Moses | What they Didn't tell you in Church
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2022
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Professor Bart D. Ehrman (Ph.D Princeton)
Bart Denton Ehrman[a] (born 1955) is an American New Testament scholar focusing on textual criticism of the New Testament, the historical Jesus, and the origins and development of early Christianity. He has written and edited 30 books, including three college textbooks. He has also authored six New York Times bestsellers. He is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.
Ehrman currently serves as co-editor of the series New Testament Tools, Studies, and Documents (E. J. Brill), co-editor-in-chief for the journal Vigiliae Christianae, and on several other editorial boards for journals and monographs. Ehrman formerly served as president of the Southeast Region of the Society of Biblical Literature, chair of the New Testament textual criticism section of the society, book review editor of the Journal of Biblical Literature, and editor of the monograph series The New Testament in the Greek Fathers (Scholars Press).
In 2006 he appeared on The Colbert Report and The Daily Show, to promote his book Misquoting Jesus, and in 2009 reappeared on The Colbert Report with the release of Jesus, Interrupted. Ehrman has appeared on the History Channel, the National Geographic Channel, Discovery Channel, A&E, Dateline NBC, CNN, and NPR's Fresh Air and his writings have been featured in Time, Newsweek, The New York Times, The New Yorker, and The Washington Post.
Moses, Hebrew Moshe, (flourished 14th-13th century BCE), Hebrew prophet, teacher, and leader who, in the 13th century BCE (before the Common Era, or BC), delivered his people from Egyptian slavery. In the Covenant ceremony at Mt. Sinai, where the Ten Commandments were promulgated, he founded the religious community known as Israel.
Few historical figures have engendered such disparate interpretations as has Moses. Early Jewish and Christian traditions considered him the author of the Torah (“Law,” or “Teaching”), also called the Pentateuch (“Five Books”), comprising the first five books of the Bible, and some conservative groups still believe in Mosaic authorship.
Other critical methods (studying the biblical text from the standpoint of literary form, oral tradition, style, redaction, and archaeology) are equally valid. The most accurate answer to a critical problem is therefore likely to come from the convergence of various lines of evidence. The aid of critical scholarship notwithstanding, the sources are so sketchy that the man Moses can be portrayed only in broad outline.
According to the biblical account, Moses’ parents were from the tribe of Levi, one of the groups in Egypt called Hebrews. Originally the term Hebrew had nothing to do with race or ethnic origin. It derived from Habiru, a variant spelling of Ḫapiru (Apiru), a designation of a class of people who made their living by hiring themselves out for various services. The biblical Hebrews had been in Egypt for generations, but apparently they became a threat, so one of the pharaohs enslaved them. Unfortunately, the personal name of the king is not given, and scholars have disagreed as to his identity and, hence, as to the date of the events of the narrative of Moses. One theory takes literally the statement in I Kings 6:1 that the Exodus from Egypt occurred 480 years before Solomon began building the Temple in Jerusalem. This occurred in the fourth year of his reign, about 960 BCE; therefore, the Exodus would date about 1440 BCE.
This conclusion, however, is at variance with most of the biblical and archaeological evidence. The storage cities Pitḥom and Rameses, built for the pharaoh by the Hebrews, were located in the northeastern part of the Egyptian delta, not far from Goshen, the district in which the Hebrews lived. It is implicit in the whole story that the pharaoh’s palace and capital were in the area, but Thutmose III (the pharaoh in 1440) had his capital at Thebes, far to the south, and never conducted major building operations in the delta region. Moreover, Edom and Moab, petty kingdoms in Transjordan that forced Moses to circle east of them, were not yet settled and organized. Finally, as excavations have shown, the destruction of the cities the Hebrews claimed to have captured occurred about 1250, not 1400.
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Are you familiar with the research of Tim Mahoney. His doc Patterns of Evidence theorize the Exodus occurred earlier than commonly dated. He suggested where the Bible mentions the Hebrews built Pi-Rameses was actually the city it was built over called Avaris. He states the Bible calling it Pi-Ramases is anachronistic. He'd be an interesting interview
@@HughEMC 🤔
@@HughEMC there’s a much better explanation the region called Ramses is where the King came from and was named that for at least 1000 years before he was born
When you go to Israel I’m sure you’re gonna be chaperoned and babysat by your babysitters like James Tabor you are a close minded fool
I won’t hold my breath to see if you come with any real content that you were not chaperoned to produce
Dr. Ehrman never fails to crack me up with his delivery. I highly suggest his books too, as he writes just like he speaks. The man is a national treasure.
I'm on my 3rd Bart Ehrman book and they are amazing. This is the history I've been looking for...
When Moses came down from the mountain, he only had 1 commandment from God......
"Don't be an asshole."
Priests made up the rest of them.
@@mickmccrory8534 were you there ❓🤔
What a rediculous question...we're you 😂?
@@mickmccrory8534 wonder why God didn’t give you the same commandment 🤣
Larry Fink, George Soros, Bill Ackman, Jeffrey Epstein, Roman Polanski, Harvey Weinstein, Ronald Lauder, Benjamin Netanyahu, Peter Thiel, Gary Cohn, David de Rothschild, Karl Marx, Vladimir Lenin, Robert Reich, Jared Kushner, Rahm Emmanuel, Harley Pasternak, Mendel Schneerson, Sam Altman, Antony Blinken, Victoria Nuland, Alexander Mayorkas, Sam Bankman-Fried, Rachel Levine, Janet Yellen, Ben Shapiro, Dennis Prager, and Dave Rubin.
@@MathewThomasFET His being there is as possible as there were 600,000 military aged men plus their families that fled Egypt across the Red Sea, which was parted by a very, very old man, in the Sinai desert for 40 years(....and being enough food/water etc to survive). If you believe one implausible story why not another......it is writen in one place, with no other evidence of it happening, so it must be equally as true
After convincing me that the Exodus didn't happen it seems superfluous to ask about what happened between God and Moses up the mountain.
Moses went up for shrooms and talked to himself
@@MarcusAurelius13 I don’t know from which country you are from. Ask yourself where did it get the laws it has. The basis ❓
@@MarcusAurelius13 Go to the Red Sea. Dive into it at the place where the Israelites crossed it and look at Egyptian chariot wheels and horse bones. Where did they come from. Seeing is believing for normal humans, not for the stubbornly insane 🤣
@@MathewThomasFET Which airline did you take to get there? How deep did you dive? Got photos?
That's where God gave Moses the Fifteen...oy...Ten Commandments.
Dr. Bart Ehrman is so knowledgable and quite entertaining as well
Yes 🙌
Not laxity
So knowledgeable but can't figure out why a baby raised in EGYPTIAN homes by EGYPTIANS would have an EGYPTIAN name🤣🤣🤣 yes its a Jewish story but Moses was raised EGYPTIAN and named by EGYPTIANs omg 🙈🤣🤣🤣 "Dr"
He only appears knowledgeable to the unlearned.
@@fredgillespie5855 In debates with theologians, Ehrman usually wins.
I'm a new fan/subscribers! You folks do incredible work. 👏
I would think pinning down a date for events that never happened would be very difficult.
So why DON'T you think that? What is stopping you?
@@byteme0000 Perhaps reword this so it makes sense.
Want answers from the best modern research?
Bart's the man.
Yep
Looking forward to seeing you in this course Neal! Bart is a blast!
Yo
Me too
I've wondered why the name of the Pharaoh is not mentioned in Exodus. This is probably the most powerful man in the world at that time. It would be like mentioning the Chancellor of Germany or the President of the USA in WWII by office title only without referring by name to Hitler or Roosevelt.
Pharaoh is the winter season of five months (Rev 9.5).
@@0752756949
Perhaps there is a connection to the lighthouse of Alexandra.
Most powerful man in the world at that time was a Chinese emperor. It’s so strange how God ignored most of the people of antiquity, especially those with far more advanced and refined cultures. Makes me wonder…
Year's ago, when I actually started reading up on the Exodus, the more I discovered the less I believed that it was actual history. So I agree with your comment & throughout the story it's impossible not to wonder why again & again. Simply concentrating on the logistics involved for both sides, it makes a mockery of the story as given in the Bible.
