C-FBWH Nashville TN 4 March 2024
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- Опубликовано: 5 мар 2024
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You Tube- You Must Do Better!!!
Thanks Juan. Yesterday marks the third one of these I’ve received in the past two months. It’s why I own an iPhone made in 1942!
Ugh, scammers are messaging RUclips viewers pretending to be RUclips creators to hit them up for cash, is that what's happening? Yuck!
Also beware the fraudulent users masquerading with same logo icon, and same username only slightly different, for example, suffixed with letter 'n' or 's'.
The pervasive SPAM and SCAM in the comments is not only a nuisence but a degredation of content and, I believe, a potential loss of monetary value to the content material.
Yes, Y-T- You Must Do Better!!! Right now, the brand is a disgusting mess.
Pinged three times now - seem to be hitting your channel hard.
I only got One...
“Keep flying that airplane.” Excellent interjection on the part of another pilot.
Powerful moment. It was one pilot reaching out to another pilot extending the hope that he lives. Whoever he is, he’s surely heartbroken. God bless and blue skies, pilots.
I second this
Kudos to the pilot on the air saying "keep flying that aeroplane". Kudos to ATC for taking control of the situation and doing what they could. God bless ya , Juan .
I noticed that, too. Somebody who keeps his eyes on the accident statistics.
Came here to say this too.
You took the words out of my mouth. Nobody who's had a career hasn't been involved in one of these. It is gut wrenching.
'Guessing that was PM of SWA 1059.
I heard that too. Broke my heart
@@stevemadak6255 I'd like to find out who that was. He's what I think they call a mensch.
I'm a pilot and a trucker with a drop yard right there and when he said "I don't know where ". There is no way you're going to have an empty spot on I-40 at that time of night..... or any other time. He understood.
Still, landing _with traffic_ has a greater chance of favorable outcome than, say, a stall/spin.
Is it me or what is going on with all of these small airplane crashes .One is to many but not being a pilot myself is this recent number of crashes normal?
@@noelwarner1235I blame the type of training they are getting now as compared to 20 years ago!!!!!
@@UncleKennysPlace That's true, but _my guess_ is he didn't want to endanger the people driving.
Judging from the screenshot Juan was able to share, and from mikelavelle's initial comment above, the traffic was considerable, and so the casualties would have surely been....much higher if he tried to land that aircraft on the road.
Within that context this pilot might actually be a hero. Hard to tell so early in the investigation.
@@noelwarner1235 unfortunately, GA is significantly more dangerous than commercial flying due to large variations in training standards and maintenance standards. Luckily, we have more information now to help prepare pilots against future emergencies and difficult situations. The increase in availability of information just makes us more aware of the accidents/incidents happening, but hopefully it also makes for a safer future for aviation as a whole.
"Keep flyin' that airplane..."
Whoever else said that on the same frequency, that's really powerful. Glad I didn't have to listen to it in real time.
When you stop flying the plane, Sir Issac Newton will gladly step in and fly it for you.
He’s very good at getting you down - hasn’t missed the ground once yet… but then, the problem never was with getting down.
He flew it down best he could or it would have been scattered all over.
And, if you don't like what you see....switch your landing lights off:/
Keep flying until you hear glass break…
It was the Southwest pilot. Same accent.
The resignation in his voice was very obvious; it was over and he knew it. As a retired ATC, I've heard this before. IMO, ATC gets an A+; this controller could not have done more or maintained a better demeanor for a good outcome. So sad for all involved.
Perhaps he thought, i knew i should have refueled. 5 up is a lot even for a Lance.
I don't know what will be worse for the pilots family. Hearing him talk to ATC or the inevitable law suit against his estate.
@@flybobbie1449 alot of fire to be out of fuel?
@@flybobbie1449 From the post crash fire there was lots of fuel, of course 4 fuel tanks requires switching tanks at the right time.
Does the Fed/ ATC give time off and mental healthcare to controllers who have through this?
Very sad 😢 I landed behind them at KERI earlier in the day, Approach had to prompt them multiple times to contact the tower, and on the ground they appeared to have trouble reading back and complying with taxi instructions. Fatigue may well have been an issue that day.
I do wonder if they were perhaps a newer pilot trying to fly their family south for vacation
language barrier might I politely ask? or something different....nevermind...after hearing his audio.
@esc351 will you be trying to contact the investigators about your observation?
Wow that's sad, knowing that you where so close to them and then they gone.. your observations will be very important to the investigators.
@@weldonyoung1013 I have indeed sent an email
Flying one tank to empty and not having the presence to switch to the other tank is a very real possibility. I have a Comanche and the old fuel gauges are not accurate near empty. The only way to know what empty actually means on each gauge is to fly one empty (at altitude and near the airport) and record the exact location of the needle when that tank is empty (the engine stops - hell of a scary feeling even when you know it is coming). In my plane the left gauge is empty when the needle hits a little above 1/8th of a tank while the right gauge will go below E before engine shutdown. That is not information you want to learn low and slow at night. The good news is the engine starts almost immediately after switching to the tank with fuel left.
We used to do that on the ground. Defuel plane, jack & level, and run engine(s) till it quits. Depending on aircraft type and sending unit, the float rod can be bent (adjusted) to get gauges to match up better and read closer to 'E'.
