All steve needs for him to function normally again is df 2 shiro combo back. It wonr make him good but itll make him actually viable as a counterhit puncher instead of just a mixup poker
fr b1 isn't even enough. B1 is 13 frame startup, which is actually quite slow compared to other counterhit moves on other characters like Lee's Magic 4 (only 11 frames) Imo Lee is everything Steve wants to be. A counterhit god with an actual launcher
I think option to not go into forced lionheart is more important. They can make it so that you have to input a direction or direction with button after that move to transition into lionheart or simply make lionheart cancellation to flicker
Dude bryans fastest ch move is 16f yea qcb1 His t8 move is 13f but locked behind a qc motion which makes IT was slower. I think to only char weaker than Steve in neutral is Bryan. Guy lost many counterhits for no reason.@@IWantToStayAtYourHouse
A solid buff for Steve I'm seeing would be to allow him to use db3,2 in LNH allowing him to loop the stance. This would make it fair in conjunction with the PKB tech making it so that Steve only has to guess if you are mashing RA like everyone else, no block required.
19:11 Numan was trying to do the gatling punches. In most situations, all of the punches would connect and eat at the opponent's bar life before they get to hit steve, and sometimes the last hits would trade.
I kinda get the "stop weaving" coaching but tbh the outfox and LH nerfs kill Steves. They have to make a choice to do the ultra hard f3,3+4 or the guaranteed weave block. If they stay in LH they get killed by power crush. If they opt for the f3,3+4 stance cancel theres a high probability it fails as mainmanswe has shown. He wasn't weaving just because he was forced to by the nerfs tekken devs forced on Steve.
Tekken 8 is my first Tekken , and I chose Steve Fox as my main . Every guide I look into RUclips within the first few minutes they all say the same thing “he’s not a counterhit god anymore “ “he’s trash b tier at best “ it’s so discouraging learning him so thank you for this video!🎉🎉👌
When the big balance patch comes in May, your learning and grinding will pay off 10 fold, Steve is my favorite character in any fighting game ever and I’m loyal to my stupid bean eater, he’ll get his comeback soon :)
The thing is Steve has always been top tier/busted on release in every Tekken game, so when a new tekken comes out (T8) and he's only mid tier, people complain cuz they are not used to it. He's still a solid character imo, and still has his counter hit b1 when all the other characters lost their main counter hit tools. Definitely play him if you like him!
Every character is capable of winning, the problem is these tournaments dudes start putting people on tier list based upon how a character should be played. Truth is most people get crushed when a character doesn’t used the same tech on the tier list. Every time someone thinks outside the box using a character people rush to the tier list to change their ranking. People don’t take the time to truly rank a character all they do is rank there current strats used in tournaments.
I like the sentiment of shedding a good light on the player but Steve is still trash….even worse he’s my favorite character. He needs work but I understand the pro player does well with the him
Potemkin is allegedly low tier in GG but if you watch FAB play 2 rounds you'll shake your fists in the air and demand for immediate nerfs. People love crying dor crying's sake
You gotta be real creative getting that move to work in higher ranks. But yeah still reliable. I like using B1 into flicker and then go for B2 to interrupt for a knockdown into FF2 for extra damage. Pretty safe
@@MrZayJames I played against a Steve that knew what he was doing and got rekt by those mini combos that end with ff2, that shit hits insanely hard😂😂😂
Yeah I really like PhiDX, great guy and great content. If his goal was to show that this character isn't nerfed into the ground, then it wasn't really reflected in the video. All I saw was confirmation that it's nearly impossible for Steve to get a launch in this game in comparison to others. B1 used to be Steve's best asset and now it's rare to hit at all since every character is so evasive, has better frame setups, and has better panic buttons. If you noticed, even a top tier player like Numan couldn't hit a single B1 against someone who knows the Steve matchup. Pretty sure most of his damage was from sonic fang and the occasional punish. I hope the top tiers get nerfed into the ground. Tired of playing against characters like Azucena, Feng and Viktor who have no shortage of moves that counter B1 hard
@CodyRockLee13 One B1 in 5 games is terrible though, Numan was definitely avoiding using the move too much because it's not very safe atm. Should not be launchable, yet it is for whatever reason
I think I agree, seems like Numan was just having a good day. When life long Steve mains like Knee, Lowhigh, DougFromParis, ON2, etc. all say Steve sucks, I think I'd take their word for it tbh.
@@benskxAs a Steve Player I think it's a bit of both. Steve got some changes and they negatively impacted his ability to control the game. Lateral Movement being better makes it harder for him to lock down Sidestep and Down Forward 2 got strictly Nerfed again. But on the upside, Steve has never had something like Manual Lionheart or The "Go! Go! Go!" Style of Mixup that Tekken 8 has. You straight up have to play Steve differently in this one, maybe we'll see the upside going forward with people pushing the Meta like Numan. 🤔 It's possible Steve is better than people are thinking because Manual Lionheart or Outfox really is a fantastic Move and Steve's never had anything like that and the interaction goes like this: Interaction -> Lionheart away -> Opponent swings -> Lionheart Launch Punishes the opponent for swinging. 🤔 Still Punishing the opponent for buttons at an ill informed time, just like Steve has always done, but executed differently. Food for thought.
@@kylefields3951lion heart is the worst thing that ever happened to Steve him having a kempo is disgusting and nerfing crucial counter hits like 4 12 and ws 2 for a terrible 5050 is a joke and on top of that they make his weaknesses even bigger
No Steve is not good compared to the Cast. Its the player with insane dedication and Skill making Steve look good. Yes outfox is a good tool but also beaten by powercrush, ub2b into any button beaten by piwercrush eeeevery lionheart button beaten by powercrush. Hey they buff kings jaguar rush as soon as they can. Steve remains garbage, 21b~f1+2 wallroute is inconsitent af. If u duck in after a poke string every df1 beats that option. I mean lol
Make a video and compare victors tools and steve tools exactly and compare the difficulty in gettin it to work exactly and than listen to this video again lol.
i mean, i think steve players are generally more careful and collected due to his tools being so unique. No surprise pakistani player can make him look really good even if he is nerfed
You only hear bad steve players complain about everything because they don't utilize this character well. He has more tekken god and above ranks than other B or C tier characters in terms of popularity. That means good steve know how to play this character correctly, but bad steves only focuses on complaining.