@harveywabbit9541 Pharaoh comes from two Egyptian words, per a'oh, meaning "great house" referring to the royal palace. Kings weren't called Pharaoh until the New Kingdom, 1550-1070 bce. The 10 Plagues happened at least 100 years before that. The Egyptian year had 3 seasons, lasting 4 months each. Will you PLEASE drag your nose out of the Bible and LEARN something? At least stop pretending you know things that you don't!
Professor Ehrman’s delivery is very exciting. 😊 But seriously, thank you Professor Ehrman for your encyclopaedic knowledge of the Biblical text and subjecting the narrative of Moses to a rigorous test. 🙏🏽
Awesome, thank you. I can’t help but mention that in the Hawaiian history of the Nu’uanu Battle that most of my life I believed was a myth, tho not as great as this story in the Bible, it has been verified by 800+ skulls that were found at the bottom of the Pali where the battle was.
Talk about reality. Thanks and Aloha 🌺
That battle and the surrounding events was in the 1790s, and the English were involved. Easy to look up.
Once folk thought that Troy was a myth then Schliemann dug it up.
@@fredgillespie5855 It's a valid comparison, but the thing is - Troy was real, and Achilles may have been, but if he was, he wasn't invulnerable or superhuman. Just like if Moses existed, he probably didn't part the red sea.
@@fredgillespie5855 Been there. In Turkey on the beach.
@@fredgillespie5855Yes Troy was found. Unfortunately nothing in the bible has been found and people have looked far more extensively and exhaustingly than the search for Troy.
I love it!
This November on the 6 day of November 2022
The Vatican will be hosting a meeting called the UN conference global meeting called “Cop27”
To me it’s very interesting that they are hosting this meeting in Egypt.
You're thinking of Copt'27
@@topcat8804 yes
lISTENING IN JUST FOR A MOMENT - IT'S OBVIOUS - I NEED MORE, AND MUCH MORE!
I just bought his book "misquoting Jesus" so far, it's a great book, it definitely grabbed my attention!
The serpent was the symbol of everlasting life and healing because it shed its skin, and this can be found in many cultures' way back before the Hebrew bible was written. The serpent curled around a staff is still the symbol of healing and appears on ambulances and hospitals today.
The caduceus yes. But the Brazen Serpent prefigured Christ’s crucifixion, insofar that all who ‘gaze upon’ it would be safe from the bite. That means XC becomes the edenic serpent by proxy, taking the curse of death upon himself and then breaking the power of the one who had taken all humanity captive after death, that is Hades. This is the wisdom of the fathers of the ancient church, which Prof. Ehrman rejects flippantly in his ignorance.
@@claesvanoldenphatt9972 I flippantly agree with the Professor
I understand the serpent symbol is for healing and that’s why hospitals have this symbol. But the two serpents on the staff is a different thing it’s a meaning for money and fortune. It seems to be true health care is a very profitable industry.
It has also been a symbol of knowledge
@@claesvanoldenphatt9972 Thank you for the wonderful write up!
I love Mr Bart!!
I am where I am today, largely because Alan Watts, and Mr Ehrman!
Now I'm a Neal(ite) 😁 lol
I also enjoyed "the Heart of the Buddha's Teachings", by Thich Nhat Hanh. The mean jealous vindictive god of Abraham is what's wrong with the Bible. Additionally, my mother would never curse a fig tree, so she is more well-behaved than Jesus. But people are taught that it's the word of God, so no one reads it objectivity.
*doctor
Bart is one of my absolute favourite Bible nerds ❤
I think the Moses/Exodus story is a conflation of the Hyksos invasion of Egypt and their subsequent departure. You see, the pharaoh that defeated the Hyksos and drove them out of Kemet was Ahmose 1. He was seen as a savior among his people for liberating Egypt from these tyrannical Hyksos. I think that when the Hyksos and other Semitic tribes returned to the Levant, they began retelling the events of their expulsion as a positive event instead of a defeat. And given that the man responsible for kicking them out of Egypt was named Ahmose, it’s not hard to imagine their oral tradition conflating his identity with that a savior figure.
Just a thought.
Spot on! This is MUCH better than some of the other comments I've read from narrow-minded loonies who are too lazy and/ or stupid to drag their noses out of the Bible and learn some actual FACTS. ( My apologies if you're a Christian. I'm not...)
quote " think the Moses/Exodus story is a conflation of the Hyksos invasion of Egypt and their subsequent departure. " wow.. very good observation specially of the moses being actually AHMOSE.. and the story being a rewrite with a happy ending of what actually happened.
Your theory is worth of researching . sounds very plausible.
The sacrifice because of our sins just sounds like “we weren’t able to rescue our friend because we were weak”.
The problem with atheism is that everything is oversimplified. It all MUST make sense from a childish perspective. Like, if you can't touch it, it doesn't exist. Or, if it doesn't make sense to one person, than it can't be real.
If there are events that humans cannot understand, then there is something exciting and new to learn.
But a lot of humans (mostly atheists) think humans are the supreme intelligence. When in fact, we are low on the totem pole of potential. The geniuses we have are super-limited.
@@asmongoldsmouth9839 "EVERYTHING is simplified"... talk about simplifying.
Asmon, it appears you don't have any familiarity with atheists at all. Some atheists are quite well read and strive to understand gods and religions, psychology, history, philisophy, and science. But the vast majority of atheists don't know and don't care--they simply don't believe.
Well Informing content
Great talk 🔥🔥🔥
Love this channel keep it up
ABSOLUTE GOLD
Fools gold, yes.
I think the serpent on the pole might be esoteric symbolism for the khundalini serpent. I honestly think most of the books are an internal pilgrimage. The Bible mentions that Solomons temple was built in silence without the sounds of construction. There is no evidence for Solomons temple which leads me to believe that the temple is referring to the body and building your temple in silence seems to be referring to meditation in my opinion.
The Israeli Antiquities Authority has found a temple in the City of David, near the Gihon Spring. They are officially calling it Melkizedek's temple. But the dating also fits for Solomon's Temple.
Solomans temple is the temple mount with the now standing dome of the rock
@@ByronWarfield demons made it for him
@@paulmetrich87 The wailing wall is the wall of Fort Antonia. Josephus' and the Apostle Luke both have accounted that Fort Antonia was on the highest peak of Mt. Moriah.
@@paulmetrich87 There are 3 peaks on Mt. Moriah, and the Temple that was found is on a peak that's about halfway up the mountain. It's in close proximity to the Gihon Spring and it matches what the Tanakh says about where the Temple was built.
So far so good! A correction: Barabas is actually Bar Abbas, Bar=Son of, Bar Abbas=Son of Abbas. And there was no such Roman custom of releasing one prisoner to the Jews. So the Bar Abbas bit is questionable. MY line about releasing a prisoner I gleaned this from the book "Zealot" by Reza Aslan. The Bar Abbas comes from other characters in the New Testament, such as Simon Bar Jesus (Son of Joshua [Yeshua/Yoshua]).
Bar abba means son of the father. Abbas is not a Hebraic name. It's more of an Arabic form of whatever that word would be, but all that doesn't matter, since they refer to someone's father.
And you're right. There was no such custom in Roman led Judea. What that "custom" is derived from is the custom of sacrificing one of two lambs and releasing the other in the Jewish temple every Passover. It's called the Passover lamb. That is what the story represents. Jesus (or Judas) Barabas is released as the innocent lamb, Jesus is held and sacrificed as the guilty Passover lamb. His death is supposed to represent the final Passover lamb of the Temple before its destruction.
None of it is based in history and many of the "laws" that Christians use to allege that Jesus was sacrificed by the Jews were all laws that either didn't exist in the books at the time, or laws that would only exist in the 2nd century CE and not before
So either way, to claim historicity is folly
@@johntiggleman4686 What about weleasing Wodewick?
