The 7.1 storyline made Koana stupider than Wuk Lamat. Our boy is supposed to be the Vow of Reason, he's supposed to the one who thinks ahead, but when he sees a fancy cow being run down by a spiky T-Rex that looks like it's straight out of Monster Hunter, what does he do? He runs in its path. Koana, my brother in Hydaelyn, it's a fucking COW!!! You're one of the leaders of an ENTIRE NATION. The most recent alliance your country forged rests on your shoulders and your people are relying on you to be level headed and guide things in a healthy direction. Why the fuck are you putting your life on the line for ONE COW?!?! If it died and you killed the dino then Hhetsaro could still use its carcass for resources! If you die because you put human level value on the life of ONE COW you've suddenly cost your entire nation a second leader in the span of months! No kitty that's a bad kitty!
@@FredericckPesetas i disagree it makes sense for the PEOPLE of that tribe to care he isnt obligated to believe their beliefs his whole point was to understand it not follow it. Him being ok dying for a fucking cow was stupid and character degradation.
I don't think the MSQ is doomed and can't recover in 8.0, but what DT did is shake my faith in the level of care being put in the MSQ, which does concern me, it feels like they let a lot of easily fixable issues get through so it feels like they don't care. Stuff like the Koana cow thing getting memed to death, how did no one think to have the genius tech guy use something to trip or slow the monster instead of body blocking like an idiot? Or if they were dead set on self sacrifice, maybe have the guy that was at the other attack 20 years ago be the one that gets charged at and he freezes because he's traumatized, Koana can't stop it with his gun so he jumps to knock him out of the path and gets rammed. Then it's not stupid. The lack of care and attention to framing and context is extremely worrying to me for the future.
@@FredericckPesetasthat's your opinion. My personal thoughts were that the Dawntrail story was trash compared to everything else. No big baddies setup or any real path forward for the story. The main writers for it were the tribe quest line writers. But normally if anyone speaks out they get attacked by toxic positivity police 😅
@FredericckPesetas Clearly you haven't been to places like Reddit or many comment sections in general. Him almost killing himself to save a fantasy cow is constantly being joked about, I've seen at least 3 pictures made joking about it as well acting like he's in love with that buffalo, and countless jokes, look at most videos and posts about 7.1, it's harder to find one where no one is clowning Koana and the cow than finding one where they are by a huge margin. You can take my word or not, regardless, it doesn't change how unbelievably stupid that entire section was.
@@FredericckPesetas No, this is not better than ARR. ARR had the benefit of being the first one. By DT they have more than enough talent, money and experience identifying what has worked for years. And there's no excuse for scenes like making the leader of the country almost kill himself to save a cow. The same cows you literally get as hunt marks that you kill right next to that settlement for sacks of nuts. The whole expansion was riddled with B.S. like that and most players found it stupid and frustrating to watch. I can run through a laundry list of scenes that are bafflingly stupid if you would like but I should not have to. There's a reason the majority of players responded negatively to DT, and it's not blind hate, it was bad and the writing continues to be bad in the patches. I'm far from the only person calling this out.
@@FredericckPesetas Bro as I said Toxic positivity. You have 100+10 percent proved my point. 😆 Played and cleared all msq started in beta of ARR after coming over from FFXI. I took a long break from saying much in the comments because of what you are doing now.
I have kinda zoned out with DawnTrail's story at the moment, but the Raid and Alliance Raid stories are quite intriguing so far to me, having this weird situation where I'm looking more forward to the raid and Alliance Raid story compared to the actual story of DawnTrail.
@@FredericckPesetas Look, Sareel Ja is far more interesting than Zoraal Ja, least he actually has a personality to him that caters well to his villain antics when he's using his electrope to see what powers he can bring from other worlds
@@FredericckPesetas It's not even that, Zoraal ja literally doesn't even have a personality until level 95, and it's literally just, Identity crisis. Sareel Ja is a manipulator who gets other people to do his work for him to get his way, and that kind of personality fits really well for a main antagonist, using his brains instead of his brawn to get his way by getting the actually strong people to do his dirty work, and being understandably salty about being backstabbed by Zoraal Ja
If anything Sareel Ja would have been a better antagonist to Wuk than Zoraal, those 2 have beef with each other right from the get go with Sareel Ja's antics going straight for Wuk, while Zoraal literally only has conflict with Wuk over wanting to create world peace through world conquest.
@@FredericckPesetas I mean, he's literally doing it in the Alliance raid with the phantom creations of his, otherwise he convinced Zoraal Ja to let Bakool live and then used Bakool and his henchmen to steal keystones from Wuk specifically.
WoW's story at its best is still worse than XIV's story at its worst. It has a level of non-story that is hard to even equal. Its excuse of a campaign is "we don't really have any idea what we wanna do, and it might not go anywhere and half of it may be retconned by patch 3, but we needed some excuse to make a claymation cinematic featuring the smirking smug main villain's feet." That's about the depth of that game's story. But that's not really the point, I would assume. Most people want a good story compared to XIV, and not a good story compared to WoW.
@@LionLostInTime once again worse is subjective. Its worse because there isn't much of a story at all compared to FFXIV, most lore and dialogue is in quest descriptions that not many read. In terms of writing it's also quite generic, especially in recent years. So while dawn trail has flaws it's still a better told story overall. But obviously if you hate it then you'd probably prefer wows because it's so skippable
Idk Id have to disagree, I think TWW msq was significantly better than DT. I cared about the characters, there were stakes, the villain is genuinely interesting and menacing and the character moments, especially in some of the side quests were meaningful and enjoyable. I think the side quest where you Anduin and Faerin play the in universe miniature war game while they discuss their culture and history is more endearing than basically anything so far in DT. Obviously this is all subjective but for me, somehow wow’s story actually has me quite a bit more invested in the world and characters currently.