@@jkdman2007 look at his win rate then see what all the complaining is about. And the people doing amazing with Steve been playing him for years. And the top Steve player historically like knee low high and others say he not useable. So thanks for your opinion but yeah I hope he gets super buffed
Lots of people play old characters for years not just steve, so what you said doesn't make any sense at all. Winrate isn't a good index because bad players make it lower. If the character is not strong enough, that means not many people can reach the highest rank because they just can't even they are good players. That's why namco officially use popularity and high ranks as the index because you just can't count bad players and they don't use this character properly.
@@jkdman2007 I hear what you’re saying but I’d rather listen to the pros who played him in previous games now saying he not playable. Let’s be real for a second if you actually played Tekken 8 you would know how aggressive it is so the fact that the devs removed key counter hit properties from certain moves that he has it make it so much harder to deal with all the aggressive play
Not even remotely the same, Rangchu didn't win all the matches with Panda, he pulled Panda as a wild card. Steve is objectively strong, he just doesn't play the same at all, it even might be more boring/less defined, but not bad at all.
It can go the opposite way too, though. Remember how no one knew how good Akumu was in T7 until like the third or fourth year when Atif and all of them started showing us? Knee had him rated as like a B Tier lol
@@lt_johnmcclane that’s different (fr here ahah) Akuma was new to tekken scene and needed some execution that wasn’t known at that time Steve is a well known character I play it as a side and you can trust me the character is trash (lost tracking, new stance is shit and you are forced into it on every move) No launcher while his CH game is really weak now (nomore tracking on df2, no more shiro combo etc etc)
I'm still not convinced Steve is that good. His weaves get beaten by a lot of moves, and B1 is definitely bugged rn (other moves that transition into FLK are safe, so it seems unintentional). Since B1 is so unsafe rn, Steve the "counterhit paragon" has like 2 good counterhits (dck f2 and flk 2). He has the least opportunity to combo in the game because B1 is unsafe and his other launchers are slow in comparison to others. Yes, db 1+2 is a decent powercrush, and outfox is decent for catching whiffs. Every other character has similar tools and 3x more. B2 is super unsafe and a hard read tool, so it should never have been nerfed. Allow B2 to combo and make B1 safer like in every other Tekken and Steve will probably still be mid tier
You're right. Numan is great. Dude was ultra instinct during most of the stuff. Low high knee have dropped Steve for Dragunov eventhough they've been playing Steve for years. Even heera Malik best Steve in the world is saying Steve is weak
If you're top 5 with any character in any game, then of course the character is going to look good but it's just the player. I'd say Numan is good. Steve, not so much. I've been maining my boy since the end of Tekken 7 and all the way till last week with Tekken 8. Fun in 7, a rage inducing nightmare in 8. But since picking up Eddy, Leroy, and Brian, I've been having so much more fun and success in the game. One thing for sure, is Steve trains you to be a better fundamentalist. I just wish they'd drop another boxer that does damage, so at least players can pick a different playstyle because I love the boxer persona.
Steve does good damage it’s just that lionheart is a shit stance and his overall offensive options are lacking especially in the low department and they needed his chs a lot
@@pranavjain8774 Eh, I play Steve a bit on the side. His damage doesn't seem that great to me outside of very specific situations. His bnb only does around 70, which is pretty whatever in a game where characters are regularly dumping out 80, 90 or 100 damage combos. He has some high damage combos off stuff like LHS 2, but they require heat and rage and pretty specific circumstances.
He's definitely not as good of a character as he was before, but watching this match he's still incredibly powerful in the right hands. Hard to balance a character who has a strong counter game that'll blow you for taking your turn. Lion stance hurts though definitely.
Sadly this video shows more of steves flaws more than it shows his strengths. It shows the weakness of his lion hart transition out of moves. poor mix ups and damage. Using this video to say steve is good is similar to saying the bear is good because ranchu won a tournament with him.
Its not about the character, its about the player. When Rangchu won twt - Panda hasnt suddenly become an S tier 😂 and saying that a tournament results “shake up the tierlists” is kinda wild tbh. If tomorrow some genius kid emerges on a counter strike scene, and demolishes everyone with glock, never even bothering to buy an AK - it wont make glock the best weapon in the game. Remember in your interview with Spag too, he was mentioning that Pakistan had players like that ganryu main, that would destroy everyone with impeccable defense, no matter the character tier. Steve is still objectively very handicapped in specifically tekken 8 environment, and has 0 “carry” potential. Every W has to be earned.
@@justhit6673 While Steve doesn't win that matchup. It's not as bad for him as it is for other characters. Steve's B1 will launch Dragonuvs While running 2 if he throws it out without setting it up and his LH entry will avoid the low mix ups that other characters can't avoid. That said Steve is still forced into terrible situations in which guessing right gives you between 60-75 damage and guessing wrong gives you launched for around 90 damage. And a good dragonuv will set up his pressure and lows with good pokes and his grab game. TLDR: not as bad for Steve for most other characters but Drag still wins the matchup by a long shot.
That’s what this video was made for. It could be that or so that the devs don’t buff him I noticed a couple of content creators making videos like this one trying to make Steve seem like he isn’t terrible Justin Wong, main man,and now this I think people fear Steve getting too buff
So glad you covered this match. This was an amazing tournament to have watched live. In a time where everyone is talking about mindless offense in T8 it was interesting to see a final in which both players played a very patient timing-based game. I need to see these guys Numan and Farzeen more because they are crazy good.
