Final Fantasy IX Retrospective Review | Game Discourses
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- Опубликовано: 7 авг 2024
- To mark the 20th Anniversary of Final Fantasy IX this episode is dedicated to discussing the unique and wonderful world and characters of the final Playstation era instalment of the Final Fantasy series.
Final Fantasy 9 was a conscious return to several tropes and conventions of past Final Fantasy games. It was a unique homage to the character classeses, and medieval aesthetic of the earliest titles, and also drew on various historical elements from William Shakespeare to the Industrial Revolution. This FF9 Review considers these aspects of the game along with the existential, philosophical themes evident in the character arcs rather than necessarily critiquing gameplay or how ‘good’ the game is in a subjective sense.
The Kuja analysis referenced in the review can be found here: • Kuja Explained | Final...
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This Final Fantasy IX Analysis covers:
Final Fantasy 9 and existentialism
Character analysis of the central party
Zidane and Kuja
An existential analysis of Vivi
A comparison of Final Fantasy 9 mist technology with the industrial revolution
Shakespeare in Final Fantasy
A general FF9 Retrospective discussing most things besides gameplay!
#ff9 #finalfantasy9 #gamediscourses 
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Zidane is a great character to me. Because on the surface he is laid back and carefree, but he can be dead serious when the time is right and will do anything to help a friend.
A change of name I see. Congratulations on the 3k landmark, well deserved!
Cheers mate, as always appreciate the feedback 👍
Dude I love your content. FF IX is my favorite FF by far. I’d love to see some more deep dives into the lore of the game.
29:05 Zidane did mention the 'blue light' as being his only clue as to where he came from, when telling Garnet the 'bedtime story'.
I think he's referring more to the whole Angel of Death aspect to his backstory. Zidane being from some mysterious place he cannot remember is something that's built up relatively better and has a fair bit of hints throughout the game. However, them trying to tie Kuja and Garland to the whole thing and having Zidane conveniently being part of this big master plan was clunkier.
We get a bit of foreshadowing through his Trance abilities and some allusions to him from Garland, but I think the real issue is more of a foundational problem. Even if we had a lot more foreshadowing behind the truth, it really doesn't alleviate the overly coincidental nature of these revelations, as Zidane's involvement in the game's plot was initially so far removed from the likes of Kuja and it was just happenstance that he wound up running into him.
Usually, big twists that revolve around characters having some form of connection to each other have a organic build up within the story, where you look back and see how it was practically inevitable that such and such would reunite again, and that it only seems like coincidence on the surface. In FFIX, there's no unseen force or any individuals that bait Zidane into meeting Kuja again, so it retroactively becomes a forced reunion once you find out that they're related and that they're both these super special beings that were supposed to wreak havoc upon the world of Gaia.
I think it Zidane's past could have also been teased at the end of disc one after their defeat against Beatrix where Kuja looks a Zidane and says "This boy could be a problem..."
@@Sawngawkuh Very good point!
Hi again- I’ve been playing FFIX again and I think there’s an important aspect of the world and character design you haven’t mentioned- I feel the “storybook” or innocent-toon design brings out and drives home a (at least for me) the shocking violence of the story- as early as the amazing sight of the black mages who come tumbling out of the sky to their deaths- I mean it’s SO horrific and sad and shocking and poetic BECAUSE of the toy like childlike design! The same happens during the frightful destruction of Alexandria, and, among other cutscenes, the same thing happens when we realize that the “comedy” of Zorn and Thorn is not so funny after all, and that it’s not only their actions that are monstrous, but that they are, their being, is monstrous- non of which would really have worked- have been experienced- so starkly- so shocking- had the design been “realistic”. Anyways... J.
Zidane's true nature as the Angel of Death from Gaia is hinted at through gameplay, not exposition or dialogue. Look at his trance form and abilities. When in trance, he can tap into the powers Garland programmed into him.
