As an aside, it's amazing to me how quickly much of this country is regressing to the bad old days of Dickens. No vegan should be buying Hershey's because of their cacao suppliers, but I've said the same to non-vegans who have children: You're feeding your kids chocolate made from beans picked by child slaves! Because I'm an insufferable vegan, donchano! The vegans scolding about child labor do have a point, but have the worst timing and poor communication style with non-vegans to whom we are trying to appeal. Thanks for posting!
Bravo! Another important topic! We just discussed the Reese Peanut Butter Cups, and why vegans shouldn't be excited by an offering from Hershey, who historically has a bad record where forced & child labor are concerned. There are plenty of ethically sourced vegan peanut butter cups out there. Anyway, thanks for bringing this to light.💚
THANK YOU for calling out this hypocrisy. It’s gross to jump on another issue to push veganism; same thing happened at the start of COVID. Instead of waiting for “gotcha” moments, let’s lead by example and fight for liberation of all, including but not limited to animals. BTW Chomp! makes incredible, ethically sourced peanut butter cups!!! ❤
Did Martin actually have the take being mocked? What did he say? (Also, the chud vegan demographic seems so small and fringe and pointless as to be uninteresting, rather like MAGA communism. Is there a worry that chud vegans are somehow exerting more influence on the rest of the AR and Plant-Based space than eg MAGA communism is exerting on the the left? If so how is that influence working?)
I recommend the recently published book, _The Good It Promises, the Harm It Does: Critical Essays on Effective Altruism_ (edited by Carol Adams, Alice Crary, and Lori Gruen). It's relevant to the issues you bring up here about money, labor, corporations, and willful ignorance of vegans to harm caused in the name of "doing good for animals."
A great episode, a mix of disturbing stuff that goes on, a lot of laughter at your little noises, editing and comments and then also a great set of messages at the end. Sense, progressive and positive.
While I can get where you are coming from ( That blurred line of sentience/ feeling pain in bivalves...), I can't see it being Vegan. There is that argument amongst some though. 🤔
There’s got to be a way that vegans can collectively agree that any form of exploitation - non-human animal or human animal - isn’t cool. Can we update the vegan society’s philosophy? Or is that too big of an ask? Interesting debate on whether it’s enough to advocate for one group only or if it’s completely short-sighted/missing the mark considering most causes aren’t single issue. Maybe it’s enough that some people can see the interconnection and are defenders of all.
@Jonah Whale While I agree with you and wish that at minimum companies/producers had a better understanding of what vegan means ethically instead of just giving high fives in the boardroom over vegan certification that’ll make them extra dough… Screwed the pooch? Cmon dude.😝
@Jonah Whale I get what the meaning is behind screwed the pooch and that it’s a joke, was just kidding around with you. Let’s hope the Vegan Society isn’t screwing the pooch, yknow? Ha ha
Did someone actually react in the messed up way you are mocking, blaming all child labour on non-vegans, and ignoring it with vegan products? That would be such a messed up take that I find it shocking if someone other than like one nutter on Twitter actually had it...(but the world is indeed shocking and I am prepared to be shocked...)
The take was more like “this is animal agriculture’s fault and if people went vegan, awful stuff like child labor wouldn’t occur. So go vegan.” That type of thing. Christopher Sebastian did a great piece on this on IG with screenshots if you want to check it out.
@The Cranky Vegan Cool cool. Personally I despise IG and all of the other platforms and ideas of Zuckerberg and do not use them unless forced to do so (not that Alphabet and YT are not horrible in their own ways, but I find YT helpful for keeping up with things and find IG and FB to be unmitigated disasters for anything other than direct organizing)
![ARGENTINA vs. BOLIVIA [6-0] | RESUMEN | ELIMINATORIAS SUDAMERICANAS | FECHA 10](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/C3wPtKNbAOA/mqdefault.jpg)
Apologies for all the audio problems on this one. Therefore, all subscriptions to my youtube channel will be free this week.
:-D
As an aside, it's amazing to me how quickly much of this country is regressing to the bad old days of Dickens. No vegan should be buying Hershey's because of their cacao suppliers, but I've said the same to non-vegans who have children: You're feeding your kids chocolate made from beans picked by child slaves! Because I'm an insufferable vegan, donchano! The vegans scolding about child labor do have a point, but have the worst timing and poor communication style with non-vegans to whom we are trying to appeal. Thanks for posting!