Hello. Numan Ch. has been a Steve main for years. The fact that Farzeen who just recently picked Viktor is beating him down to the wire only adds to the T8 powercreep and the Steve nerfs. If you don't believe me look at low high knee heera. They cant make Steve work vs the high tiers. Low high used Steve vs Azucena in tournament and got murdered by Jeonnding without getting a round. Both Low High and Knee have dropped Steve for Dragunov currently both online and in tournaments. P.S Devs need to nerf the top tiers and buff the low tiers if they want to retain interest in this game because the game's current meta is tekken 6 levels where ppl who just picked up Dragunov a month ago are beating JDCR in mirrors in ATL.
All great fighting games ideally incentivize character diversity by catering to unique playstyles and strengths, and allow the players to shine over the characters. Excited to see how EVO Japan shakes out. Great breakdown!
Great video. The Tierlist needs more tournament Tekken input and less Mainmanswe influence. For what it’s worth I think Law and Jin are being slept on but we’ll see how it goes!
Despite the short-falls this game has had recently there still isn't another fighting game out there that makes me feel like I'm kicking as much snot out of someone quite like Tekken does.
The characters are pretty balanced to be honest. There are just a few that are much better than the others; however, you can clearly win with any character you play with. I think that's a hallmark of a well made game.
lol your not delusional. People just don’t want Steve to get buffs that’s all. there are players that have Steve infinite ptsd and they will never get over it 👌
Steve don't play Tekken the same way others do. He don't just play Tekken, he play his opponents. So of course meta need to have the time to stabilise enought for the other and Steve's players time to adapt to it and really learn their kit before his full potential can give us a glimse. Down players don't understand him
@@JobeLovo Having a big weakness doesn't mean he can't play around it and yes he don't have the best counter hit anymore, but who said Steve can only counter hit to be good or that you absolutly need to nuke the opponent with every combo ? I do understand him and fighting game in general. If he was only playable with counter hit, they would have gave him the best counter hits by far, if his big weakness was that much of a handicap he would be almost unplayable which is nowhere near the case. So learn to play him better if you play him or just learn to play more intelligently in general and you'll see: he is far from as bas as you think. I'm not claiming he is the best character in the game, but he is at least top 15/end of top 10 for me.
@@marcunbut1058just because he's not unplayable and you can win with him doesn't make him not weak ? And you have to be smoking crack cocaine to think he's top 10 are you trolling or something?
@@marcunbut1058 like what are the 9 characters better then him so I know who u think he's better then if your actually serious cuz saying steve is top 10 is outrageous
@@JobeLovo I don't have precisely anyone in mind, it was just a way to say he is stronger than you think but not the best of all as well. For me the strongest would be (keep in mind i'm taking into consideration only the character, not the player who control lt) Jin, Reina, Devil Jin, Bryan, Dragunov, Feng of course and King for sure in top 10 in no particular order here. King and Dragunov also because of how they currently are tecnically because of how this game work. Kazuya probably top 10 too haven't seen a lot about him, Lee maybe if we consider never missing input timings but we rarely see it. I clearly see Steve fit in top 10 like 9th or 10th place though. Can't give you a more precise/organised list though. And you ? Who so you think is top 10 ? The same way, thinking about the characters themself not limited by player skill.
Lets keep it a buck most of the people one and doning are rookie hunting. They are looking for players they can farm rank from and will leave the second someone slightly challenges them. That's why im running into the most scrubbiest high ranked Tekken players I've ever seen.
@@tristanherb49 we will just have to see how things go, the outcry against buffing characters has been pretty strong, maybe with time they will give some hard nerfs to other characters and maybe some minor buffs to steve
Numan is extraordinary steve player he even beat heera in a tournament and made him shift to feng…..he reaching finals doesn’t mean steve is good….perhaps he lost because of that….LH got beaten multiple times….that doesn’t only deal damage to your character’s health bar but also to your morale.
If one player did well in tournaments, that doesn't mean the character is good. We watch Rangchu win the tekken world with Banda, and Banda is still the worst character in tekken 7. We need to see other people playing Steve in tournaments to see how good he is.
I wonder what complaints people have…I feel so out of the tekken space lol I’ve been watching tourneys and I play a lot. I personally have been having a lot of fun with tekken 8 and from what I can see in tourneys is a lot of people feel the game is really fun. People have their opinions on the heat system but I feel like people have adjusted to it so what other complaints are there that are bringing the game down? I genuinely don’t know lol
Steves only weakness is having the worst VA in the game, who said he was bad Oh you're arguing against redditors. Bro they're not worth paying any attention to. They've always been the dumbest people on the internet.
@@bilalharis838 That's exactly what defines a best from the rest. One who can adapt in a longer run and dominate, that's what Heera is all about. He can smoke Low high, Numan and the rest, he is that good. It was not long ago when he mauled Knee in a FT10 match, and there are not many in this world who can win Ft10 against knee, not even Arslan or Atif.
ltg got blown to bits by outfox awhile ago and the funny part is that the steve was a beginner, didn't really know anything outside of the outfox combo but yeah so because of that i've been knowing about outfox.
Steve always been good he's never been low tier and he's better with the new stance he has and that's just my opinion.. but I've always thought Steve was good no matter what ppl say
As a Steve main who hates that we can’t block out of this new stance they gave us without doing frame perfect tech is annoying but this kind of analysis gave me insight on how to use it better thanks
I need more of this. Up till now Sajam has been my main analysis guy for other games but he is not on the Tekken grind atm. I just need more people on this platform to talk about the game and the situations in it.
I know it’s not exactly the conversation but imo Steve 100% is a character that can easily carry players up to like blue ranks. I don’t see how people can’t see that he has so many different but similar looking punches and strings that he’s basically a punching Hwoarang at 90% of ranks imo. Ain’t no way 99% of purple ranks know what the hell to do against his millions of pressure strings and punches.
And this is the reason why they should never listen to the "omg the game is inbalanced" after the first 3 days let alone the first months of the game..
