Aptera is basically an Italian exotic
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- Опубликовано: 20 сен 2024
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Extra solar panels
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More and more amazed by both content And sheer amount of content you create without missing a beat, or losing any relevance. No wonder they hold you in such high regard! Amazing stuff! Can’t thank you enough! Cheers mate!
What a jackpot in this interview, Thank You Steve! This news from Steve Fambro, although not yet confirmed, heavily implies that C.P.C. will be doing the aluminum casting for Aptera as well. This speaks to very high quality in the frame, suspension and belly pan components also! If C.P.C. is the investing partner, they may have the composites and casting tooling manufacture already under way, we can only hope! As the quality goes up, the production delay means less and less to me. Maybe more details and confirmation will come out in the webinar on the 20th, it should be exciting to find out.
IDRA and CPC have me impressed with Italian engineering
CPC makes so much sense...they will have the capability to spool up European assembly....aptera assembly line requires relatively small square footage. and CPC has a lot of floor space.
Yep, CPC for sure. I was thinking that it would make a lot of sense when the CPC thing was announced, and then subsequently the CPC sales director said they would be assembling the bodies at 'CPC Aptera' (which sounds like a JV to me). Also, when the EU variant is designed & ready, I bet that they'll also be doing the complete vehicle for the EU market.
If Aptera expanded another production line into Europe, they can avoid tarrifs for European sales.
Disagree on CPC’s role. Re: Aptera Principals. CPC & Elaphè, both as primary capital investors. Aptera represents comparatively high volume “bread & butter” revenues that will sustain their aspirations for advancing their technologies into other industries. E.g., I can see both having lots to do with VTOL. MEasterners, where both free oil & sunlight are in surplus, have lots of “strings free” petrodollars to throw at this. Yes, please “push” PPF over vinyl, at least as an option. CPC is making ALL of the fcf exoskeletons (in Sandy Munro terms) & extrusions will be rapidly & efficiently made in Italy, stacked, & shipped in crates to Carlsbad. No assembly by CPC. Motors & all else will be attached in Carlsbad where manufacturing is being optimized. However, ALL entire Deltas, from start thru all changes, including production jigs that will be replicated for use in Carlsbad, must necessarily need to be developed & proven at CFC, due to the highly specific requirements of the CPC made parts. This includes all safety testing being done in Italy whenever any significant changes are made, going forward. Think location independent design, engineering, development, testing, & manufacture.
@@Crunch_dGH Elaphe is a startup, and is probably having to chase funding as well, in order to expand production facilities into the USA for Lordsdown+Aptera. I don't think they'll have spare capital to invest into Aptera. If they had been an established company with capital to spare, then I think investing into Aptera would make sense for them. Hence why I think it is CPC who is investing.
(What does VTOL mean in this context? I am more familiar with the aviation meaning).
I wouldn’t look into the “vinyl” wrap as being confirmed by his comment. People commonly put those two terms together to describe a wrap, without really meaning to specify the wrap material/type.
Chris mentioned the revenue potential also in a previous video. I was happy to hear from Steve also. Not only the licensing but also some companies wanting Aptera to produce panels for them.
So no question - they are building the Aptera! … as they ordered and received in Italy highly expensive tooling steel blocks. It happens I could collect it in Italy.
I expect all sub-assemblies will come in as bolt-on modules, so the final assembly location(s) can be anywhere. And we’ll see them pop up in centralized locations around the country and the world in the coming years.
They are talking about having 8 final assembly locations worldwide, costing $60M each.
@@WyndStryke That would imply a maximum production of what, 160,000 vehicles annually. Monro projects over 300.000 or about double that will be needed to meet minimal demand. If you add custom fleet assembly - if say Hertz wanted 50,000 units, Aptera may build them their own assembly plant.
Personally, I'm expecting the mini-assembly plants to blossom to at least 50 locations world wide if not 100.
When smaller foreign nations - there about 200 nations worldwide and most can swing $60 million for an assembly plant - see they can build their own vehicles and don't have to pay the Seven sisters or the Cartel for 'mobility' ... they'll invest like crazy because it would help their balance of trade dramatically. ... to the point they'll start restricting even more the duties and costs incurred by those importing used ICE vehicles into their markets to consume gas and oil.
@@g.pattonhughes5991 Aptera themselves always seem a lot more cautious than Monro, I think they don't want to get caught out by overextending.
I hope they make them snap on. no tool required.
Aptera's killer application is the replacement of short haul flights. If they license FSD from Tesla and they can drive all through the night without assistance they'd be awesome.
