Okay in my opinion the sisters totally USED Cole. It's like "Hey, Cole, we need your help!" and he helps them. For heaven's sake, if Cole hadn't helped Phoebe at the end of season 3, that would have been the end: the source would have killed Phoebe and then Piper. But when Cole needed them did they ever actually help just to help? No they didn't. They had ulterior motives (except when Phoebe had Leo heal Cole but then she didn't know who he really was at that time)
It was so baffling, they straight out refused to help him, without any reason. He tried so hard during the seasons to be good, to do good, to change, to make up for his mistakes, even the ones made when he was possessed by the Source and they just kept insisting he was evil until he eventually turned back to evil because he had nothing left and had gone insane. That’s the most selfish thing the sisters have done during the show.
@@Velvet.323 right? It was like they decided (without any reason to support it) that he was not an innocent and so he didn’t deserve any help anymore. What about his human half? It just didn’t make any sense, the writers couldn’t be bothered to develop it well in my opinion, they made a sudden switch in how they made the charmed ones behave and think of Cole but didn’t explain it at all.
@@carinaguida558 I mean, I get that! She didn’t have to take him back! But he was an innocent to help, he wanted to be good and they should have encouraged that instead of telling him he was evil and pushing him away.
My entire problem with Cole's season 5 storyline was the fact that the sisters would run to Cole when they deemed it was convenient for them but then they'd turn around and remind him that they thought he was scum. Twice they went to him to save Phoebe, both times he was trying to go away from them and their lives.I spent half that season up to the point that he died being pissed at them. You can't claim to be a good person when you use a person when they benefit you and then discard them like trash when they've done what you need them to.
The thing that annoyed me was that Cole was possessed by the The Source of All Evil and they never forgave him even though he was resisting. Phoebe was pregnant with the The Source's baby and turned on them instantly, But they forgave her completely. They were mad at Cole for sacrificing himself to save them.
to be fair a very fair prejudice coz Cole did kill a ton of innocent people....@@LadyDoomsinger ..like the show masks it well but I d call even the girls quite morally wrong for even giving Cole a chance(tho also happy from the show perspective coz it was a great storyline) especially since it was VERY clear he didnt want to be good to be good, he wanted to get Phoebe. If we saw ANY proof of Cole willing to be a good guy without being rewarded for it by getting Phoebe maybe I d have a different opinion, but from where I stood he changed himself only for Phoebe... I d bet that if Phoebe died he d go back to being a demon , you do not grow morals from one day ot another...and the show doesnt pretend he does, but it does pretened the the girls are somehow morally superior when they clearly protected a sserial killer for a few season just coz their sister found him hot. Put them in a position where the killer of Pru is protected by some other witch coz of love...and then ask them how rightful they find that.
@@Kunoichi4ever4I disagree to some extent; at first Cole definitely only cared about Phoebe, and any good he did in the process was incidental, but he was learning and trying to be a better person - as seen when he infiltrated the Brotherhood at great risk to himself, despite Phoebe begging him not to, because it was too dangerous, and after he was stripped of his powers, he was starting to adjust to being a "normal" man. That doesn't erase all the evil he did as a demon, but I think the morality of it comes down to whether you believe in retributive justice or reformative justice. Personally I think even serial killers deserve a chance to redeem themselves, if they are sincere (and with all the necessary precautions, of course)... However before he could really fully appreciate his new mortality he was infected by the Source of All Evil, which derailed any further potential redemption for him.
Cole DID intend to just leave and set out on his own with his new powers after Phoebe's initial post-resurrection rejection. He accepted that she didn't want him back and planned to leave, but then Paige showed up, cast a spell that messed with his head and made him feel "Phoebe's love for him," and that started him down the path of continuing to hang around her, convinced that she'd take him back if he just did better. That's practically the theme of their relationship: the sisters get in trouble, browbeat Cole into pulling their asses out of the fire, and then blame him for existing afterwards, ignoring the various factors that garble his mental state in the process.
He should have left at the end of a Witches Tail. He talks to Phoebe and, after Paige's spell, he understands her feelings and knows that even though Phoebe loves him there's too much pain there for them to try again. Cole leaves. Every once in a while, we'll hear stories of a mystery man in another city doing good deeds. And maybe he'll make an appearance in the later seasons. I'd like him and Phoebe to get back together at the end of the show but they don't have to.
Cole had been as loved by me as Leo. I really resented how they turned him into a psycho. They really should either have killed him off early on or just given h8m that redemption arc and let it stick, or ebb and flow for interest without going full on psycho
I think what's the most frustrating about it is that the message is just bad. Coles arc says literally that no matter how hard one tries to be good and how often chooses the right path, they'll fail eventually, if they are born with evil in them. We only see something similar play out the other way with this priest Prue fell for but this was just one episode and the premise different. Doesn't matter if he and Phoebe would've been endgame (I admit I don't like Coop that much, however), Cole deserved to have his arc end on a more hopeful note when it comes to redemption. They made him just another great complex character who was done dirty in turning him into a crazy villain he never was nor should've become
cole wasn't born evil, he was half human and the mother killed the father in order to turn cole evil, He just wanted to save his human fathers soul by season 4
I mean, you say it in the video, but I have to agree , what it boils down to: Cole's later characterization isn't naturally written. Audiences can sense that. It's why Daenerys' final actions were so vocally protested. It went against every action and philosophy she portrayed. Cole was clearly leaning toward Good (perhaps not permanently, but actively working on it) and the show's foundational philosophy of "Good can overcome Evil,' particularly with Phoebe and Paige battling their past lives, is completely thrown out the window with Cole. Not to say a Bad character can't try and ultimatly fail, but Julian Mcmahon's performance gave plenty of credibility to the idea that he would turn good. HIs ending felt cheap. You want a character to ultimately turn Evil? That's great. Prove to me, the watcher, that this is a viable path for them to take. Put in the hours and I'll gladly watch someone's (fictional) downfall. But make 👏 it 👏work👏
Yep. Although Christy is divisive, I feel that with her it worked. She got offered the chance to be Good but she chose Evil because it was what she knew - although the arc could have been a bit less rushed.
@@BetterWithBob Christy is a good example. Her path was mapped out more naturalistically imo and her end didn't bother me (as much). They def could've spent more time w/ her tho.
Ultimately the show wasn't clear about Cole's turn towards evil. It is heavily implied it was the source possessing him, but then it was him too? Then the source was vanquished and Cole was just evil again?
@@MrSasyBI feel like the show was kinda insinuating that Cole returned to evil because Phoebe wouldn't take him back after they vanquished the Source, which I don't like either.
im guessing im the only one who felt Cole ended up where and how he was supposed to be. He was never going to be truly good. but he knows what it's like to experience true love and happiness. He thought about what was best for Phoebe over himself and ends up in purgatory over it.
The scene that has the voiceover of Cole's farewell letter, when he was first vanquished- was one of the most beautiful, heart-breaking moments for me - I always assumed that the growth & purity of his love for Pheobe bound some kind of magic into it, & that was the reason he survived on- in some kind of limbo. But to hear the writers/ show-runners... it wasn't enough for him to love her, to try & strive & struggle- none of his efforts were ever going to be good enough...
The problem with Charmed is with its continuity I think it's because Constance M. Burge left. I mean Brad Kern had a good Idea about the Cole arc but I liked Constance writing for the Sister bonding and not Brad's let's make them wear skimpy outfits every episode.
Thank you for reminding me how mad I was about this lol. You’re completely on point. Cole was a convenient punching bag. The sisters constantly dog piled him and used him as opposing force to strengthen their sisterhood, even after he was absolved for the umptenth time. He was their enemy in reserve and I hated that. And while I loved seeing him in the later episodes I couldn’t help but acknowledge I was only prolonging the shows masochistic treatment of him. He didn’t deserve what happened to him. Justice for Cole.
@@avrilfan0521 the scoobies 😂 you’re completely right though. Either let that man… vamp? vamp man? (Can’t remember there was a lot of losing and regaining souls in that show). Nevertheless. Either let HIM be redeemed or go kick tombstones elsewhere. Enough with the limbo treatment! Edit: spike was much better than angel so where’s his spin-off, huh?!
The most frustrating thing about Cole's journey is that he was trying so HARD to be good but because he didn't meet the Charmed ones expectations of what THEY thought good should be, they just wipe their hands off him. Which is especially unfair because the Charmed Ones have dome Evil as well and yet they can be redeemed but Not Cole? Nonsense.
@@gabriellafox2981 exactlyyyyy I mean whatever happened to the soul storyline he had towards the end of season 3 - they should’ve ended with that type of arc
I wouldn't have minded him being vanquished as the Source of All Evil, in a tragic ending of his character, with the realization that the only way to destroy the Source is to kill him - and having Phoebe reeling with conflicting emotions of guilt and grief for killing him, as well as relief that he is gone. If he had just stayed dead after that, he could've been remembered as the Good Guy who was ultimately destroyed and overtaken by the Source of All Evil possessing him. Bringing him back just undermined the whole tragedy.
I have felt this way for YEARS. It’s like you perfectly explained what I have been thinking and it annoyed me to no end that Cole had a heel turn even after he was no longer possessed like the writers had it OUT for him. I think each sister had undergone possession at some point so I just never understood how they couldn’t see that Cole was a victim of the Source. It’s maddening.
I think when he became the Source and Phoebe became his queen, was like the highlight of their storyline. And also made the show stay new/fresh. The writers should have made this last waaaaay longer then just one tiny episode.
Didn't even need to be happy - I would've been satisfied if his story had ended tragically with him being vanquished as the Source of All Evil. Bringing him back after that undermined his entire character.
The chemistry between them was phenomenal; it actually looked like a real love, and it was much more natural. Leo is just too perfect. Cole is morally gray, and that’s more natural.
Cole became so inconsistent he was eventually dropped from the show as they had written themselves into a corner with his botched character development. One week he was evil, the other week he was good, then he turned crazy....terribly misused character as a whole. The storyline in season 5 could have been much, much more compelling if they had allowed themselves to HOLD PHOEBE ACCOUNTABLE FOR HER WRONGDOINGS and make her look bad for once. She was the one who stated at the end of Season 4 that she owned him that much and by the first episode of Season 5 this sentiment is thrown out the window. What's even more annoying, by mid season 5 is she becomes so obsessively sadistic with him she won't even grant him the peace of death when he asks for it! (Sam I Am episode). The persistent Cole blaming and gaslighting are jarring in that season, not mention incredibly dull and repetitious; everyone just keeps going on about how he'll never amount to anything other than being an evil bastard and how Phoebe was the victim in the situation when she clearly had her fair share of blame. After all she chose to become evil Queen of the underworld and no, the demonic fetus and the Seer's potions don't change the fact that she chose that path when the possessed by the Source Cole was still WILLING TO GIVE UP HIS DEMONIC POWERS FOR HER SAKE and she stopped him so no, there are no excuses for Phoebe's actions in late season 4. She also treated poor Paige like crap when there were obvious signs his behaviour was suspicious. Baby bangs Phoebe was his ultimate demise and she never got an ounce of flack for that, not even from the stupid Elders who turned a blind eye during the time a Charmed One chose to become married to the Source of all things evil but they had the audacity to threaten severe repercussions if Piper married a freaking Whitelighter. The inconsistency is beyond ridiculous and him admitting in his final episode he still loved the person that walked all over him despite all the things he had done for her and her family was the final nail in the coffin.
Mary V. Excellently well summed up. Yes, they used Cole's character until there was nothing left to tell so they cheapened his last day by killing him. Charmed is not the only series on TV to do this. There are other shows (screenwriters and directors) who know when a character becomes fan-fav and fan love/hate fav, then throw that well-established character into the grinder. I do wish to see more writers punish their protagonists for wrongdoings, something that wasn't done to Phoebe or Paige. I'm not saying torture or kill the female protagonist, just saying let the person stand in, lay out on the floor crying "This is on me. I have to redeem myself. Something has to be done..."
@@jclyntoledo Alyssa Milano had some ugly baby bangs mid season 4 which added to the whole obnoxiousness of the storyline, particularly when she joined the dark side. I was being sarcastic about the haircut lol.
100% agreed with the whole video! Cole was my favorite character and his last arc treated him so badly. I actually grew to hate Phoebe and Paige for what they did to him. The man just wanted the only family he ever really had back and those two refused to let him. Something that I find interesting is that he and Piper, while not having much screen time, always got along really well and I loved that he was the guide sent to her in the 150th episode. I also love his reaction to learning that she's pregnant with Wyatt. He was so joyful *for* her because he knew how much she and Leo had wanted a family and now they were going to have it. I just- He was so so good and they just wrecked his character completely to make Phoebe and Paige look better.