Not sure if this is considered a hot take or not, but here it goes! I actually loved Dawntrail, 7.0 and 7.1’s story. Especially loved the whole Resident Evil experience in the latter xD Sure there are faults here and there, but personally I find them to be minimal to impact my experience. As someone who roleplays in the game with friends and others, I like having new lore being introduced to us so we can make our own stories!
Gacha take is very true. Dawntrail main defense is "its a new arc". Well Fate Grand Order also had new arc open with Lostbelt 1 and my god story of dawntrail cant even stand close to it.
7:13 That's the same for me with Heavens Burn Red lately. It's practically a VN but the writing was so amazing that I just went "FFXIV used to be this good..." We've got to that point now and that's something. I hope the writing can recover from this
Wuk Lamat's rapid progress from fledgling to OP pseudo-protagonist and the similarity of her path to Zero's is no coincidence and no mistake of lazy writing. EW ended with a massive upheaval. Heidi, Zodi, and Endsinger all died. The bounds on our world are removed and the aether/dynamis they commanded is freed up. Zero and Lama'ti ascended quickly because it's easier to do so. And going forward this will pave the way for new antagonists that can meaningfully challenge us.
Could be like this, you get a option of long ass side quest to least recap the Hydalyn arc, or do the classic way with extra rewards ((mounts with different colors glams etc etc. ))and add a feature to Newgame plus for older players to earn the same rewards
So we have been through a lot since older zones, and for story sake why doesn’t the old map kinda upgrade? I mean even after stormblood, war is kinda over by the end of shadowbringers and then endwalker and dawntrail happens but like we don’t really get a lot of upgrades to older city’s characters and their changes since. I think backtracking to older characters to Introduce new places and areas. then look no further then the other members of the scions ( at the end of shadowbringers when they finally disband and all go their separate ways, their are a lot of ( non main characters ) that are in the scions and if u talked to each of their npc’s, u get some dialogue of where they are thinking of going too.) I think those characters are worth revisiting and seeing their change while going to new places too. Making the past lore and new lore come together in a way that makes it an amazing story.
I just wanna update my spicy take that I don't think TWW is GREAT, it's just better than Dawntrail. I'm not as doomery as others either. They clearly stumbled here but that doesn't mean they won't get back up.
Yeah exactly, I'm about to jump into TWW tonight on stream and check it out for myself but everyone misses occasionally, and if DT is the lowest point this game has narratively speaking it'll be fine imo, they are already showing me signs of moving back in the direction I like with things like 7.1 and the potential plot threads that are still hanging (Zero and Golbez being a big one and Azem almost certainly being a focal point in the future)
TWW isn't even good in general. It's the same Dragonflight mediocrity with a different skin. People are simply okay with it because Shadowlands was worse. That's the standard created for that game.
@@FredericckPesetas I don't have to think about anything. I was more engaged going through the main campaign of TWW than I was DT. That is just a fact.
@FredericckPesetas Bro what are you talking about? I am talking purely MSQ here. The battle content for 14 has been amazing in DT. I finished the campaign in TWW a week after it came out and haven't played since, I just want to see the story. I don't like WoW's approach to end game. I've been playing both WoW and 14 since they both came out and my "bias" is definitely towards 14. You people lose your minds when anyone doesn't like the same thing you do. Come off it.
I like the 7.1 ending with Sphene, she was the most interesting character in Dawntrail. And with her return it bring alot of questions. How does she have a body, who is the imposter, how will they deal with their new found fear of death. All interseting points.
The only good part about Dawntrail, to me, is Shaaloani (aka wild west zone). Because based on all the prior scraps of information we had over the many years about Tural as a place, that is what they were setting up. Meanwhile that gets thrown out the window mostly because I have to deal with some cyberpunk dystopia that feels out of place in what is basically just fantasy North American and South America.
It would be cool to do more with Living Memory, maybe build it back up or 'turn it on' again in some way but as a place for the living and not the dead. We saw this back in ARR with Revenant's Toll, building it over time, and with Idyllshire in Heavensward. Just kinda sad you can't see their old versions anymore.
I briefly tried to enjoy the Pelu Pelu tribal questline, but… my God. No matter how you slice it, it’s still the story of helping a travel agency start-up. And… that’s it. Sorry, I just… could not care less. Stakes don’t get much lower than that, really.
It's the Pelu Pelu, what the he'll were you expecting out of that? I'm just taking the FFX reference that it is and just getting through it. I didn't expect much out of it.
lets face it here without the key members of the team there like Ishikawa or hell even Koji has left for other projects feels like the new talent is not talented enough WoW really has been catching up in quality and its even adding housing now they really need to step up their game. something i personally am hopign is that we get to keep sphene as our main interaction npc going forward and she actually explains to us why Azems key is in Solution 9 in the first place
while i absolutly agree about your opinion about the team not up to snuff.. i don't think sphene can actually explain why the key was in her possession. as far as i understood it, that key came with the lala's from the source.
