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Dune: Spacing Guild Heighliner - Spacedock
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- Опубликовано: 19 июн 2017
- Spacedock delves into the bizarre world of Dune for a look at the colossal Spacing Guild Heighliner.
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Spacedock does not hold ownership of the copyrighted materiel (Footage, Stills etc) taken from the various works of fiction covered in this series, and uses them within the boundaries of Fair Use for the purpose of Analysis, Discussion and Review. Produced by Daniel Orrett. Owner/Executive Producer at Spacedock.
Be sure to go and check out the fantastic Euderion, without whom there would be basically no decent pictures of this ship. :) euderion.deviantart.com/
Mayby next bigger video you would make a TEC ships from sins of a solar empire game?
thanks spacedock :D
+Spacedock
How is 20km gargantuan? Every sci-fi setting has ships of such a size, biggest ships are still several dozen times bigger and it's still SMALLER then sizes required for effective interstellar colony ships if you don't have FTL tech.
Well it certainly isn't small, especially in the Dune universe. He is not comparing it to other universes, only describing it as it exists in Dune.
To be perfectly honest, it's pretty big by the standards of most SF. Sure there are some ships far bigger than it, but there are many many times more ships far smaller.
So basically the pilot's high most of the time.
Brilliant.
Duh! That's why it's called highliner...
Not a high, more like enhanced cognitive abilities far in excess of what modafinil does.
...that's the piont...! ;-)
Now we know what Otto does after driving the bus on The Simpsons
@@Absaalookemensch sounds like being high!!!🤯
The likes must flow.
Who controls the likes controls the universe.
*the youtube-verse.
Yeah, that one.
*The likes are indeed flowing my brother*
Panta rhei - everything flows.
I have to point out that having no sublight engines would be a death sentence in the real world, because with no ability to change the ship's Newtonian momentum, it would be doomed to plummet into a gravity well or be flung into interstellar space, if the navigator miscalculates the target orbital altitude at the destination by even a few kilometers.
I thought the idea was that they couldn't possibly miscalculate anything, because they would see the mistake happening in the future and fix it before it happens.
The navigators do not make such mistakes.
There are natural points within star systems where gravitational forces cancel each other out (real science here, not fiction), so no sub light drive would be required for station keeping within these points. The very small amount of movement (drift) within these points would be negated at the next point the ship appeared, and the drift would not move the ship sufficiency to become an issue as they do not stay in place for long enough periods to encounter any other objects, thus no collision issues.
At least this is my understanding from the books and movies I have experience with from the Dune universe.
Since they are essentially appearing in different star systems and each system has a very different velocity, they must be able to manipulate the velocity of the ship during the arrival. If they did not the difference between the origin system and destination systems velocity would mean they were rapidly leaving whatever planet they appeared at.
I honestly wasn't expcting this one, but I'm pleasantly surprised. The Heighliner is deffinately one of the more unique spacecraft in sci-fi.
I wouldn't say unique, but it is definitely one of the first of its kind and the way that it propels itself is more unique still. But the idea of a starship designed specifically to act as a hyperspace/FTL taxi for smaller, non-FTL spacecraft isn't that unique anymore.
@@kerianhalcyon2769 this was conceived in the 50’s. At the time of its conception it was very unique.
From my understanding, the Heighliner doesn't actually move. The Holtzman Engine basically Folds Space around the Heighliner causing it to basically teleport instantaneously to its destination. The Guild Steersman, hopped up on Spice, uses enhanced prescience that grants them the ability to "see" ahead in the future for thousands of Light Years to prevent the Heighliner from "materializing" or "teleporting" INSIDE a star, gas giant, or solid rock of a rocky planet. The Guild Steersman "steers" the ship out of the way of obstacles upon materialization at the destination. Once in orbit around the destination planet, all the smaller spacecraft contained within the mighty hull of the Heighliner depart and then the Heighliner goes on its way to make another jump across the Galaxy.
what I find neat is in the prequel books high level guild navigators can and do jump highliners into "grottos" in Xi for repairs or if its a new ship they jump it out
Always thought they were like 40k navigators (which were based off Dune if I'm not mistaken) in which the ship transits into the warp which is like an ocean with ever changjng waves and currents The Navigator simply steers the ship using these currents to get to the location using the Astronomicon as a light house or marker. There are also places within the warp which are reliable and others which are like riding into the storm.