I am more hopeful about Aptera's financing after listening to this interview, and that is probably the most critical factor at this point, because none of the next steps towards production can happen until investment pays for it. My guess is that the CPC Group is fronting the cost of the Aptera presses and manufacturing tools, just as Formosa and Chery (my guess) are doing. With the payoff for them coming with Aptera's volume production, and future business. Historically, American automakers who have outsourced body manufacturing to European vendors have not been profitable. With higher production costs and shipping delays. Of course global manufacturing has advanced greatly in recent years, but we have also recently seen the problems of international supply chains. If it all works, from the funding, to the overseas body/motor production, to the battery pack, solar, and outsourced HVAC, electronics and suspension, to the final assembly, then we will get a better Aptera in the end. This interview was informative, with both good and bad news. But it is still better to know Aptera's long term plan, than to keep guessing. I am looking forward to the webinar, just 4 days away.🌞
It really is crazy how hard it is to bring a vehicle to production, one would think 50 million would be enough especially for a simple vehicle like this. Hopefully it happens within the next year or so.
If they'd been able to use the powertrain from an existing vehicle, $50mil is probably doable. However, they've had to develop unique motors, motor controls and battery modules which are all expensive to do.
Feels a bit more like Cadillac Allante. Just hope it turns out better. Makes good senses to leverage the work they’ve done on solar to get the return on investment. Totally agree that CPC is the investor. Makes sense. If they expect to start validation testing mid-year I’m not expecting more than token deliveries before the end of 2023.
Win-Win partnership for both companies!
One thing about the wrap. I watched a video that said that the longer you leave a wrap on a vehicle, the harder it is to remove. It tends to bake on and comes off in small pieces.
That I didn’t know but could therefore be a good time to prior to the baking point, have it entirely removed & slap a freshly new design… thx
@@richierich440007 SLAP. hahaha S o EZ!
Remember though that with an Aptera, there won't be much wrap on horizontal surfaces since those are reserved for the solar panels. Most of the wrapped surfaces won't bake in the same way as horizontal ones tend to do.
@@jumpman83 That's true. I don't think it'll be a big problem for me anyway. I live in WI so, most of the year, it's winter.
Vinyl wraps are garbage (I make them, I know). Plan on replacing them every 3-5 years at most. If they used urethane, that can be extended a couple years.
I think Sand Monroes advice to jump right into production makes a lot of sense after hearing this .
Another great video. Thought about mentioning it to you on discord when it was dropped but, as usual, you were all over it. As a person who has ordered, here are my main concerns (with the obvious one of that they actually pull it off omitted):
-relying on suppliers for validation.
-part durability like the wrap when part of the point of ownership is to have it sit outside in full sunlight or ANY kind of daylight.
-financing an unproven product
-Insurance. Savage Geese mentioned how his insurance increased on his LC500 when insurance companies had to start paying for carbon fiber trunk lids, fenders, etc repairs. This is not to mention qualified people to fix or assess the damage when some plows into you while admiring your land-bound Cessna.
Again, I look forward to and look for your videos every day and much prefer your insights as to that of the AI voice vids others are inclined to make and get half of it right on a good day.
The BMW i3 had a carbon shell and car insurance on it was high $. I owned one. They usually totalled the car for even minor fender benders cause they couldn't fix the carbon shell
The full body assembly being done in Italy is very interesting. Curiously, this was the choice that Volvo made for the P1800 coupe in the 1960's. As much as the world changes, some things remain the same. The Italian's excel at tooling and small run design and production.
One of my favorite cars. Sadly, I only ever owned a 142 - not the same fun factor!
@Karl Jon Since they were originally planning to use 3D printed molds for vacuum resin infused parts, the capital requirements have increased dramatically. However, so will the throughput, allowing Aptera to scale much more quickly to meet demand, as well as increase the quality of the delivered vehicles.
Steve, based on my experience in supply chain and quality management of an international company, I think it would be very unlikely that C.P.C. would be attaching the Elaphe hub motors in Italy. The hub motors are a relatively expensive part that C.P.C. would probably need to purchase from Elaphe because of the requirements of international trade. To cover the cost of the inventory and material handling, C.P.C would typically add material overhead to the cost of the hub motors which would not be insignificant and from Aptera's perspective, not add very much value. It might make sense at some point for C.P.C. to do this, but due to the complexity and cost of such an arrangement, it would be after the supplier relationships were more mature.
Unless CPC is a major investor…then they have an even greater vested interest.
For comparison, cars with 2022 sales around 40,000:
Jeep Cherokee 40,322
Cadillac Escalade 40,250
Ford Mustang Mach-E 39,458
Chevy Bolt 38,122
And Aptera beats all of them.
Good info. Thx!
What caught my ear from hearing the whole thing was that tooling had begun. To me that's a big deal. Fambro said steel blocks from Germany had shipped to CPC for tooling. I'm betting CPC is funding this effort which in and of itself is sizable.
you don't by any chance know which company in Germany ist the subsupplier? maybe they are near to where I life (southern Germany, many car manufacturers around)
I never speculate without facts so I will wait until Aptera tells us who the major supplier is if they actually do release that information! Speculation sometimes leads to rumors which is not beneficial to anyone!
