Why Corruption is China's Secret Weapon
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- Опубликовано: 17 окт 2024
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A huge part of this video is based on Yuen Yuen Ang’s great book “China's Gilded Age: The Paradox of Economic Boom and Vast Corruption”. If you enjoyed this video, I recommend reading the full book: www.amazon.com... (not sponsored or an affiliate link)
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This is some kind of retarded propaganda
@@cyrusthegreat7030 οπ
any life in China?
Thank you but I use SponsorBlock to remove any kind of annoyance from videos I watch.
The high salary - low corruption theory is completely incorrect if you look at Brazil. Here, politicians make from 10 to 100 times the national average and we’ve got some of the nastiest corruption scandals ever, in every single branch of the public sector you can think of.
High salary - low corruption with accountability. Singapore manage to do that coz it grooms its leaders from young and any corruption scandal means the death of your career anywhere in Singapore. Basically, forced to resign and legal trouble. A lot of corrupt politicians in the early days of Singapore either committed suicide or forced into exile. This sets a precedent to any civil servants that repercussions of corruption are extremely severe.
@@pingdragonify To an extent, Singapore is not a real country, just a middle-size city, the mechnism works in singapore would not work in most countries.
@@taozhang4223 Several million people are large enough for a country. Many European countries do not have ten million people...
Big Carrot needs Big Stick
@@pingdragonify yeah but government spending accounts for 15% of gdp which means 85% of gdp stays in the private sector less government regulations and less taxation is key
Hi guys - I've seen a lot of pushback against the graph trend line at 1:52. It's taken directly from a book we read called "China's Gilded Age" by a professor of economics named Yuen Yuen Ang. My mistake was to emphasize the trend line, when the relevant data is how much of an outlier China is compared to every other country. I shouldn't have shown the trend line here when it wasn't directly relevant. I encourage anyone still doubtful to check out the book (it really is good) for the full methodology, or even just check out some of Yuen Yuen Ang's talks online where she explains her research with much more context. -Evan
How much does the World Economic Forum pay you to shill and make these videos?
Who cares about the trend line. Everyone with a brain understood that it's a blunder, so there's no harm done. This wasn't your most convincing video, but I love the channel and hope you keep up the good work.
In Russia there is a form of corruption called "blat" which is similar to the win win-corruption you focus on in this video. During the Soviet planned economy times, blat was one of the main ways to circumvent the official distribution of resources. Even though being an illegal way to exchange goods and services, it made the "planned" economy a bit more flexible. Maybe worth looking into that one!
You have no qualifcations in Chinese or Chinese studies either.
@@dann5480 you have to be some conscpiracy no-lifer to even have the WEF enter your mind at any point in your life
@@john_smith_john "conspiracy no-lifer" LMAO you must be an American.
There was a full length interview episode on Freakonomics podcast of Yuen Yuen Ang that I heard last week that really dives much more into the different types of corruption and China's was one of the major studies that is summarized in this video. Very informative if you want to dive more into this topic.
Thank you!
Great recommendation!
Same!
Yeah, I thought this video was inspired by that episode.
While some of what she says is true, she's definitely a CCP mouthpiece. Being a party member is pretty common; most of my educated/rich friends in China are members of the communist party.
China's bureaucracy is something to marvel at. Outside it looks like a highly centralized system, with the premier having absolute power but inside it looks a lot more like a cartel with independent departments rivaling each other.
That sounds a lot like feudalism too really, or absolute power in dictatorships also works similarly in terms of 'apparent absolute power' when they are really bribing all of the right underlings to stay in power.
sounds like working for microsoft.
It works basically identical to imperial China. There's an emperor that rules over everyone, but sometimes the emperor is powerless, there are officials fighting for favours, factions formed within the council, etc.
No, actually this is pretty typical of dictatorships. The leader does act like he has full control over everyhing, but in reality a lot of daily life is quite chaotic, with every public official acting like some mini-dictator in their own right and you depending on their personal feelings more than the law.
This actually sounds like a polycratic system rather than an autocratic system. The nazis had a similar polycratic system were all branches of governments and departments rivalled each over all the time. Of course Hitler was the final decision maker at the end though.
The graph at around 1:45 really does not demonstrate any kind of trend you can draw conclusions from. The amount of spread (range) on that X-axis is too little to support the trend line drawn.. You can probably get a better demonstration if you'd pick a random x-variable such as 'amount of rainfall, mm' or 'number of goats'. That's to say, the data doesn't support the premise being made.
It is fine to speculate and to have hypothesis, reasons and such- but to misconstrue a trend when the data doesn't support one.. ah. Otherwise, seems like a good video.
I was about to comment the same thing, I've never seen a worse "trend line" before
That was a shockingly bad plot. I bet the r^2 was essentially 0. And also, they should have used GDP on y axis (dependent) and CPI on x axis (explanatory). And making the units decrease on y axis is confusing.
exactly and from what i understood is that 0 is most corrupt? so there are still quite a few countries who are plenty more corrupt than some countries with larger gdp change. the "gdp change" doesn't even mean it is an improvement lol
unfortunately this is the standard level of quality-assurance you can expect from these "China Bad, No Nuance" channels
Exactly right. I was so stunned that I paused the video to write a comment, but I see that you've already done so. Very strange that nobody in the production team for this thing would have noticed that the script and the graphic don't match up at all. Interestingly, this tells us something about the production process for these videos: assuming that they're made by a team of people and are not a one-man labor of love, the team in question is either (a) too stupid to notice obvious errors or (b) so afraid of their boss that they won't point out said errors. The same dichotomy can be used to think about the endless series of CCP fiascoes that we see, week after week, playing out in China.
