, along with the fact that automatic transmissions have historically been much less common here, so most drivers over about 40 never consider anything else and were taught manual shifting from the start.
@@phillee2814 I would think that shifting while driving work vehicles would not entail speed-shifting, which is typically when dangerous engine rev conditions would occur. (Unless your work vehicle is a race car)😏
@@davepaturno4290 Maintaining momentum oh hills is critical in goods vehicles, so fast shifting skills are a prerequisite. Getting it wrong can stall you out completely, and make you resort to a crawler gear which will make you a rolling roadblock and drink fuel like a thrsty camel. But I would not have done as much work driving and riding if I didn't enjoy it, so although that accounted for the vast majority of my milage, it did not exclude reacreational riding and driving - I only really mentioned it as explanation for the high milage I've done. So although none of my work vehicles were race cars/bikes/trucks, they were certainly not the only vehicles I drove/rode. Never seriously competitive, but had some fun, then moved sideways into race marshalling.
I’ve driven manual-transmission vehicles for almost 15 years and it finally happened to me during a spirited driving session on a mountain road. Luckily I recognized what was happening and immediately depressed the clutch before things got crazy. It happens …
I just did this in my brand new GTI. I was having a little fun but was nowhere near the redline, so I doubt a shift from 3rd into 2nd would have damaged the car. But it still freaked me out and thankfully I didn’t let the clutch in, realized my mistake like you did
@@n16161 especially if youre turning a bit and being pushed in the seat ive gone from 8000rpm in 4th to 3rd in an old vtec prelude 😂 and it shot to 10,000 rpm for half a second but i didnt let the clutch out all the way thankfully but it did jump up way over redline. Surprisingly nothing broke and still runs good for an old 1993 engine
coming off the freeway one day I shifted from 5th to 4th but actually hit 2nd. saw the tach hit 8500 before i put the clutch back in and thought the engine was toast because a heater hose chose that moment to blow and spray down the distributor causing a bad misfire...since the hose blew right at the connection, I just trimmed it back, dried out the distributor and was back on the road for $0!! Karma shined on me that day for sure!
Miss shift occurs because we are human. With that being said, you hit the nail on the head about getting lucky. Thank you for admitting to an error and teaching people about said error and how to car manufacturers try to avoid it from happening.
Manufacturers can implement fixes but one can also adjust technique. Palm faces left for 1-2, straight down for 3-4, palm facing right for 5-6. I also don't recommend gripping the shifter hard for 2-3 -- just straight ahead with bottom of palm and fingers straight back to avoid transferring lateral forces while turning. Seems to be effective for me even when hooning around in the twisties.
I absolutely appreciate your work, very few people out there are willing to explain it step-by-step, I think your channel is great, I have learned a substantial amount from you, Thank you
I did a similar thing in my Scion tC. Went from 3rd to 2nd at 7000rpm. I saw the tachometer go well past 9k. Seven out of 16 rocker arms flew out of position (I think this saved my bottom end). However a few of the rocker arms got caught between the cams and valves and ended up bending 3 valves. No valve to piston contact however. Slapped on a used head and she’s good as new now
Same thing in a RSX type -S in 2005 did like 11k rpm's. New valves and intake cam.
2 года назад+99
Re: Clutch by wire - I have recently read an article from an ex-employee of a car manufacturing supplier (think something like ZF) regarding clutch-by-wire. The TLDR of it was that it is indeed a better solution for multiple reasons (one of them being fuel economy as well), however it was put on ice because the benefits didn’t outweigh the costs (which weren’t too hight to begin with, but still it made the car slightly more expensive). If you would think this topic is interesting, I might try to get you in touch with the author of that article (I don’t know him, but he’s a fellow Czech, so maybe I’d be able to get hold of him).
@@MadScientist267 There's no torque converter, no planetary gearing, no clutch packs. It still has synchros, a direct drive train through the transmission with synchronizers and a clutch. Just is its a computer controlled manual.
@@matthewone7907 Mazda aswell iirc on their Mazda 2 mild hybrids. Allows the clutch to disengage automatically in order to freewheel when using cruise control, prompting the ECU to shut the engine down and restarting it with the integrated starter generator assist motor when the speed dips below the set speed.
I once tried to downshift to pass and went from 5th to 2nd (instead of 4th). When releasing the clutch felt like standing on the brake I pushed it back in. Took less than half a second, no damage done but I was really mad at myself.
If you drive a car with a manual transmission long enough, it will eventually happen to you. We're human and prone to making mistakes from time to time. The fact that you reacted properly and disengaged the clutch shows that you are in-tune with the car enough to handle it, so I wouldn't sweat it.
Did exactly this in my recently aquired NB Miata. It's my first manual car, and I was still learning and fooling around with downshifting. I'm more careful with shifting now. lol
Caught myself nearly shifting from 5th to 2nd on the highway. I was going to 4th. These things happen sometimes, luckily I'm so petrified of moneyshifting my daily I took a second look before even moving my left leg and went "OHHHH boy".
@@fruitygranulizer540 holy smokes you went on a journey to get from 5th to 2nd! I had an old Mazda Protege from 1996 that had absolutely trashed bushings - thing was vaguer than the essay prompts you get in college. You were guessing which gear was which, definitely managed to touch second a few times coming from 5th😂
I did kind of the reverse, overtaking a truck on a highway, was going back up to 5th again but hit the 3rd instead. That sudden braking and revving was a quick scare that I thankfully instinctively hit the clutch again to do it properly this time. No damage done as the reaction was quick enough, but lesson learned no doubt.
@@AdderoYuu I would say just pushed too much to the left, given 5th is on the far right. A habit to never do this (...with a properly tight shifter and no weird 7 gears or such) would be to just push back and let it drop to the middle
For me, auto rev matching has helped avoid a couple of money shifts... When you start to put in into the wrong gear, the engine will redline because it's trying to match the speed of the trans input shaft. If your paying attention and notice the high rev, you know not to let off the clutch because it'll break something.
Another type of money shift without fully shifting: At high speed downshift to 1st and not letting the clutch out. So far no harm done. But the primary shaft in the gearbox and the clutch disk will spin at crazy rpms like 5 times the redline.. 30k rpms or something like that. Clutch disk explodes and may rip the transmission housing. Case study: agricultural tractor goes uphill in 1st gear. Max speed in 1st gear is about 5km/h. The hill gets steeper and steeper until wheels slip on the ground. The operator presses the clutch and let it roll backwards (still in 1st gear, but clutch disengaged). The backward roll from the hill ended in 30-40km/h. The tractor split up at the bottom of the hill as the clutch disk (quite heavy in tractors) exploded and ripped apart the bell housing. Tractors many times don't have a chasis.. so the engine-transmission-rear axle is one rigid body bolted. Bolt the front axle to the front of the engine and bolt the cab on the engine-transmision-rear axle.. so if the engine and transimssion is split, the whole tractor splits in two! It is to be noted that the engine-transmission housings coupling is under a lot of stress from the weight of the tractor, unlike a truck/car where this coupling only support the gearbox weight an not the whole rear axle and all the weight of the vehicle.
Same happened to me during the test drive of a Skoda Octavia TDI, in 2004. The engine went up to 5500 approx and the emissions light was flashing like a Christmas Tree. Apparently the engine didn’t suffer permanent damage, despite these modern diesel cars are long stroke so the piston speed was really high… for an oil burner. Thank you for the quantitative explanation, really very nice.
One important observatuon is that the synchros make it harder to get in the wrong gear (because they have to spin up a lot). Whether it's enough to stop you depends on the transmission and how hard you're shifting. In most cars I've driven, downshifting to 1 at high rpm would take a lot of force or time.
In my experience I’ve only found that true for first gear. One can definitely money shift into second or third with little additional resistance. Definitely not from experience. Only suckers money shift. That’s why I drive a car with a cvt. Try money shifting that.
@@uhoh_bent2445 all transmissions will fail eventually even manual transmissions LOL CVTs are actually quite efficient they just aren’t as cool from a racing perspective
on a bike you need slipper clutch to prevent crash in corners. It is almost impossible to damage the engine by downshifting on a bike. Because of strong weight shift to front, rear wheel will slide every time. You can make slipper clutch on a car, but it is quite complex and expensive thing. Much simpler just electronically lock such possibility.
I love you. Most RUclipsrs would try to pretend this never happened. You make a video detailing precisely how you damaged someone else's car, technically. Just wonderful
I've been driving manuals since 1978. Yeah, I'm a gripper. I use a different hand position when shifting first to second. I have my thumb pointing up. When shifting third to fourth, my thumb is closer to horizontal. When shifting fifth to sixth, my thumb is down. This way, my palm does the work and naturally puts pressure to select the gear I want. It becomes second nature after a while. When you're hustling a car on a track, and trying to make quick shifts, it's easy to mess up. EE gets a pass from me for this one! He realized his error and got the clutch disengaged in time to save the engine. That's a fast reaction. There are two kinds of manual drivers; those who miss a shift on occasion, and those who lie about it.
I money-shifted my '95 Civic a few years back on I-5 going almost 70 MPH. THANKFULLY, I disengaged the clutch before fully releasing it. I'm sure it gave the rotating assembly a workout!!
Also when you are revving out the motor, giving it all the beans, the engine tends to torque over more than normal (especially if the motor mounts are a bit worn or old). This causes the shift linkage to go out of alignment slightly, making it easier to get the lever into the wrong gate. I did this once at the track (willow springs), and could tell something didn't feel quite right when grabbing forth gear coming into turn 7. Luckily, I was able to clutch super fast and keep the engine from zinging itself to the moon. Some cars were known to be easier to money shift, like the E36 M3, and earlier subaru STI.
This! Happened to me in a 318ti at Mid-America Motorplex (now called Raceway Park of the Midlands). I was in 3rd going to 4th and hit 2nd. I did the same as you, in fact I didn't even get the clutch all the way out before slamming the pedal back to the floor to prevent damage. It's not only the torque of the engine moves it on the motor mounts, but the g-forces in the corner also contribute to pulling everything to one side. In that corner in that car, a straight pull from 3rd would always go very smoothly right into 2nd. To make the 318ti shift in that corner at mid-america, I had to shift into "6th." Well, it would feel like I was shifting into 6th gear, but I was actually shifting into 4th under load and with some g-forces in the corner. The Scion FR-S I just sold had stiffer engine and transmission mounts to help prevent some of these issues and make it easier to shift in the corner under load.