Does that mean that the vehicles for European customers will also be assembled in Europe? That would be FANTASTIC!! I live in southern Austria and would love to actually go to Modena and pick it up in person. And the drive back would be doable with less than half a battery charge...
I'm in Switzerland - hoping to do the same !
I predicted that after Jason's interview with that CPC guy. Now I consider this almost certain. I'll be getting my Paradigm Launch Edition Aptera together with my fellow American reservation holders, hopefully. I live in Greece.
Yes that would indeed be nice, I'm in Austria, too. I suspect final assembly will be in the US though, at least initially.
There isn’t a European version planned yet, sadly it’s to wide for legal driving in Austria
@@mcmurdostation7134 Aptera have been on record that they would indeed get the Apteras into Europe due to a regulatory opportunity that eases the legal homologation requirements if you only import a small amount of cars (I believe it was sub-1000, a regulation apparently aimed at low-volume sports cars and such things). For me this was the main reason to become an investor and place a pre-order, as I would actually be able to get the car delivered here. Also, I'd be very surprised if Aptera would design and build a car that generally could never be sold in Europe... That would be a bit of a hard sell to their investors I would imagine.
THANKS AGAIN FOR SHARING THIS WITH US 🤗💚💚💚
Ditto for the invested supplier as CPC. They saw a huge global market demand (vs their usual suspect Italian exotic brand clientele) for such a solar EV . Being based in Motor Valley of Italy is also a natural fit. Close also to another vital supplier Elaphe at Ljubljana next door to east.
The CPC and Elaphe factories are 429km apart by highway with a drive time of 4h 12m according to Google maps.
Makes sense to do the major weight lifting in Europe and do the finishing touches in the US.
I'm not at all surprised by Vinyl wrap despite your earlier video. I do think PPF would be better, but thats something that can be done by the owners if desired.
A lot of (reoccurring) cost associated with this!
I very much suspect that saying 'vinyl' is habitual from their search for the final finish product and that they will be using PPF. It would not be the first time that he has misstated something - they are really busy and mental slips like this will come through.
Hearing that final assembly will only take about 300 workers to produce 40,000 vehicles a year, is encouraging. It should alleviate the worry that start up cash burn could use all available fund and risk bankruptcy or loss of control of the company. If you take 300 workers at a pay of one hundred thousand dollars per year that is 30 million dollars. A full production of 40,000 vehicles selling for 40 thousand dollars would bring in 1.6 billion dollars. Even if the start up difficulties led to only 20,000 vehicles the first year that is still 800 million dollars. Looks like that is plenty of room for error and still get positive cash flow. That looks like a safe investment to me for someone with deep pockets.
12 minute tac time...
Tac time is the pulse of manufacturing. It's the drum beat of when each finished vehicle pops out of the factory.
60 min / 12 tac = 5 per hour.
5per hour * 8 hours = 40.
It all follows.
I'm REALLY looking forward to holding the smiling bear's face in my hands while pressing on the + pedal!
I would think you would add the suspension & wheels after the vehicle was delivered to CA. You want to be able to pack the container as tight as possible and having the wheels sticking out there would make that difficult. For a car you could use role on roll off ships, but if the car can't move on its own, that would be difficult.
Assembled body with wheel motors from Italy may cause a US import tax on the vehicle. This is a gray area with the US government on what they decide is a partial assembled vehicle. Could add unplanned cost.
The thing that worries me, is why hasn't anyone rich pumped in like 50 million themselves
A lot of rich people don't like to have their activities public. I think we are seeing actions such as the steel for the tooling being delivered to C.P.C. from Germany that may be telegraphing some successful efforts.
Looking at current and projected dollar strength, makes sense to take advantage and offshore as much as possible. They are trying to retain as many preorders as possible. So if you can take advantage of currency fluctuations/arbitrage to keep initial production costs down, even if it means punting on IRA credits, it’s the smart move. If you can offshore a vehicle at a $45K sticker, vs onshore it for $57K w/ a $49.5K walk out, the $45k option makes more sense. And that’s without taking into account the benefit of Other Peoples’ Money and scalability benefits.
As the line scales and generates free cash flow, in concert with CPC, they can onshore production when the domestic interest rate/economic environment make it apt to do so.
3D, if not 4D chess gambits for sure. Best I’ve felt about my deposit in ages.
Cheers for all you do to keep us informed Steve!
