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The Contrarians Panel: Dark Horse Album #37 - Kiss Unmasked
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- Опубликовано: 10 апр 2023
- Great discussion regarding one of the first few "poppy" efforts for Kiss that seemingly derailed their meteoric rise. Was this album a big mistake? Find out what our panel thinks of it!
The Contrarians is a show where one of us jumps in the hot seat picks a dark horse album from a band as that band's best album. The guest host will argue against them with facts, stats and all around truth, subjective and objective!
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"Naked City" is a stellar vocal performance by Gene. The whole song is just stellar.
Best song on Unmasked no doubt , it's a great song.
Agreed
i have noticed on 'Gene' songs, his bass playing seems to be a bit more creative and unique and stands out, which i love.
I would love to hear a version of naked city same vocals just rock and roll it up the bass and guitar solo
Unmasked was the 2nd Kiss album I heard, not long after it came out in 1980 and from the start, I loved it. I was already into "Kiss Alive II" and where I was living at the time, you grabbed albums as and when they came into your orbit. I remember getting Unmasked the same day that I got Ted Nugent's "Scream Dream", Led Zeppelin's "In through the out door" and Kansas' "Point of know return." It was my first airing of Kansas and Ted, my third of Zep.
Living in Nigeria at the time, I did not know anyone that specifically liked heavy rock enough to talk knowledgably about it, so I took my cues from any magazine, book or annual {remember them ?} to give me clues on who played heavy rock and trudged around the record shacks in town just to see what was there. Therefore, when I saw "Unmasked" there was no pfaffing around. It was Kiss, they were heavy, I'll take it !
These record shacks in those days {80/81} would record 2 albums {or a double album} onto a C90 tape for the price of the tape and that was how I built up my collection of albums until I got back to England in '81 and was able to buy the actual vinyl. It was a great {and ever so cheap} way to build up an album collection because lots of heavy rock records found their way into the city I was living in {a place called Enugu} but no one was interested in them because disco had quite literally taken over.
So........
I was already into Kiss and when I played "Unmasked" I dug it. Apart from "Shandi" which I hate even more than "Beth" {and that's saying something}, it is packed with great, singable heavy metal pop, the kind of which Cheap Trick had done so well with in the previous year's "Dream Police." And 43 years on, I have to say, I still love this album. It's not particularly varied although it does have variation. It may not rank highly in the eyes of the fans or critics, but I'm kind of fortunate that I'm able to take an album in isolation and base my conclusions around one issue ¬> do I like it ? I don't compare it with other works or think about the social or technical aspects until much, much later {although I didn't always do that !} by which time, I've already concluded whether I like it or not.
The sing-a-long quality of the songs is a real winner for me, the slight easing off of heavy rock clichés, far from being a turn-off is a real plus and Kiss showed, like a few groups before them, that heavy metal rock was actually more than just skull-crushing, headbanging bludgeon riffola, that it was actually intelligent music that was capable of adaptation, that it could soften up a little, while still retaining those heavy elements that drew one in in the first place.
The panel gave the album a 6.75 average. I think that's fair, but taking it on its merits, I'm giving it a solid 8. "Shandi" stops it from being a 9. Ace's songs are among the best in the Kiss catalogue here, Gene may not be as dominant as he was in the period up until now, but his contributions are stellar and Paul is on fire with some of the best power pop or pop-metal seen - very little surpassed it in the 80s.
I always thought the cover was a good bit of fun, all the more poignant when one considers the turmoil they were going through at the time with Peter Criss.
Hated it as kid, now it's high up there!!
You've got to admire a band who put I STILL SAY THEY STINK on the front cover of their album.
It is cool that Ace played bass on Torpedo Girl. Great harmonies in the chorus too.
My favorite era is 74 to 81 and everything is a hit or miss after that. Unmasked is a great album for what it is which is radio poprock. A thing I love about Unmasked are the melodic guitar solos. What makes the world go round, Naked city, Tomorrow, Is that you?,Talk to me and Easy as it seems are all great songs that got my attention after the first listen. The other ones grew on me. I love the writing and catchy hooks. No way these sound like their 78 solo songs but Dynasty sure does. I hear Billy Squier, 38 Special, Cheap Trick, Rick Springfield and the Cars throughout Unmasked. I feel Paul shines on this album, not Ace.This music I loved at the time and still do. I give Unmasked a 9. Love the summertime feel and memories from this album. My favorite album next to their first 3 ,Dynasty and Paul's 78 solo
If Rick Springfield recorded the song 'Tomorrow' and put it out as a single he would have made it a hit! Just like he did with Hagar's 'I've Done Everything For You'.
