recently started watching this channel, ive got to say its easily my favourite fitness channel I've been using some off your drills and exercises for my rugby preseason and have already seen so much improvement in balance and coordination and agility. Would love to see some backline focused rugby videos, other than that thanks for the great content, I just wished more of the products you advertised could ship to Australia.
This is really interesting. I went from a 315 1rm back squat to a 365 1rm back squat at the same bodyweight, and my vertical jump improved drastically. All of my squat training in that off season was done with bands as well so I wonder if that had an impact on the results.
You said off season squat training, so we can assume you are an athlete who does dynamic training regularly during the season right? Maybe it has an impact as well, if those who participated never did jump training even before study...hmmm... P.S. I think there is no doubt that bands did the work! Well done really, smart!
Great job Coach!!! I have been training for nearly 40 years (53 yo) and I have my masters in exercise physiology. I felt like I was back in class listening to my professors while watching this. Really solid work here...I just clicked subscribe!
I always do full range of motion with both front and back squats, I recently started pin and quarter squats. I do feel like they have helped my dip and drive for the jerk.
So happy to have seen how your channel has grown. Cannot stress how much I love this channel and the consistency you bring with every video. Big ups my man!!!!
What a great study; I would have liked to know this 20 years ago, or even 40 years ago. I get you are very focused on power and speed. However some of the reasons I moved to lower range of motion (more than quarter, but not deep) squats was there were a bunch of studies "in the last century" which did show that whatever angular range of motion you trained in a joint led to an increase of about 10-15 degrees more angle for strength. And that might still hold up in comparison to this study, since quarter squat doesn't seem that close to deep - which would predict what was observed in the study - not much improvement. However squatting "parallel" is not that far from deep, so maybe that is not directly countraindicated by this study. I suppose they went for quarter squats for a reason, but it sort of means the "parallel" case is in limbo? I suppose a collateral question for study would be like considering rack pulls as opposed to full deadlifts. I do think a lot of people would be surprised if there was no hypertrophy from rack pulls. But isn't that what you might expect from the results of this study? One of the reasons we avoided "full" range of motion was studies that showed that full load and full range of motion was risky (i.e. why some people don't "lock out" at the top, squat all the way even if they squat deep, etc.) That doesn't appear to have been something this study observed. That old rule would have predicted full movements provide improvement in limited movements, but that the limited movement they used here is too limited to improve results at the extreme angles. We also spent a lot of time wondering about what Escamilla et. al. (pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11404665/) meant since that was one of the few studies we had back in the day. Another point is that to get full range of motion, we figured that copious unilateral work was a better bet, since you don't need the same loads. I bet heavily on unilateral lifts about 15 years ago and think that was a good move. All my heavy bilateral squats since then have been box squats with full relaxation on the box, with depth just about exactly parallel. All the deep squats I've done in that period are unilateral (mostly Bulgarian). Do you think reserving full range of motion to unilateral exercises would be a mistake? In any case it's too late for me, my college athletic "career" (fencing) was in the 1970s. So yeah, I used to be really interested in jumping performance (although not the one you usually think about) but my high impact days are pretty much over now.
Appreciate the science based approach you take Dane! Athletes can take your work to heart because you apply the science to your programs to build Olympic level athletes.
That was a really fkng good video. You guys made a study that's usually pretty boring to read into a very easy to understand video. Thanks for the great content!
Based off of how the first study turned out, to me it seems like the quarter squat group might just be the most tired (CNS wise) group. One of the possibilities at least. I do agree though that actually jumping alongside squatting is by far superior.
i see it. you got your hands up and in front of you when you're doing most athletic moves. front squat totally translates to fighting and balling and everything. dang. thanks Coach!
Interesting question, not sure how much it has to do with why people actually choose a given squat form. I think high squatting is usually driven by ego, knee/back pain, or both.
