Misfire Case Study (1999 Honda Accord)
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2024
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In Part 2 take questions from my students and really take this thing from start to finish on why I chose a particular test and how exactly to perform the test. I also show and discuss the compression waveforms that I took on this engine and why I came back to it being a fuel problem. These lecture videos (Part 2) will be in 3 segments and will be about 1 hour each. So there will be a ton of great information for those willing to learn and take your diagnostics to the next level.
For more information on this topic, I have written a “field manual” called Engine Performance Diagnostics which is available at www.scannerdanner.com as an eBook or paper book.
Want even more diagnostic training? Whether you are a DIY trying to fix your own car, someone looking to become an auto technician, or a current auto technician that wants to get more into diagnostics, subscribe to ScannerDanner Premium www.scannerdan... There is a 14 day free trial.
On ScannerDanner Premium I will bring you right into my classroom at Rosedale Technical College. You will find page for page lectures taken right from my book as well as exclusive classroom type case studies. What is so special about these classroom case studies? I pull live problem vehicles directly into my classroom and we troubleshoot them in real time, using and applying the theory and testing procedures we learn during the classroom lectures. There is no better on-line training of how to troubleshoot automotive electrical and electronics systems anywhere!
Disclaimer:
Due to factors beyond the control of ScannerDanner LLC, it cannot guarantee against unauthorized modifications of this information, or improper use of this information. ScannerDanner LLC assumes no liability for property damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this video. ScannerDanner LLC recommends safe practices when working with power tools, automotive lifts, lifting tools, jack stands, electrical equipment, blunt instruments, chemicals, lubricants, or any other tools or equipment seen or implied in this video. Due to factors beyond the control of ScannerDanner LLC, no information contained in this video shall create any express or implied warranty or guarantee of any particular result. Any injury, damage or loss that may result from improper use of these tools, equipment, or the information contained in this video is the sole responsibility of the user and not ScannerDanner LLC.
I have this car. I’ve learned a lot about it thanks to this video. ! My misfire was the distributor rotor, or (whatever it’s called!). I replaced that and the cap. And it fixed my problem! As you can tell I’m not a mechanic!
This dude has a real grip on modern engine management,you can see that with a true grasp on the basic fundamental principles .you can use logic and the process of elimination to save time and cut to the core of automotive issues. Thank you sir! Good day!
EXACTLY
This video is absolutely gold for me. I have a very similar misfire going on with my Honda im going attempt to identify using low tech strategies. Thank you for such a easy to understand, funny and knowledgeable video. Ill post a update
Your vids never get old, even the old ones. A lot of good auto channels out there, yours is the funnest.
I have the same issue. I figured it was the Injector by unplugging it from the back; the car showed no signs of rpm change. Great work. I'll go ahead and replace the injector :)
man you have no idea how much this video help me understand what was wrong with my accord thank you brother
at 11:40, the single cylinder misfire triggering multi-cylinder misfire code is very valuable. It gave me a hint to try to replace a ignition coil on a cylinder i found bad when the code P1399 was multi-cylinder random misfire. It fixed the problem eliminating check engine light and TCS light on my 2000 TL.
Thanks so much for posting this video.
You can sure tell the difference with these videos when a real pro is doing the talking. Thanks for a great vid.
Just watchd your video on the Honda injector problem, You come across as knowledgable and genuine, so thank yhou
Superb. I so enjoy it when these things don't go to plan (just like the real world Paul). But you got there in the end. True professional once more. And i learn some thing new at the same time.
This video didn't show the struggle I had with the fuel system. I tried and tried so many different ways to get my psi gauge installed and I failed.
Thanks so much!
Thank you sooooo much for posting this video, because of you I was able to fix my car. I sure wish I. Had you as a professor in Lincoln tech
This is the exact problem I have with my Honda and I haven't been able to identify any solution, I sure hope by the end of this I have found one!
It was a bad injector
That was great 👌
I'm doing some pro-bono work on my wifes cousins 1999 Honda Accord with same issue.
Weekend mechanic here using a 3160RS OBD2 analyzer that is telling me there's eight issues and three of them are missfire related (random).
3 plugs were burnt looking and one was dark.
All 4 had .060 gap instead of. 039-.043. I swapped out old ones for new NGK plugs.
Starts nice, idles rough... revs ok...sounds like it wants to die on rev down. Stalls easy.