Spot on. So true.
Hmmm.... I don't think so. I really don't believe Tomorrow would have been a hit song. It's a fun little tune in the context of this record, but not a hit. Even in the hands of Rick. Who knows?
Unmasked is my second favorite Kiss album just after Dynasty.There are only good-very good songs on Unmasked...8/10.😃👍
Love this album too! Ok, it's not the heavy Kiss from the seventies, it's pop/rock oriented, but the songs are just great. 8/10
Sorry but its half assed. I like a few songs. But its below average. The Ace songs suck. Shandi is a good pop song but a little too syrupy. Is That You rocks. Naked City is ok. Easy As It Seems is a good song but maybe not Kiss moreso than IWMFLU on Dynasty. Tommorrow is ok. But it really isnt a good record overall. 5/10
Jorn Lande’s cover of The Naked City is awesome. Highly underrated song.
Love jorn’s version, I wonder if the contrarian’s are familiar with him?
Yes, Reed mentions Jorn now and then
absolutely! Reed has introduced some of our members who weren’t familiar with Jorn, now I’m going to check out that version of naked city!
Jorn lande the best vocalist of 2000's
I never understood why this album has bad reviews
I remember listening to it everyday during one year in 1980 81
this is a masterpiece as Dynasty was
Oh C'mon,
Even the people who produced Unmasked said its dime store trash.
Naked City is up there with Dirty Livin' off Dynasty
I.e. good rock and roll without being blatant hard rock.
Vini Poncia apparently, got blamed for it's teeny bopper pop fluffy sound.
A few years back Vini Poncia came out and gave his version of events.
Poncia said " Unmasked started off well and then it was rushed. We told we had 6 weeks to do the album then we had 16 days. It did begin as a hard rock, guitar based album and then it descended into bubblegum pop aimed at 8 to 10 year olds. "
Paul Stanley said the same. We knew we had lost a large slice off our fans due to Dynasty. Unmasked initially had raunchy guitars. Not as hard or as heavy as RocknRoll Over but definitely harder than Dynasty.
He too said 'no one knows how and why it became pop drivel.'
I'm a dumb Aussie and Unmasked was huge here. We found out why about 4 years ago. It came to fruition that Rupert Murdoch bank rolled the huge Australasian Tour in1980.
Australian radio stations as early as May 1980 were told to play it on high rotation. Murdoch wanted his millions and rumour has it KISS were paid there fee of $ US1 million plus merchandise sales.
Rupert Murdoch made a cool $US 3 million dollars.
@@FrostedSeagull Interesting indeed but a good song is still a good song in itself whatever the genre pop ...hard rock ...AOR etc...
I certainly would not call dynasty a masterpiece!?. Unmasked is not as good as dynasty either.
@@guillaumechabason3165 I agree. To say that people liked a song, made the decision to buy it with their own money and listen to it over many years just because they were "persuaded" to do so by the underhanded shenanigans of the evil corporate Rupert Murdoch {and as a Brit, I have no admiration for him, at all, whatsoever}, is a bridge too far in my opinion.
When it comes down to it, even with peer pressure operating, you either like a song or you don't. You can't throw stones at the idea of continual airplay ! There are songs I've heard continually since the 1960s and 70s and I still don't like them, nor would I buy them !
You know, I have a handful of absolute favorite Kiss records. In no particular order; Love Gun, Dynasty, Creatures, Unmasked, Revenge, Psycho and the studio tunes on the final side of the Alive 2 record. I adore particular tracks of many of the other records of course, but, if I'm going to listen to a full album, it's probably going to be one of those. Which record do I find myself actually taking off the shelf and spinning most frequently? Unmasked. Why? I just couldn't tell you. All I know is that I grab it often. I go into it knowing there isn't any one particular brilliant tune, but just a solid, fun pop-rock record from beginning to end with all three guys singing. What would I change about it if I could? I would have had Peter singing "Is That You."
