Update: Turns out Carol did in fact lie and was banned for save injecting prior. (x.com/davoodisatwat/status/1823832876208808176) I don't really give a shit about save injection as it is pretty much not cheating once you are actually in the game but this does justify Behaviour initiating with a 2 week ban, deepening the story a bit.
and when i report blatant cheaters they dont get banned! now there is cheat that can regress gen progress to hold everybody hostage happened 3 times already to me in a course of few weeks..me and the other survivor and the killer had to dc
@@reset123451 editing your save file, like adding in more blood points than you actually own, then launching the game and the blood points you edited in would appear in game. This used to be possible in the earlier days of DBD, but as far as I know, it isn't possible anymore.
A similar situation happened in a game called Black Desert Online in Korea. A korean streamer accidentally used a macro whilst afk in town on stream (macros are bannable offense) which looked like it had done absolutely nothing in benefit to the streamer. Pretty much the whole Korean community was in uproar about this and demanded that he got perma banned. In which he did. Also another korean streamer had actually done the exact same thing as stated above ^^^^. However he had faked it, by using a secret keyboard off camera. He also had gotten banned, but only because the community had demanded and pestered the developers to do it. The funny part about it is that the devs had done an "investigation" into it. claiming that he did use macros. This was obvs a lie or complete incompetence. The streamer had only showed the footage of the secret off camera keyboard after he was gotten banned. So he was wrongfully banned. Its crazy how much control the community has over things like this.
Those are your "customers." If you own a hotel and all of your clients are complaining about a person in one of the room, are you just going to let those people become upset with you at your refusal to do anything, ruining your name and reputation? Or are you just going to do the right thing and kick that guy out and keep your clientele happy?
Carol has, in my personal experience, been pretty vile to people on Twitter over DBD opinions. I think there is more to this. I wouldn't be surprised if BHVR saw something in chat logs or on Twitter.
in-game chat logs is fine, negative or toxic opinions on Twitter should NOT get ANYONE banned. That's just wrong and completely fucking stupid. The TOS of a game does NOT include anything related to social media accounts. Never has and never will.
I already just commented something about them but probably shouldve posted my comment here due to relevance, ive had a bad experience with them too, i faced them as nemesis when they were streaming and the whole time they were just calling me braindead for playing the killer, and were whining constantly
@@madithevampirequeen9316to be fair, that’s the majority of the player base, “WAA WAA YOU’RE NOT PLAYING THE GAME THE WAY I WANT YOU TO AND USING SOMETHING I DON’T LIKE WAAAA!!!” Just such a lame community.
@@julcanda actually no, he ban evaded and conveniently keep that out from his OG post and had to bring it up when people realized things weren’t making sense, So #KeepThatWeirdoLockedUp
@@madithevampirequeen9316 ok but did he also do that in game chat or was he saying that exclusively in his stream? There's a big difference to some1 directly insulting you IN the game and someone who's talking shit "privately". Like sure, he was an asshole for talking shit about you in his stream, but you made the choice to listen in the first place and that should not be bannable, only in-game behavior should be.
@@chemicalfx_v2that's the point BOTH should have received some form of negative reinforcement. They should BOTH have gotten a temporary ban. Neither should have gotten a permanent ban
@@chemicalfx_v2they didn't call the killer innocent, they said that the survivors weren't innocent either. So having just one side punished (especially that severely) doesn't make sense
Maybe something else at play we don't kno about 😮 Seen content creators in the past get ban for using hacks, then make a video tryna prove their innocence. It's extremely hard to believe he was ban for that. Also, Behavior isn't going to tell you why you was ban. For all we know, this video could be a "pity me, I'm innocence" video. It's very difficult to believe he was ban for that. Seriously hope not!
The issue is that DBD has mechanics that allow your opponent to remove your agency as a player, on both sides. This is foolish game design and instead of eliminating the issue, BHVR places the blame on the players and turns the player base against each other. The game allows people to act out of ego, spite, and malice, instead of out of a desire to complete the game. The game then gives you no ability to react or respond to these actions, and you are penalized by every avenue of avoidance (DC penalty, losing BP when disconnecting, banning for retaliation, etc.).
TRUE, situations like that should NOT be possible in the first place. It is stupid that there is no mechanics to prevent it. You said it well , the game (or developers) just assume players will be reasonable enough to not stand afk on hatch or decide to hide until killer gives up.
The whole game objectives are fundamentally flawed (hooking vs killing, playing immersed vs doing gens), and even though they have been slowly fixing the most insane shit over the years it's still far from being done. Mori at 5 gens, bully/sabo squads, 10h hatch standoffs, old keys, forever freddy/chess merchant, tombstone myers etc. there's been just so many retarded strats in this game
@@Archimedes.5000 I agree. Many many dumb things... I really do miss the old keys, though. It was broken as hell, but multiple person hatch escapes were so exhilarating. Some of my best memories from the game are coordinating a desperate escape through the hatch with a teammate against a killer that was dominating us.
I think the entire concept of static objectives like hooks and generators is flawed from the very core. It encourages territorial and minimum interaction gameplay like camping, tunnelling, or generator rushing. All strategies where players mostly stand still and/or interact with the adversary as little as possible and usually limit the action to only small parts of the map. I wish they would make the primary objective more dynamic and encourage exploring the map more.
It's a morally gray scenerio, giving a PERMANENT BAN for this considering that player NEVER had an offense in their 4K hours playing the game is AN INSANE OVERKILL and not at all deserved. This actually made me lose all faith in BHVR Edit: NVM they deserved it lmao
Wait until you hear about the manual permanent bans handed out to random content creators because a hacker who streams their cheats copied their stream overlays. Some allegedly never received an unban (bhvr outright refused)-if someone has an update on those niche cases PLEASE correct me
Someone made a great point earlier. No gaming company tells you why you was ban. What we see in this video is what he thinks he was ban for. For all we kno, this video could be a "pity me I did nothing" type deal. The dude could've been using hacks or something. We will never truly kno. If the Creator was telling the truth, and he truly thinks he was ban for that body block. Feel sorry for dude.
@@mercifuldeath Most streamer I watched that got ban, stated "They won't even tell me why I was ban". Seen this multiple times so I don't really take your word over what I seen.
Its not holding the game hostage if there are other survivors doing gens. Holding a game hostage, by definition, requires a state where the game cannot progress and end through normal game play.
I don't agree with that definition. If a survivor playing the game had ended up body blocked, even if other survivors can trigger EGC, that's still denying general gameplay. I would say *if* EGC has already started, it becomes a reasonable tactical end to the game (and killers frequently fail this attempt eg blocking at the exit gate when the timer is close). But before then, the tactic is too long-term blocking of gameplay to be called "tactical" unless you're going by ultra-competitive tunneling-minded rulesets.
If i remember correctly, BHVR stated you can still be banned as killer if you hold someone on a corner, even if other survivors are still alive, for example if you find a claudette at the start of the trial and holds her hostage in a corner the entire game, thats bannable even if their teamates are doing gens and "progressing the game" @@ScottJund
I'm almost positive the tweet battle where Carol had his followers spam #freecarol on every BHVR twitter post probably made the two week ban into a permaban. Carol could have taken the two week ban and moved on. Carol may be the sacrificial goat to show other streamers to not marshal their followers to spam BHVR over suspensions.
@@Archimedes.5000 if you move someone out your house because they broke the rules and you banned em for 2 weeks and they come with a riot outside your house because they are mad, you aint gonna want that riot to ever come in your house a long with the person who started it right.. pretty valid
@@bsn6e4 That doensn't change the fact that it still sets a terrible precedent. How would you feel like if the Devs permabanned you because you said some opinion unrelated to the game on outside media and they didn't agree and saw fit to ban you just for that? Regarless of what is said, the result is the same; Banned for saying things in a media outside the game.
A small ban for it? Sure as long as the survivors get it too. But a perma ban? Just for ruining the game for one person in one match after being held hostage? That's just stupid. Turns out they have been banned before but even so Scott's point of Carol never really holding anyone hostage rings true. I especially want to know what happened to the other survivors who spent all that time doing nothing and whether they received a ban or not. And Carol's further point of general inconsistencies with who, why and for how long Bhvr decides to ban people is also true. There have been well known hackers who have existed in the game, some in the community, for years now. There are transphobes, racists, homophobes, etc that run rampant in their servers with little backlash from Bhvr. Some of them are streamers who broadcast their bigotry for people to see. It makes me feel like they are potentially making an example out of Carol. To prove that they aren't going to allow well known figures in the community to break their rules.
@XiaoLing-pu9st What you said is very true. No gaming company wants to tell you why you was ban. The last thing they'll do is tell you which hack got someone ban. They want you to second guess what got you ban. So that person can't find ways around it. Sounds crappy but it's actually the best way to go about it while protecting other players.
@@SweetLeavesXbox1 When a case becomes a public controversy it is best to come out and say your reasoning. Otherwise your playerbase will lose trust in you. You'll find plenty of evidence of other companies doing this, when a case becomes a significant controversy they will come out and speak about it. Staying silent will only make your players hate you.
One thing: remorse in court does in fact go a very long way determining minimum vs maximum sentence. I’m not saying that anything is deserved or not, just that if someone is genuinely remorseful of their action they usually get a lighter sentence.
@@godlyvex5543 They literally lied to everyone about being banned before to gain sympathy from others. Like I said I couldn’t care less about them or their account.
@@godlyvex5543 Are you being obtuse of purpose? They lied to everyone about their previous bans and were caught save injecting on PC after getting banned on PlayStation which is against TOS. Also on top of that Carol is known for being very rude and despicable to people online. The perma ban is deserved 100%
After some more thinking, I think a better system for AFK detection would be to have a hidden timer that counts down when you are doing nothing, and counts back up while you do conspicuous actions. If the timer hits 0 you will get crows and noise notifs and they won't go away until you personally complete an objective. For example 10 minute timer, put every second on a gen, or healing, or exit gate opening increases your time by 5 seconds per second spent on the action. So if you spent 1 minute finding a gen, your down to 9 minutes, but if you work on it for 12 seconds you are back up to 10 minutes. Could add a bonus to your time for completing an objective too or finishing a heal, or unhooking. Just test a bit and tweak. 10 minutes is a LONG time in DBD, anyone wasting that much time is being a piece of poop. Meanwhile just make a killer who doesn't cause a hit for 10 minutes lose collision. Now a ban isn't needed the game is changed to make hiding for a LONG time not possible, and killers can't body block you forever.
