Incredible footage once again. DE30 breakdowns like this are fairly common, but very rarely is the process caught on camera. Great job documenting this startup and rescue move.
LIRR DE AC 405 Junker rescue. I was amused to see on the switcher, the faded We Serve With Pride on peeling off paint. Now some LIRR crew do work hard, can't deny them credit. But some, not so much. LIRR MissManagement - better not say.
@@ARandom777These old things won't last the next few years. They need to start the process NOW and get some possibles on property. They don't need lists.
What was the problem, how much does it cost to fix in terms of delays, pulling to the yard, new train crew and then the actual repair? And what is exactly being repaired all the time? What is the issue with these things? Why can't it be prevented or reduced? Is it preventative maintenance or random stuff that keeps failing? Are diesels no longer good for short routes and frequent stops w/o significant maintenance issues? You cant electrify the whole line, but man there has to be a better middle ground someplace.
The original crew, the shop guys, the road foreman, and the other shop guys who came out on the service call. Meanwhile on the highway, it’s one guy in a wrecker.
LIRR really just needs to electrify the entire network, is buying a fleet of untested dual mode Chargers (nobody has even bought a diesel/catenary dual mode charger, much less a diesel/3rd rail version) and new rolling stock really more cost effective than extending 3rd rail and signaling on the diesel lines? The closest I've seen is the Amtrak Airo rolling stock, which puts a pantograph on the cab car which can be used to power a charger at the other end of the consist.
The far east branches see dramatically less ridership, especially in winter season. You'd have to replace all the rail too, since many stretches are 30-45 mph. It'll be a cold day in hell the day an M9 rolls into montauk
IMHO, this diesel fleet was junk from before it was built. It's not getting better with age. I've heard that there are no plans to replace it, no plans to electrify out here, but oh, if they replaced the locos, supposedly there would be no DM's - LIRR still seems to consider eastern Long Island to be all farm country, where all we need is a way for farmers to take their goods to market once in a while.
They are getting new locomotives, a bit over 60 Siemens Charger locomotives are on ordered named the SC-42DM. They may need to replace the C3 coaches as well while they're add it because those coaches are only compatible with the DE/DM30AC locomotives.
@@omar.w939 Where did you hear that from? As far as I've hard from within MTA, only MNCR is getting new diesel equipment. The argument re LIRR is that sure, it's bad, but we don't really care about past Huntington, Babylon or Ronk, or for that matter, much of the OB branch. Most of it needs double tracking but it's not worth it, and it's not worth electrifying without double tracking, and besides, if we do buy new diesels, we want to eliminate DM's for LIRR (because hey, were not capable of maintaining them). As best as I can tell, they've made a small order for those DM's for MNCR and may have options for more for them, and maybe LIRR. BTW, when the current junkers went into service, there were 30 DE's and 30 DM's. At least one DM fire roasted it's inverter gear and downgraded to a DE, one or more DE's or DM's are either gone or parts sources. And 60 total was never enough to properly serve all of diesel country even before you include the Drunk Tank trains on summer weekends - they borrow equipment from other trains to take care of the spoiled brats.
First, I got the info from the Siemens Charger Wikipedia as well as Metro North Wikipedia (future rolling stock section). Second, you are right about the option order part between Metro North and LIRR. Thirdly, you may want to know this, LIRR Engine #406 actually had an engine over the weekend somewhere along the Montauk line. Some people are saying the locomotive is done for and may not be fixed. Another example that we need new locomotives. And we need something that can fit under the tunnels of Grand Central and Atlantic Terminal. Overcrowding is already worst at Jamaica Station. I was thinking a couple of months ago that the LIRR should have invested in on getting new DMUs (Diesel Multiple Units) trains that have third rail shoes. I don't know why the LIRR stopped investing on getting new BEMU (Battery Electric Multiple Units) trains. Two years ago, there were going to covert an M7 to run batteries but failed.
