I've been playing the mishra pre con and ran into the problem you mentioned with strionic resonator - you want to copy Mishra's ability as much as possible. I found running both Sakashimas is amazing, as they make copies of Mishra that don't get sacced to the legend rule, so you are increasing the number of warforms you're making each turn. This deck is so sweet I love it
A great addition to mishra is an assault suit, equip it to warform and it cant be sacrificed which is really good for keeping a key artifact copy. I am adding the jesters cap, that is a good ability as you stated.
Monkey cage is fantastic in a sharuum deck as well! When you blink her, you can sacrifice monkey cage, make 6 2/2 monkeys, and then get it from your graveyard to battlefield again :)
This deck needs Grave Pact. Its fantastic synergy with Braids so you have your opponents sacrificing multiple things. The downside is that it will make you a target so it's high risk but high reward so you'll wanna play it when you have your board set up and maybe have a counter ready for the inevitable enchantment hate.
been building my own mishra's deck for a few months now, recently I changed Jester's Cap for a Jester's Scepter, and, in one turn, had the hate of one player because I exiled the top 20 cards from his deck using its ETB and a panharmonicon. Jester's Cap enters the battlefield with Panharmonicon in play, it triggers once and a player exiles 5 cards, then Panharmonicon triggers it again, exiling 5 more. Go to the battle phase, copy the jester's cap, exile 5, and panharmonicon triggers it once more, exiling 5 more. 20 cards exiled from the top in one turn.
as soon as this guy was spoiled i already knew i had to build him. I actually already have a toggo / silas renn deck thats going to be converted over to this guy
For me Ashnod's Altar is a very very good card in this deck. Enables so much big plays. I have some token creators and with mishras warform and copies of it you can make a lot of mana. I also like to have some extra combat phases with the deck to also prog the ability of mishra again and also swing for more dmg.
Drawing 2 cards for 2 mana consistently is superior to drawing 1 card for 1 mana. ALSO you can’t attack with the hedron archive, so if you’re not gonna attack with a 4/4 it has to be worth it in order to justify not attacking. Imagine sacrificing a 4/4 for 1 card, not worth it. That’s just my thought though. If you’re going budget, it’s a good include still if you want mind stone.
Wish I saw this a few weeks ago, Mishra was my first precon deck and I thought it sucked because I didn't understand how great that ability is due to difficult wording and learning the rules of the game. Have it tore apart for a daretti deck right now will need to add some of your suggestions.
How is It that monkey cage (the token copy) sees itself? Usually this is not the case, and I’m trying to figure out how it is that it sees itself. Someone please explain!
I've gone a mean route with my Mishra, Stax pieces, Gonti's Aether Heart, Mindslaver, Mycosynth Lattice locks etc. Also Sundial of the Infinite and Obeka for if you want to keep the 4/4's around to beat down once you've stopped everyone from actually playing MTG.
How would an equipment work as an Mishra's Warform? Assuming you get the same ETBs and LTBs? Assume you don't get the equipped abilities though. But you could make a Mishra's Warform from an equipment, then attach the equipment to it, then it would fall off for another round. Thinking of blade of selves for attack trigger, would it trigger twice if equipped on itself as a warform? Would goblin mornigstar create another goblin token when it ETB's. Great video and deck focusing on soceries and instants.
As long as the equipment isn’t a creature, you can copy it, however, you wouldn’t be able to put the copy on another creature, as you can’t do anything at sorcery speed in the combat phase, and equipping is done at sorcery speed, however, if the equipment says to equip it to something when something etbs, then you could
I've seen a couple videos about this deck and it seems like nobody seems to be talking about the potential of infinite combat steps with Breath of Fury with Mishra's ability. You need evasive creatures or an opponent with their defenses down but it's still possible
Beautiful use of Monkey Cage!! I love that card also; I discovered it while building my Yorion, Sky Nomad deck. I have it exiled before any of its triggers resolve, allowing me to repeatedly generate an insane amount of green monkeys. I'll definitely have to borrow your Eye of Doom idea for the same deck! For Reference (Yorion): ruclips.net/video/0jCBAvGiMpU/видео.html Decklist in Description
Conjurer's Closet wouldn't work, since the tokens would cease to exist once you blink them. Sundial of the Infinite would be a fantastic fit here, though.