My ‘most listened to’ Kiss album
The first problem with Unmasked was acknowledged by the panel; it sounds like songs from the solo albums. Only with a lot more pop layered in. What Makes The World Go ‘Round, Tomorrow and Easy As It Seems sound like songs that didn’t make Paul’s solo album. Naked City and She’s So European sound like songs that SHOULD have been on Gene’s album. Talk To Me is ok, but Two Sides Of The Coin and Torpedo Girl are lyrical disasters that aren’t even close to Ace’s solo album, or any of the other contributions he made on prior KISS albums.
The second major thing wrong with Unmasked is there is no Peter Criss vocal. But then, there is nothing gritty enough on this album to warrant a Peter vocal. Maybe Naked City. At least Dynasty had Dirty Livin’!
I like Unmasked for what it is, and I should have seen it coming when they closed Love Gun with Then She Kissed Me.
I give Unmasked a 7/10
Great episode! Unmasked was the first newly released KISS album that I had (I got it for my 6th birthday, July '80). I loved the songs right off the bat! As you stated, timeline is vital in regards to music. I love "Is That You", it's all snotty attitude and riffy guitars. "Tomorrow" ABSOLUTELY should have been a huge hit, Casablanca/Aucoin missed the boat. "Naked City" is my all-time favorite Gene "deep cut"!!!
Tomorrow and Shandi are my two favorite songs on Unmasked. (but then, I love the Partridge Family..lol)
Nice feature, guys. My opinion on this one hasn't changed since day one, so i repeat my two cents about it from Peter Kerr's channel right here.
Easily my #3 KISS album after "Rock And Roll Over" and "Dynasty", since day one. Unlike many other lifelong fans, I like KISS best when they venture outside of their comfort zones and predictable (70s-)formulas. For me, KISS - especially in the 70s - were never a typical, one-dimensional Hard Rock band anyway, for especially their Beatles influences - which they have always openly articulated themselves - are too dominant for that, as well as this colourful, versatile and essentially song-oriented approach blossoms wonderfully on "Unmasked". Another thing - as mentioned - Gene, whom I always hear most strongly when he is NOT trying to play any role, but performs as himself. Which then culminates on this album in "Naked City" - for me by far his greatest song to this day - by a country mile! Also, I would have liked a more earthy, dirtier, grittier production on this album - preferably like on "Rock And Roll Over", but at least like on "Dynasty" - as the overall sound is well balanced, but also a bit too polished, without corners and edges and unfortunately with too little punch. I also don't consider this album to be a "Pop album" like some people do, because it isn't any more than the nonsensical assertion in some circles that "Dynasty" is a "Disco album". Basically, KISS have never left their own identity, they have always absorbed other influences, processed and incorporated them and put their own stamp on the result. Which is especially - in my view - due to Paul Stanley, who is not originally influenced by only one kind of music.
I really like Unmasked. I think it’s a great pop rock album. It’s almost a uk Glam rock album, but 5 years too late. Favourite songs are IsThat You (a great opener), Talk To Me, Tomorrow & You’re All That I want. I saw them on this tour, so I will always have a soft spot for it. 7.5/10
Unmasked is in my top 3 kiss albums. "Naked City" and "Is that you" are outstanding.
Love "Unmasked " - its relax , pop -rock summer album .
Ace Frehley solo from 78 ' is best KISS record ( under name of Kiss ) .
I recently listened to the entire KISS catalogue during my daily commute. This album ranks right in the middle for me. I loved the album when it came out. I still enjoy it today. Great analysis guys.
the entire catalog?
how long is your commute??? 😂
@@romangarcia608 daily commutes over a couple of months.
This was my first introduction to KISS, must have been in 86 or 87 before or right after I started 1st grade. My parents bought the tape from an older kid in the neighborhood. I remember it as it was yesterday, getting this tape and a walkman. Combine that with a BMX bicycle the rock and roll seed was surely born. Talk to me was the first song that caugth my ear, ofcourse i liked Shandi but Naked City oh my that one was probably played to death due to rewinding. Tomorrow also caught my ear early on, same with Easy as it seems. I cincerly think this is one of their best albums, it takes the 70s rock and infuse some other musical elements from the late 70s such as disco and rnb in a cool manner. So I love this album regardless.