9:30
- "All corruption is bad. But bad to who, when and how."
- Hu, Wen and Hao: *visibly angered"
Nice
XD
I really like most of your videos and you often bring original and good points but be careful on this one. It feels like your whole video relies on the graph shown at 1:45 but this graph actually doesnt tell us anything. First because it uses the Absolute change in GDP which doesnt mean a thing when we want to compare every country together for that specific analysis and also this is really not significant as a trend. It could as well only be noise. I recreated the graph with the relative change instead of the absolute one and there's not much here either. I don't usually care that much about those types of mistakes as I do not expect every youtubers to be Experts in statistics but since this the main "reason" of the video is to prove that China goes against the trend (while there is actually no trend), I felt like you had to be aware of that so that you become more careful in your next videos
Otherwise I really enjoy your content, keep it flowing!
What you described is basically how China operated for two thousand years. Public servants have almost always been paid less and given other privilege compensations. It has been this way for many dynasties, it is just that the current government does a better job at maintaining positive feedback.
It’s called Lobbying in the west
So it’s legal
Cheers from west Africa
🦅
Holy shit no brother, my wife father also public servant holy hell he got 8000rmb salary and government pay his insurance and give him 3000rmb in card only use if he go to hospital. When he retired he Will get 8000rmb monthly. He is not even managers or high position
Interesting idea. Might help to explain the cycle China seems to be caught in of corruption leads to dynasty downfall leads to a brand new dynasty focused against corruption leads eventually to corruption in order to manage such a large country.
@@Silverhawk100 They cycles are getting shorter and shorter....
Isn't public servant just a normal working class job?
Not to mention China is 5 times cheaper than USA, using dollar to compare the life quality of two completely different economy and country is a really unequal comparison
I mean a phone made in China bought in China will be much cheaper than a phone made in China bought in the US
Regarding the statement at 12:16 about "millions of officials using public funds to play blackjack in Macau": While the general spirit of the statement is correct, if this guy really knew anything about Chinese people, he'd know that the kind of official who's going to Macau to gamble away public funds is going to be playing baccarat.
It's not like his audience knows what baccarat is.
@@youtubesucksbutts what’s that
lol, you know since 2015, Macau businesspeople actually worried that mainland's anti-corruption agency has stopped that from happening so much that they are worried their income will drop.
ok boomer
Very informative. I'm a civil servant from the Philippines and though my salary isn't as massive, it is at least 20% higher than the minimum wage from the private sector. On my level just being a clerk, there's hardly any corruption (unless you're stealing office supplies.) But when you get to like chief of office levels, who already have significantly higher salaries, that's where I see the corruption come in. Make no mistake, at my level, I know people that handle funds and supply distribution. They can make funds and supplies disappear if they want and no one would notice but they never do. The higher ups, though, they got there because they want to siphon tax payers money for themselves. Sometimes I just ask, what are they going to do with all that money? They already have so much. Aren't their salaries enough?
Wow, as an individual that aspires to work in government, that sucks. By the way, pwede bang magtanong? Paano po ba makakakuha ng posisyon sa gobyerno, kase nais ko po sanang magtrabaho sa gobyerno, kahit nasa mababang posisyon man lang, Salamat po.
@@rickv9180 Mag apply ka muna ng csc eligibility. Every year lagi may vacancy sa gov dahil marami nag reretire. Pero kailangan csc certified ka para mag apply. Yung test sa csc every year din yun. Ewan ko lang ngayon dahil may covid kung ano na scheduling nun pero 3 years ago may test sila every year.
Certain jobs and positions naturally draw in certain people.
You need a certain amount of greed and lack of insight of your own desire to go after those positions. For us normal people the stress and responsibility is not worth it
Greed is endless. When you get some, you start to want more.
After they're died it might be burn with them lol wishful thinking 😅 guess who will have them, the relatives..
Been watching your channel for many years. Having studied China, you make great points. I think something that gets missed in the discussion is how unique China''s system is in how it functions. Not many would care to understand how land managemenet bureaus can basically pay for their staff's rent as a form of compensation, provided enough tax is retained. The US civil servants meanwhile don't get paid very well in DC, but private sector firms that deal with the government will hound them with salaries upwards of 4x what they made on the inside, often with less benefits overall but the salray is enticing. Quite the difference, imo.
Covered around 10:40
@@Justgoodvids not really
You know that reminds me, this doesn’t get talked about much either. The Chinese government owns ALL the land in China. All the “personal” land is basically leased from the government. It’s a massive source of income for the government. However, there is a special case for farmers that can own their personal farmland that they’ve had since before the PRC took over China and they get this special farmer ID(?) that’s different from the normal ID most Chinese receive and the difference is basically proof that they own the land they have. Oh and only one farmer ID is issues per the land that farmer owns. Like say you own a piece of land, you get a farmer ID but your family won’t and when you pass away, whomever you want to receive the land gets their ID “upgraded” to farmer ID (typically the eldest son).
