Wheel of Rock - Van Halen (Albums Tier List)
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- Опубликовано: 13 янв 2025
- Are you a Roth or Hagar fan? We tackle that question and more as we rank the incredible albums by the legendary Van Halen. This might have been the Wheel episode with the most arguing. How do you rank these?
Host: Roie Avin
Panel: Kyle Fagala, Victor Giol, Prog Nick
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Opening theme music to podcast: • Art Crime
#vanhalen #sammyhagar #davidleeroth
How about an Iron Maiden Wheel of Rock?
I would love that so much!
Maiden is prog imo
Yes, please!
Please, no...
There is no way F. U. C. K. is ranked higher than VH II or Fair Warning… mind blowing
Love this- my first time catching the Wheel of Rock. Great episode and channel!🇨🇦
Love both eras of the band.
Welcome. Check out some of the other episodes!
"Fair Warning" is a masterpiece. It is by far their best album.
43:43 Yep, the genius of 1984 is its two themes: party rockers and sophisticated deep cuts. There's a sly moment in Panama that marries the two: in the breakdown (right before "yeah, we're runnin' a lil' bit hot..."), Edward plays a dissonant, arppeggiated chord in the middle of an AC/DC-style party tune! It winks at some of the other weird stuff (e.g. Holdsworth-ian outro of Drop Dead Legs) on this fabulous record.
I got see VH support Black Sabbath in 1978, and blow them off stage in a major way. Saw them headline in 1979, and brilliant. Finally in 1980, and the ego expand was very clear. Sloppiness had started to set in, even at that early stage.
I often say that if I could see any band past or present, the "Sunset Strip era" of VH would be in my top 5.
I keep wondering when you're going to do one of these on Marillion. Seems perfect for the format: lots of albums, distinct eras with different lead singers/lyricists, still making albums to present, etc.
It's on the list. Will happen.
Can’t get enough of the Wheel episodes!
Great episode, love how you all have different and strong opinions. This episode made me realize that I have honestly never dug into Van Halen deep cuts, other than I and 1984
Hey, I like Ou812. It has an underccoked production that gives it a laid back vibe.
As a Lifelong VH fan I could Never put 5150 over Anything in the Dave era!! Sammy was Great but VH with Diamond Dave was MAGIC!! Lightning in a bottle that struck the same bottle 6 times before they're break. Edward and Dave Changed Everything! Yes appetite is a defining album but even Slash says Edward was on the level of Hendrix and the Beatles as far as a mania for electric guitar. JMO but Everything in order is VH best. Yeah you can jumble up a few but that's just the way I feel.
History kinda shows what happened in 84. Dave had an ego is an understatement but so did Edward! Here's what I believe summed up. Dave wanted Ed to be the guitar hero he was and Ed wanted to be the musician he believed he was. Just that simple. Everything else is just Noise. Both were Right and Wrong at the same time. Long live the Mighty Van Halen 🎸
I'm sure most people know that VH was a cover band for years before they broke in 78. Hours of playing covers is probably why they were So good at it. I almost came unglued hearing your thoughts on women and children and even saying the word Cheese with Intruder. And I'll go to my grave saying if a different kind of truth came out in 85 or 86 it would be a Smash VH hit album. Timing is EVERYTHING! Dave and the boys knew that👍🎸
The panelists were fighting before the video? Sounds like something Van Halen would do
hahaha. So true.
S: Van Halen, Fair Warning, 1984
A: Van Halen II, Women and Children First, Diver Down
B: 5150, For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge
C: OU812, Balance
D: Different Kind of Truth, Van Halen III
*Edited to conform to the rules for the amount of albums in each tier. I had the bottom 4 all in C tier but I pretty much agree with what was said ranking those. If I didn’t want to show my DLR era bias I could maybe be persuaded to swap F.U.C.K. or 5150 for Diver Down.
As usual, Kyle saves these tier lists for me with the relatable takes. Been listening to these at work ever since I found the channel via the Opeth episode with Mike Portnoy. Been trying to go through the rest of that discography before I see them in Denver later in October, but it’s so dense!