Naked City, is that You, Tomorrow, Two Sides of the coin.Easy as it seems, are great tunes.. Great Production
As a fan I give a 6.5, but I can see how so many rate it much lower
I frigging hate shandi
This album was huge in Australia
Yeah kiss didn't hit Australia till 79 really .dynasty went nuts first
Dynasty and unmasked were huge in Australia and Shandi was a big hit
I always liked it, it's well produced but it's an odd collection of songs that stylistically are all over the place and don't really fit together on the same record, I think. The only reason it kind of works, is because we know it's Kiss so we accept it as a Kiss album even though we're not used to their band albums being such a mixed bag. In some ways, it's probably an even weirder album than The Elder or even Dynasty those two had some consistency to them where Unmasked doesn't sound like a band playing together at all. It's still really good pop songs.
Unmasked definitely moves around in my top eight favorite Kiss albums, along with the first six and dynasty, depending on my mood.
Ace played bass on his songs & Gene played rhythm guitar on his songs since 'Love Gun' (ie: 'Shock Me', 'Almost Human' etc.). Ironically the final track on 'Unmasked', 'You're All That I Want', was demoed by Gene in '77 during the 'Love Gun' sessions. The original featured in the Box-set
It would of been a better ending song on Love gun. Tunnel of love was left off LG also which would of worked too
So great! First kiss album I got when it first came out! My brother had been a huge kiss fan, by this point he had moved on to Van Halen! So I got all his kiss stuff, I had seen kiss on the Dynasty tour and was blown away! I was 6 when the album came out! Kiss was still very popular at my elementary school! This album will always hold a special place in my heart! Top ten kiss album for me! Great episode guys ☺️!
Unmasked is truly a unique album for KISS. After Dynasty, and the fan backlash, was a pop album really the best path? Probably not, but even on a lesser KISS album of that era, they were able to put out some very good material.
“Naked City” is great. A really well thought out and crafted song that shows Gene’s songwriting chops and vocal skill. Ace’s material is very good as well, showing him branch out and becoming more confident as a singer and songwriter. “Shandi” is an absolute ear worm and a great pop song. The rest of the album is not as good, but has its moments. If you look at this album not necessarily as a kiss album, but a product of its time, you can see the positives. A solid 7/10 for me.
"Easy as it seems" sounds a lot like "Driver's Seat" by Sniff n the tears. I guess that was the era. Was a fun album for me when it came out. I was only a kid and KISS was huge here in Australia at the time. The pop sensibilities drew a lot of younger listeners. I also recall that by the time they left the country and finished the tour their popularity dropped very fast. By January 1981 it was, mostly, over as a phenomenon. But it did lead to a whole generation of die hards in Australia.
People never liked the fox , missed Peter criss , albums became laughable after unmasked
Solid 7/10 for me. Naked City is my favorite, followed close by Tomorrow. I don't mind Shandi. I wish they would have punched the guitars up a little more on the mix of the album, but I guess they were trying not to scare off some of their new fans that jumped on board after Dynasty.
Dynasty and Unmasked are two Kiss albums i listen to very often. I am actually late on becoming a Kiss fan. It happened about eight years ago in my mid 30's after I got their Unplugged CD. I loved it so much that I eventually got their whole catalog within one year. Naked City and Easy As It Seems are easily my favorite songs off of Unmasked, but I love the whole album alot.
unmasked is my favorite album i only wish they had Eric Carr on drums and on cover but its a gem of an album i also named my daughter Shandi so for me this is a gem!
Ace played bass on his songs & Gene played rhythm guitar on his songs since 'Love Gun' (ie: 'Shock Me', 'Almost Human' etc.). Ironically the final track on 'Unmasked', 'You're All That I Want', was demoed by Gene in '77 during the 'Love Gun' sessions. Kiss had the same look & aesthetic for 'Shandi' music video. They didn't reveal their haircuts & new look until the promo for 'A World Without Heroes' a year later in '81
For some reason I seem to dig this out every spring. I have been listening to it quite a bit the last couple of weeks. It is pretty much in the middle of my career ranking for them. I'd give it a 6.5. The song title "She's So European" always makes me want to sing Boomtown Rats.
I don't mind the transitions albums that much (except for maybe The Elder). Obviously, my perspective is from looking back and not living thru it. I was 4 when the album came out. But to me, the Ace songs carry the album for me. I listen to them repeatedly. I also really like Tomorrow. Is That You has grown on me over the years. I think live it could kick butt. Shandi...eh? I'll give it a listen every other year or so. The rest I've listened to about 2x in 32 years. I'll give it a 7/10.