I listened to the interview. Steve, if you do a Zoom interview, I know that it is a bunch of extra work, but it really improves the sound if you have each participant record the interview locally and then edit those local recordings together. (also, if you ask three questions together, you are probably only going to get one of them answered)
The CPC partnership makes lots of sense and if CPC is willing to upfront a huge part of the money needed to go into production, that is great. One thing occurred to me when I listened to the podcast the other night was how this will play out with the DOE loan. The amount of involvement that CPC is a part of, likely disqualifies them from the loan. If more than 50% of the vehicle is assembled in Italy that makes it kinda tough to say that the final assembly is in Carlsbad, CA. It doesn't seem to make sense to ship a battery to Italy and then ship the vehicle back to the US. For EU markets, it does make sense but the EU customers at this point is relatively small compared to the US. There is also a bit of fine print to the CA grant and that money can only be used for specific purposes. It now makes lots of sense why Aptera has not applied for the DOE loan and say they are working on that now. Remember that the loan would not have diluted our investments. If a group of people invest $150M which is what I have been saying they really need, our investment value will definitely be diluted very significantly. Of course, if they don't come up with the $150M, our investment is likely gone.
I think your timeline of production in 2024 is unfortunately more likely than us seeing any vehicles in late 2023. Aptera has been working with CPC for nearly a year at this point and I truly hope they were aware of the real timeline. I am not thrilled with the thought that Aptera knew the timeline and let us believe we might see a production vehicle at the end of 2022 or even a Delta vehicle. They did not say they were going to produce either in 2022, only that it was their intention or that they were tracking towards it, leaving us to think that it was a possibility. It was never a possibility. Now the challenge will be keeping the interest of 40,000 people for at least another year, assuming they have a source of funding that allows for progress to production in the next month or so.
It would also be a good idea for Aptera to update their website to use the Delta design when ordering a vehicle instead of showing the Alpha. They could easily send out a notice that informs pre-order holders that Aptera has updated their pre-order to more accurately reflect the production intent vehicle customers can expect. Some things like L2 autonomy might also be shown as an option but as a future upgrade or not released with the initial version of the vehicle though they now have another year to work out the details of L2 autonomy. They also have a year to work out the issues with providing a heat pump instead of resistive heating and AC. Resistant heating and AC to a lesser extent will kill the range when we have a 41kWh battery or less.
I would love to have a heat pump instead but they’ve (Steve and Chris both, I believe) have been pretty clear they have not gotten the suppliers and integration done and will not make it in the early machines, if at all.
@@scottgabbard662 yup, they said likely 2 years. It will be 2 years by the time we start seeing production. Last year and this year. Realistically, it will be 2024 before we see vehicles in our driveway.
No, Aptera did not make us believe they were going to produce vehicles in 2022. As you said, they only declared their intention to do so, and people chose to be overexcited instead. I was one of the few people making pessimistic predictions and cautioning reserved expectations. Now folks have to manage their disappointment.
I wonder if the decision to sell their solar panels is an effort to qualify for the DOE loan ?
Did you miss the part about Aptera purchase of (2) very large blocks of tool steel from a company Germany to form the CPC body parts 6-8 months ago?
BTW, there is a new room temperature molten salt battery that is 4 times energy dense compared to lithium ion. It's early in development and does have other issues, but it is promising.
The Italian Manufacturing base makes me a little worried with the current "Supply Chain Issues" everyone seems to be having. Can they get parts shipped on time?
It seems that Aptera went to CPC to solve a supply chain issue.
Although is does bring up the observation that a good portion of the vehicle is being manufactured outside of the U.S..
It does amuse me that, not only is the Aptera wider than a Lambo, but it body is being made by Lambo's supplier.
As I understand it, the intent is to produce about 40 cars a day. How is it that some of us in the remote state of Oregon would be able to get anything in the new year time?
This will be largely dependent on when your order was placed, and if you could travel to the factory for pickup.
Great information! With so much flooding in California, I started looking at this vehicle a little differently. I bet this car will do better that a tesla if caught in 2 feet of water.
Water damage is not the concern. Aptera will float in two feet of water, and if you are driving you could lose control.
Please do an episode about car washing options for the Aptera.
This news makes me feel more confident that the plan is coming together. I was worried about the software, but there’s a hint there that it will be a third-party OS. If it was Apple’s, that would be a hoot, but I give that a 0.5% chance. Major component procurement and assembly in Italy seems logical. I’m not bothered so much about the vinyl. If the film wears out in a few years, it’s an opportunity to give your vehicle an updated look, and choose whatever coating you feel is best for you.
Aptera has said the OS will be Linux based. If it is based on Apple, that will cost a great deal and not be an open system as Chris and Steve has suggested. (Steve was clear to point out that certain parts of the UI will not be open to customers from a safety standpoint.) Chris has also stated that there is a Canadian company that is developing the software. I wish I could remember the company he said at Fully Charged or the Ambassador's reveal of Gamma. (There are several things that I am looking forward to programming into the Aptera, like presence sensing.)
After the vinyl wears out I might go with a diy peelable dip kit, which can be had for like 300 bucks.
Choosing the best balance between Italian Makers and the UAW, Between Shipping Nearly Whole Vehicles versus stacks of Panels, gonna be Difficult! Still Hoping for the Best! I am Hoping for a Resounding Commercial Success, but if it is Like DeLorean, Cadillac Allante, Chrysler Maserati, Facel Vega, Jensen Interceptor, Iso Grifo, et al, I STILL Want My APTERA!
