I Started a Charger Company
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- Опубликовано: 30 июл 2024
- We founded Coul St. to bring street charging to EV drivers everywhere. Curbside charging is hard, so we've created our unique charger, which solves the biggest challenges and gives electric vehicle drivers access to charging where they park. We want you to join our team!
You can contact me at: josh@coulst.com
The Coul St. Website: www.coulst.com
0:00 How will street parkers charge?
0:29 The problem
1:27 Current solutions
3:29 The solution
4:25 What should it look like?
5:41 Detachable cords
7:21 The post
7:58 The history of Coul St.
8:34 The Team 
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If you want them to really disappear paint them white and put mailboxes on top. Every house (without an HOA) could have one and no one would notice.
That is really smart and you don't have to have a random pole in your yard it just is half charging half mailbox
Tough because when charging it is a trip hazard for mail deliverers
Almost a good idea, how would the mailperson get mail into the box if there was a charger in front of it at every house? Seems like it would slow mail delivery down quite a bit.
@@JasonWho- Car is parked on the Street side, in a City, Mail Carriers walk the Sidewalk, don't they? So, make the Mailbox Door face the House!
In Rural Delivery, where they use a Vehicle, and reach out, if you don't have a Driveway, your car would be Parked in the Way anyway,
@@retrotim - In the City, a Mail carrier is walking on the Sidewalk, to deliver Mail, not on the Road, becoming a Potential "Hood Ornament!"
This is the kind of infrastructure we need. DC fast chargers are great for trips but for the vast majority of time we need to be charging where we park. After all the car is going to be there anyway.
DC Fast Charging is rarely needed when EV range are now 250 miles plus. What we need way more is Level 2 AC just everywhere.
I could definitely see this in small municipalities to get people to come to shop in their downtown!
Apartment complexes and condo complexes are the natural opportunity for this!
Specially here in the jersey shore where you are near nyc but the public transportation sucks here and you must drive everywhere for everything . Ev for all!!
My apartment complex has 4 (per level) FREE chargers in the parking garage
@@Plague_Rat778 lucky mine doesn't and they even warn us that putting extension out of our windows is a violation.
@@heribertosarmiento1265 damn, that sucks.
@@Plague_Rat778 yeah they got scared after seeing some EV catching fire....which are far and few and our parking spots are assigned and behind each condo
I would definitely reach out to Tom Moloughney from State of Charge to help get the word out and add it to the chargers he reviews. Perhaps you already have...
I reached out to Tom a while back, but I definitely need to hit him up again.
@@chargeeverywhere awesome!
@@chargeeverywhere Now that he sees the additional work that you've put into it, he might be more receptive to sharing his thoughts. I would also ask the ladies at Transport Evolved
@@StephenMatreseI second transport evolved!
Great Ideas include Teams at "A Better Route Planner", and at "Plug Share" also come to mind!
Lars at "Best In Tesla" is a good idea, also.
And a dozen other Similar RUclips channels!
THIS! I have a driveway charger and I don't share it and really don't care to open it to the public as I don't want to bear the costs. What I've envisioned is a network where we swipe our card(or phone or whatever) and plug in and pay for our charging. (or GET paid for providing the charging but not gouging each other) You really need a pay/credit system built into this to make it viable and not have it overrun with freeloaders but you're on the perfect path if you can get the swipe payment/credit part integrated.
A credit card terminal cost money. In Europe we use an app. I have multiple apps for the commercial providers. I also have an app that allows people to share a charger and get paid through the network.
I wonder if there would not be some form of “summup” (uk mobile/personal) card reader that could be cheaply integrated in to this sort of charger? Thinking about this sort of thing for a holiday cottage to allow guests to charge at cost.
If you really want to keep it cheap, each charger could have a QR code on it that you scan and manage your payment and start/stop charging.
Having a plug and charge style system like tesla that integrates with the utility provider would be pretty cool.
@@buttonmonkey6845Payment is the easy part, but what about metering? And why on earth would I want to pay THOUSANDS to run cabling under the sidewalk out to the curb that anyone could use? How would I ever make that money back? This whole business model makes NO sense.
This is exactly type of charging, which I saw in 2016 in Oslo, Norway. Once I saw it, I was sold, that EVs are the future. We need more options like that. This is great. Good luck!
Thanks! Europe is well ahead of us on this. We'll get there.
@@chargeeverywhere using the right terminology will get us there quicker. What you are describing is an EVSE not a charger. There is no AC to DC rectification going on externally it is outputting AC.
@@joeyscleaninglady2877 - While you are "Technically Correct", go and talk to a Hundred people, half that own an EV, and half that don't, and ask them what they are calling these posts, or the Tesla and J1772 boxes, that are out there today! See if you hear more than 25% say "EVSE's! I doubt it!
Most will call them "EV Chargers" even if they are just a "NEMA 14-50 Stove Plug" you use to connect a Portable Charging Cable to!
So, if you are talking to "The People" - EV Charger" is Fine! Sure, if you have to deal with an Agency, for Permitting, go ahead and use "EVSE" as the Term!
(EVSE: Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment) 😁
EVs are old tech and clearly not the future. Gas is better in every way.
@@darksideblues135Except for:
- the pollution
- the noise level
- the fuel cost
- the acceleration
- the ability to power devices that need an outlet
The J3400 standard (formerly NACS) specifies Type 2 connectors on the equipment side for detachable cables, exactly as in Europe. You deviating from that winds up with a “…there are now 15 competing standards” situation (xkcd 927). Use a Type 2 on the pole now before it’s too late. Otherwise your product will be irrelevant in the huge market of new charging stations to come.
A good point. We would already have cables available this way as well
This seems like a pretty big problem to me too, I would have went with J1772 since extension and adapter cables for it are already pretty prolific, and having a fixture with a male J1772 outlet does not violate the standard.