That's a pretty sound idea, and would go a long way towards combatting this. It may have issues with things like 3-gen Skull Merchant, where you may literally be unable to progress the game as survivor despite your best efforts.
The problem with this idea is that it requires competent tuning to implement properly. But as a company incapable of understanding statistics, this requirement is beyond them.
I've only reported one person for bodyblocking. A skullmerchant held my friend in a spot for 50 minutes until the server closed. Game was completely normal, he just got stuck mid chase as the last person and she decided to sit and wait. He wasn't hiding, just got found by BBQ after the last death.
@@finnjay6149 I'm scrambling to hold on to what little remains, if at all. I am fully convinced we have a case, but i'm afraid a large chunk of the community would sooner actually die in real life than admit or say anything positive about skull merchant regardless of how much of a point one has, so it's rather hopeless. Well, won't give up still.
@@dumblenutz5561 seriously though, I played my second match as Skull Merchant trying to get her Adept, and the match was pretty decent. There was only 1 gen left to do, not even in a 3 gen "chess merchant" situation, as the gens were spread around, 1 dead, the rest hooked at least once. I enter a chase with someone but they give up and stop running, ruining the match for the rest of their team. Then after I inevitably won, the only lobby message I get is "wow boring killer" from the guy that gave up. I wasn't even putting drones on gens by the way. I was using them in chase and putting them in tight spots around the map such as the main building and jungle gyms (it was Nurse's map). DbD players feel so entitled to having everything go their way it's pathetic.
@@samk8905 Then stop implying you dont give a rats ass. Makes you seem neutral to your current situation (being banned) and therefore nobody would think to bother un banning. Buddies hitting behavior with the "im not mad.. I just think its funny that" Theres a reason his tweets are deleted lol ^_^ buddy played a stupid game and won the ultimate prize
People have some kind of allergy to implying they care about anything at all that they aren't socially demanded to care about. Probably because the moment you say you're serious or passionate about something everyone mocks you with the usual. "Nerd", "it's not that serious", "chill bro", "i aint reading all that". When you consider this, it's no wonder everyone desperately tries to say they don't care even if they clearly do. You are socially pressured to be apathetic because god forbid those gutless fools see someone with more spirit than them, no no, everyone has to be pathetic like them. This is all a sad display from both sides of the described problem, honestly. Yes, i've experienced it a lot. You could surely tell from how much i "cared" about it and wrote a text that's more than 2 sentences long... A book on it's own right by modern barely-literate standards. Ugh.
@@andreyu5640 You will have found nothing said to be toxic my guy. No idea what this generations deal is with calling absolutely everything in every situation toxic because you may not agree. Get educated on the matter.
This guy didn’t just do it as a one time thing, he is notorious for holding people hostage in his games so it was most likely a build up of multiple offences before they decided to reach the decision they have.
He has lit. never been banned before. He streams almost all of his games, so if that were the case he would've had past bans and would've been permabanned sooner
Moderators on forums have stated that *blocking someone so that they cannot do anything to progress the game is against game rules - if they are not in dying state (bleedout), EGC has not started (countdown timer for end of game), on a hook (again hook timer will end) - there is nothing they can do to progress that game, so the player who is preventing them taking part in the game is at fault here.'* Holding the game hostage doesn't mean the overall match is in hostage, it is holding the game hostage by disallowing survivor(s) from progressing the match. Survivors also broke the rule. However, he was maliciously doing it blatantly by recording himself, we have no idea if the other players are new or are waiting for hatch. I have been held hostage many times as killer for around 10-15 minutes, I have found the players every time and I just kill them. We do not know if this man is lying about this being his first ban as they do not have a good reputation. We have no idea if the other players were banned as well. A moderator must have been watching his stream for it to be a ban that fast. If you were really upset about being held hostage, you would have instantly downed the survivor after being found, yet you go AFK to do something else, so why not AFK when you realise they weren't progressing? Both are in the wrong, but blatant malicious intent from the streamer was here.
"If you were really upset about being held hostage, you would have instantly downed the survivor after being found" Says who? I'm not gonna say it's necessarily okay to retaliate, but how can you say "if this really annoyed you, you would have actually not retaliated" and not see the obvious absurdity The person was mad, they got even. You can argue whether or not that's okay but you can't argue it didn't make sense
Honestly, not sure if this is a hot take or something, but I'd say everyone should be banned. This is super boring on all sides and there's griefing from both sides, and everyone's being super immature and petty about it
How is it grieffing by killer, if second surv is free to end the match by doing gens? Desire to punish psychopaths and have vengeance by blocking untill egc death or bleed out is absolutely normal and mature thing. I bleed out survivors for much lesser things than holding me hostage
@@MrPendalv That's not exactly something to be proud of. Forcing someone to not be able to play the game is not a mature thing to do, as a survivor or killer.
I honestly don't know if survivors should be banned, like if trying to get hatch is bannable that's silly, they should just give killer a base kit aura reading for 3 sec every 30 sec if like 3-5min pass and you haven't been in a chase or something like that. Boom solved hiding
@@irregularassassin6380 your view on justice is so twisted :) First, its not a complete block pf able to play the game, match can be ended by second surv. And if it deserved and holding hostage was started by survivors, then its just justified punishment
@@bigidiot5881 Hiding isn't denying the killer to play the game. You could argue this game is about hide and seek, therefore hiding can by definition not be "holding the game hostage".
Carol could have just downed the Ada and hooked them, proxy camp if they wanted the match to be over. The survivors tho is speculation whether they intent was to hold the killer hostage or not. Carol putting a tweet of them trapping the Ada by the hook probably didn't help their case too.
As a member of the jury, I am inclined to believe that the game was NOT indeed held hostage, as the defense has pointed out that there was a second survivor who could progress the game
BHVR has clarified multiple times that blocking a Survivor, even if others are still alive, is a bannable offense. So guilty as charged as the law BHVR set down was indeed broken. Now it'd be interesting to know why it was a permaban that was chosen as punishment. Maybe support harrassment? Past cheating? we don't know. But as a response to one bodyblock it's a bit overkill. 2 Weeks would suffice for that to send the message. But even better would be if Survivors lost collision when they gain 3 crows so this no longer is an issue ...
From 2018 on the dbd forums commented by Peanits. Title is "what is classed as bannable bodyblocking": What you described is not bannable. It actually wouldn't work either since hitting them allows them to pass through you briefly. Bodyblocking is bannable when it is used to hold the game hostage or grief, such as blocking a survivor in a corner and sitting there for a long period of time just so they can't play. Or sandbagging, where you intentionally jump in from of someone and block their path so the killer hits them. ------------------------------------------------------------ also the ban reason stated for the 2 week was griefing, intentional gameplay abuse NOT holding the game hostage.
The perma ban was because he injected addons into his account by bypassing easy anticheat. So he wasn't perma banned for holding the game hostage he was banned for modifying the game. Turned out he lied about being banned b4. Not surprised he was an asshole on twitter at every opportunity
its not an "indefinite" hostage but it should absolutely be bannable, i understand it being in retaliation but we shouldnt set a precedent for "bodyblocking a survivor for the entire match is okay because the game will end eventually", getting slugged out for 4 minutes already sucks enough, lets not give killers another tool to ruin peoples games with
I think it was okay in this case because the survivors did it to him first. Nobody was being punished or having their agency taken away except the person who was taking away someone else's agency. The person who started it is at fault.
He hopped on Twitter and said “worth it I don’t care” would a behavior employee not read that and be like ok this person could very likely end up being a repeat offender and they obviously don’t have any remorse so why not just perma ban to get ahead of this issue? Not to mention he also said in the video that he WANTED to hold the ada hostage for the full hour even though that isn’t what ended up happening. Gloating about it was like actually the dumbest thing he could’ve done.
crazy how it's literally impossible to reply to your comment cause youtube just auto deletes anything that sounds remotely negative. I'm trying to say that they were in the right.
It doesn't matter if server times out or not, you simply can't hold survivor in a corner and not end up hitting them, because killer is a proactive role.
Reminds me one time, my lobby saw that Haddie was stuck in the middle of a rock on the Cinema map... and in my head I was like "dang if I don't trigger egc she could be here for a while..." So I opened the gate and then died with her 😅
Bittersweet revenge. Unfortunately, many online game report systems have a flaw like this. For Apex, it's chat toxicity vs open-mic toxicity without recordings. Someone can openly say every curse word in every language and if you don't record it but type negativity back, you are at fault and can be banned permanently... which is what happened to me.
I once got held for 15 mins as the last survivor standing with hatch available. I tried to do a sneaky trick on RPD near 2nd floor bathroom, fake the hole and run into a stall and hope the killer drops down the hole. The fake didn’t work and I was held hostage for 15 minutes. I reported this as hostage takeover, and BHVR responding by saying sorry you had a bad experience, nothing we can do… if this guy gets banned, then why didn’t the plague in my game. Only thing I can think of is content creators are being held to a higher standard… simply because BHVR can find the footage I guess.
Behaviour definitely needs to free carol if genuinely he hasn’t also done anything bad prior, one match meaning you can’t play the game you spend 4k hours on, is just absolutely STUPID
oh this guy, i honestly cant stand him, went against him as nemesis once when he was streaming and the whole time he was just whining and making fun of me because "nemesis is so braindead to play" despite literally being a spirit main which is arguably worse 😭
There's also a possibility that after constantly getting twitter farmed, Bhvr looked at previous reports and found Carol to have done/said some heinous shit.
@@parkerluciani7048 what? That's crazy. You're so desperate for any advantage you're justifying glitching the game. Maybe chill and play the game according to the rules?
@@araccoonstolemyradiator ? It's the developpers role to change what is wrong with the game, not to tje community to play ignorining that. If after many years this can of things still exist, it's a game feature, not a bug. Why are so so concilient witht the devs ? It's litteraly their job
tl;dw : Strimmer was permabanned sometime in the past, ban evaded, got a 2-week ban for griefing, which brought BHVR's attention to his case, upgrading the ban to a perma once they found out he was ban evading a prior perma.
Survivors that dont repair gens and dont get into chase, should just have their aura revealed, period. Killers who sit there bodyblocking you should have their character become intangible and lose collision, too many games recently consist of survivors halting the entire game to hide and try and get hatch
Hey Judge, just chiming in with some info about irl court Publicly posting about crimes does sometimes influence rulings since a lot of rulings will consider if the perpetrator is remorseful, likelihood of reoffending once released, etc. Public statements can help to inform these determinations depending on the nature of the statements.