Steve is still weak. No power mid, b1 doesn't work if steve ss slightly will not counter hit, and no lowers, lion heart sux can be armored with all options. Don't bring up one frame cancel that still sux because of a high grab. Power mid, less frames on lows, and block in lion heart. Steve will be fixed.
@@PhiDXIt’s a good mid I agree, but it’s steppable to both sides and only does 21 damage. Not to mention you’re forced into heat and that pisses me off. When hatchet does more damage, kind of discouraging.
@@tristanherb49quarter circle forward one. Qcf refers to the input down, down forward, forward (d,df,f) and one is equivalent to left punch or square on PlayStation.
I think specifically against Victor or character that has a high powercrush, i just Sway 2 from Lionheart, but yeah in tense situation you forget stuff.
I’ve been having a bit of a character crisis with this game. I have not been able to nail down a character I really like. And the only character I played from Tekken 7 has been made baby proof (Lars) and he’s just not fun. Then I started playing Steve and man is he fun. I’m glad someone is trying to make the character shine despite his disadvantages.
This is why I personally never pay attention to teir lists seriously. I know they are some BUSTED chars in 8 rn esp Drag, but any char can win even in the wrong hands 😂 jokes aside I enjoy character loyalists that specializes and not "teir whore" they wanted to make Tekken more fun to spectate with aggressive play but without the loyalists that do well in tournaments its boring watching the same few characters to me thats boring. I remember the hype when JDCR busted out the hei.
Lies! Oh wait, i gotta watch the video first and see if this is is true.
Did you watch it yet? I need answers
Let's just look at the title and argue!
Honestly it's good because of the player. Lionheart and weaving still bad tho.
All steve needs for him to function normally again is df 2 shiro combo back. It wonr make him good but itll make him actually viable as a counterhit puncher instead of just a mixup poker
fr b1 isn't even enough. B1 is 13 frame startup, which is actually quite slow compared to other counterhit moves on other characters like Lee's Magic 4 (only 11 frames)
Imo Lee is everything Steve wants to be. A counterhit god with an actual launcher
I think option to not go into forced lionheart is more important. They can make it so that you have to input a direction or direction with button after that move to transition into lionheart or simply make lionheart cancellation to flicker
@@BullC6the only move that has directional cancel is bounty hunter (u/b + 2). Might be a nice change to not force into LIH
Dude bryans fastest ch move is 16f yea qcb1 His t8 move is 13f but locked behind a qc motion which makes IT was slower. I think to only char weaker than Steve in neutral is Bryan. Guy lost many counterhits for no reason.@@IWantToStayAtYourHouse
@@BullC6or make a option out of lionheart beat armor since the lionheart to peakaboo is hard to do consistently in high level
The only buff Steve needs is muting his voice
Ikr he sounds so annoying now
Talks like he's in an anime fighter.
"Ovah here" "FIARR"
😂 that is actually a buff if you think so
GOOD NOIGHT
A solid buff for Steve I'm seeing would be to allow him to use db3,2 in LNH allowing him to loop the stance. This would make it fair in conjunction with the PKB tech making it so that Steve only has to guess if you are mashing RA like everyone else, no block required.
19:11 Numan was trying to do the gatling punches.
In most situations, all of the punches would connect and eat at the opponent's bar life before they get to hit steve, and sometimes the last hits would trade.
I kinda get the "stop weaving" coaching but tbh the outfox and LH nerfs kill Steves. They have to make a choice to do the ultra hard f3,3+4 or the guaranteed weave block. If they stay in LH they get killed by power crush. If they opt for the f3,3+4 stance cancel theres a high probability it fails as mainmanswe has shown. He wasn't weaving just because he was forced to by the nerfs tekken devs forced on Steve.
Tekken 8 is my first Tekken , and I chose Steve Fox as my main . Every guide I look into RUclips within the first few minutes they all say the same thing “he’s not a counterhit god anymore “ “he’s trash b tier at best “ it’s so discouraging learning him so thank you for this video!🎉🎉👌
nono. it should be ENCOURAGING if anything. if it is true, then that means every game you win is THAT much more sweet too
When the big balance patch comes in May, your learning and grinding will pay off 10 fold, Steve is my favorite character in any fighting game ever and I’m loyal to my stupid bean eater, he’ll get his comeback soon :)
If you win with Steve, just know you're the better player majority of the time.
@@epictcg4424 everytime basically every character has some bs steve has not.
The thing is Steve has always been top tier/busted on release in every Tekken game, so when a new tekken comes out (T8) and he's only mid tier, people complain cuz they are not used to it. He's still a solid character imo, and still has his counter hit b1 when all the other characters lost their main counter hit tools. Definitely play him if you like him!
I could listen to coach Phidy all day im learning everytime lol😅 i wanna play steve now
Every character is capable of winning, the problem is these tournaments dudes start putting people on tier list based upon how a character should be played. Truth is most people get crushed when a character doesn’t used the same tech on the tier list. Every time someone thinks outside the box using a character people rush to the tier list to change their ranking. People don’t take the time to truly rank a character all they do is rank there current strats used in tournaments.
I will only refer to my Heat Meter as my Meat Heater from here on out. Thank you PhiDx 😂
this would be a good series, going through all the supposedly weak characters to see if they really are that bad
i'm sad that king gets to block during his jaguar sprint but steve can't block during lionheart.....
I like the sentiment of shedding a good light on the player but Steve is still trash….even worse he’s my favorite character. He needs work but I understand the pro player does well with the him
*Hajime no Ippo reference*
Potemkin is allegedly low tier in GG but if you watch FAB play 2 rounds you'll shake your fists in the air and demand for immediate nerfs. People love crying dor crying's sake
Viktor: lasers,knives,sword
Steve: _ovah heyaa_ punch
I have no idea if this is true, but it feeds into my internal biases (getting whacked by B1), so I’ll incorporate it into my belief system.
intensely based opinion
You gotta be real creative getting that move to work in higher ranks. But yeah still reliable. I like using B1 into flicker and then go for B2 to interrupt for a knockdown into FF2 for extra damage. Pretty safe
@@MrZayJamesyessssir I’m not a high rank by any means, but B1 > FLK > B2 is a great keep out/get off me combo
@Eggsecuter also try 1, D1 combo > flicker > B2 incase they like to duck.