So it might not be exactly the same but always figured it followed the same analogy of riding the currents and waves.
so in other words you're fleet could share the same highliner as your enemy and you might not even know it and if you did you wouldn't do anything about it
"Guild law must be upheld. Cease all hostilities immediately. If you do not comply, all frigates will be jettisoned into deep-space. Count-down to decompression now commencing" -Navigator in E:BFD, Harkonnen mission 3.
The Duke Leto straight up tells his son not to explore the Highliner in the first book because any of the other ships in dock could belong to an enemy House.
If you do attack the enemy, you might be ditched at the next stop, and the Guild will probably suspend your access to their ships
Yup, that fact is touched on a bit in the books
But there has to be other ways, right
I remember there were independent smugglers that would travel without the guild's help
These Guild Highliner's remind me of Rendezvous with Rama from Author C. Clarke. Ever do a Spacedock review of those Rama ships?
I like how even though ftl travel is possible and routine for some, it is expensive enough that most individuals are bound to a single planet or system. Even Paul, a highborn to a great house, never saw the inside of a heighliner until he was of age. At a guess most of the harkoonens never left arrakis untill the emperor's decree.
Sweet! Dune... I never expected to see dune ships here, since there is not much emphasis on their ships in any of the books (except maybe for ornithopters). This ship is really truly huge...
The navigator is actually a human that slowly gets deformed by an excess amount of spice being pumped into his tank. They actually have a limited version of Muad'Dib's vision of the future and use that sence to navigate folded space.
Aww man, you got me into Nerd mode again :)
HelDM Gaming I know what you mean I was going through all the details in my head of this ship but he missed but overall a good summary. :)
well there are sooo many details... it boggles the mind. He's done a nice job. I like this channel a lot!
Muad'Dib! Muad'Dib! Muad'Dib!
I am a desert creature.
Muad'dib is dead.
--Muad'dib
mu habib , mu habib
@RedneckSpaceMan shai dulu...
Long Live the Fighters!
Heighliners - WOW!! An incredible concept;"Travelling... without Moving." Thanks very much for doing an episode on this one!!
Geek-time.... again, maybe I'm overthinking this, the Navigator visualizes each destination as it resides within current Spacetime. Whilst capturing the glimpses of these locations the Navigator's project a new line of reality for itself, mentally, taking the two locations, placing them on each end of a flexible stick, for lack of a better analogy, seemingly & gently, bending that stick so that the ends are just nano-meters apart and place the Heighliner, in the exact orbit mind you, as it was from origin prior to transit. This is a fantastic concept in travel!!
I mean, think about the effects on the gravity wells of each location/Planet.... you can't just let go of the stick's ends!! If you do both origin & destination would be completely obliterated... a kill shot from a very large rubber band. The navigator must control the Spacetime fabric as the two gravity wells merge, place the ship within its perceived reality, then reverse the processes from which it began within normal Spacetime. SOOOOOO Fascinating to contemplate!!
Geek-time over... back to work!! Have a good Day everyone!!
Was always interested in Dune space tech. thanks for this one!
Drug abuse make interstellar spaceflight possible, a truly 1960's idea :)
I see what your saying for sure 👍😊but the ideas been around for longer than u think 💭
🤔
@@rawreviewsandreactions6434 yeah but it was hippy culture of the 1960s that brought that stuff more into the public eye, also friendly criticism, cut the emojis, they undermine the ability to take you seriously.
Heavy metal?
@@grayman735 Check out heavy metal flying threw space on drugs scene
Next Dune ship: the No-ship.
you can't review No-ship, it reviews you
It delivers all of the Marvel No-Prizes
In the later books, there was a new ship talked about and used. They were called "No" ships.
*raises crysknife* Long live the fighters!
jds001 Chaii Chouada !!!!!!
...not so loud...!
...the sleepers will wake up...! ;-)
AWESOME!!!
... still waiting for The Heart of Gold from Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy...
Yay thanks for showing Dune some love!
Must be awkward when the armies of two opposing factions have to take the same highliner to get to the battle
Even more awkward is the trip back home for both ! lol
Since we're talking about FTL-capable ships this episode, can we see one soon talking about the Jumpships from the Battletech universe?
Frank Herbert's Dune series was VERY good, and VERY "revolutionary" in design and thought. Asimov, Heinlein, E.E "Doc" Smith, Clarke - the "Big Names" that laid the foundation of today's SciFi.
Clarke is mediocre. I don't see what people find so special about him
@@SuperNovaJinckUFO Presumably his predicting the future of communication satellites counts for mediocrity in your eyes?
The foundations of today's Sci Fi where laid down much earlier than the stories of those authors...