Indeed. Think I saw a NY company doing this as well but using a Type2 socket
The other advantage of Type2 over Type1/J1772 is it locks inside, so that end or both ends of a NACS car are locked
@@PSByteJ1772 might be currently more prolific in terms of charging stations your aware of. But Tesla uses NACS (J3400) and From June 2023 through February 2024, automakers BMW Group, Fisker, General Motors, Honda, Hyundai Motor Group, Jaguar Land Rover, Lotus Cars, Lucid Motors, Mazda, Mercedes-Benz, Nissan, Polestar, Rivian, Stellantis, Subaru, Toyota, Volvo Cars, and Volkswagen Group all announced that they would equip their electric vehicles sold in the North American market with NACS charge ports from the factory starting in 2025. *By year, Tesla sells a MINIMUM of six times more EVs than all other MFGs COMBINED.
Does the post have the EVSE and you are simply plugging in an “extension” cord like Lectron’s NACS extension cord?
I’ve decently retired and am traveling by e-bike. Think about adding a solid loop to lock a bike to and a standard 110 outlet. Think of it as an even closer return to the hitching post.
Excellent idea. I live in an area where people actually use horses for transportation still, so if it was a "hitch post" nobody would complain!
This is extremely common in Europe. It's pretty much every 3 parking spaces in new neighborhoods in the Netherlands. AFAIK, it's a requirement for all new neighborhoods and has been for at least the last 7-10 years. And they are really small, basically like a sidewalk light and you bring your own cable.
The real question is how you get the wiring inexpensively (and legally) run under the sidewalk.
Legality isn't much of an issue. You apply for the permits.
I worked at a landscape company. We took a steel pipe and put a cap on the end and used a sledgehammer to drive it under the sidewalk.
There are lots of RUclips videos about how to get a pipe under a sidewalk. In some you connect a garden hose to the pipe to wash the dirt out as you drive it through.
Imagine everyone charging their vehicle (which will eventually happen) wouldn’t that just fry up the entire country and possible the planet?
EV is BS
This is the problem here, because its not your property. And you also have to put all the wiring you put under the ground in a database etc. This does not work here, and many people want it. But local government has problems with it. While they also want to promote charging at the same time hahahaha
For years now I’ve thought it was inevitable that we’d have to switch to Europe’s bring-your-own-cable model. Thieves will discover EVSE cables have copper and inevitably start cutting the cables off public stations. Of course, we also need these cables to lock on the EVSE during use so we aren’t making it any easier for them.
Once I discovered BYOC there was no way to unsee the advantages. Once I was talking with a Dutch man and he was shocked that we didn't take the cable off.
The dumbest part is that they get caught and are on the hook of tens of thousands of dollars (~$2000 USD/cable), but liquid cooling has dropped the copper to around $15 USD/cable
It's sad that we have to think about things like detering cable theft. I wonder if it is anti-EV or money or a mix
Especially in the US, those cables will be cut by crack heads faster than they can replace them. lol
@@StephenMatrese Not talking about liquid-cooled cables.
In particular, I’m thinking of my 16A AmazingE (ClipperCreek) portable EVSE that’s dangling from the side of my workshop. I share a parking lot with a convenience store… along with their drunks and schiztophrenic homeless who already ripped down exterior electrical wiring on the opposite side of my building. I have a backup if they get that one (NOS control board from the GM of the same ClipperCreek unit plus a J1772 from someone’s parted-out OpenEVSE build).
Thankfully, the store just got rid of their gazebo/gondola thing that the crazies were sleeping under. …and I do mean “crazies.” One of them recently admitted to throwing a piece from my van (diagonal brace bar) at “shadow people” when it turned out a doormat had simply fallen on top.
What's to prevent a thief from running off with a BYOC cable?
I am interested in how you imagine sharing would work, billing, and limiting freeloaders. In our condo in Mexico, I proposed connecting to the building with wall chargers and having multiple people use it and having a RFID card to access. The other owners, who do not foresee EVs did not like the idea.
So, two of us got together and had NMEA 6-20 outlets connected to 2 parking places where most owners do NOT prefer to park. These 2 outlets are connected to our individual electric meters instead of connected to the common meter for the building. Other owners are happier.
I think you should expand your thinking to condominiums. I am interested in the comments from others.
I still think that a common solution for charging in our condos in both the USA and Mexico would be ideal. Unfortunately, we are going with the private solutions in both.
I'm worried about freeloaders and such as others have said. I bet their are ways to combat most of that. Your idea is great and I wish I could help build your company and idea. Please let me know how to help. I'm in Illinois.
Our electricity is $0.10 per kWh, I'm not worried about "free-loaders". The freeloaders are the gas guzzlers polluting while taking oil com[anies take BILLIONS in free government money... oh but we don't pay the gas tax.
Anyone can charge at my house (If I'm not charging and can't disconnect... rare), it's been that way for years.
Do you have your granny lead? well, now 2 can charge.
@@coreyverisario6570 Switch at the home would be the easiest method.
The hardest part, in actuality, is the software. New federal regulations that were announced last year via executive order should relate to this idea, hopefully help but we know that stuff often has biases towards big business.
Like you said, RFID card and billing by energy exported from EVSE to connected vehicle.
I could see 1 of those posts with a parking meter on top of it. Perhaps the parking meter could handle the UI/payment for non-home owner charging points
Hi. I am not from the US or Europe and have been thinking of trying to solve the same issue for my country. I have two suggestions.
1. As many already have, there is a need to mitigate the risk of chargers being simply unplugged from the car or charging posts by champion climate deniers. An alarm/alert can be set up during such a case. Such alert can also be triggered if the car stops charging at an unexpected time or SOC.
No one wants to come to their car in the morning, just to see if the car has not charged overnight.
2. As adoption picks up, the post socket will experience increased wear and tear, so an option to conveniently replace the socket will be a good future proofing step.
When using the type 2 chargers in Europe the car will lock the cable and to the charger. There’s no way for anyone to unplug or stop charging. From the car I can stop the charging and unlock the cable.
@@tomm5936 as long as the latching option is on both ends of the connector, it will be good.
erm... the chargers just lock in place?
@@MaticTheProto when you start charging a type 2 cable will lock and you cannot unplug as long as it is charging. There’s no way to stop charging at the charger, only I can do it from my car or in the app with my account. In my car it’s a setting that it stays locked even when charging has ended or it can immediately unlock. I have it locked because I charge on the street. When I unlock the car the cable will unlock at both the car and the charger and I can unplug and put the cable in the frunk.