This WAS the way China worked before Xi Jing Ping came to power. The direction of the party has now in the past 5 years headed towards a more traditional communist regime. Hence why polymatter could only use data from 2015 and before. China is now headed for a great collpase especially after the pandemic, with significant wages decline across almost all sectors. Housing is now stagant meaning that local governments who rely upon land sales to generate their taxes are now effectively broke and many has not paid any salary since december 2021. There are many many more indications, but please keep in mind that this polymatter video is accurate ONLY for years up and until maybe 2016 and does not reflect the current state China is in. The past 5 years (especially since pandemic) is a whole different story.
@@inthelight4671 😆😂Lmao Stop dude Let me guess Gordan chen Fake if
"He who wouldn't steal from the state, is he who deprives his family."
- A common saying in Eastern Europe during the Soviet era.
Gross
@@hugoclarke3284 Oh look, an idealist!
Literally every single post-socialist or currently socialist country has this exact mindset.
Could very well define Latinamerica
@@lordumas literally. I get both points
1:47 the X-axis might be a tad broken
Interesting theory, and I'm not against it. But some of the data need double check or clarification. For example, "2015, 2% population paid any personal income tax". Personal income tax should be salary/wage income not overall personal income tax if you dig deep enough. Also public servants' income = basic wage + official allowance + unofficial compensation. official allowance > basic wage can be true based on position and location of the city, and these two are big parts. Unofficial compensation on the other hand is only minor benefit.
Would depend on the 'unofficial compensation' no? Non-monetary 'unofficial compensation' could be far more valuable than basic wage and official allowance. The video didn't mention in-party fighting and throwing people under the bus for corruption scandals either.
Also worth noting that's all Citizens not public servants which that formula doesn't apply to
Also, Xi really changed a lot of those. The perks now are a lot less than what they were previously.
@@ruekurei88 ,
Which is where the per day number of corruption cases comes from, the infighting. The entire point of this video was to highlight how official sourced corruption is the carrot and the stick both. You are required to take the bribes offered by everyone, especially your boss, just to survive. This means your bosses know you have done so, and their bosses know you have done so... everyone is quiet about it, as long as you stay in line.
@@ruekurei88 p
Access money corruption can work for a while and can create huge growth like we see now in China, but it highly encourages monopolies so eventually there's no competition (because all of the access has been bought up). Then the economy no longer expands.
China doesn't have that problem Alibaba and Tencent gets broken up like Styrofoam while Google and Amazon in America have much more political power.
The only monopoly China has and will ever have is the government which comes with its own pros and cons.
we see this in the tech sector in China now. Although they are buying start ups. It will be interesting to see if this really plays out that way. Currently is seems that it is restricted access the will limit the tech sector rather than their lack of competition. The monopoly only resulted in shareholder pressure to find other areas to expand into rather than a halt on expansion. Like their expansion into the so called Xiachen markets. {eye roll}
@@sophisticatedthumb5364 Tech monopolies are DEFINITELY an issue in the US. It's disgusting.
@@calebamore its not just tech monopolies. There's high degrees of corporate consolidation everywhere. Its a real problem since inefficiencies just build up over time
@@calebamore Pharma monopolies in US are stronger than tech monopolies because of involvement of patents of all kinds.
your videos are so pleasing, the animations, the drawings and graphs it’s all perfect. your content is amazing and one of my favourite accounts on the platform !!!
Do you wanna help rebuild the Persian empire? Read my nam*
Yeah! As a geopolitical youtuber myself I agree POLYMATTER is an amazing channel but he should cover a more vast variety of topics.
Video is blocked like it's being censored can hear the audio
The graph on this one is wrong tho. That 'trend line' is really no trend at all, as several comments have already pointed out.
Agreed on all except graphs. They're absolutely horrendous. Basically breaks every rule there is in making a good graph. Moreover he completely makes up trends as evidenced in this video
Bureaucrats and civil servants are extremely wealthy everywhere in Asia with a notable exception of Japan. In Japan, it used to be the case in the high growth era but the economic downturn means all businesses are offshoring. Perks and corrupt compensations for Japanese civil servants are quite low. As a result, many Japanese public employees of all tiers have been engaging in fraud as they can no longer receive tributes from businesses. Only lucky ones, who are overseas bureaucrats in China and Vietnam, earn a lot of money as Japanese executives from the practice of akumadari.
Having just taken the AP comparative politics test and the AP statistics test I’ve had to look at a lot of data and find trends in it but I have 0 clue how you find that trend line from your graph at 1:46
Same, I found it extremely weird. Doesn't seem like their are enough datapoints through the X-axis to justify that trendline. The data points are mostly narrowly distributed between 0-2. Maybe the line is correct, but the visuals are really off.
oh no why remind me i have been suppressing this memory
RIGHT! Didn't even want to watch after that. Set the stage for a confirmation bias-based argument
probably just used excel, its a completely useless line as it doesn't describe or show anything that the data points haven't already
It’s a regression line and perfectly normal
Serious problem at #2:00 because *there is no trend line*. Nothing about this data cluster shows any kind of obvious correlation. Sure, you can pretend there should be one, and run the numbers, or PCE, or SVM, or any other classifier, but this is a text book example of a data set where trying to force a trend means you're trying to make the data tell your story, instead of the telling the data's story.