@@Fifury161 Certainly correct - and even the earlier authors (Verne, Wells) were not the earliest - again predated by Frankenstein. The earliest "Sci Fi" novel was probably written in 1616 (The Chemical Wedding")
@@phils4634 I guess it depends on your definition of Sci-Fi as you could go further back to Ovid's Metamorphoses. Your first list of names also aren't the first Sci-Fi authors to have their books made into film... I guess perhaps you chose them as they are closest to your generation? I do enjoy reading stories from before the 19th century, they aren't tainted with modern ideas! Sadly most 20th & 21st century authors appear to "borrow" heavily from others!
Emperor: Battle for Dune was an awesome game.
Another great video from another of my favorite franchises. Great job!
Also. "The Spice Must Flow". - Spacing Guild and Bene Gesserit
Yeah but the Bene Gesserit weren't the focus of this video.
Oi. I just wanted to say - the Navigators needing the Spice is supposed to be a fucking bombshell in the first book. It's common knowledge today because the movie ruined that twist in the first five minutes, but you'll notice that no one in the story even mentions Spice and the Guild in the same breath until Paul survives the spice trance and goes "OH. _That's_ how they do it. This is what happens when the right male genes ingest the right amount of spice."
That's why the Navigators stay so secretive until Dune Messiah, when their secret's out and like hundreds of people see Edric with their own eyes. That's why the emissaries contact lenses in the first book, to hide their blue eyes. If people knew they needed spice then you better fucking believe _everyone_ would be doing exactly what Paul actually did in the book way before Paul actually tried to do it.
Damn Lynch literally ruining the entire point of the first book. The Baron _has_ to be crazy in his version because, if book Baron knew the "damnable guild" was useless without it, he would have deposed the Emperor the second his family took control of Arrakis - 80 years before the events of the story. Why not a single Atreides, even when discussing their super secret Weirding Modules _(gag)_ even mentions that they have the guild by the balls for as long as they can defend Arrakis just speaks volumes as to how poorly Lynch understood the material and how terribly he's confused fans of an already confusing universe.
He who controls the spice controls the universe!
Hey Spacedock do the one on Elysium next.
Looks like one of those cigar ships that's been seen over the decades.
My English skill increased by +1 just by listening to this narration.
Thank you so much!I've been looking forward to this.
Guild Navigator: “We just folded from Ix.”
Emperor: “Oh?”
Navigator:”Many machines on Ix.”
Emperor. ‘wtf’
Navigator: “Lynch’s movie started off so well… I was never here, this conversation never happened”
Emperor: “Of course…”
3rd Stage Guild Navigators are awesome
The timing of this was perfect as I just rewatched Dune like 2 days ago ... such a good movie, kinda wonder what could be done with modern fix techniques but if star wars is a hint they'd screw it up. Still would like to see the rest of the story in movie or series.
I'd love to see a remake of dune
Sounds nice until you consider Hollywood's recent history with remakes. :/
Perhaps a digital remaster would hit the mark?
+Nathan O'Connor
Hollywood is not the only option. Do you have anything against The Expanse/Westworld/dozen other high budget TV serieses?
Well you have the original movie (which was a total disaster if you read the books) from 1984
There is a mini series from the 2000s which technically could be considered a remake. It was closer to the original as well (and included the books 'messiah, and 'children of dune)
I think a high budget tv series would be sweet
12.42 miles long. Whew lads!
I'm glad you got all the details right as well, that it's not the navigator who folds Space but the holtzmann drives (Norma Cenva should have been credited with its creation but she didn't want it), as to its design, I've heard that it was supposed to be spherical, which would make a good deal of sense in terms of transportation
As I recall there is no clear description of the Heighliner in the books, but it has been many years since I read them. This image is from either the film or the tv series.
An extra interesting fact is that they are manufactured underground on the guilds home planet Ix
that isn't the home planet of the guild. Ix besides Richese are the only planets where tech is invented and machines built in huge numbers
Most of the time spent with regard to an interstellar trip is getting on and off the heighliner.
Heighliners must have some kind of propulsion - how do they stay in orbit around worlds with different gravity? I suppose they could plonk themselves behind planets and just fall slowly towards the sun until they move off again, but that means they'd have still momentum. After they folded space and moved to another planet, they'd still have that momentum. Sounds all kinds of awkward without engines.
That's a good point. If they just sort of pop up in place around a star instead of flying in a path, they won't have any sideways movement for an orbit and will just start being pulled directly into stuff.
Edit: Actually, it might be ejected from the solar system. Since the sun is itself moving around the galaxy and the Highliner won't have momentum in the direction the suns going either.