Inb4 the takeaway SE takes from "These gachas have a similar situation with a better story" is tgat they should make the next "MMO" FF into a gacha instead
the best thing they can dop is to give the gameplay of recent levels at lower level if someone wants to do the MSQ they still hav e he option to skip a lot of content, that's what I did with anything unvoiced in DT. They took a huge step back with DT they need to put this writer away going forward
To be clear, I don't think FFXIV is going to stay that way. I just think currently they're in a bad spot. I've been giving my sub money to WuWa for the battlepass, but I will probably be back closer to 8.0 if I hear things are turning around. I'm also playing GW2 for the first time in about 10years for the time being 😆
@JMulls that's my hope. I could probably use a break from the game anyways honestly. Been playing it since 1.0 beta fairly consistently with only a small break during Stormblood. Might be good to come back after another break more fresh to the next expansion.
@@ChannelRaznoff I mean right now content in recent patches is so low you can just wait for Free Login campaign and clear everything in record time...casually. Everything will bank on story going back to Shadowbringers quality and the combat system getting overhauled but don't expect too much on that front if recent changes to Dragoon mean anything. Only thing that might be interesting is how Beastmaster is handled. This hyperfocus on streamlining the game to appeal to a broader audience is a double edged sword. And the FFXIV mobile announcement while separate from the main game leaves a sour taste in my mouth. They after that Mobile scene that is popular over in most of Asia. Business smart but it concerns me if it'll cross over into the game and make it even more braindead then it already is. It really is tiresome that most days it just is very easy to dump negativity on XIV. I still like the game but it doesn't want me to keep playing. Plenty of stuff to do but none of the stuff in there I want to do. Sucks. Rant over.
@MagiusNecros eh, I would rather wait. There are a ton of games in my backlog and several on the horizon, namely Expedition 33. Not in a rush to stay caught up.
On the point of them changing a zones look based on the story, they've already done that before... I mean the jump from 1.0 to arr had a whole host of physical changes to every zone due to bahamut, even the polluting of mor dhona due to the garleans and migardzormyr
i do agree that the msq is vitally important to the identity of this game, but i do feel that there should be more content that doesn't require the MSQ to do. took me almost 3 1/2 years to fully catch up because even though I liked the msq it can be a slog when you just want to play a games with your friends. like when im playing an mmo id expect to be playing multiplayer but the story is so long and single player and so much of the great multiplayer content is locked behind msq. I was so excited for criterion dungeons in endwalker but i hadn't gotten caught up yet. they should make content like that across all levels of play to update the player experience across all levels.
sometime i really feel like i played a different game then most with Dawntrail. I wont sit here and say it perfect cause its not it has issues, but people act like its complete dogwater and I genuinely don't get it, and that only on a narrative level. If we are talking Galmeplay id argue its objectively some of the funnest content design iv ever played in 4 years years iv been playing. All the content we missed in Endwalker is coming back plus new stuff. idk id argue that as a whole Dawntrail is actually a pretty strong expa and comparing it the absolute lows of wow is a bit of a stretch but idk just my opinion im def in the minority
Gameplay wise, wow is just far better. There's a lot more content to actually do, goals to achieve, and if you can't raid there's still difficult content you can clear. I cannot say most of these things about 14. Also, 14's gearing system is comedically bad.
Question is will DT become the next AAR after another 4 expansions? i can see SE condensing AAR even further, fleshing out HW world building, or rewriting SB pacing issues to get players closer to DT's new starting point. Its been done in the past and even recently so anything is possible.
@@slimfastsubaru2043 True, i didn't mean to say skip ShB or EW there good in there own right just stream line the weaker aspects of the overall story.
The War Within is informed by the lore that came before it, which was pure garbage tier writing. Anduin’s whole arc is coming off of the terrible arc he had in Shadowlands. WW doesn’t exist in a vacuum. It’s actually an interesting contrast. WoW lore has been dog water for almost 10 years, then they had a good and well written expansion. XIV has had 10 years of amazing lore, and then they released a very mid expansion. If some of you had perspective, you’d stop being so alarmist about DT while being so forgiving with WoW
I don't really care about TWW, but outside of dungeons, and raids, is there even gameplay in Dawntrail aside from "speak to wuk lamat" and "follow wuk lamat" and so on? So to be better than that is kind of a low bar, right now.
@@LontEnCaras Wow clears 14 in terms of gameplay so hard it's not even funny. The only thing wow looses in is fight design, and that's only because blizzard can't design a telegraph worth a shit
It clearly shows they have been more busy with creating the FFXIV Mobile game, then actually making sure we had good content for dawntrail & post dawntrail.
Yeah TWW > DT with its overall story. Now, DT at its peek is far more interesting to me then anything in TWW, but the bad parts of DT are really bad and drag it down. TWW you can shut your brain off at least as you are use to, and while technically you can do the same wiht DT and just skip most everything, it becomes much more jarring. Wow's writing was never anything stellar (I argue it peeked back in Warcraft 3) but DT when you got such bad wriitng on that side that you have parts that make players adamantly hate sections you REALLY screwed up. At least Wow you can generally ignore most of it.
@FredericckPesetas dude, they added selva and world activities. Not to mention raids and dungeons as they have. DT has added so far Zero new content. Don't be dishonest just since you want 14 to win. Wow has added more new types of content then 14 with tww. It doesn't mean tww is a stunning success either, just overall it was executed better then DT with what we have so far. Also you are very much ignoring the "msq" bit in my response.
@FredericckPesetas Name new types of content added in DT they never did before so far. Baby rage? Are you like 12 or something? Where do you remotely come yup with an idea like that?
@@BautistaSiciliano That's not out yet, try again with new content that is actually out. To be clear, I'm also only including new types of content that WoW has out right now. I'm not including anything that wow announced but isn't in game yet just like FF14.