Also, after finishing this: I think you guys are sleeping on both In a Simple Rhyme and House of Pain. HOP has one of my favorite Eddie solos. It was an early song of theirs too, you can find a 1976 demo of it on RUclips that absolutely rips! Check it out everyone!
Balance was a fantastic album, with not a single bad song on the entire record.
I enjoy that my favorite band - the original Van Halen - still gets talked about!!
I’d respectfully disagree a bit:
1-Fair Warning (S) my intro to the band is still my very favorite album of all albums/all bands and Mean Street my favorite song. I listen to this at least weekly to this day.
2-Van Halen (S) in my opinion the greatest debut, especially in terms of impact, ever.
3-1984 (S)
4-Van Halen II (A) this would be another (S) but I’m trying to abide by your rules
5-A Different Kind of Truth (A) the more I listen the more I love it
6-Women and Children First (A)
7-Diver Down (B)
8-5150 (B) to be fair I love Diver Down and 5150 nearly as much as W&CF and they’d be A albums if it was just a basic grade.
9-For Unlawful Carnal
Knowledge (B)
10-Van Halen III (C) I know I’m in a large minority with this but after Edward’s passing (and covid) I spent weeks just listening to everything Van Halen and I ended up enjoying more songs (Without You, Ballot or the Bullet, Fire in the Hole) on III than on either of the next two …
11-OU812 (C)
12-Balance (D) the only Van Halen album I don’t actually love.
Thank you for your time.
The Flower Kings Wheel of Prog next, with Mike Portnoy as guest? :)
Will do Flower Kings soon.
Excellent
Gonna have to spin Fair Warning now! Thanks for another great episode, dudes.
Really enjoyed this "wheel" episode. I think the ranking are fairly spot on. I got into Van Halen with Hagar. As I started listening to the back catalog I really love the Roth era a lot more. We'll done guys!
I think if you ask any Van Halen fan, the ranking is going to be different. But this was a fun watch. Van Halen was and is my favorite band, and Edward is one of my biggest influences as a guitarist and musician.
1. Fair Warning
2. Women and Children First
3. VH I
4. VH II
5. 1984
6. Diver Down
7. A Different Kind of Truth
8. 5150
9. Balance
10. OU812
11. For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge
12. VH III
In my opinion, their third and fourth albums are their best. But, as the cliché states, we all hear - and see - things differently.
I found FM rock radio in 1977, but I don’t recall hearing VH until 1980. When NY radio played “And the Cradle Will Rock… “ THAT’S the song that grabbed me! I thought it was such a cool keyboard sound, having no clue it was Edward on guitar! Since l was a big fan of Yes, Styx, and The Cars, l dug VH right away… in 1980.
To me, the Sammy era is good - for the most part - but the Roth era is the s€$¥. The “My Sharona” album? Fuggetaboutit! Wrong singer, wrong time, bad songs. And l love the third Extreme album, nothing against Gary Sharona. 😜
Cheers 🍻 from The Big Apple. 🍎
Rock Out, Prog On and Pogo, Yo!
Your clone and mine,
~ The Moronic, Demonic, Dopamine Addicted Doppelgänger of Davey Cretin, from CRETIN CLASSICS.
It's "Hello Baby" Nick, and Hell yes to Sammy introducing himself to Van Halen "Roth" style! They stuck it to Dave everywhere they could and he had it coming! I'm having a tough time not launching into Kyle for his takes but, I promised myself I'd be nice.
Its “Hello Baby…” not “Hey Baby…”
Yep. It’s Big Bopper reference from his song ‘Chantilly Lace’ from 1958, or 59, but that’s probably before these guys’ time.
Good enough is a perfect way to introduce a new singer to the world
As always, I like to post my choices prior to watching just to see how things compare.
S - Women and Children First, Van Halen, Fair Warning
A - Van Halen II, A Different Kind of Truth, Diver Down
B - 1984, For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge
C - OU812, 5150
D - Van Halen III, Balance
Can't wait for the King Crimson Wheel, that'll be interesting as hell.