I once held a David "hostage" for the 4K to get my Oni adept achievement because he was avoiding being hooked by using Boil Over on Coal Tower fire escape (2F). So I immediately put him down, got off the fire escape and found hatch (it wasn't far away), went back to David and let him wiggle off, and he ran back into the corner to avoid being hooked, so I just held him in the corner of the fire escape until EGC took him. I obviously haven't been banned for this, but I couldn't be, right? I took steps to end the game sooner while still getting the best result for myself and the David was trying to stall the game further by remaining on the fire escape.
The murder comparison kinda makes sense, but there's a massive difference in sentencing if a defendant says "I regret it," vs. "I dont regret it at all." On a less extreme: mom and dad grounds you and takes your cell phone for a week. If you yell out the window "Worth it!" to your friends waiting outside in earshot of your parents, expect even more punitive measures. That's exactly what happened with Carol, and he tried to farm as much X clout as possible from the situatuon. Literally signaling to BHVR he doesn't care about their rules, and no one else should. He'd take the ban and get right back to it by Castlevania DLC. Indefinite ban is certainly a choice, but he should respect BHVR's decision (doesnt matter if he didnt have priors). It's part of being an adult. He can work on other aspects of his life in the mean time.
Why doesn't Behavior design the game to prevent these issues? It's absurd that with all their money and success, they can't find a solution. What if, after 60 seconds of standing still, the player's body collider disables just like it does when they get hit? You can't ban a player for using the tools provided, toxic or not-it's on the dev team to fix these issues so players can't abuse them. From the killer's POV, if they move, there's a high chance a healthy survivor would escape once the gate opens, especially with the speed boost they get when hit. The survivor would need to make a major mistake for the killer to actually win, so tactically, this is the best option, toxic or not. It's the dev team's fault that this happens, not the player's.
This is why I don’t argue with survivors, they can hold a game hostage when they know they won’t win. The moment you slug you’re every word in the dictionary.
He had a previous account which was permabanned for save editing items into his inventory. After they gave him his two week griefing ban they realized he was the same person as the previously banned account so they permabanned his new one. Still not a reason to perma ban someone for not recomitting an offense of TOS or whatever bhvr shoves down our throats as backup
So the person that ACTUALLY held the game hostage gets away without punishment and the person that DIDNT hold the game hostage gets permabanned. Fuck BVHR.
@@randomaetherThere have been countless times when I’m playing a match as survivor and everyone is doing their part for most of the game. But then once it goes down to two survivors remaining, often times one of them stops whatever they’re doing and simply hides. Waiting for the other survivor to get eliminated
There's no gray area and it's surreptitious to pass it off as such. Holding the game hostage is just the title of the offense, not its whole definition with all nuances. BHVR said many times the exact behavior in that video falls under this infraction. There's no wiggle room, no grey area unless we make up one. For the perma ban it was either a mistake that should be appealed, or someone is lying about the first offense.
Your honour, the killer in question here IS holding the game hostage for the Ada. While this isn't holding the whole survivor team hostage, he is still removing all agency from a player and locking them out of the game. Midwich is also a terrible map to find generators, making the survivor case harder to prove. And yes, bHVR and people involved in bans do have clear biases and grudges against people, as I have experienced on the forums with one individual being allowed on for way too long, and seeing others banned at the drop of a hat. That being said, I believe that the initial ban is justified and anything after that was possibly a result of fanning the flames.
Honestly ban all 3 then. Carol posted a video of bragging about doing it. Also they clearly stated in comments that "They DNGAF about being banned for 2 weeks" well guess what? You got perna banned. This is not their first instance doing this. Also there is no defending Carol's behavior because we do not know if the David was in the same VC as them. So Carol is keeping the game hostage for Ada. They handed the smoking gun to the cops and are mad they were banned. Carol knew what they were doing posting the video and getting peoples attention. They are actively happy about their little fanbase attacking Behavior which is not needed. Behavior took action and they were upset at the 2 week and than proceeded to keep poking the bear. UPDATE: There it is. The other piece of the puzzle. They were lying the whole time and really injected items into the game. So I guess I was right about them being scummy.
"slugging people for the 4k is never a bannable offense" - Slugging people for any reason is never a bannable offense. Slugging them because you want to BM and humptech them is not a bannable offense. BHVR doesn't care because there's a built-in timer that guarantees slugging can only last so long. That timer is how long BHVR is okay with you doing this. Bodyblocking a survivor has no set timer. In this video, Ada had no control over how long it took David to finish the gens, or if he would finish at all. The game was being held hostage by the killer for an indefinite period of time, which is why the killer was banned. You can get away with doing this for a couple minutes at most (waiting for cooldowns, waiting for last gen to pop, waiting for EGC to end, etc). You can't do it for 5+ minutes though. Should the survivors also be banned for not working on gens? Maybe if they kept it up. I don't think any survivors are getting banned for having 2 gens left at 14 minutes. This killer was a little too impatient, looking for survivors is part of the game and hiding from the killer is part of the game. If survivors were required to touch a gen at least once every 5 minutes, most of the community would be banned retroactively. Some challenges (like "cleanse 5 totems" or "find the glyphs") really incentivize you to focus on objectives other than gens. I'm a killer main so I understand the occasional frustration of not being able to find the last survivors, but even so, I say the killer is guilty here. The match didn't last nearly long enough to fault the survivors. Even if the killer had bled out Ada, the match would have been less than 20 minutes long.
Addendum: Although the killer was guilty, giving the killer a permanent ban is insanity, especially when they have 4k hours and it's their first offense. Bodyblocking a survivor for 10 minutes to secure a kill should not be a PERMANENT ban. The punishment does not fit the crime.
Crazy how BHVR finally cares about "holding the game hostage" while killers have been "4k slugging until bleed out" since the dawn of dbd. There's no significant difference between 4 minutes and 15 minutes in this scenario.
The fact you can get held hostage at all in a situation where the EGC hasn't started it dumb. Why Behaviour can't just add a piece of code that removes collision for survivors to killers after they get three crows circling their head or something like that is obviously beyond my understanding.
It's certainly possible to counter survivors attempting to spend large amounts of time in the game doing nothing. The game is capable of seeing if a player is doing all sorts of various things, as evidenced by the challenges in the game. I think that after 5 minutes, the player should start getting an AFK crow. Similar to being AFK but taking longer to getting them. Say, start with 1 at 5 minutes and get 1 every minute, until your location is constantly given to the killer every 5 seconds at 3 crows. The crows would also not be visible to the killer unless you had three of them as it's meant to tell you to make progress, not make it easier to be found. In response, you can avoid getting crows or begin dispersing crows by doing things that put you at risk or otherwise progressing the game. A Crow would disappear once every ten seconds if: You work on a generator. You attempt to open a chest (At least 1 crow disperses if you open it, even if you only did it for one second). You attempt to restore a healing state (Again, at least 1 crow is gone if successful) Cleanse a totem (only if it's fully cleansed) Opening the Exit Gate. Crows would instantly disperse if: You are the last survivor. The killer successfully lands an attack on you. The killer starts a chase after you. You successfully blind the killer with an item. You successfully stun the killer with a pallet. You rescue a survivor from a hook. The End Game Collapse begins for any reason. Even if you otherwise do nothing for 5 minutes, you will not gain a crow if: You are the last survivor standing (it's a race to the hatch now, the only way the game can be held hostage is if both people do it and stealth is very important for the survivor). The End Game Collapse is active.
I mean just make it so survivors auras are revealed for 3 sec every 30 sec if 5min pass and no chase. (Except if only 1 survivor) No need for all this complex shit.
@@ethan6627 I don't agree with that. It's possible to go through most, even the entire game, without being seen let alone chased by the killer and still be contributing to winning the game. Very unlikely, but still possible. For example, most of the games where I barely interact with the killer is when I'm running a healing build and I hide if I hear the terror radius at all. This means I can rescue and heal those that go down and get the most out of my perks. But with this, those games would cause me to end up being revealed about halfway through a game consistently, even though I'm doing things that are helping to progress it.
@Technature7567 I mean in general if no survivor is chased for 5min if in 5min a killer can't find a survivor then they can be shown survivor locations for 3 sec every 30 sec I think just to help them get into a chase, so unless your whole team can't be found for 5min you won't get revealed
I’ve been playing dbd for about 450 hours now and I just had this happen to me for the first time today. It was so frustrating… I was on the Haddonfield map, and I was repairing a generator on the second floor of one of the houses; I was in a small room with one entrance and Ghostface stood in the doorway body blocking the entrance to my little room for the whole match. Everyone else was able to repair the gens and escape. I genuinely don’t understand how the killer could’ve gotten any enjoyment out of doing this. My Nvidia overlay recorder wasn’t working otherwise I would’ve opened a ticket and sent the footage to Behavior.
It happened with me too. I was playing Demo, the survivors brought me to Midwich and had dark outfits and a full stealth build. It was one of the worst and most boring match I've ever played.
Its actually insane that someone can get banned for this. Would holding a single person in a corner when 3 others are alive also be considered holding them hostage? Bhvr's logic is so dumb.
Of course it's bannable. It's holding the game hostage for that specific person as they can do nothing to actually play the video game. Blocking someone for a little while is fine; either to mess with them or use a killer power like Plague, Bubba, etc but for an extended period as Carol did? Even with three left it'd still be a ban.
@@bobcat946732 no, because they will get out eventually. Holding the game hostage has to stop the game progression completely, which bodyblocking one person does not do when there's multiple other people who can progress the game.
@@araccoonstolemyradiator That it literally not true. They have gone on record multiple times saying blocking a single person is bannable because it's holding that specific person hostage. Whether the game can continue doesn't matter. The only exception being EGC where you can body block someone till time run out.
@@bobcat946732 that's still crazy then, since their word goes against their written rules. Imo that shouldn't be bannable since the game would end if the killer did nothing but waste a single survivor's time for a few minutes. Thanks for giving me their official opinion though.
I love that BHVR has managed to figure out spirit/onryo being able to phase through players but cant figure out letting survivors phase through killers if neither of them have moved more than 5m in 15-20 seconds. Sure would be nice
The survivors are at 2 gens with 2 survivors left, they either do gens and die, or don't do gens and die, regardless at this point it's Ada and David fighting for a chance at hatch. Survivors aren't responsible for the killer not being able to find them, in fact they essentially doing what they're supposed to be doing here, trying to survive as long as possible. The survivors can't progress the game at this point because the game is at a stalemate, the killer found a Survivor and refuses to act, which is in fact holding the game hostage. The survivors can do nothing to win in this scenario unless the killer allows it, and so they don't try, which is a normal response because had they tried one Survivor would likely be slugged until death which is also holding the game hostage. The job of survivors is to survive, the job of killer is to kill survivors, the survivors tried to survive here, the killer refused to kill. In conclusion this is the killers fault, and the proper ban was issued, end of conversation.
