I was having a private conversation in whispers with my friend some time ago, next day we both find out we have been banned for 4 days because we used some loaded gamer words. No one reported us, no one else knew about it, just an alarm went off in ZOS HQ and they decided we are not allowed to communicate with each other in this way like some real actual 1984 shit. Only way I see this game ever being playable at this point is making an addon with a seperate chat that ZOS cannot track, and people who are afraid of words can simply chose not to download it. Doesn't matter for me personally, I am jumping this sinking ship.
1900CP on NA and 3000CP on EU here. Played since beta, both endgame PvE and PvP. Got randomly banned on 13th of Septemper after AI automatically detected me calling my friend the c-word ('aussie' for mate) in a party chat (never swore in public chats before). Customer Support doubled down on the decision: 'At ZeniMax we moderate toxicity and inappropriate language in all channels at all times, proactively. This means that we don't require a report to remove inappropriate content from our services, nor do we wait for one. Please refrain from engaging in inappropriate chat at all times in all channels moving forward if you'd like to continue participating in our service.' Sent about what happened to all my friends along with all my savings and quit. Not gonna participate in this reincarnation of 1984. This company deserves bankruptcy, not any of your money. It's been fun, Captain. No, it hasn't.
long story short, yes they are. i was playing eso on psn with my longtime female friend about a month ago. im a gay male and we jokingly call each other b!tch a lot. well one day i was whispering her while she was in a dungeon without me and i jokingly called her that again. i got an email by the next day quoting my message to her and telling me it was strike one, and if kept doing it they would ban me. she would NEVER have reported that because we have done it jokingly for almost ten years and we both laugh about it. but apparently i can't even whisper her stuff like that in game now.
This is the problem right there. People who know each other and like to RP will say outrageous nasty things about someone because they RP as an Argonian for example and often get just as nasty replies back.. Some people just like this sort of thing... But that's just not going to happen if they start banning people because they said bad word x, y or z.
I just commented the game is just being racist toward aussies lmao. I have been perm banned off reddit like 9 times for being an aussie and usong aussie words. Worst one was getting banned for calling some a monkey because they did 35 arenas in one day on new world. I made the mod explain why i was banned in DM. So funny.
@stonic5 An odd one, imo I'm torn on it. Just because calling someone a monkey for you might be normalized where you are, it could still be easily taken the wrong way and if it becomes a common insult on the Reddit, I could see why it's moderated, there is logical sense for that being moderated. Within the same logic, should n word and other phrases be allowed by the black community? They are 'allowed' to say it and it's normalized for them, so in the same case there should be no punishment for such words. But again - How will they moderate it from being used in a toxic way? Race checks through support tickets? No way. Bit of a large difference in the words, sure, but it's within the same ballpark of uses and being used by certain cultures/groups of people and easily being used in an offensive manner. --- Now if you're doing it in a private message, then I feel context matters a lot more and it should be moderated less and punished if a report is made. But publicly should be moderated differently. I don't think it's too much to ask/do, to use different words in public places while speaking your way in private. Also from my experience, never have I witnessed this AI picking up any of my private messages in ESO... Yet lol
I think Zos needs to stop trying to police the video game and let people have fun. Unless someone reports a conversation, there is no need for Zos to do anything ever. And every report should be reviewed on individual basis, and reviewed by more than one person. Developers need to stop acting like a government.
they are probably running it so that it can "learn" and eventually be able to handle all reports and decision outcomes in the future. it's an investment and it will be cheaper to make AI do that instead of paying CS
@@adnanelamrani6659 also a way to streamline killing your game, never thought we would witness a game moderate their rated M audience to death but here we are
Facebook AI banned me after disabling my account. When I tried reactivating I had news I got banned from the site. So it wouldn’t surprise me if this happens. Let robots monitor things without real eyes. This happens.
This is rediculous , literally it's an adult game. Unless your literally bullying , so dumb. I have spent a tonne of these games, they start bringing in shit like this and banning people, you are going to lose a hell of all of players.