I had to deal with that while flying a C-172. I was lucky. I actually trusted the fuel gauges and thought that I had enough fuel for my flight. In fact, both gauges showed having the exact amount that I had calculated for the flight. Imagine my surprise when the engine quit! I switched to the right tank which was showing "empty""! Thankfully I was at 7,500 feet and only 20 miles from KFAT. I declared "minimum fuel" and got a "straight in" for 29R. I had perhaps 5 minutes of fuel left! Needless to say, I pay attention to my fuel!
This is exactly why you are REQUIRED to do fuel calculations for each and every flight and if you are smart you will stick your tanks. Believe it or not in the US aircraft fuel gauges are only required to be accurate when they are completely empty, if you choose to fly carelessly Id recommend doing the empty fuel shutdown test as mentioned above to see where they are actually empty and engine quits, or just do everyone a favor and don't fly at all.
Yea blowing off the outboards first is what I would do .. when I fly I go by time ,never trust fuel gouges. These airplanes call for fuel management more so than others , Could get imbalance if not monitored correctly , leading to tired arms , with no auto pilot .
Bet you 100 bucks he ran out of fuel on selected tank.
This happened not too far from me. My mother actually saw it. Sending my condolences to the families. Thanks for your report. I’m starting my masters program in aviation safety so I love watching your videos
Brittany, I hope you do well in your masters program! I pray that your mom doesn’t have any lasting issues with having witnessed this unfortunate incident.
At timecode 5:31 in this clip, someone who may have sensed resignation in the pilot's voice interjected with "keep flying the aeroplane", implying "don't give up."
We all heard it
I interpret a pilot saying that to mean, “Fly the plane even into the crash. Do not stall.” It’s a last ditch reminder that can save a life.
It’s a nice tip, but when you are in that task saturated situation, you’ll likely not comprehend much. He was passed off from Nashville approach to John Tune tower. Then he flew right over the airport at 2,500 and didn’t see it, so Tower sent him back to approach and it went downhill from there.
Rather..don't stall/spin.
@@rv10flyer84 It’s THE most important “tip.” Stall-spin fatalities kill pilots regularly in accidents that may have been survivable. This one may not have been.
As a former Lance driver this is hard to watch. I remember my Lance used to glide like a rock.
I was the Arrow instructor at my school and, while it wasn't the T-tail one, its power-off performance sounds pretty similar. Power-off 180s were very delicate.
T tail Lance was always reluctant to leave the ground.
Yeah with those Hershey wings
We had a Lance in our flying club for a few years, it was a contest between the short Hershey bar wing and the big Lycoming, glide ratio without power was not good.
I never liked Pipers fat wing airplanes.
I haven't flown one since 77, except a turbo Seneca a few times.
JMO/JME
Incredibly tragic outcome for this pilot and his family- the other victims were his wife and 3 young children. I used to instruct at the airport where he learned to fly (Brampton-Caledon Airport- CNC3) and where he later kept the Lance that he bought (the Transport Canada civil aviation registry shows it was imported last year). While I never flew with him, I ran into him many times while he was working on his PPL, and he always seemed sharp and well-prepared. For those wondering about the accent, he is of Eastern European descent.
The pilot had hobbies with cars and boats for a long time. He was also used to his plane's two fuel tanks and how to use them. Especially in the dark flying over a strange airport before landing makes sense. A forced landing to the fields on the north side of the river would have succeeded quite easily in daylight. The darkness and limited time to solve the engine problem were not on the pilot's side. This was very unfortunate and so sad. RIP.
Flew a Lance for 13 years. Like other aircraft in the same category it can be quite a workload at night, exhausted and apparently lost. The starboard wing didn't catch fire which makes me think he may have sucked it dry when turning inbound for the airport. Prayers to all involved especially the 3 babies. Thanks for such good reporting Juan.
Thanks! Good insight!
Probably he got tired after three take offs and two landings, and having kids onboard, and especially without flying instrumental to help him being relaxed and monitor everything properly and manage the energy and fly path... Maybe had some really bad luck, but don't think so.
I had wondered about just that having experienced it operating other than AirCraft. A bit surprise the don't have a cross over feed or draw of both if you wanted.
Probably a reason for not I would guess.
Always Forward~Godspeed lost souls, children dam-it!
I would agree and you can inadvertently turn the fuel off in the PA32 when you switch tanks. If he ran one tank dry, that would be a huge factor. With the fatigue he’s might have forgot to switch tanks. Similar accident near PDK airport in a Saratoga, (newer version of the Lance), and the pilot coming into land shut the fuel off switching tanks. He landed on the interstate near the airport and walked away from the crash. Another tragic loss.
Wind factor ??
I’m thinking he forgot to push the mixture up for the descent. From 10k down to 2k. Engine ran at reduced/idle power fine, but when he throttled up to level-off, it started running rough. Then quit. Long day, distractions, night, etc.
Thank you for Blancolirio Juan, you are without rival.
I used to fly the club PA28-180 ironically, at Milton Ont. with a similar fuel system. That aircraft ...OCH, was once successfully ditched less than a mile from Toronto Island Airport by a pilot with his daughter and pet dog on board after a return flight from Ottawa. All were fine and picked up promptly. The Airpark owner told me later that after the sunken plane was recovered, all the systems and engine were dried of water, then with the fuller tank selected and fuel pump on, the engine started and ran fine.
Whatever the investigation turns up in this recent tragedy, it should remind us about flying beyond our personal limits or the limits of our aircraft and the importance of procedures and checklists. Thoughts and prayers for those lost, and their families.
