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Peter Hitchens Claims Doubts Over Baby Killer Nurse Lucy Letby
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- Опубликовано: 10 июл 2024
- Mike Graham and Peter Hitchens discuss the conviction of Lucy Letby in the trial of the murder of babies at a neonatal unit. Peter Hitchens expresses doubts about the conviction due to the lack of what he says is was any direct evidence of harm, while Mike Graham acknowledges the concerns but notes that the Court of Appeal denied Letby's appeal.
Both Mike and Peter emphasize the importance of ensuring that all convictions are safe and just, particularly in cases where severe punishment is involved.
Child serial killer Lucy Letby said “I’m innocent” as she was led from court after being sentenced to an additional whole-life order for the attempted murder of a baby girl.
Last week, the 34-year-old former nurse was found guilty at Manchester Crown Court of the attack on the newborn infant during a night shift in the Countess of Chester Hospital’s neonatal unit in February 2016.
#lucyletby #mikegraham #peterhitchens
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IMO The hospital is liable and they needed a fall guy. I don’t trust our so called authorities AT ALL.
She's essentially the "Osama Bin Laden" of this situation
"I don’t trust our so called authorities" at all, really? Who do you trust then?
yea the hospital is liable, They ignored repeated calls for Letby to be investigated, trying to cover the whole thing up
No. Look. Spend the time to look at the evidence, this guy is heavily biased, make your own mind up.
@@oldtimer7635Of course you shouldnt trust authorities.
As someone who worked or the nhs for a few years I can say my experience with NHS managers was awful, if they want you out they will hound you until you resign
I was forced to leave an NHS Trust after 30 years for following my 'code of professional conduct' - I passed the concerns of a junior member of staff to managers to investigate, after they repeatedly ignored those concerns. I was then subject to 2 investigations, both of which were entirely groundless, indeed managers simply made things up that they thought they could get me on. These same NHS managers acted like crazed bullies who's goal was to crush me and silence me through intimidation. In the end I had to leave because I did not feel safe under their control, but two years later won a case for 'constructive dismissal'. The whole event was a nightmare.
Let's just say the NHS isn't the same place I trained at in the seventies.
Yup
Same with managers in a Matalan I worked for
I worked for years in the Social Housing sector, lost my position many times as condemed for abiding by principals & not towing the corrupt line. Four tribunal cases for unfair dismissal against certain establishments & nothing ever changed the system & conduct carried on, didnt even dent the heirachy, attitude. What hurt the most, was the continued inability to ignor the corruption or hold those accountable for the failures to support the vulnerable people it was our job to help & protect.
She may be guilty, but the whole point of a conviction is that its is supposed to be beyond a reasonable doubt, which doesnt seem to be the case in this instance.
She wouldn't have admitted it if she hadn't done it
You wasn't in court and you wasn't on the jury.
Absolutely beyond reasonable doubt.
I'm no fan of Hitchens, but he has a point.
A lot of miscarriages of justice is due to a lazy or incompetent defence team.
And many people have got away with crimes that can't be proven without doubt. Unfortunately that is the side effect of a just system, or should i say, a system attempting to be just.
I am not saying this nurse is innocent or guilty, but she has a right to a fair trial.
The Soham girls murder case trial was a bit dodgy as well. It is questionable if Ian Huntley and his girlfriend received a fair trials.
What about those letters diaries at her house thays evidence
I agree with Peter Hitchins. I've thought this for a long time. It is too easy for doctors to blame nurses. This is not the first case of this nature.
As a retired nurse you are talking bollocks and so is Hitchens , She was practically caught in the act by one parent and altered numerous medical records and drug charts , Innocent people don’t forge or alter medical records to cover their tracks
It is plausible l myself know a nurse who was hung out to dry by those higher up the chain
@@PeterWilson-ix3sd one if the first things that rang alarm bells with me was the overwhelming press attendance when she was arrested …..heads should have rolled, but they didn’t.
And it's not the 1000th case of female nurses killing babies
@@PeterWilson-ix3sd me too
Crown prosecution service and UK judges are horrendous, people don't realise unless they have had dealings with them. The UK justice system is rubbish.
Absolutely, just look at the current PM and his actions as Crown Prosecutor.
Move to Russia then. If you don’t already live there 😂
@maxpaws3977. Agreed!shockingly trials are often a complete shambles..and jurors luck of the draw..the more complex the case the WORSE the jurors WHO are available..WHO has that time to serve on a jury?
Totaly agree..The police, lawyers and barrister and judges use the system to their own ends..Two people commit the same crime and get totaly different sentences and then you find out that the one that got off is a friend of the judges dad ... fact..
Agree
It’s incomprehensible to me that anybody can be sentenced to life with no parole on the basis of circumstantial evidence.
@@rexmundi1812 Seems absolutely disgusting.
a circumstance where everyone just dies in your care and nobody else's.
Do you find it in comprehensible that Rose West was sentenced due to circumstancal evidence?
@@jaylockwood5030Well Said!!
@@Plainandsimple25 Plain and simple you really are, go away and play with your toy.
Imagine if some of the people leaving comments here were selected to be part of the jury in a trial in which your freedom was on the line, and then tell us how confident you were in the system.
Correct. So many on here led by their feelings and not the facts.
@@ronaldaddison2146True, so many think that as soon as someone is charged for something, they must automate be guilty and ready some of the comments leading up to the trial, they had found her guilty then.
I sat on a jury once. Some of the jurors had some very strange viewpoints and couldn’t be swayed by knowledge etc. so yes, when you put yourself before a jury you really won’t know which way it’s going to go.
@@katuk8173 I don't think there's any great justice system, you are either judged by 12 people or you a judge by one both are capable of getting spot on or totally wrong, and with the media we now have, I think there's even less chances of someone getting a fair trial without some sort of biased.
@katuk8173 really, that must have been difficult.
I've been called to jury service twice and luckily I served it with normal people.
One case was theft with a firearm, another was a SA case. We found both guilty unanimously, the evidence was substantial in both cases.
She herself raised concerns over the safety of the ward she worked on. The NHS does not protect whistleblowers they bully and harass them. Could this be the most extreme form of whistleblower targeting?