If zos cannot even be bothered to do basic moderation and trust a robot to do it instead, what hope does the game itself have with this much complacency for high potential chaos? The dip in quality has been massive but dear god they aren't even trying at this point, it's like the devs of neverwinter online draining every penny out of their game before they kill it.
the AI used to filter actual reports wouldn't bother most of the community but AI just trawling through thousands of line of chat looking for any bad keyword is really disappointing considering how bad their chat filter is.
Why don't they just state in the TOS that they OWN you, all your actions and all your thoughts!!?? You have to submit and become a slave to ZOS or else!!!
I think the best way to protest this is to have a very large number of people type "cum orbs" in chat, whispers or not, and then watch Zos have a meltdown as a portion of their playerbase was all banned at the same time.
another day of treating a dying rated m game thats 10 years old with a community so small everyone knows eachother by name like it's a daycare. this game literally talks about rape and murder as plot points and to open their website you have to type in your birthday like you're about to view porn, but no swearing thats too far. god forbid i dm my friend a joke they're ok with.
I get their responses in the forums, but I wonder if more accurately there are temp bans so there is enough time for humans to actually look at the AI temp bans. This starting process may also be teaching AI (at the expense of the temp ban folks in the process) more nuance and certain phrases that are acceptable. Like the DK poop fist may be one that can get flagged. However, real talk, this AI stuff may be really good for how awful people get in PvP salt whispers.
How about asking whom it's directed at if they are offended. Second maybe track repeat offenders, though this may be imperfect if rp, lol. Maybe just use ai to focus on ppl n use human judgement to discern if a ban is warranted. I forsee ppl using proxy phrases to thwart ai, lol. 0's and 1's are never a good policy, a human should be final judge, I agree with an ai to flag for review by a human.
I sent in a ticket 3 months ago about my eso plus not having refreshed even though it was paid (xbox server issue at the time) n they said nothing about the eso plus not reneweing but instead flagged my account for character name being profane, but i’ve had these names since 2017 n never been reported once(confirmed since they said this is the first ever flag on my acc for a name report) n i knew it was one of the Bethesda customer support people who did it cuz they reported my “Zosdon’tloveyou” Europe server named character that i haven’t even logged into in 2 years. Shi is one big funny joke of a gaming service😂
yep, i was given a 3 day suspension for a word i used in a group chat with my irl friend, and got the same response from zos about how they dont need to wait for anything to be reported
just give game users the privileges to judge some tickets in an anonymized and randomized matter after the AI would take automated moderative action, and decide if it should be escalated human ZOS employee before taking that action for a review. Have the tickets be crosschecked with decisions from other players (also randomly picked) and develop a score system that checks for outliers in decisions to eliminate abuse. Then pay players some crowns to do that preselection (like make a menu where you can work such tickets). Community can police itself, with the help of A/I, ZOS gets useful (community preserving) work handed to them basically for free and can show some digital gratitude :P (skins also possible if you don't want opportunity cost in lost Gold purchases, they would show "hey this person has done a service to the community").
The 'Cum orb' player got a warning not a ban ( 2.53 ). I can only hope they are using the AI as a tool, not as a replacement. The reason for this is myself and a few hundred ( or more ) people had our ETSY accounts permanently banned. Later people figured out how to get reinstalled, but there was a time limit. It's not the same.. a game ban and an ETSY ban, which was over half my income... but I seriously dislike the AI ban algorythums. What Zos says and what happens doesn't always appear to be the same thing.
Facebook has been using AI for about decade to moderate groups and private chat. The tech is there, and it's actually pretty advanced in the industry. However, the process is different for every industry and company. Since they are testing with it, they should only activate flagging and reporting, not deciding to ban people (which they allegedly did so that's fine). However they also have to make that whole process flawless otherwise the "human" will end up making a worse decision than the AI. These things can happen because it's harder to decide when it's AI + human who are partaking in the process. (Maybe the human gets a million different flags and has to make a million decisions in a short amount of time, of course he will make the wrong decisions sometimes, even judges make wrong decisions) On another note, ZOS's intention of making people "cause less harm" is noble. It's the same idea that drove them to ban teabaggers. However, it's the wrong way to approach the issue. It's always been better to arm people against being harmed FIRST, before even thinking about disarming people that can cause harm once they have developed the ability to. (This alone can open up a debate but that's not the point). As an example, AI can also power smart chat filters and give people more flexibility in defending themselves if they wanted to. But we focus too much on the external that we forget that we have to fix things from within first and then look outwards.
