Glad to see you and the MvM community still kicking, haven’t had much time to play bc school, but ill certainly be back at some point especially after seeing some clips of myself playing last summers event and remembering how fun it was
Sounds great, heavy is my mvm main and my 3rd most played class overall, so i'm very much down to hear what you got to say for unothodox strategies that deviate from what the "meta" is, but are still extremally good if not better than the "meta" regarding my favorite russian with a minigun
Firmware Frenzy was my first ever community MVM tour and I've been watching a lot of your stuff to get up to speed on MvM. Really appreciate your videos!
Wdym more? Pretty much all youtubers except him make misleading videos which makes average player perform so badly. Honestly I think removing mvm segment from youtube entirely would increase skill level in mvm by a bit. The point I'm trying to make is that other youtubers deserve 0 attention or else you will leave with brain damage after their videos. Underscore's guides are a lot better than what's popular, they're still not perfect though
I guess we need better quality thumbnail and overall video in order to outperform those guys like weezy and dewill. No offence, they might be good mann up players, but outside of two cities some of their advices are wrong
@@dis_pencer I mean of course they mostly play Mann-up, so their advice is for mann up. They don't make content for general MvM, or maybe they just don't play community. It's not like they've said anything. Also, a lot of the advice from them is still applicable for outside in community too. What about it doesn't work?
Imo madness vs machines is the best community operation ever made. It's also the first community operation i completed, yeah, i learned a lot about mvm thx to that event and continued on improving with later tours
speaking of heavy, i think huo long heater is slightly better than brass beast. you get more damage while being up close to giants, and heavy body blocking them is already a good thing to do, also you get faster speed while trying to dodge projectiles while using it with a more passive playstile. I also seen some players use natasha just so they would get damage resistance without downside of being so slow
Both give damage penalty which is the most important stat on heavy and huo long only deals additional damage point blank if you don't have pyro, also being outperfomed by brass beast in dps. If you wanna tryhard there are only 2 good options - brass beast or stock
The other dude is right. Huo long heater does more damage at close range, and close range only unless you have a Pyro way off in the distance flaming enemies for you. It's not unusable, just not meta. But the natascha is a great counterpick minigun if you are constantly rushed by super scouts that your team is having trouble dealing with.
entire point of heavy is too tank damage and body block giants, putting him in close range of said giants. If you pair it with boxing gloves you get to melt those giants faster than even spy would @@mariustan9275
While I don't agree with everything you say or do, you make really good quality videos. For me specifically, the Spy video showed me how he can be viable but really difficult. If you need something put out that doesn't require the full effort of one video I'd like to see you react to Weezy's video on Spy or at least hear your thoughts on it. I know you might disagree that Spy is weakest but honestly, he has good points, and most of the points against Spy are less "Spy is the weakest class" and "Spy gets screwed over the most by everyone else, sometimes even his own teammates". Maybe you can give your thoughts on his tier lists? He made those for 2 Cities specifically and later expanded to most of Mann Up and I'd like to see your thoughts given how much community you play. Or his videos on the community in general like the gas passer?
I actually left a comment on Weezy's Spy video. It boiled down to: 1. Yes, The Spy is the overall weakest class. 2. Part of this is because The Medic's 2013 buffs made The Spy redundant. 3. The stale state of Mann Up, which is artificially easy due to everyone having the missions memorized, also makes The Spy redundant. 4. There are still missions where The Spy is the best class. 5. I'd rather have a slightly underpowered class than another overpowered one. It's good to not agree with everything other people say. That means you're capable of coming to your own conclusions.
@UnderscoreGamingChannel Thanks for actually saying that it's fine to have my own opinion. But I'd like to ask specifically what about the Medic 2013 buffs that make the Spy redundant. Sure the shield is really strong, but it serves an entirely different function compared to Spy. The shield blocks projectiles and bullets except fire, and the Spy kills giants quickly. I'd honestly like to see a reaction video. Normally I think reaction videos are meh and I only watch ones where they can offer their own input, like maybe teachers watching edutainment videos. Given how there would probably be a lot of factors going into this sort of thing, I'd be willing to watch one of those, and it'd probably easier to make a reaction video (you don't need your face) than a full MvM guide. Just a suggestion. Merry Christmas.