Ive always wondered. When these companies pay their fines how does that compensate the children?
Bravo! Another important topic! We just discussed the Reese Peanut Butter Cups, and why vegans shouldn't be excited by an offering from Hershey, who historically has a bad record where forced & child labor are concerned. There are plenty of ethically sourced vegan peanut butter cups out there. Anyway, thanks for bringing this to light.💚
Child labour is why I avoid all chocolate that isn't fair-trade.
Non-vegan chocolate that isn't fair-trade? I'm not touching it.
Unfortunately only 20% of the cacao and ingredients need to be fair-trade in order to get the fair-trade label.
little kids working in slaughterhouses? the world truly is insane
Really awesome you put this out! We absolutely need to understand all aspects of being vegans and knowing the ramifications of our choices.
THANK YOU for calling out this hypocrisy. It’s gross to jump on another issue to push veganism; same thing happened at the start of COVID. Instead of waiting for “gotcha” moments, let’s lead by example and fight for liberation of all, including but not limited to animals.
BTW Chomp! makes incredible, ethically sourced peanut butter cups!!! ❤
George Martin is gonna hate this lol. But, on a serious note, you always have the best takes as far as activism goes.
😂 I’ve never lived rent-free in someone’s head for so long…
Did Martin actually have the take being mocked? What did he say? (Also, the chud vegan demographic seems so small and fringe and pointless as to be uninteresting, rather like MAGA communism. Is there a worry that chud vegans are somehow exerting more influence on the rest of the AR and Plant-Based space than eg MAGA communism is exerting on the the left? If so how is that influence working?)
I don’t follow him so I don’t know. But I’m guessing the OP was referring to George’s distaste for collective liberation.
@@thecrankyvegan You are correct sir!
Smeorge Smartin will justify this as having lived experience as a former (white male) child, and thus he was himself oppressed, too.
I recommend the recently published book, _The Good It Promises, the Harm It Does: Critical Essays on Effective Altruism_ (edited by Carol Adams, Alice Crary, and Lori Gruen). It's relevant to the issues you bring up here about money, labor, corporations, and willful ignorance of vegans to harm caused in the name of "doing good for animals."
Thanks for pointing on the hypocrisy in vegans! We need to be self-aware too.
A great episode, a mix of disturbing stuff that goes on, a lot of laughter at your little noises, editing and comments and then also a great set of messages at the end. Sense, progressive and positive.
Thank you for being that guy walking behind Caesar reminding him that he’s just a man.
Excellent points 👍🌿
No to child labor.
Well said XXXX
Hey Jake, what's your opinion about eating bivalves and being an ostrovegan?
While I can get where you are coming from ( That blurred line of sentience/ feeling pain in bivalves...), I can't see it being Vegan. There is that argument amongst some though. 🤔
There’s got to be a way that vegans can collectively agree that any form of exploitation - non-human animal or human animal - isn’t cool. Can we update the vegan society’s philosophy? Or is that too big of an ask? Interesting debate on whether it’s enough to advocate for one group only or if it’s completely short-sighted/missing the mark considering most causes aren’t single issue. Maybe it’s enough that some people can see the interconnection and are defenders of all.
@Jonah Whale While I agree with you and wish that at minimum companies/producers had a better understanding of what vegan means ethically instead of just giving high fives in the boardroom over vegan certification that’ll make them extra dough… Screwed the pooch? Cmon dude.😝
@Jonah Whale I get what the meaning is behind screwed the pooch and that it’s a joke, was just kidding around with you. Let’s hope the Vegan Society isn’t screwing the pooch, yknow? Ha ha
👍👍 ✊
Did someone actually react in the messed up way you are mocking, blaming all child labour on non-vegans, and ignoring it with vegan products? That would be such a messed up take that I find it shocking if someone other than like one nutter on Twitter actually had it...(but the world is indeed shocking and I am prepared to be shocked...)
The take was more like “this is animal agriculture’s fault and if people went vegan, awful stuff like child labor wouldn’t occur. So go vegan.” That type of thing. Christopher Sebastian did a great piece on this on IG with screenshots if you want to check it out.
@The Cranky Vegan Cool cool. Personally I despise IG and all of the other platforms and ideas of Zuckerberg and do not use them unless forced to do so (not that Alphabet and YT are not horrible in their own ways, but I find YT helpful for keeping up with things and find IG and FB to be unmitigated disasters for anything other than direct organizing)