The distributed ownership thing is a fantastic idea.
Regarding the concept of BYOC, I'm an electrician, and I have been saying this FOR YEARS!!
Chargers are not chargers! Chargers are extension cords. All you need is an outlet. Installing a 30 amp outlet is an extremely simple job, assuming your panel has enough space.
How has it taken this long for people to realize this?
Sure the outlet is simple, but trenching it from the panel is what takes time and in most cases "permission". The pay model is the hard part. How does one add the feature of charging someone for using your electricity? Overnight prices in my southern state are about $0.14/kWh. Someone fills up their 60kWh battery on their Tesla overnight, I am going to want my $8.40 plus a percentage of what it cost me to put in the outlet (or do you electricians work for free?).
@@jrjohnson5336 I'm assuming what they are making has some sort of integrated payment system, otherwise they wouldn't have talked about your neighbors buying power from you.
There is probably a small CT inside that monitors current flow, which likely links to an app. If you are the owner, you can likely set it up however you want, and sell the power at whatever rate you want. Good questions though! These are definitely things they should clarify.
Regarding the trenching and permits, I'm in Washington State, with pretty strict electrical laws, and all I have to do is buy a permit online, post it on the outside of my house, do the work and call for an inspection.
The laws in Washington allow homeowners to do their own electrical work, or to have someone assist them, as long as that person is not being compensated. Sizing a device like that, and installing an appropriate breaker is incredibly simple.
The actual installation of course needs to be done by a legit electrician, but you only need to bury that conduit (I believe) 2-3 feet down. Every house is different of course, but I could do that entire job all by myself in a day.
@@jrjohnson5336 man I hate RUclips...keep deleting my comments!
I posted a longer response, but you make good points about the payment! They should clarify it for sure, but I'm assuming there is some kind of CT in the stand that monitors current flow, which likely links to an app through which the owner can sell the power to authorized users at whatever rate they want.
As far as the installation, I can go into more detail if you want, but the TLDR is a good electrician on average house can do that job in a day.
How much does a local electrical company charge to install a generator plug in on the outside of your house? If you dug the trench for the conduit yourself, it would take just about as long.
@@jrjohnson5336 RUclips keeps deleting my comments.... apologies for the short response.
I think you make good points, I suspect that there is a current monitoring device in the post that links to an app, through which the owner can sell the power to authorized users at whatever rate they want. But you are totally right, they should clarify how they intend it to work!
In terms of installation, I've been a commercial electrician for the last seven years, and me or any other decent electrician could do this entire job by ourselves in one day. It's really not as complicated as it seems on the surface.
How does distributed ownership make sense? Why would anyone spend thousands to install this thing, which has no metering or payment capabilities, and is completely open for ANYONE to use, running up your electric bill? This is perhaps the dumbest idea I’ve ever heard.
This is exactly the way to do it. Build a kiosk with the plug and let the car owner provide the cord. I'd suggest though that these kiosks also have an RFID or credit card reader to to turn the juice on and that reader could also bill the car owner. I've actually been advocating the kiosk approach like this for at least 10 years. Right after I saw a kiosk with a credit card reader on the side of a street in Limerick, Ireland in 2013.
It makes sense for the CITY to install this type of charger, but it makes absolutely no sense to expect individual homeowners to install them at great expense, with no way to meter or charge for it! It’s just wide open for anyone to use, at your expense. I just don’t know what this guy is thinking…
I like that post. I would combine mine with my mailbox so I could only have one post in front of my house.
Keep in mind that new neighborhoods in the US are going to cluster boxes.
And if it is a streetside box for vehicle post delivery... it is illegal to block it (eg: with a parked vehicle). At best, you just don't get mail delivery. At worst... ?
Eta: And with a property mount for a walking route (eg: edge of the lawn)... it's illegal to block a sidewalk such as with the cord running to the vehicle on the street.
Sad to say the mailbox combo is a beautiful idea, I just don't see how to accommodate it.
@@dalececil7527 I'm in a brand-new neighborhood and we still have individual boxes. Although they are a standard design neighborhood wide, and this would deviate from the others that everyone has.
Living in a Type 2 Mennekes nation this would be another great option. We have a lot of curb side median strip space here, this is the most compact discrete version i've seen soo far. Hope to see this in Australia one day.
I like the post idea. Would add an RFID card to access, or at least have the option. Prevents freeloaders. Much nicer than the ones with the cables on the street, and more discrete. I was wondering why that concept has not made it to North America. Hope you make it catch. You will need to add some locking mechanism so people do not unplug and steal your cable. Perhaps scan the RFID to unlock the cable.
Yes, these things. I just stumbled on this video and I'm excited as a condo owner with no garage, only a parking spot in a parking lot in front of my condo. This could be the ticket to EVs for me cause I am not charging at commercial charging stations unless I absolutely have to.
I like it, perhaps building a modular system that can fit within your pedestals, light posts (separate wire run, not the city energy) or offer multiple outlets at one post?
I like your thinking. This is exactly where we have landed. Pedestals were too limited, and we saw an opportunity to fit into existing electrical infrastructure. I'll be sharing more on this soon.
@@chargeeverywhere - A big problem in the US is convincing, licensing, and building charger in apartments and condos. So far my condo has no plans anytime soon to put some in.
@@BillAntgreed is a huge hurdle there, why would they do any of that if they can’t make money off of it? And it needs to be a big profit, fuck this capitalist system
It would be super easy to just add a specialized cap for the pedestal
right now I use the charger that came with my ev and i got an extender cord to reach the street. we have no sidewalk. this would be cool but we rent. We love our Chevy bolt!!! we only have to charge everyother night and we will be charged to 80%
When I saw the prototype, my first thought was, "Put a mailbox on that!" That might make it more palatable in some neighborhoods. Perhaps something else could be integrated with it, like a light or address marker.
I think it's a great idea, though!
The downside to the mailbox idea is that you can't part there during the day. Otherwise, you won't get your mail.
Great project, this will really help advancing the EV transition in your area!