The trouble with those vehicle failures was too many 20th century cooks stirring the soup. The fact that big auto part suppliers need large volume was part of their demise.
Regarding the “vinyl wrap” comment: I don’t put too much confidence in the assured accuracy of these sort of ad hoc word choices. I don’t pretend to know what they currently plan to use, but I bet the words “vinyl” and “wrap” have been uttered so many times already that simple habit drives their continued use; accurately or not.
If it is still vinyl, I am not sure that will be all the problem that so many predict. With PV composite panels and glazing dominating the up-facing surfaces, the wrap covered surfaces will be mostly side-facing and thus subject to far less intense sun exposure.
All this remains to be demonstrated. I remain eager to participate in the experiment.
I agree. Sort of like Xerox meaning photo copy a couple of decades ago.
With several F1 teams having operations in Italy as well as super cars the technology must be pretty advanced there. It is no surprise so much of the car is be built and assembled there. Hopefully that means easier distribution to European customers sooner rather than later.
Bet the early Europeans among the first 100 Apterae reservation holders will be getting their orders together with their American counterparts.
Aerodynamic is. use the air to generate electricity + panels very useful ❤
I'm super excited about the collaboration with CPC. However I'm disappointed that I probably won't get my solar EV dream machine until 2024.
In the long run its best. We are going to get a quality vehicle for an affordable price that can rapidly scale up production for the masses.
Who knows...Maybe CPC will eventually build a plant in the US like Elaphe plans to.
Aptera planned on delivering vehicles in 2021 and then in 2022... Best said plans. Until Elaphe or CPC actually build plants in the US, I would not hold my breath on this as much as I would like to see these plants. It really needs to be in the benefit of Elaphe and CPC to establish a US plant. Establishing a US plant can be extremely expensive. Yes, I am aware of the Lordstown and Elaphe agreement but those motors are not for Aptera.
Massive vehicles are painfully inefficient for passenger vehicles and couldn't agree more that that's going in the wrong direction. Trucks are not for commuters and it's a shame that they're still marketed fiercely to mostly Americans. Part of the "paradigm shift" ought to be the reprogramming minds of adults to get away from being so wasteful. I trust that this will come natural to upcoming generations. We must understand that we are sharing this earth with others, past present and future, and we must respect this 🌎 and who lives here. Humankind are merely a part of the earth. People need to see that.
Thanks for a great update! Not sure if someone has asked this before (I'm sure they have and I just missed it) but, what about a front license plate? I was thinking they could make a inset section with a clear plastic cover that follows the body lines to maintain aerodynamics while still have a front plate.
Cars may need a front license in some states but isn't the Aptera classified differently?
@@paulchristenson5256 Due to the autocycle or motorcycle designation there are no US states that require a front plate for the Aptera. I can't speak to all international markets.
Supplier investor could be Maxion, especially if they are going to joint venture the liscensing of the solar mobility. IMO, it's the combo of high efficieny cells, great encapsulation, and wiring / charge controling that will be their selling point to potential customers.
I am a fan of the Italian specialty Automotive Industry and think CPC is the right move. Shipping is a real problem and contributed to DeLorean's demise. Although the Aptera is a bit wide for European inner cities, it might be best to do an initial release there to maximize a very tight link between the initial user experience and the factory. After acceptance and process are proven, transfer mfg. to N. America paying particular attention to total factory costs when choosing a site. Perhaps a port city on the east coast with direct rail line to San Diego to minimize costs and maximize marketing potential. Use Tesla's direct marketing approach.
OK, So I pose this question. Why not assembly the Aptera with minimal components to make to movable on wheels under its own power. Basically, a shell with wheels, steering wheel, and small temporary battery. Now you move from a ocean containers to RoRo Car Shipping (Roll-On Roll-Off). Shipping hundreds of vehicles at once. instead of 6-8 per container. Once received at Carlsbad the final assembly is completed.
Aptera did clarify a while back that the BINC was being assembled in Italy, and then shipped (shortly after the interview with the CPC sales director). Although I do find it a bit weird, since shipping would probably be cheaper the other way.
The castings can be stacked tightly. There's a Munro video where he received a car frame as a gift from CPC. The whole body casting was split into 6 pieces that you can click together.
@@karlschleifenbaum5793 that's not what they're doing with Aptera though and that's what I find weird as well. They're assembling the 6 parts together first then ship them.
@@my2cents795 oh OK, I didn't know that
@@my2cents795 I think the idea is, if there's any kind of problem they can correct it right away in Italy, rather than ship a bunch of parts to the US and then find a problem with really no way to fix it here in the US. So...we'll all be driving Italian supercars, I'm cool with that. 😂😂😂
@@p0kerp1aya I guess that makes sense. But would this mean this is only a provisionary because early Deltas are prototypes ? because once everything is set in stone and full scale manufacturing starts, I don' t see where the error might come from.