@@MrZayJames I played against a Steve that knew what he was doing and got rekt by those mini combos that end with ff2, that shit hits insanely hard😂😂😂
Snitched on chat in this stream, instantly got gifted a sub. Amazing community 10/10 would snitch again
I Needed a positive video about Tekken 8 😂, thanks. Saludos desde Argentina
2:41 classic Aris laugh
Put em in the bag, amigo.
Reads title, streamer proceeds to explain how awful Steve is and Steve loses. Hmmm...
Yeah I really like PhiDX, great guy and great content. If his goal was to show that this character isn't nerfed into the ground, then it wasn't really reflected in the video. All I saw was confirmation that it's nearly impossible for Steve to get a launch in this game in comparison to others. B1 used to be Steve's best asset and now it's rare to hit at all since every character is so evasive, has better frame setups, and has better panic buttons. If you noticed, even a top tier player like Numan couldn't hit a single B1 against someone who knows the Steve matchup. Pretty sure most of his damage was from sonic fang and the occasional punish.
I hope the top tiers get nerfed into the ground. Tired of playing against characters like Azucena, Feng and Viktor who have no shortage of moves that counter B1 hard
@@VermillionGatesI understand the point you're making, but to be fair, Numan *did* hit a b1 in game 5.
@CodyRockLee13 One B1 in 5 games is terrible though, Numan was definitely avoiding using the move too much because it's not very safe atm. Should not be launchable, yet it is for whatever reason
Steve is definitely not good Numan CH is good.
Nah, Steve is trash, buff please UwU
Yeah steve is still shit Numan just played insanely well
I think I agree, seems like Numan was just having a good day.
When life long Steve mains like Knee, Lowhigh, DougFromParis, ON2, etc. all say Steve sucks, I think I'd take their word for it tbh.
@@benskxyeah, not even Phidx is touching the character for tournament. He said so while gathering data for the ranking up/down video.
@@benskxAs a Steve Player I think it's a bit of both. Steve got some changes and they negatively impacted his ability to control the game. Lateral Movement being better makes it harder for him to lock down Sidestep and Down Forward 2 got strictly Nerfed again.
But on the upside, Steve has never had something like Manual Lionheart or The "Go! Go! Go!" Style of Mixup that Tekken 8 has. You straight up have to play Steve differently in this one, maybe we'll see the upside going forward with people pushing the Meta like Numan. 🤔 It's possible Steve is better than people are thinking because Manual Lionheart or Outfox really is a fantastic Move and Steve's never had anything like that and the interaction goes like this:
Interaction -> Lionheart away -> Opponent swings -> Lionheart Launch Punishes the opponent for swinging.
🤔 Still Punishing the opponent for buttons at an ill informed time, just like Steve has always done, but executed differently.
Food for thought.
@@kylefields3951lion heart is the worst thing that ever happened to Steve him having a kempo is disgusting and nerfing crucial counter hits like 4 12 and ws 2 for a terrible 5050 is a joke and on top of that they make his weaknesses even bigger
💫
Steve will be good if they fixed his new stance and maybe make sonic fang launch on heat.
Until he gets his old counter hit moves and old guard break, he wil be bad no matter how much you fix the suicide stance
make d2 good again
No Steve is not good compared to the Cast. Its the player with insane dedication and Skill making Steve look good.
Yes outfox is a good tool but also beaten by powercrush, ub2b into any button beaten by piwercrush eeeevery lionheart button beaten by powercrush. Hey they buff kings jaguar rush as soon as they can. Steve remains garbage, 21b~f1+2 wallroute is inconsitent af. If u duck in after a poke string every df1 beats that option. I mean lol
Make a video and compare victors tools and steve tools exactly and compare the difficulty in gettin it to work exactly and than listen to this video again lol.
i mean, i think steve players are generally more careful and collected due to his tools being so unique. No surprise pakistani player can make him look really good even if he is nerfed
This comment is golden it’s the player not the character
You only hear bad steve players complain about everything because they don't utilize this character well. He has more tekken god and above ranks than other B or C tier characters in terms of popularity. That means good steve know how to play this character correctly, but bad steves only focuses on complaining.
@@jkdman2007 look at his win rate then see what all the complaining is about. And the people doing amazing with Steve been playing him for years. And the top Steve player historically like knee low high and others say he not useable. So thanks for your opinion but yeah I hope he gets super buffed
Lots of people play old characters for years not just steve, so what you said doesn't make any sense at all. Winrate isn't a good index because bad players make it lower. If the character is not strong enough, that means not many people can reach the highest rank because they just can't even they are good players. That's why namco officially use popularity and high ranks as the index because you just can't count bad players and they don't use this character properly.
@@jkdman2007 I hear what you’re saying but I’d rather listen to the pros who played him in previous games now saying he not playable. Let’s be real for a second if you actually played Tekken 8 you would know how aggressive it is so the fact that the devs removed key counter hit properties from certain moves that he has it make it so much harder to deal with all the aggressive play
yeah well it Panda strong in T7 ? cuz Rangchu is a world champion with it so ???
Not even remotely the same, Rangchu didn't win all the matches with Panda, he pulled Panda as a wild card. Steve is objectively strong, he just doesn't play the same at all, it even might be more boring/less defined, but not bad at all.