@@mnntropy5615 Yep happened to me twice in my 2006 Miata. The engine mounts get a little soft and the engine and gearbox are in a slightly different spot than usual while cornering. The first time, I was upshifting from 2nd to 3rd and caught 1st, the wheels locked and I spun. I pushed the clutch back in as soon as it started spinning, so the RPM didn't exceed 7000. The second time was due to not filling enough transmission fluid. (Turns out my 5-speed likes 2.5 qts, not the recommended 2.2 qts.) I was downshifting from 4th to 3rd and caught 1st. It didn't quite go into gear, so I had slowed to a normal 1st gear speed by the time it popped in. I now have solid EDPM engine mounts.
Even before STI.... my 1990 Legacy RS was NOTORIOUS for being easy to money shift... That said they're also NOTORIOUS for having sloppier boxes than a $10 hooker
Yep, learned it on 6th gen camaros with drag racing. On launch, it binds and makes it very difficult to get into 2nd sometimes. Poly motor and trans mounts are a big help with it
Hey EE. Thanks for taking time to explain things like these. I have not driven a manual car for close to 10 years but have recently booked for a manual sports car which is expected to arrive next year. Been watching all sorts of videos since then to try and understand cars better and to refresh my memory on MTs, so thank you!
Exciting! My folks just got a manual car for the first time in about a decade, and are loving it! I also taught my girlfriend to drive stick this summer, and now she owns a stick car! It's really the way to go!
Recently started driving a manual car... Never really drove one daily and it's very nice, even in traffic😂... I learned how to drive with a manual transmission car but all my cars were automatic.
@@jasonandrews7355 I feel like it's got nothing to do with "which one is better" but more of switching things up. I've drove a manual all my life and I'm a die hard manual fan, but I recently drove an auto for the first time and I LOVED it, now I understand why people like autos. I just feel like there's a use for both.
You're probably the only person on earth who would derp a shift like this and, instead of pretending it never happened, make a video explaining what happened and what could happen. Bravo, sir. My synchros in 2nd grind enough to let me know I'm about to f*ck up. Weird to think a new car wouldn't do that. Did you SLAM it into gear? Didn't look like you were shifting hard enough to do that, but I don't know the new Z.
After I too experienced the dreaded "money shift" I did some research and there's a very simple shifting technique that helps to greatly reduce the odd's of it occurring. You want to backhand the 3-4 shift the same way you would a 5-6 shift as this mostly prevents any chance of misalignment, and even if there is some you're more likely to end up in 6th gear instead of 2nd like when you're pulling it towards you. This logic can be applied to other shifts allowing you to determine the "safest" way to grasp the shifter for each other gear selection(up or down)
@@Trinexx42 Yeah, me too. Btw, the natural plane of a manual is 3-N-4. For selecting 1 or 2 you have to pull the stick out of this plane, for selecting 5 or 6 you have to push the stick out of this plane.
Well, i did the same thing you explained in a friends clio rs and low and behold, 2-3-2 at the limiter in third, rip clutch and tranny and a solid hole in my pocket, the engine is still mad af though, and also he is on his 3rd gearbox as we speak, so i guess it was gonna happen, it was its destiny
He means you face your palms towards the passenger, on the 3 to 4 shift. On 1 to 2 shift, your palms is facing you. 2 to 3, still palms facing you. 3 to 4 turn hand upside down. 4 to 5 palm face u again. 5 to 6 turn hand upside down like 3 to 4. 6 to reverse use right leg.
@@Trinexx42 ...if you can find a copy of GRANDPRIX, watch how the driver holds his hand on the shift lever when shifting up or down. That's what he means
I almost money shifted my new WRX a couple years ago on the highway (going 6th to 5th at 80mph, hit 3rd instead). Caught the issue real quick when the car engine braked really hard. Probably not technically a money shift since 3rd will go up to around 80mph redline but still seemed really harsh on the engine and drivetrain. It also helped that I had already blipped the throttle for the downshift.
Lol shifting into right before redline or at redline is not money shifting. It’s not efficient, as you’ll use time to immediately upshift, but you were within the mechanical limitations of engine and drivetrain. Not a money shift.
@@pogtuber5146 isn’t “almost” money shifting just normal high rpm downshifting? If peak power is at or near redline are you “almost” money shifting every time you shift with peak performance in mind? I wouldn’t think so.
I was always taught by Dad to roll my hand on the side of the shift you don't want, to bias the shift towards your intended need. So in my RHD cars, left hand is shifting, first to second would be with the palm facing away from me towards the pax side of the car keeping the shift biased correctly. Second to third roll over so palm faces me and as you push past the gate the stick moves naturally toward my side and forward. That way the worst you can do is just go straight to 5th and less likely back to first. Nothing is perfect but as a gear changing habit it helps to mitigate the chances of the 'money shift'.
Interesting that you mention this tip. I adapted my shifting to do the same thing in my 2011 Subaru STI. Short shifter and gates are close together, easy to miss shift. Fortunately for me, the easiest mis shift is running through 5th and then missing 6th and going back to 4th when pulling the shift back. The good news is the car is already going pretty fast by 5,000 RPM in 5th so I’m usually going for 6th before that point….not so bad accidentally going into 4th. After one or two such instances I found it more predictable to roll my palm to left side of shifter (LH drive car) when pulling back from 5th into 6th. Works like a charm every time.
I was taught something similar for a regular 5-speed H pattern gearbox, you envolve the shifter with your hand like a "spoon" with the palm on the opposite side of the knob and pull it TOWARDS YOU first then down for second gear, grab the shifter without your thumb finger from the front/top side and pull down for fourth (no palm), third gear goes with your palm on the back of the shifter knob and fifth gear is palm and thumb pushing towards the passenger side
I almost did it some months ago, when I was taking off to take a long, fast left turn to merge into a lane. The car rolled slightly to the right in the left turn so _I slightly leaned to the left to compensate. This made my H shift pattern muscle memory to offset a bit to the left compared where the shifter's pattern actually is_ and then when shifting 3rd to 4th, it got back to 2nd. Luckily, having approached the end of the turn for the merge, I shifted earlier and the very moment I started to let the clucth go, I instantly felt the massive jerk building up so I instinctively kicked the clutch back in so I got away with a peak rev of 5000 according to the tach. OMG it was a pucker factor 9 moment.
Was going to say the same thing. Seems like after all these years, they still aren’t going to fix the manual shifter vibration. This actually looks worse than the older gens, that shifter’s shaking violently
If it’s shaking a lot it’s because of stiff bushing which improve shifter precision but do allow more vibration to pass thru. Soft shifter bushings would reduce movement and vibration but cause a sloppier feeling shifter.
The 1-2-1 money shift seems to be the worst well I’ve seen the videos of the Honda’s on the drag strip exploding after that so it seems the worst for the Honda’s
I've also seen Hondas survive money shifts. Drag strip Hondas are probably revving really high to begin with, money shifting 1-2-1 at 8000+ rpm to begin with is asking for trouble lol
Honestly I feel like you'd have to bash the living crap out of your shifter for your trans to accept first instead of third. At least, with my tr6060 I feel like that would require a lot of force.
@@androiduberalles I have an older Honda and it doesn't let me shift from 3rd to 2nd over 40 mph and that wouldn't even be over revving it. Would be around 5k rpm
Most cars physically lock out first gear if you're already moving. You basically have to force it in to get it to shift back into first. The cars I've driven all usually played nice if the speed was low enough (
The reason money shifts from 3rd happen is because of the way people hold the knob baseball bat style which biomechanically makes your hand pull in towards your body when you pull back. Backhand it (or at least palm it) into 4th and you won't accidentally go into 2nd. Also palm it up into 3rd and backhand it into 5th and 6th. When you release that death grip on your shift knob, and you'll be able to shift properly.
Interesting video, something you alluded to, but didn't specifically mention is the possibility of breaking the con-rod due to the extreme forces! About 15 yrs ago I mis-shifted from 5th down to 2nd (instead of 4th!) at about 75 mph in my '97 BMW 323i, I saw (and heard) my engine scream right off the RPM scale (7k) to about 7300 RPM!! It's redline was 6300 RPM! I wasn't quick enough on the clutch :(, after I dipped it I listened, and all seemed good amazingly! But a few months later, gently cruising at 75 mph again (in 5th!), their was a (surprisingly faint) 'boom' and a sound like gravel being thrown under the car, followed by the back end weaving slightly, smoke pouring out the back like the red arrows!, the dash lighting up like an xmas tree and a knocking noise. I pulled over and I could see a big hole in the side of the block :(, a rod had let go. Later when I removed the engine I could see a rod had snapped in 1/2, and the remaining bit had flailed around and cut through the block from about 1" below the head and through most of the sump! That was an expensive mistake :'( I just hope you didn't rev your(?) Nissan too high!
Assimilator1, I'm pretty sure it was a press car so he won't have that anxiety wondering when his engine will suddenly fail catastrophically. But you make a good point that just because everything seems fine after a money shift, there might be hidden damage that could show up later when you least expect it.
When I took my car on a race track I discovered that you can shift down gears too early before a corner. It's actually quite tricky to time it, but watching that needle go above redline was terrifying so I quickly learnt my lesson.