I always felt Paige wanted something to be wrong with Cole because Leo was basically an angel so an angel being bad isn't as likely as a half demon with a dark past being evil... Keep in mind when Paige moved in she was already feeling like a 3rd wheel because her relationships were all meh and here are these new sisters with magical and handsome men in their life and she is pretty much a fling girl. I felt she was secretly jealous and when she saw something to build upon she went all in
I think Paige got Prue’s storyline. Before Prue died, she was dead set against Cole. The writers transferred that to Paige. I don’t think the jealousy arc was really at play. She did however feel insecure about being the replacement sister.
Another thing that’s so frustrating is how they got rid of their baby. They couldn’t even settle on whether it was Cole and Phoebes baby or the Seers, and the latter never made any sense. Piper specifically refers to the child when Cole returns as “your demonic spawn” when talking to Cole…so is it his or not?? But they kill the baby off so Phoebe can be fully free of Cole and can move on to dating one smoking hot rich guy (with nowhere near the same charisma and complexity as Cole) after another…groundbreaking 😑
I figured the ambiguity was intentional - none of the sisters really knew what the baby was or how it would have turned out - when Phoebe says it was all Evil, neither hers nor Cole's, I always felt that she was trying to distance herself from the emotional trauma of loosing the baby - telling herself it wasn't really hers, because she lost it.
@@LadyDoomsinger I always assumed they just wanted to move on without her having to deal with any of the emotional turmoil from that experience Because in seasons 5 and especially 6 it really just became more and more about dumb wacky hijinks more than real character development
When he becomes human, they could have made him become a male witch-somehow rewarded with good powers with turning away from his evil past and becoming a good asset (having such knowledge for what demons are out there to warn them is actually very helpful) for the sisters so he doesn’t mope around feeling useless without powers. Then later becomes a male witch mentor for Wyatt and Chris, instead of dragging the cringe evil crazy crap through the seasons until his demise. That would have been helpful for when Leo goes down his weird struggles so Cole would have become the steady help instead of leo. That would have been interesting.
I love this idea. And even if the actor playing Cole had left for Nip/Tuck they could have brought him back for future episodes as you have stated to aide/mentor Wyatt. Then write him off as him leaving to help other whitelighters or witches.
Honestly, I took a stab at trying to fix it with fan fiction and took two stabs at him getting powers as a human. one way having a power stripping spell go wrong on a warlock that stole powers from witches, as that happened often, and one with him dying and the Elders rewarding his struggle to fight evil, even as a human, by making him a Whitelighter and I gave up cause both seemed just as forced as the retcon that says he chose evil.
My theory is that the writers wanted to make the 100th episode 'special' so they marked that as the point where they would kill off Cole. They just had no coherent plans on how to get there
This and also Julian decided to leave and take the lead role in Nip N Tuck so the writers wrote him out of charmed. I agree with you. I think they deci🎉ded to turn Cole evil and write him out "with a bang" to make the 100th episode "special". At the start of season 5 I thought they were going to go with Cole proving Phoebe wrong and showing her that he can choose to be good; that powers aren't inherently good or evil, they are just powers and how you use them is what counts. But then the show goes in another direction. Cole seems to go off the rails- mad with power I guess? And meets a unsatisfactory and underserved end. His character deserved better. There was so much to explore- he was over 100 years old! It would have been really interesting to learn and see more about his life before he met the charmed ones. Plus it really annoyed me that the charmed ones blamed Cole for becomming the Source and acted like he tricked them and it was his master plan or something. He was tricked by the Seer! He only choose to take in the hollow to save the charmed ones from the Source and he didn't know that, in doing so, the would become the Source! And when Cole over came the Source and tried to have the Source removed with the Wizard, Phoebe stopped the spell. It annoys me how the Charmed one's and even Leo's bad and questionable actions are forgiven but Cole aren't- when it wasn't his fault! He helped them so many times and they wouldn't have vanquished the Source without him. Being taken over by the Source must have been so traumatic and surviving the demonic wasteland. And no one was there for him or even tried to understand. It really annoyed me in season 5 how the charmed ones would use Cole. They visited him because they wanted his help but never gave him anything in return and wanted nothing to do with him once his help was over.
This video is everything! I feel that I have been waiting 20+ years for justice for Cole, and it's finally here! I feel vindicated. It's actually crazy how dirty Charmed did its best character, and also the sisters at the same time
It really does annoy me how badly they treat Cole after s4, phoebe is the worst culprit for it but the way that it wasent even Cole doing it, it was the source who possessed him, he should of been killed off ceremoniously halfway through or at the end of s5 protecting wyatt from the hag or something like that
Or he borrows the tetsaiga from Inuyasha and murders Phoebe with the wind scar and Paige with the Backlash Wave and Piper gets her house back and enjoys peace and quiet with her husband and sons.
The worst thing was Piper lying and talking about the choices he made that clearly played out to that he didn't make. He was infected with evil in their epic battle against the Source had he not stepped end they would have lost. He saved them at the cost of his soul. They had no empathy for his plight after forgetting what he sacrificed for them.
I've always hated the way Cole was handled at the end of his arch. I mean the man was possessed, and his love for Phoebe stayed a detrimental constant to the end, and yet she condemns him to hell?
The single most frustrating inconsistency on Charmed! The writers never made it clear if "The Source" was the half-faced demon possessing Cole or if it was a literal source of energy tempting him towards Evil like a drug to an addict. It seemed he was just possessed by Half-Face at first but then they kind of forgot that and changed it to being Cole's choice. In either case, why did Phoebe get a pass and not Cole? Like they'd even be alive if he'd just left them to it. Great video!
This!! It also ties into the question they kinda left about if their baby was really their baby, or if it was never theirs and actually belonged to the seer and half faced source.
I agree with this because was he possessed? Why didn't Cole tell them? I was rooting for Cole but honestly I think that he missed having powers and he liked it. He wanted to live a double life
@@akyanajanay Well it seemed in 3 Faces of Phoebe he was gonna tell her but when he tried the first time the Sources magic or whatever prevented him from doing so and then later on when old Phoebe and him are talking he tells her he wants to tell Present Phoebe but he claims that he's not sure he can.
It always annoyed me that no one wondered where the source’s power went, nobody thought to test cole for powers, nobody thought cole’s human soul might be over powered by the source’s essence and he wasnt in control when they FINALLY realized he was the source (which is exactly what happened) AND breaking phoebe and cole up essentially rendered prue’s death in the context of the show completely useless. She died in canon because phoebe was in the underworld saving cole and when leo arrived his first thought was to save his wife. Phoebe’s character development also stalls for the rest of the series after leaving cole…they definitely fumbled writing that part.
Probably because this was the first time, if memory serves correct, that the idea of powers transferring to an available vessel after death was used in the show. Usually, when someone magical died, their power just went away, too, unless the person who killed them had a spell or weapon to intentionally absorb it
Yes. Thank you. This perfectly explains my frustrations because I too love Paige and Phoebe but how they interact with Cole in the later years made me dislike all three of them at points. I feel like sometimes people like to throw Cole out with the bathwater, forgetting the good because the writing deteriorated over time.
Cole was my favorite character, he deserved better… I rewatch the series like once every 2 years but only until Cole’s death. Julian McMahon is the total best ❤
I was so frustrated with Cole's story line. And the girls just wouldn't give him a chance (except Phoebe), I felt like that's the only thing that could explain him becoming evil again, because to change you need support from people who won't drag you back down, and if they'd leaned into that, and made it a lesson for them to learn not to push those who need help away. But no, it just became "Phoebe's good heart made her blind and she made mistakes"... And then the whole thing at the end with Phoebe ending up with a cupid sent to her by the elders just... no please no. I actually do think Phoebe/cupid pairing works in the end but the way that was executed was so revolting, especially when contrasted with Phoebe's previous love stories that were more passionate and complex, and about accepting the flaws along with the good, that's Phoebe's thing seeing into people and embracing who they are (which is another reason the Cole thing annoys me, she saw there was good in him worth nurturing but no one else would fully accept that) but in the end her soulmate is someone chosen for her? Those are the two parts of Charmed that annoy me the most.
Now that you bring up the cupid thing, it does seem off she would just accept matchmaking fro the Elders. How many times has she watched them put Piper and Leo through the emotional ringer for manipulative or just bureaucratic reasons including one of them trying to murder her nephew?
Phoebe was the bad guy here. Cole did all in his power to protect her AND her sisters, they literally stopped him from getting rid of power of source which he WANTED to do and when he finally gave in he still loved her and protected her while Phoebe ( followed by her sisters) acted like self righteous judgmental b*tches with "you're not good enough for me" attitude. And when he came back it was even worse. He kept trying to prove he wants to be good and they kept rejecting him. It really maked me hate Phoebe. You don't turn your back on those who love you. You do turn your back on those who try and need help to succeed... And they all did out of superiority
You've reopened an old wound. I had forgotten why I stopped watching Charmed. I thought it was because Prue left and I didn't really like Paige, but watching this video reminded me: this story arc completely killed my love for the show. It's probably the reason why I could never come around to liking Paige, and it made me dislike Phoebe too.
"To take evil back, no. But I'm not doing it for me." s05e07 - Sympathy For The Demon. This dialogue completely shows Cole's relationship fore Phoebe, good and evil. He could just not take away the powers from the Barbas and let the world die. By the way, Cole didn't tell the sisters about the seer's deception. I haven't seen this in episodes. The sisters constantly provoke Cole (episode Witches In Tights). "Why don't you just turn him into a fountain pen?". No sympathy, even though she knows about Cole's inner fight. Barbas is right - the sisters are responsible for Cole's actions.
When you mentioned how in the alternate reality Phoebe would never have stayed among the demons, you forgot that this wouldn’t have even been a possibility. We see in Charmed again that Leo helped phoebe and Cole escape and that they were already back home with Piper before anyone even met Paige. If Paige had been killed beforehand as in the alternate reality, Leo still would’ve helped phoebe and Cole escape and there’d be no possibility of demons taking over the manor or Phoebe living among demons. In fact, if Paige had never reconstituted the power of 3, the source probably would’ve even stopped going after them, no longer considering them a threat.
Regrettably, I have but one like to give this video. You said exactly what I have been saying since season 5. For me, they handled it so badly that it only left me hating Phoebe. I never forgave her for her treatment of Cole in the fifth season.
"Powers are only as good as the people knowing the right way to use them" This is a theme they could have used with Cole's character and his ending. It honestly didn't make sense to me when the Charmed ones used his demonic powers as an excuse to treat him like a demon. Especially when Piper was giving Paige a speech and said "It's our passion, not our powers, that separate us from the bad guys" meaning that every Halliwell knows that power alone isn't enough to be considered a good person - you also have to have a good heart. Leo even brings this message up when talking to the Elders about the Avatars because the Elders sees them as a threat because they are powerful. Leo asks "Well, we have power, does that make us a threat too?". Reinforcing that power alone doesn't make someone a threat. I will say that Paige got sort of a redemption in the episode when Barbas (my favorite villain) came back and stole Cole's powers. She was against giving the powers back because she actually sympathized with what he was going through and didn't want him to continue to suffer. I just thought that the Charmed Ones should have kept themselves responsible for Cole since they decided he needed to keep those powers.
Coles biggest problem was that they used him in later seasons so poorly; he literally went from one episode to another wanting to be good then evil. The problem is that a lot of Pheobes actions get placed on him, and when there is a reasonable excuse for his actions, it's completely ignored
While I agree with a lot of what you're saying. The one thing I feel needs to be considered is when Pheobe could tell something was off about Cole and we spent a whole episode around her trying to figure out if she should marry him. At the end she point blank asks him if there is anything he's keeping from her that she should know, and he says no. I know this could be a glimmer into The Source taking over his good side..but it urkes me that being how good he was up until then and how close he got to the sisters and Leo, that he couldn't convide in anyone that he was tricked into having the essence of the source inside of him. Would have been amazing to see how them knowing about the possession, not being able to realease him from the sources grip in time over how many episodes, and then having to sacrifice him, and that being hard on everyone because he was an innocent and trying to do the right thing and saved them. That would have made a lot more sense and a better send off for rhe charactor. Then the following season pheobe having cold feet about using the grimware, but paige and piper(who is known for breaking the rules when the greater good is at stake) finding out a way to save cole, but darkening the power of three slightly in the process and dealing with that would have been epic.
Spot on!!! I hate it when characters are written inconsistently. It only highlights how much of a downside a show often takes. They could have done so much more than just making him a scapegoat or a whipping boy for the self-righteous and whiney sisters. I have no idea what was going on with Charmed at the time but Julian McMahon went over to Nip/Tuck and had a character he could really stick his teeth into.
It's about time someone talked about this. Cole was done so dirty by the end. It really should have been him surviving for sure. Good thing the comics fixed this a bit and gave Phoebe and Cole proper closure.
@@Serenityblu23no I think when Cole made the guest appearance for when he sent that one former demon back to help the charmed one's and for when he came back to help Piper was enough. Like even when he was helping Piper she wasn't really grateful.