(Standard trans)
Going to do those drop and compression tests next.
Thanks !
So much to learn from this... I am still a Carookie !Thanks.. uploader
Paul, I enjoy all your videos. Your live diagnostics videos the best. You can have a dead misfire like that with a intake runner gasket just leaking on that cylinder. You will not hear it and it will not show up in fuel trims. Poor a gallon of water on the intake and see if you hear it being sucked into the engine and you will see steam come out the exhaust. Typically the KV line will be higher on the cylinder with the intake runner leak. Thank you so much for all the great videos.
Absolutely my friend, and I love the water test too. I actually have a video on that here on RUclips on a Dodge Neon with a misfire. Intake Runner Vacuum leak (water test)
And I did check for this on this car, just forgot to mention it. Sorry about that.
I have one of these from 99 with the f18b2 vtec engine in it. F series engines are absolutely bulletproof
"massive misfire"
Starts it up, runs better than a new Chrysler.
Should have said Ford lol
This shows awesome perspective of what a technician faces in the field ... great video. I face this at work often. I recently picked up a Snap-On Verus and am working on my scope skills, but let me tell you. It is very difficult to do what you did without a scope. I would have sold the guy an injector based on the evidence, assuming all your parts are good, the process of elimination proves that it's an injector issue. Having the right tools for the job really makes the differences. Knowing how to use them, is what makes you a good tech.
Thanks Bro. Sorry I didn't go over the compression waveforms in this video. I was so drained by the end of it.
Deserves so much more views. Pure school.
Thank you! Glad you found me
These guys are awesome..they are really a trusted mechanic..good work man..it pays to do a good work so you can get recommend.
Dude, I thought you was crazy for pulling them wires off the distributor like that. Keep a test light near by. I learn something from you every time I stop by.
I love these shop call videos, good job ScannerDanner
I would be surprised if this is not a low fuel pressure problem, possibly a bad fuel pressure regulator great video and thanks.
That was very funny when the 'humble' message came up! I was thinking the video was a little long for a bad plug! Great video.
just watched it again after 8 years. the difference from then to now is obvious... :) :)
For sure my friend
Favorite bit: 22:06 - 22:08
Lol great video; Very helpful and insightful.
Another fantastic video Paul! Really enjoyed watching this and love these videos when you have problems like this. Really good to watch and we all learn something too!
love to see the final repair video.
Hi Paul. Sometimes you can't see the forest for the trees. It happens to all of us.
I diagnosed a car with clogged injectors a month or so back using what I learned from you by testing secondary waveforms.
Problem is there are so many ways to test, and so many different makes & models that doing this sort of work you are challenged everyday. But then, this is why we enjoy doing it. If it was easy every one would do it and get it right first time. As we all know this is not the case. Keep up the good work.
For sure man, I definitely had some tunnel vision on this car.
Thanks!
Hilarious I love it when stuff just keeps failing. Shooting the boot out was great. I think that's a compression tester adapter that you found in the number two hole I have one that looks just like it.
WOW! This is an excellent video. Your the man
I learn a lot
You're the man Scanner Dan!
GREAT VIDEO PAUL, LEARN SO MUCH SO MUCH STILL TO LEARN KEEPEM COMING
Great instructional video. I'm not a car/mechanic guy by any means. I own a 1999 Honda Accord and I'm now willing to get down an dirty to learn about how to fix stuff. Keep up the good work. You're probably the best technician I've seen online. I wish I knew someone like you. I could really learn a lot.
Thank you.
sick video gona diag my 99 accord tomorrow
LOL!! spacers and crap on the plug. OMG. I'm dying.
If only you could find the person who did this hack job with the spacers and anti-fowler and beat them. That's a new one for me. Ive never seen something so ridiculous as that. That person should never work on a car again in their life. My dad gave me a good bit of advice that went something like this.... "If you're experiencing new issues with something that are similar to the original problem, check the work that was done last and it's most likely the problem." Good video. I learned some things from it.
Nice video, a good realistic pain in the neck!
My 97' Odyssey 4 cyl. started missing. The plug wells were filling with oil from leaking gaskets. Sopped it out with paper towels and long surgical forceps. That was it. Runs perfect. Easy to do when needed. FREE.