I'm mostly happy with this. I probably would have Fair Warning in S, For Unlawful Cardinal Knowledge in A, Diver Down moved up to A and 5150 in B. My son who is a huge Van Halen fan discussed it and he would move VH I to A, Fair Warning to S. VH II is his favorite but he said he would leave it in A. Also Diver Down should have its own Tier1 outside of time and space because its awesome.
Nice thoughts. I also love VHII. Diver Down is better than it gets credit.
Wow... had to hang up on y'all after the Fair Warning is not S Tier...
Zep wheel? So many .. incredible idea!
Yeh, Zep would be great.
I love that you mentioned the CD-era, in the 90s, where the only real exposure, we had to an album was the singles or music videos, etc. I recall when Van Halen III was announced, the 2 singles I had heard at the time were "Fire in the Hole" and "Without You" and after buying the album, I tried very very hard, through multiple listens to justify having spent money on this record, and it just never worked. I really love both the DLR and Hagar eras, almost equally, as different as they are musically.
I grew up in L.A., 18 years old in 1978. Saw them for the 1st time at Anaheim Stadium after they dropped VH I...saw them10x after that. This was the "Parachute" show. This was the line-up: Sammy Hagar(just a coincidence); Van Halen; Black Sabbath; and Boston. With the first chords of "On Fire", Sabbath and Boston should have gone home. VH destroyed the place. YES, Eddie was playing with his back to the crowd, at times. We had. heard of them playing in Hollywood and Pasadena, but this was just beyond. They were in full flight from day one.
Crazy that Sammy was on the same show! Sammy was actually my first ever live concert. (many years later).
Balance is underrated
1984 is a Masterpiece. Another awesome cover too.
Balance is a straight B tier. Production value and sound alone get it there for me. Only 2 meh songs. Don’t Tell Me has a beautiful and organic solo. Doing Time is a serious composition.
I had a feeling you'd be a fan of Balance.
jethro tull
iron maiden
king crimson
voivod?
Ah, memory's of CD warehouse rushin' in...spent so many hours in that joint!
Ha, totally.
I too miss CD Warehouse, yeah some of their used CD prices were a bit high compared to other shops in my area at the time, but they did have some great deals where the prices were lower than the other shops. Case in point, I took a chance on the bands It Bites and Karmakanic, mostly due to price of the ones I picked that were about a buck or two each, and also they were on Inside Out ( so I knew I would like them) so how could I go wrong.
What about Kiss on Wheel of Rock?
How about a Thin Lizzy Wheel of Rock?
Great episode. Would like to see Deep Purple, Iron Maiden, Marillion.
I’m only familiar with the songs that were on the radio. I need to check out some of these albums. Idk why I never dug into VH.
I loved OU812 because of the variety. The production was lackluster but the songs were a great mix. Conversely, the F-album had GREAT production but the songs were... I mean come on, the songs were weaker. Fans just like the higher aggression level. Swear to God. It wasn't as risky or catchy. Except yes, Judgment Day kicked some ass and Pleasure Dome had the best drumming. And Poundcake was fun too.
Who's that guy on the left? He's right hahaha! Dreams and Judgment Day all the way!
5150 is the best album, because Sammy was the best frontman for this band of course. I only say that because it's uncool to say and my "hipper" friends found me incredibly lame for thinking so. Admittedly Dave is more creative, is a brilliant a-hole, and is touched by genius, but I like the way Sammy screams, so there. Yes, he is cornier and it's sometimes embarrassing. But I like corny stuff.
I missed Michael on ADKOT.
VHIII would be fine if they'd labeled themselves as a different band. A COMPLETELY different band. And maybe changed their names. It does has nice moments but wow, what were they thinking.