I've never made a true money shift where something breaks, but I've certainly mis-shifted on occasion. Mostly, hitting 3rd when I wanted 5th or 4th when I wanted 6th. That's because of the spring that wants to return the shifter to neutral between 3rd & 4th; if I don't apply enough force to move the shifter to the right it ends up staying in the middle. Honestly, I don't think trying to electronically block the wrong gear in a manual is a good idea. First of all, part of the point of a manual is that you have to actually think about driving; if you want a computer to keep you out of trouble, buy an automatic. Secondly, it would certainly increase the cost of a manual car. And third, it would invariably fail at some point and prevent you from being able to shift at all. I see zero chance the manufacturers will be putting any money into manual transmission designs, seeing as they reduce the number of cars still available with them almost every year. Plus, it's all moot as the industry switches to all electric vehicles, with no shifting of any kind.
my idea is using a stepper motor and PWM and logic for the neutral springs aka the extra set so if it's going to over rev it adds weight/feel so it won't 💯 stop 🛑 you but it will make it vary clumsy to forcefully $$-shift ( same for drag-mode aka gated shifting so it's really hard to miss as 6-speeds are known to be harder to launch 👌 mcfarland/lero has it down pat 👍 ) the rest of the time is making butter smooth and or allows my to have a mode for the wife for a automated manual transmission same with the clutch 😉 and or flappy paddle's at the track if i get tired/lazybones working on doing that to a TR6060/TR6070 but making my c7 7-speed-trans shift is lower on my priority's in my 60's BBM/hemi charger
Good breakdown as always. I’ve done the same thing although I was at a lower speed. After doing it, I began to place my hand with my palm on the inside of the shifter nob to ensure I didn’t go from third to second and it has worked well. I typically do that only for the 3-4 and 5-6 shifts. My hand is in an opposing grip for all other shifts.
My wrx shifter is kinda weird, there's no real "H" - you can push the shifter left and right while it's already in a gear. So I found the safest way to go to 5th is to first push it all the way to the right, while it's in 4th still, then up.
I could have sworn there was some sort of lockout for 1st. Gear on our golf and up when going too fast. At less going straight into 1st. After cruising in 5th. When coming to a stop was almost impossible. Going into 2nd. In-between made everything much easier.
Some cars probably have a 1st gear lock out, however usually it's simply hard to shift into first at speed because the gear ratio is so short. The jump in ratio is much bigger than between other gears on road cars. That means a lot of force on the shifter is required to get the synchros to match speed, and the gear to actually engage.
There's another tech that would help: slipper/assist clutches. Somewhat common on motorcycles for totally different reasons, but it would slip the clutch more in a situation like this.
But just thinking, you could have it be able to have it retroactive... like you can change gated transmissions top plate with a few screws to change the feel, this just adds a wire or two and a thing attached to it.
I remember back when the 7th gen Celica GTS came out, there were numerous instances on the forums of money shifting the car from 3rd to 2nd. It was likely due to the shift gates on that car being quite narrow (I also felt they were a bit narrow than other 6 speeds) and one had to he more mindful while shifting.
Never drove one of those (they're cool though), but ouch. If I remember correctly, the first few years that engine had a problem with the variable-lift system at really high RPM, they eventually lowered the redline or something... So money shift sounds like RIP 2ZZ-GE
When I had just started riding my first just-bought bike, I did something like that too, I was going full RPM in 4th shift and since I was going on a highway completely alone I was thinking in other stuff, just had my mind in another place (common novice mistake) and I intended to shift to 5th... but... I moved the lever down LOL obviously I almost fell from the bike, it shakes and almost lost control and thought myself "oh no... I ruined my brand new bike". Fortunately nothing mayor happened to the engine, it kept running fine, and the lesson was definitely learned: if you're driving, you're driving, not thinking.
Is it possible that synchronizers could be setup to prevent you from choosing the wrong gear? A few times I attempted the money shift, the synchroniser couldn't keep up and the trans. just whined and wouldn't allow me to engage the gear. I wasn't on a track and realized immediately what was happening and selected the proper gear.
the issue with the z is the auto rev match feature brings the engine up to the correct speed as soon as you go near the gate, it's not once the car is actually in gear. Did this in my 370 once before and its the same system
The slipper clutch, developed by Honda, has been in use for a decade or two, and limits the amount of "bite" in the clutch in just the direction of rear wheel driving engine. It uses a multi-plate wet clutch in which not all the plates drive in both directions, the others being only able to drive forwards - so excessive engine braking causes clutch slip. That is a mechanical system which has proven to be highly effective and reliable. Thus, it is entirely mechanical. I don't beliieve manual transmissions will go away before internal combustion engines do - i.e. electric vehicles will be universal first, and they rarely need to have more than one gear.
With GM's skipshift, you could bypass it by simply increasing the engine rpms before shifting. There was also a bypass device available in the aftermarket.
@@bubbleman2002 GM did that so that the owners wouldn't be subject to the gas guzzler tax. Many Corvette owners bought an inexpensive bypass but I didn't feel like I needed it because when I wanted to aggressively accelerate, the skipshift was inactivated, anyway.
@@Steamrick I did but it was never disclosed if any severe damage was done to the z. Clips of engine damage is from humble mechanics money shift incident a year or so ago. First comment was just a joke
everyone dogging him for missing one shift in 15 years, wants to act like it'll never happen to them. A saying in motorsports is also true for the public roads. "There are only two types of drivers. Those that _have_ crashed, and those that _will_ crash." Same thing applies to mis-shifting a manual transmission.
Been there done that.... 2004 325xi. Redline 3rd into what I believed to be 4th... was actually 2nd. All wheel drive held traction and clutch grabbed and held. Do not know how many rpm but it bent a few valves. Zero compression in all six. Cost me a bundle, thus the name, money shift. Expensive lesson.
Screw tube again no notification. I have 91 Thunderbird SC, have had 9 of these cars but one in particular is very easy to do this, five speed M5R2...4th to 3rd...🤨...
I almost money shifted my Starion when I bought it. Learned how to drive stick in the parking lot that day when I bought it and was getting on the highway to drive it the 200 miles home. I went from 2nd to 3rd, back to 2nd again. luckily the engine only jumped up to 6100rpm's, which was 600rpm's passed redline, but the redline of it was so damn low because it had weak valve springs and just didn't make power passed 4800rpms. Not because it couldn't handle spinning that fast. Wasn't even a concern of piston's touching the valves because it had a Hemi head with dished pistons and those hit TDC about 3/16's of an inch into the bore. Funnily enough, I don't think I've ever moneyshifted again in the 8 years since I picked up that relic and that includes all the other cars and truck since.
The idea of driving a manual car with the potential for money shifting is scary. I drive a semi truck, and money shifting is impossible with their non synchronized transmissions. The amount of times I 100% would have money shifted is frightening. Forgetting where my range selector is (down is 1-5th gear. up is 6-10th gear. This lever allows the same shifting pattern to use two different sets of gears) some times, or just plainly missing the opening for one gear for another. Bravo to you good sir.
I saw this caption under a screen capture on MSN /Jalopnik which cracked me up. "Graying man in red hoodie pontificates in front of a whiteboard." From one graying pontificator to another great video!
I did a money hold back in the day. Entered a freeway at 60mph in a 2nd gen RX-7. I realized I was blocked out by several semi’s traveling nose to tail. I just kept the pedal down and honed in on the lead truck. I drove well pasted the shift buzzer, when I shifted to third I looked down to see the rpm’s DROP to redline! Gotta love rotaries!
The old manuals on Stock cars were spring loaded so once you were in third you could just slap it back to fourth. The spring held it over so it couldn't go into second unless you forced it. Works great when you only need to get to high gear.
Nearly all modern cars have that (i.e all manual transmissions made since the mid-1990s); most are sprung between 3rd and 4th; it does depend on the weight of that springing however, as to how easy it is to accidentally find 2nd instead of 4th. Some are sprung between 5th and 6th on later 2000's cars, but commonly 3rd-4th alignment is where the lever spring will always return to when out of gear.
When I learned to drive manual, for whatever reason I've always turned my palm out (towards the passenger seat) and it's definitely stopped me from money shifting because in order to pull into 2nd/1st it's a really deliberate motion with my arm rotated.
I halfway money shifted my car today, and took to youtube to dwell on my mistake. Thankfully, I caught it as I was letting out on the clutch and didn't go through with the shift. Still trying to figure out in my head how I did that....
Years ago when I had my learner's permit and my dad was teaching me to drive, I accidentally shifted from 3rd into 2nd when accelerating onto the freeway. My dad had a diesel Toyota Fortuner at the time. I will never forget the moment I lifted my foot off the clutch. The thing violently locked all 4 wheels and the motor sounded like it wanted to climb out the front. Fortunately I realised pretty quickly what was going on and depressed the clutch again.
It's honestly nice to see someone explain this correctly and easy to understand for those who have no mechanical experience. As well as those like me who do have mechanical experience but none of the deep technical data knowledge. And knowledge is power. So here I am getting better at my craft. 🖖
Did one of these in my 03 Cobra, did exactly what you did, at redline went from 3rd to 2nd. The tach went way beyond the redline and I've never heard the supercharger scream that loud! Didn't hurt anything and I shifted into 4th and continued to finish accelerating!
I did a money shift in my Renault Megane rs. Went from the top of third into second on a freeway on ramp. Heard the engine scream immediately kicked the clutch in and slammed it into fourth. Decided to keep going until 200kmh and came off. No issues no engine lights damage or anything. This was around 40,000km ago.
I was taught a simple technique to prevent this from happening. Divide the shifter pattern in half. 1st, 2nd gears, you shift with your grip facing towards you(drivers door). 3rd, 4th, you shift gripping the shifter from the top(overhand fist 👊) straight up & down (going to 3rd pushes your fist into the dash. 5th, 6th, you shift with your grip facing the passenger door. This technique uses your natural hand motions to limit it’s affect on the shift patterns. Granted accidents will happen but this really reduces it.
@@phillm156 your advice applies to left-hand-drive vehicles. The directions are reversed (relative to the driver's position) in a right-hand-drive vehicle. In fact, it probably makes money shifting less likely as it requires a pushing motion rather than a pulling motion
Man you really love your craft it is impressive id mutter under my breathe and hope no one saw but you take the opportunity to share and teach on something so many would love to know more about. Love the video man you can probably outshine 99% of us driving knowing the mechanics and honestly most engineers can visualize the problems but can’t explain them which makes you upper tier for sure.
I have a 2002 sentra se-r spec v. I've "money shifted" on accident, and fortunately it has some kind of protection to keep it from causing serious damage. Maybe I was just fast to put it into neutral and avoid damage, but nothing seems to have suffered from it. You only do it once. After that you learn to be SURE you're in the right gear.