WoW really isn't in the same ballpark - it has good world-building lore but everything else has the emotional depth and complexity of someone making a soap opera for action figures. Its major achievement this go-round has been not being terrible but it's still shallow in comparison. It is so mediocre it makes Dragon Age Veilguard look like War and Peace. I will not concede a single angstrom of credit to WoW's current story away from DT or FF14 as a whole. There's fair critique where it's deserved everything can be improved but I'm not taking notes from Blizzard of all people. Not the same League. Not the same ballpark. That's delusional dishonesty.
my hot take is WoW looks way much better than Dawntrail in terms of art direction and world design and if the crap story we got from Dawntrail is the new normal for FFXIV, they better be careful if WoW starts being better at story.
World design....I dunno. Honestly both of 14's and Wow's worlds both feel almost equally empty, with 14 kinda winning out due to hunts fates and maps being content people actually do, well most of wow's open world content you engage with it till you outgear it and don't touch that shit for the rest of the xpack
@@scorpiowarrior7841 Don't forget gathering in ff14 world as well, after some time passes I just see a lot of players either fishing or gathering mats in all the maps.
They prob will have to pull that trigger at some point but I think they would need to retool the entire reward structure surrounding new game plus to incentivize playing the msq at some point. I think having it exist as a good way to level other jobs or to just acquire a bunch of scrips for your main to use could be worth looking into or just really lean into achievements and give a bunch more mounts and minions alongside or just do both
What doesn't make sense? They could just make a 20min cutscene of the main story beats of the hydaelyn and zodiark saga. Introduce the scions. 6.1 is basically the start of the new saga. They have updated hall of the novice with all the new game mechanics. I don't think it be that hard to implement.
People have been saying this since stormblood was in its patch cycle. The reason XIV has a reputation of having a player base of helpful people is because the only people at endgame are the ones who are invested in the story and overall experience. It's like a cult, and I'm in it.
@@cheffdonty I get that and I support it too. But the game needs a healthy influx of new players to survive. When too many expansions come out it will become a barrier of entry for many.
Dunno this is a hot take: Our WoL story should've ended on EW You make a new character on DT. It'll be groundbreaking especially for MMOs but I doubt CBU3 would do that. Ofc your progression remains intact as a player, it'll just give the dev to make a light do over with new job systems or something. Also I think it'll be cool if the game somehow can make our character return as a cameo in an expansion or something. Seeing our new WoL paired with the our old WoL would be awesome. Pardon I'm just rambling something that wouldn't be possible. Carry on.
I cannot disagree more. The idea of just outright loosing your character due to story reasons is awful, espically for people like RPers or hardcore raiders who have A LOT invested into that character and now I have to remake them? Do I have to have a new name? No that's ridicious.
And that's exactly why I know they won't do it. I'm thinking in the perspective of refreshing the game and making it work lore wise but I do understand if people do not want that due to their investment with the character. I am an ARR player. Been raiding seriously since SB and grown attached to my WoL. It's been a long decade and I think if they would do that I would be fine. Again, your progress as a player remains intact. It's just you're playing as another character (which btw you can recreate the same character with the new system). How they would go about this is up to them.
@@scorpiowarrior7841 You keep everything. You lose nothing. It's simply another character sharing your main character slot. Logistically your OG WoL and new WoL have the same 'Character ID'. They're linked. It's just a soft reboot for the job system and for immersion they'll let you make a 'new character'. This is the same approach they did for Legacy 1.0 characters but with a caveat that you can still keep your stuff and play the new FFXIV overhaul. It's a big dream of if. I don't think this is possible but the fact that they manage to make server crossing a thing and no other MMO manage to do so makes me hope this is plausible is all.
Living memory looked worse before than after. Seeing the natural sky come in made the beauty of nature who will never end overshadow the manmade monstrosity
Honestly, I would have like Dawntrail a lot more if it's just the story about us exploring uncharted continent and discovering lost civilizations.
Yup... That's all I wanted. Vacation, slow-burn...
The 7.1 storyline made Koana stupider than Wuk Lamat. Our boy is supposed to be the Vow of Reason, he's supposed to the one who thinks ahead, but when he sees a fancy cow being run down by a spiky T-Rex that looks like it's straight out of Monster Hunter, what does he do? He runs in its path.
Koana, my brother in Hydaelyn, it's a fucking COW!!! You're one of the leaders of an ENTIRE NATION. The most recent alliance your country forged rests on your shoulders and your people are relying on you to be level headed and guide things in a healthy direction. Why the fuck are you putting your life on the line for ONE COW?!?! If it died and you killed the dino then Hhetsaro could still use its carcass for resources! If you die because you put human level value on the life of ONE COW you've suddenly cost your entire nation a second leader in the span of months! No kitty that's a bad kitty!
thats like a REALLY dumb thing to complain about. like who cares?
@zackskyborne2904 Great Scott! A hot take on a video about hot takes?! Who could've seen that coming!
@@FredericckPesetas i disagree it makes sense for the PEOPLE of that tribe to care he isnt obligated to believe their beliefs his whole point was to understand it not follow it. Him being ok dying for a fucking cow was stupid and character degradation.
@@TheManBehindtheScreen not really a hot take, alot of people yells and moans about this
@@FredericckPesetas sometimes they say that. But other times, they admit, that they are also eating those cows.