What you mean sim.ilar fuel system? Lance has 4 fuel tanks ,180 has 2 .
I did not say identical, both are manually switched to balance and the POH procedure to do so is essentially the same.@@dennisstoesz
that plane is back flying now for many years! I rent it out of burlington
Sad loss of pilot and passengers
It shows the advantage of ditching in fresh water instead of salt water.
I was on I-40 at the time but on the East side of Nashville. I was listening to ATC when this happened. To me, the pilot did sound like he had given up all hope in successfully landing his airplane. It was heart breaking.
I always appreciate and respect the non-judgmental nature of your commentary. None of us know what we we would have done, or how we would have reacted. This is such a tragedy for all involved. May they RIP.
If the video is from TDOT, Storyful doesn't have copyright. And neither does TDOT.
But it will be in RUclips's automatic copyright strike system.
NASA had their channel taken down after downstream networks claimed copyright on the footage.
I watched it, doesn't show anying until the fireball.
There is a doorbell video I saw yesterday that apparently shows the airplane with strobes flashing moving to the left of the frame and then circling around to the right and approaching the camera before descending out of frame to the left followed by a bright flash. It seemed to be posted by one of the local homeowners.
Please share the link
@@jamesphillips2285Then the content company should get sued for maliciously using dcma tools on public data.
To all you pilots out there...
Keep flyin' that airplane...❤️
The victims of the crash have been identified by the mayor of King Township.
“An Ontario couple and their three children have been identified as the victims of a deadly plane crash in Nashville. Nashville police identified the pilot of the single-engine plane as 43-year-old Victor Dotsenko from King Township in a post on X Wednesday night. The post on the social media platform, formerly known as Twitter, said Dotsenko's wife, 39-year-old Rimma, and their three children, 12-year-old David, 10-year-old Adam and seven-year-old Emma, were also killed in the crash.”
That is so tragic. At least they are all together. May they rest in peace.
social media platform, formerly known as Twitter. Is that like The Artist Formerly Known as Prince? Not to make light of this tragedy. I never twitted so to me it's The social media not formerly known as Twitter.
I can’t get over the fact that he flew perfectly over the runway at John Tune.
Yeah, did the engine fail before he got there or after he passed the runway?
Probably looking for the runway and of course its hardest to see when you're right above it
Seems like it failed after he flew over, but he was having engine trouble before? If that’s the case put the plane down, you don’t get go arounds.
That's what I was wondering. Why?
John C Tune is pretty easy to spot. It’s on a bend of a river and surrounded by prisons on empty swaths of land. Unless he was IMC it would be difficult to miss. The control tower tapes will be revealing.
As An experienced Canadian Private Pilot from Eastern Canada, who has flown to Florida many times, I would not have done the last leg at Night, also I wonder if he had current Sectionals to show all Available Airports in better Detail, or experience working on the Navigation equipment, all questions for his training...Not knowing the fuel practices of the Lance I cant, comment on the Fuel situation, But can tell you flying a C172 I always had the tanks on Both, except on Taxi...I can tell you flying through the States is extremely challenging on ATC, compared to Canadian airspace, and can be very distracting to a low time Pilot, there are simply fewer airports to Talk too, I was really moved on the news reports and had to comment. Sympathies go out to the surviving family members...
The Lance doesn't have a "both" setting. Juan said it has to be managed and tanks switched between right and left every hour.
Jack
Spot on...!
Flying this at night is the clue: which you rightly identify.
Nowhere to go.......and more importantly unable to see where he might be able to go.
A twofold inevitabilty here. The resignation to his fate...and the darkness.
Tragic in every way, but poor decision making to be concluding this flight in darkness.
As Dan Gryder has often said....about both darkness and IMC..... best to use the Credit Card and get a hotel room.
There is always tomorrow...
Another outstanding analysis from Juan.....
James Hennighan
Yorkshire, England
I have a few hundreds of hours in Pipers, the Lance series is a nice roomy single engine. The optional gear override system was installed also on my Arrow, I kept the override on during the flight and always used my checklists as a backup to GUMPS. Speculation: why one side of the wind burned so intensely and other didn't, .. sounds like he ran it out of fuel. NTSB will also look at fuel contamination. I always ran 30 minutes, 1 hour, then swaped tanks every 30 minutes....... I had a partnership in the Arrow, the little brother plane. Thanks for the quick report. Sad the accident recording was copywrite protected.
According to news in Canada, he was a very new pilot having received his PPL in 2022.
and he was with arab accent !
@@sakadabaraYes, he sounds Arab to me also.
That was NOT a French accent. Cheers from Eastern Canada.
@@dddddyyn I suspect he knew, he just knew he could leave it to us.
Two years into my private license I was good enough for an Arrow. Turbo Lance, no way!
That’s a lesson to be learned here. If you think you are having engine trouble, and you have already made the decision to divert to the field, you get to the nearest field as quickly as possible. Don’t mess around with a pattern, and just go straight in and declare an emergency if you have to.
I nearly died flying into Charleston executive about 10 years ago after a long cross country trip from Toronto. I was 50 miles out and I saw my oil pressure fall in my 68 Cherokee. I was thinking “ok 2 psi per min, I think at my current speed I will be able to make it before it drops to my critical oil pressure”. No rise in oil temp.