Then, sirs, I have the moniest shift. I was driving my Ford Fiesta down the A3(M) in Hampshire, England. I pulled out to overtake when somebody paused for me to do so, shifted down into 4th and accelerated hard. I then block shifted into 6th. Except... I don't have a 6th, I don't own my Focus anymore, in driving a 5 speed. At 80 miles an hour, I have just shifted into Reverse. The clutch is down hard, in a million to one chance I've got it in reverse without needing synchro. If I hadn't noticed, I suspect the gear box would have voiced it's displeasure by separating from the car. Whatever happened, I doubt I would have survived. So that was fun.
Did this in my SRT-10 Ram not too long after I got it. It was basically like hitting the brakes and the tac pegged on the rev limiter. I grabbed the clutch really quick. It was a very unpleasant experience. Thankfully it didn’t cause any damage. Part of the problem was I bought it in 2017, it was an 05 with 2700 miles and it had the original transmission fluid in it. Put some Royal Purple in it and that was that.
I did an accidental 4->2 after two long days on the road. Found out there really was an rpm limiter. And, like one of Mr. Bond's martinis, VERY much "shaken, not stirred".
If manual transmission are on their way out.... Prices of old manual cars will skyrocket. Thank goodness for this new z keeping the enthusiasm alive. Especially because in the US you could always get any car cheaper in a manual. I have a 17 year old bmw and I still love it more than almost any other car I've ever driven. Only ever changed the clutch 1 time in 14 years of ownership and a bonus it only caught on fire once! Lol.
As an experienced driver it is easy to think a moneyshift is easy to avoid. However, in teaching my teenage son to drive my mazda with m6 transmission, he has accidentally shifted from 5th into 4th multiple times. Not performance driving so nowhere near redline, so no damage, but an obvious error trap that we can generally, but not always, avoid through practice and experience.
This smart dude wasn’t that smart thinking his shifting skills were on par, but what he’s really smart at is making a very detailed video on what his mistake was and it’s complexities within. He will make more money from this one video than what that new engine would cost. Well done sir, we’ll done.
2 questions: 1. What would be the easiest of these solutions to implement aftermarket? Maybe some sort of skipshift-style system for preventing you from going into wrong gears, based on OBD ECU monitoring or something? 2. Would the potential for damage be significantly less on something that uses the (Koenigsegg) Freevalve system, because it can't overwhelm the springs?
Similar thing happened to one of my family members. They accidentally downshifted from 5th to 2nd on a Toyota diesel engine while going at 100 KPH (60 MPH). The engine briefly saw 5 500 RPM but they immediately put the clutch in and saved the engine. It happens to everyone who is driving a manual car, at least once :D
Comments be like "this wouldn't have happened if you shifted properly." No kidding haha! A fellow misses *one* shift in 15 years of driving tons of different manual transmissions, and y'all tell me I'm clueless. 😂 Thinking it'll never happen to you is a bit arrogant; sometimes people make mistakes. Happy Friday everyone, enjoy your weekend!
This proves it... clueless. LOL
I've made mistakes in the past. I'll likely make mistakes in the future. I feel ya. 🤷♂
These people have a case of inflated ego - remember guys, don't try to constantly prove yourselves on every little thing.
Instead of acting like smartasses on every occasion possible, try to engage in conversation in a more chill and polite way with your fellow people, even if online.
The commenters have also probably never raced around a track. Glad you got out of it scot free Jason.
Yep it is. If you try to do a money shift with that car you really have to force it in the gear. I think it's how they make make sure that car with smal engines like mine 0.8l NA don't get damaged by a money shift.
The average person after money shifting: cries
Engineering Explained after money shifting: "So let's talk about what's going on here."
I was going to like this, but it’s at 69 likes. Nice!
i noticed i was the 70th like then unliked
just in case if there's a damage to the engine, this video will cover some of the cost to repair it 😂
@@haydenwadsworth7575 i was gonna like it but it has 244 likes. No more likes is needed
@@aceburgers8801 liked now because it’s not 69 anymore 😕
Been there done that. I was on track and money shifted my S2000 from the top of 3rd to second mid corner. Engine saw north of 11,500 RPM. I did a full inspection of the pistons and valve retainers afterwards and got lucky. The engine is still running strong to this day!
well, that engine is made for super high rpms and if there's one company from which i expect the engines to survive a money shift is Honda.
that's gotta be the only engine that could survive that lol
You hit a super secret second V-Tec at that RPM
Honda's secret bonus RPM dlc
I built a b18 ek9 that the owner ended up doing that to once. Smoked a little afterwards, think it bounced a valve and damaged a stem seal but otherwise ran perfect. Hondas are good engines.
The classic Japanese street racer technique to avoid the money shift is to use a reverse grip on the shifter once you hit 3rd gear. You hook your shifting hand backwards by rotating it out (palm away from your body instead of facing it). That way if you accidentally shift to the wrong gear you'll go to 6th by accident instead of 2nd. Killing your lap time is no where near as bad as killing your wallet!
But the steering wheel is on the right for cars in japan, isn't it?
@@naksitanantalapochai4010 .... their gearboxes aren't backwards either. Wow they really just do it to be cool and it just works that way for us. I guess it would prevent losing a race from an accidental upshift but risk a money shift.
That's what I've always done. I never though it was anything that special, I've never missed a 3rd - 4th gear shift.
That's what I do and it really helps a lot. Also to not death grip the shifter because that will definitely make you mess up. Be loose and direct with it.
time to try this on my 5-speed honda! *accidentally misses 4th gear from 3rd and shifts into reverse*
Not only did you openly own up to a mistake, but you teach us what and why it happened. Amazing!
Man’s trying to make the money to pay Nissan back for a new engine and gearbox! 🤣
@@rikkiseddoaye 🤷🏾♂️, you got to what you got to do 😂
@@rikkiseddodid you watch the video? He did not damage his engine. The shown engine is from another guy.
Takes a lot humility for showing us your mistake. Thanks EE!
he's profiting of it, no humility... he's gaining and promoting herself
@@six8810 Let me see you do a video on your high dollar mistake!
He's putting up the video to get the money to pay for it.
@@six8810 Are you sure you know what you 're talking about here?
@@boywonderrr71 well that guy doesn’t have 3miilion subscribers and isn’t making 8-10k per video to cover his high bill
I money-shifted to 10500rpm in my old RX8. Absolutely nothing happened, owing to the absence of valves! Trackday continued...
Ha, amazing!
Haha dorito spin fast
I guess you can't really money-shift a rotary. Haha
@@kiefershanks4172 owning a rotary is a money shift in itself 🤔
@@RETMTM under rated comment 😂
>”what kind of damage can you expect “
Me : Emotional Damage!
Man card took a ding... but that's just the voices in my head
* Aggressively throws slipper at the floor *
A slipper clutch is also a viable solution. Its a purely mechanical system used on motorbikes - when torque is the correct direction it acts as a normal clutch. But when torque goes the other way the clutch automatically (and rapidly) opens. The idea is to prevent rear wheel slip on corner entry as you downshift. It's considerably more of a problem on motorbikes, and the solution came long before electronic control for everything. Technically we aren't so worried about rear wheel slip, but back torque is what is destroying the engine so its simply a different purpose for the same action. Probably a relatively cheap solution with little development required to implement
good idea. but I wonder if implementing a system like that could backfire if the clutch were to spontaneously fail (no longer transfer power to the transmission and wheels). but I don't know. engineers have overcome some serious technical limitations before!
@@nup5 It's a pretty simple system. Very, very similar to that in a limited slip differential. Essentially just a ramp and some springs. Otherwise its an entirely conventional clutch with entirely predictable results. They've been in use for over a decade on production sports bikes now, and obviously longer than that for race bikes. I've one on my own bike built 2007. So its not like an untested or experimental technique, its going to be the most tested and likely most reliable way to solve the issue in my opinion.
@@olivialambert4124 ahhh. yeah I'm out of my league here, thank you for informing me!
@@olivialambert4124 I've always wondered why slipper clutch doesn't exist on cars. Is it due to bigger clutches and flywheels?
@@CaliByGreg Theres a number of reasons it could be, but ultimately I think its just a matter of timing. When slipper clutches started to become popular on motorbikes the race cars were already using semi automatic gearboxes, complex ECUs, and electronic assists. So naturally that moves to the sports cars and renders a slipper clutch largely useless. I think most car manufacturers care more for performance than money shifts anyway, and adding a few hundred dollars to the price to eliminate a problem customers aren't thinking about isn't on their mind. Then when they did care to prevent it you already had all the electronic assists so it was an easy matter of adding a little code.
Maybe in a different universe they transfer to cars. It would likely take a different clutch material, but sports cars already use a more grippy material to make the clutch smaller anyway.
Flywheel wouldn't affect it at all. I wouldn't think the size of the clutch would make much difference. The massively higher torque from a car motor might, but there's a lot of different clutch materials able to provide more grip to counteract that. They're just typically not used as much as they're more "on or off" and thus harder to smoothly pull away from the lights with. Personally I found no difference after a few days of use but it sounds like older people find it harder to learn.
Bro, you are the goat. In a world where no one wants to take responsibility for anything, not only did you do this but you made a whole video explaining what you did and all the consequences and repercussions of it! MAD RESPECT FOR YOU!! All these clowns here acting like they never done this before are just keyboard warriors. Drive manual cars long enough and this happens!! I only drive a lowly Si and ive been there done that! Good stuff man!!
well, considering my car literally doesn't allow me to shift into first gear from any other gear unless im below 10 kph, i'd say i've never done it, and with higher gears it's pretty easy to feel the direction the stick is going in so I don't somehow accidentally shift into 2nd from 3rd.
@@dubl33_27 Well, I've only driven automatics and I've never money shifted 😎
You could analyze the audio frequencies to figure out the RPM reached by the engine. Should be relatively easy to eye-ball it looking at the spectrogram.
Admittedly, I love this idea! Not planning on following thru though haha.
@@EngineeringExplained c'mon buy a 400$ scrapper then scrap it when you're done 😂
By ear my guess is 10k (RIP engine)
@@AruEsse except it's a 6 cyl, not a 4 cyl, so the sound would naturally be higher pitched for a lower RPM. I worked it out above to about 8400 RPM.