The first time I heard that song from Twister, I loved it, but I instantly thought there had been a communication breakdown in the Sammy version of the band. It's a mess, but a wonderful one, like the last two from 1984. Those three songs sound half-assedly put together (House of Pain, Girl Gone Bad, Humans Being) but they're all fantastic partly because they're so undisciplined. Okay, take a few points off for Sammy's then-trendy voice effect and attempt at edgelord lyrics, but the playing. Jeez.
I realize this comment will either be seen by no one or trashed.
Nice thoughts, Steve. Corny is probably a better word for the Hagar era than Cheesy. Nothing wrong with corny if that's what ya like, and it's all subjective. DLR does his own version of cheesy, but it somehow works better for me. His albums sound more timeless to my ear these days. Also, bonus points for saying "edgelord lyrics" - love it.
@@KyleFagala Haha, thanks! I was proud of the "edgelord" mention myself
This was awesome. A lot of people talk about David Lee Roth’s voice live not sounding great these days but to me he was never a great singer live. If you look at some of those old live Van Halen videos, he would mumble & forget lyrics constantly. Studio wise, he sings great.
It's unfair only allow x number of albums in any one tier. For me, "Van Halen I," "Van Halen II," "Fair Warning" and "1984" recieve an "S." "Women and Children First" get's an "A" only because there is no continuity to the album. It is all over the place.
"Van Halen III" gets a "B." "5150" gets a "C." "For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge," "OU812" and "A Different Kind of Truth" get "Ds," and "Balance" gets an "F."
I really enjoy these tier list videos!
One question, though. Does it have to be a set number of albums in a certain tier to achieve some sort of equal distribution? That does not have to be ”true” with the quality of the album/-s.
We usually have 3 per tier to force decisions
A Van Halen debate ranking by people who don't like Van Halen.
Not true!! I love Van Halen. I just prefer DLR to Sammy. I’ve seen both variations in concert and have listened to them my entire life.
How did you get that from this episode. We’re clearly fans.
You should actually watch the video before commenting since they are all clearly fans.
@@rusbell2981 No no. It makes way more sense to say we don't know or like one of the world's most popular bands.
Yeah! All seem casual fans .
I’ve seen VH 5 times. 1984 and Diver Down tour, at the US Festival, and twice with Sammy Hagar. I was at the concert when they recorded their first live album. I was 11 when VH1 came out. Eruption blew me away. I stopped listening to VH after Sammy left the band.
Production was my biggest complaint in ADKOT. For the amount of stratification that album had from a mix standpoint (not as many complex and “masked” sounds), it sure was a boomy mess in the bass and kick. Drums sound a bit wild and unfocused.
It’s “Hellllo Baaaaaaybeee!” not “Hey Baby” 😉 5150 is fantastic!
Yep. It’s Big Bopper reference from his song ‘Chantilly Lace’ from 1958, or 59, but that’s probably before these guys’ time.
I love your "Wheels of..." shows. I hope you can make a Mercyful Fate Wheel with Mike Portnoy as a guest :D
Very much doubt we’ll do Mercyful Fate. Sorry.
Can’t wait to see the ultimate S and D Wheel episodes!
Same!
Fun topic! Agree more or less with most of it. However, I don’t get the hate towards ADKOT! I have always really liked that album, a great, late-addition to the catalog. A little long? Yes. But there’s 5-6 really good songs on there. I’d personally put it in B. =v=
I really liked it when it came out, but in prepping for this podcast, I realized there was a lot I didn't like about it. Mostly Dave's voice and the recording quality. Put the band from the 70s and 80s in a time machine and have them record it and it might be a top 5 album for them.
Van halen 2 is the best album for me
1984 and 5150 are similar in my likes. And fair warning my favourite
A lot of this is based on how much I love the deep cuts. VH3 is unlistenable. I have tried recently...can't do it. ADKOT just never grabbed me.
S -> WACF -> FW -> VH
A -> F-Album -> VH2 -> 1984
B -> 5150 -> OU812
C -> DD -> Balance
D -> ADKOT
F -> VH3
Ps - pretty much agree with the rankings
Nice! An Ayreon wheel of prog would also be great!