Two suggestions: Use a type 2 (mennekes) connector. Although it is larger, it supports cable locking and larger means more robustness. Parts may be cheaper because everyone in Europe uses it.
Also add an RFID based access control and accounting with a dedicated meter. Setup and operate a backend to track and account charging sessions. I'd suggest an ethernet connection to the pole which runs into the homes powering the pole. If connectivity is an issue (no cable to the router), just add a small ethernet to WiFi module where you connect to the power.
Also look into existing solutions for inspiration, like the "Charging Point Berlin" from the German company "Bender GmbH".
In Oslo, Norway about 20% of all public street parking spots have public chargers. And charging is free as long as you pay for parking. Parking while charging is about 70% cheaper than parking non-electric cars and charging your car up while parked is about 50% cheaper than on a tesla supercharger.
Wow
I have Tesla destination chargers at my business that are also open to the public. In the beginning they were free as a perk for customers. I eventually went pay per use because people and car dealers were leaving their cars plugged in all day .
We need these things everywhere in Chicago. The charging experience sucks here.
How do you charge your customer for charging? App?
My question too
If you go into the description of the video and visit the website, there's what looks to be an app shown towards the bottom of the page.
Home charging is the only way to keep costs low so I like the idea.
I don't drive much anymore but I love my EV. No more maintenance is a win, win.
The superchargers are a perfect solution for me but I wish you the best with your company.
LOL! The notion that EV’s have “no more maintenance” is absurd!
So my main issue is the incentive for home owners. If I’m a home owner, I do not own the street parking in front of my house. But if I have an EV and park it on the street, I would want something like this. However, it looks like there isn’t anything on the post preventing people from using it (like a lock or a code).
This means the spot in front of my house will become a hot commodity for all the EVs in the neighborhood, just like when a parking lot introduces EV charging. If I’m installing one of these, I would like to see the ability to put some sort of code on the box to make charging exclusive to me or my visitors. I do see some challenges with this though because I would be putting up personal infrastructure on land reserved for the city to use (I’m from Canada so even if we own the land, the city has the right to use the front part of it)
If the idea is that other cars can use it and pay for the electricity, how will that work? Will they pay via credit card? Or are you thinking that having one of these posts hooked up to your property can be some sort of tax rebate on an annual basis?
The problem with this product is American culture. If you install this in front of your house on a public road, does that mean you are essentially telling other people you can't park there? Like now you are reserving this spot in front of your house for your car charger? This is what people will be upset about. Then they will see your car plugged and either go unplug it or maybe vandalize the cable. That's the sad part.
I can see this solution being perfect for places like apartment building outdoor parking spots where you can install them in dedicated spots assigned to an individual apartment. But then what do you do if someone plugs into your spot when you're not there and you have to pay for the electricity? At that point you then start entering the territory of the current market of chargers out there where you can start charging with an NFC card for example, but then at that point the only selling point of your product is the detachable cable.
Maybe in the beginning when doing so is a novelty but just like anything that becomes normalized people will just get used to it and then ignore it.
From 2007 to 2017, Philadelphia actually let drivers reserve spots at their self-installed EV chargers. This led to many complaints, and eventually, they killed the program just as EVs started to take off. I agree with @DoRC; in the short term, there are more issues, but in the medium to long term, they will work themselves out. Today, the best neighborhoods for a solution like this are medium to low-density parking. Parking competition is much less there, and it'll be good to gain experience before tackling high-density downtowns.
EU “bring your own cable” makes so much more sense
yeah. In europe there's always at least one that comes with an ev or hybrid
Great idea! I understand the mission you are looking for help with includes: - figuring out how to turn it into a ecosystem - with installers, maintainers, municipal information kits, manufacturers, and payment / sharing solutions.
I've been wondering why nobody has done the lead method here in the States. Thank you for pushing it hopefully it takes off soon.
I have a friend whose business is trenchless digging. He runs the power without actually digging up sidewalks and roads. I wonder if it would work for this too?
If it's NACS, could there be a thick cable, so you can use Level 2 or as an extension cable for DC charging for all those vehicle that have the charge port on the wrong side?
Ive had this exact thought, as a landscaper in the process of switching over to All electric the power required to keep my batteries charged is pretty big, being able to pull up to every house and plugging in to maintain capacity is huge. This is definitely the future.
I live in NYC and we desperately need something like this on every block. There are a total of 8 street side charging at level 2 in Astoria, Queens and they are always occupied.
You need 2 options. A simple one for homeowners to use in their driveway and for their own locked use, and a city/street version for intigrating into a smart city style environment we seem to be headed to that can be public and shared.
For the city public version, you need to have a good payment system in place.. ideally with a plug and charge style authentication. As a homeowner installing one, people are not going to want the costs associated with paying for others.
Find a way to install these quickly and cheaply doing not much more than running a cable to a breaker. Are there deals to be made with utilities using streetlight power?
Consider Dual outlets-- double the capacity and powershare/ limit automatically to avalible power. Half the chargers potentially needed per street.
Put a low slung pathway light on top to blend them in and make them apppealing for the curbside eye.
Keep them appealing by having a 110 outlet on one side for homeowners for who knows what.. even if lockable.
A way to reset the unit if its not functioning would be amazing if its at/ on the unit.
Maybe consider intigrating wifi access points that piggy-backs off the charging pole owners home networks expanding comunications to the cars. Think maybe small cell network extending deals with cell companies as well.
To do a payment system you need some form of connectivity anyway so even if one person joins, you could comunicate pole to pole for payment monitoring, avoiding seperare connections for each one and failures in the event internet goes down. Might be able to incentivice this into revenue for the owner and company to recoup the install costs.. that stated i dont know the legalities of this. Could also integrate a sensor for airtags, tile style wifi devices. Where is there money to be made in a smart city style life to subsidize the costs for homeowners wanting to intall these? Running power to them is the expensive part here for most cases.
Potentially add an option for security cameras to face the owners house.
"You're putting your charging in the hands of one entity and that entity is not you" - when I moved to my last apartment, I asked about EV charging. They said they'd be installing something within the year. I asked if they'd gotten a plan set up with a charger company like ChargePoint or SemaCharge or getting their own Clipper Creek units. They said they hadn't gotten a plan yet, but if I had recommendations, they'd love to hear them.