@@mariustan9275 In addition to his easy-to-measure high DPS against Giants, an important part of The Spy is his harder-to-measure abilities of getting close to very dangerous robots (giant or otherwise) using disguises and of stealing aggro from his teammates. Some people say that the latter is one of The Scout's key abilities, but I think The Spy is better at it because he steals aggro in a way that teammates can more easily anticipate and take advantage of. The Medic's Projectile Shield makes it easy to defeat most things with a W+M1 Heavy, disincentivizing any tactics that don't involve brute force. Behind the Projectile Shield, it usually doesn't matter what you're facing, as long as you have the DPS. It's not invincible, but it works most of the time, so why bother with things like distractions and sneaking up from behind? It should also be noted that The Spy probably benefits from The Medic's Reanimator less than any other class, making the ability to revive teammates effectively a buff for every class EXCEPT The Spy. I agree that reaction videos are usually "meh", and I don't intend to make any at this time.
@UnderscoreGamingChannel So what you're saying is that normally a Heavy can't just put his cross hair on a giant, hold mouse one and kill a giant because the giant would obliterate Heavy, but the shield makes the Heavy invincible unless the giant is running a laser weapon or is a Pyro, thus making it possible to W+M1 giants to death. I get it. I think it's mostly official MvM that has this problem even when it is sometimes present in community. At least in community things like endless bison Lazer beams that cut through shields and dragon fury pyros means that a shield can be less effective, and giant vaccinator and more giant medics in general make running a Spy more effective. But I understand why you see the shield is overpowered. A lot of people would be really angry if it was nerfed into oblivion and as a Medic main in casual and mvm I still want the ability to have the shield and shield bash and kill bots with it. What would you do to make it less strong in a way that people would be OK with? Edit: I thought of something. In Overwatch, Reinhardt has a similar shield but generates on it's own and has it's own healthbar rather than an infinite spam blocker. What do you think of that?
@@mariustan9275 I don't know how I'd rebalance the shield. I haven't thought much about it. The shield having a "health bar" seems like an interesting idea. If I recall, many of the lasers and other things in community MvM missions that counter the shield were added specifically because the mission creators viewed the shield as a problem.
I was expecting Heavy last, if at all. You haven't given the impression that you think there's much to him.
Glad to see you and the MvM community still kicking, haven’t had much time to play bc school, but ill certainly be back at some point especially after seeing some clips of myself playing last summers event and remembering how fun it was
Sounds great, heavy is my mvm main and my 3rd most played class overall, so i'm very much down to hear what you got to say for unothodox strategies that deviate from what the "meta" is, but are still extremally good if not better than the "meta" regarding my favorite russian with a minigun
Firmware Frenzy was my first ever community MVM tour and I've been watching a lot of your stuff to get up to speed on MvM. Really appreciate your videos!
your videos deserve moore attention than most mvm youutubers
Wdym more? Pretty much all youtubers except him make misleading videos which makes average player perform so badly. Honestly I think removing mvm segment from youtube entirely would increase skill level in mvm by a bit. The point I'm trying to make is that other youtubers deserve 0 attention or else you will leave with brain damage after their videos. Underscore's guides are a lot better than what's popular, they're still not perfect though
I agree. His guides show you how to play well as the classes in mvm.
I guess we need better quality thumbnail and overall video in order to outperform those guys like weezy and dewill. No offence, they might be good mann up players, but outside of two cities some of their advices are wrong
@@dis_pencer And the fact they just do mann-up pretty much.
@@dis_pencer I mean of course they mostly play Mann-up, so their advice is for mann up. They don't make content for general MvM, or maybe they just don't play community. It's not like they've said anything. Also, a lot of the advice from them is still applicable for outside in community too. What about it doesn't work?
No stress underscore
Thank you for your work thus far, and take your time for the heavy video
Imo madness vs machines is the best community operation ever made. It's also the first community operation i completed, yeah, i learned a lot about mvm thx to that event and continued on improving with later tours
speaking of heavy, i think huo long heater is slightly better than brass beast. you get more damage while being up close to giants, and heavy body blocking them is already a good thing to do, also you get faster speed while trying to dodge projectiles while using it with a more passive playstile. I also seen some players use natasha just so they would get damage resistance without downside of being so slow
Both give damage penalty which is the most important stat on heavy and huo long only deals additional damage point blank if you don't have pyro, also being outperfomed by brass beast in dps. If you wanna tryhard there are only 2 good options - brass beast or stock
The other dude is right. Huo long heater does more damage at close range, and close range only unless you have a Pyro way off in the distance flaming enemies for you. It's not unusable, just not meta. But the natascha is a great counterpick minigun if you are constantly rushed by super scouts that your team is having trouble dealing with.
entire point of heavy is too tank damage and body block giants, putting him in close range of said giants. If you pair it with boxing gloves you get to melt those giants faster than even spy would @@mariustan9275
Given all of the Custom MvM missions you've played up to this point, what is your favorite. My favorite event mission is Waters of a Robot Regime.