I used to train a couple sets of five or a few sets of three on the parallel squat, power clean, bench press, chin-up, dip, push press and dumbbell rows with frequency ranging from 1-4 days per week but averaging 2-3 days with periodic breaks of up to a couple months while playing basketball and doing everything I did as fast and explosive as possible which would include scaling anything for any reason, sprinting up every set of stairs I ever climbed, playing basketball and practicing pull up and fade away jump shots from all over the court. This had me at a 43” standing vertical with a 495 squat at 175-186 bodyweight and standing 6’ tall.
I think the broader and not surprising take away from this is, most gains in a specific movement will be best achieved with that specific movement- and for best overall strength and athletic performance- do everything !! 1/4 squats all too often end up being ego-lifts- and can push too close to the injury precipice... Something not to be overlooked from a raw power perspective- are 1/2 leg presses starting from the negative position (each rep). hack squats are fabulous also- utilizing full depth... As a sprinter/jumper- i made colossal gains utilizing these...
Exactly my point. Doing 10 weeks of hypertrophy and strength only results kinda predictable, because athletes should combine velocity profiles in one program (ex. conjugate). Otherwise strongest squater aka powerlifter would jump crazy high
Your channel's great but, sometimes, I just don't understand your reasoning. For instance, in this video, you talk about a quarterback squat. But why should you only train quarterbacks? What's wrong with the rest of the team? (And I don't see anything wrong with including the cheer girls, either. In fact, if you need any help with 'em, give us a call, will ya?)
Some thoughts: MVC test and qsquat angles are not the same: hip angles( hamstring, glute length) are completely different There was not anything about explosive concentric. 2 months of hypertrophy and 2 weeks of probably slow strength- of cause no RFD improvements. And I think, jumps went up only for not experienced individuals or for ones, whoes limiting factor was strength (So, we can see, that full squats are really good at hypertrothy and hypertrothy leads to some strength gaines) Qsquat is a little bit quad dominant, but these quads don't help to drive from the bottom( just my experience, whem I tried full fronts after a long time doing quater backs). Therefore it does not immideately carry over to jumps, which has high post chain recruitment. And ,finally, big squat != big jump (not equal). Peak glute contractions are different, and if it's slow, it's just a potential, not a great power yet
🤔 I wonder if they were told to do every rep with full intent and if you can't easily rep 315-405lbs for reps you aren't even strong enough to do quarter squats. Building a base is more important in the beginning. Specific joint training is used mainly for peaking phase and the fact you brought up plyometrics which has like 11-13% maximal increase on average vs strength with is like 3-5% if I'm not mistaken on maximal increase from strength training. This was a really good break down, I perosnally don't like studies like this because there's too many variables that could affect results from individual athletes. Such as if he has great genetics and more quick fibers vs someone who is average with more slow fibers. Too many variables and if they weren't doing full intent each rep there won't be carry over and seedman is a joke of a man. I think as far as lifting goes the most beneficial lift I've seen is he'd bar deadlift with variations and hang cleans.
Any exercise that explosive and involves triple extension and the knee's/hips/ankles and obviously nothing is better than getting a high vertical than jumping more and getting your tendons stiff and reactive.
Low bar squat to 90 degrees for maximum weight and posterior chain development. Do squat variations for full depth ie front, high bar ect. for main accessories. Problem solved 😎 best of both worlds.
Video Idea: How big should an athlete expect grow over time while working out. My son is a Freshman at 150lbs and wants to grow to 185lbs by the time he his a senior. Is that realistic?
Depends a lot on genetics and height, but you can get big in 4 years, Especially as a teenager. 150 is a relatively large freshman in general, so he probably won’t have much issue packing on the pounds.
hmmm, interesting. I just recently saw a video from pfjperformance. "The Best Squat Variation for Jumping Higher". he basically said that the peak forces are to low when squating in full range of motion. he recommended quater squats and rear foot elevated quater squats with high loads cause you train in those jump specific joint angles. and he also said that this way you train with higher peak forces, so it would make more sense for vertical jump training. what's your take on this?