I asked this a while ago in the steam community hub. And the answer was that this is a bannable offence because of the grief, not holding the game hostage.
By their own definition of hostage taking, what Carol did isn't it. The game could end, and a slap on the wrist ban wouldve been enough punishment, if bhvr truly did take it personally when theyre a massive fucking company and extend it? That's truly fucking pathetic. Especially when they could and SHOULD have a fix for this shit by now, its been said a million times but make survivors lose collision when a certain amount of afk crows are acquired, and teveal survivors not progressing the game in anyway, or if theyre too fucking lazy for even that, just force EGC after a certain amount of time when theres only two survivors left.
By their own definition this is hostage taking though? They've said multiple times that body blocking a survivor where they can't move is bannable as it's holding that specific survivor hostage. You can hold the game hostage and you can hold specific survivors hostage. Both are bannable and Carol deserved a ban. Now whether the two weeks was justified is impossible to say. We have no idea if they're lying and there is more going on. Now going from the comments and some of their tweets, they don't seem like the best of people so I'm leaning on they've either been banned before or there is more going on. It's impossible to say for sure though.
Apparently it's more time efficient to manually police each individual player's behavior than to just code the behavior to become impossible. It's like manually moving your cows back onto the farm one by one every single day rather than building a fence
From 2018 on the dbd forums commented by Peanits. Title is "what is classed as bannable bodyblocking": What you described is not bannable. It actually wouldn't work either since hitting them allows them to pass through you briefly. Bodyblocking is bannable when it is used to hold the game hostage or grief, such as blocking a survivor in a corner and sitting there for a long period of time just so they can't play. Or sandbagging, where you intentionally jump in from of someone and block their path so the killer hits them.
1:10 this is false. I actually asked bhvr if the old pig box situation or the current situation where Myers stares at a survivor in locker wanting his achievement but the survivor knowing this stay inside the locker to deny him; both are NOT considered holding the game hostage. Holding the game hostage now is extremely rare and I can't even think of a situation currently bug or otherwise that can legit hold a game hostage since the coming of EGC. Holding the game hostage is "If the game CANNOT continue, then the game is being held hostage." This is why previously, killer standing at the basement stairs was "Holding the game hostage", Previously the basement stairs was so narrow that the killer could be on the stairs and block the 2 survivors in basement from going for a save) and not only block them but EGC didn't exist at the time. Guess what? That's a hostage situation because the game cannot literally end. The Survivors in Carol's clip DID NOT hold the game hostage in anyway, they have the benefit of the doubt of "Trying for the hatch by hoping the other dies". Carol I see, publicly admitted to grieving them on purpose seems like a shut case to me, Do I think bhvr over did it? Absolutely. Heck you are allowed to body block kill survivors as long as EGC is active because you are doing it for the intent to kill them. But Carol afk'd in the clip adding another layer of things to add to reasons to his ban. I think Carol was in the wrong here completely and the survivors did nothing wrong. However, It is bhvr's fault themselves for allowing things like this happen; you shouldn't blame survivors for trying to survive with the mechanics available.
From 2018 on the dbd forums commented by Peanits. Title is "what is classed as bannable bodyblocking": What you described is not bannable. It actually wouldn't work either since hitting them allows them to pass through you briefly. Bodyblocking is bannable when it is used to hold the game hostage or grief, such as blocking a survivor in a corner and sitting there for a long period of time just so they can't play. Or sandbagging, where you intentionally jump in from of someone and block their path so the killer hits them. ------------------------------------------------ From 2020 0n the dbd forums also commented by Peanits. Title is "Why are killers allowed to take the game hostage but survivors aren't": Struggling on the hook is not taking the game hostage, first of all. It's only considered to be holding the game hostage when it's indefinite or for an extended period of time. The longest you can stay on a hook is 2 minutes (+34 seconds if you happen to have Camaraderie). Beyond that, nobody is allowed to take the game hostage. Whether that's survivors crouching around in corners refusing to touch generators to drag on the game for half an hour or a killer blocking someone in the corner and refusing to kill them, it's reportable either way.
Frankly, even if the survivors are “holding the game hostage” it really is up to the killer to successfully track and locate the hiding survivors regardless if they do gens or not. It can be a boring slog for sure, but it is clear the devs encourage hiding in some ways (i.e. the recent iron will buff). I don’t mind when the last 2 survivors go full hiding mode because the game shifts away from the typical DBD to a hide-and-seek mode (you can call me crazy for that). Now this is a totally different story if you are a streamer, at which point having survivors hide can hurt your viewership and slow down any excitement which is obviously annoying. Still, like you said, its not possible to prove maliciousness on the survivors end which Carol clearly displayed. Even if he wanted to make the claim to BHVR that he was being held hostage, it simply doesn’t work because of his actions towards the Ada. He could’ve easily killed her when he saw her and have a strong argument that his time was being wasted by the survs but nope. He threw that chance away.
I mean, if someone uses hacks on a match, you can't just also use hacks and go "Well, they did it first so it is okay." Other than that, I think the fact that Carol made a bid deal of the situation with the deleted tweets and #freecarol stuff was what pushed the 2 week ban itnto a permaban. You don't delete tweets just because, I think.
Those are two completely different situations. One is using exploits, and this was using an in game mechanic. Carol did not start #freecarol, his followers on twitter did that on their own accord. People delete tweets all the time, like if they realise it comes off in a way they didn't mean it to, or if he tweeted it while he was angry and later realised it wasn't acceptable
@@samk8905 The streamer literally has #freecarol in their name on Twitter. I think you can say they started it and my bet is there is probably some stream stuff where Carol maybe marshals his followers into action.
Update: Turns out Carol did in fact lie and was banned for save injecting prior. (x.com/davoodisatwat/status/1823832876208808176) I don't really give a shit about save injection as it is pretty much not cheating once you are actually in the game but this does justify Behaviour initiating with a 2 week ban, deepening the story a bit.
Gives BHVR an excuse to perma-ban at any rate, and they probably didn't like the hoard of rabid fans that spammed their twitter over a 2 week ban
What is save injection??
they cheat items into their account @@reset123451
and when i report blatant cheaters they dont get banned! now there is cheat that can regress gen progress to hold everybody hostage happened 3 times already to me in a course of few weeks..me and the other survivor and the killer had to dc
@@reset123451 editing your save file, like adding in more blood points than you actually own, then launching the game and the blood points you edited in would appear in game. This used to be possible in the earlier days of DBD, but as far as I know, it isn't possible anymore.
We the Jury find both players guilty of playing Dead by Daylight and insist on the death penalty
Your Honor, League of Legends.
@@flameous
_horrified gasp_
I think its about time we implement Marshall Law and get rid of these "Dead By Daylight players"
The constant infighting of this community has more lore than the actual game sometimes
@@flameous That requires the torture penalty.
I don’t wish to alarm you your honor but your courtroom appears to be going up in flames
Order in court, this remark is completely beside the point.
The Great Ace Attorney 2 ending
its just a hot topic, so all good
Objection.
Relevence?
Sustained
SEND HIM TO THE PRINCIPAL'S OFFICE AND HAVE HIM EXPELLED!
Minus! Lmao
i thought it was an explosion chamber
W reference
W reference, minus was a g, however Mr electric my OG real one
HE RUINED MY DREAM JOURNAL
Your honor, permission to refer to the jury as "chat".
This is good I'm gonna steal this for a discord status thank you :3
Motion denied
Scot Jund, Doug Doug, and Northernlion walk into a court room...
Death penalty
Dead by penalty
This profile pic goes well with this comment I almost shitted my self from laughing
He will be dead by daylight
A similar situation happened in a game called Black Desert Online in Korea. A korean streamer accidentally used a macro whilst afk in town on stream (macros are bannable offense) which looked like it had done absolutely nothing in benefit to the streamer. Pretty much the whole Korean community was in uproar about this and demanded that he got perma banned. In which he did.
Also another korean streamer had actually done the exact same thing as stated above ^^^^. However he had faked it, by using a secret keyboard off camera. He also had gotten banned, but only because the community had demanded and pestered the developers to do it. The funny part about it is that the devs had done an "investigation" into it. claiming that he did use macros. This was obvs a lie or complete incompetence. The streamer had only showed the footage of the secret off camera keyboard after he was gotten banned. So he was wrongfully banned. Its crazy how much control the community has over things like this.
Getting banned off BDO is kind of a win though lol
His headphones fell on his keyboard when he got up and it used a preprogrammed macro that came with the keyboard.
crabs in a bucket
Those are your "customers." If you own a hotel and all of your clients are complaining about a person in one of the room, are you just going to let those people become upset with you at your refusal to do anything, ruining your name and reputation? Or are you just going to do the right thing and kick that guy out and keep your clientele happy?
@@aPumpknso mob mentality
Carol has, in my personal experience, been pretty vile to people on Twitter over DBD opinions. I think there is more to this. I wouldn't be surprised if BHVR saw something in chat logs or on Twitter.
in-game chat logs is fine, negative or toxic opinions on Twitter should NOT get ANYONE banned. That's just wrong and completely fucking stupid. The TOS of a game does NOT include anything related to social media accounts. Never has and never will.
I already just commented something about them but probably shouldve posted my comment here due to relevance, ive had a bad experience with them too, i faced them as nemesis when they were streaming and the whole time they were just calling me braindead for playing the killer, and were whining constantly
@@madithevampirequeen9316to be fair, that’s the majority of the player base, “WAA WAA YOU’RE NOT PLAYING THE GAME THE WAY I WANT YOU TO AND USING SOMETHING I DON’T LIKE WAAAA!!!” Just such a lame community.
@@julcanda actually no, he ban evaded and conveniently keep that out from his OG post and had to bring it up when people realized things weren’t making sense, So #KeepThatWeirdoLockedUp
@@madithevampirequeen9316 ok but did he also do that in game chat or was he saying that exclusively in his stream? There's a big difference to some1 directly insulting you IN the game and someone who's talking shit "privately".
Like sure, he was an asshole for talking shit about you in his stream, but you made the choice to listen in the first place and that should not be bannable, only in-game behavior should be.
I can't believe the killer got a life sentence and the survivors who committed the crime are set free. We truly are in starmers dbd.