@@lucastonoli3256 lmao yeah that’s probably thzt yeah
It can go the opposite way too, though. Remember how no one knew how good Akumu was in T7 until like the third or fourth year when Atif and all of them started showing us? Knee had him rated as like a B Tier lol
@@lt_johnmcclane that’s different (fr here ahah)
Akuma was new to tekken scene and needed some execution that wasn’t known at that time
Steve is a well known character
I play it as a side and you can trust me the character is trash (lost tracking, new stance is shit and you are forced into it on every move)
No launcher while his CH game is really weak now (nomore tracking on df2, no more shiro combo etc etc)
@@lucastonoli3256Steve is objectively strong 💀 yeah you have no idea what your talking about in t8 hes trash
steve redemption arc
Hopefully arriving this may
lmfao
Remenber when ppl said akuma is weak in early t7
I'm still not convinced Steve is that good. His weaves get beaten by a lot of moves, and B1 is definitely bugged rn (other moves that transition into FLK are safe, so it seems unintentional). Since B1 is so unsafe rn, Steve the "counterhit paragon" has like 2 good counterhits (dck f2 and flk 2). He has the least opportunity to combo in the game because B1 is unsafe and his other launchers are slow in comparison to others.
Yes, db 1+2 is a decent powercrush, and outfox is decent for catching whiffs. Every other character has similar tools and 3x more. B2 is super unsafe and a hard read tool, so it should never have been nerfed. Allow B2 to combo and make B1 safer like in every other Tekken and Steve will probably still be mid tier
You're right. Numan is great. Dude was ultra instinct during most of the stuff. Low high knee have dropped Steve for Dragunov eventhough they've been playing Steve for years. Even heera Malik best Steve in the world is saying Steve is weak
if he gets nerfed im deleting
No, Steve is bad. Go play someone else. Leave Steve alone. 😒
Steve just need 1 extra plus frame to fix Lion Heart after db3,2 b1,2 3,1,2 and 4,1,2.
+8 will allow LNH 1 to always beat Power Crushes, burst and RA.
Lnh needs to not be automatic. Forced stances are trash
We should be able to hold back to cancel Lionheart from any of his moves that put him in the stance, db32 included
Numan CH is an exceptional player for making it to the GF and almost winning it with a severely handicapped character. Major props.
Preach
If you're top 5 with any character in any game, then of course the character is going to look good but it's just the player. I'd say Numan is good. Steve, not so much. I've been maining my boy since the end of Tekken 7 and all the way till last week with Tekken 8. Fun in 7, a rage inducing nightmare in 8. But since picking up Eddy, Leroy, and Brian, I've been having so much more fun and success in the game. One thing for sure, is Steve trains you to be a better fundamentalist. I just wish they'd drop another boxer that does damage, so at least players can pick a different playstyle because I love the boxer persona.
Steve does good damage it’s just that lionheart is a shit stance and his overall offensive options are lacking especially in the low department and they needed his chs a lot
@@pranavjain8774 Eh, I play Steve a bit on the side. His damage doesn't seem that great to me outside of very specific situations. His bnb only does around 70, which is pretty whatever in a game where characters are regularly dumping out 80, 90 or 100 damage combos.
He has some high damage combos off stuff like LHS 2, but they require heat and rage and pretty specific circumstances.
@@pranavjain8774 Steve isn't a high damage char anymore
He's definitely not as good of a character as he was before, but watching this match he's still incredibly powerful in the right hands. Hard to balance a character who has a strong counter game that'll blow you for taking your turn. Lion stance hurts though definitely.
Welcome to the Byron gang
I ran into a bunch of Steve’s yesterday. It was weird. I knew there was something that happened to cause this.
Sadly this video shows more of steves flaws more than it shows his strengths. It shows the weakness of his lion hart transition out of moves. poor mix ups and damage.
Using this video to say steve is good is similar to saying the bear is good because ranchu won a tournament with him.
Its not about the character, its about the player. When Rangchu won twt - Panda hasnt suddenly become an S tier 😂 and saying that a tournament results “shake up the tierlists” is kinda wild tbh. If tomorrow some genius kid emerges on a counter strike scene, and demolishes everyone with glock, never even bothering to buy an AK - it wont make glock the best weapon in the game.
Remember in your interview with Spag too, he was mentioning that Pakistan had players like that ganryu main, that would destroy everyone with impeccable defense, no matter the character tier.
Steve is still objectively very handicapped in specifically tekken 8 environment, and has 0 “carry” potential. Every W has to be earned.
Depends on which character you use. Some are just better matches for other characters. Id say not every character has the same tier list.
@@blueisacolor7639 I completely agree to this.
@@blueisacolor7639yeah even tho everyone says Steve low tier and dragonuv is god apparently Steve wins that match ups
@@justhit6673 no he doesnt
@@justhit6673 While Steve doesn't win that matchup. It's not as bad for him as it is for other characters. Steve's B1 will launch Dragonuvs While running 2 if he throws it out without setting it up and his LH entry will avoid the low mix ups that other characters can't avoid. That said Steve is still forced into terrible situations in which guessing right gives you between 60-75 damage and guessing wrong gives you launched for around 90 damage.
And a good dragonuv will set up his pressure and lows with good pokes and his grab game.
TLDR: not as bad for Steve for most other characters but Drag still wins the matchup by a long shot.
Bamcos gonna see this and nerf steve even more
That’s what this video was made for. It could be that or so that the devs don’t buff him I noticed a couple of content creators making videos like this one trying to make Steve seem like he isn’t terrible Justin Wong, main man,and now this I think people fear Steve getting too buff
@okellsgamingtuna8213 remember when tmm recently made a vid about kazuya being stronger then dvj and then he got nerfed
@@LeBaldJames23- lol yup 👍
So glad you covered this match. This was an amazing tournament to have watched live. In a time where everyone is talking about mindless offense in T8 it was interesting to see a final in which both players played a very patient timing-based game. I need to see these guys Numan and Farzeen more because they are crazy good.
reminder that Farzeen eliminated Knee from Evo last year =)
Hello. Numan Ch. has been a Steve main for years. The fact that Farzeen who just recently picked Viktor is beating him down to the wire only adds to the T8 powercreep and the Steve nerfs.