I refer to Unmasked as the power-pop album. Some fun, catchy, accessible tunes.
a lot of people do, but it's more of a pop album than a power-pop album. Either way it's a good album!
“Dynasty” might be an even more blatant dark horse, besides the two “disco” songs, everything else is heavy and rockin!!
Good show and a good choice..its definitely an underrated album although it showed signs that the band were creaking. It's main problem was that it didn't Rock and lacked direction.creatures was the album that kiss returned to being the band I'd wanted them to be. That said unmasked is good enough and not the stinker many think it is.
Was entirely underwhelmed by Dynasty as an elementary school Kiss fan and completely abandoned the band when I heard Unmasked. Many decades later, in retrospect, as an adult with a much broader musical palette, I consider Dynasty a phenomenal record. While Unmasked is a weak throw away.
I don't know why everyone hates Shandi so much! It's such a neat ballad with a perfect chorus, but that's just me 🙃
I always loved it. It was their first real ballad after Beth besides a few on the 78 solo albums. Its very catchy and near the end I catch myself singing New kid in Town by the Eagles for some reason lol
Sometimes, one just dislikes a song. I dislike a number of songs that ended up on "Alive II", like I hate the cover of "Any way you want it." I don't like "Love Gun." Or "Hard luck woman." Or "Beth." And for me, "Shandi" is in that realm. I love many power ballads and ballads per se. I just don't like "Shandi." I didn't like it in 1980. I didn't like it in '81. I didn't listen to it again until 2015 and I thought I'd give it a chance to see if maturity had mellowed my tastes, because it had with a number of other songs. And guess what ? I still hated it !
I tried for over 20 years to like the Beatles' "Revolution #9." I failed.
"Shandi" is just one of those songs that I do not like. It's nothing to do with its balladicness because I like ballads. There are some heavy rockers I don't like. We're human. We're weird !
I will be a contrarian, and say this is a strong, change of pace album. Unmasked was part of the Dynasty wave, and it was 1980 in a nutshell; that is what people need to realize. Softer Rock was reigning supreme at this time and Kiss was capitalizing. Shandi, Talk to Me, Easy as it Seems, and Naked City are great tracks.
It’s incredible to me that people advocate for The Elder and not Unmasked. IMO Unmasked is soooo much better than The Elder. It’s a fun record full of great power pop rock songs. Is that you, Shandi, Talk to me, Naked city, Tomorrow, Two sides of the coin, etc., are some of my favorite Kiss songs. Is a decent Kiss record, and a good rock record overall.
I probably play this more than I should (but then again, I rather enjoy The Elder - so what do I know 😊)
Peter Criss M.I.A once again, but Anton Fig doing a fine job imo.
Didn't buy it until 1984 ..I didn't get Dynasty until 86. Had given up on them after the Dynasty tour. Little kids and parents..dead crowd compared to past tours..very wierd. When I purchased this I always thought it had a Monkees vibe to it! I grew to live it! " Is that You?" Blew me away, but was def the heaviest song on the album. Loved "Shandi" originally now I skip it! Adore the album overall. " Naked City" is Genes peak. Love all 3 Ace songs!
What makes the world go round is decent
Is That You , Naked City and Shandi are the best songs on Unmasked in my opinion. Talk To Me , Tomorrow and She's So European are also pretty good. I don't love the album but I certainly don't hate it. I would give it 6.5/10.
You can tell they're all burned out at this point, but still managed to keep it interesting. No other band has an album quite like it.
Really fun record. To me it doesn't sound much different than what came before it, KISS for the most part have always had pop centric lyrics so I don't think this is a huge switch like many say. Played a bit less hard? Sure, but if you don't have a problem with pop rock and are a fan of the band than there's no reason to dislike this.
Tomorrow is Rick Springfield
David: The word is "middling." Not "midland."
Kiss Unmasked is underated. For those who think this record stinks, I invite them to listen to the tribute record Kiss Undressed. Undressed shows one thing clearly if one removes the Disco beat, these songs rock.
Unmasked doesn't sound at all like any other record I own. I love it. What Makes and Tomorrow, best songs imo
This is where Epic started **** with formula. I'm just surprised the the band never reached out to Werman to get them back on track..