@jclyntoledo Cole wouldn't have been a threat at the end of the show. The charmed ones finally had peace in the last episode I have a feeling that Cole helps them without them knowing.
It's been so long that I don't remember a lot about Charmed other than remembering that it was one of my favourite shows and they did Cole wrong. To this day, it's still the thing I remember most about it. I really liked Cole, he tried so hard but his character was treated so unfairly by both the writers and the characters.
The writers did Cole so dirty and I will never forgive the writers for that. For me, that was where Charmed ended. I still watched, but it was never the same.
Recently I got the chance to watch charmed again, and season 5 felt like all the sisters became stupid about Cole. He was trying to redeem himself and everybody just didn't acknowledge that at all. The extremes he committed felt so forced and sometimes I wondered if they were able to see reality clearly until Paige did it out of the blue and suddenly everything ended.
I've always wished over-analysing-nerdie-youtubers had been around during the Charmed age. Thank you for this!! Cole remains one of my biggest heartbreaks lol
In Paige's defense, we have to remember she's had a different past than the Charmed ones. We do not know her full dating history like we do the other Charmed ones. We have to remember where she works too. The reality is the relationship between Phoebe and Cole could even be a form of a abusive relationship (believe it, or not), or maybe a better wording "I can fix him" relationship. Which Paige might have experienced herself and/or at least seen plenty of them in the work she's involved in. The reality is those type of relationships do not work for various reasons. It's hard for a real human to "change" let alone a half-human/half demon who's been doing evil for over a hundred years "change". She used to do drugs and she's was/is an alcoholic according to her. Being in AA doesn't just magically go away you have to be on top of it for the rest of your life. She could have seen it as a relapse moment for him (only in the form of dark magic) for all we know. So while it's frustrating I understood why she was suspicious.
Also the fact that this show was bold enough to go the realistic route & not portray Cole to suddenly do a complete 180 & become a total good guy after a century of evil, I mean how the hell does that make sense to anyone? Paige said it herself you can't be a demon who did terrible things for a whole century and expect that there won't be bad karma that continually builds up. Piper pointed out how naive phoebe was being at particular point. And even Cole himself said it, that the little good he did couldn't match up to all the wrong he'd done. So all these people acting surprised that he ended up evil after the constant reminders throughout the show of what he truly was, even as far as minor characters in different episodes always pointing out that he is evil, are honestly deluding themselves. What Prue said about him "once a demon always a demon" and Phoebe as well "maybe not on the surface but deep down you always will be", was exactly right. And yes, I truly believe Cole wanted to change, I'm sure he did he even wanted to convince himself he could and had everyone believing that he could, but eventually he just couldn't which is SO true to the harsh reality of life, like for example with people who are addicts. Some just don't make it, and its not for a lack of trying. I think how the show handled it was to a)make him a tragic character, who doesnt get a happy ending because writing-wise it's refreshing when not all characters have to have a happy ending, I think that a character can still be great & end tragically b) Show the ptsd of women who try to save damaged men and put a much needed emphasis on the idea that it's not a woman's job to save a man from himself & lastly c)To stop being so goddamn naive when the writings are clearly on the wall. So does this mean Cole didn't deserve redemption, no, it just means that sometimes the road to hell is paved with good intentions. It doesn't matter how much you want sth, sometimes it just ends in tragedy. The fact that this show pulled that off as well as giving Cole his moment of closure & acceptance of his ultimate fate, is sth that you can only appreciate with time & maturity.
@@judigemini178 you have understand their alot Cole fans who think he can't do anything wrong was some Phoebe fault yes but Cole had a lot fault to in the relationship
@@judigemini178 The trouble there is that its predetermination which the show also says is wrong. For example the Manticore baby who is half human. According to you they should have killed it immediately. Same for the father who was human and became half demon to protect it, kill him off too right? It also means Wyatt could have NEVER turned evil because he is half angel so he could never actually be evil. And of course the show contradicts Predetermination by saying its all about CHOICE at least at times. Like if Paige had chosen to use her powers for evil she would be 100% evil and could never be turned back good even if her "Evil act" was done through a trick. Pheobe made a choice to be evil to go live as the queen of the underworld and that should have made her 100% evil and never able to turn back. But it didn't. Because the rules of the world are inconsistent with themselves depending on what the writers want in that moment.
@@TheLastSane1 omg you’re still tagging me in these dumbass comments. How many times has the show mentioned that if someone kills innocents in their demon form that’s how they become evil for good (Phoebe as a banshee, Piper as a fury, Prues ex boyfriend in the demon academy) and then there’s the people who should’ve been evil but chose a different path before they went killing people for a century (the priest who had warlock half-brothers, Paige’s boyfriend Richard who had a problem with magic) so idk what you’re talking about that I said they should kill the half demon baby. Stop putting words in my mouth and use your damn brain.
He should at least gont put fighting that evil, and remembered as that. And let paige admit that. And let them not have ,ok have him gradually get a darker alter ego he fights, to the end, and sets off him getting killed himself, and them havibg a hard time. Let him be a tragic hero.
They apparently took away Phoebes powers in season 7 because they wanted to show that love was her true power… kinda agree, phoebes love is more dangerous than atom bombs. God save any man who comes near it.
Cole Turner was my first tv heartbreak. Watching a show deem a character evil despite his actions and motivations was a powerful lesson in media literacy.
That was an excellent breakdown, I felt exactly the same way about Cole by the end: that he had been rejected by the ppl he repeatedly risked EVERYTHING for 💔
Let’s also remember that the girls were producers on the show at this point. I wouldn’t put all the blame on Brian Kerns for trying to pretend they were blameless.
I understand your frustrations with how Paige acted towards Cole and jumping to conclusions, but I always thought it was because he started acting Sus.
Also I don’t get why he is surprised and even vilifying Paige for thinking he’d gone back to evil rather than he was possessed (as if it even makes any difference) HOW EXACTLY WAS SHE SUPPOSED TO KNOW?Even before Cole became the source Paige’s doubts & suspicions of him already existed, which we see in “Blacker than Cole”. I feel like sometimes for storylines like this maybe it’s better for a show to keep the audience in the dark as much as the key character/s & have big reveals, because some people can’t seem to place themselves in the shoes of the characters who have no clue what’s actually going on. Maybe they could’ve avoided this over-sympathizing & apologist tendency charmed fans have for Cole. People overlook SO MUCH crap that he did because the show spent way too much time portraying him as a victim.
@@judigemini178 yeah exactly its like people forgot that he has been a DEMON FOR 100 YEARS, just because he was trying to redeem still doesn't excuse the innocents he killed, look. I love Pheobe and Cole, but I honestly didn't see how she could of stayed. with him anyway, knowing the amount of people he has murdered in cold blood. He wasn't just in love with Phoebe he became obsessed with her, he didn't really have a life of his own. It made sense that there was a void in him, because he was BORN EVIL.
@@kmt8825 exactly, his love for her a lot of the time came off as a VERY UNHEALTHY OBSESSION, imagine breaking up with someone who died because of a horrific situation based on forcing your rship together that just wouldn’t work, only for them to come back to life saying they’re here to stay & they’ll never leave. I would literally freak tf out. Oh & just when you think it couldnt get any worse he rearranges reality so he can keep forcing this rship to work. Like, seriously. And then imagine all your friends saying “why can’t you see how hard he’s trying (ie videos like this that want to constantly defend him), why won’t you help him, you’re being a bitch”. It just takes seeing it from that perspective to see how this video is SO problematic.
@@kmt8825 Except that he wasn't. He was RAISED Evil. Half-Demons and such are stated to not be born one way or the other. Thats the lore the show went with and then tried to backtrack on for JUST Cole. We see other people in the show who are half demon or half-supernatural at least and are not evil by default. Like the telepath kid, the Manitcore baby and the dad who transformed into a half-demon to save that child. Or the Prue Love Interest who had almost become a demon and yet all of them where capable of being good.
Thank you for this video! I have argued with people who don't want to give Cole any credit for all of the good he did, how far the character came, and how they don't hold Phoebe or Paige responsible for anything. I love Charmed still to this day, but the way that they destroyed the Cole character still makes me upset.
There's a part that a lot of people don't consider: how different would Cole's ending have been if the writers were allowed to explore the Cole and Paige romance? Maybe instead of killing him off for being evil, they might have written him out as part of a breakup story and Paige works to repair her relationship with Phoebe like Phoebe did with Prue over Roger. Plus the tension would have made the power of 3 shaky which would have made the sisters more vulnerable, leading the story in interesting directions. Anyhoooo, loved this analysis as usual. There are parts I disagree with (Cole knew the demon that vanquishes the old Source becomes the new Source) but the way its done always leaves me unable to leave the video without a thumbs up. So here we go 👍🏾
To be clear, no demon knew that the source was just the POWERS. They knew that the title of the Source was passed on. So if Raynor had staged a coup and killed the source to the demons it would just be that Raynor was now the new "King of Demons" not that Raynor then gets possessed by the Source and takes his place.
@@TheLastSane1 the powers thing is a misnomer for ppl to keep exonerating Cole for willingly becoming the Source. He knew when he asked the Seer what would happen in Charmed and Dangerous that The Hollow cannot store power. It needs a host. So if the Source attacks him and he's got his powers, then those powers stay with Cole after the Source gets defeated and the Hollow is returned to it's crypt. He was acting schizophrenic at the beginning of 3 Faces of Phoebe but by the end, he stopped the act. He wasn't "possessed". The new powers just had him acting erratic. He made a choice, an admirable one, to save the Charmed ones and face the repercussions. Let's not take agency from him by saying he was tricked. He was the might Belthazor. Lived for over a century. He knew EXACTLY what he was doing.
You just put every thought I've ever had about this, and then some, into a video 😭 This is my new favorite video. The Halliwells didn’t know how to deal with mental health at all, which is kinda Wild considering Phoebe is supposed to have a degree in psychology.
Again, another great video. Whenever I rewatch Charmed, I have to skip the Cole/Source and season 5 storyline. Not only does it not do Cole the justice he deserves, it retroactively ruins the Charmed Ones. The worst part of it all is like you said, it's never stated in the show how wrong they are. We're just supposed to believe they're the good guys. This video sparks an idea tho, you should TOTALLY do a Rumple character breakdown or review of OUAT as a whole. I feel like that's a show people have just forgot about.
@@BetterWithBob That's the struggle. As someone who has been trying to start a YT channel, I do not envy you. 😭 But man do I appreciate all the hard work you put into your videos.
Continuity took so many vanquishings especially with the last few episodes with the return of Wyatt and Chris 😩. But nothing was as bad as the 70's episode and the flower power one - the time line was all over the map.
YES! I thank you!! I was so upset over the injustice, it was just so unfair! He was possessed and still fought it and he was willing to give it all up for her. It was just brutal and just wrong…. I hated it
7:35 "This can often result when a writer plans out their story with a predetermined ending and doesn't account for how their characters evolve as you're writing them" fucking THANK YOU. How many times have these hacks ruined shows and characters because of their stubbornness and ego. Like...take a writing course before thinking you'd write a good show.
This video is great because it gave me the words to finally put into perspective what I feel about the character of Cole Turner. Because on one hand, I love Cole and ship Phoebe and Cole hard still to this day. I know I'm weird and I've been watching this show for ages. But on the other hand, I hate the emotional manipulation and the bad plot devices that lead to Julian McMahon's exit from the show. Even though I think they did an OK job of fixing the errors they created with what they came up with. For me what was most irritating about watching charmed for the first time again after not watching it with my mom and grandma for so long was that it felt like the writers couldn't make up their minds about what they were doing with Cole. Was he a good guy or a bad guy or some kind of weird anti-hero I want to root for but also wish he would just die off? For a long time, I had just concluded that the character was collateral damage and Julian McMahon did the best he could with what he was given. Which in my humble opinion was amazing 👏 I felt that Cole was a toxic being who never had a chance to figure out who he was or what he wanted out of life aside from outlines of what was expected for human or demon. He was a turning point for Phoebe to grow as a character but that plot line failed and Coop would later be the one to pick up the pieces of Phoebe's romantic trauma. So all in all the character was a necessity to get the happy ending we wanted for Phoebe all along and the happy ending she deserved. But I always hate how he felt like a slapstick afterthought in my mind and was until you referred to the bad writing GOT that I release, shit this character was done dirty.
This video finally made me re-watch the entire show like I had planned for years. Well, re-watch might not be very accurate, I have only ever seen random episodes on tv many years ago, so I might as well call this one my first real viewing as well. Anyhow, thank you for bringing Charmed to my attention again.
Wow, I'm glad I stumbled upon this video. I'm a long time Charmed fan. I grew up watching this series with my mom (who's no longer with us) and it holds a somewhat special place in my heart. I'm honestly glad you talked about Cole and how he was willing to change and use his powers to become good and as human as he can be. He was done dirty with his forced ending and with how Paige treated him most of the time. Looking back, those scenes are very infuriating to watch. I believe Cole deserved better...like you said, to live his life with his new powers trying to make the world a better place. I'm adopting that for my personal Charmed headcanon.