Like I said: There were over 400. It's all a blur. :)
@@UnderscoreGamingChannel True. Certainly with madness it is a bit of a blur.
That is also my favourite just for the final wave and boss. It feels so awesome.
While I don't agree with everything you say or do, you make really good quality videos. For me specifically, the Spy video showed me how he can be viable but really difficult. If you need something put out that doesn't require the full effort of one video I'd like to see you react to Weezy's video on Spy or at least hear your thoughts on it. I know you might disagree that Spy is weakest but honestly, he has good points, and most of the points against Spy are less "Spy is the weakest class" and "Spy gets screwed over the most by everyone else, sometimes even his own teammates".
Maybe you can give your thoughts on his tier lists? He made those for 2 Cities specifically and later expanded to most of Mann Up and I'd like to see your thoughts given how much community you play. Or his videos on the community in general like the gas passer?
I actually left a comment on Weezy's Spy video. It boiled down to:
1. Yes, The Spy is the overall weakest class.
2. Part of this is because The Medic's 2013 buffs made The Spy redundant.
3. The stale state of Mann Up, which is artificially easy due to everyone having the missions memorized, also makes The Spy redundant.
4. There are still missions where The Spy is the best class.
5. I'd rather have a slightly underpowered class than another overpowered one.
It's good to not agree with everything other people say. That means you're capable of coming to your own conclusions.
@UnderscoreGamingChannel Thanks for actually saying that it's fine to have my own opinion. But I'd like to ask specifically what about the Medic 2013 buffs that make the Spy redundant. Sure the shield is really strong, but it serves an entirely different function compared to Spy. The shield blocks projectiles and bullets except fire, and the Spy kills giants quickly.
I'd honestly like to see a reaction video. Normally I think reaction videos are meh and I only watch ones where they can offer their own input, like maybe teachers watching edutainment videos. Given how there would probably be a lot of factors going into this sort of thing, I'd be willing to watch one of those, and it'd probably easier to make a reaction video (you don't need your face) than a full MvM guide. Just a suggestion. Merry Christmas.
@@mariustan9275 In addition to his easy-to-measure high DPS against Giants, an important part of The Spy is his harder-to-measure abilities of getting close to very dangerous robots (giant or otherwise) using disguises and of stealing aggro from his teammates. Some people say that the latter is one of The Scout's key abilities, but I think The Spy is better at it because he steals aggro in a way that teammates can more easily anticipate and take advantage of.
The Medic's Projectile Shield makes it easy to defeat most things with a W+M1 Heavy, disincentivizing any tactics that don't involve brute force. Behind the Projectile Shield, it usually doesn't matter what you're facing, as long as you have the DPS. It's not invincible, but it works most of the time, so why bother with things like distractions and sneaking up from behind?
It should also be noted that The Spy probably benefits from The Medic's Reanimator less than any other class, making the ability to revive teammates effectively a buff for every class EXCEPT The Spy.
I agree that reaction videos are usually "meh", and I don't intend to make any at this time.
@UnderscoreGamingChannel So what you're saying is that normally a Heavy can't just put his cross hair on a giant, hold mouse one and kill a giant because the giant would obliterate Heavy, but the shield makes the Heavy invincible unless the giant is running a laser weapon or is a Pyro, thus making it possible to W+M1 giants to death. I get it.
I think it's mostly official MvM that has this problem even when it is sometimes present in community. At least in community things like endless bison Lazer beams that cut through shields and dragon fury pyros means that a shield can be less effective, and giant vaccinator and more giant medics in general make running a Spy more effective. But I understand why you see the shield is overpowered. A lot of people would be really angry if it was nerfed into oblivion and as a Medic main in casual and mvm I still want the ability to have the shield and shield bash and kill bots with it. What would you do to make it less strong in a way that people would be OK with?
Edit: I thought of something. In Overwatch, Reinhardt has a similar shield but generates on it's own and has it's own healthbar rather than an infinite spam blocker. What do you think of that?
@@mariustan9275 I don't know how I'd rebalance the shield. I haven't thought much about it. The shield having a "health bar" seems like an interesting idea.
If I recall, many of the lasers and other things in community MvM missions that counter the shield were added specifically because the mission creators viewed the shield as a problem.