Great video Bart!
Is it true that the Bible when describing the Pharaoh chasing the Israelites going through the parting of Red Sea, that it never describes Pharaoh going that far but only his army? So the pharaoh is never actually described as drowning, or dying there.
The children of Israel were now at the spring equinox - at the end of the year. Up to this time, the Lord went before them by day in a pillar of cloud (the days are cloudy during the rainy season) and by night in a pillar of fire = the stars (“toward evening during the rainy season, the clouds disappear, the Sun sets in a clear sky, and the nights are serene and fine ") " that they might go by day and night " (Ex. 13.2121). But now, at the end of winter, the rainy season being over, the Angel of the Gods (the spring equinox) removed and went behind them, and came between the Egyptians and the camp of Israel; and it was a cloud and darkness to them, but it gave light by night to these (Ex. 14.20). Thus, were the two parties, winter and summer, situated; the one would not recede and other could not advance. A miracle, of course, must be wrought to save the chosen of the Gods. So, the Lord said to Moses - "lift up thy rod, and stretch out thy hand over the sea and divide it" (Ex. 14.16). Aquarius rises heliacally or just before the Sun, and you will see Moses with his uplifted rod and outstretched hand, in the very act of dividing the Red Sea (the Aurora of the morning - of Spring). The waters (the rainy season) thus divided, the children of Israel pass over or through the sea dry-shod, while the Egyptians, pursuing, were "shook off" into the waters, i.e., winter ended and summer began. Take a look at Moses aka Aquarius with his rod in his left hand and water pot in his right hand.
I think the reason why the people were afraid of the 600,000 chariots was because....they were made of iron.
Iron = winter and sun in southern hemisphere. Joseph was in the chariot behind Pharaoh (Scorpio). This would make him Sagittarius.
Iron in the bronze age. 1175BCE is the onset late bronze collapse, 1050 BCE, the beginning of the Iron age.
@@Darisiabgal7573 you didn't get the joke. The old testament god was beaten by iron chariots after Israel began its war on other nations in Canaan.
@@MidlifeCrisis82 I suspected it was but i didnt get the context.
@@harveywabbit9541 exactly my thoughts.
Wow watching this again
This chanel on YT makes me feel noobish - and I like it!
Great stuff, guys. I was a little disappointed that no one mentioned how the origin of Sargon is almost identical to Moses'.
As well as Gilgamesh. Had the same story of being placed in the Nile in a reed basket as a baby and is found and adopted by a farmer or however it goes. It’s been a while but yeah several kings used that same exact origin story
@@Butlerwilliamp1986I didn't know this, thank you!
This is fire 🔥 great stuff
I spent some time in Eritrea. People have lived there since they were people. No trash anywhere if you could use it for anything it got picked up.
Great discussion, very interesting...
I can listen to Bart for hours!
I would say to the bible leaders at youth group, that what if it is just Chinese whispers and exaggeration in regards to Moses. I said it could be 100 people but when telling others this story they said “there were thousands” of people or we today say “millions of people” in order to portray a huge number to give awe to an account. I also said that the Red Sea was no where near them but perhaps it was a mistranslation from the “REED” sea, which you could cross on foot over the reeds growing there and the Reed sea was closer, I used to ask many questions at bible class & the teachers would sigh saying I was just playing the devil’s advocate. The leaders said” we know you have questions but we must caution that if you don’t accept theses teachings in your heart and have faith, then you were hit by a bus tomorrow and died, you will go to Hell” I know it was to scare me into now asking questions but it turned me away from faith.
I’m glad im not crazy for making the connect when I compared the Bible timeline with who would have been pharaoh in Moses supposed time in Egypt since the Bible conveniently leaves out the name of certain pharaohs
Excellent talk
Didn't an Egyptian find and name Moses? Thats why he was named Moses? 👀🤔
Yes
@@samanthadejardins9540
The Egyptian woman was a snake goddess, her history went back to Neith of Sais.
The Mo in Moses means water.
@@harveywabbit9541 No, it doesn't.
Moab is two words of Mo (water) and ab (father). Moses is a personification of Aquarius and the month of January. Medad is two words of me (water) and dad (lover).
This is Libra (Reed) in Isaiah 9.14-15.
Tell this to Robert Sepehr who can’t grasp this
He's a grifter fleecing his flock. He'll just push whatever crackpot conspiracy will stir up his audience and get him views.
lol
Love this guest.
The greeks said the Hebrews came from the east but the hyskos came in and helped Egypt but after the Egyptians didn't need them anymore they drove them out. Israeli archaeologists have also said the exodus didn't happen but if the number of people left Egypt they would still be leaving once they arrived. They crossed the reed sea not red sea because hebrew says reed sea. The 2nd expulsion was a religious revolt and i agree with Freud.
I'm so glad he mentions Joseph and the Hyksos. I definitely believe this was the source of the Exodus story, as the official Egyptian chronology is 300 years off. There were two Hyksos/Hebrew expulsions, after they were driven out the first time they went and got Nubian mercenaries and came back and took the place over and ruled a large part of Egypt until being driven out again. It is then that the Hebrews established their own country, and during the second period Egypt became multiculturalized.
Exodus never happened nor the persons mentioned in it never existed, these are all fairy tales like HERCULES, HARRY POTTER, SPIDERMAN etc.
@@anthonyjohn9000 no those are for the most part original stories. There is nothing original in the Bible.
Biblical Joseph is the constellation Sagittarius, his "chariot" was just behind Pharaoh (Scorpio). Oh! That Scorpion, he is such a meanie...throughout the bible. He had so many bad attributes, such as Satan..father of lies. Oh my! There never was a liar like Scorpion.
I heard a theory saying that the Abraham and Sarah refugee story was a portrayal of the Hyksos. The idea being that the Hyksos were refugees from India after the Aryan invasion. Hindu gods Brahma and Sarasweti equals Abraham and Sarah. Hagar symbolizes the Egyptian women and the intermixing that bore the Arabs (Ishmael)
@@1traphistory
It appears that Abram was married to the wife of Brahma who was also the wife of Osiris.
Adam/Cain/Seth are from Egyptian myth. Set/Seth a son of Nut (Heaven) and Geb (Earth) is both the "father" and "son." Set/Seth was an evil god who was killed by Horus. Isis, brought Set/Seth back as a reformed servant of Ra.
Set/Seth was depicted as a number of animals, such as the donkey. He was also the Cockatrice and others.
This really got me thinking. I first remember reading it was Ramses army who ran in to the red sea crossing and drowned but then it was Akenahten and Moses and witch God is he meeting?
mandela
You do realise this is fiction, right?
It is hard to disapprove a story...it is even harder to disapprove a written story. Especially a story with magic and super naturals...
We have many of those in Africa, magical things happening passed from generation to generation. Now imagine if it was written
Do you mean ‘disprove’?
@@alamunez thanks for the correction
Hi! I've Seen Your Old Video Regarding The Bible & Its An Eye Opener. Can You Do On The Amalekites Cause A Group Of People Are Saying The Arabs Are Descendant From Them...
I don't know why anyone debates the timeline of this since nearly all of the OT is contrived.
The Latin Jupiter plays a huge role in the bible. Did any bible teacher ever tell you that Melchizedek is two Hebrew words of King Jupiter?
All the Abrahamic texts are contrived fictions.
@@harveywabbit9541 I storied Hebrew in seminary and even Mauro Biglino does not translate it as that. I think I'd recheck it
@@gavinpeek7781
My neighbor, a Reform Jew, agrees that Melchizedek is King Jupiter. He was the just and righteous god of the Romans.
@@harveywabbit9541 great. So a man who has no connection to ancient Judaism and might speak modern Hebrew which has zero connection to ancient Hebrew says it means something that every scholar says can't be translated? Sure... if run with that
Love Dr. Bart
Bart D. Ehrman professor of
New Testament theologian at Princeton Theological Seminary 😮
❤
This is such a good point
it's allegory, the staff is always the spine, the snake is the Kundalini energy rising up the spine. How come you don't know this??? this is vary well known now.