Well, I gave them my recommendations... and checked in 6 months later... and a year later... and two years later... and nothing :(
I've since moved out and have my own EVSE at my own place and it's so much nicer being able to charge at home rather than having to charge at public stations only! Making charging available for street parkers is going to be so helpful to increasing EV adoption.
It's a great idea. The detachable cord is the best. No more worries about damaged connectors twisted cables, etc. This will make it a much more reliable system too. I think a payment system is a must, but it works have to be better competitive.
How hard would it to put both the new NACS and the older J1772, one above the other? Or would it be just you buy the cord based on your cars connection?
How does one pay for the electricity, or in the case of neighborhood ones, how does one charge someone for using the charger?
My eyes lit up, I got it immediately, and anyone with 2 brain cells to rub together can easily understand just how much this idea can be beneficial to everyone moving forward.
Slow, street charging is definitely the way to go. I have a 2015 Smart Fortwo Electric Drive, it takes a full 16 hours to charge 0-100% on 110v (6h on Level 2 charging), just for 100km of range... and it's literally all I need for my daily needs! If I didn't have a private parking and external 110v plug, the car wouldn't be economical or convenient for me... Except if there was cheap, easy access to street parking with a charger. There *are* street chargers but they cost $1/h and even at that relatively cheap parking price it's still way too expensive for overnight, slow charging, especially since I usually don't need a full charge in the first place.
I absolutely love the metaphor of the hitching posts, it makes it simple to explain to people. You charge when you can, whenever you're parked, be it at home or at work or at the store (these posts in any parking lot would be insanely convenient, if they're made in a sturdier fashion), etc. We all know that 90% of people drive less than 100km per day, and even the slowest charging EV (mine!) gets me this easily plugged into the standard, dumb, 110v socket.
And hey, you know what, I also ride electric unicycles, and having the ability to just go anywhere and know, hopefully, that there's a charger around I can get power from to keep going on my ride... well let's say I'm in. Twice over. Now to get a house with street parking in front in the suburbs, now that's going to be my next step ;)
What's your plan to manage sharing? In a perfect world, everyone would play nice, however, in our world, we need ways to ensure this isn't abused.
Do you have any ideas for how you might mitigate cable theft?
Have you considered the safety aspects of what happens if a charger is struck by a vehicle?
What about preventing them from being struck by a vehicle. Reflective tape might be one approach, but another might be lights atop the posts either solar-powered or powered by the charger.
Brilliance at its core! Very very very COUL brother!
Josh, I think this is a great concept. I have been following EV charging and infrastructure for a few years now and one of the big issues we are facing is people stealing the cord. Your design allows a charger to sit and not be vulnerable to theft. I have a vacation property that I would not want to have a traditional charger sitting out all year round and until this product I was thinking of a pole with a Nema 14-50 and being able to charge faster at my cabin. While I don't yet have and EV, I want to be ready to charge in the future...This could work for my situation and countless other people too. I will be watching to see where this product goes! Keep up the great ideas.
Very Coul.
Something I have thought since I got my EV, 6 years ago, is that we have the charging infrastructure all wrong.
Every car should come with a built in, switchable Level One to Level Two EVSE and cable.
This would help address the theft and vandalism of cables and mean that cities, landlords, businesses don't need to install EVSEs, just electrical outlets.
The only time cables are needed on the actual charger, is at DC Fast Chargers.
Hi Josh. I have a couple of points. Someone from Europe here, or more specifically, Ireland. In Ireland and the UK, 3 phase domestic is not common. Single phase 240V is where the vast majority of us are at. The home charge points available to us are sold in single phase or 3 phase units, with some catering for both. In single phase, the additional 2 pins on the socket side are redundant. It's cheaper to manufacture them this way, as the same product essentially suits both markets, similar to manufacturers putting electric seats in all cars, but only connecting them in premium models. Most of our EVs take a TYPE 2 MENNEKES and some of the older cars, such as the 2010-2017 Nissan Leaf, or the Mitsubishi i-miev take the TYPE 1 (J1772).
Here's the important bit. No matter the connection on the EV end, the port on the charge point is always the same Type 2. So I could rock up with my i-miev and use the cable that came with the car to charge from any untethered charge point. The same is true if I do the same in my Tesla. I just use the cable that comes with the car. I assumed the charger sockets in the US were also Type 2. Is this not the case? The only difference should be the end that connects to the car, which should have a cable with a TYPE 2 connector for the charge point and then a J1772, or MENNEKES, or NACS or whatever other type connects to the car.
Another option would be to add a domestic socket to the charge point, allowing users to use the "granny" charger if they don't have the larger public charging cable. Maybe you call it something different over there, but I am talking about the slow domestic charge cable which looks like an old laptop charger and has a domestic plug on it. This would add a lot of redundancy to the unit at low cost and a minor design addition. You would simply need to add a second socket point under the existing one.
I agree that the port on the EVSE side should be whatever is the standard and the same on every charger, so that you never have the issue of incompatibility with the cable. I do believe however that NACS has recently become the US official standard connection.
I really like your idea of adding a standard outlet for the granny charger, if for some reason you cannot connect using a standard charging cable! That’s a nice redundancy I wish public chargers in Europe would have. Maybe an important consideration for this would be to provide some sort of locking/latching mechanism covering the socket, so someone doesn’t run off with your charger. Type 2 and NACS can be mechanically locked but a standard plug/socket traditionally cannot.
Whatever happens to be the country standard, I think the EVSE port should be a type 2. That doesn’t prevent the car side from being Type 1, Type 2, or NACS.
The locking mechanism to prevent someone running away is on most EVs and doesn’t require locking at the EVSE side, save for the low life people who purposefully disconnect cars that are charging for selfish, or childish reasons. When my Leaf, or Model 3 is charging, the car either automatically locks the charging cable, or it can be set manually.
@@GaryMeatsLife I agree that Type 2 is probably the safest option right now, although I don’t know what cable EVs in the US typically ship with. Many US brands are switching to NACS on the car side, and there’s a case to be made for NACS in that it could support either AC or DC charging on the same connector/cable which is a good future proof feature.