I was too proud to declare an emergency,as I approached (5 miles out) and the oil pressure dropped rapidly to about 10psi.
I made it to the field, and my engine temp started to rise on taxi. When I got out of the plane, there was a large black streak under the plane from the engine to the tail. I checked my oil with the dipstick, and I couldn’t see any oil.
Mechanic (who came out a day after Christmas) found that the oil filter came loose (other co-owner did it himself, didn’t do it right).
Don’t play games if you think your single engine is having trouble. Military airfield? Who cares. Class B? Who cares. Landing downwind? Who cares. Declare an emergency and put it down as soon as you can.
Edit: I strongly believe most pilots are scared to declare an emergency. I’ve been there, and my thoughts were “I can’t declare an emergency and land at an AFB, that’s really embarrassing and my vacation will be over and I’ll lose my license”. It’s not even the reality.. At the end of the day, it may be more of a headache, but nobody is going to judge you or reprimand you if you were flying with your family and something was making you uncomfortable like a rough running engine or even feeling sick.
Agree 100%. I'm sure I"m not the only one who remembers the safety institute video of the poor guy who timidly asked ATC (when he was in a truly desperate situation) if he could land at the nearby military base and was told no way unless you declare an emergency. So all aboard died a few minutes later due to his fear of embarrassment.
Yep, I remember that too. He was trying to find place to land for a while and could use the Air Force Base. I think it was Dover. I have flown over it before. Sad.
@@bobmarino350 now compare that to how Doug White handled things when his pilot died heading home from Florida. The very first thing he did was find the radio and declare an Emergency. And I still clearly remember hearing his "come ON, Miami, let's go" when the Controllers didn't get back to him as fast as he had hoped. Then again, he didn't consider himself a pilot and had no ego to protect. Not to mention, Doug is, how shall I say, Doug.
It’s awful to hear the acceptance in his voice 😢 it really brings it home that those people had seconds to live.
Thanks for sharing.
Especially because statistically speaking if you point the plane away from vertical structures and fly it all the way to impact just above stall speed you have a good chance of surviving. Even if you hit trees. To just give up 1100 feet agl and hit the ground nose down is some severe resignation and shutting down.
I think he was crying 😢
I like to think the wife and kids were likely sleeping and never knew what was happening. Nonetheless the resignation in the man's voice is heartbreaking.
Fellow pilots: NEVER GIVE UP
Fly it all the way into the crash. This guy gave up. You can hear it.
The only time I would fly single engine at night was when I HAD to as a flight instructor.
People that choose to fly single engine at night, or over mountains day or night, single-pilot IMC in LIFR, or over water... that's your perogative, but you're stacking the odds against you, as Juan would say. Every single day there is an engine failure somewhere. They are basically 1950s technology engines. Can you imagine your modern car engine having magnetos for ignition, requiring 100 octane, and needing a complete overhaul after only 2,000 hours?
Only time I fly at night is in the pattern over Illinois farm fields. Tennessee has very unforgiving terrain. Night and terrain stack the odds and greatly reduce chances of survival.
Darren G. Sarvis
I was the night time specialist at our school/club. Lots of night flying. Loved it. Assumed the risks. Always kept in mind loss of the engine and where I'd go for controlled landing flying it to the crash (hopefully not a building, trees, poles). Had emergency at night | Friday the 13th| night | partial engine power. Glided with minimal power to runway. I enjoyed night flying for the good anti-collision factors, and smooth air (San Diego). Never did night IFR/IMC. Night flying did require good panel proficiency and near IFR navigation skills. Did many night flights to Palm Springs, Los Angeles, etc.. Night overwater too, with very clear stars. Panel dependent again.
I know we will get the identity of the victims shortly but it’s not a French Canadian accent. Sounded more Eastern European. Brampton Canada has a huge East Indian community but I don’t think that this pilot was of East Indian origin. This one is a little tough, with the loss of children. Thanks for the excellent report Juan.
I hope that they can figure out where his accent comes from. That could be a critical part of this story. At least for many commenters here.
From ABC11 News: "The Metro Nashville Police Department identified the victims as pilot Victor Dotsenko, 43, his wife, Rimma Dotsenko, 39, and their three children, David, 12, Adam, 10, and Emma, 7."
@@UserName-jm8yw 😢The family picture is online.
@@UserName-jm8yw David, Adam, and Emma....someone was certainly trying to forget that they came from the land of Putin.
That accent was likely Jordanian or Syrian. Certainly Middle Eastern.
i have had in 50 plus years of flying 3 engine failures/ one in a `72 one in my old duke and one in a moxmaster(337) where both engine quit. if you panic you will messup big time. stay calm setup to land even on a freeway/ i lost my `172 engine in the mtns east of sonora calif. only place i could land was on a old forest service rd. i tore off the right wing but stayed calm. i was not hurt. my duke literally blew up a engine over texas. landed on the old king ranch. afteri landed and got out it literally exploded. ntsb said there was a badcrank and when the engine blewup it got the fuel line. the old mix master had a fuel issue both out over nothern mn, landed in a lake. that was 40 years ago been lucky but ga aircraft do quit.. without notice or in some cases rhyme or reason
The accent is new Canadian; the airplane is fairly new to the pilot; and the pilot is potentially newish to flying based on some of the comments I've seen regarding his arrival at the previous airport (missed/misunderstood calls and confusion on the ground freq)
On that last point, he may have just not been comfortable flying into controlled fields. The aircraft is apparently based out of Brampton, one of the busiest non-towered airports in Ontario.