Cum Orbs ✨️⚪️⚪️⚪️⚪️✨️
i saw this comment before i watched and was so curious about the context 😹
I was having a private conversation in whispers with my friend some time ago, next day we both find out we have been banned for 4 days because we used some loaded gamer words. No one reported us, no one else knew about it, just an alarm went off in ZOS HQ and they decided we are not allowed to communicate with each other in this way like some real actual 1984 shit.
Only way I see this game ever being playable at this point is making an addon with a seperate chat that ZOS cannot track, and people who are afraid of words can simply chose not to download it. Doesn't matter for me personally, I am jumping this sinking ship.
1900CP on NA and 3000CP on EU here. Played since beta, both endgame PvE and PvP.
Got randomly banned on 13th of Septemper after AI automatically detected me calling my friend the c-word ('aussie' for mate) in a party chat (never swore in public chats before). Customer Support doubled down on the decision:
'At ZeniMax we moderate toxicity and inappropriate language in all channels at all times, proactively. This means that we don't require a report to remove inappropriate content from our services, nor do we wait for one. Please refrain from engaging in inappropriate chat at all times in all channels moving forward if you'd like to continue participating in our service.'
Sent about what happened to all my friends along with all my savings and quit.
Not gonna participate in this reincarnation of 1984.
This company deserves bankruptcy, not any of your money.
It's been fun, Captain. No, it hasn't.
Was this written or spoken?
@@gronkogronksen9603 Written, PC.
someone got banned while in maelsrom arena and doing a /say 'fuck you' to a boss too so it legit scared me because I swear like a MF in whispers lol.
Its just the game being racist to aussies. We use these words all the time as emphasis or endearment.
long story short, yes they are. i was playing eso on psn with my longtime female friend about a month ago. im a gay male and we jokingly call each other b!tch a lot. well one day i was whispering her while she was in a dungeon without me and i jokingly called her that again. i got an email by the next day quoting my message to her and telling me it was strike one, and if kept doing it they would ban me. she would NEVER have reported that because we have done it jokingly for almost ten years and we both laugh about it. but apparently i can't even whisper her stuff like that in game now.
This is the problem right there. People who know each other and like to RP will say outrageous nasty things about someone because they RP as an Argonian for example and often get just as nasty replies back.. Some people just like this sort of thing... But that's just not going to happen if they start banning people because they said bad word x, y or z.
I got perma banned for something similar too shits insane
i guess a profanity filter means nothing
and we wonder why the performance tanked lol.
Get rid of AI
Well have to do the 40k way...
If my account gets banned because I am Australian... I won't be coming back or even trying to, no ticket I will just leave.
I just commented the game is just being racist toward aussies lmao.
I have been perm banned off reddit like 9 times for being an aussie and usong aussie words.
Worst one was getting banned for calling some a monkey because they did 35 arenas in one day on new world.
I made the mod explain why i was banned in DM. So funny.
You should, write them an appeal with your most commonly used words.
@@stonic5 Well calling someone a Monkey is racist tbh but anyways
@stonic5 An odd one, imo I'm torn on it. Just because calling someone a monkey for you might be normalized where you are, it could still be easily taken the wrong way and if it becomes a common insult on the Reddit, I could see why it's moderated, there is logical sense for that being moderated.
Within the same logic, should n word and other phrases be allowed by the black community? They are 'allowed' to say it and it's normalized for them, so in the same case there should be no punishment for such words.
But again - How will they moderate it from being used in a toxic way? Race checks through support tickets? No way.
Bit of a large difference in the words, sure, but it's within the same ballpark of uses and being used by certain cultures/groups of people and easily being used in an offensive manner.
---
Now if you're doing it in a private message, then I feel context matters a lot more and it should be moderated less and punished if a report is made. But publicly should be moderated differently.
I don't think it's too much to ask/do, to use different words in public places while speaking your way in private.
Also from my experience, never have I witnessed this AI picking up any of my private messages in ESO... Yet lol
Whos the employee who saw two guildies joking around and got super duper mad? Cause that person needs to get it together.