This channel has terrible bais.
And yet, the HIGHEST employment ideal in China is not to be in private business, but to be state administrative employee (but not a soldier) - such is the safety, perks, immunity, and perception.
That's actually not quite the case. Everyone wants to work in the private sector. They get paid way, way, WAY better, have more freedoms (can travel freely -- yes, there are travel restrictions for people who work for the State. Hell, even 3rd party contractors have to submit to this too). The reason why a lot of people might think a government job is the most desired is because of high unemployment. It's too competitive and there simply isn't enough jobs to go around for a country of 1.4 billion people. The government job becomes the ideal security net not because they grew up dreaming of such a job since they were a kid, but because it's just way too hard to get a job for a lot of people. No one goes through the harsh and expensive education process of China, from K-12 + College + years of paying for after school and weekend tutoring and etc., (and you all who lived in China know this), there ON WAY all of those students think: "Man, when I get done with all this, I'm going to get a government job." So ask yourself, is being a State employee really the ideal or most desired position in China? Or is it just a "no better choice" last resort backup insurance plan. Another thing you should know is, government jobs are mostly acquired through connections and under-the-table deals. Every Chinese knows that. The turnover rate for any government position is simply too low. My point is, your comment implies there are a lot of options and choices, when in reality, there isn't. I know a lot of college graduates and seasoned professionals who simply can't get good jobs in China, and some haven't worked for years. The "Government Job" is more like... the poor joining the military because it pays, puts food on the table and a roof over your head -- but much worst because not everyone can get a government job either. Those jobs are very, VERY low paying. If given a REAL CHOICE. If an average Chinese citizen had 2, 3 or 5 job offers and one of them was a government position, I bet 9/10 will choose a private company. People I know who are in state job are always trying to get out because they are just in it until they find something better. What' worse is, in China, if you're over 30 and STILL in a government job, then you might as well stay there because private sectors look down on candidates in their 30's if they don't have a super impressive resume. Housing in China ain't exactly cheap either. You REALLY think if given a choice people want a government job? Nah man. It's not ideal at all; it's just a "deal with it" and suck it up situation for a lot of people.
It really depends nowadays since the perks are being shrunk every year due to local governments tight on budget.
Your family is well-off, you are satisfied with it, you want loads of free time, yet you still want to do some stuff? Work as a state employee in your home town.
You want “stability” and not to worry about unemployment? Work as a state employee.
All you need is money since you REALLY want to buy an apartment on your own, build a McMansion in your rural hometown, raise your kids, or buy a BMW? Go work in the private sector. Even blue collar jobs get paid well despite long work hours.
jelouse and cant admit is the real reasone for you country has tone of homless,bagger,drugabys,killing on street and raping women and rasicm...dont talk like you know chaina if you naver go there....you cant even find homless in chaina..is that what corupt country look like.?and all the high leader not even close comfare to you leader or buisness man in us...even a teacher has more wealty then xie..so if they mass corupt why they still not the wealty person in the world??
@@telesophy When you say a lot of people, you mean the very minor source of information you could actually reach out to?
Goes back to the imperial mandarin says
Love your videos PolyMatter, but the graph at 1:49 is NOT convincing. I would hardly call that a decisive trend.
Not much of a trend, just an outlier.
China is such an incredibly fascinating country. Almost every part of it, especially today, is so different from the West, it's amazing. And the fact that it also happens to be the most populous nation on Earth only intensifies the importance of studying and understanding China. There are so many stories to be learned from here.
Just wish it was a democracy
@@DyslexicMitochondria your username made me click on ur profile. Ur channeI is a hidden gem broo
shame the CCP and china is actually a fascist technocracy. without any real communist priniciples anymore, and ethnic cleansing. we've ended up with a more pragmatic nazi germany with a billion people willing to be brainwashed. hopefully one day, we'll figure out how that happens.
Huh? Go and collect your 50c, you earned it. 🤣
Soon to be 2nd most populous country.
Population decline in China will hit them HARD. SO HARD HAHA
One of the earlier comments mentioned that this is how China has been operating in the last 2,000 years. Actually, it is quite true. During the Ming and Qing dynasties, every court appointed official was given a relatively modest salary. However, he is also expected to conduct his work using this salary (e.g. pay the salaries of public servants under him, carry out his day-to-day administrative duties, etc). As such, the salary is never enough. As a result, corruption occurs. It should be noted that by the Late Qing dynasty, there were even guidelines on corruption (陋规 or ugly rules) that were widely practiced (i e. how much money to take for what type of favours).
Not all corruption was due to personal greed. There are also well known cases of corruption for good reasons. If I recall correctly, one member of the royalty, Prince Zaize, was overseeing reforms but as the court did not have enough money, he had to raise his own. So he had a rule where any court official who needs to meet him has to pay a bribe. If you don't pay, you don't get to meet him and will not be able to fulfill your administrative duties. But Prince Zaize would take every cent that was given to him and put it into the imperial coffers so that he can carry out his reforms.
Another well know case is Zeng Guofan. One of his subordinates wrote in his diary that he would only take 20 taels of silver even though he is entitled to take hundreds of thousands of taels. Zeng just took the extra that he needed for his family to get by.