On some older EVs (so not the biggest issue) like my 2011 Leaf the connector doesn’t lock on the side of the car. In Europe most public chargers lock the cable on the charger side too. This does help prevent people from simply unplugging your car from the charger for the sake of it. But if I read in the comments the hate EVs/chargers get in the US, it might still be a nice thing to have for now. Also in the case of the granny socket, it would prevent somebody from unplugging you and plugging in their own car or any other appliance while you/the homeowner pays for the electrical bill (assuming you don’t automatically stop a session/cut power when the load is removed, but as the socket would not have any communication, this might be harder to implement).
@@noevandenbranden1229 The NACS standard is a perfectly good option for the car side, especially because of the AC or DC charging through a smaller connector. I am based in Ireland and the Fremont built Teslas arrived here with the NACS charge port. My "made in china" Tesla Model 3 is Type 2 and CCS. The Fremont built cars could plug directly into the Tesla Super Chargers before CCS became mandatory, or with an adaptor they could use CHAdeMO, or CCS charge points. They also came with the type 2 to Tesla (NACS) public cable to allow people to AC charge either from untethered public, work, or home charge points. The only issue I have with the NACS is the naming of it. The aim should be Global, not North America. I suspect Europe would fight to keep CCS though because they only recently enough mandated the standard.
My 2012 Leaf also did not have a locking mechanism for the charge port, but my 2014 UK built one did. It may be the case that the Japanese built ones did not have a locking mechanism, or it may be that from late 2013 they came with them. My 2014 Leaf had one and my 2018 also has one. Like I said, most EVs have a charge cable lock built in.
I think a locking mechanism at the charge point is a piece of extra security. I don't know how they would implement a locking mechanism for a domestic plug without adding significant costs to the charge point. With regards to stealing electricity, the answer is RFID to engage the electrical contactor and allow electrons to flow. As soon as the cable is unplugged, the contactor should dis-engage and be ready for the next RFID scan.
@@noevandenbranden1229 We don't get cords that separate from our chargers in the US currently. All EVSE's come with it hard wired. Even the ones you can add from the manufacturer have them hard wired into them. This is one of the areas where thieves are starting to cut the wires for the metal and leaving EV drivers with issues of not being able to charge. There are even videos out there where people are getting shocked cutting the cables. Then they get broke because people don't take care of them when using them and some don't have cable management built into them at all. Our charging here is a mess between connector types, networks, and reliability I am all for this as a solution here.
Really cool solution to a problem I've been wondering about for a long time! Best of luck to you guys. I hope your product is successful. There's a lot of potential in this idea.
Where is the meter to measure consumption? Does the rate charged for electricity flow with the grids rate?
Could you advise what the cost for a unit is and cost of installation assuming I own the land?
If you want to make the device usable to the public consider redesigning it to function like a parking meter. Since this device will be connected to your power or your neighbor's power, incorporating a payment method such as a card reader or a coin slot would be much more efficient. This way, neighbors or the public wouldn't need to knock on doors to ask to use the charger, and the owner of the charger would receive compensation immediately.
Love this, couldn't understand why the USA didn't adopt the same method as the EU. It's a BRING YOUR OWN CABLE method (like every other piece of tech we use day to day). Works WAY easier, just small charge boxes throughout a Euro city and you can also have a 10-12 foot cable so the box could be 2 parking spots away and you can still reach it. Cool to see you working on implementing something like that Josh! Stoked to see how this project shapes up. Could be a bigger impact on the EV space in the US!
This is good stuff! I've seen the detachable cables in Europe, and always wondered why this wasn't a thing in the US. Kudos to you for making it happen.
I have a garage, so I don't currently need one, but I'd be more than willing to throw a few bucks your way if desired.
Great idea! I have an installed ChargePoint in my carport, but I also have a cable that I can plug into a 50 amp service. I don’t use it on a regular basis, but there are RV parks everywhere. Say, the isolated level 3 charger you need doesn’t work, you can ask a park manager to sell you a few electrons. Had I known then what I know now, I would have gotten a 50 amp plug for my carport and saved myself some money. Maybe you could register locations on a trip planner, like PlugShare, with a billing system so the owners can make a little income when they aren’t using them.
I would go a step further and let people sell charging time. Even people who do not own EVs. You could add a contactless credit card machine to every pole, or even better, an app so you add your card and unlock the pole, and owners would track their earnings. Just like rental bikes. It would add extra complexity, but it'd be a huge incentive.
Love this idea -- especially in the roll out being person by person.
One thing you should try to do is find universal legal precedent for allowing homeowners to do this that can't be easily stopped by local zoning ordinances -- that is a huge problem. But I really LOVE the idea of a "bring your own cable" solution. Most EVs have space for them anyway and then the adapters are just part of the cable. Great work, keep it up.
Best of luck. I signed up for your mailing list and hope to see this really take off. Great idea in a lot of places. Costs to get the power to the street might be excessive in others. (Thinking about having to run 50+ feet of 220/2400v capable copper just to get a post to my street. I don't need it right now, but it would be interesting to try. The mailbox idea seems great in a lot of places where that wouldn't block delivery vehicles.
I love this idea and hope you get it everywhere esp I would love to have it at my condo building! It definitely made me think of Helium when you mentioned a network by the people. There's another company called DIMO that is building a connected car ecosystem and was just thinking of how your plug could utilize something like IOT to handle infrastructure, location of chargers and/or payments somehow. Just things that came to mind when watching your video if you haven't heard of any of these things; I think what you're building could fit right into that space.
Awesome Idea. Would love to see these in every neighborhood!
That's an excellent idea good job. You worked out most of the critiques I've thought of and I don't even have an EV
I dig the idea, I'd be curious, if I already have a charger that uses a nema 6-20 (220v), could this be adapted for that? Also what does the board behind do other than light up? Does this have over current protection on it? How about a method to lock your cable into the post? All ideas for you.
Also follow up, Michigan just approved a bill that doesn't allow HOAs from preventing you from installing car chargers. House Bill 5028, just signed into law today.