I think it needed some kind of character acknowledgement. Trance is so removed from any story beats up until the end bit when Kuja embraces his inner Super Saiyan 4, that I think me and many others just wrote it off as a weird bit of game design and showing off what the artists could do.
The account re-naming couldn't be any more topical, haha. Love your videos, man.
Very thorough and interesting analysis!
Love the inclusion of the philosophy and other material.
Bit harsh on Quina towards the end though.
Thanks! And yeah maybe a little harsh on Quina, I do actually really like the character though, just slightly at odds with the others.
So glad you're doing this game. Good luck with your channel
Thanks Michael, and yeah it's one of my favourites:)
I love your analysis's of games. You should check out the Suikoden series....all of the games have rich history and lore and great characters. And since the creators of the series are now working on a spiritual successor (titled
Eiyuden Chronicle: Hundred Heroes) outside of Konami, there has been renewed interest in the series in spawned from. May be worth a look.
Probably my favourite game of all time. I find it sad when people get put off by the art style and never give it a chance. Never was an issue for me.
I love basically everything about. Some of the pre-rendered backgrounds are stunning. Not much I'd change on this game at all. Maybe make Trance better and I was never keen on Amarant being a character. I think he would have played better staying with Lani and being a reoccurring boss battle. Bit like the Turks from 7
I loved the art style! It's what gave the game its charm! If they ever remade this i would be so scared if they decided to go with a more realistic look.
My favorite game. Great video. One of the best endings of all time
I see no lies here 🧐
Quina showed a bit of growth. If you return to Master Quan's cave the master shows them about the importance of imagination and even scolds Master Quale for teaching that the point of life for a Gourmand is only to eat everything. There is a bit of dialogue at the end of the game when everyone is addressing Zidane where Quina says they must prepare and share a meal with everyone rather than once again saying they want Zidane return to show them more food to eat.
FFIX is held back a little for me simply because I'm not as big a fan of its combat system and some of its mechanics as I am of the systems of other games. That said, I love the visuals and the music, and it probably has my overall favorite cast of characters in any Final Fantasy game.
I love that your review focuses a lot on the characters, because I do agree with you that their individual arcs and the way they tie together is the highlight, as opposed to the overarching narrative itself. While I understand why some people have issues with this game due to the admittedly kind of jarring and confusing twists toward the end, these characters, their backgrounds, and their relationships still create a truly memorable experience. I think if I was making a list of my favorite Final Fantasy characters, it's very possible that Zidane, Garnet, Vivi, and Freya would all end up in my top ten.
Classic game, love these rumination styled deep dives! Sent ya a message on Twitter btw.
As usual, love it. Best!
Thank you Jack for the video! I'd love to hear you ruminate on FF9 all day
Love these videos of yours!
Thanks :)
Fantastic video as always!
(Love the new name by the way)
Thanks man :)
Where you say: "It's interesting how our perceptions can often change as we mature". This is actually a notion I recently thought of and how characters I previously did not like or understand, with age that changes when I cast my mind back to a game or character I haven't thought about in years. For me it was how I found TIdus so annoying and pointless, and now I enjoy him, and I believe he has a great character arc. It' s interesting to note tough, Stiener in my case, even as a young teen first playing FF IX I enjoyed him and understood why he was a hindrance on the party, he's in a moral dilemma, he serves the queen but his led along this journey wrestling with his thoughts on what the moral thing to do is. Strange how I could understand that as a younger person but it took me more years to understand Tidus.