Love the Wheel of Rock!
Kyle. You don’t know VH music. Fair warning was a favorite among guitarists.
Ah, cool. I don't know VH music. Maybe that's the problem... I think if you'll read through the comments, you'll see a lot of variety of thought. I have Fair Warning in my A tier, and I mention in the podcast that I know it is typically ranked around the top 3 or 4. It just isn't there for me. I'm a drummer. Perhaps that's why?
I love sammy era
Some of do too.
Still waiting for your Marillion Wheel of Prog too!!
Fair Warning should be in S, and the Cover is awesome. lol
S Tier - 1st album, VH 2, Fair Warning.......... A Tier - 1984 ..............all the other Roth era albums can go in the B Tier............................all the other albums can go in the bin, especially Balance and VH 3
Agree 100%, Long Live to DLR🤘
Beatles wheel?
Top of my wish list!
Dirty Movies the most underrated Fair Warning track.
5150 = A Tier, F.U.C.K = S Tier, OU812 = A Tier. Ok, so I calmed down and watched the video until the end. I like the adjustments. I just think OU812 shows how versatile the VH Brothers were at writing music and creating songs that didn't sound the same. OU812 is such an eclectic masterpiece and an electrified rocker! I get tired of hearing the Dave vs Sammy thing, so dumb. Both eras were magical!
Holy shit, this is the first time someone has actually voiced my exact thoughts on ou812! Cheers, dude! 🤟🔥
S tier:
1. VH1 (1978)
2. Fair Warning (1981)
3. Women and Children First (1980)
4. 1984 (1984)
A tier:
5. Van Halen II (1979)
B tier:
6. Diver Down (1982)
7. A Different Kind of Truth (2012)
8. For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge (1991)
C tier:
9. 5150 (1986)
10. Balance (1995)
11. OU812 (1988)
F tier:
12. Van Halen III (1998)
0U812 always reminded me of a guy at a party on acid bumping into the only other person at the party on acid after an hour of wandering alone, lol!
I saw them live with Gary Cherone. They were good live. They played songs from both era's, including Roth era songs they had not played in years at the time, like Meanstreets and Unchained. I agree that the album bombed. They just needed a couple of good songs with Gary to make it work. It's ironic when the panel talks about needing a real singer for the last album.
I’m the guy that defends VH3! It’s weird, it’s different, the songs are a bit experimental. But I think it’s cool to hear the Van Halen brothers in this way! Although, I do agree that Gary sounds like he was being pushed out of his comfort range, vocally.
But the tour with Gary is, in my opinion, one of their best in terms of setlists! You truly got the best of both words, with Gary being willing and able to sing both Dave and Sammy’s songs!
And DKoT has a real bite to it. EVH playing is heavy.
Bowie wheel
Great show as always for The Wheel... even if I´m not the biggest Van Halen fan. The debut and Fair Warning are classics of course. I sold away Women and Childern First, 1984 and Diver Down...
That wasn’t a good idea!, 1984 is probably the best album to me.
5150 is B at best!
Honeybabysweetiedoll, is maybe the heaviest song they have done, it has a killer groove! Surprised nobody mentioned it. I loved it.
Imo, 5150 is their best Hagar album. The best album overall is Fair Warning. VH1, 1984, and WACF are masterpieces, too. Unlawful has no business in S tier. I get these opinions, but no.
Van Halen II is the best Van Halen record.
As a lover of both eras, I feel compelled to add my 2 cents:
S: VH1, 84, Carnal
A: FW, VH2, 5150
B: WCF, OU812
C: DD, BAL
D: III, ADKT
S: VH, WaCF, FW
A: II, 1984, 5150
B: Diver, Truth
C: OU812, Carnal
D: Balance, III
Geoff is wrong about everything
🤔
hahaha. You can't be criticized if you say about it yourself first. Smart.
1) VH 1 ; 2) 1984 ; 3) Fair Warning 4) Women & Children 5) Different Kind...