Nice product. I was looking for something like this for my driveway when we got our EV. I had to make my own out of a bollard. The idea seems intuitive to me and I wonder why it hasnt happened sooner.
Love the hardware execution, but how does the billing system work? Other than permits and installation, the #1 difficulty in EV charging for Apartments and Condos is how to handle reimbursement to Apt Management or HOA's, when you can't directly tap into your specific utility at your home.
Well done josh, the world needs more forward thinkers like yourself 😊
This is an amazing idea. I could see an app where when a person taps their phone to the charger it checks if they're the owner and then shows the price for charging. You could even split the income of each charger with the owner so that the owner gets paid for the used electricity and the company can get a small kick back.
I use a portable level 2 charger that I plug into a 240v 50amp line I had run from my 2nd floor condo. It’s under the steps and my charger has an unbelievable 24 ft cable that reaches my 2020 Niro EV. I’ve installed the rv240 connector and it works well. Portable charger fits in the frunk.
Ia there tech or just a switch inside the home to turn on and off the juice? I wouodnt want people to be able to use my electricity while im away.
If my mailbox sat on top of this ev post that would be awesome! Imagine every mailbox is actually a ev charger in the years to come.
Hi, EV-driver from Europe here. We use indeed the Mennekes 2 type connector, on the car side and charger side those both connectors get locked. You’re only able to remove the cable when the charging has stopped and when you have unlocked your car or have presented the charger with the rfid card that started the charging session. I don’t see that in your product?
Its a neat idea. I think the street parking solution will look similar to this, but with one large caveat. Streets are public spaces. You dont own the parking space in front of your house. The vast majority of street parking in urban areas is free without permits, and even in places where permitted parking exists, it is never limited to one specific parking spot.
By paying personally to install this in front of your house, you are essentially claiming "dibs" to "your" parking spot, but its not your spot, its free public parking for anyone.
Perhaps in a more suburban environment where a few people park on the street, but theres still a lot of driveways, this could work as basically a more aesthetically pleasing extension cord. But for urban areas where street parking is more heavily used, and sometimes you cant always park RIGHT in front of your house, the only real way street charging working is for the City or Electric Utility company to install them all the way down the block and implement some sort of RFID payment/metering system.
Except that you have to go through the same permission processes, since it is on public ground with a cable through public ground.
My city simply doesn't allow laying cables over or through public ground from your home to a car or charging pole. No negotiation.
The public charging stations (that are not monopolized) are similar slim line units as you designed.
How does your pole manage the payments for the power delivered by your pole to other cars? Here the public charging poles use (nearly universal) cards from lots of different providers, that simply manage authorization for the power you load to your car (and will handle charging to any other car too)
This is super clean, I think it would be VERY difficult to get these installed in my city on the street.
But for multi-family buildings, having these in the parking spaces would be incredible!
I find this idea super amazing! Would love to see set ups like this in the Atlanta area. Great job!
Was wondering about some of the community sharing aspects of this. Is there an app or website where users can communicate or negotiate pricing for power use?
An issue I see is you dont own the parking space in front of your home. It can easily be blocked. Will you allow others to use it?
What kind of software and metering are you using so the neighbors pay for their use? How long to get permitting for the post? I don't have a NACS to NACS cable, mine is NEMA 14-50 to NACS (I have no idea if mine is common or not), does this mean it's on the neighbors to purchase a new cable? What if you need an upgrade to your home power ie 200A or 400A? HMO's? I think it makes sense, it's relatively easy for me to add a 240/208 VAC plug and trench it outside, but I really don't want to donate electricity to the neighbors.
Another issue just occurred to me, a second reason to establish a software/pay system is to prevent excess vehicle traffic, especially initially on your street. If it's "free" I worry people will just camp there (as occurs at our local library and museum, where there is free level 2 charging). If you have a handful of posts on one street, I am concerned that nearby neighbors will just charge on your posts if it's at no cost to them beyond a short walk.
Charles, I was looking through the video. First of all congratulations. Really great base idea. Challenge looks like how you’re going to Crossbill between the neighbors, and keep people from another block from using it when the Chargers on their street are all filled up.
Also, it would seem like without some sort of a payment gateway, it will be very difficult to keep all the neighbors from just using one neighbors post. During the day and such.
Easiest methodology would be some sort of an encoding methodology similar to what Tesla uses at the superchargers, to understand who did what. that would give a very clear billing structure to be charged back to people, but would require connectivity to replace like Tesla to track it. Another idea would be some sort of RF ID card, which would charge the user at the max rate for the number of minutes that they used it. Or, 30 minutes of charge per swipe. Or something like that. It would have to have some sort of an interchange that would end it when the plug was pulled, or when the amperage ceased go flowing to the car.
Another way would be to include that with some sort of an meter on the wire that could do an active billing for how many amps were used during that charging session and then charge back the Neighbor who had a credit card on file. most of this could be put on a circuit board.
I wish i knew how much it costs to install and where you do installs
I can see this also be the new mailbox post. It can serve as a double duty. As for usage I can also see nfc tag usage. If you come across one you just use your phone to scan an nfc and you pay for the usage and the home owner gets a small cut as part of being part of the communal network. Lots of other things you can do with this (allow others to use during certain hours, etc)
Very cool idea. I don't park on the street anymore, but in most cities this would be great.
Just a food for thought, have you thought of the idea of also making it a fence post. Invisible in plain sight but there when you needed it.
Cool concept. I dig it. Sometimes the most elegant solution is the simplest
Does the 'post' have continuous power or is a signal used to trigger the power connect at the source in the premises?
I'm asking this because I'm wondering what happens if the post gets damaged, for example a car knocking it over or being vandalised.
Don't want that having power at that point.
Also for vandals. Maybe a really loud squealer or very bright LEDs in the 'post' as warning or to frighten them off.
Software developer here! I love the idea of having a website or app you could open that would allow you to see open chargers or broken chargers, if you were just wanting to use some else’s
Stateside as well. I hated the idea of leaving cables out in the elements all year with most type 1 charging configurations. My biggest gripe with public charging is much wear level 2 station cables see.