Speculation only, but given the likely low time on type and the length of the day, they probably ran dry on one side. It's easy enough to forget when other things are on your mind, and with a good autopilot you're not going to have a heavy wing to remind you....
Is that code for Immigrant? WTH is new Canadian?
Yea. I’m Canada. We tend to call them new Canadians lol.
His accent sounded East Indian to me. So also English comprehension may not have been a strong skill for him.
He sounded almost tuned out to the severity of the issue he had.
@@jasonpeterson7842 My vote was Indian as well. Yeah this one is very strange.
@@MRBLACK947 Russian apparently.
@@eerrm1 I speak with no accent so it's always interesting to hear others.
I ran a tank dry on a touch and go. My hands have never moved so fast. Very sad accident.
That sounds terrifying. Did you crash the plane?
I was on a long cross country flight and on one of my legs the controller gave me a straight in. I thought that was easy, new airport, no traffic, life is good. I refueled and noted the gallons. 22.5 gals total. I put the hose away and it donned on me, gezzz the useable is 24 gallons. YIKE's! If the controller hadn't given me a straight in or I needed to go around I would have been in the weeds. I learned a very important lesson that day. I fly with a stop watch, soon as I push that throttle forward the clock starts. I will be on the ground in 3:20 be it a runway, field or road. Fly conservatively and live to fly another day!
My dad bought a new Turbo Lance II back in 78, SN32R-7887147 and very close to the SN that just went down. I earned my commercial and instrument rating in that bird. We ended up selling her in the early 90's and found out that it (CFIT) crashed by a novice pilot in 1999. I still have a spare key, sadly. The engine/exhaust/turbo system runs real hot and needs to be watched very closely for any problems and defects.
One of my very first flying jobs involved working for a company that had 2 of these aircraft. My memory is a little fuzzy because that was almost 40 years ago, but I seem to recall that one of our birds had an extra set of tanks in the wing tips. Not all that unusual but I want to say that you had to be real careful how you managed the fuel. There was something funky about the fuel return from the fuel injection system where you could run whatever main you had selected dry but like I said that was the better part of 40 years ago.
The news is now out. The family killed was Victor Dotsenko and wife and three children. For those trying to source the accent the Dotsenko name has Ukraine and Russian roots.
Thank you for your in depth research to give us as much information as you can Juan... even though each of your crash analysis vids hurts just a little.
ATC audio was numbing, the pilot sounds like he's defeated and the outcome isn't going to be good
We maintained a Cherokee Arrow that had the auto gear extension system. There is a Pitot Tube on the side of the fuselage that actuated the extension. A June Bug got stuck in the tube and the gear would not retract in the normal configuration.
Thank you, Juan! I know exactly where this is, right behind a Costco and near a densely populated neighborhood. I grew up in West Nashville and I still live in the area 😔
The pilot was a ukranian canadian juan. Thanks for all your flight analysis. Unfortunately this one was sad.
Engine out in an urban area is not a good situation. Night after a long day made it worse. I grew up flying my uncles PA 32.
God bless the man who for some reason just knew it was all over. He missed the freeway and costco.
Thank you juan
I have been waiting on you to cover this accident. I livre in Nashville and heard about it around 8:30pm on local news. They had the interstate east lanes closed until the next day. It is so sad 2 adults and 3 children were on board the Airplane according to the news.
I landed at KJWN 20 minutes after they crashed. Had to divert to 0M5 from my IFR flight plan back to KMBT. Had some weird comm exchanges with KJWN Tower and Nash Approach (119.35) around 19:45 CDT. Didn’t realize they had crashed until I did a touch and go at KJWN and saw the wreckage off of my left wing. Words can’t describe how sad this makes me…
Edit: I shot the ILS RWY 20 and was told conflicting things by tower when landing. After landing back at KMBT, the tower had closed and I hadn’t heard anything else from other pilots on CTAF/UNICOM.
What kind of conflicting messages did you hear from tower/approach? Could tower have not cleared him for landing initially, that's why he flew past the runway?
@@usertom1967 Tower seemed flustered when I asked for the option and didn’t get back to me right away. I was on a standby for a second while on approach after giving my initial call. Afterwards, they seemed direct and blunt. They forgot about me while I was departing and I just declared I was switching to Nash App (119.35). Nash App seemed busier and I never got handed off to 118.4 which is Nash App East. Seemed like they had isolated a lot of the squawks too. Just strange and not like Nash App/KJWN Tower.
@@usertom1967 Also, I don’t know whether he was on Nash App or KJWN Tower’s frequency.
@@usertom1967 I’m not sure what happened to my initial response, BUT… KJWN Tower seemed confused when I asked for the option after my 4 mile final call for the ILS. They cleared me for the option and after executing my touch and go they forgot about me on frequency until I declared I was switching over to Nash App (119.35). Once I switched over, approach seemed to isolate a majority of the planes and I never received Nash App East (118.4) frequency change instructions which is usually what I get. Overall, everyone seemed off their usual game but only later did I find out why that was. It’s just a sad situation overall…
esp given there were 3 young kids on board.
I want to let you know I been watching your videos for some time. This video I pass on really helped a friend of mine find answers to His this friend and families in this plain crash . Very respectful. Thanks for this video.