I think a good ending for Cole would have been to have him accept he and Phoebe were done in the mermaid episode and have him leave. He could have been an occasional guest like with Angel on Buffy and maybe play a part in future battles.
I loved charmed so much and still do for the most part. But rewatching most of it as made me realize how much they seemed to just hate on most of the male characters. It feels so frustrating to look back and realize how often our main girls made mistakes and were forgiven, but the male characters didn’t get that same grace at all.
Cole will forever be my favorite Charmed character.(It's also love at first sight at Julian McMahon by the way))) His story is about betrayed love, injustice and imperfection. It`s painfully realistic, because in life we also don`t always receive the help we deserve, our loved ones turn away from us, we are often misunderstood, love turns into hatred, and our sacrifice and struggle remains unappreciated and ultimately meaningless. There couldn't be a good ending for Cole. He dies despised and alone, as if he was thrown out as unnecessary. And the most tragic thing is that he absolutely did not deserve this. As a result, he was the most alive, humane and selfless. He directly confronted evil and defeated it. The irony is that he lost not to evil, but to the embodiment of good: love, devotion, desire to his detriment to be recognized by others. Till the end I hoped that sisters would change, but, unfortunately, Cole became their test, which they did not pass.
The fact that you just combine two of my favorite TV shows of all time together is why I subscribed thank you very much for this video it was so much appreciated❤❤❤❤
I love Cole alot and if I had been the one put in charge of writing him ot of the show I would've taken a different approach. HOWEVER that does'nt mean what they did go with did'nt make sense because it does. The way the story is played out with him now is a good man incapable of turning away from the addiction to evil permanently. People treat him like he's a precious snowflake who had no faults ever and so ignore any context to that in the name of defending him. Something that the show ALWAYS consistently showed is that Cole had a bad habbit of not communicating properly with Phoebe when they were together even after he turns good he still does'nt trust her enough to help him. And this habit eventually bites him in the ass hard when he becomes the source, now yes the source was in control for most of the time they were merged. but only for about 80% of that time. There were THREE instances where Cole had the chance to either tell Phoebe about the source or at least keep her from making an extremely bad decision but chose not to. When he's ready to give up his powers that is 100% Cole talking because there's no way in hell the source would've let him do it. So yes he did ALLOW Phoebe to become Queen of the underworld knowing she had a demonic baby inside her controling her every action that HE'S responsible for. And even when the source is gone it's shown he still has'nt learned his lesson because the first thing he asks for is Phoebe getting the book that requires you to be EVIL in order to use it. And so when he came back in Season 5 I completely understood why Phoebe would be tired of all of it even as a kid. He did put her through hell and to expect her to just be forgiving after that tramuatic experience was just unfair of people especially when he does'nt even start with apologies just expects that saying he'll redeem himself would be enough to get him off the hook. And again to be fair to Phoebe it's not like she was 100% closed off to the idea of forgiving him Siren song showed her really wrestling with her decision and in Witches in Tights their even in a less tense place, until the ending of that episode which again Phoebe was completely justified Cole had so many other ways of dealing with that slum lord instead of killing him.
Well, you did a great job, especially in the terms of delivery, because if I would made a video about Cole, I would probably be yelling through the whole rant! Yes, I have more important things in life to worry about but unfairness to this character still pisses me off. Especially: the sisters NEVER actually learned that he was possessed and manipulated, therefore never acknowledged their mistake and Cole himself never let them know. It all was so stupid and forced and out of character and he didn't deserve any of this (neither did us viewers). Ffs, if Julian was that eager to leave the show, still Brad & co could write a better exit for him, without ruining one of the best characters.
thank you for this video, i'm forever mad about what they did with Cole storyline. And honestly, Phoeby ending up with the Cupid who LOOKS EXACTLY LIKE COLE but like with zero chemistry and story behind relashionships is maddening
@@georgeprchal3924 Yeah I know that but if he'd just left for the show & Charmed didn't write him as dead it would've hirt Charmed rating cuz Charmed fans wouldn't have stopped demanding him
One gigantic ussue with Charmed, is that, whenever one of the sisters got possesed, it was acknowledeged as them not having a choice, but with Cole, it was just him deciding to be evil, Or how about, powers aren't evil, and don't make them evil. But with Cole his powers are evil, and therefore, he is evil.
Great video! What the Charmed writers and producers did to Cole still frustrates me to this day. I never understood why the sisters were always able to get free passes and forgive when they were forced to turn evil, and yet when that happened to Cole, he never got the same treatment. It's so hypocritical. Everything Cole did was out of love for Phoebe and trying to save her, but the writers trying to justify their drastic change were framing it so that the sisters and Phoebe blamed him, as if he'd always be too tempted by evil and therefore a risk. Funny thing is half the time they were more tempted than him and only became more selfish characters in the seasons after him. Cole was such an intriguing character I just don't get why they would make audiences fall in love with him, give him a redemption arc, make his intentions good and show his returns to evil being from manipulation and tricks, to then end him as this unrecognisable character that was ultimately evil as if grey complex characters can't exist. What was the point?
For me it's Chris that everyone hates, and season 6 too, but I love that character! I love his storyline and the sacrifices he made for his family. Many hate that season, but it's my favorite.
I have to disagree to a certain extent. Cole even possessed was able to tell the seer about the possession. He made no attempts at all to tell any of the sisters about what happened. And even though he was possessed it's about intent vs impact. He wasn't responsible for all of the things he did, but he still terrorized them and they have rights to be wary as this went on for so long. Phoebe was not obligated to save him from the wasteland. He should have moved on imo. He made a decision to steal powers and become invincible. He wanted Phoebe back but she was moving on. He traumatized her whether he wanted to or not. The women weren't innocent at all but Paige was the punching bag in a lot of the possession antics so she had some rights to be aggravated and dubious of him. But let's not forget too that Paige was the one who led Cole to Phoebe in season 5 so that they can acknowledge their mutual heartbreak about the situation. So to me, Cole was put in a lot of messy situations, sometimes at no fault of his own, but he lacked proper communication at that pivotal point in season 4 that threw everything to hell (literally). Instead of giving into this fact he decided to push the issue and still lose everything anyways. But I think the storyline is realistic in the sense that even if you try and do everything right and redeem yourself, sometimes it just doesn't work out.
The Seer points out that the Source's essence won't let him do anything like telling the sisters so it seems more as though it's the Source's self preservation stopping him doing anything that might counter the plan.
I see your point, but strongly disagree on this one: imo Phoebe was obliged to save Cole from wasteland regardless of her feelings about him. And I don't mean necessarily resurrect him. Cole has human soul, therefore he is an innocent - it was established in the show that even human criminals are considered "innocents"; also the show draws a very distinct line between justice and punishment (we don't talk about season 6 now...) Cole's soul deserved afterlife and whatever expected him there. I'm not sure it was possible for him to move on in the wasteland
@@chaklunkaparfum And the last sentence is the kicker, Cole never attempted to see if he could have afterlife that didn't include coming back from the dead. We can't really determine that because he was good for 2 years out of hundreds that his soul is redeemed enough to make it to the "good" afterlife. The show seems to have 2 separate afterlife plans for humans and demons but never went into the nuance of those who are half and where they would go. So to me, we can't really determine if Cole would go the wasteland or not as they didn't structure many alternative options on the show.
@@BetterWithBob I get that and they've all been possessed multiple times and especially by that point so we see what the rules are for it. When Paige rightfully calls out his odd behavior (which is always the telltale sign) Piper should've made more of an effort to believe her instead of dismiss her. Unfortunately the timing of everything threw off their perception abilities, besides Paige, who was constantly punished for her pointing things out that didn't make sense. Of course based on her wariness of him even before the possession as his behavior was very volatile in those brief episodes in between his elimination of his demonic side and the Source possession. He was always about to jump out of his skin because he missed the action he even says that in the episode when Paige let's him work at her job. He was struggling to reconcile a post demon life (rightfully so) and did somethings he definitely didn't need to do but makes sense as he was a demon for the majority of his life. So we can only speculate what that feeling could've developed into (that would make a very compelling rewrite potential imo though I love the Source storyline) because in my mind he could've gone either way. But to the main point it was established that he was fighting and even did things that wouldn't hurt Phoebe and since her intuition is the strongest and she was being blocked and manipulated so much as a result it was truly on the other two to notice the clear difference in his behavior because all the signs were there very blatantly and heck Cole even wrote her that letter so I'd say enough of him was still in there and able to do more fighting imo.
@@mama456100 powerful rebuttal btw. I personally just always reject the possession narrative. He who kills the old source becomes the new source. That was clearly established. It was a line that came from Cole merely a few hours before he volunteered to took in the Hollow. The man knew what he was doing when he made that choice to save his wife and her sisters so I reject all narratives that tries to strip him of his agency. That's why the Seer told him clearly the very next episode to stop pretending like he didn't know what would happen. He wasn't possessed in as much as he was just corrupted by the old source's powers.
In retrospect the Phoebe Cole storyline equals Buffy and Spike's except the dynamics of their relationship have been reversed and while Spike earns Buffys trust back in the end and dies as a hero as for Cole he gets the short end of the stick.
i’m a cole defender until the day i DIE he was done soooo wrong by the writers
Same!!! I love Cole a lot!
They did him SO DIRTY
Cole is one of my favorite characters in the show
I WILL defend Cole til the end of all days.
Okay in my opinion the sisters totally USED Cole. It's like "Hey, Cole, we need your help!" and he helps them. For heaven's sake, if Cole hadn't helped Phoebe at the end of season 3, that would have been the end: the source would have killed Phoebe and then Piper. But when Cole needed them did they ever actually help just to help? No they didn't. They had ulterior motives (except when Phoebe had Leo heal Cole but then she didn't know who he really was at that time)
It was so baffling, they straight out refused to help him, without any reason. He tried so hard during the seasons to be good, to do good, to change, to make up for his mistakes, even the ones made when he was possessed by the Source and they just kept insisting he was evil until he eventually turned back to evil because he had nothing left and had gone insane. That’s the most selfish thing the sisters have done during the show.
@@Velvet.323 right? It was like they decided (without any reason to support it) that he was not an innocent and so he didn’t deserve any help anymore. What about his human half? It just didn’t make any sense, the writers couldn’t be bothered to develop it well in my opinion, they made a sudden switch in how they made the charmed ones behave and think of Cole but didn’t explain it at all.
I think she was just fed up with giving him chance after chance. I’d have gladly taken Cole back though lol.
@@carinaguida558 I mean, I get that! She didn’t have to take him back! But he was an innocent to help, he wanted to be good and they should have encouraged that instead of telling him he was evil and pushing him away.
Meanwhile, Phoebe got to be the queen of the Underworld by her own will, only to be forgiven and forgotten.
Yup that should’ve been the reason why they mainly Freebie and Paige getting their power taking away by the tribunal.
He legit sacrificed himself for the witches then they tossed him.
💁🏾♂️ Righty So. 🤓
@@ricardomoseley they were right to toss him??
@@swagsukeuchiha7599 he had many opportunities to come clean
Hoes
he was also a demon and lied to them about beign the source so he deserves it
My entire problem with Cole's season 5 storyline was the fact that the sisters would run to Cole when they deemed it was convenient for them but then they'd turn around and remind him that they thought he was scum. Twice they went to him to save Phoebe, both times he was trying to go away from them and their lives.I spent half that season up to the point that he died being pissed at them. You can't claim to be a good person when you use a person when they benefit you and then discard them like trash when they've done what you need them to.
So agreed. Season 5 was the worst ever
That’s behavior is actually spot on for the modern narcissist woman 🤣🤣🤣
it is like wome and desiring equality and being independent... until the bill comes lol... or they need to change the tire.. etc
@@Deimonos85 Not misoginy is a fucking charmed video essay...
@@Criszgz22 Shut up! You' re being pretentious
The thing that annoyed me was that Cole was possessed by the The Source of All Evil and they never forgave him even though he was resisting. Phoebe was pregnant with the The Source's baby and turned on them instantly, But they forgave her completely. They were mad at Cole for sacrificing himself to save them.
Phoebe was their sister and Cole is a demon … 🤷🏾♂️
@@brycelwynn Prejudice.