If these are built in Italy, it may prevent us from getting Federal or State EV credits.
Wow, it really sounds like it's all going to work .
Wondering if the Aptera will still qualify for any of the tax incentives with this sort of massive outsourcing. Not sure this is very reassuring.
Let’s just say it doesn’t at this earlier point since it’s a unicycle/ tricycle & from what we’ve been knowing, there hasn’t been (YET) a provision for 3 wheelers. I believe by the time it gets near production time, 3rd or 4th QT 2023 or even 1st QT 2024, there will be (upon all later crash testing) both state & federal tax deduction provisions made. HOPEFULLY 👊
The answer is no, not so much because of the outsourcing, but rather simply because of something that should matter a whole lot less: it has only three wheels. The requirement for four wheels is explicit in the text of the legislation; no doubt at the behest of legacy auto manufacturers seeking to reserve the benefits for themselves and their mainstream auto designs.
@@joelsmith4394 With the help of the filthy Government.
The government is not here to help you.
these exotics usually are 6 figure vehicles and more, if aptera can do that at nearly a quarter that, that is very lean manufacturing, i hope they can do that, and be profitable, time will tell.
Just cos the vehicle is prices at 6 figures doesn't mean that it costs anywhere near that much to build- ruclips.net/user/shortsg7R4_rMvXEQ
Development and company operating costs make up a lot more of the price of the car from a low volume manufacturer.
I will take mine wrapless....maybe even get a credit for the option delete.
That's a good idea, though, maybe the composit needs the wrap for UV protection.
I wonder if that will be possible. I'd like to see what an unwrapped Aptera will look like.
Hmmmm. Roller and some roof paint or a fine brush and lacquer like the model T?
Seriously, maybe I'll just plasti dip it myself...
@@JohnboyCollins Rattle cans have made incredible strides in the last decade.
I must not be cur out to be a billionaire, because I’d give them $50 million in a heartbeat.
Go back to the assembly line video...there is no space for sub-assembly assembly. The CA space is simply putting together all the sub assemblies.
Thanks Steve, your videos get better and better.
Two things come to mind. If the major assembly is to be done in Italy does Aptara need as large a facility as they have? Given that Apteras don't have to meet the stringent demands of other vehicles, why can't they start production before all the testing is done?
I still think, though I don't know the details, shipping the parts here and doing the assembly makes more sense to me. Aptera would have better quality control.
Aptera has always said that safety is one of their primary two goals. The design has been far more advanced than minimum standards from the beginning.
Aptera’s main facility is not really that large; I don’t think a smaller one would work. When I visited it was pretty empty, but here’s the section where they were working. This represents perhaps 25% of the total space.
Update - I was unable to post that photo here. My apologies.
@@stevekenyonmusic Yes. I visited when they first started renovating the space. Both the nearby solar and battery assembly plants are larger.
Every time Chris or Steve say Vinyl Wrap, I wonder if they are using it as a generic term for wrap, or if they really mean vinyl wrap. First, they need to decide to use PPF, and second, they need to be deliberate and consistent about delivering that information. There is an opportunity to clear this up in 5 days.
Agreed, but what's been shown so far has been vinyl (junk)...
I posted this question for the webinar a couple of times (yesterday & a few days ago). Fingers crossed that they see it and answer it. PPF is the one which most closely matches what Aptera have been saying about the durability etc.
My thought is they have been using vinyl wrap for all the prototypes because it is cheaper for proof of concept. Plus people use vinyl wrap generically. Similarly to using Novacaine as the numbing agent dentists use. Novacaine hasn't been used since the 60's when Lidocaine came out. Not sure what they use today.
I find it hard to believe with all the material engineering going into this vehicle, they would use junk material for the wrap.
@@LarryDickman1 Well, they answered my question, it is most likely to be 3M 2080 wrap to be specific. I'd have preferred to have seen them use PPF instead. 2080 seems to be a dual-layer wrap (i.e., a very thin protective film layer over the vinyl to protect it during installation).
Hope they offer a polished carbon fiber option. I know it looks cool. There may be negatives for exposed carbon fiber that i don't know about.
Great info, thanks for the updates!
More than the panels, like this channel has covered, it’s also the control technology behind turning the solar harvesting on and off.
Bread crumbs - Aptera from California is in Italy now, Aptera to get batteries from EVE Energy of Taiwan, StoreDot is working to produce fast charging ev batteries and has a joint venture agreement with EVE Energy, StoreDot to build battery plant in
Italy and has a research hub in California, mmm...
Really interesting. Thank you!
My PPF guy says one can apply PPF to vinyl film, just as to paint. Just consider vinyl film soft paint (like the earlier Tesla paint.)
I wonder if cpc was making the carbon parts for bmw i3 that was discontinued in 2021? If so maybe they have some available capacity that Aptera will fill.