I don't think the MSQ is doomed and can't recover in 8.0, but what DT did is shake my faith in the level of care being put in the MSQ, which does concern me, it feels like they let a lot of easily fixable issues get through so it feels like they don't care. Stuff like the Koana cow thing getting memed to death, how did no one think to have the genius tech guy use something to trip or slow the monster instead of body blocking like an idiot? Or if they were dead set on self sacrifice, maybe have the guy that was at the other attack 20 years ago be the one that gets charged at and he freezes because he's traumatized, Koana can't stop it with his gun so he jumps to knock him out of the path and gets rammed. Then it's not stupid. The lack of care and attention to framing and context is extremely worrying to me for the future.
@@FredericckPesetas Toxic positivity is Toxic.
@@FredericckPesetasthat's your opinion. My personal thoughts were that the Dawntrail story was trash compared to everything else. No big baddies setup or any real path forward for the story. The main writers for it were the tribe quest line writers. But normally if anyone speaks out they get attacked by toxic positivity police 😅
@FredericckPesetas Clearly you haven't been to places like Reddit or many comment sections in general. Him almost killing himself to save a fantasy cow is constantly being joked about, I've seen at least 3 pictures made joking about it as well acting like he's in love with that buffalo, and countless jokes, look at most videos and posts about 7.1, it's harder to find one where no one is clowning Koana and the cow than finding one where they are by a huge margin. You can take my word or not, regardless, it doesn't change how unbelievably stupid that entire section was.
@@FredericckPesetas No, this is not better than ARR. ARR had the benefit of being the first one. By DT they have more than enough talent, money and experience identifying what has worked for years. And there's no excuse for scenes like making the leader of the country almost kill himself to save a cow. The same cows you literally get as hunt marks that you kill right next to that settlement for sacks of nuts.
The whole expansion was riddled with B.S. like that and most players found it stupid and frustrating to watch. I can run through a laundry list of scenes that are bafflingly stupid if you would like but I should not have to. There's a reason the majority of players responded negatively to DT, and it's not blind hate, it was bad and the writing continues to be bad in the patches. I'm far from the only person calling this out.
@@FredericckPesetas Bro as I said Toxic positivity. You have 100+10 percent proved my point. 😆 Played and cleared all msq started in beta of ARR after coming over from FFXI. I took a long break from saying much in the comments because of what you are doing now.
I have kinda zoned out with DawnTrail's story at the moment, but the Raid and Alliance Raid stories are quite intriguing so far to me, having this weird situation where I'm looking more forward to the raid and Alliance Raid story compared to the actual story of DawnTrail.
Lol same
@@FredericckPesetas Look, Sareel Ja is far more interesting than Zoraal Ja, least he actually has a personality to him that caters well to his villain antics when he's using his electrope to see what powers he can bring from other worlds
@@FredericckPesetas It's not even that, Zoraal ja literally doesn't even have a personality until level 95, and it's literally just, Identity crisis. Sareel Ja is a manipulator who gets other people to do his work for him to get his way, and that kind of personality fits really well for a main antagonist, using his brains instead of his brawn to get his way by getting the actually strong people to do his dirty work, and being understandably salty about being backstabbed by Zoraal Ja
If anything Sareel Ja would have been a better antagonist to Wuk than Zoraal, those 2 have beef with each other right from the get go with Sareel Ja's antics going straight for Wuk, while Zoraal literally only has conflict with Wuk over wanting to create world peace through world conquest.
@@FredericckPesetas I mean, he's literally doing it in the Alliance raid with the phantom creations of his, otherwise he convinced Zoraal Ja to let Bakool live and then used Bakool and his henchmen to steal keystones from Wuk specifically.
WoW's story at its best is still worse than XIV's story at its worst. It has a level of non-story that is hard to even equal. Its excuse of a campaign is "we don't really have any idea what we wanna do, and it might not go anywhere and half of it may be retconned by patch 3, but we needed some excuse to make a claymation cinematic featuring the smirking smug main villain's feet." That's about the depth of that game's story. But that's not really the point, I would assume. Most people want a good story compared to XIV, and not a good story compared to WoW.
Idk about wow but it can't be worse than DT
@@LionLostInTime once again worse is subjective. Its worse because there isn't much of a story at all compared to FFXIV, most lore and dialogue is in quest descriptions that not many read. In terms of writing it's also quite generic, especially in recent years.
So while dawn trail has flaws it's still a better told story overall. But obviously if you hate it then you'd probably prefer wows because it's so skippable
Idk Id have to disagree, I think TWW msq was significantly better than DT. I cared about the characters, there were stakes, the villain is genuinely interesting and menacing and the character moments, especially in some of the side quests were meaningful and enjoyable. I think the side quest where you Anduin and Faerin play the in universe miniature war game while they discuss their culture and history is more endearing than basically anything so far in DT. Obviously this is all subjective but for me, somehow wow’s story actually has me quite a bit more invested in the world and characters currently.
@@LionLostInTime they retcon decades of story and butchered a fan favorite antagonist so they could have a wannabe thanos.
Not mention the Wow’s gameplay is always a all over the place where only half of it is worth your time
Not sure if this is considered a hot take or not, but here it goes!
I actually loved Dawntrail, 7.0 and 7.1’s story. Especially loved the whole Resident Evil experience in the latter xD Sure there are faults here and there, but personally I find them to be minimal to impact my experience.
As someone who roleplays in the game with friends and others, I like having new lore being introduced to us so we can make our own stories!