I-40 was packed that night and the area he was in is a dense urban environment. Tons of infrastructure and street lights, power poles, bridges, buildings etc. There was zero place to make it down safely there. The grassy area he crashed in was itself very small, just large enough for some road signage. The over flying of the runway early on at 2500 feet is puzzling. That's BNA (Nashville int’l) airspace and if he had flight following on a vfr I doubt he would have been instructed to over fly the runway like that. I'd be curious to hear his earlier calls to atc on approach into the airspace. Visually John c tune is well lit, but is also in a fairly dense industrial area north and west of town. Fatigue and task overload could well be a factor here but I guess we will wait to find out. Just tragic for all involved.
If he was below 2400 msl and below he was already below the class C shelf, there's actually a good deal of places just southish of the field off the 20 runway end to put it down, wouldn't be pretty but there's fields there that we know in the event of an engine out on takeoff from 20, we are prepared to go in... I would presume he was going to land a JWN as he would've our should've been already cleared into the class D airspace based on his altitude and heading. His other options would've been the river.
Cant see them at night. Night and terrain are a fatal combination.@@bcfreedomfighterbcff167
Totally unrelated to this incident.
Sometimes I imagine Juan’s introduction of my accident on his channel. Then I double and triple check my shit before doing something dumb.
I do that often myself...
Oh man... his voice on his last transmission was heart breaking.
Juan ji, thank you so much for covering this.
Our hearfelt condolences to the bereaved and our prayers for the departed souls.
A bit offtopic but ever since the final report came out in December 2023... many of us have been wondering if you might do a follow-up on the Yeti 691 crash please.
Thank you again for all your timely, regular updates here.
Definitely not French Canadian accent. Thank you for the video!
Yes, I agree.
Arab, this is arab accent
@@sakadabarasouth asian, i believe Indian, large population in area of departure airport(Milton is just west of Brampton ON, which is a suburb of Toronto)
@@peteaplin8324 Arab accent 100%
In the 80's you could see Lada's driving around Toronto
Reports I’ve heard said the pilot stated that his engine was running rough which does not sound like a fuel starvation/exhaustion scenario. Not sure why he overflew the airport at 1800 AGL but apparently he was not on any type of instrument approach and just showed up unannounced on tower frequency. Reportedly JWN was the final destination but the pilot should have been talking to Nashville approach to get clearance through the class C airspace. The JWN tower controller asking if he was trying to land there speaks volumes. Also, I believe he was high enough over the airport to have executed a partial power 180 to a successful landing. Looking at the ADSB data it appears the engine was still developing some power at this time. A real tragedy occurred here and there are many takeaways from this accident that we can put in our toolkit to keep the Swiss cheese holes from lining up.
Left side of the aircraft badly burned, right side not badly burned could mean unsuccessful late switching from empty right tank to fuller left tank causing fuel flow interruption and not enough altitude/time to restore fuel flow. Seemingly unnecessary accident - over JWN airport with plenty of altitude easy entry to right traffic pattern to land to the South or plenty of altitude to make a 180 and land to the North. Clear skies, well- lit airport at dusk. I think the low-time fatigued pilot let the airplane get ahead of him. We based our C210 at JWN for many years.
That’s certainly a possibility as this now fatigued pilot was switching to the fuller tank as part of the approach/pre landing checklist. Also, something I’ve seen in these type accidents is that when switching tanks, the selector handle is not firmly placed into the detent of the selected fuel tank thereby causing fuel starvation. This could happen to any one of us any given flight.@@richardpeugeot9143
From the recordings Juan posted, he was talking to BNA Approach, not JWN Tower.
"..his engine was running rough which does not sound like a fuel starvation/exhaustion scenario."
Fuel starvation will cause a rough running-engine, but for how long depends on how well the engine is fed by the leftover (unusable) fuel which in turn depends on system contamination (the factors at play here are quite many considering fuel to engine-issues), airplane attitude and engine power settings. If the pilot, as a reaction to the rough running, lowered his throttle to idle, it can keep running for a few more minutes.
Interesting analysis. One would think he would have switched tanks as part of the checklist for this abnormal. Perhaps the fuel selector wasn’t positioned in the detent for the selected tank. Lot of factors working against this reportedly low time pilot, long duty day and night flying in a piston single bring among them. Thanks for your insight!@@MrGyngve
Thankyou so much Juan for your analysis. My condolences to all my fellow Canadians that were onboard.
Family of 5 that apparently immigrated to Canada from Ukraine. Terrible loss.
Poor guy sounded tired and resigned to his fate. What an absolutely terrifying feeling to know that your life is moments away from ending. Rest in peace to the pilot and the lost souls aboard that aircraft. God bless the pilot who interjected over the open channel to “keep flying that airplane.” That’s really all you can do in that situation and hope for the best.
I am bawling…”keep flying that airplane”…whoa
"Keep flying that airplane", man that hit hard, never give up!
Chilling
On fuel management for new pilots in Foreflight you can set the timer up in loop countdown mode. At the bottom of each loop it will give a pop-up message. I set mine up for 30 minutes so in case I have to skip one I never go over an hour. In Foreflight in my checklists I added a step to start the timer during pre-flight. Works like a charm.
Thanks Juan for the update on this terrible accident. Never been into John Tune before, but we fly near it regularly.
That a inexperienced pilot would load his family into a small plane is just insane.
At NIGHT!