Pretty sure the rule is cards that reference themselves in the text box change that text to it’s new name. Not a judge but I’m like 90% that’s the way it works.
I have a very strange question regarding Mishra. Let’s say you liquimetal torque an aura and make a war form of an enchantment artifact creature aura construct. What happens? Does the creature become enchanted onto another creature?
that would result in Mishra having no targets, as Mishra only targets *Non-Creature* artifacts, and March of the Machines makes all artifacts creatures
not sure if you've seen it from a weekly mtg prodcast but "Monkey cage" actually has 2 homes this and the other one is "Kibo, Uktabi Prince" this is monkey and ape tribal
What happens if I make a copy of the artifact land Power Depot? Power Depot normally etbs tapped, so doesn't the copy enter untapped since the copy effect changes the name from Power Depot to Mishra's Warform? I can't find a ruling on this anywhere
Whenever a card refers to itself by name aka "power depot enters tapped" its referring to itself. So even if you change the cards name, it's still referring to itself. So the text basically changes from "power depot enters tapped" to "mishras warform enters tapped"
If skysoverign comes in as a copy but has the name mishra's warform then does it trigger the etb effect. Cause it specifically says 'when skysovereign etb...'?
@@edhdeckbuilding So do both of the cards target the original monkey cage to be sacrificed at the same time? If it changes name to mishra's warform do i get to keep it until the end of turn?
I guess I just don't really get copying entirely. If it specifies Monkey Cage to be sacrificed, does the card switch to Mishra's Warform to be sacrificed when it's copied?
It doesn't become a new permanent, only changing zones, so the way I understand it is it will get sacced by an opponent on your end step. Since the the activated ability is sorcery speed, said opponent can't remove a counter to tutor before it gets sacced
@alphaskag1878 No actually they would keep it. L1 - The delayed trigger setup by mishra is controlled by the mishra player. When it goes on the stack the mishra player cannot sacrifice something controlled by another player. So the talisman token would stick around.
Bought the precon Planning to change maximum 10 cards not more to keep its power not too high. No big combo obviously I found some other interesting cards I will post them when I have the time
I added a warstorm surge and man that card go nuts in this deck dealing 4 damage if not more every turn play my upgrade deck with my brother now he's having a big problem trying to beat this deck lol
So does this mean with Mishra out you don't have to pay the sacrifice cost of an artifact with a sacrifice ability with a cost? like the 8 cost on idol of oblivion? Or is that not how that works?
Unfortunately, you can't sacrifice a creature to two abilities (Mishra's triggered and Idol's activated), either you sacrifice to Mishra's ability when it resolves and nothing else happens or you pay 8 and sacrifice to the copied Idol's ability beforehand.
@@olburgle2841 I see. But I can get the effect for free (not pay the 8) if I'm using Mishra to sacrifice the card instead? I can't double up but I can ignore the cost/condition on the card? I guess I'm trying to wrap my mind around how the sacrifice mechanic works.
@@creeplordx1x Yeah i get what you're saying. There's no easy way to cheat the 8 mana cost on Idol. I guess what you're more thinking of is when a permanent has a triggered ability of "when this dies" or "when this is sacrificed", those happen as a result of sacrificing (dying), not as part of an activation cost (anything before the colon ":" in the ability.)
@@olburgle2841 so for example from the video. Hedron Archive 2 mana tap to sacrifice to draw a card. Does mishra text to sacrifice the token mean you do not have to pay 2 and tap to get the draw? (from the token) Or does Mishra warform copy have to pay 2 to draw?
@@creeplordx1x You would still have to pay the 2 to draw, and it has to be done before Mishra's sacrifice ability resolves. It comes back to Mishra's Warform now having 2 separate abilities that involve sacrificing, Mishra's sacrifice trigger from making the Mishra's Warform, and the Hedron Archive's activated ability (for being a copy) which is paying 2 and sacrifice, to draw 2. Since the copy can only be sacrificed to one ability, they can't replace the cost of the other ability in order to get more value.
@@ShiningCrimzon bro what? It’s mostly a colorless deck AND you’d only be casting Obeka after or right before you cast Mishra, meaning you’d already have your colors. If not then you need to check your mana base lol.