Surely you are not suggesting that modern day Chinese civil servants are expected to cover work expenses? Though propaganda will often sing their selfless praise. Most civil positions are decently paid. One interesting area is teachers, who are held in high esteem and are often offered bribes by parents hoping to get their children ahead in private tutoring etc, unlike say in the US, where primary/secondary teachers are underpaid and overworked, often paying for supplies out of pocket.
good comment. i wouldn't say the last 2,000 years though, more like the last 700. still its a very long time, to shape the identity of a nation.
I mean, this is just universal. Like businesses, if they really care about production, should not be paying fixed salaries, but instead salaries that heavily weight towards evaluation which determines bonus. This is the point of middle managers, not lounging around and sending useless emails and hanging kindergarten-esque motivational quotes on the walls.
Polymatter: This incredible economic growth was made possible by...
Me: Skillshare?
Polymatter: millions of official
Me: oh...
What...lol
@@YChess expected a sponsorship segue, only it wasn't
exploit the peasant workers. That's the only secret.
“Paralyzed against their will by an endless cycle of incompetence and corruption,” is a succinct and, so far, historically accurate description of the Philippines.
You can not make any reasonable trend claims based on the data shown at 1:44, much less project that trend across the range shown in that x-axis
Excel is going to excel at something
Yea I looked at that and was fully baffled. A lot of the data points just seem incomplete as well, as if they weren't meant to have data on the x attribute.
Not only that but he assumed causation on a few other points aswell.... overtime thus guys videos get worse or maybe I'm less retarded now
1:43 uhh is there an issue with the graph? The dots don't show that trend line at all.
polymatter often misrepresent data to fit his narrative
"Paradoxically, this incredible economic growth was made possible by--"
me: skillshare
"--millions of officials..."
Oh
"Those who harm corporate interests are sinners" sounds like a line from a really cringeworthy dystopian sci-fi flick.
The fact that people watch videos on a heavily regulated media platform and undoubtably take it as true is the ultimate cringeworthy dystopian sci-fi flick.
Muse lyrics
Seems to me it is in force in every capitalist country - which is why environmentalists go to jail/get censored/blocked/lobbied against for protesting about water theft, pollution, overfishing, agrotoxins, etc.
One could make the case that politicians grossly overpaying themselves is corruption in itself, I say this as a Singaporean.
formalize or legalize corruption, not necessarily Singapore, but any country that allows campaign finance
that trend line for CPI against GDP is terrible, there are many things to say against china, but that doesn’t make it alright to misrepresent data
1:41 there is no trend on those data points, what the hell?
polymatter often misrepresent data to fit his narrative
Bit worried about the graph at 1:59... On the available data you should absolutely not be projecting across the X axis like that. It makes it look like you haven't study stats at all
I am from Shanghai and I gotta say this guy explains this so well.
Bullshit!
@@ChrisJu3 chill bruh
As a Chinese, I am not sure whether the 80 bucks a month is a reliable number. Personally speaking, this number might be a lot higher these days. And public employees, as far as I know, get various allowance monthly or yearly. For example, meal allowance, or transportation allowance or accomodation etc. Also, just put forward one example. The cafeteria in public units(事业单位) is heavily subsidized so the expense for meal is much lower than in the outside market. For example, a typical lunch with 3 dishes might just cost under 10 RMB or 1.5 USD. Things are much complicated in reality, but you definitely point out sth.
I'll be honest. This was quite good. As an Indian I see quite a lot of parallels.
Lol
Though Id still prefer low corruption.
I'm from a Latin American country, and I see a lot of parallels as well. Guess that being not corrupted is rather the exception, not the rule.
Outcome is very different
Odd name for an Indian.
Not really because in India when corrupt officials take money from infrastructure projects the project just halts and stops progress but in China the corrupt official makes sure the project will be constructed on time.
This was great, I definitely want to check that book out now. Thanks for the informative vid Polymatter! Keep it up! God bless you
you will not regret that. Also look for a podcast on the Freakonmics network under the series People I mostly admire. Ang YuenYuen 从 m no regrets there either.
PolyMatter: Another China video?
Viewers: Yes!
Wait until you see I have a whole Nebula Original series on it…
Do you wanna help rebuild the Persian empire? Read my nam*
@@cyrusthegreat7030 This isn't Roblox.
Saying "Discord" won't get you in trouble here.
@@cakeisyummy5755 RUclips name limit
CGPGrey actually did a good video on this called Rules for Rulers and even stated that Corruption isn't inherently evil, but simply a tool used for those in power.
I remember that corruption was secret weapon that saved a state at one point, and that was Syria in 2011. because the people in power both had stakes in political surviaval of government AND most of them knew each other or were connected to each other, it was possible in those times where one doesnt know where things will go, to bypass official hierarchies (for example military or political hierarchy) and react quickly and make sure that those tasked with things did not buckle.
Also, the corruption and resource control ("free" apartments for officer) assured that army officers stayed loyal. and without officers the common soldiers can't rebel.
I disagree on your view concerning the reserved correlation between « growth » and « corruption ». In short, high growth lowers the corruption level. I believe in growing economies, typically seen in developing countries, corruption is usually accepted and tolerated. This is because legal systems of those countries are also developing along with the economy and corruption is seen as a business facilitator. It is when an economy becomes mature, and its legal system has taken its root in society then corruption is seen as unaccepted.
