California... was an Island? | Armoured Skeptic Rabbit Hole

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  • Опубликовано: 6 окт 2024

Комментарии • 88

  • @thrillhouse4151
    @thrillhouse4151 Год назад +46

    Oh boy taking old timey maps literally! I can’t wait for the sea serpent episode.

    • @amyallen6863
      @amyallen6863 Год назад +5

      Do not call up that which you cannot put back down.

    • @n0etic_f0x
      @n0etic_f0x Год назад +3

      I can not wait for Space Jews!

    • @CrowManyClouds
      @CrowManyClouds Год назад +2

      @@n0etic_f0x followed shortly by Greg declaring that Natalie Portman is his soul mate?

    • @n0etic_f0x
      @n0etic_f0x Год назад +1

      @CrowManyClouds nah he is too classy for that I am thinking Ed Sheeran. We need to get even more wacky with it. Plus the whole gay thing allows him to not become a right wing grifter both practically or figuratively.

    • @evielikeshugs1055
      @evielikeshugs1055 Год назад

      Tldr; a prediction from 100s of years ago ended up being false and people 100s of years later are trying to prove how they were actually right

  • @marijkestoll816
    @marijkestoll816 Год назад +29

    I'm an archaeologist who works a lot with GIS, so I have a lot of background in cartography and the history of map-making. Some of the oddness of both the island and the attached maps is because they are navigation maps and were meant for ships traveling along the coast seeking safe harbors. Thus, accurate geographical direction was not important, accurate depictions of the coastline were, even if the results came out wonky. Coastlines would also have been the first areas of land to be mapped. At that time, explorers wouldn't have been traveling far inland beyond the coast. Those islands depicted on the map, where the Sierra Madres are located, were probably those peaks that they could see from the shore. A lot of map-making at the time was guess work and cartographers made a lot of assumptions. Map-making is also very political, in the past and today, so some of the decisions that went into making them had to do with political reasons. Another issue I see is that he gives no dates for when these maps are made, so we have no sense of the chronological order. Nor does he discuss how or why these maps were produced and for whom. Another key point with regards to depictions of the interior, well Coronado's expedition was in the 1550s and they traveled through the Southwest US. Maps would have been made along the way. Some of the maps he shows were made by cartographers who never visited these places but they would combine information from several explorer's maps (e.g., Coronado's maps and those from the people who explored the coastlines) to produce more complete maps, filling in the gaps with guesses. We also have to remember the instruments they were working with rudimentary and not very accurate. And yes, a lot maps were just copied over from older maps. It's funny that he claims at 24:14 that the island map is more accurate, yet Mexico is oddly shaped and not accurate at all - the Yucatan Peninsula is all types of wrong, as is the northern section of California and the eastern seaboard of Canada and the United States. The Caribbean is all out of proportion - how can he claim this maps is more accurate based on California alone? Anyway, yes it is very clear that Greg? has no background in history, cartography, geography, or any related field.

  • @saininj
    @saininj Год назад +29

    I....I think I'm starting to feel sorry for Armoured Skeptic. He really let that fart sniffing ego get the best of him.

    • @n0etic_f0x
      @n0etic_f0x Год назад +4

      He has always been like this, it is what becoming "Armoured Skeptic" was supposed to have saved him from, and how he got the name was abandoning his old ideas but he very much believed all this prior to his first video.

    • @novarachnid
      @novarachnid Год назад +3

      @@n0etic_f0x Yeah, way back I thought I'd like he and Sh0e's little talk show podcast thing... I was wrong. That room was hotboxed in steamy farts.

    • @n0etic_f0x
      @n0etic_f0x Год назад

      @Nova honestly I think people around him prevented both of them from going full on Sargon, it was kind of the result of the SJW wars on who became what politically as far as public persona is concerned.

  • @widdershinscryptid
    @widdershinscryptid Год назад +11

    I'm so very shocked he didn't connect this to Lake Bonneville. Y'know, the giant lake over the western part of Utah that drained 12,000~ years ago. The Great Salt Lake, Utah Lake, and Sevier Lake are all that's left of Lake Bonneville. I was just waiting to hear "Atlantis" or "Younger Dryas Impact". Missed some low-hanging fruit there, Greg!