@@omar.w939 I started riding in 1992, when all we had were the true rustbuckets. Only good things were the GP38-2's; they seemed capable of outlasting anything done to them - though one night at Greenlawn, the train operator / engineer's seat pedestal broke (rusted through). There were 2 of them; I believe they carefully ran the train from the 2nd to get people home. I would not be surprised that something (what?) went wrong with one of the current fleet. I absolutely agree we need a new fleet, probably over 70, preferably all DM, or at least not needing 2 DM's to go into Penn. And yes, it would be nice if this time they specified new equipment to not be, say, 3 inches too tall for GCT-LIRR, but apparently the Chargers are even taller than the DM's and DE's by about 3 inches. LIRR officials told me in 1996 how they had specced the new fleet to not fit the 63rd St tunnel (we are just outside the tunnel in the access pit at the time). We were going to have a quick, easy to transfer across platform at a new Sunnyside Station, which of course, was never built. Then, for years, I asked LIRR officials how we diesel country passengers would get to GCT-LIRR. Never an answer until operations began. The DM's do have 3rd rail shoes, but LIRR doesn't trust them to run a DM train into Penn with only one loco (because of dead spots). As to battery power, I think they could have gotten a small M7 fleet with batteries for Oyster Bay, where they would charge as they were running to / from within a half mile of the end of electrification, but for OB, the best solution would be to fix flood zones and then electrify all the way to OB. I am guessing that other railroads will do better with batteries than MTA. MTA officially studied the battery concept but whatever they came up with would have been super expensive. As far as doing actual conversion, I don't think any physical work was done, just some paperwork exercise.
The shop switcher lumbering over the hill is like when you see the wrecker coming up the road with the amber lights on.
Oooohhhh the indignity.
Incredible footage once again. DE30 breakdowns like this are fairly common, but very rarely is the process caught on camera. Great job documenting this startup and rescue move.
It's embarrassing!
DE 30 breakdowns are common because they're worn out. They've long ago outlived their shelf life.
The LIRR guy puffing away on a cigar is pure LIRR…
Lirr should’ve ordered p32s-dms they are more reliable
They have been replaced these D30ACs long time ago with the Chargers
You might be the only non-employee to catch two startups
LIRR DE AC 405 Junker rescue. I was amused to see on the switcher, the faded We Serve With Pride on peeling off paint. Now some LIRR crew do work hard, can't deny them credit. But some, not so much. LIRR MissManagement - better not say.
Great catch! Is LIRR looking to replace these engines and equipment anytime soon?
Yes in the next few years. They have the Siemens Charger locomotives on their list.
@@ARandom777These old things won't last the next few years. They need to start the process NOW and get some possibles on property. They don't need lists.
I was on there we pulled in then the engine just popped
But these engines are nice
I gather it went off to Hillside to be repaired? Pretty sure I have seen 405 on the Oyster Bay line in the last month so apparently it was fixed.
i just caught it today on the oyster bay line.
whos radio audio is that an employee radio or a personal scanner or VHF radio of yours and what model is that scanner or VHF radio?
What was the problem, how much does it cost to fix in terms of delays, pulling to the yard, new train crew and then the actual repair? And what is exactly being repaired all the time? What is the issue with these things? Why can't it be prevented or reduced? Is it preventative maintenance or random stuff that keeps failing? Are diesels no longer good for short routes and frequent stops w/o significant maintenance issues? You cant electrify the whole line, but man there has to be a better middle ground someplace.
Why can't they electrify?
@@rontroy3843they was thinking about putting battery on the m7 m9 test them on non electrical branches
@@Lirr_. they decided not to. Mta doing that would supposedly cost a fortune.
@@rontroy3843 true
What a operation here, how many men its takes to couple a Engine to a train, what waste.
The original crew, the shop guys, the road foreman, and the other shop guys who came out on the service call.
Meanwhile on the highway, it’s one guy in a wrecker.
What's going on?
Oh, I do feel bad for the train crew, stuck with this junk.
LIRR really just needs to electrify the entire network, is buying a fleet of untested dual mode Chargers (nobody has even bought a diesel/catenary dual mode charger, much less a diesel/3rd rail version) and new rolling stock really more cost effective than extending 3rd rail and signaling on the diesel lines? The closest I've seen is the Amtrak Airo rolling stock, which puts a pantograph on the cab car which can be used to power a charger at the other end of the consist.
lol we have a better chance at lotto then lirr do third rail everywhere
The far east branches see dramatically less ridership, especially in winter season. You'd have to replace all the rail too, since many stretches are 30-45 mph. It'll be a cold day in hell the day an M9 rolls into montauk
They’re getting worse and worse! Long haul engines meant for stop and go isn’t it!