Take Korea in the 70-80’s and Korea today. Corruption was common, sometimes not even perceived as such and yet its economy was growing. Today Korea’s economy to is close to being mature and yet, the public don’t take kindly on corruption scandal.
In my opinion, in mature economies like the USA, corruption simply becomes more... legalized, as people learn how to mold the system to their advantage and make what they do seem unremarkable.
@@modove2842 I agree but the US has its very own approach on corruption that the rest of mature economies do not share. The US which is very specific is not to be confused with EU rule of laws.
Developed countries define corruption in convenient ways to ignore actual acts of bribery. Donations to political parties, for example. Perfectly legal corruption.
@@modove2842 well what happens in the US is that the rich do shady things in other countries so they can avoid the US laws on them.
Korean corruption is still alive and well today tho. It's just been practically institutionalized. That's why the chaebol dominate.
That trend line at 1:50 really made me lose a lot of trust in this channel... How an entire team could deem this okay is beyond me. Not to mention the terrible graph itself
for a channel that uses a lot graphs they should know better. makes me wonder how many of their other graphs were misleading.
Gift giving for favors is something that is just baked into Chinese culture that has very ancient origins. You don't give a gift without expecting something in return and you don't receive a gift without being expect to return the favor.
Being from China and educated in the US, I think this video has offered a very valuable view into how differently the Chinese systems work. Of course this system is far from perfect, and a lot of the merits of a typical democracy are missing here. But at least this video is really trying to understand how and why things are done differently here, instead of vehemently pointing a finger or vilifying this system merely on the basis that it is an 'authoritarian regime'.
A weapon, like bioweapons and shoddy construction, that can come back to haunt you.
That corruption vs growth trendline is a joke lol
That must have an abysmal R^2 value
Should be a vertical line
This guy’s obsession with China (next to wendover’s obsession with airplanes) is one of the most bizarre phenomenons on RUclips . Lol
This is nothing, China uncensored is the worst
@@warringfinger967 china uncensored is basically funded and operated by a cult called falun gong
it's because china is a bizarre phenomenon in this world
What is with the graph at 1:56, does he think we are stupid? 🤣🤣
Looks like he completely smooshed the scale of the graph, probably put it through Excel and then left it as is.
polymatter often misrepresent data to fit his narrative
Hey @PolyMatter I expect a bit more from you when it comes to the chart at 1:53. It's extremely disingenuous to say that the graph shows a negative correlation between corruption and GDP. You should know that's now how statistics work.
There are plenty of studies showing negative correlation between corruption and GDP growth…however this graph doesn’t make sense to me
Agreed. Polymatter often uses graphics that might look pretty to the average uninformed person but the conclusions he draws are mostly incorrect or flat out misinformation. Kind of pathetic that we have to call him out more than once on this.
This is the Chinese traditional governing system for thousand of years, not something new to CCP.
Throughout the history, many low/middle government positions can be "purchased", and it is expected
that those in position have to provide a pre-determined amount of contribution to central government.
The remaining is the "benefit" to be kept by these bureacrats.
It is more like a franchise system where territories are assigned. Those in position of power have
to ensure that they can squeeze out as much as possible without killing the golden goose.
14:04 The success of the Chinese economy despite rampant corruption is all well and good. But ultimately access corruption will still result in the exploitation of Chinese citizens, as the desire of corporations are placed above their needs. Its gonna be interesting what happens when China's shrinking workforce drives up the price of labour for these corporations. Will they be able to pay local governments or unions to "access" skilled workers?
Funny how communist china is actually more capitalistic than western world based on what this video describes
@@alfaseeds13 ikr
@@alfaseeds13 in this context china sounds like the most capitalistic country on earth
It's not exploitation though. China lifted its citizens off the poverty line. In the 50s, China was top 10 poorest country in the world. Now it's no. 2.
This sounds amazing for businesses and horrific for the population. The given examples like days where businesses are exempted from normal regulation oversight sound like worker, environmental, and consumer nightmares.
It's corruption that helps the GDP yes, but this video clearly ignores who it harms.
This type of corruption is pretty much common even in a developed world. Just look at Japan with their "Zaibatsu", South Korea with their "Chaebol", and the US with their "lobying system in their bureaucracy". It is a corruption driven by pragmatism instead of morals. The problem with this type of corruption is, this is going to cause the rise in power of the plutocrats and may cause a 😘bussines monopoly.
@@cakapcakep241 Ya, I'm familiar with both actually though the Zaibatsu have been largely replaced by the Keiretsu which don't have quite the iron grip.
And yes, bussiness monopolies tend to cause tragedy of the commons issues among a variety of other social problems.
This is a country that trades the lives of its people for any level of gain, so it is to be expected.
China went from top 10 poorest country in the world to no. 2. It's been good for the population.
@@elmohead The same tactics that took China out of an agrarian economy aren't the ones it needs as an advanced technological superpower
That’s not how you draw a trend line
You put out more China videos than Disney puts out Marvel movies.
@K KK They get bullied because of the authoritarianism and genocide not because they run their economy differently.
@K KK Lmao okay. That's not even remotely true. Australia, Eastern Europe, Taiwan, and Argentina were themselves colonies and still became high income countries. And there are many other examples. Besides, correlation does not equal causative.