@@ant7433 absolutely run Obeka she’s a bomb in the deck that dude is crazy lol it’s the same colors you need for your commander. She’s in my Mishra deck and works great.
Hmm... Mindslaver is saying "4T, Sacrifice Mindslaver: You control target player's next turn". As a copy of the Mindslaver is called "Mishra's Warform" now, I guess you can't perma-lock an opponent with this one.... as you have to sacrifice "Mindslaver".
Interesting cards Enthusiastic Mechanic for cost reduction FOr damage Marionette master FOr graveyard hate Stonespeaker Crystal FOr scry/draw Weatherlight COmpleated Graveyard recursion Altar of Bhaal and Scrap Welder For small bodies Prized STatues and Nimblewright Schematic For Draw Shadow heart, Dark Justiciar FOr copying artifact abiliies Tawnos, Urza's Apprentice Panharmonicon if a lot of ETBs
Wouldn't the fact that Mishra's ability changes the name of the token affect the ability of the vehicle token? Like, when you make the copy of Nautaloid Ship, it comes in as Mishra's Warform but it's ability will still say, "When Nautaloid Ship enters the battlefield, exile target players graveyard" so does that ability even procs then or am I making this more complicated then it is?
Right, I was wondering the same thing. But wotc put things like ichor wellspring in the precon. If this were the case they would be pointless includes for the theme.
Whenever a card references it's own name in game terms it just means "this card." So Mishra's ability works since the name change really only matters for things being legendary in this case.
The text actually just means: "When [Insert card's name] enter the battlefield...". So it doesn't matter if the name changes, the effect still resolves as if its name was Nautaloid Ship.
@@derekgunnels4856 I think giving them vigilance would allow you to attack with them as well as use the original artifacts ability on the same turn. Makes it a bit stronger. But thats my thought. I may be wrong.
Mishra> Urza Urza is too easy… I like that Mishra you have allot of possibilities while the urza deck is brainless and just goes for artifact creatures every turn
I just about doubled over laughing when you brought up Monkey Cage! Excellent picks all around.
I've used monkey cage many times. Such a fun card.
@@huntergrant6520 Oh, for sure! The interaction was what cracked me up. Too good!
What if you copy monkey cage
I love how learning this deck is helping me understand so many rules better like copies.
I really apreciate the interaction and rule explanation, your channel rocks.
My issue is, that i want to keep old borders on every Card ._.
Thats my problem as well. The look gets thrown off and the ocd is triggered.
All of us :(
I agree, but I HAD to let it go. The precon comes with some serious dead cards in my opinion.
All of the 15 ish cards that care about ashnod pretty much
I have spent years hoping to figure out what to do with monkey cage
I've been playing the mishra pre con and ran into the problem you mentioned with strionic resonator - you want to copy Mishra's ability as much as possible. I found running both Sakashimas is amazing, as they make copies of Mishra that don't get sacced to the legend rule, so you are increasing the number of warforms you're making each turn. This deck is so sweet I love it
this list you make is really good... so many sleeper cards you have discovered
A great addition to mishra is an assault suit, equip it to warform and it cant be sacrificed which is really good for keeping a key artifact copy. I am adding the jesters cap, that is a good ability as you stated.
Monkey cage is fantastic in a sharuum deck as well! When you blink her, you can sacrifice monkey cage, make 6 2/2 monkeys, and then get it from your graveyard to battlefield again :)
Great video my friend!!!!
This deck needs Grave Pact. Its fantastic synergy with Braids so you have your opponents sacrificing multiple things. The downside is that it will make you a target so it's high risk but high reward so you'll wanna play it when you have your board set up and maybe have a counter ready for the inevitable enchantment hate.
Cool stuff
been building my own mishra's deck for a few months now, recently I changed Jester's Cap for a Jester's Scepter, and, in one turn, had the hate of one player because I exiled the top 20 cards from his deck using its ETB and a panharmonicon.
Jester's Cap enters the battlefield with Panharmonicon in play, it triggers once and a player exiles 5 cards, then Panharmonicon triggers it again, exiling 5 more. Go to the battle phase, copy the jester's cap, exile 5, and panharmonicon triggers it once more, exiling 5 more. 20 cards exiled from the top in one turn.
as soon as this guy was spoiled i already knew i had to build him. I actually already have a toggo / silas renn deck thats going to be converted over to this guy
For me Ashnod's Altar is a very very good card in this deck. Enables so much big plays. I have some token creators and with mishras warform and copies of it you can make a lot of mana.