Thanks Paul I really appreciate that pointer that will take me a long way thanks so much
I had one of these (1999 Accord) that had an stuck open injector. Computer was keeping an injector open all the time. It needed a new computer.
TestlightDanner lol I SAY THAT AFFECTIONATELY... LUV UR VIDEOS WATCH THEM ALL DAY!!
Hack a Billy mechanic lol
I've found that taking an old spark plug and wizo wheel 4 stripes makes a great thread chaser fill the sliced parts with grease to capture aluminum debris. This works with any bolt. Clean out cylinder head bolts into the block with an old bolt. Works on subframe bolts ECT... 3 or four slices up the side of the old bolt.
Was it just me who thought the compression tester was slow to ramp up? I had visions of VVTi issues. Another great video Paul!
learned lot from th video...THANK YOU!
Can't believe people actually do crap work like that and sleep well..
Another job well done Paul,
Thanks for sharing your experience
They don't care , as long as the car " runs" to sell at auction . Some wiseguy would SWEAR it was running PERFECT . They would put in parts from a BATHTUB if they thought it would work . They don't have a concept of what a lean misfire us . They they think it's like changing bulbs in a string of Christmas lights . Just keep putting in parts - ANY - parts , till it works . A plug is a plug - as long as it fires . We don't need no stinkin' heat range . Oh crap - the piston hit that LONG plug - it came out of a LAWNMOWER ! IDIOTS ! Shovel operator at horse stable !
I had a hard time not seeing you use an ignition scope and a vacuum Guage from the start. The cranking compressing test was good.
Another way to check for injector flow could have been to look inside the cylinder. With the intake valve open and activate the injector. Activating the pump if needed but residual pressure could have done it.
If it was a restricted injector, activating the injector manually while idling could have given it enough fuel to fire and sometimes clears out the obstruction.
A four gas analyzer would have gone a long way. I know you said you wanted to keep it low tech but that was agonizing.
Glad I watched it. Thanks for doing what you do.
bro this is a bad ass video. really like the attention to the detail of everything u looked at. got ur self a subscriber.
thanks Carlos!
Great videos man! I wish all mechanics were as thorough as you and Eric O. If only i could get one of you to diagnose my intermittent loss of power to passenger power window motor issue. I read something about a multiplexer that could be the issue.
Eric is a great guy to learn from too man. No doubt.
Love this video Paul,I thought it was just me that had grief with vehicles lol,must admit it looked like an HT problem though especially when you found that bodged up spark plug,I can't believe someone actually did that lol
Awsome vid man i had this same issue on a 93 civic 1.5 and yes it was an injector
Near the end you speak of finding lean misfires with secondary ignition waveforms. Do you have a free video with an explanation?
this one is the most hilarious video Ive seen , I can say that we Techs have encounter a car like this one, once or twice, I guaranty that some of us threw a tool or two at the wall . hahahaha
They were maybe trying to cool down the cylinder with the device and a big spark plug
I got a 2000 honda accord 2.3l vtec engine code misfire cylinder 1, new plugs wires cap rotor ignition coil
Engine code P1399 also shows
Engine light flashes
Egr cleaned
No vacuum leak
Throttle position sensor new
Idle air sensor new
Throttle body cleaned
Has strong spark on all cylinders
Pressure leak down test good
Could it be the fuel injector for cylinder 1
Thanks, man. I learned a lot. Liked and subbed. Looking forward to watching more of your videos.
I liked and subscribed because you didn't hold the answer for ransom. I appreciate that. I can't believe they shoved that Autolite in there. If that antifouler wasn't in play, I fear that could have been much worse.
Paul
You did say you wanted to not do a technical test. Just tried to keep it simple. Just to see if it could be diagnosed.
Hey Danner. I may be making a trip up to RTI soon. I'll call you when I know the date for sure. Hope all is well. Keep doing what you do and thank you so much for everything
Hey Bro. Thanks! Sounds good. Good to hear from you.
I have been getting caught up on a lot of your videos and I must say it's just like being back in your class. It's so awesome that this channel and the other paid channels have such a huge following. Who would have thought 5 or 6 years ago you would have the exposure that you do know. I am so lucky to have had you not only as the best best teacher I ever had but also you have always been someone I could look up to and call if I needed help or advice on anything. Thank you man.