I'd love to see a piece on the Ornithopter on Spacedock Ground.
Everyone forgets the contradiction that's a spice is and isn't the only world with spice. Initially the story says that the Guild's do not find that world important enough to have given it weather control machines, yet as the story develops the author forgot that he wrote it and goes nuts with this whole idea that this is where space LSD comes from
Do SDF-1 Macross and fighters
My all time favourite spaceship..
Dune a sci-fi epic of very deep history of the universe from their species, government, clans and ships.
thank you for using the old dune designs in this video I think they many times better then the newer dune which had James macavoy in
Got a difficult one for you. the Space probe from Startrek the Voyage home
One could say Warhammer 40K was inspired by Dune. Granted the game Dune 2000 was very difficult... especially if you didn't play as house atraties.
Dune was the catalyst for many works of science-fiction
Dune was Lawrence of Arabia recycled in space.
ElJorro Dune and Starship Troopers are probably the most influential science fiction books ever.
have you read the Dune books? what connection is there between that and 40K? All the Dunes games are about the First book out of 6
Dune was a send up the the oil-based economy and the politics of its day.
love Dune cant wait to see more.
More Dune! MORE DUNE!! MORE BECAUSE MOAR!!
heres a question that pleuges my mind, if a spacing guild highliner doesnt have engines, doesnt really move and cant travel under its own power outside FTL travel, can it still be seen as a space ship or is it a semi mobile space station?
Simple answer is that it's a space ship because they classify it as such in universe.
Advanced answer is that a Heighliner doesn't need sublight drives to act as a space ship. If a navigator wanted to he could use the FTL engines to do tiny intra-system jumps mimicking the use of sublight engines.
Space stations usually have sublight engines anyways, they are just built to predominantly stay in one place and often the station engines are only geared to aid in station keeping movements. It's not strictly the engines and ability to move that separates a ship from a station, it's the intent it was built with and its use. Heighliners are built with the intent of traveling the entire known universe, that puts them in ship territory really even if they lack proper engines.
Seems like every time Dune is translated into another media, the technology changes. The eversion here seems like it is from the David Lynch movie. The book version is slightly different in that the Heighliner actually does travel at hyperluminal speeds, and it requires the prescient ability granted by spice to allow the Guild Navigators to avoid anything lethal in their path. Otherwise they could fly right through a star or bounce too close to a supernova and that'd end your trip real quick, wouldn't it? You could say the Navigators know a few maneuvers...
Dune is a trip of a universe
I love it!
Amazing that the story is just within the confides of a single galaxy.
Great video
Any plans on doing a video of the Andromeda Ascendant/Glorious Heritage Class ships? Or any other vessels from Andromeda?
Tbh, kind of expected to be a little bigger than 20k long, if they can hold entire fleets. No ISD-size ships in Dune, I guess.
A Heighliner can probably carry in excess of 3 million people & all their ships & equipment
Ah Dune a cult classic, I grew up reading this series and watched both movie adaptations, the sci-fi mini series is the closest adaption.
Fucking great video man. This is why I love your channel. Dune is not my favorite IP but it's great to learn more about it.
Hard to believe that the Navigators are actually Human, albeit horribly mutated into an incredibly hideous form!
Probably the most grotesque portrayal is in the 1984 film!
I enjoy this channel. It is a better source for feeding our need for fantasy.
i watched dune and i never understood this much about it wow Dune must be way deaper in the books then in the movies.
Yes it is. Book gives much more details, of course. Mini series got closest to books in form of presentation of the Dune universe.
Took a taxi with a driver high AF and saw my life whizz by for 10 minutes. Not sure I'd want to take an intergalactic space trip with the pilot high AF.
Does anyone think they'll ever get the original Dune (1984) put back together in its 4Hr 20Min format... because I would buy that in a heartbeat!!
Would you consider doing a "No-Ship" from the latter books from the dune series ?
Have you reviewed any Culture spacecraft? How about Falling Outside The Normal Moral Constraints for starters?
I wonder if after all those years the "tunnels" they created are carved into whatever space the folding existed?
And if it was possible for a regular ship could be created to enter these tunnels & navigate them without needing the guild?
The first answer is No. For the second question, yes, you don't need the guild. However, the guild navigators held a supremacy over interstellar travel for millenia and all navigators belonged to them.
The beans I eat is also converted to gaseous form. Then there is a big movement.
I prefer the intro tune from your previous videos. It was MUCH more thrilling and exciting. Could you entertain the thought of reverting back to it?