Cloud wants to be cool and almost succeeds until his anti social qualities show. Zidane doesn't try to be cool. His genuine, relaxed, straightforward, confident, and laid back attitude/mindset makes him cool. What you see is what you get with him. I love Cloud and Zidane, but Zidane is my favorite extroverted protagonist and there is strength in his simplicity. This isn't to say Zidane has paper thin motives or characterization, he's just easy to vibe with and understand. He's a cool older brother mentor to Vivi that looks out for him and Garnet/Dagger. He's even willing to have Kuja's back so he can have a satisfactory death where he comes to peace with what happened. Kuja and Zidane being related is an excellent example of what happens when a writer uses a trope extremely well because it didn't feel forced. His traditionally masculine traits don't feel excessive or overbearing. It doesn't feel like he's characterized similar to how people make fun of flirtatious men who won't take no for an answer and insist on pestering women they find attractive physically. Cloud shows why purposefully trying to be cool doesn't work out as cracks will show, Zidane doesn't try to be cool because he just is. He has the confidence Cloud doesn't have until late FF7. There's no need to put up a character in Zidane's mind so he doesn't lie to himself. When his sense of identity is shattered by Garland, it's believable why he temporarily turns his back on everything. It's an upsetting(in the good way narrative wise) sequence where he believes the worst in everything because he has no reason to be optimistic at this time. FF9 carries the central theme of identity and love, at this point the two come together at the emotional weight of Zidane's arc. His loved ones and friends who he helped and taught valuable lessons stick with him and in the process prove his new mindset wrong. I know Vivi is the fan favorite in FF9(and the poster boy since) but Zidane is my favorite out of the cast. Zidane started out believing he didn't need a reason to save Garnet and was challenged with the lie of him not having a place in Gaia as he wasn't actually born there. Him not being born in Gaia is one of the reasons he used to justify staying on his home planet and serving his angel of death role. If Kuja couldn't escape it, how could he? Zidane overcoming this lie thanks to the help of his loved ones and friends is a trope that was done very well. FF9 ending with Zidane embracing Garnet/Dagger and most likely becoming a king is one of my favorite endings to any rpg. I'll leave you with this quote "you don't need a reason to help someone." It really is that simple.
I loved every character in this game, I wish Amarant and Freya had more distinguished arcs though I feel Freya herself gets shafted the most despite meeting her early. Quina honestly might as well not even be a character missed opportunity i think to not make Zidane the blue mage as hes a thief and remove Quina entirely, because Zidane is so lackluster late game compared to the rest of the part unless he is in trance.
Also felt those two could have had more distinguished arcs and perhaps a little closure on Freyas part too.
@@AlleywayJack A sidequest dedicated to Freya and Fratley would have been great imo a nice quest chain where you see Fratley in different towns and Freya attempts to ewmins him of their history together. The quest chain would end having Freya fail in reminding him but having the player discover that Fratley has fallen for Freya anew after completing the quest chain, this way the ending scene during Vivi's speech of them together seems a lot less forced. As for Amarant he should have been shown as soon as the group "captures" Dagger and he is sent by Queen Brahne like in the original with Lani to bring back the princess. He could of had 3 encounters with the party before ultimately joining the team where he does in the original,yes it would still be a late join, but there would be a working plot leading up to it to give him more character.
I agreed. If this ever got a remake (which I hope not) I wouldn't want anything changed but maybe just expand upon a few things. Garnet and Queen Brahne's relationship before she was corrupted. Maybe more on Amarant's past to give him more character. Keep Freya's arc going instead of just dropping it. Etc
Great video. You mentioned several authors, some I know and some I dont. Are there any novels you can specifically recommend to Final Fantasy fans? IX or otherwise. I'd also love more videos from you and others comparing books to FF series jn future. Oh, and thanks again!
Thanks! I actually read a fantasy novel not long ago called The Lies of Locke Lamora by Scott Lynch which reminded me of Final Fantasy IX in some respects (the protagonists are a band of thieves who operate in a quasi-medieval world), so there were some parallels and I really enjoyed it. Aside from that I haven't read much fantasy lately aside from Neil Gaiman's work; Neverwhere, American Gods, Stardust and the Sandman graphic novels, all of which I liked, and also the cyberpunk novel Neuromancer by William Gibson, which was really crazy , but also enjoyable - all of these stories have a 'party' or 'fellowship' element to them, so are similar to FF in that respect.