Well either that or a murderer clumsily trying to divert attention
No it’s not
No she didn't-that's just another fake SM conspiracy theory. And it was the whistleblowers reporting Letby that were bullied and harassed.
My partner works in midwifery and its beyond dangerous with the current staffing levels. The managers get away with doing nothing but dipping biscuits in tea when the staff are at their wits end. Ive tried to convince her to whistleblow to the CQC but none on her team are willing to do so due to fear of repercussions.
Being bullied, harassed and ill treated as an NHS employee are all occupational norms. Lower the pay grade the worse it gets.
Maybe you should ask nurses that work with premature babies to go over the court transcripts then ask their opinion if they think she is guilty. As a nurse that has heard the transcripts and evidence I believe she is 100% guilty. We know the equipment and procedures and can tell you air embolus doesn’t randomly happen in central lines, large volumes of air or milk doesn’t just randomly enter a premature babies stomach via their NGT without someone pushing it through their tube, insulin doesn’t just show up in TPN, and premature babies do NOT scream unless something horrifying has happened to cause them unimaginable pain. Nurses don’t have 250 handover sheetss with confidential information in bags under their beds, don’t stalk the parents of deceased children on Facebook on the anniversaRy of their deaths, or take photos of condolence cards they sent the parents. And Lucy was the ONLY person that was present at work when every one of these incidents or deaths happened and the death/incidents started happening when she was transferred to dayshift and magically stopped since she stopped working there. Plus she wrote a note found in her home that said “i am evil, I did this.” When someone shows you who they are believe them.
Yes u seem a expert in this area. I agree with you
If all that is true then it's pretty damning and I'll go with that, as someone that hasn't followed or knows about the case beyond the headlines when it broke.
Circumstantial is not complete evidence. Too much info kept out of the evidence. Check out norman fenton. Gotta see all evidence not just the evidence that makes sence.
@@GhostRider-cv5lb
🎯
The so called expert medical evidence in Letby's trial was utter crap. The post mortems tell the story of those deaths, all by natural causes. The obvious cause of death was early onset neonatal sepsis likely in each case. There was a systematic failure to maintain oxygenation and respiration in every case. Ventilation of many of these preterm babies is phenomenally difficult with the equipment they had. They couldn't sustain central lines, couldn't insert arterial lines. Pulse oximetry and perfusion monitoring in these babies is very difficult, it's rarely possible to say a baby was stable. But the worst evidence given against Letby was the diagnosis of air embolism. The most common sources of air emboli (of which there is zero evidence) are central lines and CPR and there is no way to distinguish the source.
The insulin "science is junk" Preterm neonates metabolise glucose entirely differently from adults and can easily produce blood results like these cases of poisoning. Hindmarsh calculated the dose wrongly. Milan said she was measuring insulin - she wasn't - she was measuring antibodies to insulin which is fraught with technical and biological problems, one test is never sufficient to draw a valid conclusion. The level of negligence and incompetence on that unqualified unit was breathtaking. That is the only crime committed.
Lucy's conviction unsafe because the consultants who were interviewed as witnesses themselves remain suspects.
And you know better 😂
See Gary Waterman's evidence with regards to this matter.
Lucy's ? geeze a convicted killer
@@veganvivjones4655Why did infant mortality rise when Letby was on duty.
Not true. I highly recommend the vid from Cheshire police on operation hummingbird. If you have the courage to watch it.
A few things to add,
In fact, the total NHS clinical negligence payments in England for 2022-23 was £2.6bn, of which £1.1bn related to maternity services.
1.1 Billion in compensation and that's government figures.
Police are examining 600 cases linked to the biggest maternity scandal in the history of the NHS, after a damning report into baby deaths condemned health staff for blaming mothers while repeatedly ignoring their own catastrophic blunders for decades.
Also look at the case of Lucia de Berk.
That was a very similar case and her guilt was never in question but she was innocent.
Also Louise Woodward she was 100 guilty until she wasn't.
Something about this case does not make sense.
Coming from a man who doesn't understand why a murder trial was necessary when another murder came to light, i think I'll take his conspiracy theory with a pinch of salt.
I think it's unlikely that Peter Hitchens is more on top of the facts than the entire Crown Court.
Aprox 30 highly qualified medical people have cast doubts on the medical evidence that was presented.
Hahaha - that's how it's supposed to be? But I have no respect for the Crown Court or the entire judiciary any more.
Like me, he looked at the lack of physical evidence. Even the post mortems couldn't conclude foul play. Circumstantial evidence isn't enough to lock someone up for life
Those concerns were raised by a small you tube channel last yr , something stinks, and my money is on the system being as corrupt as hell
I RAISED IT AND GOT SHUT DOWN
The Post Office scandal comes to mind,
@@TeddyG-y6s apples and oranges
Hello again
Total drivel. There was a huge lengthy police investigation,you totally over look the fact that it was the whistleblowers about Letby that were bullied and harassed-a fatal flaw in you conspiracy theory-the deaths under Letby were inexplicable-you obviously are clueless,but to put it briefly,collapses are expected or explainable NONE of Letby's were-in fact the babies were reported as "Doing very well" "No cause for concern" You also need to read the transcripts from the trial.Letby gives herself away.
No direct evidence???? Other than the doctor who caught her red handed? Other than all the babies dying when she was on duty, which stopped when she was suspended????
The doctor caught her red handed, are you sure? That was anecdotal evidence, dr ravi jayaram was the consultant your referring to who was also responsible for the underperforming neonatal unit. One of the baby’s that passed on her watch was 2lb! These were incredibly sick children that has been overlooked on how this story was reported.
Some of the babies died when she wasn’t on duty.
Caught red handed doing what? None of you can ever give any specifics
The Dr who caught her red handed and never reported it at the time! When asked why he didn’t report it he replied because he wasn’t trained in how to report it!!! Have you ever heard such nonsense!!
Also the parents who found her solely around when something happened to their babies. Can't believe Hitchens is making this statement.
This stinks - my gut feeling is the hospital and management needed to cover up huge failings and needed a scapegoat.
Look at the recent contaminated blood scandal...