It was literally never addressed / acknowledge by the sisters that Cole was possessed at the first place and that left a sour taste in my mouth
to be fair a very fair prejudice coz Cole did kill a ton of innocent people....@@LadyDoomsinger ..like the show masks it well but I d call even the girls quite morally wrong for even giving Cole a chance(tho also happy from the show perspective coz it was a great storyline) especially since it was VERY clear he didnt want to be good to be good, he wanted to get Phoebe. If we saw ANY proof of Cole willing to be a good guy without being rewarded for it by getting Phoebe maybe I d have a different opinion, but from where I stood he changed himself only for Phoebe... I d bet that if Phoebe died he d go back to being a demon , you do not grow morals from one day ot another...and the show doesnt pretend he does, but it does pretened the the girls are somehow morally superior when they clearly protected a sserial killer for a few season just coz their sister found him hot. Put them in a position where the killer of Pru is protected by some other witch coz of love...and then ask them how rightful they find that.
@@Kunoichi4ever4I disagree to some extent; at first Cole definitely only cared about Phoebe, and any good he did in the process was incidental, but he was learning and trying to be a better person - as seen when he infiltrated the Brotherhood at great risk to himself, despite Phoebe begging him not to, because it was too dangerous, and after he was stripped of his powers, he was starting to adjust to being a "normal" man. That doesn't erase all the evil he did as a demon, but I think the morality of it comes down to whether you believe in retributive justice or reformative justice. Personally I think even serial killers deserve a chance to redeem themselves, if they are sincere (and with all the necessary precautions, of course)... However before he could really fully appreciate his new mortality he was infected by the Source of All Evil, which derailed any further potential redemption for him.
Cole DID intend to just leave and set out on his own with his new powers after Phoebe's initial post-resurrection rejection. He accepted that she didn't want him back and planned to leave, but then Paige showed up, cast a spell that messed with his head and made him feel "Phoebe's love for him," and that started him down the path of continuing to hang around her, convinced that she'd take him back if he just did better. That's practically the theme of their relationship: the sisters get in trouble, browbeat Cole into pulling their asses out of the fire, and then blame him for existing afterwards, ignoring the various factors that garble his mental state in the process.
this is so off topic and i am so sorry but I just have to say it - seeing Murtagh as your profile picture made me so happy 😭❤
He should have left at the end of a Witches Tail. He talks to Phoebe and, after Paige's spell, he understands her feelings and knows that even though Phoebe loves him there's too much pain there for them to try again. Cole leaves. Every once in a while, we'll hear stories of a mystery man in another city doing good deeds. And maybe he'll make an appearance in the later seasons. I'd like him and Phoebe to get back together at the end of the show but they don't have to.
That ending seemed so at odds with how they portrayed him afterwards. Your idea is 👌
Cole had been as loved by me as Leo. I really resented how they turned him into a psycho. They really should either have killed him off early on or just given h8m that redemption arc and let it stick, or ebb and flow for interest without going full on psycho
I like your ending for Cole better.
He deserved soooo much better than Phoebe!
Great idea! That could’ve even opened up for a spin off option like Angel from Buffy
I think what's the most frustrating about it is that the message is just bad. Coles arc says literally that no matter how hard one tries to be good and how often chooses the right path, they'll fail eventually, if they are born with evil in them.
We only see something similar play out the other way with this priest Prue fell for but this was just one episode and the premise different.
Doesn't matter if he and Phoebe would've been endgame (I admit I don't like Coop that much, however), Cole deserved to have his arc end on a more hopeful note when it comes to redemption. They made him just another great complex character who was done dirty in turning him into a crazy villain he never was nor should've become
And They are absolutely right. 💁🏾♂️
Agree
I was thinking the same thing. Thank you!
cole wasn't born evil, he was half human and the mother killed the father in order to turn cole evil, He just wanted to save his human fathers soul by season 4
I mean, you say it in the video, but I have to agree , what it boils down to: Cole's later characterization isn't naturally written. Audiences can sense that. It's why Daenerys' final actions were so vocally protested. It went against every action and philosophy she portrayed. Cole was clearly leaning toward Good (perhaps not permanently, but actively working on it) and the show's foundational philosophy of "Good can overcome Evil,' particularly with Phoebe and Paige battling their past lives, is completely thrown out the window with Cole. Not to say a Bad character can't try and ultimatly fail, but Julian Mcmahon's performance gave plenty of credibility to the idea that he would turn good. HIs ending felt cheap. You want a character to ultimately turn Evil? That's great. Prove to me, the watcher, that this is a viable path for them to take. Put in the hours and I'll gladly watch someone's (fictional) downfall. But make 👏 it 👏work👏
Yep. Although Christy is divisive, I feel that with her it worked. She got offered the chance to be Good but she chose Evil because it was what she knew - although the arc could have been a bit less rushed.
@@BetterWithBob Christy is a good example. Her path was mapped out more naturalistically imo and her end didn't bother me (as much). They def could've spent more time w/ her tho.
Ultimately the show wasn't clear about Cole's turn towards evil. It is heavily implied it was the source possessing him, but then it was him too? Then the source was vanquished and Cole was just evil again?
@@MrSasyBI feel like the show was kinda insinuating that Cole returned to evil because Phoebe wouldn't take him back after they vanquished the Source, which I don't like either.
im guessing im the only one who felt Cole ended up where and how he was supposed to be. He was never going to be truly good. but he knows what it's like to experience true love and happiness. He thought about what was best for Phoebe over himself and ends up in purgatory over it.
The scene that has the voiceover of Cole's farewell letter, when he was first vanquished- was one of the most beautiful, heart-breaking moments for me - I always assumed that the growth & purity of his love for Pheobe bound some kind of magic into it, & that was the reason he survived on- in some kind of limbo.
But to hear the writers/ show-runners... it wasn't enough for him to love her, to try & strive & struggle- none of his efforts were ever going to be good enough...
Yeah it's rather depressing when you put it like that
The problem with Charmed is with its continuity I think it's because Constance M. Burge left. I mean Brad Kern had a good Idea about the Cole arc but I liked Constance writing for the Sister bonding and not Brad's let's make them wear skimpy outfits every episode.
Thank you for reminding me how mad I was about this lol. You’re completely on point. Cole was a convenient punching bag. The sisters constantly dog piled him and used him as opposing force to strengthen their sisterhood, even after he was absolved for the umptenth time. He was their enemy in reserve and I hated that. And while I loved seeing him in the later episodes I couldn’t help but acknowledge I was only prolonging the shows masochistic treatment of him. He didn’t deserve what happened to him. Justice for Cole.
If we're being honest Buffy and the Scooby's pretty much treated Spike the same way.
@@avrilfan0521 the scoobies 😂 you’re completely right though. Either let that man… vamp? vamp man? (Can’t remember there was a lot of losing and regaining souls in that show). Nevertheless. Either let HIM be redeemed or go kick tombstones elsewhere. Enough with the limbo treatment!
Edit: spike was much better than angel so where’s his spin-off, huh?!
We didn't get that spin off 😮... I totally forgot about that!
@@jjamison2027Exactly!👏
i will die on the hill of Cole being good and Phoebe's true soulmate
Save a spot for me up there 😤😤
Same
That is the logic of an unhealed person finding love in toxicity.. I’ve been there, so I’m calling even myself out .. but that’s what this is
Alyssa Milano agrees.
Actually, I feel he was too good for her, so he needed someone better, who was not abusive to him.
The most frustrating thing about Cole's journey is that he was trying so HARD to be good but because he didn't meet the Charmed ones expectations of what THEY thought good should be, they just wipe their hands off him.
Which is especially unfair because the Charmed Ones have dome Evil as well and yet they can be redeemed but Not Cole? Nonsense.
I wanted Cole to win so much but they way he ended was wrong - he should’ve gone out in a blaze of redemption
You speak le truth
@@BetterWithBob It think it's la.
Truth is feminine in French I believe 🤷🏾♂️
Yeah, like Spike's end in Buffy the Vampire Slayer
@@gabriellafox2981 exactlyyyyy I mean whatever happened to the soul storyline he had towards the end of season 3 - they should’ve ended with that type of arc
I wouldn't have minded him being vanquished as the Source of All Evil, in a tragic ending of his character, with the realization that the only way to destroy the Source is to kill him - and having Phoebe reeling with conflicting emotions of guilt and grief for killing him, as well as relief that he is gone. If he had just stayed dead after that, he could've been remembered as the Good Guy who was ultimately destroyed and overtaken by the Source of All Evil possessing him.
Bringing him back just undermined the whole tragedy.
Loved this essay ❤ 20 yrs later, Cole deserved better! (Daenerys too😢)
I have felt this way for YEARS. It’s like you perfectly explained what I have been thinking and it annoyed me to no end that Cole had a heel turn even after he was no longer possessed like the writers had it OUT for him. I think each sister had undergone possession at some point so I just never understood how they couldn’t see that Cole was a victim of the Source. It’s maddening.
I think when he became the Source and Phoebe became his queen, was like the highlight of their storyline. And also made the show stay new/fresh. The writers should have made this last waaaaay longer then just one tiny episode.
Facts
I agree. I remembered it lasting way longer (from when I watched it as a kid) and then being so confused when I rewatched it recently.
Agree 💯
facts
It should have spanned its own entire season!!!
Cole was definitely one of my favorite characters on the series- I wish he could have gotten a better, happier ending.
Didn't even need to be happy - I would've been satisfied if his story had ended tragically with him being vanquished as the Source of All Evil.
Bringing him back after that undermined his entire character.
The chemistry between them was phenomenal; it actually looked like a real love, and it was much more natural. Leo is just too perfect. Cole is morally gray, and that’s more natural.
Cole became so inconsistent he was eventually dropped from the show as they had written themselves into a corner with his botched character development. One week he was evil, the other week he was good, then he turned crazy....terribly misused character as a whole. The storyline in season 5 could have been much, much more compelling if they had allowed themselves to HOLD PHOEBE ACCOUNTABLE FOR HER WRONGDOINGS and make her look bad for once. She was the one who stated at the end of Season 4 that she owned him that much and by the first episode of Season 5 this sentiment is thrown out the window. What's even more annoying, by mid season 5 is she becomes so obsessively sadistic with him she won't even grant him the peace of death when he asks for it! (Sam I Am episode).
The persistent Cole blaming and gaslighting are jarring in that season, not mention incredibly dull and repetitious; everyone just keeps going on about how he'll never amount to anything other than being an evil bastard and how Phoebe was the victim in the situation when she clearly had her fair share of blame. After all she chose to become evil Queen of the underworld and no, the demonic fetus and the Seer's potions don't change the fact that she chose that path when the possessed by the Source Cole was still WILLING TO GIVE UP HIS DEMONIC POWERS FOR HER SAKE and she stopped him so no, there are no excuses for Phoebe's actions in late season 4. She also treated poor Paige like crap when there were obvious signs his behaviour was suspicious.
Baby bangs Phoebe was his ultimate demise and she never got an ounce of flack for that, not even from the stupid Elders who turned a blind eye during the time a Charmed One chose to become married to the Source of all things evil but they had the audacity to threaten severe repercussions if Piper married a freaking Whitelighter. The inconsistency is beyond ridiculous and him admitting in his final episode he still loved the person that walked all over him despite all the things he had done for her and her family was the final nail in the coffin.
"Baby bangs Phoebe" lmao
Mary V. Excellently well summed up. Yes, they used Cole's character until there was nothing left to tell so they cheapened his last day by killing him. Charmed is not the only series on TV to do this. There are other shows (screenwriters and directors) who know when a character becomes fan-fav and fan love/hate fav, then throw that well-established character into the grinder. I do wish to see more writers punish their protagonists for wrongdoings, something that wasn't done to Phoebe or Paige. I'm not saying torture or kill the female protagonist, just saying let the person stand in, lay out on the floor crying "This is on me. I have to redeem myself. Something has to be done..."
@@sofdemi8042 Yeah I swear if that wasn't there I would like it. Like what does that even mean?!
Yes to everything except the "baby bang phoebe" line bc I was so lost as to what you were trying to say.
@@jclyntoledo Alyssa Milano had some ugly baby bangs mid season 4 which added to the whole obnoxiousness of the storyline, particularly when she joined the dark side. I was being sarcastic about the haircut lol.
100% agreed with the whole video!
Cole was my favorite character and his last arc treated him so badly. I actually grew to hate Phoebe and Paige for what they did to him. The man just wanted the only family he ever really had back and those two refused to let him.
Something that I find interesting is that he and Piper, while not having much screen time, always got along really well and I loved that he was the guide sent to her in the 150th episode. I also love his reaction to learning that she's pregnant with Wyatt. He was so joyful *for* her because he knew how much she and Leo had wanted a family and now they were going to have it.
I just- He was so so good and they just wrecked his character completely to make Phoebe and Paige look better.
Yes, and I like that Piper even called him "an old friend" in thee 150th episode.
I always felt Paige wanted something to be wrong with Cole because Leo was basically an angel so an angel being bad isn't as likely as a half demon with a dark past being evil... Keep in mind when Paige moved in she was already feeling like a 3rd wheel because her relationships were all meh and here are these new sisters with magical and handsome men in their life and she is pretty much a fling girl. I felt she was secretly jealous and when she saw something to build upon she went all in
Oh now that's a very interesting point
That also fits with the body switching episode, "I want to be more like Phoebe"
I think Paige got Prue’s storyline. Before Prue died, she was dead set against Cole. The writers transferred that to Paige. I don’t think the jealousy arc was really at play. She did however feel insecure about being the replacement sister.