True
How do you know the numbers of people who left Egipt don’t add up if initially you said there’s no historical evidence of that time periods
Re: the name of Moses. If the Egyptian aristocracy and the Israelites came from a common ancestor, it's possible that Moses could be both a Hebrew and an Egyptian name. The Hebrews may have reserved the use of the name while the Egyptians used it as a Royal name. And if you know a bit of paleo-Hebrew, the name Moses takes on an additional dimension. The first symbol (or the first letter) is Mem, which can mean Water or Chaos, And the meaning of the name Moses is "One who is/was drawn from the Water. As for the Egyptians, their own symbol for Water looks just like Mem.
What about bones? There must be zillions of quail bones alone.
They were after the qual eggs (magic mushrooms).
How anybody believes the story of the exodus is beyond me.
How anybody can't see that it is allegorical is beyond me.
To me there's something intriguing. Moses takes the golden calf "Burns It" mixes it with water and feeds it to the people.
Um. What is it?
It’s interesting that the huge number of Israelites in the Bible presents a historical problem for the Exodus. Because when the Qur’an narrates the story of Moses, it quotes the Pharaoh as saying this about them:
_”These are but _*_a small group of people,_*_ who are provoking & agitating us…”_ _(The Qur’an, __26:54__-55, Al-Shu’arā)_
It’s also interesting that Dr. Ehrman discusses the death of the pharaoh and how we still have the mummy of Ramses II. The Qur’an also said something about this ~1,450 years ago, before any of the relics were ever discovered. It quotes God as declaring to Pharaoh at his moment of death (before drowning):
*”Today We shall preserve your body, so that you may serve a sign for those after you. But indeed, most of humanity are heedless of Our signs.”* _(The Qur’an, 10:92, Yūnus)_
LOL...stop using Bart D. Ehrman as your source to attack the bible...
Bart D. Ehrman DENIES the existence of Moses too... 🤣
So that means ,your Koran is GARBAGE also , according to Bart D. Ehrman
@@krishyyfan5153 You sound very passive-aggressive. Is that perhaps because Dr. Ehrman has written countless devastating books that have utterly obliterated & decimated people’s trust of the New Testament? And which have contributed to a massive wave of suspicion, doubt, and Christian apostasy the like of which has never been seen before? I get it. If I was a Christian, I too would understand how awkward and troubling that would feel, and the need to protect my ego by calling other Scriptures like the Qur’an (which Dr. Ehrman himself has actually praised for its high level of preservation compared to the New Testament) a piece of so-called “garbage”. But I’m really sorry that you feel the urge to have to speak like that. It’s really quite a shame.
But in any case, note that I never attacked the Bible to begin with; my only point was to show how the Qur’an shields itself from these historical criticisms by aligning with the Egyptological historical evidence much better than the Biblical narratives (which also has the secondary effect of proving that the Qur’an did not plagiarize blindly from the Bible, as some people falsely assume). That’s all. But as Muslims, we still believe that much of the Bible is divinely inspired and contains God’s word & truth about the prophets and His actions in history. We believe in God, and in what was revealed to us, and what was revealed before-and we surrender & devote ourselves entirely to God.
Also it doesn’t matter to me that Dr. Ehrman might deny Moses’ existence. Using a strict & rigid historical method (based on methodological naturalism), it is understandable and expected that it would be highly difficult to ascertain almost _anyone’s_ existence in the ancient past. And with enough pushing, you can cast doubt on nearly ANYONE’S historicity, let alone someone ~3,500 years ago. Doubts about the existence of Jesus also used to be commonplace; but now his historicity is accepted by nearly all scholars. So for all we know, with time the same paradigm shift might occur with Moses. But until then-absence of evidence isn’t necessarily evidence of absence. And none of this even affects the original points I was making about the Qur’an.
@@celestialknight2339 stop your nonsense... All Scholars use the New Testament to study the Historicity of Jesus....They don't use the Koran....Bart Ehrman even published a Book in 2012 proving the historicity of Jesus and he used the New Testament...not the Koran...LOL
@@krishyyfan5153 Great job not responding to any of my points! Insults seems to be your preferred method of choice over intellectual argument. How elegant.
To your point-of course historians use the New Testament, because once again, historians use *methodological naturalism* (if you don’t know what that term is, look it up)
So it’s expected for them to go the earliest source they can get their hands on, without being allowed to assume or pre-supposed the divine inspiration of any document. But as you & I BOTH know-as believers in God-it theologically doesn’t matter to us whether God reveals something 10 years, 1,000 years, or even 1 million years after the fact! Because God by definition has Perfect Knowledge of the past, present, and future. Therefore if God DID reveal it, we can still happily accept what He says as truth, despite the timeline in which it came.
But ironically, those SAME New Testament scholars you reference would actually agree MORE with the Quran’s presentation of Jesus (and particularly his self-perception) than they would the New Testament, which they virtually all agree is FILLED with ahistorical myths, legends, changes & distortions, and Hellenistic pagan-influenced ideas of the Messiah that Jesus himself never taught in the streets of Galilee as a humble & devout Palestinian Jewish preacher of God.
Dr. Bart Ehrman himself is on the record as saying that Jesus probably thought of himself as no more than the Messiah and *_”an apocalyptic prophet”_* And this agrees MUCH more with the Qur’an, than with the exaggerated, inflated, and excessive claims of Christians (and various New Testament authors) that Jesus supposedly claimed to be things such as God’s co-equal divine son (which he never said), or a part of the Trinity who is equally worthy of worship alongside the Father (which he never said). These are now basically provable falsehoods, which deviate severely from the historical Christ’s actual teachings. Historical Bible scholars know this. (And for us Muslims, that’s why the Qur’an came “afterwards” in the first place-to CORRECT those mistaken beliefs, and to bring people back to the truth & reality of the matter)
So yes, those historians & scholars obviously go to the New Testament first to study the person of Jesus-but they also recognize that it is FILLED with historical exaggerations and inaccuracies about Christ’s self-perception and alleged teachings. And Dr. Ehrman has written incredible works about the evolution that we see in the Gospels, as you go from the earliest account (Mark) to the latest account (John) where you can visibly see these numerous theological changes, exaggerations, and inflations of Jesus’s image as he goes from a humble rabbi and preacher of God (in the Synoptics), all the way to a semi-divine or divine being who no longer preachers about God’s kingdom, but almost EXCLUSIVELY about Himself in John’s Gospel (with all sorts of suddenly new and suspiciously unheard of “I Am” statements that didn’t exist in ANY of the previous Synoptic Gospels). Thus there is CLEAR embellishment going on, where Jesus’s image is like a snowball that just keeps getting bigger as it rolls with time. Nearly all New Testament scholars agree with this, including Dr. Ehrman-whose books such as _”Misquoting Jesus”_ and _”How Jesus Became God”_ I would highly recommend that you read for more knowledge and insight.
But once again-I stand firm in my claim-that you can take ANY unbiased or secular New Testament scholar/historian, and ask them the following question: *”Which is more consistent with the best historical evidence we have on how the historical Jesus of Nazareth probably viewed himself?”*
*A)* A book which claims that Jesus declared himself to be the divine son of God, a co-equal member of a Holy Trinity, and a divine incarnation of none other than YHWH the God of the Old Testament, who has come down from Heaven and is eternally worthy of the highest religious worship and divine praise.
Or
*B)* A book which claims that Jesus was simply a wise Jewish rabbi and humble believer in God, who thought of himself as the awaited Jewish Messiah and an apocalyptic prophet, who preached to the Children of Israel, and who thought of himself as being distinct from God-a servant of God-and no more than a divinely-inspired human messenger, sent by God to preach and warn before the coming Day of Judgement.
Without a doubt, I can practically GUARANTEE you that the overwhelming *vast majority* of historians & secular New Testament scholars, would agree with *Option B* which represents *the Qur’an* (yes, even though it came later!)-and NOT the Christian conception which you believes comes from the Bible. So even though they may not take the Qur’an has history, they would still confess that the Qur’an is _more historically accurate_ in its representation of who Jesus thought himself to be.