Hospital management were the ones defending her from accusations made by Dr Brearey (who went on to actively assist the police investigation) and Dr Jayaram
Yeah well the main scandal is they employed a murderer and didn't notice.
@@serendipidus8482 Read the article in the New Yorker magazine. You may change your mind. And ask yourself, why is the article banned in the UK?!
Makes little sense, they tried to sweep it under the carpet as it would be a disaster if it the killings came to light.
They failed because they protected her and let her carry on.
She even wrote down that she killed them.
I think there comes a point with mounting circumstancial evidence that you have to say they are guilty.
Should we let a person go free if statistically there's a 1 in a million chance they are innocent?
@CC-uc4gq do you need a subscription to read it?
No actual evidence that she did any harm. The prosecution statistical evidence simply shows that she was on duty when she was on duty, due to the source data being selectively chosen.
eh no there was direct evidence of insulin poisoning. Nothing was 'selectively chosen'
Yeah because newborns are always injecting themselves with air and insulin.
ONLY the fact that Infant mortality went up when she was on duty.
WHAT MAKES YOU AN EXPERT.
You clearly need to read more the case. They proved using medical expertise that someone working on the unit gave the babies life threatening INSULIN. Unfortunately for Lucy she tried to blame the supplier but they worked out using the half life of insulin that it must’ve been administered at certain times. When they saw who was on duty for three times guess who was the constant? Lucy. She thought she’d get away with it as it’s hard to detect after death but she also didn’t know that it has links to c peptide which tests can prove insulin posining was the chosen method for a few of the babies. It was a long court case , certainly not just you were on duty so it was you. No medical experts would go in defence of her in court as once they’d seen the evidence evidence against her they knew their credibility would be in question if they tried to defend her.
@jeffreyuprichard3754
Yeah an the mortality rate went down significantly when the hospital downgraded.
It would never have upgraded imln the first place, it was out of it's depth.
You don't need to be an expert to realise that.
You just need to hear the RCPCH report which strangely wasn't mentioned much, if at all in the trial
The plumber told everyone what the killer was .Bodged up sewage pipes above premature babies unit .Bodged up by high paid managers so they could earn bonuses for saving money .Managers threw Lucy under the bus to save themselves.
funny how other nurses not affected
@@beaulieuc8910 They only needed one nurse to take the fall .
That's why the managers made the consultants apologize to her .🤦
Is the plumber witness a joke of some sort?
If your so certain would you let her look after your children. No you wouldn’t.
If this were a male nurse called Luke Letby I doubt anyone would care if he was innocent or not and would just condemn him as guilty. People's inability to acknowledge evil women is very concerning.
People's positive bias for women over men is an entirely separate issue to the one at hand.
Rubbish
What a weird thing to say
Not at all, when there is zero evidence presented to show that the person being charged did anything wrong, it would be called out!
1000% and this statement is absolutely relevant to this case . There is so much evidence against her , its crazy. She literally admitted doing it in her diary, was euphoric and smiling immediately following the death of babies, took pictures of a baby with her feeding tube removed and send them to parents. Had written a note out consoling the parents for the death of three triplets, even though one survived after being moved off the ward and out of her clutches. Was seen standing over a baby dying and not alerting any doctors to come and save it. If it was a man, we have gone so far past the point of reasonable doubt.
Hold on the comments are suprising. How exactly is she not guilty? The documentary showed whenever she was on duty or in a specific room a baby died.
But that isn't enough to prove something beyond reasonable doubt. She may have done it, or may have been in the wrong place at the wrong time. Without certainty is unethical to convict because this could happen to anyone
@@_Too_Late If it were just one stable baby who died coincidentally whilst Letby was around then you might have an argument. But we are talking about 7 (that she got convicted of killing) occasions that she was in the wrong place at the wrong time. She's either did it or she is literally the most unlucky human being who has ever lived. What do you think is more likely?
@@doctor_gibbo1392 If were making a judgment on which is 'more likely' I would say she is probably guilty. But the threshold in a criminal conviction is 'beyond reasonable doubt' - and there is a lot of legitimate doubt. In the case of reasonable doubt one must acquit. They cannot prove how any of the babies died, that's a huge problem. There's all sorts of possible alternate scenarios. For example maybe some of the 7 died naturally, or from faulty equipment, and maybe there's another suspect who was with some of the seven but not all, and these various issues intersected - I'm not saying these things happened, only that it's legitimately possible
@_Too_Late I get where your comijg from, it all falls on what you can prove. Could you share some reasonable doubts that are being mentioned? The fact that they can't prove how the babies died sounds like the perfect crime to me.
@_Too_Late Also just to mention her handwritten notes which were found at her home is a pretty strong indication she murdered or played a part in murdering those babies.
Why Did She write that she killed these Babies, found by Police!??
Apparently this Paediatric Unit was NOT running as it Should have been..a year Prior to to these Incidents!
Who knows? 😢
Exactly, she was probably keeping a journal of what's going on at the hospital as she felt there was issues
she didn't.
@@Kiltoonie hope the truth comes out.. 🎉
@@mazybee9149 hope the truth comes out .. 🎉
@@mystrength5640 luckily they had a trial... Maybe you heard about it?
His doubt is not reasonable. The juries got it right.
No patch on his late brother Christopher Hitchens.
Oh come on. Just look at her notes. She admits it in her writings. What’s wrong with you doubters.
Those poor parents listening to your ramblings.
Just a bunch of sad mental cases sitting on the internet formulating crazy theories and ignoring facts for attention.
Lucy did no such thing, those notes were written when she was under extreme duress. Lucy was actually writing about what she thought the police & others thought of her. It was a case of 'cherry picked' evidence the same as the bogus spreadsheet.
Those poor parents being lied to by the NHS, the consultants, the police...
@@ruthbashford3176 maybe you should have conducted her defence?
So why was she writing ‘I killed them’ in the diary she kept? And why didn’t she leave the hospital and distance herself when she knew there was suspicion about her?
False memory syndrome?
Read the article. She was moved into an Admin role.
@@user-de8mu8xh9j read the guardian and Telegraph articles about the case
She didn't write 'I killed them'. She wrote 'I did it' and 'I'm evil'. That could mean anything.