Better Call Scott
As if the killer didn't commit a crime by holding the Ada in a corner.
@@chemicalfx_v2that's the point BOTH should have received some form of negative reinforcement. They should BOTH have gotten a temporary ban. Neither should have gotten a permanent ban
@@chemicalfx_v2they didn't call the killer innocent, they said that the survivors weren't innocent either. So having just one side punished (especially that severely) doesn't make sense
Maybe something else at play we don't kno about 😮
Seen content creators in the past get ban for using hacks, then make a video tryna prove their innocence.
It's extremely hard to believe he was ban for that. Also, Behavior isn't going to tell you why you was ban. For all we know, this video could be a "pity me, I'm innocence" video.
It's very difficult to believe he was ban for that. Seriously hope not!
The issue is that DBD has mechanics that allow your opponent to remove your agency as a player, on both sides. This is foolish game design and instead of eliminating the issue, BHVR places the blame on the players and turns the player base against each other.
The game allows people to act out of ego, spite, and malice, instead of out of a desire to complete the game. The game then gives you no ability to react or respond to these actions, and you are penalized by every avenue of avoidance (DC penalty, losing BP when disconnecting, banning for retaliation, etc.).
TRUE, situations like that should NOT be possible in the first place. It is stupid that there is no mechanics to prevent it. You said it well , the game (or developers) just assume players will be reasonable enough to not stand afk on hatch or decide to hide until killer gives up.
The whole game objectives are fundamentally flawed (hooking vs killing, playing immersed vs doing gens), and even though they have been slowly fixing the most insane shit over the years it's still far from being done.
Mori at 5 gens, bully/sabo squads, 10h hatch standoffs, old keys, forever freddy/chess merchant, tombstone myers etc. there's been just so many retarded strats in this game
@@Archimedes.5000 I agree. Many many dumb things...
I really do miss the old keys, though. It was broken as hell, but multiple person hatch escapes were so exhilarating. Some of my best memories from the game are coordinating a desperate escape through the hatch with a teammate against a killer that was dominating us.
You can only remove the player's agency to progress the game on one side not both
I think the entire concept of static objectives like hooks and generators is flawed from the very core. It encourages territorial and minimum interaction gameplay like camping, tunnelling, or generator rushing. All strategies where players mostly stand still and/or interact with the adversary as little as possible and usually limit the action to only small parts of the map. I wish they would make the primary objective more dynamic and encourage exploring the map more.
It's a morally gray scenerio, giving a PERMANENT BAN for this considering that player NEVER had an offense in their 4K hours playing the game is AN INSANE OVERKILL and not at all deserved. This actually made me lose all faith in BHVR
Edit: NVM they deserved it lmao
Wait until you hear about the manual permanent bans handed out to random content creators because a hacker who streams their cheats copied their stream overlays. Some allegedly never received an unban (bhvr outright refused)-if someone has an update on those niche cases PLEASE correct me
Someone made a great point earlier. No gaming company tells you why you was ban. What we see in this video is what he thinks he was ban for. For all we kno, this video could be a "pity me I did nothing" type deal.
The dude could've been using hacks or something. We will never truly kno. If the Creator was telling the truth, and he truly thinks he was ban for that body block. Feel sorry for dude.
@SweetLeavesXbox1 BHVR tells why you're banned. Both in game (depending on platform) and in support email.
Lol ok
@@mercifuldeath Most streamer I watched that got ban, stated "They won't even tell me why I was ban". Seen this multiple times so I don't really take your word over what I seen.
Its not holding the game hostage if there are other survivors doing gens. Holding a game hostage, by definition, requires a state where the game cannot progress and end through normal game play.
The only stipulation would be if the David refused to do anything, then the Ada would in fact have no power to progress the game. But he did, so...
@@ScottJund In that case it would be David holding the game hostage not the killer.
I don't agree with that definition. If a survivor playing the game had ended up body blocked, even if other survivors can trigger EGC, that's still denying general gameplay. I would say *if* EGC has already started, it becomes a reasonable tactical end to the game (and killers frequently fail this attempt eg blocking at the exit gate when the timer is close). But before then, the tactic is too long-term blocking of gameplay to be called "tactical" unless you're going by ultra-competitive tunneling-minded rulesets.
The devs have stated that hiding and refusing to do gens for an extended period of time does come under holding the game hostage and is reportable.
If i remember correctly, BHVR stated you can still be banned as killer if you hold someone on a corner, even if other survivors are still alive, for example if you find a claudette at the start of the trial and holds her hostage in a corner the entire game, thats bannable even if their teamates are doing gens and "progressing the game" @@ScottJund
a perma ban for holding a single game hostage? that seems crazy
I'm almost positive the tweet battle where Carol had his followers spam #freecarol on every BHVR twitter post probably made the two week ban into a permaban. Carol could have taken the two week ban and moved on. Carol may be the sacrificial goat to show other streamers to not marshal their followers to spam BHVR over suspensions.
@@ganthcso you can get banned for out of game offence? lol, lmao even
Sounds to crazy to me -_-
@@Archimedes.5000 if you move someone out your house because they broke the rules and you banned em for 2 weeks and they come with a riot outside your house because they are mad, you aint gonna want that riot to ever come in your house a long with the person who started it right.. pretty valid
@@bsn6e4 That doensn't change the fact that it still sets a terrible precedent. How would you feel like if the Devs permabanned you because you said some opinion unrelated to the game on outside media and they didn't agree and saw fit to ban you just for that? Regarless of what is said, the result is the same; Banned for saying things in a media outside the game.
A small ban for it? Sure as long as the survivors get it too.
But a perma ban? Just for ruining the game for one person in one match after being held hostage? That's just stupid.
Turns out they have been banned before but even so Scott's point of Carol never really holding anyone hostage rings true. I especially want to know what happened to the other survivors who spent all that time doing nothing and whether they received a ban or not.
And Carol's further point of general inconsistencies with who, why and for how long Bhvr decides to ban people is also true. There have been well known hackers who have existed in the game, some in the community, for years now. There are transphobes, racists, homophobes, etc that run rampant in their servers with little backlash from Bhvr. Some of them are streamers who broadcast their bigotry for people to see. It makes me feel like they are potentially making an example out of Carol. To prove that they aren't going to allow well known figures in the community to break their rules.
The fact that BHVR can rip away your account, that you could have years of paid cosmetics and DLCs on, for something so minor is unbelievably crazy.
We don't know if they were banned before, that user doesn't have a good reputation. There isn't even a ban reason as to why they were banned.
@XiaoLing-pu9st What you said is very true. No gaming company wants to tell you why you was ban. The last thing they'll do is tell you which hack got someone ban. They want you to second guess what got you ban. So that person can't find ways around it. Sounds crappy but it's actually the best way to go about it while protecting other players.
@@XiaoLing-pu9st Doesn't matter, changing a 2 week ban to a permanent ban for no other additional offense is lunacy.
@@SweetLeavesXbox1 When a case becomes a public controversy it is best to come out and say your reasoning. Otherwise your playerbase will lose trust in you. You'll find plenty of evidence of other companies doing this, when a case becomes a significant controversy they will come out and speak about it. Staying silent will only make your players hate you.
One thing: remorse in court does in fact go a very long way determining minimum vs maximum sentence. I’m not saying that anything is deserved or not, just that if someone is genuinely remorseful of their action they usually get a lighter sentence.
That person is annoying af couldn’t care less about them getting banned
someone being annoying shouldn't weigh in on how they are treated when it comes to punishments
@@godlyvex5543 This person is a toxic a hole idgaf what happens to them
@@godlyvex5543 They literally lied to everyone about being banned before to gain sympathy from others. Like I said I couldn’t care less about them or their account.
@@Titus.The_Crucifier What exactly counts as deserving? Hopefully not "being annoying"
@@godlyvex5543 Are you being obtuse of purpose? They lied to everyone about their previous bans and were caught save injecting on PC after getting banned on PlayStation which is against TOS. Also on top of that Carol is known for being very rude and despicable to people online. The perma ban is deserved 100%
Better Call Scott!
so did u get shat up or nah
Pyrax do you think you’re next ?
@@speetermaan I'm getting so "sh1t up" I am quivering in my boots as we speak
Please sit patiently in the waiting room sir its not your turn.
Omg a wild Pyrax
showing remorse or not typically does weigh in on sentencing
After some more thinking, I think a better system for AFK detection would be to have a hidden timer that counts down when you are doing nothing, and counts back up while you do conspicuous actions. If the timer hits 0 you will get crows and noise notifs and they won't go away until you personally complete an objective. For example 10 minute timer, put every second on a gen, or healing, or exit gate opening increases your time by 5 seconds per second spent on the action. So if you spent 1 minute finding a gen, your down to 9 minutes, but if you work on it for 12 seconds you are back up to 10 minutes. Could add a bonus to your time for completing an objective too or finishing a heal, or unhooking. Just test a bit and tweak.
10 minutes is a LONG time in DBD, anyone wasting that much time is being a piece of poop. Meanwhile just make a killer who doesn't cause a hit for 10 minutes lose collision.
Now a ban isn't needed the game is changed to make hiding for a LONG time not possible, and killers can't body block you forever.
That's a pretty sound idea, and would go a long way towards combatting this.
It may have issues with things like 3-gen Skull Merchant, where you may literally be unable to progress the game as survivor despite your best efforts.
@@irregularassassin63803 gen merchant doesn't work nearly that well anymore.
If you want implement something like that you will also have to do something about slugging , specially the killers that want that sweaty 4k.
A truly brainless idea if you think about it for more than a second.
The problem with this idea is that it requires competent tuning to implement properly. But as a company incapable of understanding statistics, this requirement is beyond them.
I've only reported one person for bodyblocking. A skullmerchant held my friend in a spot for 50 minutes until the server closed. Game was completely normal, he just got stuck mid chase as the last person and she decided to sit and wait. He wasn't hiding, just got found by BBQ after the last death.
average skull merchant player
That kinda shit does wonders to what little rep skull merchant players have left...
Sigh.
@@dumblenutz5561 Skull Merchant players have rep left?
@@finnjay6149 I'm scrambling to hold on to what little remains, if at all.
I am fully convinced we have a case, but i'm afraid a large chunk of the community would sooner actually die in real life than admit or say anything positive about skull merchant regardless of how much of a point one has, so it's rather hopeless.
Well, won't give up still.