@K KK Poland and Taiwan are both advanced economies and suffered mercilessly at the hands of colonizers but sure keep making excuses for poor countries.
I've heard some darker aspects of this sort of thing from a friend who lives in China. He told me that sometimes, a well-respected member of a rural community engages in human trafficking due to how difficult it can be for many men to get married, and usually the whole village at the very least looks the other way, and one or two government steps above the village don't know who to punish and how, because (depending on the situation, and who does it) you can't punish everyone and send the entire village to reeducation camps, so a lot of times nothing is done. That was a hard conversation for me to hear. I would encourage people interested in these topics to try and talk to someone from these countries, and just listen
A hard book to read is The Good Women of China, written by a Chinese woman. Hard, but essential.
我挺惊讶的，在这里居然有人愿意了解中国的运行方式，不过这个视频不完全正确，中国有个叫隐形福利的东西，让很多国企人员其实拿到了更好的待遇
@@JOKERXu-eg5jv sorry, I don't speak, read or write Chinese. My friend was able to speak enough English that we could communicate
@@benjamincarlson6994 No matter，I will try to translate them.I am quite surprised that there are people here who are willing to learn about China's operation way, but this video is not entirely correct. There is something called invisible welfare in China, which has actually given many state-owned enterprise personnel better treatment.
@@JOKERXu-eg5jv thank you, friend. The man I talked about in my original post was a good man. He wanted a good education, stable job, and family. Communication became difficult after a while due to censorship, but I hope that he and his parents are doing well, and that he achieves his dreams. Hearing about the darkness behind the curtains, so to speak, was very sad for me, and I hope that things change in a positive way soon
You always cover very interesting topics, highly captivating
The title of this video tells the truth. The Chinese Communist Party has been deliberately exporting Corruption to the whole world for many years..
Actually Chinese civil servants are paid relatively high wage depending where they live now. Take one of my friend as example. She made around $15000 per year and she worked at a county located in West area of China, hence relatively underdeveloped parts without Starbucks and stuff. And it is not a low wage there. And civil servants of Shenzhen or Suzhou have much more pay grade. Their wages can be high as new employees (both university graduates) of Huawei. And their wage is much higher than the ones in BYD, the electric car company.
Enlightening perspective, though.
"The exchange" is not considered as corruption for me. Everyone knows about it and is makes up the year-end awards of them... Mostly done by underdeveloped areas, since their government cannot get enough tax...
Corruption of the ones who has bigger power is the real problem. Civil servants are my friends and families and they don't make excessive money. But elites in power has the best stuff.. and treat everyone as tools. I always wonder: if Bo has great number of money, what about the others?
I am 39 years old, have been on RUclips for over a decade, watch 5+ hours of RUclips each day, and you create the most mind blowing videos I have ever seen.
Oh fuck, it's the Emperor of RUclips.
Read tge book or her podcast for more nuance/information. If objective truth is important to you...
"dime a dozen" .. haha that sarcasm always hit the spot polymatters .. well done !
Me, Mexican, also hope that my country’s corruption would translate to economical power.
No you don't want that, this economic growth comes with the suffering of a lot of people. For example, if a company wants to build a factory, but the land is too expensive, then they would bribe the official and the government would requisit some farmer's land and sell it with a very low price, leaving the farmer little compensation. Yes the factory is built and economy becomes better, but the farmer surely won't like it.
@@znco180 and you think mexico instead doesn't have this? lol
@@znco180 it is corruption of theft then. Using money to influence and commit theft
2:17 "By doing no other country has managed to do so"
Cough Cough *South Korea* Cough Cough
Yeah interestingly that south korea Corruption perception index still good despite they have huge corruption scandal couple years ago.
7:05 Problem with paying civil servants an astronomical amount is that they will continue to ask for more. This model that is spoken of is the same in Hong Kong and having lived there, I can say it's more of an 'open corruption' situation. Goverment workers have up to 2.x times that of people in the private sector, the work they do is little yet the pay is great. There is a reason why Anti-Corruption departments (ICAC) exist. Hiring talents from the market also reduces the pool available to the private sector and could put strains on the economy or the affected industry as a whole in doing so. Also it may be considered in some cases that sums that are used to fuel high governmental wages may be comparable to what is lost during actual corruption, the same sum comes out of the tax payers pocket but it is distributed among more people, that is all thats different.
"Made no mistake, all corruption is bad"
**ZOOMS INTO IKEA**
I love this! David Friedman was the first person I ever read, talking about corruption in this way.
One way to summarize it is states with low state capacity (particularly capacity to raise revenue) outsourcing the state capacity to its civil servants.
These videos are just SO GOOD
Do you wanna help rebuild the Persian empire? Read my nam*
7:26 I think for Singapore its not just salaries, but other policies and enforcement of the rule of law, ministers go to prison etc. I think "culture" enforced by Lee Kwon has something to it as well
Did you get Lee Kwon from Star Trek?
His name is Lee Kuan Yew
I love your videos. They are so informative and pleasant to watch. Keep up the good work:)
Yes! I am a fellow journalist on RUclips and the research by polymater is next level.
Dude, your mind and how you put things together...its actually insane.
Also that same transactional corruption is what has allowed ghost towns, abandoned construction, some percentage of permeation of garbage quality/counterfeit in every industry including construction.