@@mrsb3650you obviously have not followed the case and read her hand written post-it notes
The children's deaths only happened during her shifts as documented and completely stopped after she went to prison, mathematical improbabilities with twins etc, her sending disturbing cards and stalking victims facebook. Her parents knew she was a psycho narcissists and pandered to her. Where's the proof she's innocent? co workers and family of some of the victims said she was angry when children survived.... These children died in agony having air injected into them etc, she is a monster
They stopped after they realised there was a lot of deaths and they staffed the hospital properly. There was deaths when she was off duty too, but they pretended that date to show it was when she was on shift, that doesn’t prove it was her, there is no smoking gun. You’ve only mentioned anecdotal evidence, many of these children were extremely sick them passing on her watch doesn’t prove anything
You have just said conjecture
Proof she is innocent? You don't need to proof to be innocent. everyone is innocent until proven guilty.
That's NOT true, there were 10 other deaths over the same time frame. You should do some proper research on this case and you might then learn why so many people believe Lucy is innocent.
I went to high school in Canada with a girl back in the early 90s who later moved to England. She drowned her 2 young ones in the bathtub of her London home, something she fully admitted. She neved spent a day in prison. Strange how that works
how did she get away with that?
Name of woman involved? A quick google search can help us all check to see if this is the case
& how did she get away with that?
I think it’s fair to say that this never happened.
@@gloverdragon6854 I think you are right
Watch Hitchens with Alex O'Connor, then come back and watch this. He's a bafoon and embarrassment to the Hitchens name
Peter Hitchens is someone trying to make a name for himself while living in the shadow of his hugely gifted brother.
A shadow from which he can never escape.
Great comment 👍
Correct,
He seems to be popping up all over TV giving opinions on everything and appears to crave attention,
He has got a massive ego and creates a big word salad using big fancy words delivered in a pompous nauseating fashion,
Half of which is complete drivel
Everyone saying this is a set up: so you’re telling me, hospital staff, doctors and nurses (who had worked with Lucy for a long time and built a relationship with her) and also the parents of the babies all got together one day and decided to just blame Lucy?
17 collapses and she was the only staff member to be on shift for all of them?
That is the only statistic I need to believe Lucy letby is exactly where she needs to be right now.
Letby had hand written notes in her room confessing to those murders .Just Google the trial.
🎉🎉 exactly
So you clearly believe the bogus chart they used in court then?
Oh dear!!
@@jeffreyuprichard3754well, that sounds like a fit up
I watched and read a lot about this case. She’s guilty.
Peter Dickchins doesn't understand why a family would want the death of their baby explained, and proven to be murder - because proving it wouldn't add to a life sentence, so what the point? That emotional blindness aside, the second trial didn't reach a different verdict from the first. She's been proven guilty - twice.
Exactly right.
If my baby had been killed I wouldn't want an innocent person in prison. I would want the truth no matter what.
@@Skaramoosh5
Same. If an innocent person is in prison, the perp is out walking free.
Kitchens talks as if he were a mathematician or medical scientist instead of a boomer tabloid journalist stuck in 1950.
@@johnkeane1419 No ... he's pointing out that statisticians and scientists have serious concerns.
I wonder. The NHS, the managers et al are very good at covering up for their inadequacies. If Lucy Letby is a serial murderer, then she deserves her sentence, however, if there were failures in NHS healthcare and Lucy Letby is a scapegoat for wider NHS failings, let there be a retrial and further investigation. Nurses, ward managers and “sisters” doing their homework for their degrees, yet not answering patient buzzers, not catheterising patients who cannot leave their beds to go to the toilet without injuring themselves. Patients who cannot walk falling and getting head injuries, stitches, not feeling safe in a hospital, then wanting to come home to die in an environment they can feel safe in - with their family. Hospitals cannot be trusted anymore. I slept at the foot of my mum’s bed for the last seven weeks, nursing her, ready to give morphine if she needed it. In the hospital she was not even on the feeding list. I had to find blankets for my mum when she was cold. The “ward sister” was too busy doing her university homework, ignored patient buzzers for help. I say this in truth. It broke me.
I had the same experience while in hospital for an amputation.
The consultant prescribed Oxicontin every six hours to deal with the acute pain
I would often be left In agony for 12 hours or more, with no pain relief.
I heard every excuse in the book for the lack of care i received. The nurses are like some untouchable angels in the eyes of the public, but they are not as hard done by as people think. I suggest a more regimented approach, and a return to the days when the patient was the priority, unlike today's care free nursing.
Sometimes, it felt as if the nursing staff resented the patients.
I could go on about my 2 month stay in hospital, and the incompetence I was subjected to, but most people wouldn't believe me.
@@pleasantville4529 I believe you totally. Something is very wrong. Some nurses and “carers:” even bully people.
@@pleasantville4529 sorry to hear what you went through. Things are very different from 20/ 30 years ago. The NHS seemed to work for everyone back then,.
@@pleasantville4529 I believe you. My father had a fall and was admitted to hospital. He actually had a stroke while eating his lunch, the food was still in his mouth when my brother went in at 7pm to visit him! Nobody noticed! My son in law is a nurse and he has actually cried before going to work to do a job he loves. He is a very hard worker and nursing is his true vocation, he really cares. He can't fight the system any more and is now leaving this job he was made to do, to become a teacher. Not all nurses are the same. Take care x
Hitchens probably thinks Elvis is still alive.
Elvis Presley is Dead?????
Peter Hitchens . Publicly stated on this here channel not long ago he couldn’t see the point of stripping Paula Vennels of her CBE !!!!!!!! You really couldn’t make it up . Ridiculous Man . One of life’s pontificaters is out Peter . Never had a serious job in his life . Never held any real responsibility . Babble Babble Babble !!!!!
And took the vaccine as well.
He's nowt but a professional contrarian and a bore with it.
What is his literal profession?
What is his qualification?
I'm not getting at him because I've agreed with a lot of his ideas.
But I don't have any idea why we know who he is.
@@marcuswilson3485he has strong opinions about things, apparently
@@marcuswilson3485 "But I don't have any idea why we know who he is."
Because of his surname, mostly.
What kind of defence team did she have???? Not great. She got life.