  • @themartianVA87
    @themartianVA87 Год назад +6

    Ever since Greg first rambled about The Green Man, all I could see was Charlie in his GREENMAN outfit from Always Sunny. I think Greg might be huffing paint from a sock like Charlie, as well.

  • @GodKingReiss
    @GodKingReiss Год назад +18

    Greg’s suspicion at island maps and not-island maps existing simultaneously is like thinking there’s something behind people who create flat earth projections today, as if our world went through some Silmarillion shit where it was flat until it magically became round.

    • @PunkZombie1300
      @PunkZombie1300 Год назад +2

      Also the fact the cartographers would often put incorrect information on their maps as a sort of copyright protection. Putting fake town names and other markers that you made up can prove that another cartographer is copying your work if they include those markers.
      While I doubt somebody did something as extreme as turning California into an island as a marker, it does show that there were enough cartographers just copying other people's work for it to be a problem. And if the older maps had California as an island due to an assumption based on exploring the lower penninsula, there will likely have been people copying those older maps instead of exploring themselves. And even as new information about California came out there would likely be older cartographers who don't want to change how they draw their maps, and so just keep making them the same way.
      Even if this doesn't explain everything there's no reason to believe it was an island as little as tens of thousands of years ago (I haven't finished the video so idk if he gives a time period for when it might've been an island, but I figured 10,000+ years would be generous).
      Edit: So Greg basically brought up exactly the point I made. I honestly don't know why he still made the video, since it really didn't add anything to his theory. Maybe he still wasn't fully convinced at this point so didn't mind not cramming a "this is (probably) true" into his conclusion.

    • @Elysium_the_Bard
      @Elysium_the_Bard Год назад +1

      Wait, I've never read the Silmarillion yet...is that seriously what happens? I mean, at least in the world of Tolkien I can believe that COULD happen, due to literal magic and deities/deity-like beings existing in that universe.

    • @GodKingReiss
      @GodKingReiss Год назад +1

      @@Elysium_the_Bard Pretty much. As the story goes, Arda was created as a flat world in an enclosed spherical plane that was made round towards the end of the Second Age as punishment for humankind attempting to invade the Undying Lands. Though there's also other drafts and texts that say it was always round and the flat earth details are in-universe Numenorean myths, but that's a whole other can of worms.

    • @julietfischer5056
      @julietfischer5056 Год назад

      @@PunkZombie1300- Copyright is a recent thing. Nobody in the 1400s and 1500s had copyright.

  • @Grace-tg4oy
    @Grace-tg4oy Год назад +4

    Living for him calling the clues "Easter eggs" like this is a video game and not early American cartography

  • @carlwarner5239
    @carlwarner5239 Год назад +9

    I just finished reading The Eye of the World by Robert Jorden and there is a literal character called the green man and when they introduced him I almost lost myself because I couldn't stop thinking about these videos.

  • @damejanea.macdonald2371
    @damejanea.macdonald2371 Год назад +13

    Proof that California Island maps are correct based on the notes I took while watching this:
    1) People who later named things used some names that were also used on the island version of the map.
    2) The people who made other island maps during the time people weren't exploring that part of the world used the same unchanged information from the earlier island maps.
    3) The island maps got some things not in California right, like including a lake sort of near where the Great Salt Lake is. It doesn't look like the Great Salt Lake and is connected to a river that isn't there, but it's sort of nearby and the map would be wrong if it wasn't a previous version of the lake that maybe existed.
    4) The top of the island is not very far from where the United States would arbitrarily define the edges of a state hundreds of years later.
    5) Later maps after California was declared to not be an island included mountain ranges somewhere near where the supposed channel existed, which is to say where there are mountain ranges by his own four island hypothesis.
    6) It's not impossible that California was an island when we weren't looking and just happened to not be an island when we finally did look.
    7) Though point 2 relies on people not copying maps, maybe there was a map we have no proof existed was used to get the shape to match the state borders.
    This is probably more plausible than people made mistakes and no one got around to checking who was right for a while. People so rarely make mistakes, so by Occam's Razor California was an island that suddenly stopped being an island sometime, QED.