I also like to have some extra combat phases with the deck to also prog the ability of mishra again and also swing for more dmg.
Neat deck, some really interesting inclusions and a lot of value, which i like. I was wondering, why no mind stone if you include Hedron archive?
Drawing 2 cards for 2 mana consistently is superior to drawing 1 card for 1 mana. ALSO you can’t attack with the hedron archive, so if you’re not gonna attack with a 4/4 it has to be worth it in order to justify not attacking. Imagine sacrificing a 4/4 for 1 card, not worth it.
That’s just my thought though.
If you’re going budget, it’s a good include still if you want mind stone.
Nice video
Wish I saw this a few weeks ago, Mishra was my first precon deck and I thought it sucked because I didn't understand how great that ability is due to difficult wording and learning the rules of the game. Have it tore apart for a daretti deck right now will need to add some of your suggestions.
How is It that monkey cage (the token copy) sees itself?
Usually this is not the case, and I’m trying to figure out how it is that it sees itself. Someone please explain!
I've gone a mean route with my Mishra, Stax pieces, Gonti's Aether Heart, Mindslaver, Mycosynth Lattice locks etc. Also Sundial of the Infinite and Obeka for if you want to keep the 4/4's around to beat down once you've stopped everyone from actually playing MTG.
How would an equipment work as an Mishra's Warform? Assuming you get the same ETBs and LTBs? Assume you don't get the equipped abilities though. But you could make a Mishra's Warform from an equipment, then attach the equipment to it, then it would fall off for another round. Thinking of blade of selves for attack trigger, would it trigger twice if equipped on itself as a warform? Would goblin mornigstar create another goblin token when it ETB's. Great video and deck focusing on soceries and instants.
As long as the equipment isn’t a creature, you can copy it, however, you wouldn’t be able to put the copy on another creature, as you can’t do anything at sorcery speed in the combat phase, and equipping is done at sorcery speed, however, if the equipment says to equip it to something when something etbs, then you could
Mishra, Tamer of Mak Fawa seems worthy of consideration in this deck.
Retributive Wand doesnt work with Mishra since tokens dont go to the graveyard right?
I've seen a couple videos about this deck and it seems like nobody seems to be talking about the potential of infinite combat steps with Breath of Fury with Mishra's ability. You need evasive creatures or an opponent with their defenses down but it's still possible
Also Combat Celebrant + Machine God's Effigy for much easier infinite combat phases
monkey cage is a fantastic idea 😀
heh you guys ever make 4 copy's of Doubling cube with him? with the legendary artifact. It's uhh pretty fun lol
Beautiful use of Monkey Cage!! I love that card also; I discovered it while building my Yorion, Sky Nomad deck. I have it exiled before any of its triggers resolve, allowing me to repeatedly generate an insane amount of green monkeys.
I'll definitely have to borrow your Eye of Doom idea for the same deck!
For Reference (Yorion):
ruclips.net/video/0jCBAvGiMpU/видео.html
Decklist in Description
Reject non artifacts, return to monke cage
Would conjourer’s closet and sundial the infinite work well for this commander ?
Conjurer's Closet wouldn't work, since the tokens would cease to exist once you blink them.
Sundial of the Infinite would be a fantastic fit here, though.
Does the sleeper dart work? Its not named “Sleeper Dart” anymore for the token
Pretty sure the rule is cards that reference themselves in the text box change that text to it’s new name. Not a judge but I’m like 90% that’s the way it works.
@@pistolpete7422 yeah that's correct, this also applies to creatures that steal abilities from others. The name just gets replaced!