She confessed in her scribblings! 'i did this - i killed them - i don't deserve to live!' and they all died during her shifts? GUILTY AS HELL!!!
😂😂😂 how do people explain that away
Stressy scribblings...worry..extreme pressure and just an outlet?..diaries and notes have been proven in other cases to be irrelevant irl
Bloody hell, all the babies died while she was working! When she wasn't working no babies died?? Guilty as hell
Oh yes, the convenient note she left admitting to everything, how thoughtful of her to do that and leave it for the police to find. There's me, thinking psychopaths are supposed to be very clever.
@@user-tl1zz1ug7h
Don't talk wet!!
What else did she say in that note?!
" I haven't done anything wrong"
Did you conveniently forget about that bit?
A note was found in her bedroom it said "I am evil I did this".
that doesn't close the case, people have been fitted up in many ways before, the most common one being racist cops planting black men with drugs to justify an arrest over the years
They used "evidence" like this against her because they had no REAL evidence
@@WIP532 But why would she write this
They hardly touched on those notes during cross examination
@@terminator2girl
Without context it could mean anything. Was it the last chocolate she ate and as writing a joke.
The evidence presented at Howard Shipman's trial was largely circumstantial and he was convicted of multiple murders.
The evidence presented at Lucy Letby's trial was largely circumstantial and she was convicted of multiple murders.
The evidence presented at both trials was overwhelming and the juries agreed on a guilty verdict in both cases.
As they say "Bang to Rights"
Perhaps you mean HAROLD Shipman
@@iaincumming982 I do haha
@@thebonkser There was plenty of non-circumstantial evidence with Shipman. For example he financially benefited from the deaths.
People are only protesting Letby's innocence because she's a woman. If this were a man no one would care and would just condemn him as guilty. And I'm saying this as a woman.
I think you are mistaken and sad
@@alanforrester6900 Get a life mate. You know what she's saying is true.
What an absurd comment
Just an extraordinary and unprecedented coincidence that so many babies died in her “care”.
Don't underestimate the depths that our institutions will stoop to, in order to connive their way out of responsibility for their negligence. The NHS has history! .
10 babies also died over the same time period but they couldn't pin them on Lucy. The jury were not told about them
That's like saying to a lottery winner, "it's an extraordinary coincidence that all your numbers came up. You must have cheated." It's also extraordinary to have a serial killer nurse. Check out Prosecutor's Fallacy.
🙏 The Truth comes out eventually ! Look at Julian Assange . Innocent but accused of rape. God Bless ! 🙏🕊🙏
Seems to be the case
Hitchens falls for the popular fallacy: 'the whole thing is totally circumstantial' - the fallacy being that 'circumstantial evidence' is inherently inferior to direct evidence from a witness. Circumstantial evidence is not infallible, but it doesn't suffer from memory lapses, bias, errors of perception, dishonesty and suchlike. What is more, from even my limited grasp of the evidence from news reports, there was plenty of direct witness evidence from other clinicians as to her behaviour, so it was not 'totally circumstantial'. And finally, it is not at all odd that no experts were called on her behalf. She had a skilled and well funded legal team who had access to any expertise they may have wished to call - if they didn't, it was because they chose not to and not because it was denied to them.
Well said.
clott shotsss
The whole thing is another GREAT BRITISH stitch up. NO PROOF. Look at how many people serve 20 years for crimes they didn't commit. She was doomed from the hysterical start.
@constantgardener19 I respectfully disagree. Anyone who considers LL'S legal team to be 'skilled' cannot be described as making an 'excellent comment'. Misguided may be more accurate?
Excellent comment👍
Simon Webb said the same thing in a video on RUclips a year ago, what took everyone else so long to notice?
What about Lee Ryan ? What did he say ?
So did David Kurten, leader of the Heritage Party. Took quite a bit of flak for it, too.
He did some good analysis of their pathetic statistical fiddling.@@JamesBurrTV
😂 this is Britain. A few thousand called Conjob19 a load of bollocks in April 2020 but millions obediently did as they were told and refused to listen to the warnings of the few. People are stupid 😅
I've been saying this since the story broke, but youtube kept deleting my comments
Blocking any comment that says anything to condemn her and point out obvious facts on her case. RUclips really does believe in free speech 🤦♂️
Well Peter has gone off the rails lately so I'm going to doubt him on this as well.
His stuff about the Lotus Eaters podcast was dumb af too
If someone is working so much overtime as in working 6/7 days a week she was going to be on duty for all or most of the deaths during that period of time. There were also deaths when she wasn’t there or the person looking after just came to help during the emergency situation. She could well be guilty but there was a lot of circumstantial evidence and no real hard factual proof. She was a very young not long qualified nurse also so some of her behavior was probably due to inexperience. She deserves an appeal like most people get. But they made their mind up on her before the court case that she was guilty and doesn’t sound like she had a great defense team.
So why did she write in her diary that shes evil i did it ??????? Explain
Did what?
I'm convinced I'm the devil sometimes and wandering through this wasteland, people say funny things 😑
She didn't. That post it note didn't even come close to meeting the PACE requirements to be submitted as a confession. The facts of this case are not adding up. To me, I believe there is more than reasonable doubt that the cause of death was actually criminal. And why was no one else on the ward ever investigated if the causes of death were believed to be criminal? The evidence seems shaky at best.
@@RC-gh7os Exactly this. We don’t even know if ANY of the babies were murdered. Their deaths were recorded as ‘natural’ given their issues. They were in an ICU after all. This case was brought as an explanation as to why there were so many deaths in one time frame at this hospital. They didn’t mention other factors like a virus outbreak and sewage contamination in the unit itself.
There is so much ‘reasonable doubt’ around this as far as I can see.
Because she didn't write that. She wrote '*They are all saying* I am Evil, that I did it, but I didn't, I am innocent'. Those words then got the Emms Telegram treatment by the prosecution.
He's a fool
Let's hope he's a fool if this ever happens to you.
She’s guilty. Jeez wake up people.
You mean she was found guilty by a jury. The evidence presented to them was weak/flawed.
See what Gary Waterman has uncovered and you might not be so sure.