Gacha take is very true. Dawntrail main defense is "its a new arc". Well Fate Grand Order also had new arc open with Lostbelt 1 and my god story of dawntrail cant even stand close to it.
lol 1/2 of this vid is just talking about Wuthering Waves, should've stated that in the title, kind of clickbaity
7:13
That's the same for me with Heavens Burn Red lately. It's practically a VN but the writing was so amazing that I just went "FFXIV used to be this good..."
We've got to that point now and that's something. I hope the writing can recover from this
The Sphene inside of Solutiion Nine sounds like she wants to make Ascians out of the Alexandrians.
Wuk Lamat's rapid progress from fledgling to OP pseudo-protagonist and the similarity of her path to Zero's is no coincidence and no mistake of lazy writing.
EW ended with a massive upheaval. Heidi, Zodi, and Endsinger all died. The bounds on our world are removed and the aether/dynamis they commanded is freed up.
Zero and Lama'ti ascended quickly because it's easier to do so. And going forward this will pave the way for new antagonists that can meaningfully challenge us.
Square Enix needs to stop having the Warrior of Light react with a horrified expression whenever Y'shtola shows up.
i headcanon it to the WOL still being terrified from her doing the magical girl pose from the EW patches
Could be like this, you get a option of long ass side quest to least recap the Hydalyn arc, or do the classic way with extra rewards ((mounts with different colors glams etc etc. ))and add a feature to Newgame plus for older players to earn the same rewards
So we have been through a lot since older zones, and for story sake why doesn’t the old map kinda upgrade? I mean even after stormblood, war is kinda over by the end of shadowbringers and then endwalker and dawntrail happens but like we don’t really get a lot of upgrades to older city’s characters and their changes since. I think backtracking to older characters to Introduce new places and areas.
then look no further then the other members of the scions ( at the end of shadowbringers when they finally disband and all go their separate ways, their are a lot of ( non main characters ) that are in the scions and if u talked to each of their npc’s, u get some dialogue of where they are thinking of going too.)
I think those characters are worth revisiting and seeing their change while going to new places too. Making the past lore and new lore come together in a way that makes it an amazing story.
I just wanna update my spicy take that I don't think TWW is GREAT, it's just better than Dawntrail.
I'm not as doomery as others either. They clearly stumbled here but that doesn't mean they won't get back up.
Yeah exactly, I'm about to jump into TWW tonight on stream and check it out for myself but everyone misses occasionally, and if DT is the lowest point this game has narratively speaking it'll be fine imo, they are already showing me signs of moving back in the direction I like with things like 7.1 and the potential plot threads that are still hanging (Zero and Golbez being a big one and Azem almost certainly being a focal point in the future)
TWW isn't even good in general. It's the same Dragonflight mediocrity with a different skin. People are simply okay with it because Shadowlands was worse. That's the standard created for that game.
@@Zakjuh Yeah, I'd agree. Last time I truly enjoyed WoW was Legion.
@@FredericckPesetas I don't have to think about anything. I was more engaged going through the main campaign of TWW than I was DT. That is just a fact.
@FredericckPesetas Bro what are you talking about? I am talking purely MSQ here. The battle content for 14 has been amazing in DT. I finished the campaign in TWW a week after it came out and haven't played since, I just want to see the story. I don't like WoW's approach to end game. I've been playing both WoW and 14 since they both came out and my "bias" is definitely towards 14. You people lose your minds when anyone doesn't like the same thing you do. Come off it.
I like the 7.1 ending with Sphene, she was the most interesting character in Dawntrail. And with her return it bring alot of questions. How does she have a body, who is the imposter, how will they deal with their new found fear of death. All interseting points.
The only good part about Dawntrail, to me, is Shaaloani (aka wild west zone). Because based on all the prior scraps of information we had over the many years about Tural as a place, that is what they were setting up. Meanwhile that gets thrown out the window mostly because I have to deal with some cyberpunk dystopia that feels out of place in what is basically just fantasy North American and South America.
Yeah solution 9 and whatnot could have been a part of its own expansion. Such a clash of ideas.
It would be cool to do more with Living Memory, maybe build it back up or 'turn it on' again in some way but as a place for the living and not the dead. We saw this back in ARR with Revenant's Toll, building it over time, and with Idyllshire in Heavensward. Just kinda sad you can't see their old versions anymore.
I have no idea how you go from one of the best rpg stories ever told, to writing worse than the WoW Avengers cinematic is beyond me...
Replacing the writers 😂
i'm sorry but not even DT is worse than wow avengers and shadowlands
I briefly tried to enjoy the Pelu Pelu tribal questline, but… my God. No matter how you slice it, it’s still the story of helping a travel agency start-up. And… that’s it. Sorry, I just… could not care less. Stakes don’t get much lower than that, really.
It's the Pelu Pelu, what the he'll were you expecting out of that? I'm just taking the FFX reference that it is and just getting through it. I didn't expect much out of it.
7.2 theory: We are see a kid good Sphene become buddies with with the new king of Alexandria
SPHEERREEE!!! LISSEN TU MMIIIIIIIIII
lets face it here without the key members of the team there like Ishikawa or hell even Koji has left for other projects feels like the new talent is not talented enough WoW really has been catching up in quality and its even adding housing now they really need to step up their game.
something i personally am hopign is that we get to keep sphene as our main interaction npc going forward and she actually explains to us why Azems key is in Solution 9 in the first place
while i absolutly agree about your opinion about the team not up to snuff.. i don't think sphene can actually explain why the key was in her possession. as far as i understood it, that key came with the lala's from the source.
@@FredericckPesetas WHINIIIIIIIIING
The funny thing is as wow catches up in quality, 14's poor endgame experience really really starts to show itself.