I checked it an it went briefly to 7900 rpm (using the third harmonic at 395Hz)
To all the commenters about "proper shifting." - s*it happens. We all probably stalled a manual transmission, we all have made some mistakes.
He could've just disguised this video as another educational one, but he included his mistake and recovery, so be glad for his humility and cut him some slack.
No i've never stalled an engine... never driven manual :)
Yup. If you've been driving a manual transmission for any length of time, you've done this.
@@ThexXxXxOLOxXxXx a friend of mine stalled an automatic car once 😳
Haters gonna hate.
@@ThexXxXxOLOxXxXx Lmao I managed to stall an automatic a week ago
Yes, the rev limiter works for only upshifting and/or full throttle conditions while in lower gears. I'm fairly sure that shifting to a lower gear by accident has happened to almost everyone who has been driving manual transmission cars for many years as I have.
I can safely say this only happened to me once on my entire lifetime, but I wasn't racing so no damage occurred
I don't recall it ever happening to me, and I have many years in cars (roughly 60% manual, by milage) motorcycles (100% pedal shift, 0% auto) and large goods vehicles (100% manual, with splitters and range changers thrown in to make things more interesting). I have reached over a million miles on each of those, as I spent a large portion of my working life driving or riding for a living. I've never heard the term in the UK, but as we sit on the right and shift with our left hand, the tendency is to pull towards us so that may make it much rarer, along with the fact that automatic transmissions have historically been much less common here, so most drivers over about 40 never consider anything else and were taught manual shifting from the start.
It’s almost happened while downshifting but I’ve always caught it before I let the clutch out
@@phillee2814 I would think that shifting while driving work vehicles would not entail speed-shifting, which is typically when dangerous engine rev conditions would occur. (Unless your work vehicle is a race car)😏
@@davepaturno4290 Maintaining momentum oh hills is critical in goods vehicles, so fast shifting skills are a prerequisite. Getting it wrong can stall you out completely, and make you resort to a crawler gear which will make you a rolling roadblock and drink fuel like a thrsty camel.
But I would not have done as much work driving and riding if I didn't enjoy it, so although that accounted for the vast majority of my milage, it did not exclude reacreational riding and driving - I only really mentioned it as explanation for the high milage I've done. So although none of my work vehicles were race cars/bikes/trucks, they were certainly not the only vehicles I drove/rode. Never seriously competitive, but had some fun, then moved sideways into race marshalling.
I’ve driven manual-transmission vehicles for almost 15 years and it finally happened to me during a spirited driving session on a mountain road. Luckily I recognized what was happening and immediately depressed the clutch before things got crazy. It happens …
What was the outcome in terms of the the ending and transmission condition afterwards?
I just did this in my brand new GTI. I was having a little fun but was nowhere near the redline, so I doubt a shift from 3rd into 2nd would have damaged the car. But it still freaked me out and thankfully I didn’t let the clutch in, realized my mistake like you did
@@n16161 especially if youre turning a bit and being pushed in the seat ive gone from 8000rpm in 4th to 3rd in an old vtec prelude 😂 and it shot to 10,000 rpm for half a second but i didnt let the clutch out all the way thankfully but it did jump up way over redline. Surprisingly nothing broke and still runs good for an old 1993 engine
@@repingers9777
"10,000 RPM" 😂
@@CadillacDriver h22a literally built like an f1 engine wish it was fast as one 🤣
coming off the freeway one day I shifted from 5th to 4th but actually hit 2nd. saw the tach hit 8500 before i put the clutch back in and thought the engine was toast because a heater hose chose that moment to blow and spray down the distributor causing a bad misfire...since the hose blew right at the connection, I just trimmed it back, dried out the distributor and was back on the road for $0!! Karma shined on me that day for sure!
Miss shift occurs because we are human. With that being said, you hit the nail on the head about getting lucky. Thank you for admitting to an error and teaching people about said error and how to car manufacturers try to avoid it from happening.
Manufacturers can implement fixes but one can also adjust technique. Palm faces left for 1-2, straight down for 3-4, palm facing right for 5-6. I also don't recommend gripping the shifter hard for 2-3 -- just straight ahead with bottom of palm and fingers straight back to avoid transferring lateral forces while turning. Seems to be effective for me even when hooning around in the twisties.
"Clutch by wire" might be the worst phrase I've ever heard.
What's potentially coming is disturbing! ruclips.net/video/YZR3FM2ENMM/видео.html
"Wire by wire" - all old-school wires are eliminated and everything is a computer
They could integrate it into the voice assistant. Hey Siri, let out the clutch!
I absolutely appreciate your work, very few people out there are willing to explain it step-by-step, I think your channel is great, I have learned a substantial amount from you,
Thank you
Thanks for watching Michael!
No you haven't Michael lol. You've learned stuff that requires experience and either you or this ding dong have any of that
@@ClaytonYatescarenthusiast
Thank you for the complement, you are probably right, my 33 years of wrenching mean nothing, God Bless
@@ClaytonYatescarenthusiast cope.
I did a similar thing in my Scion tC. Went from 3rd to 2nd at 7000rpm. I saw the tachometer go well past 9k. Seven out of 16 rocker arms flew out of position (I think this saved my bottom end). However a few of the rocker arms got caught between the cams and valves and ended up bending 3 valves. No valve to piston contact however. Slapped on a used head and she’s good as new now
Ayyy
Same thing in a RSX type -S in 2005 did like 11k rpm's. New valves and intake cam.
Re: Clutch by wire - I have recently read an article from an ex-employee of a car manufacturing supplier (think something like ZF) regarding clutch-by-wire. The TLDR of it was that it is indeed a better solution for multiple reasons (one of them being fuel economy as well), however it was put on ice because the benefits didn’t outweigh the costs (which weren’t too hight to begin with, but still it made the car slightly more expensive). If you would think this topic is interesting, I might try to get you in touch with the author of that article (I don’t know him, but he’s a fellow Czech, so maybe I’d be able to get hold of him).
actually, Hyundai already uses this type of clutch-by-wire in their iMT manual transmission cars
Dual clutch transmissions such as in the GT500 basically use this, but do away with the clutch pedal completely.
@@dundonrl That's no longer a manual
@@MadScientist267 There's no torque converter, no planetary gearing, no clutch packs. It still has synchros, a direct drive train through the transmission with synchronizers and a clutch. Just is its a computer controlled manual.
@@matthewone7907 Mazda aswell iirc on their Mazda 2 mild hybrids. Allows the clutch to disengage automatically in order to freewheel when using cruise control, prompting the ECU to shut the engine down and restarting it with the integrated starter generator assist motor when the speed dips below the set speed.
These videos with formulas are your best content. Facts - conjecture = Good content 👍
I once tried to downshift to pass and went from 5th to 2nd (instead of 4th). When releasing the clutch felt like standing on the brake I pushed it back in. Took less than half a second, no damage done but I was really mad at myself.
I did this myself when test driving my weekend car, over two years ago and that car has given me nothing but smiles since!
If you drive a car with a manual transmission long enough, it will eventually happen to you. We're human and prone to making mistakes from time to time. The fact that you reacted properly and disengaged the clutch shows that you are in-tune with the car enough to handle it, so I wouldn't sweat it.
I did exactly the same a decade ago and i'm still scared to pass a car on a one lane road
Haha I just wrote something similar.
Did exactly this in my recently aquired NB Miata. It's my first manual car, and I was still learning and fooling around with downshifting. I'm more careful with shifting now. lol
Caught myself nearly shifting from 5th to 2nd on the highway. I was going to 4th. These things happen sometimes, luckily I'm so petrified of moneyshifting my daily I took a second look before even moving my left leg and went "OHHHH boy".
5th to 2nd would have been a disaster lol!
@@fruitygranulizer540 holy smokes you went on a journey to get from 5th to 2nd! I had an old Mazda Protege from 1996 that had absolutely trashed bushings - thing was vaguer than the essay prompts you get in college. You were guessing which gear was which, definitely managed to touch second a few times coming from 5th😂
If your 2nd goes to 60mph and you're doing 60 in 5th then it's not so bad
I did kind of the reverse, overtaking a truck on a highway, was going back up to 5th again but hit the 3rd instead. That sudden braking and revving was a quick scare that I thankfully instinctively hit the clutch again to do it properly this time. No damage done as the reaction was quick enough, but lesson learned no doubt.
@@AdderoYuu I would say just pushed too much to the left, given 5th is on the far right. A habit to never do this (...with a properly tight shifter and no weird 7 gears or such) would be to just push back and let it drop to the middle
For me, auto rev matching has helped avoid a couple of money shifts... When you start to put in into the wrong gear, the engine will redline because it's trying to match the speed of the trans input shaft. If your paying attention and notice the high rev, you know not to let off the clutch because it'll break something.
Another type of money shift without fully shifting:
At high speed downshift to 1st and not letting the clutch out. So far no harm done. But the primary shaft in the gearbox and the clutch disk will spin at crazy rpms like 5 times the redline.. 30k rpms or something like that. Clutch disk explodes and may rip the transmission housing.
Case study: agricultural tractor goes uphill in 1st gear. Max speed in 1st gear is about 5km/h. The hill gets steeper and steeper until wheels slip on the ground. The operator presses the clutch and let it roll backwards (still in 1st gear, but clutch disengaged). The backward roll from the hill ended in 30-40km/h. The tractor split up at the bottom of the hill as the clutch disk (quite heavy in tractors) exploded and ripped apart the bell housing. Tractors many times don't have a chasis.. so the engine-transmission-rear axle is one rigid body bolted. Bolt the front axle to the front of the engine and bolt the cab on the engine-transmision-rear axle.. so if the engine and transimssion is split, the whole tractor splits in two!
It is to be noted that the engine-transmission housings coupling is under a lot of stress from the weight of the tractor, unlike a truck/car where this coupling only support the gearbox weight an not the whole rear axle and all the weight of the vehicle.
Same happened to me during the test drive of a Skoda Octavia TDI, in 2004. The engine went up to 5500 approx and the emissions light was flashing like a Christmas Tree. Apparently the engine didn’t suffer permanent damage, despite these modern diesel cars are long stroke so the piston speed was really high… for an oil burner. Thank you for the quantitative explanation, really very nice.