Do you have any substance to go with your bald assertion? Waking up to evidence is precisely why I doubt the validity of this conviction.
@@fredneecher1746yes read the court transcripts.
@@DarkCriimesHave you read the article in the Telegraph or the New York Times?
I would suggest there is evidence to convict her beyond all reason doubt because she has been convicted beyond all reasonable doubt.
The 12 people of the Jury who heard all the evidence and statistics in the case felt she was guilty and I think they are right in this case. I know miscarriages do occur but some cases are overwhelming even without direct evidence I think this is the case here but I could be wrong.
Ten, actually.
The jury can only can deliberate the evidence they are presented with. The more I read of the total lack of medical evidence, and the skewed statistical evidence, the more I think she is innocent. And I was a nurse
@@RC-gh7os I thought it was 11
The jury heard flawed evidence.
@ruthbashford3176 my apologies, to clarify the judge asked for a 10-1 majority verdict. So ten returned a guilty verdict.
what about her diary's saying stuff like - she's evil and harmed the babies
For the sake of argument, if the diary didn't exist would you still think she's guilty? Because people write all sorts of weird things in diaries, it's not a crime
@@_Too_Lateyes what about the person claming to be the Yorkshire ripper but it wasn't him.
NO Medical Evidence. No Autopsy Results, No Direct Cause of Death Reports, No Cause of Death Homicide Reports. A Nurse who made Official Complaints against a Married Senior Consultant gets Blamed? Who would have knowledge to cause such deaths, who would have access to work schedules, who would have a grudge. Only the Senior Consultant would have those elements. The Senior Consultant who was preying on Young Nurses. They are facts which are 900% more tangible than any Evidence used in this case.
And we never landed on the moon 😂
How did the moon buggy get on the moon 🤔
Well done Inspector Clouseau, I see you have it all figured out!
@@Roy-jf3pv An alien mother left it behind 😂
@@Roy-jf3pvthey built the rover up there with a few spanners and a screwdriver🤣🤣🤣😭
A witness, a Dr, saw her stood iver a baby that was struggling to breathe, the tubes werent connected properly. She didnt help and didnt ask anyone else to help, she was found standing watching the baby struggle to breathe.
What did the doctor do, run over and help and report her, no. So that dr is a liar.
@@Skaramoosh5 Not necessarily. I note that we have not been given the end of the story.
This claim is now a proved lie
She is guilty! No one else filled her timeline. Let her rot in the glory she took on her baby crimes. She's horrendous!
Keep an open mind from the man who believes being gay is a choice you make
Hitchens will say anything to keep himself relevant
Boring guy
The trophies and writings in her house need explanation..
Did you know they hardly questioned her about those notes in the cross examination which i found odd
@@denise4487Well it was in black and white.
No they don't as they don't prove anything. The most damning piece of evidence was the post note but it wasn't a confession, it was the ramblings of someone under extreme duress
Lucy had about 250 patient notes at her house only 30 had anything to do with the babies in the trial. So what the police, who are desperate to get a conviction, have done is select the tiny percentage of notes that had anything to do with the babies in the charge sheet and said look she kept trophies. I'm the context though she took lots of paper home
@@ruthbashford3176 Thanks, Doctor, if there's anything else we'll let you know.
No that's not true😧 ... She wrote what she had done in her own diary .. which was also very detailed and written by the perpetrator herself for all the babies ... That's the evidence ...
She is Guilty ...👀🧐🤔💯
Where does everybody get the diary from? They must all have read the same incorrect statement. The infamous note was not in her diary.
The letter was planted, the police do that a lot.
@@Skaramoosh5Really?
Guilty as sin. She constantly contradicted herself under questioning. @CrimeScene2Courtroom documents her testimonies and evidence.
@@whiteswan6867 I CANNOT RECCOMEND EVERYONE CHECKING THIS CHANNEL OUT ENOUGH!!! THIS MAN HAS ATTENDED AND DOCUMENTED LUCYS TRIAL AND I GUARANTEE HE HAS MORE INSIGHT AND FACTUAL INFORMATION THAN PETER AND WHOEVER THIS OTHER DUDE IS.
The experts are now suggesting otherwise. Just because you believe something doesn't make it true, no matter how strongly you believe it.
Lucy is undoubtedly innocent and I'm surprised she had the strength to go into the witness box, she was bullied by that awful Johnson. His accusations were nothing but speculation.
Poor Lucy must be suffering from PTSD
And the doctor's evidence was certainly contradictory!
@@ruthbashford3176 , she's been made to take the fall for the holy NHS inadequacies, which we can't have since it's a national cult.
The real question here is why the KC defending Letby put up such an astonishingly weak case
This was a big case for him with lots of attention from the media and peers and he appears to have phoned in a half hearted defense that a legal aid intern (or random journalist) could easily have surpassed
So he's either guilty of total incompetence or threw the case for some reason - to this day, experts willing to defend Letby still don't know why they weren't called to give evidence
A simple defense would be:
1) There's no evidence of any murder occurring, all the autopsies were completely normal
2) There is no evidence at all of Letby ever harming a child
3) The prosecution's expert witness is highly dubious, with many other experts disagreeing completely with his ludicrous hypothesis
4) Most of Letby's colleagues believe she is innocent and were willing to give glowing character references
That alone is enough to put reasonable doubt in the minds of any juror
I'm so pleased that people like Peter Hitchens exist.
Unless you are in court. Unless you know the evidence that was out before the court . Unless you are the judge.Then you know sod all.
@@TheSuperHarrygeorge most of the information was made public.... but that aside, the jury were satisfied of her guilt and so was the appeal judge. She's stuffed.
@@S.Trades Your telling word MOST evidence was made public. I doubt any of those who champion her innocence would have one iota of knowledge ‘that was made public’. If the Judge and Jury heard the evidence then that is good enough for me. I wonder what the public verdict was on plain Jane Beverly Allitt !
@@TheSuperHarrygeorge letby is actually pretty grim, without her makeup on.
@@S.Trades yes I agree.
Yeah like you
Shut up Pete
She's as guilty as hell
Yes it's "possible" that she's not guilty, but it's infinitely improbable given the circumstances
So why did she write about her exploits in her diary?