@@Nana-hz2tr facts
Cole had been stayed violent when he became human.
Cole was too good for his ending. Awesome performance.
Another thing that’s so frustrating is how they got rid of their baby. They couldn’t even settle on whether it was Cole and Phoebes baby or the Seers, and the latter never made any sense. Piper specifically refers to the child when Cole returns as “your demonic spawn” when talking to Cole…so is it his or not??
But they kill the baby off so Phoebe can be fully free of Cole and can move on to dating one smoking hot rich guy (with nowhere near the same charisma and complexity as Cole) after another…groundbreaking 😑
Jason was so lame and gary stu lol like calm down he only owns a magazine, his wealth is obnoxious
During the initial run of the show my sister and I had the theory that Chris was going to be Pheobe and Cole's son who somehow survived.
@@stephw1702 I also thought that too
I figured the ambiguity was intentional - none of the sisters really knew what the baby was or how it would have turned out - when Phoebe says it was all Evil, neither hers nor Cole's, I always felt that she was trying to distance herself from the emotional trauma of loosing the baby - telling herself it wasn't really hers, because she lost it.
@@LadyDoomsinger I always assumed they just wanted to move on without her having to deal with any of the emotional turmoil from that experience
Because in seasons 5 and especially 6 it really just became more and more about dumb wacky hijinks more than real character development
When he becomes human, they could have made him become a male witch-somehow rewarded with good powers with turning away from his evil past and becoming a good asset (having such knowledge for what demons are out there to warn them is actually very helpful) for the sisters so he doesn’t mope around feeling useless without powers. Then later becomes a male witch mentor for Wyatt and Chris, instead of dragging the cringe evil crazy crap through the seasons until his demise. That would have been helpful for when Leo goes down his weird struggles so Cole would have become the steady help instead of leo. That would have been interesting.
I love this idea. And even if the actor playing Cole had left for Nip/Tuck they could have brought him back for future episodes as you have stated to aide/mentor Wyatt. Then write him off as him leaving to help other whitelighters or witches.
Turns out hollywood being bad at writing and treating characters unfairly isn't a new phenomena
I think the writers never gave him a purpose on the show after he lost his powers like they did with Leo.
Honestly, I took a stab at trying to fix it with fan fiction and took two stabs at him getting powers as a human. one way having a power stripping spell go wrong on a warlock that stole powers from witches, as that happened often, and one with him dying and the Elders rewarding his struggle to fight evil, even as a human, by making him a Whitelighter and I gave up cause both seemed just as forced as the retcon that says he chose evil.
My theory is that the writers wanted to make the 100th episode 'special' so they marked that as the point where they would kill off Cole. They just had no coherent plans on how to get there
This and also Julian decided to leave and take the lead role in Nip N Tuck so the writers wrote him out of charmed.
I agree with you. I think they deci🎉ded to turn Cole evil and write him out "with a bang" to make the 100th episode "special".
At the start of season 5 I thought they were going to go with Cole proving Phoebe wrong and showing her that he can choose to be good; that powers aren't inherently good or evil, they are just powers and how you use them is what counts.
But then the show goes in another direction. Cole seems to go off the rails- mad with power I guess? And meets a unsatisfactory and underserved end. His character deserved better.
There was so much to explore- he was over 100 years old! It would have been really interesting to learn and see more about his life before he met the charmed ones.
Plus it really annoyed me that the charmed ones blamed Cole for becomming the Source and acted like he tricked them and it was his master plan or something.
He was tricked by the Seer! He only choose to take in the hollow to save the charmed ones from the Source and he didn't know that, in doing so, the would become the Source!
And when Cole over came the Source and tried to have the Source removed with the Wizard, Phoebe stopped the spell. It annoys me how the Charmed one's and even Leo's bad and questionable actions are forgiven but Cole aren't- when it wasn't his fault! He helped them so many times and they wouldn't have vanquished the Source without him.
Being taken over by the Source must have been so traumatic and surviving the demonic wasteland. And no one was there for him or even tried to understand.
It really annoyed me in season 5 how the charmed ones would use Cole. They visited him because they wanted his help but never gave him anything in return and wanted nothing to do with him once his help was over.
This video is everything! I feel that I have been waiting 20+ years for justice for Cole, and it's finally here! I feel vindicated. It's actually crazy how dirty Charmed did its best character, and also the sisters at the same time
My friend who reads the comics says that he's brought back to fix the arc but I've not caught up with it yet
@@BetterWithBob Oh I'd love that! Hope you'll update us if you do read it😊
It really does annoy me how badly they treat Cole after s4, phoebe is the worst culprit for it but the way that it wasent even Cole doing it, it was the source who possessed him, he should of been killed off ceremoniously halfway through or at the end of s5 protecting wyatt from the hag or something like that
Or he borrows the tetsaiga from Inuyasha and murders Phoebe with the wind scar and Paige with the Backlash Wave and Piper gets her house back and enjoys peace and quiet with her husband and sons.
Cole deserved so much better.
The worst thing was Piper lying and talking about the choices he made that clearly played out to that he didn't make. He was infected with evil in their epic battle against the Source had he not stepped end they would have lost. He saved them at the cost of his soul. They had no empathy for his plight after forgetting what he sacrificed for them.
Cole was awesome. Justice for Cole.
*Cole was treated so badly. I loved the character and he just kept getting screwed around*
I've always hated the way Cole was handled at the end of his arch. I mean the man was possessed, and his love for Phoebe stayed a detrimental constant to the end, and yet she condemns him to hell?
The single most frustrating inconsistency on Charmed! The writers never made it clear if "The Source" was the half-faced demon possessing Cole or if it was a literal source of energy tempting him towards Evil like a drug to an addict. It seemed he was just possessed by Half-Face at first but then they kind of forgot that and changed it to being Cole's choice. In either case, why did Phoebe get a pass and not Cole? Like they'd even be alive if he'd just left them to it. Great video!
This!! It also ties into the question they kinda left about if their baby was really their baby, or if it was never theirs and actually belonged to the seer and half faced source.
I agree with this because was he possessed? Why didn't Cole tell them? I was rooting for Cole but honestly I think that he missed having powers and he liked it. He wanted to live a double life
@@akyanajanay Well it seemed in 3 Faces of Phoebe he was gonna tell her but when he tried the first time the Sources magic or whatever prevented him from doing so and then later on when old Phoebe and him are talking he tells her he wants to tell Present Phoebe but he claims that he's not sure he can.
It always annoyed me that no one wondered where the source’s power went, nobody thought to test cole for powers, nobody thought cole’s human soul might be over powered by the source’s essence and he wasnt in control when they FINALLY realized he was the source (which is exactly what happened) AND breaking phoebe and cole up essentially rendered prue’s death in the context of the show completely useless. She died in canon because phoebe was in the underworld saving cole and when leo arrived his first thought was to save his wife. Phoebe’s character development also stalls for the rest of the series after leaving cole…they definitely fumbled writing that part.
Probably because this was the first time, if memory serves correct, that the idea of powers transferring to an available vessel after death was used in the show. Usually, when someone magical died, their power just went away, too, unless the person who killed them had a spell or weapon to intentionally absorb it
Oooh. I kind of knew Phoebe and Leo underground was indirectly responsible, but to have Prue's death completely meaningless...wow, you are right.
Cole's conclusion didn't sit well with me for the same reasons you laid out. He was my favorite character and the writers did him dirty.
Yes. Thank you. This perfectly explains my frustrations because I too love Paige and Phoebe but how they interact with Cole in the later years made me dislike all three of them at points. I feel like sometimes people like to throw Cole out with the bathwater, forgetting the good because the writing deteriorated over time.
They both could get hit by a bus and nothing would make me happier.
Cole was my favorite character, he deserved better… I rewatch the series like once every 2 years but only until Cole’s death. Julian McMahon is the total best ❤
I rewatch only episodes with him
I was so frustrated with Cole's story line. And the girls just wouldn't give him a chance (except Phoebe), I felt like that's the only thing that could explain him becoming evil again, because to change you need support from people who won't drag you back down, and if they'd leaned into that, and made it a lesson for them to learn not to push those who need help away. But no, it just became "Phoebe's good heart made her blind and she made mistakes"... And then the whole thing at the end with Phoebe ending up with a cupid sent to her by the elders just... no please no. I actually do think Phoebe/cupid pairing works in the end but the way that was executed was so revolting, especially when contrasted with Phoebe's previous love stories that were more passionate and complex, and about accepting the flaws along with the good, that's Phoebe's thing seeing into people and embracing who they are (which is another reason the Cole thing annoys me, she saw there was good in him worth nurturing but no one else would fully accept that) but in the end her soulmate is someone chosen for her? Those are the two parts of Charmed that annoy me the most.
Now that you bring up the cupid thing, it does seem off she would just accept matchmaking fro the Elders. How many times has she watched them put Piper and Leo through the emotional ringer for manipulative or just bureaucratic reasons including one of them trying to murder her nephew?
The cupid thing was yucky at best
Phoebe was the bad guy here. Cole did all in his power to protect her AND her sisters, they literally stopped him from getting rid of power of source which he WANTED to do and when he finally gave in he still loved her and protected her while Phoebe ( followed by her sisters) acted like self righteous judgmental b*tches with "you're not good enough for me" attitude. And when he came back it was even worse. He kept trying to prove he wants to be good and they kept rejecting him. It really maked me hate Phoebe. You don't turn your back on those who love you. You do turn your back on those who try and need help to succeed... And they all did out of superiority
Coop the Cupid also has a name that starts with a C, I guess the writers remembered
The funny thing is, what else should an apple peel form other than a C? 😂
@@Mondfischie exactly, maybe an O or P or E but that's it
@@mariaheart8259 G and U would be possible as well.
Coop made better sense for Phoebe.
You've reopened an old wound. I had forgotten why I stopped watching Charmed. I thought it was because Prue left and I didn't really like Paige, but watching this video reminded me: this story arc completely killed my love for the show. It's probably the reason why I could never come around to liking Paige, and it made me dislike Phoebe too.
"To take evil back, no. But I'm not doing it for me." s05e07 - Sympathy For The Demon.
This dialogue completely shows Cole's relationship fore Phoebe, good and evil. He could just not take away the powers from the Barbas and let the world die. By the way, Cole didn't tell the sisters about the seer's deception. I haven't seen this in episodes. The sisters constantly provoke Cole (episode Witches In Tights). "Why don't you just turn him into a fountain pen?". No sympathy, even though she knows about Cole's inner fight. Barbas is right - the sisters are responsible for Cole's actions.
Barbas really always saw the sisters for who they were and called them on their bs so many times, it was always funny to watch.
When you mentioned how in the alternate reality Phoebe would never have stayed among the demons, you forgot that this wouldn’t have even been a possibility. We see in Charmed again that Leo helped phoebe and Cole escape and that they were already back home with Piper before anyone even met Paige. If Paige had been killed beforehand as in the alternate reality, Leo still would’ve helped phoebe and Cole escape and there’d be no possibility of demons taking over the manor or Phoebe living among demons. In fact, if Paige had never reconstituted the power of 3, the source probably would’ve even stopped going after them, no longer considering them a threat.
Ah. Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.
Regrettably, I have but one like to give this video. You said exactly what I have been saying since season 5. For me, they handled it so badly that it only left me hating Phoebe. I never forgave her for her treatment of Cole in the fifth season.
Thanks for watching XD
"Powers are only as good as the people knowing the right way to use them"
This is a theme they could have used with Cole's character and his ending. It honestly didn't make sense to me when the Charmed ones used his demonic powers as an excuse to treat him like a demon. Especially when Piper was giving Paige a speech and said "It's our passion, not our powers, that separate us from the bad guys" meaning that every Halliwell knows that power alone isn't enough to be considered a good person - you also have to have a good heart. Leo even brings this message up when talking to the Elders about the Avatars because the Elders sees them as a threat because they are powerful. Leo asks "Well, we have power, does that make us a threat too?". Reinforcing that power alone doesn't make someone a threat.
I will say that Paige got sort of a redemption in the episode when Barbas (my favorite villain) came back and stole Cole's powers. She was against giving the powers back because she actually sympathized with what he was going through and didn't want him to continue to suffer. I just thought that the Charmed Ones should have kept themselves responsible for Cole since they decided he needed to keep those powers.