If you don't believe me look at low high knee heera. They cant make Steve work vs the high tiers. Low high used Steve vs Azucena in tournament and got murdered by Jeonnding without getting a round. Both Low High and Knee have dropped Steve for Dragunov currently both online and in tournaments.
P.S Devs need to nerf the top tiers and buff the low tiers if they want to retain interest in this game because the game's current meta is tekken 6 levels where ppl who just picked up Dragunov a month ago are beating JDCR in mirrors in ATL.
All great fighting games ideally incentivize character diversity by catering to unique playstyles and strengths, and allow the players to shine over the characters. Excited to see how EVO Japan shakes out. Great breakdown!
Great video. The Tierlist needs more tournament Tekken input and less Mainmanswe influence.
For what it’s worth I think Law and Jin are being slept on but we’ll see how it goes!
still steve second worst character in the game after leroy.if same player picks high tier character. prob wins the tournament.
In Pakistan, we have our own tier lists.
Not of the characters, oh no. We have tier lists for our players.
How does it look like?
Where does Devilster fall in?
your players definitely showed up that tournament was amazing especially top 8
cool where can i find one?
wheres arslan in the tierlist
Steve is good if it good he's still shit character compared to most other T8 characters he's playing T7
He still needs buffs
And some
Despite the short-falls this game has had recently there still isn't another fighting game out there that makes me feel like I'm kicking as much snot out of someone quite like Tekken does.
As a Steve main I must ask that you stop speaking. 😆
Now that I've finished the video. I apologize for my outburst. Lol
Just buff lionheart and every steve player (inlcuding me) will need more than that to stop downplaying him lmao.
Exactly lol LH Is his biggest down fall I mean man he has to work hard to get his damage as well but man LH is icing on the cake
Chilllll don’t blow up Steve’s spot he’s baddd🤫🤫🤫
no character in tekken 8 is bad, i feel like the top 15 characters are overtuned and outshines others
The characters are pretty balanced to be honest. There are just a few that are much better than the others; however, you can clearly win with any character you play with. I think that's a hallmark of a well made game.
no and i’m a delusional steve main
lol your not delusional. People just don’t want Steve to get buffs that’s all. there are players that have Steve infinite ptsd and they will never get over it 👌
Lmao first time I actually full watched the whole video. A breakdown feels a lot better when it’s about Steve. ❤cool video bro
OK, you were showing us a pretty good player struggling to stay relevant right?
That exception only justifies the fact that Steve needs buffs.
Steve don't play Tekken the same way others do. He don't just play Tekken, he play his opponents. So of course meta need to have the time to stabilise enought for the other and Steve's players time to adapt to it and really learn their kit before his full potential can give us a glimse.
Down players don't understand him
He has the biggest weaknesses out of any character in the game and he doesn't even have the best counter hits you don't understand him
@@JobeLovo Having a big weakness doesn't mean he can't play around it and yes he don't have the best counter hit anymore, but who said Steve can only counter hit to be good or that you absolutly need to nuke the opponent with every combo ? I do understand him and fighting game in general. If he was only playable with counter hit, they would have gave him the best counter hits by far, if his big weakness was that much of a handicap he would be almost unplayable which is nowhere near the case.
So learn to play him better if you play him or just learn to play more intelligently in general and you'll see: he is far from as bas as you think. I'm not claiming he is the best character in the game, but he is at least top 15/end of top 10 for me.
@@marcunbut1058just because he's not unplayable and you can win with him doesn't make him not weak ? And you have to be smoking crack cocaine to think he's top 10 are you trolling or something?
@@marcunbut1058 like what are the 9 characters better then him so I know who u think he's better then if your actually serious cuz saying steve is top 10 is outrageous
@@JobeLovo I don't have precisely anyone in mind, it was just a way to say he is stronger than you think but not the best of all as well. For me the strongest would be (keep in mind i'm taking into consideration only the character, not the player who control lt) Jin, Reina, Devil Jin, Bryan, Dragunov, Feng of course and King for sure in top 10 in no particular order here. King and Dragunov also because of how they currently are tecnically because of how this game work. Kazuya probably top 10 too haven't seen a lot about him, Lee maybe if we consider never missing input timings but we rarely see it. I clearly see Steve fit in top 10 like 9th or 10th place though. Can't give you a more precise/organised list though.
And you ? Who so you think is top 10 ? The same way, thinking about the characters themself not limited by player skill.
Hey, how are you doing PhiDX?
Not me sharing this video with my Tekken buddies before watching because of pure cope. Make Steve Great Again!
Lets keep it a buck most of the people one and doning are rookie hunting. They are looking for players they can farm rank from and will leave the second someone slightly challenges them. That's why im running into the most scrubbiest high ranked Tekken players I've ever seen.
Steve has never been bad, and I dont think thats going to be any different in T8, he doesnt need buffs but others definitely need nerfs
yeah but nerfing everybody is never gonna happen.
@@tristanherb49 we will just have to see how things go, the outcry against buffing characters has been pretty strong, maybe with time they will give some hard nerfs to other characters and maybe some minor buffs to steve
Numan is extraordinary steve player he even beat heera in a tournament and made him shift to feng…..he reaching finals doesn’t mean steve is good….perhaps he lost because of that….LH got beaten multiple times….that doesn’t only deal damage to your character’s health bar but also to your morale.
If one player did well in tournaments, that doesn't mean the character is good. We watch Rangchu win the tekken world with Banda, and Banda is still the worst character in tekken 7.
We need to see other people playing Steve in tournaments to see how good he is.