Don't you think it's convenient she had a diary? How many people do you know who have time for a hand written diary?
@@DanAdlingtonOnline It was her hand writing and she admitted to writing her thoughts about how evil she was. Maybe disturbed people do that. The idea this girl was set up is just ridiculous and if she’s ever released, how about you let her babysit your children.
@@pershorefoodbanktrusselltr3632 Everything you are saying was reported by a corrupt media from a corrupt health service and corrupt police. You might be right you might be wrong. But after my 30 years of NHS experiences I think they were deflecting from themselves
@@pershorefoodbanktrusselltr3632 Out of curiosity. I read you comment and it got me thinking. Do you have a degree and PHD in something related to medical science?
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Peter definitely smokes weed. He says he doesn't but i bet he does.
Hitting the peace pipe like a champion
what about the notes in her house
Written by someone on intense pressure and doubting everything she has done.
Besides serial killers don't write down that they murdered people. And if they do, they certainly don't keep the notes knowing that they are under investigation.
And the Facebook stalking, and the weird cards, and the fact that only she could’ve given those babies that insulin and those emboli.
@@Autumn_Forest_ Read the New Yorker article. It explains all of that and much more., you will need a couple of hours though.
That’s not true Alyssa bustamante wrote down how she murdered her child neighbour and that’s what got her caught and arrested.
@turquoiseblue228 look at dahmers apartment. They do alot of dumb stuff
Embarrassing talk tv stupid conspiracy theories this children your talking about god dam
I don't trust any news story fully anymore.
It's forced me to use more discernment, which has been for the better.
Like what if you don't read any news for info - sounds like a hunch?
You'd rather believe ill informed youtube videos?
@@robertstorey7476 Weird comment.
Followed the case for a couple of years and I’m in no doubt the Letby’s guilt. Admittedly the evidence was circumstantial, but children dying whenever she’s on duty, (day or night), within hours of being on shift, a pattern emerging of her being the only common denominator in ALL cases, the private notes she wrote to herself- “I did this’ etc etc, = a confession. The suspicions raised by consultants about her, now 2 trials returning guilty verdicts, the likelihood of her being innocent is for the birds…!
Read the New Yorker article. One baby died after she had been on duty for THREE minutes!
Cheshire police threatened one European professor of mathematics after he used his blog to demolish all the stats they used to convict her, with contempt of court and prison. They did the same to a US scientist who also blogged about the case and took it all apart.
She did not fit the profile of a serial killer, she had friends, wasn't a loner, had a social life, was well liked. The notes she wrote were because they questioned her competence and made her start questioning herself, asking herself if it was her fault, etc.
This article is available if you look for it. It will take you a couple of hours to read as it is very detailed. The main reason I read it is because it is banned in the UK. Why? To me that is a big red flag that it contains info that the NHS and the UK courts don't want in the UK public domain.
@@CC-uc4gq Like I said, I know she’s guilty so I won’t bother. She’ll never be released so you carry on with your delusions
@@CC-uc4gqdo you have any links to these so ican read them
@@CC-uc4gqprovide the evidence or post ? I am on the fence .
*_You have been watching too much MSM "information"._*
Didn't she confess?
No
Stressed unwell frightened terrified people will say anything to stop recriminations.
@@PH63-t6tabsolutely 💯 false confessions are involved in a number of female extonerees from the Innocence Project
I trust the jury, not Peter Hitchins.
And the jury trust the 'experts' ! Nuff said!!
@@vinparaffin6082 The jury got to listen and watch all sorts of people, mostly at first hand. They receive all sorts of extra information - body language, etc, that Peter Hitchens didn't.
Unfortunately the UK is known for its many miscarriages of justice.
Were you in court to hear everything that the jury heard? If the answer to this question is no, then we can all safely switch off.
And you can switch off your brain
You didn't have to be in court to know the evidence the jury heard was flawed.
I think she did it because there were witnesses who said they was standing over a baby not breathing and didn't do anything until she saw she was being watched. The deaths stopped after she was taken off the unit and they found loads of patient records in her home and a dairy saying she did it. I don't understand how anyone can think she is innocent. She's like Beverly Alit.
I don’t have enough knowledge of this case to make my mind up if she did it or not. The amount of people in the comments acting as if they do have that knowledge is concerning. How would you feel if, after demanding her release, she was released and killed your child? Why people feel the need to jump onto a particular side of the argument with such certainty is beyond me.
Unfortunately this is the world we now live in.
If you care to do some research you would soon realise why people believe Lucy is innocent.
Try reading the Guardian and Telegraph articles on the case.
You could also listen to the excellent podcasts 'Lets Talk About Lucy Letby' by Dr Michael McConville & Peter Elston.
And remember the babies Lucy was supposed to have murdered had post mortems and were found to have died from natural causes.
We dont put people in jail for what they might do in the future its formeaht we can prove they did
@@johnconnors6412 I’m well aware of that. Good to know you’re an expert on the case. You better ring up the courts and demand her release immediately.
@@michaelmurray7220 good to see your an expert on what she might do in the future
Well, if she acted alone , she was very clever, sneaky and surrounded by blind deaf and dumb colleagues and management. Theres people being paid or threatened into keeping very quiet here. Fotr her to kill so many unnoticed dont add up.
I really don't think she is that smart to have outsmarted all those imported consultants with university degrees she's been framed simple as
She’s guilty.
Not true. Those who called her out were made to apologise. Her daddy made them apologise.
a doctor called her out and management made him appologise to her. She was a suspect from very early on.
@@DarkCriimeselaborate then, I’m sure you know everything about the case
Peter Hitchens is addicted to playing the contrarian role.
You can not dismiss the fact that every time a baby died or got worse was when letby was caring for them.. its just horrible to think a human can be capable of these crimes
These babies were incredibly sick and frail so the mortality rate is going to be high.
Except that there were other babies that died when she wasn't there.
You can dismiss it because its not true as there were a further 10 babies that died over the same time period.
@@pamelahunter8659 Especially when they were born into a chaotic, shambolic open sewer with incompetent consultants and under trained staff.