21:21 Dreams is a top 5 VH song
VH!! Nice
It's a pity the song "We Die bold" Worth recording on an album.❤
First four Van Halen albums = S tier
Humans Being is not Roth. Its Hagar. One of my all time favorite VH songs.
Correct. We meant Hagar of course.
I was 18 when women and children first came out. Was very disappointed with it. I don't get it. I listened again a couple of years ago. Still don't like it. Take your whiskey home is the only song I really like.
It's "Hello Baby," not "Hay Baby."
Yep. It’s Big Bopper reference from his song ‘Chantilly Lace’ from 1958, or 59, but that’s probably before these guys’ time.
Boston’s first album is super important and before VH1. Boston took rock and roll right to the edge.
Eddie defined virtuoso guitar on Van Halen 1 making it an essential album. But I don’t think from a song perspective it is S tier.
how about some Satriani?!
Man, I can’t stand Van Hagar.
Sammy is really losing sleep over your opinion
@@petepassiglia8564 He really isn’t, but you might be!
I can go along with most of your rankings. Depending on my mood, I could swap 1984 and Fair Warning. Van Halen, which I contend is the greatest album ever recorded, deserves better than S. I'm also amazed that someone finally agrees with me when I say For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge is better than 5150. I would call it borderline S-A tier.
Now onto the ones I'd change. AKDOT is B tier. That album is full of songs that should have been on earlier albums. Honeybabysweetiedoll absolutely melted my eardrums the first time I heard it. 5150 is C tier. I fell it is the most overrated Van Halen album. It's almost as cheesy as OU812. OU812 is D tier. I cannot listen to it. It has two songs I like which makes it a touch better than VH3 (can we call it F tier?). Balance is B tier. I really like the album. It had some great guitar and it's another Sammy album that's better than 5150.
I'm not a Van Halen fan, only really listened to them other than singles after Eddie passed away when I listened to all the albums a few times. I actually like Van Halen III quite a lot....ducks for cover.
Lol. Good for you.
For me VHII is the ultimate - yes better than VHI - the energy is just off the charts and it's so much fun. Second fave is Diver Down - again fun and great energy plus the amazing Little Guitars and Secrets. 1984 I loved as a teen but these days it's not a fave. I agree with Roie that Women and Children First is way overrated.
Kyle clueless when it comes to Dreams. Thats literally the best Van Halen song. Incredible vocals
Dreams is ok, not the best vh song or the best on 5150, to me
I loved Dreams as a teenager. One of my favorite VH song back then. Incredible guitar solo and might be Sammy's best vocal performance. But, I struggle to get through the song these days.
"Wheel Of Wok"
Coheed and Cambria wheel of prog would be awesome!
Well done
You got it somewhat wrong. 😅 Fair warning, 1984 and 5150 are the best ones. Balance is B tier. And I think some of you (hey Kyle!) are too locked in on one specific singer. Sammy Hagar is so underrated, and when you pair his voice with Michael Anthony’s - something unique happens. To me that is pure harmonic magic.
Best “Wheel” episode yet….I feel bad for Vic getting his beloved Van Hagar era albums trashed….but F.U.C.K did manage S tier. I’m squarely with Nick and Kyle….I’m a child of the Roth era and I thought 5150, OU812 were terrible. Only Hagar era album I ever listen to is F.U.C.K. Also, VH never achieved “favorite band” status for me as I always felt their albums were “uneven”. VH is a “Greatest Hits” band for me with most albums having a few masterpiece songs and a lot of filler. My vinyl collection has only 3 VH albums in it: VH I, 1984 and Fair Warning. That is my S-tier.
VH3 is NOT a Van Halen album. It is an EVH solo album. With a hint of VH every so often. EVH plays every instrument. IMHO it is a masterpiece.
Interesting. I had no idea people liked VHIII. I respect it.
Just now watching this--ranking is a hot mess. Women & Children First should be higher. And a couple of panelists downplaying "In A Simple Rhyme" (which is my favorite VH song ever) and "House Of Pain" (best song off 1984) is pretty sad.