@@dumblenutz5561 seriously though, I played my second match as Skull Merchant trying to get her Adept, and the match was pretty decent. There was only 1 gen left to do, not even in a 3 gen "chess merchant" situation, as the gens were spread around, 1 dead, the rest hooked at least once. I enter a chase with someone but they give up and stop running, ruining the match for the rest of their team. Then after I inevitably won, the only lobby message I get is "wow boring killer" from the guy that gave up.
I wasn't even putting drones on gens by the way. I was using them in chase and putting them in tight spots around the map such as the main building and jungle gyms (it was Nurse's map). DbD players feel so entitled to having everything go their way it's pathetic.
"Hatsune Mike"
5:33 Hatsune Miku :)
@@lewis9391 No.
Nothing drives "I dont really care" home quite like 13 essay long tweets on the subject matter
me when I talk about an event that happens to me and try to give solutions to the issue
@@samk8905 Then stop implying you dont give a rats ass. Makes you seem neutral to your current situation (being banned) and therefore nobody would think to bother un banning. Buddies hitting behavior with the "im not mad.. I just think its funny that" Theres a reason his tweets are deleted lol ^_^ buddy played a stupid game and won the ultimate prize
People have some kind of allergy to implying they care about anything at all that they aren't socially demanded to care about. Probably because the moment you say you're serious or passionate about something everyone mocks you with the usual. "Nerd", "it's not that serious", "chill bro", "i aint reading all that".
When you consider this, it's no wonder everyone desperately tries to say they don't care even if they clearly do. You are socially pressured to be apathetic because god forbid those gutless fools see someone with more spirit than them, no no, everyone has to be pathetic like them.
This is all a sad display from both sides of the described problem, honestly.
Yes, i've experienced it a lot. You could surely tell from how much i "cared" about it and wrote a text that's more than 2 sentences long... A book on it's own right by modern barely-literate standards. Ugh.
@@Prodig3yXunleashedfound the toxic survivor main
@@andreyu5640 You will have found nothing said to be toxic my guy. No idea what this generations deal is with calling absolutely everything in every situation toxic because you may not agree. Get educated on the matter.
ELECTRIC CHAIR
This guy didn’t just do it as a one time thing, he is notorious for holding people hostage in his games so it was most likely a build up of multiple offences before they decided to reach the decision they have.
this is a blatant lie bc i called u out for being homophobic btw
He has lit. never been banned before. He streams almost all of his games, so if that were the case he would've had past bans and would've been permabanned sooner
@@samk8905 You have no idea if they haven't been banned before.
@@XiaoLing-pu9st this person is my best friend lol this account has never had a temp ban or warning or whatever
@@XiaoLing-pu9st Didn't they just state they weren't, though?
Moderators on forums have stated that *blocking someone so that they cannot do anything to progress the game is against game rules - if they are not in dying state (bleedout), EGC has not started (countdown timer for end of game), on a hook (again hook timer will end) - there is nothing they can do to progress that game, so the player who is preventing them taking part in the game is at fault here.'* Holding the game hostage doesn't mean the overall match is in hostage, it is holding the game hostage by disallowing survivor(s) from progressing the match.
Survivors also broke the rule. However, he was maliciously doing it blatantly by recording himself, we have no idea if the other players are new or are waiting for hatch. I have been held hostage many times as killer for around 10-15 minutes, I have found the players every time and I just kill them. We do not know if this man is lying about this being his first ban as they do not have a good reputation. We have no idea if the other players were banned as well. A moderator must have been watching his stream for it to be a ban that fast. If you were really upset about being held hostage, you would have instantly downed the survivor after being found, yet you go AFK to do something else, so why not AFK when you realise they weren't progressing? Both are in the wrong, but blatant malicious intent from the streamer was here.
"If you were really upset about being held hostage, you would have instantly downed the survivor after being found"
Says who? I'm not gonna say it's necessarily okay to retaliate, but how can you say "if this really annoyed you, you would have actually not retaliated" and not see the obvious absurdity
The person was mad, they got even. You can argue whether or not that's okay but you can't argue it didn't make sense
Waiting for hatch should just be a ban then too. It's toxic to both sides and just as bad as what he did.
Honestly, not sure if this is a hot take or something, but I'd say everyone should be banned. This is super boring on all sides and there's griefing from both sides, and everyone's being super immature and petty about it
How is it grieffing by killer, if second surv is free to end the match by doing gens?
Desire to punish psychopaths and have vengeance by blocking untill egc death or bleed out is absolutely normal and mature thing. I bleed out survivors for much lesser things than holding me hostage
@@MrPendalv That's not exactly something to be proud of. Forcing someone to not be able to play the game is not a mature thing to do, as a survivor or killer.
I honestly don't know if survivors should be banned, like if trying to get hatch is bannable that's silly, they should just give killer a base kit aura reading for 3 sec every 30 sec if like 3-5min pass and you haven't been in a chase or something like that. Boom solved hiding
@@irregularassassin6380 your view on justice is so twisted :)
First, its not a complete block pf able to play the game, match can be ended by second surv. And if it deserved and holding hostage was started by survivors, then its just justified punishment
@@MrPendalv"psychopaths" "vengeance" brother it is a videogame and u are not the batman of dbd learn to relax
Heres how i see this if they banned the killer they should of banned the survivors too they did the same thing
It's BHVR. Survivors get to do whatever they want.
@@bigidiot5881 yep
@@bigidiot5881 This situation is wild but lets not turn this into a dumbass Us VS Them situation. BHVR have a history of favouring both sides.
@@bigidiot5881 Hiding isn't denying the killer to play the game. You could argue this game is about hide and seek, therefore hiding can by definition not be "holding the game hostage".
Carol could have just downed the Ada and hooked them, proxy camp if they wanted the match to be over. The survivors tho is speculation whether they intent was to hold the killer hostage or not.
Carol putting a tweet of them trapping the Ada by the hook probably didn't help their case too.
As a member of the jury, I am inclined to believe that the game was NOT indeed held hostage, as the defense has pointed out that there was a second survivor who could progress the game
BHVR has clarified multiple times that blocking a Survivor, even if others are still alive, is a bannable offense. So guilty as charged as the law BHVR set down was indeed broken.
Now it'd be interesting to know why it was a permaban that was chosen as punishment. Maybe support harrassment? Past cheating? we don't know. But as a response to one bodyblock it's a bit overkill. 2 Weeks would suffice for that to send the message.
But even better would be if Survivors lost collision when they gain 3 crows so this no longer is an issue
...
From 2018 on the dbd forums commented by Peanits. Title is "what is classed as bannable bodyblocking":
What you described is not bannable. It actually wouldn't work either since hitting them allows them to pass through you briefly.
Bodyblocking is bannable when it is used to hold the game hostage or grief, such as blocking a survivor in a corner and sitting there for a long period of time just so they can't play. Or sandbagging, where you intentionally jump in from of someone and block their path so the killer hits them.
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also the ban reason stated for the 2 week was griefing, intentional gameplay abuse NOT holding the game hostage.
So holding one survivor in the match for 10 minutes is perma bannable but holding 4 survivors hostage for an hour with skull merchant wasn’t?
I say give him a life sentence, not for the body blocking but for playing DBD in the first place
Behavior definitely saw those tweets about horrible game design and perma’d him 😂
The perma ban was because he injected addons into his account by bypassing easy anticheat. So he wasn't perma banned for holding the game hostage he was banned for modifying the game. Turned out he lied about being banned b4. Not surprised he was an asshole on twitter at every opportunity
its not an "indefinite" hostage but it should absolutely be bannable, i understand it being in retaliation but we shouldnt set a precedent for "bodyblocking a survivor for the entire match is okay because the game will end eventually", getting slugged out for 4 minutes already sucks enough, lets not give killers another tool to ruin peoples games with
I think it was okay in this case because the survivors did it to him first. Nobody was being punished or having their agency taken away except the person who was taking away someone else's agency. The person who started it is at fault.
BHVR is the bad guy in this situation for the terrible design decisions that allow this to happen in the first place
He hopped on Twitter and said “worth it I don’t care” would a behavior employee not read that and be like ok this person could very likely end up being a repeat offender and they obviously don’t have any remorse so why not just perma ban to get ahead of this issue? Not to mention he also said in the video that he WANTED to hold the ada hostage for the full hour even though that isn’t what ended up happening. Gloating about it was like actually the dumbest thing he could’ve done.
crazy how it's literally impossible to reply to your comment cause youtube just auto deletes anything that sounds remotely negative. I'm trying to say that they were in the right.
It doesn't matter if server times out or not, you simply can't hold survivor in a corner and not end up hitting them, because killer is a proactive role.
Reminds me one time, my lobby saw that Haddie was stuck in the middle of a rock on the Cinema map... and in my head I was like "dang if I don't trigger egc she could be here for a while..."
So I opened the gate and then died with her 😅
Bittersweet revenge.
Unfortunately, many online game report systems have a flaw like this. For Apex, it's chat toxicity vs open-mic toxicity without recordings. Someone can openly say every curse word in every language and if you don't record it but type negativity back, you are at fault and can be banned permanently... which is what happened to me.
#FreeDOWSEY 11:37
Crossover comment moment.
I once got held for 15 mins as the last survivor standing with hatch available. I tried to do a sneaky trick on RPD near 2nd floor bathroom, fake the hole and run into a stall and hope the killer drops down the hole. The fake didn’t work and I was held hostage for 15 minutes. I reported this as hostage takeover, and BHVR responding by saying sorry you had a bad experience, nothing we can do… if this guy gets banned, then why didn’t the plague in my game. Only thing I can think of is content creators are being held to a higher standard… simply because BHVR can find the footage I guess.
Behaviour definitely needs to free carol if genuinely he hasn’t also done anything bad prior, one match meaning you can’t play the game you spend 4k hours on, is just absolutely STUPID
Banned previously for hacking. Perma is warranted.
Actually, if you do announce a murder, it does tend to increase your sentence as it shows a lack of remorse for the crime.
oh this guy, i honestly cant stand him, went against him as nemesis once when he was streaming and the whole time he was just whining and making fun of me because "nemesis is so braindead to play" despite literally being a spirit main which is arguably worse 😭
I played against him like 2 weeks ago, got a 4 man escape and was surprised he was a p100 spirit tbh, he played very strangely
There's also a possibility that after constantly getting twitter farmed, Bhvr looked at previous reports and found Carol to have done/said some heinous shit.
BHVR baning players because the players are using something that they implemented and refuse to fix is just bad game design, not guilty.
By that logic, exploits aren't bannable because they implemented flawed code and haven't fixed it.