Italian Futurismo!
I’m still not sure about which wrap they’ll be using. There’s still quite a bit time left until the Aptera is rolling off the line and a lot can change by then.
Seems like they will do assembly for European deliveries at the CPC factory, implying the core aluminium structure, battery and interior will be shipped from Dan Diego to Turin and reverse for the US- market. I'm willing to travel to Turin as it's 1120km which is the perfect roadtrip to take delivery of my new Aptera.
1120 km? Where are you based? I am only a hop across the Adriatic sea to Brindisi. I am in the seaport of Patras, the gateway to Italy from Greece.
I get the impression the aluminum structure will be made in Italy as well
@@adimchionyenadum2962 I live in The Netherlands. I have visited Patras many years ago and sailed to the islands. Nice place!
@@LanderMaybe I just read that two presses or some parts like these have been bought in Germany, to be delivered in Italy, by Aptera. But judging from the look of the aluminium base it's not machined but rather cast so that would corroborate your implication.
I hope it will be as it's produced on the EU mainland and easier for me to acquire as it doesn't need two way shipping.
Lots of new wrinkles in the little gray cells this morning. I'm really surprised. Thanks for the update. Sounds like we've stopped being concerned about the IRA.
We might see the early test vehicles all being built in Italy, perhaps even the Paradigm Edition?, but then full production here in the US.
My guess is that there will be test vehicles assembled in Italy, but I think Paradigms will be put together in California as the US factory team is trained. They are already testing the production software in California now.
So the solar panels will be made here and the battery packs. As they have already ordered the tooling to make those packs in mass with 40 packs per day. Which could be increased to 80 with a second shift. Would expect the solar factory to be much more than just their body at some time. The body, skateboard, mounting of lighting, suspension and motors assembly will be in Italy. Some questions that might be asked next Friday, will the wheels and tires be installed in Italy also? Might make sense for shipping? Do they have a supplier for the motor inverters? Does the charging inverter have diodes in it? How does the use of CPC effect parts supplies for repairs? What type of wrap will be offered and will that be done in the US?? Still does not sound like 3M would be interested given volume. Hope to watch the event but might not be able to.
"Do they have a supplier for the motor inverters?" Aptera has already announced that they are going with their own, higher end motor inverter than what Elaphe would have supplied, so I think the answer to this question is yes.
I hope you supply your questions to Aptera ahead of the seminar.
I'm not a climate person (I don't even recycle), I have not ever owned something like this, I'm only wanting this because it seems cool and I really want this vehicle because it seems so independent from plugging in and of course traditional fuel stops in any form. It just looks fun, I bet I get 100 smiles per mile. I feel like what I have seen is this vehicle that it wont even need to be plugged in all that much, because of the solar charging system. One dumb question I have is; while this is sitting in my driveway will it have dual charging capabilities? i.e.; solar AND plugged in? I am all in, I invested and have a reserve. I cant wait.
Might be of interest to some.... You can find supplier info for companies on importyeti ... Enjoy :)
Can you make it over speed bumps with those fenders?
My wife and I both hit speed bumps during our demo rides over a year ago. The fenders rise with the tires. I don't think speed bumps will be an issue. There will be situations where care needs to be taken, just as with many small cars on the road today with low front air dams.
I love this fine aerodynamic design and are you using the axial flux motor with flywheel technology with a rear wheel for self charging technology and the graphene battery for electrical storage efficiency and what about a flying aptera ?
Disagree with you about the motors being included in the Italian assembly for a couple of reasons including uncertainty about two or three wheel drive for any given chassis at that point, adding electrical assembly to an otherwise purely mechanical assembly process, and that it is likely still efficient to ship the motors directly to Carlsbad.
All outsider speculation, of course. We will see.
Man, gotta say... Seeing b-roll of the Alpha vehicles makes me kinda sad the shape changed with Gamma. It was so sleek before! The new shape may be aerodynamically more efficient, but the Alpha shape is gorgeous.
I don't see any deliveries on thing till 2024 or 2025, don't no none hold their breath getting this anytime soon.
I think the term vinyl wrap is this going to be a Is generic term at this point.
So if a greater amount of the vehicle is assembled by CPC, that would mean less assembly work needed at the Carlsbad facility. Potentially increasing the daily production rate. What say you?
Just meant to be constructive, but the title of this video was off putting as I thought this was going to be a subjective fanboy discussion. In reality it was super informative and I wish I didn’t skip it until now.
I don't find the vinyl wrap a bad option, relatively cheap to replace, and there are so many available aftermarket that you will be able to make your Aptera really yours.
Have you priced out a total vehicle wrap, and doing it every 3-5 years?
@@ssoffshore5111 not in the last year. Was looking at one for my Volt, but a deer solved the issue, and the body shop.
Could be CPC, or Elaphe, CPC makes more sense. Aptera is too small for most of our other suppliers for us to inspire them to make a large investment.