8/10. It was the first KISS album I ever got (thanks, mom!), and at age 8, I played the heck out of it until the tape wore out. Looking back at it some 40 years (yikes!) later, I still love it. It's a bit keyboard-heavy, there's no real crunch on the guitar tone, it's more colourful pop rock than silver-and-black heavy rock and Shandi is downright unbearable... but there's a lot of great tunes here (surely more than on Dynasty), and nostalgia is a sweet thing, so there you go: 8/10.
I think a lot of opinions are dependent on how old you were upon its release. I was 11 at the time and was happy to have more KISS. I listen to this album quite often.
@Scott May
"I think a lot of opinions are dependent on how old you were upon its release"
That's an interesting notion. I partially agree with it. I was 17 at the time.
On the other hand, many people get into a band or album long after that album has been released, long after that band is considered relevant or even after the band has broken up. When I got unmasked in 1980, I didn't really think about Kiss' status. To me, it was just a Kiss album in the shop.
Tomorrow was released as the third single and even charted in Germany
I absolutely loved this at the time of release, but it has lost some of its shine over the years. "Tomorrow" should have been a huge hit, and if you take away the juvenile "Torpedo Girl", this is actually a pretty solid record. I think the Gene songs are some of the better moments on the record.
Kiss made so much money for Casablanca then they signed all disco acts and pushed it kiss was there only rock band and the label pushed them to go disco and pop
This is definitely better than atleast 6 of the albums without Ace,but it is my least favorite makeup era LP.
it's a great pop album. i miss kiss not making good rock/pop songs. their beatles influence comes through on certain songs.
I think Naked City would have worked better on The Elder.
I've seen Kiss 25 times live and it pisses me off that they never played anything off Unmasked. Gene and Paul are so dismissive of it.
It does not sound like the solo albums at all to me. Dynasty definately does and feels like a continuation, except for peters as dirty livin is pretty good and his solo album is garbage haha.
Dynasty is better. Unmasked is ok, but its a chic album too me
Unmask is good album it's not a classic but it's a good album I'll give the album 7/10
I give "Unmasked" a 7 out of 10. It isn't that much different than Dynasty to ears, though the songwriting in Unmasked is not quite as strong. But overall I think it is pretty decent.
Is that you and Shandi best 2 songs on the album.
It need to be remixed, Turn the keyboards down and guitars up
It’s not very good, although the rest of their career was inconsistent. Not close to dynasty, which was also not as good as love gun and ace solo.
I enjoy Unmasked, mostly Gene and Ace’s contributions. Paul has some real dreck on the record.
I just listened to "Tomorrow" by KISS. It sounds like a "made up" song.
Let us know what you think! What would you rate Unmasked out of ten?
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I played this recently enough, sure, it's poppy enough,. But Kiss were a band that would do whatever they might deem successful outside anything else. Though clearly it wasn't. Every album they released during this period (say 1979 to 83) was different to the next / last. It has a few catchy tunes for sure. Ace puts a fair bit of effort into and his songs are arguably the most rock like. Production wise it's weak, or at least the mix is weak given it sounds very bright with the guitars sound they are played through small amps, and even then a bit turned down. Dynasty had better sonics, and probably better songs overall, but Unmasked isn't the worst album in the Kiss canon. A guilty please maybe
The Partridge family is some of the best pop ever recorded. The best songwriters in the business and the band is The Wrecking crew. C'mon Martin.
this second guy has no idea what the heck he's talkin about
Other than "Easy As it Seems", the rest is unlistenable. Few legacy bands have ever fallen so far so quickly. Starting with Kiss in 1975, not one of my Kiss fans give this the time of day.
Just dreadful.
Love the channel, but rather to much Kiss. I guess we don’t like Kiss as much over here in England
There's no such thing as too* much KISS!!
we definitely have done lots of kiss stuff… but I will say people enjoy seeing it as our kiss vids usually get really good numbers
@John Oliver
Oi John, speak for yourself !
Mediocre record.
5 out of 11 songs are good.
I love ace , but his songs on this were the worst , poorly produced and made into pop
we were all done with Kiss after Destroyer David was right.
We were all ? Hardly
Destroyer was like a overblown opera , only good songs were on side 1
Sorry, but I loathe this album.
Ewwww, that album is so bad.