Inb4 the takeaway SE takes from "These gachas have a similar situation with a better story" is tgat they should make the next "MMO" FF into a gacha instead
well... ff14 mobile just got announced so they are half there already.
the best thing they can dop is to give the gameplay of recent levels at lower level if someone wants to do the MSQ they still hav e he option to skip a lot of content, that's what I did with anything unvoiced in DT.
They took a huge step back with DT they need to put this writer away going forward
To be clear, I don't think FFXIV is going to stay that way. I just think currently they're in a bad spot. I've been giving my sub money to WuWa for the battlepass, but I will probably be back closer to 8.0 if I hear things are turning around. I'm also playing GW2 for the first time in about 10years for the time being 😆
XIV is currently in what I call the Warlords of Draenor part of it's life.
@@MagiusNecros We're about to eat so well if we get the Legion analog for FF14 in 8.0 💀
@JMulls that's my hope. I could probably use a break from the game anyways honestly. Been playing it since 1.0 beta fairly consistently with only a small break during Stormblood. Might be good to come back after another break more fresh to the next expansion.
@@ChannelRaznoff I mean right now content in recent patches is so low you can just wait for Free Login campaign and clear everything in record time...casually.
Everything will bank on story going back to Shadowbringers quality and the combat system getting overhauled but don't expect too much on that front if recent changes to Dragoon mean anything.
Only thing that might be interesting is how Beastmaster is handled.
This hyperfocus on streamlining the game to appeal to a broader audience is a double edged sword.
And the FFXIV mobile announcement while separate from the main game leaves a sour taste in my mouth. They after that Mobile scene that is popular over in most of Asia.
Business smart but it concerns me if it'll cross over into the game and make it even more braindead then it already is.
It really is tiresome that most days it just is very easy to dump negativity on XIV. I still like the game but it doesn't want me to keep playing. Plenty of stuff to do but none of the stuff in there I want to do. Sucks.
Rant over.
@MagiusNecros eh, I would rather wait. There are a ton of games in my backlog and several on the horizon, namely Expedition 33. Not in a rush to stay caught up.
On the point of them changing a zones look based on the story, they've already done that before... I mean the jump from 1.0 to arr had a whole host of physical changes to every zone due to bahamut, even the polluting of mor dhona due to the garleans and migardzormyr
And cohertas. It was...better back then Imo.
i do agree that the msq is vitally important to the identity of this game, but i do feel that there should be more content that doesn't require the MSQ to do. took me almost 3 1/2 years to fully catch up because even though I liked the msq it can be a slog when you just want to play a games with your friends. like when im playing an mmo id expect to be playing multiplayer but the story is so long and single player and so much of the great multiplayer content is locked behind msq. I was so excited for criterion dungeons in endwalker but i hadn't gotten caught up yet. they should make content like that across all levels of play to update the player experience across all levels.
Not a hot take, but it sucks that Ishikawa isn't lead writer anymore.
sometime i really feel like i played a different game then most with Dawntrail. I wont sit here and say it perfect cause its not it has issues, but people act like its complete dogwater and I genuinely don't get it, and that only on a narrative level. If we are talking Galmeplay id argue its objectively some of the funnest content design iv ever played in 4 years years iv been playing. All the content we missed in Endwalker is coming back plus new stuff. idk id argue that as a whole Dawntrail is actually a pretty strong expa and comparing it the absolute lows of wow is a bit of a stretch but idk just my opinion im def in the minority
Gameplay wise, wow is just far better. There's a lot more content to actually do, goals to achieve, and if you can't raid there's still difficult content you can clear. I cannot say most of these things about 14. Also, 14's gearing system is comedically bad.
Question is will DT become the next AAR after another 4 expansions? i can see SE condensing AAR even further, fleshing out HW world building, or rewriting SB pacing issues to get players closer to DT's new starting point. Its been done in the past and even recently so anything is possible.
No way they pass up shadowbringers or even ew. They are too good.
@@slimfastsubaru2043 True, i didn't mean to say skip ShB or EW there good in there own right just stream line the weaker aspects of the overall story.
Lukewarm take: The War Within shits all over everything that Dawntrail has done, both in story and gameplay elements
lol
lmao even
The War Within is informed by the lore that came before it, which was pure garbage tier writing. Anduin’s whole arc is coming off of the terrible arc he had in Shadowlands. WW doesn’t exist in a vacuum. It’s actually an interesting contrast. WoW lore has been dog water for almost 10 years, then they had a good and well written expansion. XIV has had 10 years of amazing lore, and then they released a very mid expansion. If some of you had perspective, you’d stop being so alarmist about DT while being so forgiving with WoW
thats a pretty low bar though.
I don't really care about TWW, but outside of dungeons, and raids, is there even gameplay in Dawntrail aside from "speak to wuk lamat" and "follow wuk lamat" and so on? So to be better than that is kind of a low bar, right now.
@@LontEnCaras Wow clears 14 in terms of gameplay so hard it's not even funny. The only thing wow looses in is fight design, and that's only because blizzard can't design a telegraph worth a shit
It clearly shows they have been more busy with creating the FFXIV Mobile game, then actually making sure we had good content for dawntrail & post dawntrail.
Yeah TWW > DT with its overall story. Now, DT at its peek is far more interesting to me then anything in TWW, but the bad parts of DT are really bad and drag it down. TWW you can shut your brain off at least as you are use to, and while technically you can do the same wiht DT and just skip most everything, it becomes much more jarring. Wow's writing was never anything stellar (I argue it peeked back in Warcraft 3) but DT when you got such bad wriitng on that side that you have parts that make players adamantly hate sections you REALLY screwed up. At least Wow you can generally ignore most of it.