B Carroll Cool man, I am glad you are watching. You always wanted to learn more and were eager to do so. That was obvious when you used to come to my garages with me, just for more knowledge. Hope things are going well with your new wife. Hope to see you soon. Definitely contact me first though. I took a term off at the school and won't be there until April.
Hey, nice to see you are human. We all suffer from brain fog at times when doing diagnosis. Sometimes when chasing my tail, i have found a dinner break does wonders.
+WyzeProbe i certainly am. Hey are you the designer of the WyzeProbe? I've used it in many of my videos. Great tool man thanks!
+ScannerDanner Yes I am the WyzeProbe designer. Thanks so much for your kind words. Can't wait to see more of your videos, they are a fantastic resource!
Great Video!!! I'm currently wrestling with my 04 mazda mpv that is giving me similar problems.
🌴🇵🇷 Hope you could make your next video on replacing cylinder knock sensor on the Honda Accord ex 4 cylinder Thank you for your video 🤗
Paul I appreciate for sharing this video, I think you have done right approach to this problem. I knew this car definitely misguided to you but you cannot ignore when you are looking for a problem you have found the first problem from a spark plug itself and second from the spark plug lead. I don't think you have done a wrong approach. If there is a simple problem, of course you have to solve simple problem first. For instance, if you can treat a problem with a medication why do you go for a surgery. Man made problem is always a complicated one then a natural problem.
Man you are awesome,just keep making video!
Thanks Dan. That was educational.
🌴🇵🇷 Hey thank you for making this video the is the model of my car Honda Accord ex 4 cylinder I have to replace the Cylinder knock sensor on it ..I did change the spake plug and wires also ❗ in the steering wheel belt... The Honda Accord ex are good car 🚗 doing maintenance on it key...👍🏽
Watching closely, it appears the P/S pump bearing might be going out(notice it wobbling a lot) within the first minute of this case study...or I'm just 'seeing' things. It may just be the camera angle. Honda clear flood mode-good luck, haha. Honda loves to blind rivet their TPS to their throttle bodies, sort of annoying. It is pretty well known in this industry that Autolite's are for Fords, come on now people. This is comical yet ridiculous. Another common sense straight to the point video, I love it Paul.
VERY EASY TO TROUBLE SHOOT STEP BY STEP GASOLINE ENGINE PROBLEM,EVEN WITHOUT SCANNER.
Oil blow by ..... anti fouler just moves the gap farther away from the piston ..then maybe the oil will not reach the gap as easy ... the gap is in a chamber that keeps the oil from reaching it .... it does work sometimes ..but the spark is a lot less efficient... by up to 40% ....
On most Honda’s, to prevent the car from starting, pull the efi fuse under the hood.
Pretty nifty. Lean from a bad injector, but wet plug from a anti-fouler and a short plug boot. Is that right? No wonder it was hard to diagnose
i recently bought your book, is a really nice and well explain book.. i just ran in a Honda Odyssey Missfire Cyl #5 that comes along with P0300 random misfire as well... i do all kind of test, spark, fuel injector delivery , swaps coils, swaps injectors, compression allacross, injector pulse, coil primary signal. intake gasket leak.. with no LUCK... i star scratching my head sooo badly . i was frustrated and i think what else can i do... and i dicied to remove the valve cover to see is there is valve calibration AND I WAS RIGHT!!! ONE OF THE 2 INTAKE VALVE WAS LITTLE TIGHT THAT CAUSE ME THAT MISFIRE... CALIBRATION ALLACROSS SOLVED MY HEADACHE.. how i recognice i tight valve Compression good and i ran leak down test and fine too... Thanks for the Book Danner
+Luis Sagastume only a running compression test would reveal that or a picoscope and pressure transducer in the cyliner. Thanks!
Only a great teacher would regret not capturing his accidental electrocution on camera. When you showed that spring I thought it was a helicoil. Fortunately not. It's interesting to see the strange things come out of used car dealer vehicles.The irony is that fixing the plug and wire correctly would not have taken much more effort. They were probably trying to get it out of the shop and they didn't want to wait for the right parts. Most of us would find that kind of workflow to be terribly dissatisfying....
The person that shimmed up the spark plug was a hack not a mechanic
8:00 I see stuff like that when I work on cars with CAI and loud mufflers.
I missed the annotation at the end that verified the injector WAS in fact the issue but would appreciate a response to my other question anyway.