  • @s7robin105
    @s7robin105 Год назад +6

    As a Californian it is true the first Spanish explorers thought it was an Island.. Which was later proven incorrect by EVERYONE else. How the hell can he call himself Armored "Skeptic" anymore? lol. This would be like saying every map in history was correct until later it just magically changed to fit the modern ones.

  • @esbenm6544
    @esbenm6544 Год назад +2

    I can't watch Greg's videos without Jake's commentary or my brain just keeps repeating Rich Evans saying "oh my gaaaawd."

  • @codydoxey2497
    @codydoxey2497 Год назад +1

    Shout out to the chatter with the red line reference. I see you, i get you, my man!

  • @sptony2718
    @sptony2718 Год назад +1

    Greg should really start looking for those sea snakes and monster squids shown on those old maps irl.

  • @dirtbag1713
    @dirtbag1713 6 месяцев назад

    Gotta day I really love falling down this rabbit hole.

  • @cf3714
    @cf3714 Год назад +2

    California was definitely an island at one point...30 million years ago. I don't think they had that many cartographers back then.

  • @Andy-br1hq
    @Andy-br1hq Год назад +2

    Greg’s vocal fry is maddening

  • @mikaelamorgan7576
    @mikaelamorgan7576 Год назад +1

    I live in California we have islands off the costs with large mammals suggesting there was more land a long time ago not less or ice or something

  • @jpbell82
    @jpbell82 Год назад +3

    He sounds like a smug Spirit Science

  • @jsnowd02
    @jsnowd02 Год назад +1

    Been waiting for the next instalment of Greg's crazy

  • @luftcorde
    @luftcorde Год назад +1

    Okay, but the first expedition to *successfully* cross the Northwest Passage soley by ship did not occur in 1590. It was completed in 1906! Previous expeditions in the 1800a made it across. But they were either solely by land, or a combination of land and sea (and one of those land and sea combination expeditions went West to East, not East to West)

  • @TheVeryHungrySingularity
    @TheVeryHungrySingularity Год назад +2

    does he know you can drive to California?

  • @Rob_Fordd
    @Rob_Fordd Год назад +1

    Can't wait to see him somehow roll mormonism into all this.

  • @SashaTheDog
    @SashaTheDog Год назад +2

    "Cartography wasnt an exact science", when I heard that now after I learned cartography I just know hes talking out of his rear end.
    A lot of old maps where made using actual tools designed for this job even using Stars for coordination of where people were.
    A lot of old maps when put ontop of modern maps are even very close to what we now have as certain land shapes.
    Cartography was a expensive and valuable profession for thousands of years even dating back to the roman era.
    Greg simply ignores evidence to fit his own narrative!
    Surveying is an old profession that was always used by humanity, errors could occure and needed a lot of time to be fixed but when fixed the maps where of high quality and used for their intended purpose.
    Also I hate how he doesnt make a difference between stylized maps and maps used for travel.
    And a lot of maps work by one exact point and build on each and every fixed point that is used as the basis for the next ones to set and if you mess up in that process it just goes trough everything you measure out. Thats why the maps with the island might be made exact while incorporating the measuring error making california an island.
    Thats it, an error wich was found way too late, a calculation error.

  • @rockandroleplay5465
    @rockandroleplay5465 Год назад +4

    Weren't the giant albinos on hand to help with the map details?

  • @Akmundra1
    @Akmundra1 Год назад +2

    Eratosthenes calculated the circumference of the earth over 2000 years ago. I don’t get how Greg can claim to be intellectual/skeptic anymore. He’s become intentionally ignorant of reality.

  • @FrankLightheart
    @FrankLightheart Год назад

    I cannot believe this is the same guy I used to watch back in the day.
    Greg.... what HAPPENED to you?!

  • @exalteddjinn69
    @exalteddjinn69 Год назад

    We've been on the run
    Driving in the sun
    Looking out for number one
    California here we come
    Right back where we started from
    Hustlers grab your guns
    Your shadow weighs a ton
    Driving down the 101
    California here we come
    Right back where we started from
    California here we come
    On the stereo
    Listen as we go
    Nothings gonna stop me now
    California here we come
    Right back where we started from
    Pedal to the floor
    Thinking of the roar
    Gotta get us to the show
    California here we come
    Right back where we started from
    California here we come
    California
    California here we come
    Oh
    California, California here we come
    California, California here we come
    California, California here we come
    California, California here we come

  • @kermitthorson9719
    @kermitthorson9719 Год назад +1

    o satan im not ready for this

  • @KrazyKaiser
    @KrazyKaiser 5 месяцев назад

    Jesus even through the filter of you watching him, i feel like greg is rotting my brain

  • @BaronVonQuiply
    @BaronVonQuiply Год назад

    At some point, someone had to officially declare that Europe was not an Island.
    Odd how that doesn't start any conspiraceh theroy jenkins.