Coles biggest problem was that they used him in later seasons so poorly; he literally went from one episode to another wanting to be good then evil. The problem is that a lot of Pheobes actions get placed on him, and when there is a reasonable excuse for his actions, it's completely ignored
While I agree with a lot of what you're saying. The one thing I feel needs to be considered is when Pheobe could tell something was off about Cole and we spent a whole episode around her trying to figure out if she should marry him. At the end she point blank asks him if there is anything he's keeping from her that she should know, and he says no. I know this could be a glimmer into The Source taking over his good side..but it urkes me that being how good he was up until then and how close he got to the sisters and Leo, that he couldn't convide in anyone that he was tricked into having the essence of the source inside of him. Would have been amazing to see how them knowing about the possession, not being able to realease him from the sources grip in time over how many episodes, and then having to sacrifice him, and that being hard on everyone because he was an innocent and trying to do the right thing and saved them. That would have made a lot more sense and a better send off for rhe charactor. Then the following season pheobe having cold feet about using the grimware, but paige and piper(who is known for breaking the rules when the greater good is at stake) finding out a way to save cole, but darkening the power of three slightly in the process and dealing with that would have been epic.
Spot on!!! I hate it when characters are written inconsistently. It only highlights how much of a downside a show often takes. They could have done so much more than just making him a scapegoat or a whipping boy for the self-righteous and whiney sisters. I have no idea what was going on with Charmed at the time but Julian McMahon went over to Nip/Tuck and had a character he could really stick his teeth into.
It's about time someone talked about this. Cole was done so dirty by the end. It really should have been him surviving for sure. Good thing the comics fixed this a bit and gave Phoebe and Cole proper closure.
By season 7, Julian said he'd "work with anyone but Alyssa". And so we saw Cole's ghost with Piper.
I can't believe you sat there and said Coop was a good match for Phoebe....
Phoebe destroys the lives of every guy she meets so there's no better match for her other than her own self.
They should have brought Cole back in the last episode
@@Serenityblu23no I think when Cole made the guest appearance for when he sent that one former demon back to help the charmed one's and for when he came back to help Piper was enough. Like even when he was helping Piper she wasn't really grateful.
@jclyntoledo Cole wouldn't have been a threat at the end of the show. The charmed ones finally had peace in the last episode I have a feeling that Cole helps them without them knowing.
It's been so long that I don't remember a lot about Charmed other than remembering that it was one of my favourite shows and they did Cole wrong. To this day, it's still the thing I remember most about it. I really liked Cole, he tried so hard but his character was treated so unfairly by both the writers and the characters.
The writers did Cole so dirty and I will never forgive the writers for that. For me, that was where Charmed ended. I still watched, but it was never the same.
Recently I got the chance to watch charmed again, and season 5 felt like all the sisters became stupid about Cole. He was trying to redeem himself and everybody just didn't acknowledge that at all. The extremes he committed felt so forced and sometimes I wondered if they were able to see reality clearly until Paige did it out of the blue and suddenly everything ended.
I've always wished over-analysing-nerdie-youtubers had been around during the Charmed age. Thank you for this!! Cole remains one of my biggest heartbreaks lol
Oh god and I love that you are linking it to GOT.
In Paige's defense, we have to remember she's had a different past than the Charmed ones. We do not know her full dating history like we do the other Charmed ones. We have to remember where she works too. The reality is the relationship between Phoebe and Cole could even be a form of a abusive relationship (believe it, or not), or maybe a better wording "I can fix him" relationship. Which Paige might have experienced herself and/or at least seen plenty of them in the work she's involved in. The reality is those type of relationships do not work for various reasons. It's hard for a real human to "change" let alone a half-human/half demon who's been doing evil for over a hundred years "change". She used to do drugs and she's was/is an alcoholic according to her. Being in AA doesn't just magically go away you have to be on top of it for the rest of your life. She could have seen it as a relapse moment for him (only in the form of dark magic) for all we know. So while it's frustrating I understood why she was suspicious.
Also the fact that this show was bold enough to go the realistic route & not portray Cole to suddenly do a complete 180 & become a total good guy after a century of evil, I mean how the hell does that make sense to anyone? Paige said it herself you can't be a demon who did terrible things for a whole century and expect that there won't be bad karma that continually builds up. Piper pointed out how naive phoebe was being at particular point. And even Cole himself said it, that the little good he did couldn't match up to all the wrong he'd done. So all these people acting surprised that he ended up evil after the constant reminders throughout the show of what he truly was, even as far as minor characters in different episodes always pointing out that he is evil, are honestly deluding themselves. What Prue said about him "once a demon always a demon" and Phoebe as well "maybe not on the surface but deep down you always will be", was exactly right. And yes, I truly believe Cole wanted to change, I'm sure he did he even wanted to convince himself he could and had everyone believing that he could, but eventually he just couldn't which is SO true to the harsh reality of life, like for example with people who are addicts. Some just don't make it, and its not for a lack of trying. I think how the show handled it was to a)make him a tragic character, who doesnt get a happy ending because writing-wise it's refreshing when not all characters have to have a happy ending, I think that a character can still be great & end tragically
b) Show the ptsd of women who try to save damaged men and put a much needed emphasis on the idea that it's not a woman's job to save a man from himself & lastly
c)To stop being so goddamn naive when the writings are clearly on the wall.
So does this mean Cole didn't deserve redemption, no, it just means that sometimes the road to hell is paved with good intentions. It doesn't matter how much you want sth, sometimes it just ends in tragedy. The fact that this show pulled that off as well as giving Cole his moment of closure & acceptance of his ultimate fate, is sth that you can only appreciate with time & maturity.
@@judigemini178 you have understand their alot Cole fans who think he can't do anything wrong was some Phoebe fault yes but Cole had a lot fault to in the relationship
@@judigemini178 The trouble there is that its predetermination which the show also says is wrong. For example the Manticore baby who is half human. According to you they should have killed it immediately. Same for the father who was human and became half demon to protect it, kill him off too right? It also means Wyatt could have NEVER turned evil because he is half angel so he could never actually be evil. And of course the show contradicts Predetermination by saying its all about CHOICE at least at times. Like if Paige had chosen to use her powers for evil she would be 100% evil and could never be turned back good even if her "Evil act" was done through a trick. Pheobe made a choice to be evil to go live as the queen of the underworld and that should have made her 100% evil and never able to turn back. But it didn't.
Because the rules of the world are inconsistent with themselves depending on what the writers want in that moment.
@@TheLastSane1 omg you’re still tagging me in these dumbass comments. How many times has the show mentioned that if someone kills innocents in their demon form that’s how they become evil for good (Phoebe as a banshee, Piper as a fury, Prues ex boyfriend in the demon academy) and then there’s the people who should’ve been evil but chose a different path before they went killing people for a century (the priest who had warlock half-brothers, Paige’s boyfriend Richard who had a problem with magic) so idk what you’re talking about that I said they should kill the half demon baby. Stop putting words in my mouth and use your damn brain.
He should at least gont put fighting that evil, and remembered as that. And let paige admit that. And let them not have ,ok have him gradually get a darker alter ego he fights, to the end, and sets off him getting killed himself, and them havibg a hard time.
Let him be a tragic hero.
They apparently took away Phoebes powers in season 7 because they wanted to show that love was her true power… kinda agree, phoebes love is more dangerous than atom bombs. God save any man who comes near it.
great analysis! cole is an iconic character. I wish he and phoebe were endgame. None of her other relationships were that compelling
Cole Turner was my first tv heartbreak. Watching a show deem a character evil despite his actions and motivations was a powerful lesson in media literacy.
ok the sabrina the teenage witch reference was everything. thank u for that lol
That was an excellent breakdown, I felt exactly the same way about Cole by the end: that he had been rejected by the ppl he repeatedly risked EVERYTHING for 💔
Let’s also remember that the girls were producers on the show at this point. I wouldn’t put all the blame on Brian Kerns for trying to pretend they were blameless.
I always thought Cole’s character was done so dirty THANK YOU for making this
I understand your frustrations with how Paige acted towards Cole and jumping to conclusions, but I always thought it was because he started acting Sus.
Yeah l agree Paige's reaction was warranted because he became the source, but thats just the writers though.
Also I don’t get why he is surprised and even vilifying Paige for thinking he’d gone back to evil rather than he was possessed (as if it even makes any difference) HOW EXACTLY WAS SHE SUPPOSED TO KNOW?Even before Cole became the source Paige’s doubts & suspicions of him already existed, which we see in “Blacker than Cole”. I feel like sometimes for storylines like this maybe it’s better for a show to keep the audience in the dark as much as the key character/s & have big reveals, because some people can’t seem to place themselves in the shoes of the characters who have no clue what’s actually going on. Maybe they could’ve avoided this over-sympathizing & apologist tendency charmed fans have for Cole. People overlook SO MUCH crap that he did because the show spent way too much time portraying him as a victim.
@@judigemini178 yeah exactly its like people forgot that he has been a DEMON FOR 100 YEARS, just because he was trying to redeem still doesn't excuse the innocents he killed, look. I love Pheobe and Cole, but I honestly didn't see how she could of stayed. with him anyway, knowing the amount of people he has murdered in cold blood. He wasn't just in love with Phoebe he became obsessed with her, he didn't really have a life of his own. It made sense that there was a void in him, because he was BORN EVIL.
@@kmt8825 exactly, his love for her a lot of the time came off as a VERY UNHEALTHY OBSESSION, imagine breaking up with someone who died because of a horrific situation based on forcing your rship together that just wouldn’t work, only for them to come back to life saying they’re here to stay & they’ll never leave. I would literally freak tf out. Oh & just when you think it couldnt get any worse he rearranges reality so he can keep forcing this rship to work. Like, seriously. And then imagine all your friends saying “why can’t you see how hard he’s trying (ie videos like this that want to constantly defend him), why won’t you help him, you’re being a bitch”.
It just takes seeing it from that perspective to see how this video is SO problematic.
@@kmt8825 Except that he wasn't. He was RAISED Evil. Half-Demons and such are stated to not be born one way or the other. Thats the lore the show went with and then tried to backtrack on for JUST Cole. We see other people in the show who are half demon or half-supernatural at least and are not evil by default. Like the telepath kid, the Manitcore baby and the dad who transformed into a half-demon to save that child. Or the Prue Love Interest who had almost become a demon and yet all of them where capable of being good.
Cole deserved better. They did him dirty.
Thank you for this video! I have argued with people who don't want to give Cole any credit for all of the good he did, how far the character came, and how they don't hold Phoebe or Paige responsible for anything. I love Charmed still to this day, but the way that they destroyed the Cole character still makes me upset.
Great video! I watched Charmed God knows how many times... I grew up with this show and liked this video so much!
Thank you for watching 😊
There's a part that a lot of people don't consider: how different would Cole's ending have been if the writers were allowed to explore the Cole and Paige romance?
Maybe instead of killing him off for being evil, they might have written him out as part of a breakup story and Paige works to repair her relationship with Phoebe like Phoebe did with Prue over Roger. Plus the tension would have made the power of 3 shaky which would have made the sisters more vulnerable, leading the story in interesting directions.
Anyhoooo, loved this analysis as usual. There are parts I disagree with (Cole knew the demon that vanquishes the old Source becomes the new Source) but the way its done always leaves me unable to leave the video without a thumbs up. So here we go 👍🏾
To be clear, no demon knew that the source was just the POWERS. They knew that the title of the Source was passed on. So if Raynor had staged a coup and killed the source to the demons it would just be that Raynor was now the new "King of Demons" not that Raynor then gets possessed by the Source and takes his place.
@@TheLastSane1 the powers thing is a misnomer for ppl to keep exonerating Cole for willingly becoming the Source. He knew when he asked the Seer what would happen in Charmed and Dangerous that The Hollow cannot store power. It needs a host.
So if the Source attacks him and he's got his powers, then those powers stay with Cole after the Source gets defeated and the Hollow is returned to it's crypt.
He was acting schizophrenic at the beginning of 3 Faces of Phoebe but by the end, he stopped the act.
He wasn't "possessed". The new powers just had him acting erratic.
He made a choice, an admirable one, to save the Charmed ones and face the repercussions. Let's not take agency from him by saying he was tricked. He was the might Belthazor. Lived for over a century. He knew EXACTLY what he was doing.
Man, I feel I should re-watch this as an adult because when this came out and I was a kid I didn't get most of the stuff going on.
Cole never get along with Prue and even attacking Paige. He just hate telekinesis
You just put every thought I've ever had about this, and then some, into a video 😭 This is my new favorite video. The Halliwells didn’t know how to deal with mental health at all, which is kinda Wild considering Phoebe is supposed to have a degree in psychology.
I had the biggest crush on Cole when I was a kid lol
Again, another great video. Whenever I rewatch Charmed, I have to skip the Cole/Source and season 5 storyline. Not only does it not do Cole the justice he deserves, it retroactively ruins the Charmed Ones. The worst part of it all is like you said, it's never stated in the show how wrong they are. We're just supposed to believe they're the good guys. This video sparks an idea tho, you should TOTALLY do a Rumple character breakdown or review of OUAT as a whole. I feel like that's a show people have just forgot about.