I wonder what complaints people have…I feel so out of the tekken space lol I’ve been watching tourneys and I play a lot. I personally have been having a lot of fun with tekken 8 and from what I can see in tourneys is a lot of people feel the game is really fun. People have their opinions on the heat system but I feel like people have adjusted to it so what other complaints are there that are bringing the game down? I genuinely don’t know lol
Steves only weakness is having the worst VA in the game, who said he was bad
Oh you're arguing against redditors. Bro they're not worth paying any attention to. They've always been the dumbest people on the internet.
numan is an excellent steve and paul player , definitely top 3 steve along with lowhigh and shin
Shin 😂 ? Heera is number 1 steve, followed by Low high, Numan and knee
@@MagnumOpus1122 heera is very good but he chokes in tough matches, he is dangerous in ft7 or ft10 when he has enough time to read his opponents
@@bilalharis838 That's exactly what defines a best from the rest. One who can adapt in a longer run and dominate, that's what Heera is all about. He can smoke Low high, Numan and the rest, he is that good. It was not long ago when he mauled Knee in a FT10 match, and there are not many in this world who can win Ft10 against knee, not even Arslan or Atif.
Shinblade is a noob, he got smoked by Bupa's steve, and Bupa is literally a nobody in the Tekken scene compared to the rest.
ltg got blown to bits by outfox awhile ago and the funny part is that the steve was a beginner, didn't really know anything outside of the outfox combo but yeah so because of that i've been knowing about outfox.
the more steve videos the better lol. great breakdown
Steve always been good he's never been low tier and he's better with the new stance he has and that's just my opinion.. but I've always thought Steve was good no matter what ppl say
Shoutout to the chat for making this video super enjoyable by uniting with those christmas lights emojis
As a Steve main who hates that we can’t block out of this new stance they gave us without doing frame perfect tech is annoying but this kind of analysis gave me insight on how to use it better thanks
I need more of this. Up till now Sajam has been my main analysis guy for other games but he is not on the Tekken grind atm. I just need more people on this platform to talk about the game and the situations in it.
I know it’s not exactly the conversation but imo Steve 100% is a character that can easily carry players up to like blue ranks.
I don’t see how people can’t see that he has so many different but similar looking punches and strings that he’s basically a punching Hwoarang at 90% of ranks imo. Ain’t no way 99% of purple ranks know what the hell to do against his millions of pressure strings and punches.
This video just showed how bad Lionheart is, being punished every single time by power crushes.
Pakistani tournaments are so un predictable.
Tournaments favourites never win here.
Full of upsets....
And this is the reason why they should never listen to the "omg the game is inbalanced" after the first 3 days let alone the first months of the game..
Always wondered how bad he can be, I always struggle with him, same with Bryan. King, Alisa are kinda easy for me but Steve and Bryan? Geez...
More than likely cause Steve and Bryan players are just outplaying with fundamentals rather than focusing on strong character tools
Thank god. I thought I was just shit at Tekken, I get cooked by every single Steve I fight
Steve is still weak. No power mid, b1 doesn't work if steve ss slightly will not counter hit, and no lowers, lion heart sux can be armored with all options. Don't bring up one frame cancel that still sux because of a high grab. Power mid, less frames on lows, and block in lion heart. Steve will be fixed.
qcf1???
@@PhiDXpkb df2 in mixup situations has helped me a lot too
@@PhiDXwhat does qfc1 mean?
@@PhiDXIt’s a good mid I agree, but it’s steppable to both sides and only does 21 damage.
Not to mention you’re forced into heat and that pisses me off.
When hatchet does more damage, kind of discouraging.
@@tristanherb49quarter circle forward one. Qcf refers to the input down, down forward, forward (d,df,f) and one is equivalent to left punch or square on PlayStation.
Ive been saying Steve is insane man! (Plus I also dont know how the hell to fight against this brit at all)
Shinblade a monster with Steve to
*reads title - immediately gets triggered* j/k. Love to see how Steve gameplay is developing.
We need Heera Malik vs Numan CH in a Tekken 8 tournament
What does ch mean?
@@ZainAli_11 It's either Chaudhary or Counter Hit I believe
@@ZainAli_11 Choudry or Chaudhary not sure of the spelling, Numan's name
Haha Steve is good but he is not top 2 he is top 10 maybe 😉
I don’t care if he’s good or not just give him back df2 shiro
I think specifically against Victor or character that has a high powercrush, i just Sway 2 from Lionheart, but yeah in tense situation you forget stuff.
It's a mindgame, that might work once, but you'll probably get launched if you keep doing it.
Steve has a nice matchup against Victor cause you can duck and side step most of his pressure
@@bonfist7277 Yeah mostly to do it once so they think twice before doing it again
I’ve been having a bit of a character crisis with this game. I have not been able to nail down a character I really like. And the only character I played from Tekken 7 has been made baby proof (Lars) and he’s just not fun. Then I started playing Steve and man is he fun. I’m glad someone is trying to make the character shine despite his disadvantages.
I feel u,i was a heihachi main and cant find my new main. Switched around 5-6chars and play kaz currently
@@newphonewhodis7152 I played him too, but I do consider myself a Miguel main. He may come back at some point but we shall see.
18:19 naughty, naughty PhiDx.
Steve player are like sub zero player's. Delusional downplaying
Nice vid as always Phidicks!
Huh
Bruh
I'm surprised Nina wasn't at the top. She feels super strong
Now do this for Asuka lmao
True. Its about time people stop lying about their main.
Viktors strings do almost the same damage as Steve's hardest combos in the game. Well done tekken devs 😂
as a tekken nub u like the optimistic disposition. keeps me excited. great content man.
Victor carrying as allways
This is why I personally never pay attention to teir lists seriously. I know they are some BUSTED chars in 8 rn esp Drag, but any char can win even in the wrong hands 😂 jokes aside I enjoy character loyalists that specializes and not "teir whore" they wanted to make Tekken more fun to spectate with aggressive play but without the loyalists that do well in tournaments its boring watching the same few characters to me thats boring. I remember the hype when JDCR busted out the hei.
Booooo Tekken 8 is garbage.
Ok I’m gonna go play it now 😂
I just want my CH launching DF2 back ( like season 1 T7) and for LNH to be less rigid personally. That’s all I ask, its not too much I’d say.
Noooo steve bad 👎 😢
ha ha ha this dude used steve and good in the same sentence.
Pure comedy
😁
ive been not liking victor lately so this is good to see and analyze