Or loose their job
I think Zos needs to stop trying to police the video game and let people have fun. Unless someone reports a conversation, there is no need for Zos to do anything ever. And every report should be reviewed on individual basis, and reviewed by more than one person. Developers need to stop acting like a government.
they are probably running it so that it can "learn" and eventually be able to handle all reports and decision outcomes in the future. it's an investment and it will be cheaper to make AI do that instead of paying CS
Governments also need to stop acting like that too if they dont want revolution and a shitter version if the same system.
@@adnanelamrani6659 also a way to streamline killing your game, never thought we would witness a game moderate their rated M audience to death but here we are
Isn't this game rated M?
Yes, at least. There's a lot of blood and violence.
The first big bad main story quest guy is the god of surprise hugs
vivec and molag bal should be banned cuz they played with their "swords"
at this point, M for Made by sensitive dumbasses
@@adnanelamrani6659 They are gods tho.. So I'm sure there's an exception for that. Must be a difference between god tier and human..
And even more validation for my decision to quit this game. Keep at it ZOS! You're helping more people go touch grass!
Facebook AI banned me after disabling my account. When I tried reactivating I had news I got banned from the site. So it wouldn’t surprise me if this happens. Let robots monitor things without real eyes. This happens.
I'll be uninstalling for sure now.
Will I get banned for typing ‘PvP’ in zone chat?
Only if you write "fix pvp"
This is rediculous , literally it's an adult game. Unless your literally bullying , so dumb. I have spent a tonne of these games, they start bringing in shit like this and banning people, you are going to lose a hell of all of players.
Fr 🤦🏾♀️
This doesn't surprise me at all with what's been happening with social media for years. First social media, now video games, next your telephone.
Why can't they just add a profanity filter and leave us alone let us say what we want for lords sake
There is a profanity filter in settings.
There is a filter you need to turn off to see profanity go figure
@@spiritualspinster4222 Good to know, that makes this even worse
maybe this is why riften on xbox na is turning into a ghost town now.
"Mixed feelings"...brother, you a sith lord in the making.
Leaving such power in hands of an AI, is never a good idea.
At the very least, someone should monitor and direct the AI to avoid this stuff.
The crown store online strikes back
Friend got a permanban over the weekend from it.
If zos cannot even be bothered to do basic moderation and trust a robot to do it instead, what hope does the game itself have with this much complacency for high potential chaos? The dip in quality has been massive but dear god they aren't even trying at this point, it's like the devs of neverwinter online draining every penny out of their game before they kill it.
the AI used to filter actual reports wouldn't bother most of the community but AI just trawling through thousands of line of chat looking for any bad keyword is really disappointing considering how bad their chat filter is.
Utter trash heap of a game never returning
Why don't they just state in the TOS that they OWN you, all your actions and all your thoughts!!?? You have to submit and become a slave to ZOS or else!!!
I think the best way to protest this is to have a very large number of people type "cum orbs" in chat, whispers or not, and then watch Zos have a meltdown as a portion of their playerbase was all banned at the same time.
Careful what u write here. They’re watching! 👀
Good
I bag every boss i kill hopefully it doesn't report me
another day of treating a dying rated m game thats 10 years old with a community so small everyone knows eachother by name like it's a daycare.
this game literally talks about rape and murder as plot points and to open their website you have to type in your birthday like you're about to view porn, but no swearing thats too far.
god forbid i dm my friend a joke they're ok with.
Dont use eso chat for anything but lfg, there is discord etc
ERP? Hell I just learned a new term.
Damn eso really cant avoid controversy
I get their responses in the forums, but I wonder if more accurately there are temp bans so there is enough time for humans to actually look at the AI temp bans. This starting process may also be teaching AI (at the expense of the temp ban folks in the process) more nuance and certain phrases that are acceptable. Like the DK poop fist may be one that can get flagged.
However, real talk, this AI stuff may be really good for how awful people get in PvP salt whispers.
Is it an invitation to RP or private chat outside of the game (ex discord)? If so it could be heavily breaking immersion.
Go to full AI! It probably has more common sense than the people currently working in that department.
Harassment reports are simply used as a weapon!