So in 19' I bought two of the OpenEVSE charger DIY kits and reworked them to run to very small outdoor box with two Type 2 female sockets. While the OpenEVSE components stay in a relative cool indoor location. I purchased a few Type2 to Type1 cables and have been satisfied ever since. dual 32A chargers at the house is fantastic.
The main issue though has always been the Type1 plug, They should have never had the Latch/microswitch/resistor as its always been my source of wear/failure. I have still have mixed feelings on the move to NACS over Type2, because discontinuing type1 should have been done years ago. But its a step in the right direction.
Interesting. One major problem (especially if its a city build out) is how do you stop people other than you from stealing your power? Or alternatively how can you pay? Not a silver bullet, but probably a better idea than permanently leaving a cable outside for meth heads to steal.
A little bit of sidewalk ambient lighting might be nice as well. Especially if you consider people leaving for work before the sun comes up.
Also probably a good idea to just make the NACS (tesla) version only. Since the country will be switching over this year for basically every new EV.
I think it's a great idea, however, you are still leaving the cable unattended overnight. If someone has a lopper and electrician's gloves, they can just lop it off in a few minutes. I've seen a different solution where the cable comes down from a utility pole and has a retraction mechanism that pulls the cable tight and pulls the cable up when not being used. Much more expensive to implement but more secure.
In some places people can still have nice things.
I like this idea. I have a house that I need to travel to but there are no charging stations along the route. I would suggest the access door have a hinge and a way to place a lock on the door. Is this going to be any different that a NEMA 14-50 to J1772 plug that one would maybe carry in their car? I use the NEMA 14-50 plug now and was thinking of this solution for the other location. Appreciate your thoughts.
An excellent idea. I also believe the removable cable is going to win out as it eliminates the need for the operator to keep replacing damaged/stolen cables. One thing I would add is a metal loop to enable these posts to do double duty and serve as a bike rack as well as the option to charge an Ebike from.
We aren't married to the current post design. Actually, we've moved on to a super small socket that can be installed just about anywhere. Integrated bike racks/charging stations are definitely an option!
@@chargeeverywhere I agree it's a really awesome design and option. Wish I had some to invest, I see major potential. The major downside I see is snow plowing piles
I love this idea! I think this is a great opportunity for new home developments to just add these outside of homes on the curb already! If its not need, no worries, but sets up the infrastructure to be ready for it when the time comes. However, i do wish there was a way to do this without detachable cables, but I understand the complexity with that.
I would suggest adding a signature shape to your post. Maybe baseball bat shape or a very narrow pyramid or slight lollipop shape. Something that would become recognizable to everyone as a charging post. Just like the iPhone popularity was partially built on the art of its physical shape. This would add to the appeal and help discourage non-charging vehicles from parking at the charger by accident. And it would reduce confusion of people thinking a mailbox post or fence post was a charger. We are primates who get around largely by vision so the shape is a big element of the charger. And add break-away fasteners like plastic nuts to the base so when they are hit they can be quickly put back up. Good luck!
Congrats on thinking it through, prototyping, and getting my eyes to view.
My input on the output;
Neighbors and their hoods are all different. Security and monetization may be key. I have one on my property, and on my utility billl? Do others bring their own cord? Do they put quarters in the machine? Do they sue me if they trip and fall in my Jellystone rock garden?
I hope you have great success with your solution.
I had no idea USA was not already doing this; so you are doing exact my the right thing, best of luck.
And to help others understand; with type 2 (in UK and Europe) the interlocking is quite clever; if the car is locked and charging both ends are locked (random person cannot unplug nor steal the cable), most unlock the car end when you unlock the car and only unlock the charger end when you disconnect the car end.
So where you live, individual homeowners pay thousands of dollars (or Euros, etc.) to install chargers on the street for ANYONE to use, with no metering or payment capabilities? Somehow I doubt that. This is possibly the stupidest idea I’ve ever heard.
I think you original idea of retracting the cables would still be needed in some places where cable theft is a possibility. Or get a way of locking the cable to the charger while in use
Seems neat. Would be cool to see how you’re going to handle the payment piece for the homeowner. In a perfect world you’d have a simple app that allows the homeowner to set their own rates and/or access control for who’s allowed to unlock and use the electricity. Super smart idea so far
Just curious, why not a NEMA 14/50? So people don't plug RVs in? I feel like most EVs come with a NEMA -> car "charger", wouldn't people need to get a different cable/adapter? I guess said "charger" isn't always waterproof so eh, I guess this makes sense lol
I'm assuming the problem is water-proofing, plus the outlet will always be energized and that might be a shock/fire hazard if somebody hits the fixture with their car.
NEMA 14-50 doesn't offer any safety mechanisms to avoid overloading the circuit if the car tries to charge too fast. A proper EVSE will negotiate with the car so it charges at either the speed the car wants or the speed the EVSE can deliver, whichever is less.
@@PSBytea cutoff switch on the property solves that problem. Also prevents unwanted randos from using your stanchion.
This is so awesome. This is going to be a game changer. I'm 100% behind this idea.
this is SO COOL!!! Awesome. love what you're doing
What are you soing about payments? How does someone pay for the power theyre using?
I'm in the UK. I think the best solution for this goes like this. Standard power outlets are put on multiple lamp posts around the city. However, there is a box that allows you to log-in to your home power account. There will need to be a security method to this, so perhaps a dongle or key that you pay a little extra for. The ends of the cable are secured against tampering, and you are charged to your normal account. This is a no brainer for me. Sure, if you want to rapid charge, then you can go and get ripped off at a rapid charging station, but this would solve the problems for people living in urban areas without access to slow charging. As the power infrastructure for slow charging is already everywhere, this could be done at little cost to the power companies, but would pay for itself eventually. Crucially, this should only be slightly more expensive than charging at home, to encourage urban dwellers to go electric (after all, they are the ones who suffer the most pollution). This scheme should be government administered, and not open to exploitation by greedy private firms. The ramifications of the EV transition to urban living and house prices are quite dangerously unfair. If the fuel is expensive, and without affordable infrastructure for charging, this will make urban living less attractive and push urban housing costs down.
A phone app could do this too.
Doesn't the type 2 / j3400 work off light poles in Europe? Then only the city is liable not the home owner.