Ive seen that video too and maybe this study came out after pjf made that video. Id like to see his take on this new study and danes takes on that study pjf referenced
bro yess yes i ssaw that also these coaches are confusing in 5 years new study says deep in 7 years new study says quarter mxm mxm but since i want to improve vertcal jump im going with PJ Performance he suggests doing both deep and quarer squats
Im a basketball player trying to jump higher. So training hypertrophy volume and strength volume did not increase vertical jump regardless of ROM... so what am I supposed to train for the vertical jump? Just plyos?
Well yeah, it's kinda obvious it did not transfer to jumps because athletes should not have so long only hypertrophy and strength focused phases right? Even pro powerlifters use conjugate with speed work, so definitely athletes should implement some variation of combining all aspects instead of just doing pure hypertrophy and strength for 10 weeks straight. Strange study when results are kinda predetermined from the beggining.
This is so confusing some say quater squats translate to vertical jump(Jump Manual/PJ Performance (NBA trainer) some say deep squats increase vertal jump ah ah ah ah ah im just doing both full and quater
Not surprising at all, atg is obviously harder causing your body to have a greater adaptation response resulting in greater strength and performance. I wish they would have done 5 weeks of strength and 5 weeks of hypertrophy as well as increasing the frequency of squats to 5 days a week with a fixed set range of 5 sets per session. They also should have included a specific diet to prevent weight gain not related to muscle growth.
Hi Dane, What about squat depth for 60+ y/o athletes? Is full squat depth advantageous over 1/4 squat for general strength training? Seems that full depth squats could promote injury in this age group?
I am 70 and do ATG squats from 45 pounds to 325. After 325 I go parallel or maybe even a couple inches higher. The ATG squats drives my strength and uses muscles other squats don't incorporate. I squatted 385 5 days ago. It was about 2-3 inches above parallel or higher. ruclips.net/video/z26_yl3msZQ/видео.html
SPECIFICITY. This same test/study has been done already long time ago. If you don't jump using full range of motion, why would you train full range for it?
Idk this study seems dodgy. The results fr the quarter squat seem very poor. Most other studies have the quarter squat out performing the squat in at least some metric.
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recently started watching this channel, ive got to say its easily my favourite fitness channel I've been using some off your drills and exercises for my rugby preseason and have already seen so much improvement in balance and coordination and agility. Would love to see some backline focused rugby videos, other than that thanks for the great content, I just wished more of the products you advertised could ship to Australia.
Awesome, thank you! Really glad you enjoy the videos!
This is really interesting. I went from a 315 1rm back squat to a 365 1rm back squat at the same bodyweight, and my vertical jump improved drastically. All of my squat training in that off season was done with bands as well so I wonder if that had an impact on the results.
You said off season squat training, so we can assume you are an athlete who does dynamic training regularly during the season right? Maybe it has an impact as well, if those who participated never did jump training even before study...hmmm...
P.S. I think there is no doubt that bands did the work! Well done really, smart!
Great job Coach!!! I have been training for nearly 40 years (53 yo) and I have my masters in exercise physiology. I felt like I was back in class listening to my professors while watching this. Really solid work here...I just clicked subscribe!
your knowledge is unmatched. I appreciate you and thank you very much for sharing so much great content!!!
Get STRONGER LEGS with our BIG SQUAT PROGRAM 🏆✔🦵
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I always do full range of motion with both front and back squats, I recently started pin and quarter squats. I do feel like they have helped my dip and drive for the jerk.
So happy to have seen how your channel has grown. Cannot stress how much I love this channel and the consistency you bring with every video. Big ups my man!!!!
What a great study; I would have liked to know this 20 years ago, or even 40 years ago. I get you are very focused on power and speed. However some of the reasons I moved to lower range of motion (more than quarter, but not deep) squats was there were a bunch of studies "in the last century" which did show that whatever angular range of motion you trained in a joint led to an increase of about 10-15 degrees more angle for strength. And that might still hold up in comparison to this study, since quarter squat doesn't seem that close to deep - which would predict what was observed in the study - not much improvement. However squatting "parallel" is not that far from deep, so maybe that is not directly countraindicated by this study. I suppose they went for quarter squats for a reason, but it sort of means the "parallel" case is in limbo?