@@celestialknight2339 are you kidding me??...How many Times did Bart Ehrman accuse the Koran of copying from Gnostic Heretics.... It was the Gnostic Heretics who propagated the belief that a SWAP of persons happened during the Crucifixion of Jesus...
the Koran Copied this Gnostic heresy...
Bart Ehrman affirms that Jesus truly died on the Cross...
And Gnostic Informant knows first hand...he was there.
😂😂😂😂 KaaAAABOOOOOOOOOOOOom
Thutmoses 3 was probably the Exodus' Pharoah. Hathshepsut was co-ruler with him and later her images were removed because she supported Moses. Thutmose eldest son didn't succeed him on the throne because he died in childhood. This coincides with the biblical plague that killed all the Egyptian firstborn. The Kolbrin Bible's Book of Manuscripts has a section titled The Destroyer that gives an Egyptian account of the Exodus.
Nah my man.
It was most likely one of these
Snefru
Khufu
Djefre.
NO DOUBT.
If you want proofs and details. You can ask for my DMs
In the Jewish midrashic tradition it's unresolved whether the Pharoah of the exodus was killed or whether he lived on past that event, regardless of the plain understanding of the text. There are rabbis that hold either opinion.
The Exodus from Egypt (winter) begins on December 25, every year. We celebrate the "escape" as the pass over from winter to spring.
Doesn't Hicksas mean "rulers from afar"?
Jordan Peterson had a interesting take on the Exodus story. It was a phycological slant where the snakes were fears and the people had to look at their fears in order to overcome them. They had been slaves and wanted to go back in some cases. If they wanted to be a fee people they would have to contend with all that freedom means. the good and the bad.
Free to prosper, free to starve, Borrowed from a Viking book.
The Exodus story, in the bible, only takes place in the Mazzaroth.
Ah yes, JP, the famous historian 🙄
13:56 I have been obsesaed with the scape goat narrative!! I am pretty sure Jesus is the goat that is sacrificed who's blood is used to anoint and Judas is the Scapegoat that is cast out. its the same Dark knight haha Batman is the Scapegoat Harvey is the Sacrifice to anoint Gotham lol If modern politics has taught me anything take a second look when somebody says "For the Profits obviously." Not to mention Azazel was also the angel castout from heaven right?
The first of these we shall notice is the scapegoat found in Leviticus 16 - " And the goat shall bear upon him all their iniquities to a land not inhabited " (vs. 22). The original (and also the marginal reading of the common Bible) is - to a land of "separation" in allusion, doubtless, to the line of the equator, which separates the two hemispheres. This line is “not inhabited."
Now let us observe the marvels which a critical examination of this subject will bring to light. The priest (Aaron = the point of the summer solstice in Cancer) is to " take the two goats, and present them before the Lord (Sun in Capricorn, opposite Cancer then setting as the Sun rises) at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation " (winter solstice), where the Sun is, Aries, the leader of the congregation being on his meridian (Lev. 16.7). He is next to " cast lots upon the two goats; one (Capricorn) for the Lord, and the other (Sun) for the scapegoat' 1 (Lev. 16.8). Here the Sun in Capricorn is conceived of as two goats, while really there is but one, and he a personification. This one (Capricorn) "upon which the Lord's lot fell," is to be instantly sacrificed (i.e., left by the Sun) for a sin-offering, or the remission (the giving-up) of the sins of the world, or of the year, i.e., the Sun's south declination will decrease from the winter solstice and become nought at the spring equinox. The other, the Sun, will be for a scape-goat, to bear off the sins (Sun's south declination) of the world, which had been heaped upon him during the past three months, and be " presented alive before the Lord, to make an atonement with him " - with him, not to him (Lev. 16.10). Thus: The Goat (Capricorn) is sacrificed (left behind) when the Sun leaves him; and the Sun in leaving him, escapes the Goat, and hence becomes the scape-goat, and so is no goat, any more than the man who escapes the gallows, is a gallows.
The High Sun will be the Summer solstice in Leo or Cancer. There is a strong connection between Issachar (Cancer constellation) and Zebulun (Capricorn constellation). Also note...Aquarius (Rebuben) is opposite Leo (Judah).
Wow
I agree, being rescued by the Egyptian princess, and adopted by her.
I would expect Moses to have an Egyptian name ; he was rescued and raised by Egyptians .. so I was wondering why you both were stupidly laughing that he didn’t have a Hebrew name?
Bart always has an inappropriate stupid laugh. It's one of his charms.
The conversation is about a fictional character and where their name originated.
@@alamunez I still don’t get it .. If your saying Moses was a fictional character ( many would disagree ) but if this “fictional character” was rescued by an Egyptian woman why would he have a Hebrew name?
@@camilleespinas2898 None of the actual experts would disagree. Again, the conversation is about why the fictional character would be named an Egyptian name, what function it serves in the telling of the story.
The one thing they didn’t tell you was he didn’t exist.
Both Francesca Stavrakapolou and Israel Finkelstein (among other experts who approach it historically and scientifically) make that perfectly clear)! But ... 🙈🙉
Staveakapolou is an expert on texts not archaeology.
Finkelstein is an archaeologist but his books are dated and have been refuted.
@@BigJFindAWay Yes, Stavrakapolou is expert on the texts where the claims about Abraham, Moses, etc., are made.
Please name the sources you say refute Finklestein so I can study them.
about dating the hyksos vs exodus.. were they using a sexagismal or decimal system to keep track? and did someone try to "correct" the dates?
The Hyksos period and expulsion fits perfectly the time between Joseph and the time of the Exodus which occurs around 200 years later after the death of Joseph and his brothers. The Hyksos were of semitic origin allowing for the rise of Joseph also a semite. The Torah then states that a time came when a new pharaoh came to power (an Egyptian not a Hyksos) that knew not of Joseph (better translated to could have cared less about the historical Joseph) and the Hebrews living in Egypt which were a constant reminder to this new pharaoh of the possible danger to his empire these Hebrews engendered should the Hyksos or another semitic race of peoples decide to try and take back the reins of power from the Egyptian rulers. This threat was not far away but living among them in Egypt itself, therefore the new king of Egypt was determined to quell that threat by enslaving the Hebrews under his rule. Nobody knows for sure who this pharaoh was for he isn't named in the Torah. Some say Ramses II, others Seti 1 and others some other king. I have always doubted it was Ramses II for the time frame simply doesn't fit. Also they did not cross the Red Sea, that is a Christian mistranslation of the text. Jews have always known it was the Sea of Reeds just across from Midian, Moses old stomping grounds for 40 years with his wife and father-in-law Jethro (Reuel).
The whole entire story is mythology. Israelites were never enslaved in Egypt. "Semite" is a huge language family that include, along with Hebrew, Akadian, Babylonian, Syriac, Amorite, Proto-Canaanite, Phonecian. Moabite and more. The Exodus story was composed no earlier than the 5th Century BCE (based on the topography. Exodus names cities and places that did not exist before then) and while it might be influenced by the Hyksos narrative, it's still essentially a literary creation and a foundation myth. Just as a reminder, he Hyksos were not slaves, they were rulers and they did not escape, they were chased away.
The fact that the Pharaoh is not named casts a lot of doubt. This is probably the most powerful man in the world at this time. It just seems incredible that he is not named. Like referring to the President of the United States in the Civil War without mentioning the name of Abraham Lincoln.
@@PeterGregoryKelly That is a serious consideration and one that should be taken into the investigation but not one that totally discredits the account.
@@PeterGregoryKelly The name of Ramesses II is referenced indirectly when it says the Israelites were forced to build the city of Pi-Ramesses, a city which was built by Ramesses II. For trhis reason, Ramesses II is sometimes identified as the Pharaoh of the Exodus in pop culture (e.g. DeMille's *Ten Commandments*). One huge problem with this identification is that Ramesses II did not drown in the Red Sea. We know this for a fact because his mummy is in a museum in Cairo and the body has been forensically examined up the wazoo (literally and figuratively). He was 90 years old when he died and he didn't die of drowning, he died of a tooth infection.