@@araccoonstolemyradiatorIt should be that way without exception
@@parkerluciani7048 what? That's crazy. You're so desperate for any advantage you're justifying glitching the game. Maybe chill and play the game according to the rules?
@@araccoonstolemyradiator No, they should fix the fucking game. Dude is right. Cope.
@@araccoonstolemyradiator ? It's the developpers role to change what is wrong with the game, not to tje community to play ignorining that. If after many years this can of things still exist, it's a game feature, not a bug. Why are so so concilient witht the devs ? It's litteraly their job
tl;dw : Strimmer was permabanned sometime in the past, ban evaded, got a 2-week ban for griefing, which brought BHVR's attention to his case, upgrading the ban to a perma once they found out he was ban evading a prior perma.
Survivors that dont repair gens and dont get into chase, should just have their aura revealed, period. Killers who sit there bodyblocking you should have their character become intangible and lose collision, too many games recently consist of survivors halting the entire game to hide and try and get hatch
Hey Judge, just chiming in with some info about irl court
Publicly posting about crimes does sometimes influence rulings since a lot of rulings will consider if the perpetrator is remorseful, likelihood of reoffending once released, etc. Public statements can help to inform these determinations depending on the nature of the statements.
There's way too much missing context. I can't take a definitive stance. Either Carol is lying and being very manipulative, or BHVR is being spiteful.
I once held a David "hostage" for the 4K to get my Oni adept achievement because he was avoiding being hooked by using Boil Over on Coal Tower fire escape (2F). So I immediately put him down, got off the fire escape and found hatch (it wasn't far away), went back to David and let him wiggle off, and he ran back into the corner to avoid being hooked, so I just held him in the corner of the fire escape until EGC took him.
I obviously haven't been banned for this, but I couldn't be, right? I took steps to end the game sooner while still getting the best result for myself and the David was trying to stall the game further by remaining on the fire escape.
that person is annoying as hell lmao rip bozo
legit the one and only person on my mute list
ez perma ban 🤣😂🤣😂
@@xSinphony ur homophobic babe i dont wanna hear it
who is that streamer? What did they do
lmao i was laughing when i saw the photos,hope he doesn't get unbanned, probably a liar and was banned before knowing how they are
The murder comparison kinda makes sense, but there's a massive difference in sentencing if a defendant says "I regret it," vs. "I dont regret it at all."
On a less extreme: mom and dad grounds you and takes your cell phone for a week. If you yell out the window "Worth it!" to your friends waiting outside in earshot of your parents, expect even more punitive measures.
That's exactly what happened with Carol, and he tried to farm as much X clout as possible from the situatuon. Literally signaling to BHVR he doesn't care about their rules, and no one else should. He'd take the ban and get right back to it by Castlevania DLC.
Indefinite ban is certainly a choice, but he should respect BHVR's decision (doesnt matter if he didnt have priors).
It's part of being an adult. He can work on other aspects of his life in the mean time.
Why doesn't Behavior design the game to prevent these issues? It's absurd that with all their money and success, they can't find a solution. What if, after 60 seconds of standing still, the player's body collider disables just like it does when they get hit? You can't ban a player for using the tools provided, toxic or not-it's on the dev team to fix these issues so players can't abuse them. From the killer's POV, if they move, there's a high chance a healthy survivor would escape once the gate opens, especially with the speed boost they get when hit. The survivor would need to make a major mistake for the killer to actually win, so tactically, this is the best option, toxic or not. It's the dev team's fault that this happens, not the player's.
They do have a 3-strike rule, so maybe there were other strikes that we don't know about.
This is why I don’t argue with survivors, they can hold a game hostage when they know they won’t win. The moment you slug you’re every word in the dictionary.
I find it funny that the survivors willfully refused to do anything for 10 minutes, so the Killer decided to force them into doing nothing. Ironic.
*Forced one of them. There was still a perfectly fine survivor able to do gens
i have this person blocked on X so i don't have to remember they exist. and here we are LOL
@@intheouts like i said, rip bozo lmao
I've played against them months ago, I remember them for their narcissistic voice
once we get down to two people it becomes a hide and seek game between the two survivors.
A harsh perma ban but then I saw who got it and laughed.
Im not familiar with the content creator in question. Are they notoriously toxic?
He had a previous account which was permabanned for save editing items into his inventory. After they gave him his two week griefing ban they realized he was the same person as the previously banned account so they permabanned his new one. Still not a reason to perma ban someone for not recomitting an offense of TOS or whatever bhvr shoves down our throats as backup
So the person that ACTUALLY held the game hostage gets away without punishment and the person that DIDNT hold the game hostage gets permabanned. Fuck BVHR.
Classic surv privilege
Amen to that.
Its a normal solo strat to wait for the other survi to die
@@randomaether 100%
@@randomaetherThere have been countless times when I’m playing a match as survivor and everyone is doing their part for most of the game. But then once it goes down to two survivors remaining, often times one of them stops whatever they’re doing and simply hides. Waiting for the other survivor to get eliminated
My eyes glossed over the video and I thought it was an actual courtroom for a moment.
There's no gray area and it's surreptitious to pass it off as such. Holding the game hostage is just the title of the offense, not its whole definition with all nuances. BHVR said many times the exact behavior in that video falls under this infraction. There's no wiggle room, no grey area unless we make up one. For the perma ban it was either a mistake that should be appealed, or someone is lying about the first offense.
you're right about everything. that said, surreptitious means "done in secret" or "secretive," and doesn't fit this context.
@@UltraSyre You're right. English is too hard, sometimes.
Your honour, the killer in question here IS holding the game hostage for the Ada. While this isn't holding the whole survivor team hostage, he is still removing all agency from a player and locking them out of the game.
Midwich is also a terrible map to find generators, making the survivor case harder to prove.
And yes, bHVR and people involved in bans do have clear biases and grudges against people, as I have experienced on the forums with one individual being allowed on for way too long, and seeing others banned at the drop of a hat.
That being said, I believe that the initial ban is justified and anything after that was possibly a result of fanning the flames.
Your honor, please dont kill my entire family.
Honestly ban all 3 then. Carol posted a video of bragging about doing it. Also they clearly stated in comments that "They DNGAF about being banned for 2 weeks" well guess what? You got perna banned. This is not their first instance doing this. Also there is no defending Carol's behavior because we do not know if the David was in the same VC as them. So Carol is keeping the game hostage for Ada. They handed the smoking gun to the cops and are mad they were banned. Carol knew what they were doing posting the video and getting peoples attention. They are actively happy about their little fanbase attacking Behavior which is not needed. Behavior took action and they were upset at the 2 week and than proceeded to keep poking the bear.
UPDATE: There it is. The other piece of the puzzle. They were lying the whole time and really injected items into the game. So I guess I was right about them being scummy.
This is way I never go to jury duty
Typical scenario of being able to dish it out but not being able to take your own medicine
"slugging people for the 4k is never a bannable offense" - Slugging people for any reason is never a bannable offense. Slugging them because you want to BM and humptech them is not a bannable offense. BHVR doesn't care because there's a built-in timer that guarantees slugging can only last so long. That timer is how long BHVR is okay with you doing this.
Bodyblocking a survivor has no set timer. In this video, Ada had no control over how long it took David to finish the gens, or if he would finish at all. The game was being held hostage by the killer for an indefinite period of time, which is why the killer was banned. You can get away with doing this for a couple minutes at most (waiting for cooldowns, waiting for last gen to pop, waiting for EGC to end, etc). You can't do it for 5+ minutes though.
Should the survivors also be banned for not working on gens? Maybe if they kept it up. I don't think any survivors are getting banned for having 2 gens left at 14 minutes. This killer was a little too impatient, looking for survivors is part of the game and hiding from the killer is part of the game. If survivors were required to touch a gen at least once every 5 minutes, most of the community would be banned retroactively. Some challenges (like "cleanse 5 totems" or "find the glyphs") really incentivize you to focus on objectives other than gens.
I'm a killer main so I understand the occasional frustration of not being able to find the last survivors, but even so, I say the killer is guilty here. The match didn't last nearly long enough to fault the survivors. Even if the killer had bled out Ada, the match would have been less than 20 minutes long.
Addendum: Although the killer was guilty, giving the killer a permanent ban is insanity, especially when they have 4k hours and it's their first offense. Bodyblocking a survivor for 10 minutes to secure a kill should not be a PERMANENT ban. The punishment does not fit the crime.
Actually, the devs stated that "progressing the game in any way" and that counts totems, chests wtv.
@@mayebeline1149The guy got permabanned previously for hacking.
Crazy how BHVR finally cares about "holding the game hostage" while killers have been "4k slugging until bleed out" since the dawn of dbd. There's no significant difference between 4 minutes and 15 minutes in this scenario.
vile scott scrolls away from the tweet that says hatsune miku at 6:17, why would he do this, is he comedically evil?
The fact you can get held hostage at all in a situation where the EGC hasn't started it dumb. Why Behaviour can't just add a piece of code that removes collision for survivors to killers after they get three crows circling their head or something like that is obviously beyond my understanding.
the initial 2 days ban was ok but a perma ban with no previous offense is kinda ridiculous
Previously permabanned for hacking. Banned again for ban evasion presumably.
at the same time the killer had the same power as the david to just hit her and end the bodyblocking
the two week ban might be because they want to make an example out of them
Trolling Ava hiding all game actual caused the killer to be perma banned. This is the most successful troll in dbd history holy shit
It's certainly possible to counter survivors attempting to spend large amounts of time in the game doing nothing. The game is capable of seeing if a player is doing all sorts of various things, as evidenced by the challenges in the game. I think that after 5 minutes, the player should start getting an AFK crow. Similar to being AFK but taking longer to getting them. Say, start with 1 at 5 minutes and get 1 every minute, until your location is constantly given to the killer every 5 seconds at 3 crows. The crows would also not be visible to the killer unless you had three of them as it's meant to tell you to make progress, not make it easier to be found.
In response, you can avoid getting crows or begin dispersing crows by doing things that put you at risk or otherwise progressing the game.
A Crow would disappear once every ten seconds if:
You work on a generator.
You attempt to open a chest (At least 1 crow disperses if you open it, even if you only did it for one second).
You attempt to restore a healing state (Again, at least 1 crow is gone if successful)
Cleanse a totem (only if it's fully cleansed)
Opening the Exit Gate.
Crows would instantly disperse if:
You are the last survivor.
The killer successfully lands an attack on you.
The killer starts a chase after you.
You successfully blind the killer with an item.