Man Autolites in a Honda.. NGK only for those guys. Unreal
Have you ever Not been able to figure out the problem? and if so tell us why. Great video Cant wait for the lectures
Of course! I would be lying if I said no. But I have fixed them all in the end except for 2. One was a caddy that would intermittently blow the muffler apart every few days (pretty sure it had a worn distributor cam gear) and another was on a Ford with an EGR flow code, but that one was taken from me before I could finish it.
ScannerDanner lol when I was a kid my dad had a 72 F150 I would drive on the farm.. Going down hills I would shut the key off and pump the gas pedal 2 or 3 time and turn the key back on WoW that was loud My old man put 3 mufflers on before my lil brother told him what I was doing Lol
vacuum gauge is quick and easy to check for compression
Great and very clear info!!!! 5 stars!
You could have just swapped #2 and #4 injector? Then do a rpm drop test?
Classic scenario of "bad miss, should be easy, wont pull out the scope." Forty minutes later still scratching head on where to go. vs. "bad miss, go right to scope.' I think the scope wins on averaged time, all the time. So for me, if the visual doesn't clue me, out goes my scope and pick up. Took a long time to break my old habits of jumping too much. After all, we're not in the gym working out. Like you said many times, "time=money." And my pigs gotta eat. Wheek wheek
That was a good one, thanks
I sometimes use fuel augmentation to test for lean misfire.
I have seen this type of issue with Mitsubishi Lancer where the tube on the COP was to short and didn't reach the plug, the amount of parts replaced on this car before I got to look at it was ridiculous including cylinder head!!!
I alway tell people. "The simplest thing can always be the hardest thing to do". At least in this line of work
Great video, sir! To me, this video perfectly showcases the twists and turns of real world diagnostics. It's rarely as simple as one problem, or one failed part, especially when the customer/other shops have been involved.
I'm wondering what you're using for a secondary ignition pickup? I've just bought a combination COP paddle/wire clamp from AESwave, getting some practice with waveform analysis.
“Nice easy fix”. “Misfire monitors are unreliable and inaccurate.” I think that Honda from hell definitely heard you because it kicked your ass. Good job. I couldn’t have done better myself. Try to trust the computer a bit more though, even though it is a fairly stupid computer.
All the refinements(?) done by previous techs (?) would definitely throw off one's usual plan of attack on tackling this issue. I remember purchasing a used 1992 Stanza from a workmate which seemed to be decent vehicle and ran good. Problem was that it failed PA. Emissions for excessive Nox. I finally noticed it had the incorrect NGK plugs. The electrode reach was not correct.
exelent video. ..SD..... Tanks very much. ..
Number two spark plug's thread looked stripped off. Why in the world putting too many washers to make the spark plug fit this engine? that is funny.
Thank you for the video.
Using fuel trim to identify injector problem, man that would make for a good inclass simulation study..
It was probably the other way around. Auction cars always hide problems. You can shorten that plug wire after you install the non toilet fouler. They did it to hide it.
In a situation like this I would have ohm'd the injector, 9 times out of ten just checking ohms will be a dead giveaway. You could try some propane, carb cleaner or brake clean to see if it straightened out. If it straightened out I would have popped the rail up enough and if all the injectors were still in the rail Firmly I would have some one crank it over to see if the injector is firing or just swap the injector out as these are pretty easy.. Mac tools makes a banjo bolt with quick connect on it that screws into the filter. It comes in the basic fuel injection kit I think the whole kit was like 100 bucks and actually covers a lot of stuff. Very Cool how you used the lab scope but if your flat rate you gotta move a lot faster lol. The biggest problem with kids when they come from school is transforming into the working world which is 150% different from schooling.
Love all your vid's!
great video Paul. i am totally thrilled by your videos. Here in Greece the premium channel is not still available. any idea if it will be anytime is the short future?
very interesting video, thank you...
Man...some people shouldn't ever touch engines. What would make someone go thru all that trouble to save $6? Poor Accord!
I'm guessing plugged injector screen. Super common with the fuel in my area.
Hello Mr danner, I have been following your work for some time now.I am a trainee technician at ABM Motors in West london(United Kingdom).Here in England german diesels are the most common used(Audi,VW,Merc,BMW).How often do you diagnose no start conditions on german cars which are far more complex then American and japenese cars.Could you do a video on German diesels.
Mohammed Zaman Lol no they are not
my car did that clean egr ports fix