  • @dorianleakey
    @dorianleakey 8 месяцев назад

    At the risk of defending Greg, during earthquakes land will move metres at a time., you could lose an island overnight, but it would be metres away from mainland when it happened.

  • @packpowerfan
    @packpowerfan Год назад

    Greg has lost his absolute goddamned mind and I can honestly not contain the laughter.

  • @jademunky4609
    @jademunky4609 Год назад

    Something Something beachfront property in Arizona.

  • @seraphonica
    @seraphonica Год назад +2

    these got so much harder to listen to once I realized that Greg is using his phone sex voice

    • @seraphonica
      @seraphonica Год назад +1

      ohgawd it gets worse every time he says "PENINSULA"

  • @lnk2158
    @lnk2158 Год назад +1

    Seems people just didn’t realize how big California and Baja California separately are and assumed they had explored it all when they hadn't even explored half of it. Considering people today living in other states think San Francisco and Los Angeles are only an hour away by car, it wouldn't be surprising if people hundreds of years ago made mistakes.

    • @jojorose1947
      @jojorose1947 7 месяцев назад

      All this comment did was remind me humans are stupid and that I'm never getting that LA to San Fran high speed rail.

  • @hex.enigma
    @hex.enigma Год назад

    Got an ad for Gaia on this video.

  • @lazzygnome4060
    @lazzygnome4060 Год назад

    There's some bugs that need to be worked out - ArmoredButNotSkeptic
    These maps are crazy accurate and can be taken literally - also ArmoredButNotSkeptic.

  • @n0etic_f0x
    @n0etic_f0x Год назад

    It is worth our time to see if something that is totally absurd on its face is plausible? No. I am sorry no it isn't, by definition it never can be. No Greg that is flatly absurd.

  • @jantjepietjepol
    @jantjepietjepol Год назад

    We all have our path in life. Some of us become less bigotted others get into mudslides. i love progress.

  • @iggyelle
    @iggyelle Год назад

    Some people learn that we're taught a really dodgy version of history and understand that we learn stories from the point of view of imperialists and conquistadors. And then there's Greg....

  • @thereccher8746
    @thereccher8746 Год назад +1

    Does Armored Skeptic have any clue how slow land masses move? Does he really think California can move the width of a full US state in a few centuries?

    • @jojorose1947
      @jojorose1947 7 месяцев назад

      I don't think he thinks any of this stuff is true, it's more a willful delusion to fit his persona shift and cultivate a distrusting conspiracy minded fanbase.
      The Piri Reis map for instance is just a copy of a Columbus map from a handful of years earlier that he charted while sailing past Venezuela and up towards Cuba, it's not a "much older map", but saying it in that sinister conspiratorial tone, while lying about the map's age puts out the idea to his viewers that it's actually an ancient secret.
      You can only come to these positions through dishonesty, even if that involves tricking yourself into believing your own lies.

  • @strawberry_milk_goblin2397
    @strawberry_milk_goblin2397 Год назад +1

    What is the hecking pacing of amoureds videos? It's so frustrating to listen to him speak, like I'm no public speaker but it feels like he's just not breathing enough

  • @kermitthorson9719
    @kermitthorson9719 Год назад

    i may have to rewatch this over a bowl. i spent my lunch listening to this and arguing for trans rights on reddit during lunch!!!! 🏳‍🌈🏳‍⚧

  • @XanKreigor
    @XanKreigor Год назад

    He's a massive narcissist. That's why he's so giddy when he talks about himself.

  • @peyotecowboy3199
    @peyotecowboy3199 Год назад

    Couldn't it be that one expedition moved on land east to west and covered the width of california where the other expedition landed on the west coast and traveled east? Maybe they hit the peninsula and guessed the rest.