The 600,000,000,000,000, chariots of iron (winter) are the six southern constellations called Libra, Scorpio, Sagittarius, Capricorn, Aquarius, and Pisces. This is also the six nights in Genesis one. This fairy tale is modified when the writers took the first night (libra) and added it to the six "days" to get the sacred seven months of summer. This left winter with five chariots of iron aka Scorpio - Pisces. Rev 9.5, describes these five signs/months that brings us up to the spring equinox. Pharaoh rides in the first chariot (Scorpio) and behind him is Joseph (Sagittarius).
Cn we be friends
@@glorihulda933
Oh! How those Pagan Jews loved to blend their astronomical charts. Assuming that all the viewers are aware that Moses was more commonly called Bacchus/Dionysus and even Osiris. We find he was born on December 25 when the winter solstice was in Aquarius. The Latin Jupiter was the "father" of Moses.
In the Pagan mythology, Dionysus or Bacchus was the son of Jupiter by Semele. The father of the Gods, at the request of Semele, having approached her with his thunder and lightning, set the palace on fire, when Semele perished in the flames. Being at her seventh month, Jupiter transferred the infant Bacchus into his thigh to be brought forth at the proper time. This story, which is related in almost every book on mythology, Thomas Franklin, D.D... The translator of Lucian, styles a "ridiculous fable." But crack the nut, and the rich meat will appear.
Jupiter is the year, being represented by the Man in the frontispiece of every almanac. Semele is the summer of seven months, and denoted by the Man's body. Summer extended from the 25th of March, or Annunciation day, to the 25th of October, the last of the ancient summer months. Thence to the 25th of December would be two months. These added to the seven summer months would make nine months, the time required. The second birth would then take place at the winter solstice, denoted by the Man's knees, to which Capricorn points. (See old farmer's almanac.)
I did as you to tell mi about pisces but you never did
@@glorihulda933
At one time, the northern star in Pisces was a swallow. She went by the name Isis who became the Virgin Mary.
@@harveywabbit9541 hmmmm
❤❤ SO, HOW DID YOU LOSE ALL THAT WEIGHT, MR. EHRMAN ????? NICE 👌 JOB !!
Can we still do that study?
The Bible is a metaphor for spiritual and intellectual enlightenment.
If you interpret it literally, you’re not getting it. Its an esoteric hidden knowledge (Gnostic) in the story. It’s a story within a story to illustrate a deeper meaning of something. All the characters in it are personifications or archetypes of others in ancient Egypt. They use symbolism in it.
The snake symbolism I believe is the vibrational frequencies of energy.
All the characters are fictional.
The numbers as in the Bible are numerology, since the New Testament was written in Greek, the ‘word’ is the spoken word. John 1:1 “ In the beginning was the word and the word was with god and the word was god.” And right after that it says ‘Let there be light.”
The twelve disc/iple of Jesus is reference to the twelve signs of the zodiac as it portrayed in the photo of the last supper. The disciples of Jesus is grouped in 3 by 4 to get 12 and Jesus the Sun being the number 13.
The story is literary, poetic, allegorical, metaphorical.
“Many will look with their eyes but cannot see, and to listened with their ears but cannot hear……”
Note that Joktan/Yoktan has 13 "sons." The famous 12 are found in Genesis one. The six days = Aries thru Virgo (spring equinox - autumn equinox). The six nights = Libra thru Pisces (autumn equinox - spring equinox). This is modified when Libra, the first light, is added to the six "days" to get the sacred seven. Sheba (7) is where we find Saturn ruled by Venus.
This shake-up left the seven "days' representing summer and the remaining five (Scorpio thru Pisces) becomes winter (sun in southern hemisphere. See Rev. 9.5, where the five months that can harm man is led by the scorpion. Winter is also symboled as Iron. The five wounds of Jesus (as winter) is these five constellations. Jesus, as the winter sun, always "dies" at the Pass Over from Egypt (winter) to the Promised Land (summer). As the Christ "he" will "die" as the sun leaves "summer" and enters "winter." This is the destruction of the Temple of God (the seven months of "summer) and transition to "winter." The death of Summer is marked by the slaying of the Ram (Aries) the Golden Ram who gets his horns entangled in the thorns (winter).
The bible is not alone or special in this regard. Not only can many ancient spiritual texts be interpreted this way , many other nonspiritual texts have been also.
More than any writings importance is the knowledge and skill of the interpreter.
I agree they need interpretation. But if interpreted in the psyche, the interpretation is grounded and interactive. It also appears in just about every single piece of story told literature from antiquity. It is in fact, the template of 'The Hero's Journey." The similarities are because they are sharing the original template. I find it in the Enuma Elish, the Babylonian creation epic which is older than Genesis. It's fake. I can show it.
Interesting that he claims that they found chariots in the bottom of the red sea. Which is true they didn't find them in the red sea. They found them in the Gulf of Aqaba where the crossing actually occurred. They also found an excellent place for the actual Mount Sinai which is actually called still today the mountain of Moses but it's not in the Sinai Peninsula it's actually in the peninsula of Arabia. There is even a stone there that appears to have been split and water coming out from the base of it in antiquity. But all of these things occurred about 1450 bc, not 1250 BC or closer to 1200 BC as people try and manipulate the Bible into. Because the Bible is not necessarily exact according to its chronological order, and we know this because the Septuagint has different dates and times in it than does the Leningrad codex. Which means that somebody changed the text of the Old Testament between 200 BC and 1000 ad. And it may have been done so to confuse the genealogy of Christ. As for any of these subferonic peoples possibly being moses, that is completely consistent with scripture and its references. Because even Ramses is a version of Moses! So I don't know when this interview was taken, but the evidence for the Exodus does exist it just exists about 200 to 250 years off of what was claimed in biblical scriptures for many centuries now. And the hicksos primarily did occur far before the exodus, but there is fellas of the time, in the middle dynastic era that indicate that they had expelled a group of Hebrews, although by a slightly different name. But they're never going to admit that they actually were able to show up the Powers at b. And the Bible is not really strict on whether or not Ramses was killed trying to catch up with the refugees while crossing the Gulf of Aqaba. But the fact that his choice Army was destroyed would have been just as severe to his reputation. Plus Egypt ran all of the peninsula of the Sinai at the time and it was critical that the Hebrews get out of Egyptian territory.
Where in the world did you get the idea that 3 million people was more than the population of Egypt at the time. Even a cursory examination of when they believed that the Great Pyramid was built, which isn't true at all but they have evidence of about 15 to 20 million people living in Egypt at 2500 BC. If there were only three to four million people in Egypt at that time they would not have even been able to keep up the edifices that we know about they would not have had enough people to even keep them going. And we only know about 20 to 30% of what is expected to still be in the area of egypt. Egypt was Far larger, especially when it was known as Khem or Khemet. We have direct knowledge that the pyramids are several thousand years older than asserted by archaeologists because of the ostrich egg in the Cairo Museum that depicts the serpent as the River Nile and the three pyramids that have been etched on it that tests several thousand years before they claim the pyramids were even built. That is direct evidence that they existed at least 5000 BC which puts them about 2500 years older at the very least then these wild ass guesses from people in the early 1800s when archeology was barely more than people running around blowing s*** up and trying to get at how old things actually were. They weren't even able to decipher Egyptian writings yet. Dometic or the hieroglyphs.