One important observatuon is that the synchros make it harder to get in the wrong gear (because they have to spin up a lot). Whether it's enough to stop you depends on the transmission and how hard you're shifting. In most cars I've driven, downshifting to 1 at high rpm would take a lot of force or time.
In my experience I’ve only found that true for first gear. One can definitely money shift into second or third with little additional resistance. Definitely not from experience. Only suckers money shift. That’s why I drive a car with a cvt. Try money shifting that.
@@danielwatson5595 How is replacing your belt?🤣
@@danielwatson5595 CVTs are absolute garbage. Have fun with that.
Edit: Also, you can _totally_ money shift a CVT.
@@uhoh_bent2445 all transmissions will fail eventually even manual transmissions LOL CVTs are actually quite efficient they just aren’t as cool from a racing perspective
@@danielwatson5595 lol.
Cvt is known for the money noshift.
In motorcycles you can have anti hopping clutch with partialy slides when you drop too many gears down, preventing your engine from damage.
Slipper clutch?
i wonder if slipper clutch (or similar mechanism) could exist in cars where single plate clutch is the norm
on a bike you need slipper clutch to prevent crash in corners. It is almost impossible to damage the engine by downshifting on a bike. Because of strong weight shift to front, rear wheel will slide every time. You can make slipper clutch on a car, but it is quite complex and expensive thing. Much simpler just electronically lock such possibility.
yea, came to comment that a money shift is quite spicy on a motorcycle without a slipper clutch!
Oooh, I like that!
I love you. Most RUclipsrs would try to pretend this never happened. You make a video detailing precisely how you damaged someone else's car, technically. Just wonderful
I've been driving manuals since 1978. Yeah, I'm a gripper. I use a different hand position when shifting first to second. I have my thumb pointing up. When shifting third to fourth, my thumb is closer to horizontal. When shifting fifth to sixth, my thumb is down. This way, my palm does the work and naturally puts pressure to select the gear I want. It becomes second nature after a while. When you're hustling a car on a track, and trying to make quick shifts, it's easy to mess up. EE gets a pass from me for this one! He realized his error and got the clutch disengaged in time to save the engine. That's a fast reaction. There are two kinds of manual drivers; those who miss a shift on occasion, and those who lie about it.
Takes a brave man to let others learn from his mistakes! Love the video.
I money-shifted my '95 Civic a few years back on I-5 going almost 70 MPH. THANKFULLY, I disengaged the clutch before fully releasing it. I'm sure it gave the rotating assembly a workout!!
That's an interference engine. I bet a valve scraped some carbon off a piston. lol.
What type of engine is in the 2020 civic?
Also when you are revving out the motor, giving it all the beans, the engine tends to torque over more than normal (especially if the motor mounts are a bit worn or old). This causes the shift linkage to go out of alignment slightly, making it easier to get the lever into the wrong gate. I did this once at the track (willow springs), and could tell something didn't feel quite right when grabbing forth gear coming into turn 7. Luckily, I was able to clutch super fast and keep the engine from zinging itself to the moon. Some cars were known to be easier to money shift, like the E36 M3, and earlier subaru STI.
This! Happened to me in a 318ti at Mid-America Motorplex (now called Raceway Park of the Midlands). I was in 3rd going to 4th and hit 2nd. I did the same as you, in fact I didn't even get the clutch all the way out before slamming the pedal back to the floor to prevent damage. It's not only the torque of the engine moves it on the motor mounts, but the g-forces in the corner also contribute to pulling everything to one side. In that corner in that car, a straight pull from 3rd would always go very smoothly right into 2nd. To make the 318ti shift in that corner at mid-america, I had to shift into "6th." Well, it would feel like I was shifting into 6th gear, but I was actually shifting into 4th under load and with some g-forces in the corner. The Scion FR-S I just sold had stiffer engine and transmission mounts to help prevent some of these issues and make it easier to shift in the corner under load.
@@mnntropy5615 Yep happened to me twice in my 2006 Miata. The engine mounts get a little soft and the engine and gearbox are in a slightly different spot than usual while cornering. The first time, I was upshifting from 2nd to 3rd and caught 1st, the wheels locked and I spun. I pushed the clutch back in as soon as it started spinning, so the RPM didn't exceed 7000. The second time was due to not filling enough transmission fluid. (Turns out my 5-speed likes 2.5 qts, not the recommended 2.2 qts.) I was downshifting from 4th to 3rd and caught 1st. It didn't quite go into gear, so I had slowed to a normal 1st gear speed by the time it popped in. I now have solid EDPM engine mounts.
Don't forget the Honda
Even before STI.... my 1990 Legacy RS was NOTORIOUS for being easy to money shift...
That said they're also NOTORIOUS for having sloppier boxes than a $10 hooker
Yep, learned it on 6th gen camaros with drag racing. On launch, it binds and makes it very difficult to get into 2nd sometimes. Poly motor and trans mounts are a big help with it
Hey EE. Thanks for taking time to explain things like these.
I have not driven a manual car for close to 10 years but have recently booked for a manual sports car which is expected to arrive next year. Been watching all sorts of videos since then to try and understand cars better and to refresh my memory on MTs, so thank you!
Exciting! My folks just got a manual car for the first time in about a decade, and are loving it! I also taught my girlfriend to drive stick this summer, and now she owns a stick car! It's really the way to go!
Recently started driving a manual car... Never really drove one daily and it's very nice, even in traffic😂... I learned how to drive with a manual transmission car but all my cars were automatic.
@@jasonandrews7355 I feel like it's got nothing to do with "which one is better" but more of switching things up. I've drove a manual all my life and I'm a die hard manual fan, but I recently drove an auto for the first time and I LOVED it, now I understand why people like autos. I just feel like there's a use for both.
You're probably the only person on earth who would derp a shift like this and, instead of pretending it never happened, make a video explaining what happened and what could happen. Bravo, sir.
My synchros in 2nd grind enough to let me know I'm about to f*ck up. Weird to think a new car wouldn't do that. Did you SLAM it into gear? Didn't look like you were shifting hard enough to do that, but I don't know the new Z.
After I too experienced the dreaded "money shift" I did some research and there's a very simple shifting technique that helps to greatly reduce the odd's of it occurring. You want to backhand the 3-4 shift the same way you would a 5-6 shift as this mostly prevents any chance of misalignment, and even if there is some you're more likely to end up in 6th gear instead of 2nd like when you're pulling it towards you. This logic can be applied to other shifts allowing you to determine the "safest" way to grasp the shifter for each other gear selection(up or down)
Wait backhand? I always learned you were supposed to use your palm.
@@Trinexx42 Yeah, me too. Btw, the natural plane of a manual is 3-N-4. For selecting 1 or 2 you have to pull the stick out of this plane, for selecting 5 or 6 you have to push the stick out of this plane.
Well, i did the same thing you explained in a friends clio rs and low and behold, 2-3-2 at the limiter in third, rip clutch and tranny and a solid hole in my pocket, the engine is still mad af though, and also he is on his 3rd gearbox as we speak, so i guess it was gonna happen, it was its destiny
He means you face your palms towards the passenger, on the 3 to 4 shift. On 1 to 2 shift, your palms is facing you. 2 to 3, still palms facing you. 3 to 4 turn hand upside down. 4 to 5 palm face u again. 5 to 6 turn hand upside down like 3 to 4. 6 to reverse use right leg.
@@Trinexx42 ...if you can find a copy of GRANDPRIX, watch how the driver holds his hand on the shift lever when shifting up or down. That's what he means
I almost money shifted my new WRX a couple years ago on the highway (going 6th to 5th at 80mph, hit 3rd instead). Caught the issue real quick when the car engine braked really hard. Probably not technically a money shift since 3rd will go up to around 80mph redline but still seemed really harsh on the engine and drivetrain. It also helped that I had already blipped the throttle for the downshift.
Lol shifting into right before redline or at redline is not money shifting. It’s not efficient, as you’ll use time to immediately upshift, but you were within the mechanical limitations of engine and drivetrain. Not a money shift.
@@danielwatson5595 Yeah note I said "almost". Obviously I would need to have been going more like 90-100mph to make it destructive.
Don't worry, it will randomly throw a rod whilst doing 55 in 6th on the way back from the wendys. It's a Subaru after all.
@@thegibbonisreal lol no doubt
@@pogtuber5146 isn’t “almost” money shifting just normal high rpm downshifting? If peak power is at or near redline are you “almost” money shifting every time you shift with peak performance in mind? I wouldn’t think so.
I was always taught by Dad to roll my hand on the side of the shift you don't want, to bias the shift towards your intended need. So in my RHD cars, left hand is shifting, first to second would be with the palm facing away from me towards the pax side of the car keeping the shift biased correctly. Second to third roll over so palm faces me and as you push past the gate the stick moves naturally toward my side and forward. That way the worst you can do is just go straight to 5th and less likely back to first. Nothing is perfect but as a gear changing habit it helps to mitigate the chances of the 'money shift'.
Interesting that you mention this tip. I adapted my shifting to do the same thing in my 2011 Subaru STI. Short shifter and gates are close together, easy to miss shift. Fortunately for me, the easiest mis shift is running through 5th and then missing 6th and going back to 4th when pulling the shift back. The good news is the car is already going pretty fast by 5,000 RPM in 5th so I’m usually going for 6th before that point….not so bad accidentally going into 4th. After one or two such instances I found it more predictable to roll my palm to left side of shifter (LH drive car) when pulling back from 5th into 6th. Works like a charm every time.
I was taught something similar for a regular 5-speed H pattern gearbox, you envolve the shifter with your hand like a "spoon" with the palm on the opposite side of the knob and pull it TOWARDS YOU first then down for second gear, grab the shifter without your thumb finger from the front/top side and pull down for fourth (no palm), third gear goes with your palm on the back of the shifter knob and fifth gear is palm and thumb pushing towards the passenger side
Did this exact shift in my 2009 370z. Was a “DOH!” Moment for sure. Never any problems. Solid car.