I have a very strange question regarding Mishra. Let’s say you liquimetal torque an aura and make a war form of an enchantment artifact creature aura construct. What happens? Does the creature become enchanted onto another creature?
it attaches as it etbs, then detaches as a state based action
Would u personally put March of the machines into your deck or do u think that would conflict with mishra's ability to much?
that would result in Mishra having no targets, as Mishra only targets *Non-Creature* artifacts, and March of the Machines makes all artifacts creatures
How does thaumatic compass Work with mishra? if i transform the copy do i still sacrifice it? or it is a different card?
you only copy the face side of the card, so its a thaumatic compass that doesn't have a second side, I think that's how that works
not sure if you've seen it from a weekly mtg prodcast but "Monkey cage" actually has 2 homes this and the other one is "Kibo, Uktabi Prince" this is monkey and ape tribal
Monkey cage has won so many games in my Karn deck might have to pick it up for Mishra
What happens if I make a copy of the artifact land Power Depot? Power Depot normally etbs tapped, so doesn't the copy enter untapped since the copy effect changes the name from Power Depot to Mishra's Warform? I can't find a ruling on this anywhere
Whenever a card refers to itself by name aka "power depot enters tapped" its referring to itself. So even if you change the cards name, it's still referring to itself. So the text basically changes from "power depot enters tapped" to "mishras warform enters tapped"
If skysoverign comes in as a copy but has the name mishra's warform then does it trigger the etb effect. Cause it specifically says 'when skysovereign etb...'?
yes, the name is replaced by the actual card name since it point to itself
I'm a little new trying to get into commander, at 13:58 Why does the Mishra's Warform trigger alongside the Monkey cage?
the creature entering the battlefield and the trigger from a creature entering the battlefield happen at the same time.
@@edhdeckbuilding So do both of the cards target the original monkey cage to be sacrificed at the same time? If it changes name to mishra's warform do i get to keep it until the end of turn?
I guess I just don't really get copying entirely. If it specifies Monkey Cage to be sacrificed, does the card switch to Mishra's Warform to be sacrificed when it's copied?
@@youmadgamer no both of them trigger from a creature entering the battlefield
@@youmadgamerif a card has its name on it, it essentially means “this card”
Gonti's Aether Heart can offer extra turn plays.
Wishclaw Talisman. Create a Mishra's Warform copy, use it once to tutor, since it gets sacced you're not giving it to an opponent. Tutor at will 😁
Can you sacrifice it if you don't control it?
It doesn't become a new permanent, only changing zones, so the way I understand it is it will get sacced by an opponent on your end step. Since the the activated ability is sorcery speed, said opponent can't remove a counter to tutor before it gets sacced
@alphaskag1878 No actually they would keep it.
L1 - The delayed trigger setup by mishra is controlled by the mishra player. When it goes on the stack the mishra player cannot sacrifice something controlled by another player. So the talisman token would stick around.
Bought the precon
Planning to change maximum 10 cards not more to keep its power not too high. No big combo obviously
I found some other interesting cards
I will post them when I have the time
You might have forgotten to change power and toughness on 11:17
I added a warstorm surge and man that card go nuts in this deck dealing 4 damage if not more every turn play my upgrade deck with my brother now he's having a big problem trying to beat this deck lol
If i get a Warform of the Flagship, why does the Warform Deals 3 Damage?
The Card says only the Flagship triggers it. Can Someone explain it to me?
The war form is a copy of the artifact with all of that artifacts abilities
if a card says it’s name, it’s basically saying “this card”
So does this mean with Mishra out you don't have to pay the sacrifice cost of an artifact with a sacrifice ability with a cost? like the 8 cost on idol of oblivion? Or is that not how that works?
Unfortunately, you can't sacrifice a creature to two abilities (Mishra's triggered and Idol's activated), either you sacrifice to Mishra's ability when it resolves and nothing else happens or you pay 8 and sacrifice to the copied Idol's ability beforehand.
@@olburgle2841 I see. But I can get the effect for free (not pay the 8) if I'm using Mishra to sacrifice the card instead? I can't double up but I can ignore the cost/condition on the card? I guess I'm trying to wrap my mind around how the sacrifice mechanic works.
@@creeplordx1x Yeah i get what you're saying. There's no easy way to cheat the 8 mana cost on Idol. I guess what you're more thinking of is when a permanent has a triggered ability of "when this dies" or "when this is sacrificed", those happen as a result of sacrificing (dying), not as part of an activation cost (anything before the colon ":" in the ability.)
@@olburgle2841 so for example from the video. Hedron Archive 2 mana tap to sacrifice to draw a card. Does mishra text to sacrifice the token mean you do not have to pay 2 and tap to get the draw? (from the token) Or does Mishra warform copy have to pay 2 to draw?