@FredericckPesetas dude, they added selva and world activities. Not to mention raids and dungeons as they have. DT has added so far Zero new content. Don't be dishonest just since you want 14 to win. Wow has added more new types of content then 14 with tww.
It doesn't mean tww is a stunning success either, just overall it was executed better then DT with what we have so far. Also you are very much ignoring the "msq" bit in my response.
@FredericckPesetas Name new types of content added in DT they never did before so far.
Baby rage? Are you like 12 or something? Where do you remotely come yup with an idea like that?
@@BautistaSiciliano That's not out yet, try again with new content that is actually out. To be clear, I'm also only including new types of content that WoW has out right now. I'm not including anything that wow announced but isn't in game yet just like FF14.
WoW really isn't in the same ballpark - it has good world-building lore but everything else has the emotional depth and complexity of someone making a soap opera for action figures.
Its major achievement this go-round has been not being terrible but it's still shallow in comparison. It is so mediocre it makes Dragon Age Veilguard look like War and Peace.
I will not concede a single angstrom of credit to WoW's current story away from DT or FF14 as a whole.
There's fair critique where it's deserved everything can be improved but I'm not taking notes from Blizzard of all people. Not the same League. Not the same ballpark. That's delusional dishonesty.
We are really living in a society if people rather take your average chinese nickle-and-dime gacha game slop over a proper MMORPG
All of this started with the Sweet Baby inc. partnership
my hot take is WoW looks way much better than Dawntrail in terms of art direction and world design and if the crap story we got from Dawntrail is the new normal for FFXIV, they better be careful if WoW starts being better at story.
World design....I dunno. Honestly both of 14's and Wow's worlds both feel almost equally empty, with 14 kinda winning out due to hunts fates and maps being content people actually do, well most of wow's open world content you engage with it till you outgear it and don't touch that shit for the rest of the xpack
@@scorpiowarrior7841 Don't forget gathering in ff14 world as well, after some time passes I just see a lot of players either fishing or gathering mats in all the maps.
I think they should give new players the choice of starting at either 2.0 or 6.1
They prob will have to pull that trigger at some point but I think they would need to retool the entire reward structure surrounding new game plus to incentivize playing the msq at some point. I think having it exist as a good way to level other jobs or to just acquire a bunch of scrips for your main to use could be worth looking into or just really lean into achievements and give a bunch more mounts and minions alongside or just do both
yeah no, that makes no sense?
What doesn't make sense? They could just make a 20min cutscene of the main story beats of the hydaelyn and zodiark saga. Introduce the scions. 6.1 is basically the start of the new saga. They have updated hall of the novice with all the new game mechanics. I don't think it be that hard to implement.
People have been saying this since stormblood was in its patch cycle. The reason XIV has a reputation of having a player base of helpful people is because the only people at endgame are the ones who are invested in the story and overall experience. It's like a cult, and I'm in it.
@@cheffdonty I get that and I support it too. But the game needs a healthy influx of new players to survive. When too many expansions come out it will become a barrier of entry for many.
the wow and gacha game comment is not a hot take if it's true.
Dunno this is a hot take:
Our WoL story should've ended on EW
You make a new character on DT. It'll be groundbreaking especially for MMOs but I doubt CBU3 would do that. Ofc your progression remains intact as a player, it'll just give the dev to make a light do over with new job systems or something.
Also I think it'll be cool if the game somehow can make our character return as a cameo in an expansion or something. Seeing our new WoL paired with the our old WoL would be awesome.
Pardon I'm just rambling something that wouldn't be possible. Carry on.
I cannot disagree more. The idea of just outright loosing your character due to story reasons is awful, espically for people like RPers or hardcore raiders who have A LOT invested into that character and now I have to remake them? Do I have to have a new name? No that's ridicious.
And that's exactly why I know they won't do it. I'm thinking in the perspective of refreshing the game and making it work lore wise but I do understand if people do not want that due to their investment with the character.
I am an ARR player. Been raiding seriously since SB and grown attached to my WoL. It's been a long decade and I think if they would do that I would be fine.
Again, your progress as a player remains intact. It's just you're playing as another character (which btw you can recreate the same character with the new system). How they would go about this is up to them.
@@Eisenight Yes but what do we loose? Housing reset? you just loose all of that, all your glams, evreything? What do you keep?
@@scorpiowarrior7841 You keep everything. You lose nothing. It's simply another character sharing your main character slot.
Logistically your OG WoL and new WoL have the same 'Character ID'. They're linked.
It's just a soft reboot for the job system and for immersion they'll let you make a 'new character'.
This is the same approach they did for Legacy 1.0 characters but with a caveat that you can still keep your stuff and play the new FFXIV overhaul.
It's a big dream of if. I don't think this is possible but the fact that they manage to make server crossing a thing and no other MMO manage to do so makes me hope this is plausible is all.
Living memory looked worse before than after. Seeing the natural sky come in made the beauty of nature who will never end overshadow the manmade monstrosity
Like if it's the gray drab buildings, they were always gray drab buildings.
Looks better when you use mods to remove the gold filter and restore the sky in new game +
My hot take is Koana is better then Graha Tia
You're right. That's a lava red take.
I promise you when i make another one of these this take will be in it 💀
The way you're gassing up a children's casino for half the video is giga cringe