You successfully stun the killer with a pallet.
You rescue a survivor from a hook.
The End Game Collapse begins for any reason.
Even if you otherwise do nothing for 5 minutes, you will not gain a crow if:
You are the last survivor standing (it's a race to the hatch now, the only way the game can be held hostage is if both people do it and stealth is very important for the survivor).
The End Game Collapse is active.
I mean just make it so survivors auras are revealed for 3 sec every 30 sec if 5min pass and no chase. (Except if only 1 survivor) No need for all this complex shit.
@@ethan6627 I don't agree with that. It's possible to go through most, even the entire game, without being seen let alone chased by the killer and still be contributing to winning the game. Very unlikely, but still possible.
For example, most of the games where I barely interact with the killer is when I'm running a healing build and I hide if I hear the terror radius at all. This means I can rescue and heal those that go down and get the most out of my perks. But with this, those games would cause me to end up being revealed about halfway through a game consistently, even though I'm doing things that are helping to progress it.
@Technature7567 I mean in general if no survivor is chased for 5min if in 5min a killer can't find a survivor then they can be shown survivor locations for 3 sec every 30 sec I think just to help them get into a chase, so unless your whole team can't be found for 5min you won't get revealed
@@ethan6627 If literally no one can be found then I can understand that.
I’ve been playing dbd for about 450 hours now and I just had this happen to me for the first time today.
It was so frustrating… I was on the Haddonfield map, and I was repairing a generator on the second floor of one of the houses; I was in a small room with one entrance and Ghostface stood in the doorway body blocking the entrance to my little room for the whole match. Everyone else was able to repair the gens and escape. I genuinely don’t understand how the killer could’ve gotten any enjoyment out of doing this.
My Nvidia overlay recorder wasn’t working otherwise I would’ve opened a ticket and sent the footage to Behavior.
Nah a ban is crazy.
They held Ada's game hostage. Ada couldn't do anything to progress the game.
It happened with me too. I was playing Demo, the survivors brought me to Midwich and had dark outfits and a full stealth build. It was one of the worst and most boring match I've ever played.
please more of this Scott, this is hilarious
Why does midwich make survivors hide so much???
Because people get scared of the terror radius, and you basically always have one on that map for the most part.
Well, that's actually how the main game was intended to be hide and seek
Perma ban is insane
The idea Carol suggested where crows make your collision go away doesn’t sound bad.
Its actually insane that someone can get banned for this. Would holding a single person in a corner when 3 others are alive also be considered holding them hostage? Bhvr's logic is so dumb.
Of course it's bannable.
It's holding the game hostage for that specific person as they can do nothing to actually play the video game. Blocking someone for a little while is fine; either to mess with them or use a killer power like Plague, Bubba, etc but for an extended period as Carol did? Even with three left it'd still be a ban.
@@bobcat946732 no, because they will get out eventually. Holding the game hostage has to stop the game progression completely, which bodyblocking one person does not do when there's multiple other people who can progress the game.
@@araccoonstolemyradiator That it literally not true. They have gone on record multiple times saying blocking a single person is bannable because it's holding that specific person hostage.
Whether the game can continue doesn't matter. The only exception being EGC where you can body block someone till time run out.
@@bobcat946732 that's still crazy then, since their word goes against their written rules. Imo that shouldn't be bannable since the game would end if the killer did nothing but waste a single survivor's time for a few minutes. Thanks for giving me their official opinion though.
I love that BHVR has managed to figure out spirit/onryo being able to phase through players but cant figure out letting survivors phase through killers if neither of them have moved more than 5m in 15-20 seconds. Sure would be nice
The survivors are at 2 gens with 2 survivors left, they either do gens and die, or don't do gens and die, regardless at this point it's Ada and David fighting for a chance at hatch. Survivors aren't responsible for the killer not being able to find them, in fact they essentially doing what they're supposed to be doing here, trying to survive as long as possible. The survivors can't progress the game at this point because the game is at a stalemate, the killer found a Survivor and refuses to act, which is in fact holding the game hostage.
The survivors can do nothing to win in this scenario unless the killer allows it, and so they don't try, which is a normal response because had they tried one Survivor would likely be slugged until death which is also holding the game hostage.
The job of survivors is to survive, the job of killer is to kill survivors, the survivors tried to survive here, the killer refused to kill. In conclusion this is the killers fault, and the proper ban was issued, end of conversation.
I asked this a while ago in the steam community hub. And the answer was that this is a bannable offence because of the grief, not holding the game hostage.
you need a gavel, Scott
"we have seen precedent before back in 2020whatever..."
starting to question the validity of this courtroom Monka
Hatsune Mike
death
This would be preventable if there was an in game loss condition for not advancing the generators for 15 minutes.
By their own definition of hostage taking, what Carol did isn't it. The game could end, and a slap on the wrist ban wouldve been enough punishment, if bhvr truly did take it personally when theyre a massive fucking company and extend it? That's truly fucking pathetic.
Especially when they could and SHOULD have a fix for this shit by now, its been said a million times but make survivors lose collision when a certain amount of afk crows are acquired, and teveal survivors not progressing the game in anyway, or if theyre too fucking lazy for even that, just force EGC after a certain amount of time when theres only two survivors left.
By their own definition this is hostage taking though? They've said multiple times that body blocking a survivor where they can't move is bannable as it's holding that specific survivor hostage.
You can hold the game hostage and you can hold specific survivors hostage. Both are bannable and Carol deserved a ban. Now whether the two weeks was justified is impossible to say. We have no idea if they're lying and there is more going on.
Now going from the comments and some of their tweets, they don't seem like the best of people so I'm leaning on they've either been banned before or there is more going on. It's impossible to say for sure though.
Apparently it's more time efficient to manually police each individual player's behavior than to just code the behavior to become impossible. It's like manually moving your cows back onto the farm one by one every single day rather than building a fence
From 2018 on the dbd forums commented by Peanits. Title is "what is classed as bannable bodyblocking":
What you described is not bannable. It actually wouldn't work either since hitting them allows them to pass through you briefly.
Bodyblocking is bannable when it is used to hold the game hostage or grief, such as blocking a survivor in a corner and sitting there for a long period of time just so they can't play. Or sandbagging, where you intentionally jump in from of someone and block their path so the killer hits them.
1:10 this is false. I actually asked bhvr if the old pig box situation or the current situation where Myers stares at a survivor in locker wanting his achievement but the survivor knowing this stay inside the locker to deny him; both are NOT considered holding the game hostage. Holding the game hostage now is extremely rare and I can't even think of a situation currently bug or otherwise that can legit hold a game hostage since the coming of EGC. Holding the game hostage is "If the game CANNOT continue, then the game is being held hostage." This is why previously, killer standing at the basement stairs was "Holding the game hostage", Previously the basement stairs was so narrow that the killer could be on the stairs and block the 2 survivors in basement from going for a save) and not only block them but EGC didn't exist at the time. Guess what? That's a hostage situation because the game cannot literally end. The Survivors in Carol's clip DID NOT hold the game hostage in anyway, they have the benefit of the doubt of "Trying for the hatch by hoping the other dies". Carol I see, publicly admitted to grieving them on purpose seems like a shut case to me, Do I think bhvr over did it? Absolutely. Heck you are allowed to body block kill survivors as long as EGC is active because you are doing it for the intent to kill them. But Carol afk'd in the clip adding another layer of things to add to reasons to his ban. I think Carol was in the wrong here completely and the survivors did nothing wrong. However, It is bhvr's fault themselves for allowing things like this happen; you shouldn't blame survivors for trying to survive with the mechanics available.
From 2018 on the dbd forums commented by Peanits. Title is "what is classed as bannable bodyblocking":
What you described is not bannable. It actually wouldn't work either since hitting them allows them to pass through you briefly.
Bodyblocking is bannable when it is used to hold the game hostage or grief, such as blocking a survivor in a corner and sitting there for a long period of time just so they can't play. Or sandbagging, where you intentionally jump in from of someone and block their path so the killer hits them.
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From 2020 0n the dbd forums also commented by Peanits. Title is "Why are killers allowed to take the game hostage but survivors aren't":
Struggling on the hook is not taking the game hostage, first of all. It's only considered to be holding the game hostage when it's indefinite or for an extended period of time. The longest you can stay on a hook is 2 minutes (+34 seconds if you happen to have Camaraderie).
Beyond that, nobody is allowed to take the game hostage. Whether that's survivors crouching around in corners refusing to touch generators to drag on the game for half an hour or a killer blocking someone in the corner and refusing to kill them, it's reportable either way.
Can you really believe a man named Carol? LMAO
Frankly, even if the survivors are “holding the game hostage” it really is up to the killer to successfully track and locate the hiding survivors regardless if they do gens or not. It can be a boring slog for sure, but it is clear the devs encourage hiding in some ways (i.e. the recent iron will buff). I don’t mind when the last 2 survivors go full hiding mode because the game shifts away from the typical DBD to a hide-and-seek mode (you can call me crazy for that).
Now this is a totally different story if you are a streamer, at which point having survivors hide can hurt your viewership and slow down any excitement which is obviously annoying. Still, like you said, its not possible to prove maliciousness on the survivors end which Carol clearly displayed. Even if he wanted to make the claim to BHVR that he was being held hostage, it simply doesn’t work because of his actions towards the Ada. He could’ve easily killed her when he saw her and have a strong argument that his time was being wasted by the survs but nope. He threw that chance away.
I mean, if someone uses hacks on a match, you can't just also use hacks and go "Well, they did it first so it is okay." Other than that, I think the fact that Carol made a bid deal of the situation with the deleted tweets and #freecarol stuff was what pushed the 2 week ban itnto a permaban. You don't delete tweets just because, I think.
Those are two completely different situations. One is using exploits, and this was using an in game mechanic. Carol did not start #freecarol, his followers on twitter did that on their own accord. People delete tweets all the time, like if they realise it comes off in a way they didn't mean it to, or if he tweeted it while he was angry and later realised it wasn't acceptable
@@samk8905 The streamer literally has #freecarol in their name on Twitter. I think you can say they started it and my bet is there is probably some stream stuff where Carol maybe marshals his followers into action.
@@ganthc They did not start it. They put it in their bio AFTER people started using it. They have also not streamed since they've been banned.
Why can't you do that exactly?
Like what??
Also banning for out of game offence is undefendable anyway
The 2 man left hide and seek is the worst part of the game
hey scott I don't really like dbd anymore you can delete your channel thanks
thanks for giving him permission 🙏🏻