Elaphe if also a startup and doesn't have any excess cash I would think
@@ApteraOwnersClub if they do some the workj in america they get federal 7.5k usd for buying electric american made car
After watching Jason Hill's video with that CPC guy, I predicted on this channel all that Steve Fambro just confirmed. I even put a bet on the fact that CPC Group was in as a partner and investor.
Great work, Steve! This is all starting to come together and to make sense, but has that scary big price tag! I wish Elon would just hand Aptera about half that $50M; I'm sure other money would follow quickly.
Keep Musk out of this !
@@ericstarmer7779 Elon is the reason there is an EV industry and suppliers to draw from.
Him getting involved is great way to get me to cancel my preorder.
Ok, so tell us why specifically.
@@jamesengland7461 ruclips.net/video/RlL4xvn6xWE/видео.html
Elon is not your friend. Nor has he invented anything, didn't found tesla, didn't invent the roadster, didn't come up with the idea for reusable rockets and we both know he didn't do any of the math involved. I'll believe he had a lot of input for the cyber truck, otherwise pretty sure he's just taking credit for smart people he pays. Now he's trying to control areas of public discourse for his own ends. Don't fall for the marketing, he spends as much advertising himself as any of his projects, the image you have in your head is a product you've been sold.
When is the due date again for this mouse? 2024? Is it good in the snow? $70 prerder, kool! A/C?
Due date won't become clear until we know the financing is in place. That is the key gating issue at present. I live in Iowa and plan to use my Aptera year round. The ABS/traction control can detect wheel slip and adjust torque 32 times per wheel revolution - about every 2.5" of tread travel. I think that with proper snow tires or chains that it will do very well. I will report on the snow performance of an early model.
AC is present and will be use both for the cabin and to cool the batteries when the vehicle is stationary during charging.
CPC buying tooling for stock makes sense. Another possibility is the battery company in Taiwan. They have deep pockets.
It is a title like this RUclips video that could lead Fambro and Anthony to raise the prices of the Aptera. Maybe do a video on how Tesla by lowering their prices will and should challenge they’re competitors like Aptera to be more competitive in their pricing.
I saw a news article a couple of weeks ago, that said Tesla changes its prices based on the competition. Tesla cars tend to be right in the middle for pricing. A lot of lower priced ev's were announced and made available for purchase in the last quarter.
I don't think Aptera is pricing their vehicle in the same way.
Nice pep talk. I really want to see Aptera succeed. I've reserved two.
However, I thought they had their funding to see them to production. Financing is what killed them on their first try. Even Henrik Fisker said to succeed you need to have your financing upfront to see you to production. That and they didn't make their projected goal to start production in 2022. All in all, it doesn't look good. I hope I'm wrong.
I think you are missing some details. The first time, their partner, Idealab, brought in management from Detroit that wanted to build a more conventional car than what they were hired for. They kicked the founders off the board in 2009, and were unable to raise funds for their alternative vision, and liquidated the company in 2011 because of it.
The primary reason for not starting production in 2022, was a surprising increase in pre-orders. Aptera had expected a total of around 3-4,000 units, which they were going to produce using vacuum resin infusion. This is how the prototypes were produced showing that they had the capability. The close to 40,000 pre-orders is what impelled Aptera to shift course and go to much more expensive tooling so that demand could be met.
This will mean both an increase in production rate, and a major increase in quality. It is ultimately good news, even for those of us at the beginning of the line that will have our deliveries delayed.
The only bad news is I'm not sure I can maintain this level of hype for another 2 years before I get my 'pterry.
Have faith. Some of us have been following Aptera closely since they restarted as a company.
Because paint last so much longer when the vinyl fails I guess I’ll have to get it painted. Even if it’s 50% more to do so.
I wonder why they think Saudi investors would be interested in Aptera. You would think they would hate this vehicle with a vengence, since it threatens the business model.
Saudi Arabia realizes that oil is running out and that they need to diversify which is why Saudi Arabia has invested in lucid and a bunch of other green tech
honestly a great car and concept but they need a four door sedan. if the goal of evs is to get less cars on the road with only 2 seater evs theres gonna be lots more cars on . the road since it can only carey two people at a time.
“Aluminum castings…” lends credence to the notion that that’s what the under-carriage/frame is made up of.
That and front and rear suspension arms
Another push back for delivery. And 40 units a day for how long. The almost 40,000 orders will take years to fill.
For about 3 months on one shift, and then they ramp up to 80 units per day with two shifts.
@@adimchionyenadum2962 Yes. And soon multiple similar factories will be started - both in the US and in other countries.
what color are the body panels in their raw state? Maybe we don't want or need any vinyl film or PPF...
Needed to prevent slow UV damage.
An Italian Exot that not allowed to drive on the roads in Italy
How would you get the vehicle repaired if you live on the east coast?