And then this man with his Harry Potter glasses is complaining about 600 chariots, that's at least 1800 Special Forces at the head of an army that's at least 10 to 12,000 men, going after people who are walking across the desert already and I would Hazard a guess that it's at least double that amount, when you get all of the Infantry and the support troops and everything else that you have to provide. Don't forget that this was the army that was the most capable on the planet at the time. That would be like complaining that the United States did not utterly devastate the Iraqi troops of 200,000 mechanized troops with a mere 30,000 of our own, when we sent in in one battle a single tank got through a fire break and destroyed eight tanks before the other tanks even made the break through the fireline. According to the Egyptians the Pharaoh at the time of the expulsion of the Hebrews was Ahmoses. Which would have placed it in the 1400s, so you're talking about about the 15th century. And a couple of hundred years off for archaeologists irritates the hell out of archaeologists but there's actually pretty good at guessing age. And many of these people actually left and went to several other countries because not everybody stayed with moses. Many of them took off on their own.
Remember that the Bible is a book of signs and symbols. The serpent on the stake is a symbol. It's meant to teach them a little bit of Faith because they head up till then only showed faith when they thought it was in their best interest. They have to learn to live in faith at all times. And the evidence at the foot of Mount Moses doesn't indicate 2 to 3 million people. It indicates about 600,000 total. And it could be that that was the only misrepresentation was that it was about 600,000 total which would have only allowed about 70 to 80,000 at best of fighting age.
And when you're talking about Barabas and you misrepresent the understanding of what is shown with that story, remember that the word Barabas means son of the father. It's a symbolic incident. The world and yes Christ was crucified outside the city. And the temple was also outside the city. The temple was not inside the city of David. It was actually about 600 ft south of the Dome of the Rock. Right behind where the Western Wall sits today and the Western Wall was never a part and parcel of the actual Temple. There is even a threshing floor at that location. And it's the only place in the area where you can actually grow things and it was originally purchased as a farm. I'd like to see you put seeds out on the Dome of the Rock and grow stuff.
There is at least once where Moses sits and speaks with God as if you would speak to a friend, face to face. And many theologist find this insane because they claim that no one can while in the flesh, stand before god. Which is a misinterpretation of the events. Remember these things have been translated at least six times from the original Hebrew into Aramaic and then into several other languages since then. And then we only have the translation from the Leningrad codex which we know to be a corrupted translation because the Pharisees and sadducees, who were not Hebrews or if they were they were basically assigned to their positions by the Romans or by Herod who was a puppet of the Romans anyway, and they needed to usurp the reality of Yeshua, Jesus's Hebrew name, and disturb his lineage.
I like the video, as wrong as some of it appears to be, because I also like the gnostics because I think they were the ones who understood the actual reality of Yeshua. I actually am of the opinion that the gnostics had once been what we call the essenes.
Jesus said nobody ever saw Father , so moses was talking to his god satan , the child killer and attention seeker
Very interesting comment thank you. Yes, I think the Gnostics got it partly right. In 'Fragments of a Faith forgotten' by Mead when I had it, I remember a passage where Jesus was talking to the Christ (spirit). My current theology - Ha, is that in the beginning, God the Father is Spirit, the Christ is spirit with him as the Word and his first born, and the "holy spirit" is the life, the breath of God. So Jesus was talking to the Christ before he was baptised. When he was baptised the holy spirit of God with the Christ spirit came upon him, and he became Jesus the Christ full of the holy spirit of God. The Gnostics say that Christ came to Earth already in his spiritual body which was never one of flesh. However, I believe that he was also born as a man to relate to humankind and in that way as a man was never part of God. ( The word became flesh and dwelt among us) However, in the mystery of a death being required and blood to be spilt in that regard, he humbled himself to the lowest possible level, and maximum suffering which fooled all the powers and principalities in the spiritual realm, and was exalted above all of them in the highest place as a "god" ie a divine being under the Father, the Most High God, and now sits at his right hand as his heir - just as we can also be his heir ( don't you know that you are all "gods") by being in union with Jesus, the Way to the Father. The Father put his holy spirit in Jesus, who in turn gives the same holy spirit of the Father to us. Jesus breathed the holy spirit of God into his disciples.
I am also fascinated by the Essenes, and was before I became a follower of the Way, but these were the occult sub branch gnostic group. Even though he is pre-trib, a trinitarian, and a dispensationalist -Ha, I think Ken Johnson as a translator and scholar of the Dead Sea Scrolls is the closest I have come across regarding the original Essenes who came down the line of the Zadok priests. His narrative is that they were the original "Jews" and the first followers of the Way. At the destruction of the first temple and sacking of Jerusalem, he says they escaped to Egypt to avoid the Roman slaughter until it was safe to come back to the Dead Sea area. However, some of them stayed in Egypt and split into various groups, particularly in Alexandria where scores of gnostic sects formed. That's what Mead's book was about, picking up scraps of some of the fragments that remained in tact. Simon Magus as recorded in the book of Acts was one of these who initially was a follower of the Way, but evidently turned gnostic, came back to Jerusalem and tried to buy the power of the Most High that Peter was demonstrating, which of course was refused him. "As in the days of Noah" are almost upon us as part of the cycles that are recorded for us to learn and gain wisdom from, and from what I believe are the writings of the Essenes recorded in the Dead Sea Scrolls, I think give us practical expression and wisdom of how we should be living to face the dark times ahead of us that they were in the middle of.
Bart is the book written Henry C Lea on the Catholic Church and entitled “A History of the inquisition of the Middle Ages”a factual account of these events. If true, I think there would be few Catholics if this was common knowledge.
Bart!
None of the world's historians ever repudiated the story of Moses as the Prince of Egypt. He never had a Hebrew name, even God spoke to the man by the Egyptian name of Moses. Now if Moses was just a legend, then historians would have noted the myth factor as early as the time of Solomon's title of 'King of Kings". All the Persian Satraps and all the Arab Kings honored the title of King of Kings, over the Land of Mesopotamia. None of these logical inferences ever suggested that Moses was merely a myth. You should not insult the intelligence of these tribal associations , they had every opportunity to voice to even the best Greek Historians any objective revelations about Moses being a real history or a myth. Historians today cannot get past even the criticism of Marcus Tullius Cicero, who said of "Herodotus" the famous Greek Father of History , "Herodotus was a liar". But nothing by these historians that even Cicero rated as unreliable, ever mentions the story of Moses being a myth or fable. There was an age of Oral Story Telling, before written language arts were popular to the recording of history. But they know that Hercules and Achaemenid were Fables, not real persons. But there was no contemporary biographers proving that Julius Caesar was really a human being who lived, for nothing of the written records exist for at least a hundred years after the time of Julius Caesar, and the most relevant famous Lawyer and Historian , Marcus Tullius Cicero, having lived in the same time as Caesar, never once mentioned Julius Caesar as a human being who actually lived. But the Gods of Rome, at the Altar of Victory, included a image of a man named Julius Caesar, as a God, not as a man, and then Octavian used the name of Julius Caesar as a surname or extra name for himself, as he emerged as Caesar who actually established the line of Flavian Caesars, and was renamed as Augustus Caesar, which means "Father of the Nations " in the Roman Empire ruled then by Flavian Caesars.
Also to note Nero Caesar was married to a Jewess, and favored the Jews of Judaism , over the newly made sect of the Christians and persecuted the Christians, at the behest of the Rabbis, of them one was Tiberius Baal, the grandson of Nero Caesar, whose grave in Israel is venerated to this day as a Rabbi in Rome who persecuted Christians, and explains the tradition of Judaism opposing Jesus Christ and advocating the destruction of all Jews who might come to believe Jesus is the Messiah of Israel. The true history you have been prevented from learning, because Cicero told us how historians were liars, and that remains true to this day. It is all given to Political Propaganda, and in the "ICONOCLAST" to break the Cross and destroy the Catholic Church , modernists have taken to repudiate a history to which they have no facts supporting them, except WITCHCRAFT AND SORCERCY.
No other culture in the middle east noticed any of exodus. Its not a big area,
@@onlyme972
Egypt = the rainy winter season.
At one time people believed that Hercules was a real. So Hercules may reference a historical figure. The Greeks went through a theological crisis after Thales and Pythagoras creating several hundred years were people felt more obliged to recognize that the Gods and heroes were allegorical. This is well documented and dramatized in Plato’s apologia.