I almost did it some months ago, when I was taking off to take a long, fast left turn to merge into a lane. The car rolled slightly to the right in the left turn so _I slightly leaned to the left to compensate. This made my H shift pattern muscle memory to offset a bit to the left compared where the shifter's pattern actually is_ and then when shifting 3rd to 4th, it got back to 2nd. Luckily, having approached the end of the turn for the merge, I shifted earlier and the very moment I started to let the clucth go, I instantly felt the massive jerk building up so I instinctively kicked the clutch back in so I got away with a peak rev of 5000 according to the tach. OMG it was a pucker factor 9 moment.
0:08 holy mother of soft bushings! They must be made of jelly! Would definitely contribute to a money shift right there lmao
that’s the old z
Was going to say the same thing. Seems like after all these years, they still aren’t going to fix the manual shifter vibration. This actually looks worse than the older gens, that shifter’s shaking violently
If it’s shaking a lot it’s because of stiff bushing which improve shifter precision but do allow more vibration to pass thru. Soft shifter bushings would reduce movement and vibration but cause a sloppier feeling shifter.
The 1-2-1 money shift seems to be the worst well I’ve seen the videos of the Honda’s on the drag strip exploding after that so it seems the worst for the Honda’s
I've also seen Hondas survive money shifts. Drag strip Hondas are probably revving really high to begin with, money shifting 1-2-1 at 8000+ rpm to begin with is asking for trouble lol
Honestly I feel like you'd have to bash the living crap out of your shifter for your trans to accept first instead of third. At least, with my tr6060 I feel like that would require a lot of force.
@@androiduberalles I have an older Honda and it doesn't let me shift from 3rd to 2nd over 40 mph and that wouldn't even be over revving it. Would be around 5k rpm
Most cars physically lock out first gear if you're already moving. You basically have to force it in to get it to shift back into first. The cars I've driven all usually played nice if the speed was low enough (
@@LevitiCUZ Honda transmission locks downshifting in speed unless you use double clutch or rev match before shifts.
I actually thought it was called money shifting because it tears up your gearbox, which makes it sound like there's coins in your trans 🤣
Thought it was money shifting cause it tears up your account balance, shifting your money into a _brand new_ used transmission!
It's probably called that because you're likely to see your money disappear when the money light comes on
xD I love this
Judging from the title I was thinking “oh noo is this the start of Engineering Explained turning into the TechRax of car RUclips channels”
The reason money shifts from 3rd happen is because of the way people hold the knob baseball bat style which biomechanically makes your hand pull in towards your body when you pull back. Backhand it (or at least palm it) into 4th and you won't accidentally go into 2nd.
Also palm it up into 3rd and backhand it into 5th and 6th. When you release that death grip on your shift knob, and you'll be able to shift properly.
Interesting video, something you alluded to, but didn't specifically mention is the possibility of breaking the con-rod due to the extreme forces!
About 15 yrs ago I mis-shifted from 5th down to 2nd (instead of 4th!) at about 75 mph in my '97 BMW 323i, I saw (and heard) my engine scream right off the RPM scale (7k) to about 7300 RPM!! It's redline was 6300 RPM! I wasn't quick enough on the clutch :(, after I dipped it I listened, and all seemed good amazingly!
But a few months later, gently cruising at 75 mph again (in 5th!), their was a (surprisingly faint) 'boom' and a sound like gravel being thrown under the car, followed by the back end weaving slightly, smoke pouring out the back like the red arrows!, the dash lighting up like an xmas tree and a knocking noise. I pulled over and I could see a big hole in the side of the block :(, a rod had let go.
Later when I removed the engine I could see a rod had snapped in 1/2, and the remaining bit had flailed around and cut through the block from about 1" below the head and through most of the sump! That was an expensive mistake :'(
I just hope you didn't rev your(?) Nissan too high!
Assimilator1, I'm pretty sure it was a press car so he won't have that anxiety wondering when his engine will suddenly fail catastrophically. But you make a good point that just because everything seems fine after a money shift, there might be hidden damage that could show up later when you least expect it.
When I took my car on a race track I discovered that you can shift down gears too early before a corner. It's actually quite tricky to time it, but watching that needle go above redline was terrifying so I quickly learnt my lesson.
I've never made a true money shift where something breaks, but I've certainly mis-shifted on occasion. Mostly, hitting 3rd when I wanted 5th or 4th when I wanted 6th. That's because of the spring that wants to return the shifter to neutral between 3rd & 4th; if I don't apply enough force to move the shifter to the right it ends up staying in the middle. Honestly, I don't think trying to electronically block the wrong gear in a manual is a good idea. First of all, part of the point of a manual is that you have to actually think about driving; if you want a computer to keep you out of trouble, buy an automatic. Secondly, it would certainly increase the cost of a manual car. And third, it would invariably fail at some point and prevent you from being able to shift at all.
I see zero chance the manufacturers will be putting any money into manual transmission designs, seeing as they reduce the number of cars still available with them almost every year. Plus, it's all moot as the industry switches to all electric vehicles, with no shifting of any kind.
my idea is using a stepper motor and PWM and logic for the neutral springs aka the extra set so if it's going to over rev it adds weight/feel so it won't 💯 stop 🛑 you but it will make it vary clumsy to forcefully $$-shift ( same for drag-mode aka gated shifting so it's really hard to miss as 6-speeds are known to be harder to launch 👌 mcfarland/lero has it down pat 👍 ) the rest of the time is making butter smooth and or allows my to have a mode for the wife for a automated manual transmission same with the clutch 😉 and or flappy paddle's at the track if i get tired/lazybones
working on doing that to a TR6060/TR6070 but making my c7 7-speed-trans shift is lower on my priority's in my 60's BBM/hemi charger
Good breakdown as always. I’ve done the same thing although I was at a lower speed. After doing it, I began to place my hand with my palm on the inside of the shifter nob to ensure I didn’t go from third to second and it has worked well. I typically do that only for the 3-4 and 5-6 shifts. My hand is in an opposing grip for all other shifts.
My wrx shifter is kinda weird, there's no real "H" - you can push the shifter left and right while it's already in a gear. So I found the safest way to go to 5th is to first push it all the way to the right, while it's in 4th still, then up.
Thank you sir for your videos!
I could have sworn there was some sort of lockout for 1st. Gear on our golf and up when going too fast. At less going straight into 1st. After cruising in 5th. When coming to a stop was almost impossible. Going into 2nd. In-between made everything much easier.
Can confirm, my Up! has a first gear lockout.
Some cars probably have a 1st gear lock out, however usually it's simply hard to shift into first at speed because the gear ratio is so short. The jump in ratio is much bigger than between other gears on road cars. That means a lot of force on the shifter is required to get the synchros to match speed, and the gear to actually engage.
I have a golf r, it doesn't let me go into first above like 20 mph
There's another tech that would help: slipper/assist clutches. Somewhat common on motorcycles for totally different reasons, but it would slip the clutch more in a situation like this.
Yeah I wonder why cars don't have them. I'm guessing it's because bikes are smaller and don't typically need to last as long as cars.
@@pleasedontwatchthese9593 their clutches last longer bruh😂. their wet clutches so it helps with wear a ton!
Amazing you are confident enough to admit a mistake and turn it into a learning lesson. Great video and enjoyed the deep dive of the topic!
Thanks Jason! Been watching your vids for almost 10 years now. Appreciate all the educational info you share with us. Keep it up! 👏🏻
I don’t know a whole lot about cars, but I was able to easily understand this concept, thank you🙏
Just like a Reverse block gate, you could have a gear block gate by Rpm, and no down shifts can be made.
Yep, mentioned at the end. :)
But just thinking, you could have it be able to have it retroactive... like you can change gated transmissions top plate with a few screws to change the feel, this just adds a wire or two and a thing attached to it.
Glad you're OK 👍, you're one of the very few that can not only explain what you experience/know, but can also help articulate it with great drawings!
Agreed I try to understand how all this works but a lot of it is tough for me to grasp.
I remember back when the 7th gen Celica GTS came out, there were numerous instances on the forums of money shifting the car from 3rd to 2nd. It was likely due to the shift gates on that car being quite narrow (I also felt they were a bit narrow than other 6 speeds) and one had to he more mindful while shifting.
Never drove one of those (they're cool though), but ouch. If I remember correctly, the first few years that engine had a problem with the variable-lift system at really high RPM, they eventually lowered the redline or something... So money shift sounds like RIP 2ZZ-GE
My subaru hit 7000 rpm during a 3rd to 4th money shift, redline at 6000. Didn't miss a beat. Sounded cool
When I had just started riding my first just-bought bike, I did something like that too, I was going full RPM in 4th shift and since I was going on a highway completely alone I was thinking in other stuff, just had my mind in another place (common novice mistake) and I intended to shift to 5th... but... I moved the lever down LOL obviously I almost fell from the bike, it shakes and almost lost control and thought myself "oh no... I ruined my brand new bike". Fortunately nothing mayor happened to the engine, it kept running fine, and the lesson was definitely learned: if you're driving, you're driving, not thinking.
Is it possible that synchronizers could be setup to prevent you from choosing the wrong gear? A few times I attempted the money shift, the synchroniser couldn't keep up and the trans. just whined and wouldn't allow me to engage the gear. I wasn't on a track and realized immediately what was happening and selected the proper gear.
A system that would kick the shifter into neutral if the speec exceeds the expected speed a gear can handle would be neat.
the issue with the z is the auto rev match feature brings the engine up to the correct speed as soon as you go near the gate, it's not once the car is actually in gear. Did this in my 370 once before and its the same system
@@kernoleary1394 I very much doubt any auto rev system would rev the engine over the redline.
@@molozful it indeed does, like I mentioned happened to me with this exact rev matching system
The slipper clutch, developed by Honda, has been in use for a decade or two, and limits the amount of "bite" in the clutch in just the direction of rear wheel driving engine.
It uses a multi-plate wet clutch in which not all the plates drive in both directions, the others being only able to drive forwards - so excessive engine braking causes clutch slip.
That is a mechanical system which has proven to be highly effective and reliable. Thus, it is entirely mechanical.
I don't beliieve manual transmissions will go away before internal combustion engines do - i.e. electric vehicles will be universal first, and they rarely need to have more than one gear.