I suppose a collateral question for study would be like considering rack pulls as opposed to full deadlifts. I do think a lot of people would be surprised if there was no hypertrophy from rack pulls. But isn't that what you might expect from the results of this study?
One of the reasons we avoided "full" range of motion was studies that showed that full load and full range of motion was risky (i.e. why some people don't "lock out" at the top, squat all the way even if they squat deep, etc.) That doesn't appear to have been something this study observed. That old rule would have predicted full movements provide improvement in limited movements, but that the limited movement they used here is too limited to improve results at the extreme angles.
We also spent a lot of time wondering about what Escamilla et. al. (pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11404665/) meant since that was one of the few studies we had back in the day.
Another point is that to get full range of motion, we figured that copious unilateral work was a better bet, since you don't need the same loads. I bet heavily on unilateral lifts about 15 years ago and think that was a good move. All my heavy bilateral squats since then have been box squats with full relaxation on the box, with depth just about exactly parallel. All the deep squats I've done in that period are unilateral (mostly Bulgarian). Do you think reserving full range of motion to unilateral exercises would be a mistake?
In any case it's too late for me, my college athletic "career" (fencing) was in the 1970s. So yeah, I used to be really interested in jumping performance (although not the one you usually think about) but my high impact days are pretty much over now.
Love the Black Star shirt! Had that album on repeat in college. 2 of the best lyricist of all time hands down
I second that, and now I have that Knowledge of Squats, determination!
Appreciate the science based approach you take Dane! Athletes can take your work to heart because you apply the science to your programs to build Olympic level athletes.
That "Black Star" shirt is on POINT sir!
That was a really fkng good video. You guys made a study that's usually pretty boring to read into a very easy to understand video. Thanks for the great content!
Based off of how the first study turned out, to me it seems like the quarter squat group might just be the most tired (CNS wise) group. One of the possibilities at least.
I do agree though that actually jumping alongside squatting is by far superior.
Such a great analysis and summary of an interesting piece of research. Thank you
i see it. you got your hands up and in front of you when you're doing most athletic moves. front squat totally translates to fighting and balling and everything. dang. thanks Coach!
Great information...👍🏾👍🏾 thank you..and nice Blackstar shirt 😁
I love your videos as the advice is great for a rugby player trying to get explosive
Interesting question, not sure how much it has to do with why people actually choose a given squat form. I think high squatting is usually driven by ego, knee/back pain, or both.
I used to train a couple sets of five or a few sets of three on the parallel squat, power clean, bench press, chin-up, dip, push press and dumbbell rows with frequency ranging from 1-4 days per week but averaging 2-3 days with periodic breaks of up to a couple months while playing basketball and doing everything I did as fast and explosive as possible which would include scaling anything for any reason, sprinting up every set of stairs I ever climbed, playing basketball and practicing pull up and fade away jump shots from all over the court. This had me at a 43” standing vertical with a 495 squat at 175-186 bodyweight and standing 6’ tall.
Sounds like they were overtraining.
I think the broader and not surprising take away from this is, most gains in a specific movement will be best achieved with that specific movement- and for best overall strength and athletic performance- do everything !!
1/4 squats all too often end up being ego-lifts- and can push too close to the injury precipice...
Something not to be overlooked from a raw power perspective- are 1/2 leg presses starting from the negative position (each rep). hack squats are fabulous also- utilizing full depth...
As a sprinter/jumper- i made colossal gains utilizing these...
Exactly my point. Doing 10 weeks of hypertrophy and strength only results kinda predictable, because athletes should combine velocity profiles in one program (ex. conjugate). Otherwise strongest squater aka powerlifter would jump crazy high
Great video, love this style of video. Do you have a link to the research paper by any chance?