Moses could be a real person but the story of Moses is certainly not a historical account.
There is absolutely zero evidence of anyone called Moses outside the bible. Same as there is zero evidence of any god existing.
If you take that as an insult then that’s your religious problem
Dr Bart d ehrman wrote misquoting Jesus , great book.
The caduceus and staff of Hermès were part of the staff of Moses.
Were the Ten Commandments given in Midian or in the Sinai Desert, next to Saint Catherine's monastery?
No
Nicely gleaned with your theories, while raising the interpretations he made of scenarios that you presented (Scapegoat).
The first of these we shall notice is the scapegoat found in Leviticus 16 - " And the goat shall bear upon him all their iniquities to a land not inhabited " (vs. 22). The original (and also the marginal reading of the common Bible) is - to a land of "separation" in allusion, doubtless, to the line of the equator, which separates the two hemispheres. This line is “not inhabited."
Now let us observe the marvels which a critical examination of this subject will bring to light. The priest (Aaron = the point of the summer solstice in Cancer) is to " take the two goats, and present them before the Lord (Sun in Capricorn, opposite Cancer then setting as the Sun rises) at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation " (winter solstice), where the Sun is, Aries, the leader of the congregation being on his meridian (Lev. 16.7). He is next to " cast lots upon the two goats; one (Capricorn) for the Lord, and the other (Sun) for the scapegoat' 1 (Lev. 16.8). Here the Sun in Capricorn is conceived of as two goats, while really there is but one, and he a personification. This one (Capricorn) "upon which the Lord's lot fell," is to be instantly sacrificed (i.e., left by the Sun) for a sin-offering, or the remission (the giving-up) of the sins of the world, or of the year, i.e., the Sun's south declination will decrease from the winter solstice and become nought at the spring equinox. The other, the Sun, will be for a scape-goat, to bear off the sins (Sun's south declination) of the world, which had been heaped upon him during the past three months, and be " presented alive before the Lord, to make an atonement with him " - with him, not to him (Lev. 16.10). Thus: The Goat (Capricorn) is sacrificed (left behind) when the Sun leaves him; and the Sun in leaving him, escapes the Goat, and hence becomes the scape-goat, and so is no goat, any more than the man who escapes the gallows, is a gallows.
The High Sun will be the Summer solstice in Leo or Cancer. There is a strong connection between Issachar (Cancer constellation) and Zebulun (Capricorn constellation). Also note...Aquarius (Rebuben) is opposite Leo (Judah).
@@harveywabbit9541 interesting how these sacrifices could get rerouted and melded into pagan tradition with parameters quite specific and reflexive. Sounds like we are sending a 1 pulse per second to Sophia and the Light bringer, encoded of our seasonal cycle. Earth's harmonic frequency, if u will.
Genesis is framed up on the template of "The Hero's Journey' like so many other works from antiquity. Humans today have lost the ability to figure them out, instead opting to treat them as real. Like trying to figure out what species of Tortoise or Hare, what they must have believed in etc, never figuring out there is a nested lesson. And it isn't for the theists or the academics. It is only for the soul seeker.
Did Moses become his own Grandpa?
Moses (winter), like Cain (winter)...married his own mother.
Moses, or Aquarius, passing from the dark into the light hemisphere, married Zipporah (the singing bird), the Virgo of spring. By Zipporah, Moses had two sons - Eliezer (Ram- helps = summer), and Gershom (A-stranger-here = winter, i.e., winter comes after summer).
Zipporah circumcised her son. Of course, she did; but her son was her husband. This the text distinctly declares: "Then Zipporah took a sharp stone (the stone Ebenezer) and cut off the foreskin of her son and cast it at his (her son's) feet, and said, surely a bloody husband art thou to me " (Ex. 4.25). Language cannot be plainer.
Now, in explanation: Moses had two sons, Eliezer and Gershom. The first personified summer, was not circumcised, because he didn't reach the end of the year. Hence, he was " cut off from his people " (Gen. 17. 14). Gershom was born in a strange land, as his name imports. He thus represented both hemispheres with his father; and both coming to the spring equinox at the same moment, were circumcised by Zipporah, who, coming down to the western horizon, seized the stone, cut off the "foreskin" of each, and cast it at their (Moses') feet - Aquarius having just entered the upper hemisphere. (See your Zodiac.) Thus, we can understand how the Bible worthies intermarried - the father the daughter, the son the mother, etc.
Lessons? Like what? The God of the Old Testament is an immoral evil prick so don’t mess with him?
islam
@@MEDDEAAMON Yes, Islam is also framed on the template of the Hero's Journey. If all the Abrahamic religions evolved from Genesis, then by default, it doesn't become any more true after that. Christians and Muslims are far down stream from reality.
@@harveywabbit9541 I've got it dialed in
The bronze serpent raised up on the standard is a lightning rod
I had no idea there were still gnostics in the world. huh.
Incredible service you guys bring
This is so good
Is the snake idol related to snake worship in Egypt at the time?
Egyptians had a lot of animal hybrid gods but I dont recall a snake god. Can you remind me of what one would be named ?
Pharaoh's daughter was a snake goddess. She took good care of baby Moses. This baby was soon a beautiful boy and Zeus/Jupiter fell in love with him and flew him to Mount Olympus (Exodus 19.4).
@@bellezavudd
There is also the Pharaoh's daughter, a snake goddess, who cared for baby Moses.
Renenutet, also called Rannut, Greek name Thermuthis, in Egyptian religion, goddess of fertility and of the harvest, sometimes depicted in the form of a snake. In addition to her other functions, she was also counted as the protector of the king. You can bet that this goddess is also Isis, the Egyptian Mother of Jesus. We could even go back to Neith of Sais Egypt, mother of all the gods and her only son was the sun.
@@harveywabbit9541
Just looked up some . There's some interesting hieroglyphs of snakes with very long legs. Humorous looking actually. And of course the famed winged serpent. Don't know how I forgot about that one.
Wadjet, Renenutet, Nehebkau, & Meretseger were some of the names I came across.
@1:20 sir chariots were made of all wood,exept nut bolts which might be metal ,and wood can't survive more than 50 years if left in water.
Phenomenal interview
Jon Snow
Wasn't the Bible taken from The Epic Of Gilgamesh? If it was then is the Bible true?
The flood part of the story, yes. To your other question: no.
I guess, unknowingly, Dr. Bart made two arguments that would rather cement someone's faith in God rather than refute it. He said it in a way I'm not sure I've heard pastors say.
Please expand.
@@MarcusAurelius13 I think they both have to do with the law helping me to see the law is not for today. Maybe just one has to do w/ the law, I'd have to watch the video again. Why do you ask?
When I first read John 3:14, I thought it was an allusion to when Moses had snakes that were stiff, but then they awoke when thrown on the ground (turning staffs into snakes.) i.e. I thought it was an allusion to initiation rituals.
Daniel is a forgery . Onias is the Christ
I love this channel
Tanakh doesn’t say that the pharaoh in Exodus was Ramses II. It identifies the city they were building as one named for him, but Ramses II renamed many sites and monuments for himself in his long rule.
I’m not a Biblical literalist, I’m not claiming it’s true history, but that particular issue isn’t a contradiction. Exodus was simply identifying the city by the name it was known as at the time of its writing.
I hope by now that Bart has read THE VALEDICTION OF MOSES and compared it to the Hebrew Matthew.
Lots of truth bombs being dropped in this one
Moses is Orpheus
I didn’t even bother watching it I know it’s total nonsense and total misunderstanding of Hebrew scripture and tradition
@@yosefgreen3130
Traditions are culture ,
not truth.
@@bellezavudd
When the tradition is an inseparable part of the archeology and the text then no🤷♂️
@@yosefgreen3130
That's not a clear statement.
"then no" what?
Then no it isn't true?
You're agreeing with me?
And archaeology isnt a tradition or a culture.
Well ,except maybe, among archaelogists.🤔
Excellent presentation
also another problem with that was ramses was at the age 130 with severe artheritis