Sorry about that, I've changed it after the recent Dash Star situation to be slightly safer from copyright troubles. There would likely have never been a problem with keeping the old one, but as the intro is in all my videos I have to be super careful.
Isn't this the intro song from Battlezone 2?
It sounds veeeery much like it!
It is indeed, good catch. :) (One of my favorite games ever)
My favourite Dune flying vehicles are the Ornithopters !
Yay ! House Atreides FTW!
Do you take suggestions? If so, I haven't seen Samus's gunship from the Metroid series (specifically the Prime 3 variant, probably the easiest to get technical specs on) on your show yet.
I do like the bit at 0:01.
It only seemed to take about 5 minutes to materialise at the destination. Not enough time to disembark to the amusement arcades, ball rooms, multiplex etc.
you should totally do the Firefly class
Diddent a single high liner transport the entire military might of every great house and the padesha emperor's sarduka legions to Dune?
Overall great video all the most important fact are there.
But just a small thing you left out the fact the highliners were used as battering rams in combat and that The Navigators were able to see into the future and know if the place they were holding space to was safe.
"The spice consumed by navigators is converted to a gaseous form"... So they basically float in an aquarium of their own farts all day long.
So spice does cause pleasurable effects? The way the wiki worded it, it sounded like it was something people only wanted for spacing and chasing longer life, but did not mention any other effectz
I wish i could support you guys on patreon. I love this channel
More people should know of Dune books
Going to go back and read Dune now :D
Anyone else realize that heighliners are technically the fastest spaceships in popular sci fi? Since in like Star Wars, Star Trek, 40k, etc the ships all have some sort of speed cap, even though they're all above light speed, which limits the scope of the interstellar civilizations. But the Dune civilization is said to span innumerable galaxies, more or less comprising the known universe of today, if not much more, and the Heighliners are still able to travel instantly to any part of it.
As an FYI I could be wrong in some people's viee because I haven't read the Brian Herbert books. I don't personally count those as cannon, though
I don't for sure if the heighliners are the fastest ships in sci fi. But they do not travel instantly to other worlds. The 1980s Lynch movie has it that they ''travel without moving'' but the books clearly state the navigators use spice to ''see'' any possible threat the ship may encounter on its journey and steer away from it.
@@Emdee5632 That's not exactly correct. The books describe that the navigators plot the course ahead of time. This is also something that can be done with a computer, since the no-ships are able to travel without a navigator. In other words, the spice isn't necessary for space travel, but it's necessary in order to travel in a way that abides by the butlerian jihad
More Dune please!
How did they figure out the spice would work that way? did a pilot just get super high at work one day and discovered he could navigate inhumanly well haha
Incrementally. When humans first discovered spice they discovered it improved health and prolonged life, naturally this lead to study and to some people taking a lot of spice. Large spice exposure leads to mutations of various kinds and among these mutations are those granting prescience. Various factions within the Dune universe noticed the tendency towards prescience among spice mutants and started breeding the mutants best at foresight.
Navigators are the product of intentional breeding of not just the best prescients but those prescients who had the most secure vision of the immediate future. They were essentially genetically designed by the Guild for their job.
I'm currently reading God Emperor of Dune. There is no more spice except for what Leto hoarded before turning Dune into a forest planet.
Can you do the Galactic Empire or Free Planets Alliance Navies from Legend of The Galactic Heroes, or some of the ships from the series? Love the channel.
Can you do a video of the mining machines used in Dune series?
HE WHO CONTROLS THE SPICE CONTROLS THE UNIVERSE!!!
that was a ship I would have never have thought to ask for thanks for that are there other ships from dune that you will cover I hope.
Got an idea for a Ship vs Ship short. Tyranid Hiveship vs Zerg Leviathan.
I wanna call these things "highlighters" because they look like markers
"HE WHO CONTROLS THE SPICE, CONTROLS THE UNIVERSE!"
reminds me of the jumpships of battletech
Heighliner? More like the... Highlighter... am I right?
The Great Houses actually have FTL capability, but it is reserved for their atomic forces. The ones that prevent other Great Houses doing something creative, like dropping a Planet Buster.
But why not just... Expand your for capability to non-atomic forces? Or is that going to get everyone else to activate their atomic forces?
I'd love to see one on the Ixian No-Ships
The heighliner looks more like a highlighter
PLEASE consider doing a video about the *Astroship XB982* from Valerian!
Valerian is the grandfather of Sci-Fi and is the sole reason why Star Wars and Mass Effect even exists.
The movie is coming out next month and is directed by Luc Besson.
curious to see your take on the dune saga's non-ships.
Do one on the Ithaca.