Here you go pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22344055/
First of all…..the T-shirt is dope! ✊🏽✌🏽 oh and thanks for all of the useful information as well
Your channel's great but, sometimes, I just don't understand your reasoning.
For instance, in this video, you talk about a quarterback squat. But why should you only train quarterbacks? What's wrong with the rest of the team?
(And I don't see anything wrong with including the cheer girls, either. In fact, if you need any help with 'em, give us a call, will ya?)
Some thoughts:
MVC test and qsquat angles are not the same: hip angles( hamstring, glute length) are completely different
There was not anything about explosive concentric. 2 months of hypertrophy and 2 weeks of probably slow strength- of cause no RFD improvements. And I think, jumps went up only for not experienced individuals or for ones, whoes limiting factor was strength (So, we can see, that full squats are really good at hypertrothy and hypertrothy leads to some strength gaines)
Qsquat is a little bit quad dominant, but these quads don't help to drive from the bottom( just my experience, whem I tried full fronts after a long time doing quater backs). Therefore it does not immideately carry over to jumps, which has high post chain recruitment.
And ,finally, big squat != big jump (not equal). Peak glute contractions are different, and if it's slow, it's just a potential, not a great power yet
Great video 👍
Would be nice with a link to the study 👍🙏
Bruh, that tee shirt is EVERYTHING!
🤔 I wonder if they were told to do every rep with full intent and if you can't easily rep 315-405lbs for reps you aren't even strong enough to do quarter squats. Building a base is more important in the beginning. Specific joint training is used mainly for peaking phase and the fact you brought up plyometrics which has like 11-13% maximal increase on average vs strength with is like 3-5% if I'm not mistaken on maximal increase from strength training. This was a really good break down, I perosnally don't like studies like this because there's too many variables that could affect results from individual athletes. Such as if he has great genetics and more quick fibers vs someone who is average with more slow fibers. Too many variables and if they weren't doing full intent each rep there won't be carry over and seedman is a joke of a man. I think as far as lifting goes the most beneficial lift I've seen is he'd bar deadlift with variations and hang cleans.
Any exercise that explosive and involves triple extension and the knee's/hips/ankles and obviously nothing is better than getting a high vertical than jumping more and getting your tendons stiff and reactive.
This is super dope. Would love move vids like this.
Would be interesting to see if there were any outliers to these trends in the group and if so analyse these athletes further 🧐
1. 2. 3. Mos Def & Talib Kweli
Low bar squat to 90 degrees for maximum weight and posterior chain development.
Do squat variations for full depth ie front, high bar ect. for main accessories.
Problem solved 😎 best of both worlds.
So back/front squat decrease in MRFD, means decrease in speed too for sprinter?
As Frans Bosch said "the stronger you get against heavy resistance, the less explosive you will become".
Next Video : Improve Balance and Coordination for Athletes !
LOVE IT! Thanks for the suggestion!
I swear, your shirts 😍… my fav group!
Video Idea: How big should an athlete expect grow over time while working out. My son is a Freshman at 150lbs and wants to grow to 185lbs by the time he his a senior. Is that realistic?
Easy
Depends a lot on genetics and height, but you can get big in 4 years, Especially as a teenager. 150 is a relatively large freshman in general, so he probably won’t have much issue packing on the pounds.
It will come as fast as it can if you eat good and sleep well everyone is different
Train hard, eat and rest harder. Then the weight should take care of itself.
hmmm, interesting. I just recently saw a video from pfjperformance. "The Best Squat Variation for Jumping Higher". he basically said that the peak forces are to low when squating in full range of motion. he recommended quater squats and rear foot elevated quater squats with high loads cause you train in those jump specific joint angles. and he also said that this way you train with higher peak forces, so it would make more sense for vertical jump training. what's your take on this?