With GM's skipshift, you could bypass it by simply increasing the engine rpms before shifting. There was also a bypass device available in the aftermarket.
Why would you buy a manual transmission car that doesn't let you pick what gear you want? It's like buying a lawnmower but it only cuts wet grass.
@@bubbleman2002 GM did that so that the owners wouldn't be subject to the gas guzzler tax. Many Corvette owners bought an inexpensive bypass but I didn't feel like I needed it because when I wanted to aggressively accelerate, the skipshift was inactivated, anyway.
Consistently one the best RUclips channels. Very detailed but well-explained concepts.
gear lockout is a godsend. helped me A LOT in my early days of autocross
The real question is how damage did you to that z with your demonstration of that beautiful money shift? 🤫
watch video
@@Steamrick I did but it was never disclosed if any severe damage was done to the z. Clips of engine damage is from humble mechanics money shift incident a year or so ago. First comment was just a joke
@@jghost910 He outright says that he got away with it
I pulled my diesel dually down to first one time, I swear chunks of pavement were flying out amongst the tire smoke.
everyone dogging him for missing one shift in 15 years, wants to act like it'll never happen to them.
A saying in motorsports is also true for the public roads. "There are only two types of drivers. Those that _have_ crashed, and those that _will_ crash."
Same thing applies to mis-shifting a manual transmission.
This is by far one of the most informative and overall well put together channels, kudos.
Been there done that.... 2004 325xi. Redline 3rd into what I believed to be 4th... was actually 2nd. All wheel drive held traction and clutch grabbed and held. Do not know how many rpm but it bent a few valves. Zero compression in all six. Cost me a bundle, thus the name, money shift. Expensive lesson.
Screw tube again no notification.
I have 91 Thunderbird SC, have had 9 of these cars but one in particular is very easy to do this, five speed M5R2...4th to 3rd...🤨...
I almost money shifted my Starion when I bought it. Learned how to drive stick in the parking lot that day when I bought it and was getting on the highway to drive it the 200 miles home. I went from 2nd to 3rd, back to 2nd again. luckily the engine only jumped up to 6100rpm's, which was 600rpm's passed redline, but the redline of it was so damn low because it had weak valve springs and just didn't make power passed 4800rpms. Not because it couldn't handle spinning that fast. Wasn't even a concern of piston's touching the valves because it had a Hemi head with dished pistons and those hit TDC about 3/16's of an inch into the bore. Funnily enough, I don't think I've ever moneyshifted again in the 8 years since I picked up that relic and that includes all the other cars and truck since.
The idea of driving a manual car with the potential for money shifting is scary. I drive a semi truck, and money shifting is impossible with their non synchronized transmissions. The amount of times I 100% would have money shifted is frightening. Forgetting where my range selector is (down is 1-5th gear. up is 6-10th gear. This lever allows the same shifting pattern to use two different sets of gears) some times, or just plainly missing the opening for one gear for another.
Bravo to you good sir.
I saw this caption under a screen capture on MSN /Jalopnik which cracked me up. "Graying man in red hoodie pontificates in front of a whiteboard." From one graying pontificator to another great video!
I did a money hold back in the day. Entered a freeway at 60mph in a 2nd gen RX-7. I realized I was blocked out by several semi’s traveling nose to tail. I just kept the pedal down and honed in on the lead truck. I drove well pasted the shift buzzer, when I shifted to third I looked down to see the rpm’s DROP to redline! Gotta love rotaries!
I remember doing that on purpose on an old E200 diesel Mercedes, daily. It never blew up, never had a problem, it was fun!
The old manuals on Stock cars were spring loaded so once you were in third you could just slap it back to fourth. The spring held it over so it couldn't go into second unless you forced it. Works great when you only need to get to high gear.
Nearly all modern cars have that (i.e all manual transmissions made since the mid-1990s); most are sprung between 3rd and 4th; it does depend on the weight of that springing however, as to how easy it is to accidentally find 2nd instead of 4th.
Some are sprung between 5th and 6th on later 2000's cars, but commonly 3rd-4th alignment is where the lever spring will always return to when out of gear.
Man, That's how we all should work on our mistakes!!! Decompose, write it down, analyse, statement!!
When I learned to drive manual, for whatever reason I've always turned my palm out (towards the passenger seat) and it's definitely stopped me from money shifting because in order to pull into 2nd/1st it's a really deliberate motion with my arm rotated.
I did this in a turbo subaru. Revved sky-high. 16 years later, not a single problem.
I halfway money shifted my car today, and took to youtube to dwell on my mistake. Thankfully, I caught it as I was letting out on the clutch and didn't go through with the shift. Still trying to figure out in my head how I did that....
Years ago when I had my learner's permit and my dad was teaching me to drive, I accidentally shifted from 3rd into 2nd when accelerating onto the freeway.
My dad had a diesel Toyota Fortuner at the time. I will never forget the moment I lifted my foot off the clutch. The thing violently locked all 4 wheels and the motor sounded like it wanted to climb out the front.
Fortunately I realised pretty quickly what was going on and depressed the clutch again.
It's honestly nice to see someone explain this correctly and easy to understand for those who have no mechanical experience. As well as those like me who do have mechanical experience but none of the deep technical data knowledge. And knowledge is power. So here I am getting better at my craft. 🖖
Did one of these in my 03 Cobra, did exactly what you did, at redline went from 3rd to 2nd. The tach went way beyond the redline and I've never heard the supercharger scream that loud! Didn't hurt anything and I shifted into 4th and continued to finish accelerating!
i love you dude! You did 1 mistake that lasted 4 seconds and made it a 10 minute video
I did a money shift in my Renault Megane rs. Went from the top of third into second on a freeway on ramp. Heard the engine scream immediately kicked the clutch in and slammed it into fourth. Decided to keep going until 200kmh and came off. No issues no engine lights damage or anything. This was around 40,000km ago.
I was taught a simple technique to prevent this from happening. Divide the shifter pattern in half.
1st, 2nd gears, you shift with your grip facing towards you(drivers door).
3rd, 4th, you shift gripping the shifter from the top(overhand fist 👊) straight up & down (going to 3rd pushes your fist into the dash.
5th, 6th, you shift with your grip facing the passenger door.
This technique uses your natural hand motions to limit it’s affect on the shift patterns.
Granted accidents will happen but this really reduces it.
Just remember, this is opposite for RHD cars
@@dielaughing73 ?
@@phillm156 your advice applies to left-hand-drive vehicles. The directions are reversed (relative to the driver's position) in a right-hand-drive vehicle.
In fact, it probably makes money shifting less likely as it requires a pushing motion rather than a pulling motion
Man you really love your craft it is impressive id mutter under my breathe and hope no one saw but you take the opportunity to share and teach on something so many would love to know more about. Love the video man you can probably outshine 99% of us driving knowing the mechanics and honestly most engineers can visualize the problems but can’t explain them which makes you upper tier for sure.
I have a 2002 sentra se-r spec v. I've "money shifted" on accident, and fortunately it has some kind of protection to keep it from causing serious damage. Maybe I was just fast to put it into neutral and avoid damage, but nothing seems to have suffered from it.
You only do it once. After that you learn to be SURE you're in the right gear.
Money shifted my WRX STI 2018 and clutch gave out saving my transmission and engine, just needed a new clutch. I got so damn lucky
Then, sirs, I have the moniest shift.
I was driving my Ford Fiesta down the A3(M) in Hampshire, England.
I pulled out to overtake when somebody paused for me to do so, shifted down into 4th and accelerated hard.
I then block shifted into 6th.
Except...
I don't have a 6th, I don't own my Focus anymore, in driving a 5 speed.
At 80 miles an hour, I have just shifted into
Reverse.
The clutch is down hard, in a million to one chance I've got it in reverse without needing synchro.
If I hadn't noticed, I suspect the gear box would have voiced it's displeasure by separating from the car.
Whatever happened, I doubt I would have survived.
So that was fun.
Did this in my SRT-10 Ram not too long after I got it. It was basically like hitting the brakes and the tac pegged on the rev limiter. I grabbed the clutch really quick. It was a very unpleasant experience. Thankfully it didn’t cause any damage.
Part of the problem was I bought it in 2017, it was an 05 with 2700 miles and it had the original transmission fluid in it. Put some Royal Purple in it and that was that.
I did an accidental 4->2 after two long days on the road. Found out there really was an rpm limiter. And, like one of Mr. Bond's martinis, VERY much "shaken, not stirred".
I almost money shifted my wrx a few weeks ago but thankfully i caught myself before i let the clutch out
If manual transmission are on their way out.... Prices of old manual cars will skyrocket. Thank goodness for this new z keeping the enthusiasm alive. Especially because in the US you could always get any car cheaper in a manual. I have a 17 year old bmw and I still love it more than almost any other car I've ever driven. Only ever changed the clutch 1 time in 14 years of ownership and a bonus it only caught on fire once! Lol.
As an experienced driver it is easy to think a moneyshift is easy to avoid. However, in teaching my teenage son to drive my mazda with m6 transmission, he has accidentally shifted from 5th into 4th multiple times. Not performance driving so nowhere near redline, so no damage, but an obvious error trap that we can generally, but not always, avoid through practice and experience.
This smart dude wasn’t that smart thinking his shifting skills were on par, but what he’s really smart at is making a very detailed video on what his mistake was and it’s complexities within. He will make more money from this one video than what that new engine would cost. Well done sir, we’ll done.
*shifts from top 4th into 2nd*
Transsmission: Dear piston, you may kiss the valve,
*rodknock applause*
2 questions:
1. What would be the easiest of these solutions to implement aftermarket? Maybe some sort of skipshift-style system for preventing you from going into wrong gears, based on OBD ECU monitoring or something?
2. Would the potential for damage be significantly less on something that uses the (Koenigsegg) Freevalve system, because it can't overwhelm the springs?
Similar thing happened to one of my family members. They accidentally downshifted from 5th to 2nd on a Toyota diesel engine while going at 100 KPH (60 MPH). The engine briefly saw 5 500 RPM but they immediately put the clutch in and saved the engine. It happens to everyone who is driving a manual car, at least once :D