9 has always been my
Favorite followed by 10
I can’t get over that you dropped in SDB and Sartre to describe Steiner, but it’s spot on! I haven’t properly played most of the FF games in years but it seemed like several of them, including this one, had a lot of latent anti-capitalist themes too, with the parallels between Mist power and steam power both being harnessed to manufacture soulless drones for a disciplined military/labour force. Might have to replay it to see how far that holds up.
Absolutely, I think a couple of games touch on these themes (Shinra's monopoly on the world's resources etc) but yeah FF9 deals a lot in industry, and seeing the mages being manufactured as a quasi-proletarian work force, and Vivi's questions around that definitely leans to a Marxist reading of the game. I also recall reading something like the greatest boon for capitalism is war - so Kuja as a weapons dealer making the mages aligns to that, though I can't remember the source!
@@AlleywayJack yeah VII is a good example. I’d love to see some Marxist analysis of other games if that’s something you ever come across. I’ve thought about doing research into it myself but my field is literature and I haven’t really got the background knowledge to comment effectively on video games. Gradually working my way through your older videos before I start on the more recent stuff you’ve posted but really enjoying your channel so far, well done :)
I loved ATE's
Me too!
Criminally underrated
@42:35 I thought freya did get a happy ending. She was with sir frately and his memories were slowly returning.
Yeah it was good they ended up together. I saw it as bittersweet, and I guess the longer term aftermath is left to interpretation
I loved the art style of this game. I wouldn't want it to look too realistic otherwise I feel like it would lose its charm.
If we ever got a remake (I personally hope not) i would like to see a nice blend between cartoony/realistic. Keep the playfulness.
I always thought FFIX would make an amazing anime series. Lol
Yeah I agree. The playfulness of the style is integral to the experience and game world I think. Not sure how well suited it would be to a remake, even voice-acting would change the experience of it. Funny you should say that about the anime, my friend recently got me into an anime called Seven Deadly Sins purely based on the face he thought the protagonist was a lot like Zidane in design and attitude, which was kind of true, ha.
I had to return to this comment. I just read they've announced FF9 as an anime series 😂
@@AlleywayJack I willed it into existence! ...I feel slightly God-like. Lol 😁
@@TheVeyZ lol godlike
(referring to the whole comment chain)
Freya reminds me of Eowyn from Lord of the Rings.
It became much easier to like Steiner when I started imagining his voice being played by Jim Cummings in my head as I read. Imagine Pete from Goofy Movie basically 👌
Edit: Pete but militaristic sounding, that’s exactly what he’d sound like 👍
I'm gonna have to listen to this lol
was wondering where ya been! glad to see ya again. you playin' RDR2 yet?! cheers
I've been absent precisely because I've started playing RDR2 lol... I was working through the story and then I tried out online mode, and have spent a LOT of time bounty hunting etc. It's a very nice game.
@@AlleywayJack haha that's grand. keep with the story as it gets masterclass! new video is great btw.
The characters are the best part of FF9. They are all fleshed out and well developed. Everyone has meaning, and everyone is fun to use. My only gripe with FF9 is the Final Boss.
Yeah, wasn't a fan of Necron either. Also the Trance system wasn't my favourite, but aside from this it's one of my favourite FF games.
What was it about necron that you didn’t like?
@@ItsSVO You don't hear anything about him until you fight him.
It's a pretty easy fight too.
@@RarelyEvenn the thing is you actually hear about him all game because necron is just death or death incarnate, the main theme of the game is life and death and mortality. You don’t have to think of him as the final boss in the traditional sense but death is rightly the last thing your party must overcome and show their will to live.
There are no hard final boss fights in the FF series tbh so that’s a criticism for all of the game not just IX in fairness
Why did you change the name???
I just wanted something that more accurately reflected the channel, but wasn't overly committal to Final Fantasy.
Bruh..... The name change is straight killing me.
Oh damn 😔
💕💕💕💕 Love your channel tho bro. 💕💕💕💕
The last good Final Fantasy.
You can hear the dried spit in this Guys mouth
brother why are adverts now.dropping every 5 minutes 🥲😭
every 5 minutes? wtf lol, I will look into that, I don't control their placement