Ive seen that video too and maybe this study came out after pjf made that video. Id like to see his take on this new study and danes takes on that study pjf referenced
bro yess yes i ssaw that also these coaches are confusing in 5 years new study says deep in 7 years new study says quarter mxm mxm but since i want to improve vertcal jump im going with PJ Performance he suggests doing both deep and quarer squats
What are your thoughts on using SSB for hypertrophy training?
could work with blowing up your squats with SSB sissy squats!
Thank you@@GarageStrength
The Black star t-shirt is nice.
Im a basketball player trying to jump higher. So training hypertrophy volume and strength volume did not increase vertical jump regardless of ROM... so what am I supposed to train for the vertical jump? Just plyos?
Which one should sprinter do for power and strength
full depth! could mix in some variations here and there
@garage strength Thanks 👍
do a video on quad vs hamstrings strength for sprinting
we do not, but could in the future!
Well yeah, it's kinda obvious it did not transfer to jumps because athletes should not have so long only hypertrophy and strength focused phases right? Even pro powerlifters use conjugate with speed work, so definitely athletes should implement some variation of combining all aspects instead of just doing pure hypertrophy and strength for 10 weeks straight. Strange study when results are kinda predetermined from the beggining.
This is so confusing some say quater squats translate to vertical jump(Jump Manual/PJ Performance (NBA trainer) some say deep squats increase vertal jump ah ah ah ah ah im just doing both full and quater
Not surprising at all, atg is obviously harder causing your body to have a greater adaptation response resulting in greater strength and performance. I wish they would have done 5 weeks of strength and 5 weeks of hypertrophy as well as increasing the frequency of squats to 5 days a week with a fixed set range of 5 sets per session. They also should have included a specific diet to prevent weight gain not related to muscle growth.
this is amazing
Hi Dane, What about squat depth for 60+ y/o athletes? Is full squat depth advantageous over 1/4 squat for general strength training? Seems that full depth squats could promote injury in this age group?
If a 60+ y/o is able to do a parallel squat, it promotes healthy hip and ankle mobility! Full-depth squats can also break up lactic acid!
I am 70 and do ATG squats from 45 pounds to 325. After 325 I go parallel or maybe even a couple inches higher. The ATG squats drives my strength and uses muscles other squats don't incorporate. I squatted 385 5 days ago. It was about 2-3 inches above parallel or higher.
ruclips.net/video/z26_yl3msZQ/видео.html
How does squats with raised heels compare to flat footed squats ?
elevated heels allow for the knees to push over the toes, allowing the hips to sink lower!
You should colab with Dr Mike. Or fight him. It would be golden
Great. last week you said for increase bench do 50 clap push up is doing 50 squat jump every single night works for increase squat??
50 squats a night would be better! might be too much impact with the jumping
@@GarageStrength Would it really be great for increse squat if I do50 squat jump every night? Have you experienced it?
How about risk of injury? And for older adults?
this would be on situational instances! If older adults are able to do full depth squats, they're able to break up any lactic acid!
intensive quarter squats just gave me It band syndrome.
More vids like this!
Damn I always wanted to know
Perfect!
Love this channel 🏋️♂️🥇🥚🥩🥦🥕🥔🙏❤
Which rep and set range is best for squat maximal strength?
5 by 5 is a solid scheme!
8x3, 5x3, 5x5, 4x6. I love 8x3 until I get to about 85% of my 1 rm then go to 5x3. That is work sets not including warmup.
front squat>back squat>quarter squat
Joel Seedman where you at?
Ok frfr
SPECIFICITY. This same test/study has been done already long time ago. If you don't jump using full range of motion, why would you train full range for it?
good point
Idk this study seems dodgy. The results fr the quarter squat seem very poor. Most other studies have the quarter squat out performing the squat in at least some metric.
Is anything in life that is easy that really is worth it on the long run ??? Why squat would be any different
Beast
You're the BEAST ☝
BROOOOOOO THE BLACKSTAR T!!!!!!
So once again we know those 1/4 squat “athletic training” is bs
Bla blabla bla bla bla bla bla news?