I would love to dive into that show, since it was my life for a long time almost as much as Charmed was. Only thing is where to begin lol
@@BetterWithBob That's the struggle. As someone who has been trying to start a YT channel, I do not envy you. 😭 But man do I appreciate all the hard work you put into your videos.
Continuity took so many vanquishings especially with the last few episodes with the return of Wyatt and Chris 😩. But nothing was as bad as the 70's episode and the flower power one - the time line was all over the map.
YES! I thank you!! I was so upset over the injustice, it was just so unfair! He was possessed and still fought it and he was willing to give it all up for her. It was just brutal and just wrong…. I hated it
7:35 "This can often result when a writer plans out their story with a predetermined ending and doesn't account for how their characters evolve as you're writing them" fucking THANK YOU. How many times have these hacks ruined shows and characters because of their stubbornness and ego. Like...take a writing course before thinking you'd write a good show.
This video is great because it gave me the words to finally put into perspective what I feel about the character of Cole Turner. Because on one hand, I love Cole and ship Phoebe and Cole hard still to this day. I know I'm weird and I've been watching this show for ages. But on the other hand, I hate the emotional manipulation and the bad plot devices that lead to Julian McMahon's exit from the show. Even though I think they did an OK job of fixing the errors they created with what they came up with. For me what was most irritating about watching charmed for the first time again after not watching it with my mom and grandma for so long was that it felt like the writers couldn't make up their minds about what they were doing with Cole. Was he a good guy or a bad guy or some kind of weird anti-hero I want to root for but also wish he would just die off? For a long time, I had just concluded that the character was collateral damage and Julian McMahon did the best he could with what he was given. Which in my humble opinion was amazing 👏 I felt that Cole was a toxic being who never had a chance to figure out who he was or what he wanted out of life aside from outlines of what was expected for human or demon. He was a turning point for Phoebe to grow as a character but that plot line failed and Coop would later be the one to pick up the pieces of Phoebe's romantic trauma. So all in all the character was a necessity to get the happy ending we wanted for Phoebe all along and the happy ending she deserved. But I always hate how he felt like a slapstick afterthought in my mind and was until you referred to the bad writing GOT that I release, shit this character was done dirty.
This video finally made me re-watch the entire show like I had planned for years. Well, re-watch might not be very accurate, I have only ever seen random episodes on tv many years ago, so I might as well call this one my first real viewing as well. Anyhow, thank you for bringing Charmed to my attention again.
Wow, I'm glad I stumbled upon this video. I'm a long time Charmed fan. I grew up watching this series with my mom (who's no longer with us) and it holds a somewhat special place in my heart.
I'm honestly glad you talked about Cole and how he was willing to change and use his powers to become good and as human as he can be. He was done dirty with his forced ending and with how Paige treated him most of the time. Looking back, those scenes are very infuriating to watch. I believe Cole deserved better...like you said, to live his life with his new powers trying to make the world a better place. I'm adopting that for my personal Charmed headcanon.
The worst season of Charmed was the last one, with Billie and Christie.
I think a good ending for Cole would have been to have him accept he and Phoebe were done in the mermaid episode and have him leave. He could have been an occasional guest like with Angel on Buffy and maybe play a part in future battles.
I loved charmed so much and still do for the most part. But rewatching most of it as made me realize how much they seemed to just hate on most of the male characters. It feels so frustrating to look back and realize how often our main girls made mistakes and were forgiven, but the male characters didn’t get that same grace at all.
Cole will forever be my favorite Charmed character.(It's also love at first sight at Julian McMahon by the way)))
His story is about betrayed love, injustice and imperfection.
It`s painfully realistic, because in life we also don`t always receive the help we deserve, our loved ones turn away from us, we are often misunderstood, love turns into hatred, and our sacrifice and struggle remains unappreciated and ultimately meaningless.
There couldn't be a good ending for Cole. He dies despised and alone, as if he was thrown out as unnecessary. And the most tragic thing is that he absolutely did not deserve this. As a result, he was the most alive, humane and selfless. He directly confronted evil and defeated it. The irony is that he lost not to evil, but to the embodiment of good: love, devotion, desire to his detriment to be recognized by others.
Till the end I hoped that sisters would change, but, unfortunately, Cole became their test, which they did not pass.
The rampant abuse towards Cole made me sad
The fact that you just combine two of my favorite TV shows of all time together is why I subscribed thank you very much for this video it was so much appreciated❤❤❤❤
In Conclusion: Piper remains the best character 😂
I love Cole alot and if I had been the one put in charge of writing him ot of the show I would've taken a different approach. HOWEVER that does'nt mean what they did go with did'nt make sense because it does. The way the story is played out with him now is a good man incapable of turning away from the addiction to evil permanently. People treat him like he's a precious snowflake who had no faults ever and so ignore any context to that in the name of defending him.
Something that the show ALWAYS consistently showed is that Cole had a bad habbit of not communicating properly with Phoebe when they were together even after he turns good he still does'nt trust her enough to help him. And this habit eventually bites him in the ass hard when he becomes the source, now yes the source was in control for most of the time they were merged. but only for about 80% of that time. There were THREE instances where Cole had the chance to either tell Phoebe about the source or at least keep her from making an extremely bad decision but chose not to. When he's ready to give up his powers that is 100% Cole talking because there's no way in hell the source would've let him do it.
So yes he did ALLOW Phoebe to become Queen of the underworld knowing she had a demonic baby inside her controling her every action that HE'S responsible for. And even when the source is gone it's shown he still has'nt learned his lesson because the first thing he asks for is Phoebe getting the book that requires you to be EVIL in order to use it. And so when he came back in Season 5 I completely understood why Phoebe would be tired of all of it even as a kid. He did put her through hell and to expect her to just be forgiving after that tramuatic experience was just unfair of people especially when he does'nt even start with apologies just expects that saying he'll redeem himself would be enough to get him off the hook.
And again to be fair to Phoebe it's not like she was 100% closed off to the idea of forgiving him Siren song showed her really wrestling with her decision and in Witches in Tights their even in a less tense place, until the ending of that episode which again Phoebe was completely justified Cole had so many other ways of dealing with that slum lord instead of killing him.
Well, you did a great job, especially in the terms of delivery, because if I would made a video about Cole, I would probably be yelling through the whole rant! Yes, I have more important things in life to worry about but unfairness to this character still pisses me off. Especially: the sisters NEVER actually learned that he was possessed and manipulated, therefore never acknowledged their mistake and Cole himself never let them know. It all was so stupid and forced and out of character and he didn't deserve any of this (neither did us viewers). Ffs, if Julian was that eager to leave the show, still Brad & co could write a better exit for him, without ruining one of the best characters.
thank you for this video, i'm forever mad about what they did with Cole storyline. And honestly, Phoeby ending up with the Cupid who LOOKS EXACTLY LIKE COLE but like with zero chemistry and story behind relashionships is maddening
I honestly think a big reasons they killed Cole was because fans would've kept demanding him back if he'd stayed alive.
No they did it because he went to a better show in Nip/Tuck and his Emmy proves it. Hell even Paige joined him there.
@@georgeprchal3924 Yeah I know that but if he'd just left for the show & Charmed didn't write him as dead it would've hirt Charmed rating cuz Charmed fans wouldn't have stopped demanding him
@@kiterafrey I just wish he'd have returned as both Avatar-level Cole who is invincible, and Belthazor, arguably the strongest demon in the show.
One gigantic ussue with Charmed, is that, whenever one of the sisters got possesed, it was acknowledeged as them not having a choice, but with Cole, it was just him deciding to be evil, Or how about, powers aren't evil, and don't make them evil. But with Cole his powers are evil, and therefore, he is evil.
Cole is my favorite character. I wish he had a redemption arc like Spike from Buffy
Cole was such an endearing character, he loved Phoebe and the circumstances weren’t in his favor but he always showed her love. 😢
Great video! What the Charmed writers and producers did to Cole still frustrates me to this day. I never understood why the sisters were always able to get free passes and forgive when they were forced to turn evil, and yet when that happened to Cole, he never got the same treatment. It's so hypocritical. Everything Cole did was out of love for Phoebe and trying to save her, but the writers trying to justify their drastic change were framing it so that the sisters and Phoebe blamed him, as if he'd always be too tempted by evil and therefore a risk. Funny thing is half the time they were more tempted than him and only became more selfish characters in the seasons after him. Cole was such an intriguing character I just don't get why they would make audiences fall in love with him, give him a redemption arc, make his intentions good and show his returns to evil being from manipulation and tricks, to then end him as this unrecognisable character that was ultimately evil as if grey complex characters can't exist. What was the point?
For me it's Chris that everyone hates, and season 6 too, but I love that character! I love his storyline and the sacrifices he made for his family. Many hate that season, but it's my favorite.
I have to disagree to a certain extent. Cole even possessed was able to tell the seer about the possession. He made no attempts at all to tell any of the sisters about what happened. And even though he was possessed it's about intent vs impact. He wasn't responsible for all of the things he did, but he still terrorized them and they have rights to be wary as this went on for so long. Phoebe was not obligated to save him from the wasteland. He should have moved on imo. He made a decision to steal powers and become invincible. He wanted Phoebe back but she was moving on. He traumatized her whether he wanted to or not. The women weren't innocent at all but Paige was the punching bag in a lot of the possession antics so she had some rights to be aggravated and dubious of him. But let's not forget too that Paige was the one who led Cole to Phoebe in season 5 so that they can acknowledge their mutual heartbreak about the situation. So to me, Cole was put in a lot of messy situations, sometimes at no fault of his own, but he lacked proper communication at that pivotal point in season 4 that threw everything to hell (literally). Instead of giving into this fact he decided to push the issue and still lose everything anyways. But I think the storyline is realistic in the sense that even if you try and do everything right and redeem yourself, sometimes it just doesn't work out.
The Seer points out that the Source's essence won't let him do anything like telling the sisters so it seems more as though it's the Source's self preservation stopping him doing anything that might counter the plan.
I see your point, but strongly disagree on this one: imo Phoebe was obliged to save Cole from wasteland regardless of her feelings about him. And I don't mean necessarily resurrect him. Cole has human soul, therefore he is an innocent - it was established in the show that even human criminals are considered "innocents"; also the show draws a very distinct line between justice and punishment (we don't talk about season 6 now...) Cole's soul deserved afterlife and whatever expected him there. I'm not sure it was possible for him to move on in the wasteland
@@chaklunkaparfum And the last sentence is the kicker, Cole never attempted to see if he could have afterlife that didn't include coming back from the dead. We can't really determine that because he was good for 2 years out of hundreds that his soul is redeemed enough to make it to the "good" afterlife. The show seems to have 2 separate afterlife plans for humans and demons but never went into the nuance of those who are half and where they would go. So to me, we can't really determine if Cole would go the wasteland or not as they didn't structure many alternative options on the show.
@@BetterWithBob I get that and they've all been possessed multiple times and especially by that point so we see what the rules are for it. When Paige rightfully calls out his odd behavior (which is always the telltale sign) Piper should've made more of an effort to believe her instead of dismiss her. Unfortunately the timing of everything threw off their perception abilities, besides Paige, who was constantly punished for her pointing things out that didn't make sense. Of course based on her wariness of him even before the possession as his behavior was very volatile in those brief episodes in between his elimination of his demonic side and the Source possession. He was always about to jump out of his skin because he missed the action he even says that in the episode when Paige let's him work at her job. He was struggling to reconcile a post demon life (rightfully so) and did somethings he definitely didn't need to do but makes sense as he was a demon for the majority of his life. So we can only speculate what that feeling could've developed into (that would make a very compelling rewrite potential imo though I love the Source storyline) because in my mind he could've gone either way. But to the main point it was established that he was fighting and even did things that wouldn't hurt Phoebe and since her intuition is the strongest and she was being blocked and manipulated so much as a result it was truly on the other two to notice the clear difference in his behavior because all the signs were there very blatantly and heck Cole even wrote her that letter so I'd say enough of him was still in there and able to do more fighting imo.
@@mama456100 powerful rebuttal btw.
I personally just always reject the possession narrative. He who kills the old source becomes the new source. That was clearly established. It was a line that came from Cole merely a few hours before he volunteered to took in the Hollow. The man knew what he was doing when he made that choice to save his wife and her sisters so I reject all narratives that tries to strip him of his agency.
That's why the Seer told him clearly the very next episode to stop pretending like he didn't know what would happen.
He wasn't possessed in as much as he was just corrupted by the old source's powers.
In retrospect the Phoebe Cole storyline equals Buffy and Spike's except the dynamics of their relationship have been reversed and while Spike earns Buffys trust back in the end and dies as a hero as for Cole he gets the short end of the stick.
I would have liked that ending for Cole were after the alienated reality he leave town and leave a note.
Justice for cole turner he had so much potential 😭