Who in the hell gets to claim copyright on a DOT video? That should either be public record or not accessible at all.
It does seem that taxpayer dollars paid for it already. What is the world becoming?
Don't answer that.
This is so sad! Thank you Juan First person I turned to, to try an understand this tragic accident!
Thanks Jaun. As always more questions than answers but I suspect night will be a factor. I’d like to hear from some locals but being on the outskirts of Nashville I wouldn’t be surprised if the airport is hard to pick up at night. That could explain flying directly over the runway. Hearing the full audio could be telling. Given the flight path one might think he busted the Delta and that would have prompted a call from the tower.
Does not sound like the french canadian accent. Sounds more like eastern europe accent to me.
Based on hearing only a few words from the pilot, I'd say the guy's native language is not english, but he is aeronautically fluent in english.
@@ZenvoST1Fire Possibly Arabic. The aircraft seems to be linked to a physiotherapic building Altum Health, in Vaughan Ontario. Aircraft owner is 1000543578 Ontario Inc 80707 Dufferin St Vaughan On. Canada, Wasn't able to find who the owner of the aircraft was.
The accent is east Indian. Where I live there many east Indians here.
Negative, although he was an immigrant to Canada he and his family are as white as white can be. Probably Eastern European.
He was from Ukraine.
Thank YOU Sir!
I've never flown one, but friends I know who have, have told me it takes 2000 feet to get an engine running again after running a tank dry
Sounds like the one tank ran dry and the other was full and he did not change over and the engine died. And so they all did too. Tragic!
It seems to me that I am listening to you describe a new accident almost every day - what is happening out there...
Too many people with too much money is my guess. Any John Doe can buy a plane these days. And of course they all know how to fly expertly as they have play video games of flying.
So Sad . . Thanks Juan . . I Live Near Milton . .
Audio is A+. Thanks!
Never fly at night on a single engine.
Going to add a couple of random observations. Comments seem to be unnecessarily focused on ethnicity by some. What is your point? A low time pilot? Yes, that may be relevant. Fatigue, yes... Arab, Canadian, French ?... no relevance at all.
Second, some advice maybe for newish pilots learning from this horrible tragedy: Single engine flight in the dark is so much more dangerous. We all learn to "pick a spot... and set up for an emergency landing". In the day. Not at night. Jokes about turning off the lights if you don't like what you see are stale and pointless. Get there itis... is real. You need to learn to fight the compulsion. Get your kids and wife to a hotel before dark. Learn to switch tanks properly and in time. Learn to fly in ATC environments BEFORE you take the family flying.
Anyway, Juan... this is such a sad one. Appreciate your quick creation of prelim data. It will no doubt give someone, somewhere some things to think about, and save a life or two.
God rest their souls....
Thank you Juan. Very sad.
NTSB is getting caught up!? That seems like some good news.
I can’t even take kids on a drive for a couple hours without pulling over regularly and usually with little more than a minute’s notice. Mind boggling.
Thanks Juan for so much clarification from the mainstream media's over-extension of the limited data. - Bob (Milton, Ontario Canada)
hi Juan, the pilot's accent was not french canadian,there are many imigrants around the Toronto area
I believe the aircraft departed CNC3 which is Brampton Airport, a small municipal airport serving the Toronto, Canada area with very little French Canadian presence in the area. FYI The airport is quite busy with hangars full of general aviation aircraft.
I don't want to be an armchair pilot however looking at the post crash picture, the lack of fire damage on the Right wing could lead me to think that fuel management could be a factor?
I'm by no means an expert but my wife is from Quebec and his accent doesn't sound quite French Canadian to me.
That’s not any kind of native Canadian accent. I think it’s Eastern European.
I’m near Brampton. All kinds of immigrants come here (a good thing). He could be from anywhere.
I'd guess Spanish background, sounds a lot like an Argentinian colleague of mine. Definitely not French Canadian and doesn't seem Eastern European to me either.
Most likely Indian or South Asian to be more accurate.
@@lebojay brangeldash as my buddy on ps3 tells me.. and he is about 40 ish I make fun of that bridge they close weekly cause of winds.... lol lol
Yea this one is a tough one knowing there were children aboard - interesting Juan to hear you focus more towards the fuel supply procedures - thank you as always and cheers
That, and hearing his voice when he said he wasn't going to make it. He thought he was doomed
I live about 2mi from the accident site...passed on a cross street (Charlotte Pk) about 15mins later and saw te emergency response...figured it was a car wreck. Topography is tough in that area - high density of commercial property and homes, major highway and scattered low hills. It's amazing that he hit that tiny grass patch and not I-40 or Costco. J C Tune might be hard to find for a tired pilot at night.
This is my home area and home airport, scary stuff when it hits this close. RIP to all onboard
Single engine at night in a plane with the glide slope of a brick, plus heavily loaded? Seems like very risky flight.
Agreed. I would never enter a fully loaded single engine plane, and most certainly not for a flight that would partially be at night. A Dash-8 with two professional pilots is my minimum.
My rules:
Single engine: okay.
Single engine at night: for a short time to complete a flight.
Single engine at night with family: never.