😅What Crime? You must remember all these babies were premature. AND Chester Hospital has now Reduced the Premature weeks for accepting such a baby AND REDUCED THE COTS BY 25%
What about the note? Wasn’t she always on duty when these things happened? Has any changes and what changes have been made to procedures,equipment etc since her arrest, and how do these changes stack up against the percentage of baby deaths since. What about other staff leaving/ leaving to other hospitals, their procedures and baby deaths.
The unexplained deaths stopped as soon as she was removed from the ward
@@exiledone69 Yes, at the exact same time the unit was downgraded and they stopped accepting babies under 32 weeks old. Less very ill babies = less babies dying.
Some of the deaths occurred when she wasn’t on duty.
@@suej9329 which ones? Was she convicted for those ones?
She’s guilty. Who in there. Right mind writes that stuff she wrote in that pad. Come on. Who else is it if not her. Really.
No one should be convicted solely on circumstantial evidence.
the king of contrarians. becoming increasingly irrelevant.
Why did so many babies die? The police investigating made a point that the evidence always pointed and led to her.
17 babies actually died over the same time period but they only managed to pin 7 of them on Lucy. And the babies she was supposed to have murdered had post mortems and were found to have died from natural causes.
Lots of other babies died as well Not just on her watch. The whole ward was for unwell babies in the first place. We all know doctors kill people.
@martint8530 Hear hear!
Parents believed their babies d1ed of natural causes, and years later told they had been m.....d. They had to grieve all over again!
@@adam_turk
as did Dewi Evans, the professional investigator.
😂😂😂😂She wrote a confession note stating ‘I am evil. I did this.’ Stupid people are hilarious.
She said 'they'll think I'm evil...If I missed something'
@@lynnbraben76 here it is word for word: ‘“I don’t deserve to live. I killed them on purpose because I’m not good enough to care for them”, “I am a horrible evil person” and in capital letters “I am evil I did this”.
We live in a world where anyone can say anything about anyone else and make their lives a misery.
Are you joking? She's guilty
Lucy is NOT guilty
@@ruthbashford3176 She most definitely is guilty.
How do u know u got any evidence
@@ruthbashford3176 She IS GUILTY
Being found guilty and being guilty are not always the same thing.
She's guilty as sin.
Hitchens is such a try hard.
He’s an agendarist who’s wheeled out as a credible rebel during difficult scenarios where a U-turn might be needed, he’s seen as an intelligent credible opponent to the agenda when he’s really a fully paid up member, extremely disingenuous
What about all those pictures and diary's that were found in her home they were very dark
"i am not sure what the point of the case was" erm how about the family of the baby. What an absolute cabbage.
Yes, I found that comment quite shocking.
From my very, very brief understanding of the case. They have never been able to actually prove she did it and to convict her on the grounds that she probably did it is just wrong.
As you say, you have a very brief understanding of it.
It's actually the very essence of the British legal system, considered the best in the world.
I mean thats sort of how the law works. Pretty much everyone who's in jail doesn't have some sort of proof like a video tape of them doing it or something. But when all the evidence adds up despite not being direct proof ..if you saw them go in the room and when they came out the baby was dead thats probably that they did it. Even if no camera proves that. And all the weird stuff she has done its pretty unlikely that it was someone else in the ward who was somehow masterminding to put the blame on her and it can't have been accidental .
If you have a brief understanding of the case maybe research before commenting
What you actually mean is, there was no real evidence that ANY deaths on the unit were not 'natural'...
Why so many deaths?
@@user-tt9zc2ii3b Basically because an understaffed unit was trying to look after Pre - natals who should have been accepted by Chester
Proof new Ward reduced from 16 cots to 12 and reducing the pre natal weeks from what they were
Why? The previous RISK WAS TOO GREAT
15 life sentences and Lucy Letby is innocent? No chance 😂 that's just ridiculous she'd have to be very unlucky.... She'll never be freed, must be some evidence there surely.
Isn't that it strange how they had no cameras in the baby ward. If they suspected Lucy of the baby killings. If they suspected her how come they didn't have her on video to proof it was definitely her.🤔
The objection to the additional trial is unwarranted. You must secure as many convictions as possible in the interest of justice and in case any are overturned. If you murder 5 people and get 5 convictions you are still in jail if 4 are overturned.
I do not if Lucy is Guilty or nor Guilty however from the media coverage before the trial it was a forgone conclusion she was Guilty
Similar to Lindy Chamberlain’s trial by media 42 years ago in Australia. She was jailed on dodgy forensic evidence and a biased media campaign, but later exonerated when new evidence in her favour appeared.
There was a court order ban on UK media coverage and reporting before the 2nd trial. Did nobody notice? She was still found guilty.
My concern is the police had their eye on Lucy, and no other theories were investigated. All the stuff with the hand over sheets proved nothing, apart from she waa lapse with data protection. Writing records after her shift is not unusual. Moaning about colleagues, not unusual....
I have always wondered whether it was one of the doctors instead of Lucy…..
The letters her admitting to killing the babies??
False memory syndrome?
Would have also been an extraordinary coincidence if it wasn’t her as she was the common denominator present for all murders/illnesses. The issues also stopped either when the baby was moved out of her reach or when she was incarcerated.
When many different professionals notice the same thing, it’s time to start worrying.
From the very moment Lucy Letbe was arrested and then convicted i had doubts about her guilt. this does not surprise me one bit
There are some juries who are simply not competent enough to deal with complex issues which require a great deal of technical knowledge, I believe this to be such a case.
Which is a good reason for jurors to have IQ tests before being selected.
Yes. That makes sense.
@@Northernlights-gv4vx
like the ones who are overcomplicating and overthinking everything while grandma with her common sense and knowledge of human nature already knows what's up?
I am a nicu nurse and I've had to explain a lot of the things to adult nurses who don't know what's normal and what's nor normal in a nicu. I can't blame the jury for finding her guilty. There should have been some sort of peer review to see if there was a case before going to trial (just for the record there was and they found Lucy was not s suspsct)
@@flohawkins1 I totally agree, yet they expect Mr or Mrs Joe Bloggs to have a grasp of a complex situation, largely just because they pay Council Tax….you couldn’t make it up.
Definitely not guilty. She was a scapegoat.