They didn't specify where the humans were. AI is way more expensive than outsourcing to asia.
How about asking whom it's directed at if they are offended. Second maybe track repeat offenders, though this may be imperfect if rp, lol. Maybe just use ai to focus on ppl n use human judgement to discern if a ban is warranted. I forsee ppl using proxy phrases to thwart ai, lol. 0's and 1's are never a good policy, a human should be final judge, I agree with an ai to flag for review by a human.
I sent in a ticket 3 months ago about my eso plus not having refreshed even though it was paid (xbox server issue at the time) n they said nothing about the eso plus not reneweing but instead flagged my account for character name being profane, but i’ve had these names since 2017 n never been reported once(confirmed since they said this is the first ever flag on my acc for a name report) n i knew it was one of the Bethesda customer support people who did it cuz they reported my “Zosdon’tloveyou” Europe server named character that i haven’t even logged into in 2 years. Shi is one big funny joke of a gaming service😂
It’s wild. Funny ass name tho lol
NBs cooked now since they have to crouch all the time. Ai will think they are Tbagging lol
yep, i was given a 3 day suspension for a word i used in a group chat with my irl friend, and got the same response from zos about how they dont need to wait for anything to be reported
This should work out well for them right?
just give game users the privileges to judge some tickets in an anonymized and randomized matter after the AI would take automated moderative action, and decide if it should be escalated human ZOS employee before taking that action for a review. Have the tickets be crosschecked with decisions from other players (also randomly picked) and develop a score system that checks for outliers in decisions to eliminate abuse. Then pay players some crowns to do that preselection (like make a menu where you can work such tickets). Community can police itself, with the help of A/I, ZOS gets useful (community preserving) work handed to them basically for free and can show some digital gratitude :P (skins also possible if you don't want opportunity cost in lost Gold purchases, they would show "hey this person has done a service to the community").
*engage say nothing mode*
me n the boys off to jail with this one
2024. Worst year in history for gamers. It has to get worse before it gets better. 😭
Can we have a list of the keywords so we know what not to say?
cum orbs
The 'Cum orb' player got a warning not a ban ( 2.53 ).
I can only hope they are using the AI as a tool, not as a replacement. The reason for this is myself and a few hundred ( or more ) people had our ETSY accounts permanently banned. Later people figured out how to get reinstalled, but there was a time limit. It's not the same.. a game ban and an ETSY ban, which was over half my income... but I seriously dislike the AI ban algorythums.
What Zos says and what happens doesn't always appear to be the same thing.
like ZOS got fully working game in ot's core after 10 years to spent time in this lmao
make a female argonian toon, go to a tavern, "my hist is weeping" - BANNED
2 seconds, banned
Just deleted the game. I am out. That's absolute BS.
Perhaps NUT ORBS IS BETTER?
ERP is against Tos 😂😂😂
Facebook has been using AI for about decade to moderate groups and private chat. The tech is there, and it's actually pretty advanced in the industry. However, the process is different for every industry and company. Since they are testing with it, they should only activate flagging and reporting, not deciding to ban people (which they allegedly did so that's fine). However they also have to make that whole process flawless otherwise the "human" will end up making a worse decision than the AI. These things can happen because it's harder to decide when it's AI + human who are partaking in the process. (Maybe the human gets a million different flags and has to make a million decisions in a short amount of time, of course he will make the wrong decisions sometimes, even judges make wrong decisions)
On another note, ZOS's intention of making people "cause less harm" is noble. It's the same idea that drove them to ban teabaggers. However, it's the wrong way to approach the issue.
It's always been better to arm people against being harmed FIRST, before even thinking about disarming people that can cause harm once they have developed the ability to. (This alone can open up a debate but that's not the point). As an example, AI can also power smart chat filters and give people more flexibility in defending themselves if they wanted to. But we focus too much on the external that we forget that we have to fix things from within first and then look outwards.
This is bullshit
Especially when they cry they want more eso+ membets, And then they do sh1t like this
throne of liberty
Bboooooooo
Let's be honest here, all RPers need to be banned so they can get a life.
You might as well ban people who play mmos in general so they can get a life.
@@angustheterrible3149 yes ban them too, they all suck