I fly a similar aircraft, Cherokee 6. Not any more risk than any other single engine. Multi engine has its own set of challenges. Train to always stay well ahead of the airplane. GUMPS with emphasis on the fullest tank prior to approach or traffic pattern. Not making assumptions here, just stating what I believe you need to do to stay safe
agreed
only way im in a SE at night is with a parachute or a turbine @@RetroracerDB1
@@yehuda.r Parachute, eh?🧐
Hearing he had his 3 children on board is heartbreaking. 😢
This is a tough one. They were local and hangar neighbours with my buddy Blake's PA-32 that I fly
What nationality were they?
They out of Brampton or Burlington? I thought Brampton, but I could see people not familiar saying Milton for a flight out of CZBA
@@Neil_ They departed Brampton - The recent track log seems to start at Milton (that is a town with no airport) - maybe that's where the ADS-B started working?
@@FlightChops Roger.. I know the area. Based out of CYFD myself. Thanks.
@@FlightChopsHey, Burlington Airpark, CZBA, is my home airport, and just a couple miles south of Milton.
Good, succinct, factual reporting as always Juan . My heart goes out the families, and to the ATC, who did all he could to get the aircraft on the ground safely. ❤
Ouch... another sad one.
Thanks Juan.
Thank you Juan.
I flew the Cherokee when i was a new pilot. I mistimed the tank switching and ended up landing with a 1/4 full tank and the other tank was iver 1/2 full. Lucky for me, it was day time, and it was a short xc trip
Definitely heard resignation in his voice more than everything else. ATC’s efforts were admirable….
Thank you Juan….. 🙏🏽
This is why I always keep my auto gear extension override on. It's in my pre-takeoff checklist and I check it at every flight. Uncommanded gear extension should never be acceptable and it's shameful that Piper ever shipped this.
Such a tragedy. The Metropolitan Nashville Police Department confirmed the victims as Victor Dotsenko, 43, his wife Rimma, 39, and their three children, David, 12, Adam, 10, and Emma, 7.
RIP Godspeed loved ones
The “my engine stopped” sounded like someone who really doesn’t understand their aircraft and steps to take in an emergency. It just feels like someone who never considered it to be a possibility
ESL
Gotta wait for the details but the factors that jump off the page of Juan’s initial summary were - long day, missed approach, dry starboard tank (based on lack of post crash fire). Thanks for your ongoing journalistic integrity.
If it's a DOT clip, don't we as citizens basically own it? How can it be copyrighted?
Exactly.
It will be in RUclips's automatic content ID system, regardless of the ACTUAL copyright status.
Then the citizens and the Government of Tennessee will be able to take this to court.
@@usafveteranandaproudlibera1658that's well after the damage has been done tho... it's been a problem in this country for a while.. not just with RUclips
They buy it...$$$$ Storyful.
I live in Nashville and know the exact area. It's extremely hilly and wooded out west of Nashville. I can't imagine many places to set down other than an airport or the highway, and as the video showed, traffic was very heavy at the time.
I was unaware that they overflew the runway. Sad. Outstanding coverage as usual.
That’s tough to listen to he realised there was nowhere to go , RIP and condolences to the families involved
That initial flash could have been a tail or prop strike on the interstate before ending up on the berm. Another camera on the interstate and closer to the crash site shows the flash of light on the interstate as the image of the plane streaks across the view of that camera.
Man, I had no idea how common/frequent general aviation accidents occur before I started following your channel, Juan. I'd fly around all damn day with you on a triple 7, but nobody could pay me enough money to go up in a little single engine prop plane, lol.
Does the NTSB have a huge backlog of investigations to catch up on? I'm used to hearing about estimates of like 24-30 months usually.
There are usually multiple GA accidents daily in the US
The real trouble with flying small, single engine aircraft, is not the airplane itself, but the pilot’s lack of respect and judgment skills.
"Breaking out the data per mile puts the accident rate of private aviation at one-sixth the accident rate in automobiles, according to the AOPA."
That includes all GA. Part 91 is about 6 times the rate of automobiles. Most of it caused by stacking risk factors, fuel, weather or low altitude manuvering. just like this guy who decided to fly at night over unforgiving inhospitable terrain.@@bcfreedomfighterbcff167
@@bcfreedomfighterbcff167 ya, find it funny how “flapjacks” who may smoke tobacco, drive automobiles, ride motorcycles, say they’d never get in a small plane, when the activities they partake in daily are far more dangerous.
Hey Brownie, any advice on editing software for YT? I've had the most difficult time finding someone to help me, so I've decided to do it on my own. Thx for your help!
7:15 I will never understand why some planes don't have BOTH on the tank selector.
It's a poor fuel system design by Piper that was not changed over the years and never updated, probably because of certification costs.
Cirrus is the same way. Although the G7 had an auto switched which is kinda weird
High wing aircraft will gravity feed fuel and typically have a "both" setting on the fuel selector. Low wing aircraft typically have an engine driven fuel pump plus an electric secondary pump. This is because if one tank runs dry on a hypothetical "both" setting the pump may cavitate, drawing air and not fuel. Always keeping one fuel line path filled with fuel through having only "left / right" selections prevents this from happening.
The Rockwell Commander 114 is a low wing with a "both" setting, but I don't know the fuel system on that one well enough to offer an explanation.
Thanks so much for your videos! I really appreciate your work. Sorry, not in a financial position to support you on patreon. I hope you keep up the great content!
Personal mins my friend. When you have kids on board family on board your personal mins should be higher because of the added pressure. Don’t fly at night. Take risk assessment.
Looks like a busy interstate… unfortunate. Condolences to all affected