IMHO, this diesel fleet was junk from before it was built. It's not getting better with age. I've heard that there are no plans to replace it, no plans to electrify out here, but oh, if they replaced the locos, supposedly there would be no DM's - LIRR still seems to consider eastern Long Island to be all farm country, where all we need is a way for farmers to take their goods to market once in a while.
They are getting new locomotives, a bit over 60 Siemens Charger locomotives are on ordered named the SC-42DM. They may need to replace the C3 coaches as well while they're add it because those coaches are only compatible with the DE/DM30AC locomotives.
@@omar.w939 Where did you hear that from? As far as I've hard from within MTA, only MNCR is getting new diesel equipment. The argument re LIRR is that sure, it's bad, but we don't really care about past Huntington, Babylon or Ronk, or for that matter, much of the OB branch. Most of it needs double tracking but it's not worth it, and it's not worth electrifying without double tracking, and besides, if we do buy new diesels, we want to eliminate DM's for LIRR (because hey, were not capable of maintaining them). As best as I can tell, they've made a small order for those DM's for MNCR and may have options for more for them, and maybe LIRR. BTW, when the current junkers went into service, there were 30 DE's and 30 DM's. At least one DM fire roasted it's inverter gear and downgraded to a DE, one or more DE's or DM's are either gone or parts sources. And 60 total was never enough to properly serve all of diesel country even before you include the Drunk Tank trains on summer weekends - they borrow equipment from other trains to take care of the spoiled brats.
First, I got the info from the Siemens Charger Wikipedia as well as Metro North Wikipedia (future rolling stock section).
Second, you are right about the option order part between Metro North and LIRR.
Thirdly, you may want to know this, LIRR Engine #406 actually had an engine over the weekend somewhere along the Montauk line. Some people are saying the locomotive is done for and may not be fixed. Another example that we need new locomotives. And we need something that can fit under the tunnels of Grand Central and Atlantic Terminal. Overcrowding is already worst at Jamaica Station. I was thinking a couple of months ago that the LIRR should have invested in on getting new DMUs (Diesel Multiple Units) trains that have third rail shoes. I don't know why the LIRR stopped investing on getting new BEMU (Battery Electric Multiple Units) trains. Two years ago, there were going to covert an M7 to run batteries but failed.
@@omar.w939 I started riding in 1992, when all we had were the true rustbuckets. Only good things were the GP38-2's; they seemed capable of outlasting anything done to them - though one night at Greenlawn, the train operator / engineer's seat pedestal broke (rusted through). There were 2 of them; I believe they carefully ran the train from the 2nd to get people home.
I would not be surprised that something (what?) went wrong with one of the current fleet. I absolutely agree we need a new fleet, probably over 70, preferably all DM, or at least not needing 2 DM's to go into Penn. And yes, it would be nice if this time they specified new equipment to not be, say, 3 inches too tall for GCT-LIRR, but apparently the Chargers are even taller than the DM's and DE's by about 3 inches. LIRR officials told me in 1996 how they had specced the new fleet to not fit the 63rd St tunnel (we are just outside the tunnel in the access pit at the time). We were going to have a quick, easy to transfer across platform at a new Sunnyside Station, which of course, was never built. Then, for years, I asked LIRR officials how we diesel country passengers would get to GCT-LIRR. Never an answer until operations began.
The DM's do have 3rd rail shoes, but LIRR doesn't trust them to run a DM train into Penn with only one loco (because of dead spots). As to battery power, I think they could have gotten a small M7 fleet with batteries for Oyster Bay, where they would charge as they were running to / from within a half mile of the end of electrification, but for OB, the best solution would be to fix flood zones and then electrify all the way to OB. I am guessing that other railroads will do better with batteries than MTA. MTA officially studied the battery concept but whatever they came up with would have been super expensive. As far as doing actual conversion, I don't think any physical work was done, just some paperwork exercise.
Pure LIRR nonsense. How many workers does it take to do that rescue?
Or change a light bulb.