  • @papaunderwater3316
    @papaunderwater3316 Год назад

    9:45 amstardam is a country?

  • @Elysium_the_Bard
    @Elysium_the_Bard Год назад

    9:23 "...there was even a rumor of boats getting caught up in the current of the channel and being swept down south."
    Why does Greg even bother to mention this, as if its something really important to make note of? He does know that there are numerous explanations for such a phenomenon and ways that people can misinterpret such phenomenons in a SPECIFIC way, right?

  • @ramenisbombman
    @ramenisbombman Год назад

    Bro is really on one

  • @charleskirby3958
    @charleskirby3958 Год назад

    Armoured skeptic, can't stop won't stop. This guy's on a national level mental health tear up. I for one support him and am interested in where this is going.

  • @carsonspears8568
    @carsonspears8568 Год назад

    Yeeeeeeessssssss

  • @bean8672
    @bean8672 Год назад

    Yes crazy greg is my emotional support animal

  • @kermitthorson9719
    @kermitthorson9719 Год назад +1

    california used to not be land, it was sea floor until the Atlantic started to spread and pushed teh north Atlantic plates into teh pacific. California is on another tectonic plate than the rest of teh US

  • @colfraserholser
    @colfraserholser Год назад

    This is so dumb. Those so called "low-lands" of the Owens Valley are all over 3000 ft. above sea level. Much of the east side of the sierra is over 5000 ft. The Ocean would have to do a loooot of climbing

  • @yaumelepire6310
    @yaumelepire6310 Год назад

    I know enough about cartography, geology and hydrology to know why he's not making any sense. Listening to him is infuriating.
    The kind of disaster that would lead to an island, any island that big, bumping into a continent in the timeline of humanity's mere existence would have been a cataclysm beyond any other. It would be like the Krakatoa on steroids. We're talking about events that birth features like the Himalayas in a fraction of a fraction of the time India took to reach its current place!

  • @mizcs
    @mizcs Год назад

    Broke: california was an island.
    Woke: florida should be an island

  • @Piterdeveirs333
    @Piterdeveirs333 Год назад

    Fuck, he is the most gullible skeptic ever

  • @robmckennie4203
    @robmckennie4203 Год назад

    Curious about what native American histories have to say about California island

    • @julietfischer5056
      @julietfischer5056 Год назад

      If you could go back in time and ask a pre-contact inhabitant (using a translator or sign language), they'd probably look you over carefully then make you lie down in the shade with a cool, damp, cloth over your face. Or point out a tiny coastal islet.

    • @julietfischer5056
      @julietfischer5056 Год назад

      From Wikipedia:
      Multiple theories regarding the origin of the name California, as well as the root language of the term, have been proposed, but most historians believe the name likely originated from a 16th-century novel, _Las Sergas de Esplandián._ The novel, popular at the time of the Spanish exploration of Mexico and the Baja California Peninsula, describes a fictional island named California, ruled by Queen Calafia, east of the Indies. The author of the novel, Garci Rodríguez de Montalvo, also known as Ordóñez de Montalvo, is thought to have derived the term California from the Arabic Khalif and/or Khalifa, but he might also have been influenced by the term "Califerne" in the 11th-century epic French poem _The Song of Roland._
      When Spanish explorers in the 16th century first encountered the Baja California Peninsula, west of the Sea of Cortez, they believed the peninsula to be an island similar to the island described in de Montalvo's novel. They named the land California. Initially, California applied only to Baja California Peninsula, but as Spanish explorers and settlers moved north and inland, the region known as California, or Las Californias, grew. Eventually it included not only the peninsula, but also the lands north of the peninsula, along the coast of today's U.S. state of California. Unlike the peninsula, this region was only practical to reach by sea voyages, and acquired a separate identity: Alta (Upper) California, making the lower territory Baja (Lower) California.

  • @Nethr
    @Nethr Год назад

    Of course it was an island, haven't you played dead island 2? It takes place in California.

  • @luciuseclipse
    @luciuseclipse Год назад

    Honestly Armoured Conspiracist is more fun and interesting than he was as a skeptic.

  • @BabbleCacophony
    @BabbleCacophony Год назад

    It is weird that jake wants to take a fun video so seriously.