@@creeplordx1x You would still have to pay the 2 to draw, and it has to be done before Mishra's sacrifice ability resolves. It comes back to Mishra's Warform now having 2 separate abilities that involve sacrificing, Mishra's sacrifice trigger from making the Mishra's Warform, and the Hedron Archive's activated ability (for being a copy) which is paying 2 and sacrifice, to draw 2. Since the copy can only be sacrificed to one ability, they can't replace the cost of the other ability in order to get more value.
Chromatic Orrery and Voltaic servant. Make a token copy of the CO and proceed to draw and cast your deck with infinite mana you can use as any color
You sure you don’t mean Voltaic Construct?
@@TheSPARTANusm you're right it's construct
Sundial of the Infinite works if you want to keep the warforms
Would you wanna run obeka as well just to run into that effect more often ?
@@ant7433 No, 3 colors is a steep cost imo
@@ShiningCrimzon ig depends on playgroup and power levels
@@ShiningCrimzon bro what? It’s mostly a colorless deck AND you’d only be casting Obeka after or right before you cast Mishra, meaning you’d already have your colors. If not then you need to check your mana base lol.
@@ant7433 absolutely run Obeka she’s a bomb in the deck that dude is crazy lol it’s the same colors you need for your commander.
She’s in my Mishra deck and works great.
Eye of Doom is awful. It doesn't say they control.... what's stopping them from putting Counters on your stuff?
Thought so too, they can group up and just place doom counters on the eye xD
Doom! Doom! Doom! Doom! Dooom!
👍
MONKEY CAGE!! YES FINALLY! 🐒
Hmm... Mindslaver is saying "4T, Sacrifice Mindslaver: You control target player's next turn". As a copy of the Mindslaver is called "Mishra's Warform" now, I guess you can't perma-lock an opponent with this one.... as you have to sacrifice "Mindslaver".
If a card references itself with its name, then a copy (even with a different name) will still reference itself. So... you can perma-lock an opponent
Interesting cards
Enthusiastic Mechanic for cost reduction
FOr damage Marionette master
FOr graveyard hate Stonespeaker Crystal
FOr scry/draw Weatherlight COmpleated
Graveyard recursion Altar of Bhaal and Scrap Welder
For small bodies Prized STatues and Nimblewright Schematic
For Draw Shadow heart, Dark Justiciar
FOr copying artifact abiliies Tawnos, Urza's Apprentice
Panharmonicon if a lot of ETBs
Wouldn't the fact that Mishra's ability changes the name of the token affect the ability of the vehicle token? Like, when you make the copy of Nautaloid Ship, it comes in as Mishra's Warform but it's ability will still say, "When Nautaloid Ship enters the battlefield, exile target players graveyard" so does that ability even procs then or am I making this more complicated then it is?
Right, I was wondering the same thing. But wotc put things like ichor wellspring in the precon. If this were the case they would be pointless includes for the theme.
Whenever a card references it's own name in game terms it just means "this card." So Mishra's ability works since the name change really only matters for things being legendary in this case.
The text actually just means: "When [Insert card's name] enter the battlefield...". So it doesn't matter if the name changes, the effect still resolves as if its name was Nautaloid Ship.
Can Mishra get around the legends rule of only one legendary name?
The copy created by mishra has a different name => gets around the legend rule
@@EineChillkroete thank you, I was thinking why not make tokens of legendary artifacts like the immortal sun or ugins nexus or something
Still don't want to include legends
Stonespeaker Crystal > Hedron Archive.
i had some people hittin hard with this deck until one guy got 162 life sadly damm coin flips lol
My issue with this deck is finding wincons
Yuuuup. I've been saying this to ppl for a while. It just does stuff, that's it. Going infinite to win is lame.
The warform should have had vigilance
@@Zeromus5555 it get sacrificed though
It's casual commander games don't have to end ( :
@@derekgunnels4856 I think giving them vigilance would allow you to attack with them as well as use the original artifacts ability on the same turn. Makes it a bit stronger. But thats my thought. I may be wrong.
I just don't want any legendaries in the deck hope this will help
Wishclaw talisman get real toolboxie, and political as well
Mishra> Urza
Urza is too easy… I like that Mishra you have allot of possibilities while the urza deck is brainless and just goes for artifact creatures every turn