Corruption can also be either outright coverups or when after an incident with a bunch of victims, upper classes circlejerk payments, keeping the majority of revenue to the company, while the actual people receive pennies if anything.. almost like class bias.
Position of power enables abuse, not just financial, but coverups and sadism; position of power can come not just from having a high job position, any feeling of superiority is enough: "social status", having a group on your side, physical or intellect is also just a tool, etc.
isn't that not technically corruption but an effort to inflate those "objective metrics" they need to get a promotion?
Check again on those so called ghost town, they are more mostly occupied now. And those shody stuff are created on demand by the buyer, china make what you can pay
if you look back at those "ghost town" most of them have been occupied. it's of course a ghost town during constructions time.
Exactly what I am thinking about. Corruption is more than just bribery, it is an abuse of power that's in favor of states and governments.
The graph at 1:45 is perhaps the worst possible illustration of the concept you laid out, making it harder to believe whatever follows. The chart at 5:40, which I'm assuming shows the number of China's politicians and public workers, does not at all take into account that they have x28 and x48 times the amount of people that South Korea and Texas have, New York should also be labeled as New York City.
It's the same misinformation tactic used by the West when they show China's current overall polution but not per capita or historical total. It's using data in a disingenuous way in order to trick the public into thinking a certain way.
After watching the video, I feel like it’s not all that different in the U.S. The only difference is that in the U.S, it’s legal and even encouraged. It’s called “lobbying”.
You right fam. 2 trillion wasted in Afghanistan? All part of the military budget nothing unusual there. Accountability? Well so far I haven't heard of anyone facing a firing squad for that 20 year debacle.
At least China punished 1.5million bureaucrats. While only 1 person was jailed for the '08 crash.
Having had a business in China it is extremely different. Prostitution and paying bribes for everything is not a normal business practice in the U.S. Everyone has to engage in corruption under Communism just to survive, not so in Western countries.
Lobbying is immensely limited, and is only to create laws, not modify or negate existing ones. Anything else is corruption
At very least "corruption" In china make their country progress a lot faster. Meanwhile my country, there is still a corruption but the progress is also slower.
Corruption is NEVER justifiable. Doing things the hard way, the proper way, achieves fruitful and meaningful results.
@@hugoclarke3284 That’s a noble perspective, but also unrealistic when confronted with systemic injustices.
in addition it makes their buildings fall down quicker, and their fried food taste funny
Americans?
@@milk_bath That's like saying it's too idealistic to untangle a bunch of wires in a hopeless mess. It is a problem, nothing more, nothing less. One simply needs to understand the collective factors and where to start from.
I just watched your Nebula video and I'd love it if you make it public at some point. It cleared up a lot of questions about China for me and I'd love to share it
This video remind me of CGP Grey's Rules for Rulers video. The civil servant in this video is the keys under the main keys. "Corruption is the tool of power" quotes by Grey really match with this video theme.
It’s called Lobbying in the west
So it’s legal
Cheers from west Africa
🦅
Not just lobbying. There's also Regulatory Capture: lawmakers pass regulations that benefit certain companies. Then after they leave the government, they're hired by those companies for super high salaries and benefits.
I'd almost argue that lobbying is worse. On the private side it is EVEN MORE exclusive than these pay-to-play shenanigans, and on the public side it is more liable to p- who am I kidding with this "more liable" stuff, it HAS ALREADY completely paralyzed the government's ability to take decisive action against large-scale long-term threats to national security and stability.
i learned a lot about corruption and its many forms in general in this video. However, the premise of the video of explaining how China beat corruption was not eligible.
this guy dont really understand the situation of china
Good thing the US isn’t corrupt! We just call it lobbying😇
I had to have a chuckle about your use of Singapore as an example... there's a big semantic difference between a "corruption perception index" and a corruption _reality_ index.
Higher salary alone is not enough to decrease corruption. We all know greed breeds more greed, it is never enough. There needs to be harsh punishment for those convicted of corruption and adequate enforcement.
That graph at 2:00 doesn't show the suggested trend line at all?? In fact it shows no statistical relevancy between corruption and GDP at all! Am I the only one who noticed that? Edit: I was so dumbfounded by the "TREND LINE" he slapped on top of that graph that I couldn't wait to read the comments before writing something lol. Now that I see all the other comments I'm kind of embarrassed but super happy everyone else pointed it out too. WORST CORRELATION EVER
Cost of living in China is much cheaper than other countries, so being paid less than say the US, is not really a problem.
I swear this is just pure capitalism with a different name
What are you talking about.
Do what the US does
In China the government controls the billionaire, that's why they capitalism leads to collective prosperity.
In USA billionaires control the government, that's why only rich get richer and rest of society has same purchasing power as 20 years ago...🤣
So glad I watch your comprehensive videos
Hi PolyMatter,
I am from the Philippines and our election just finished yesterday.
I want to tell you we will not be "paralyzed against our will by an endless cycle of incompetence and corruption" anymore.
That's all, Thanks
Kwim
I am from India 🇮🇳 . Polymatter is an US sponsored propaganda machinery . They want to portray all of Asia as having non foolproof systems . They tie Autocratic government in Iran 🇮🇷 with religion , Democratic government in India 🇮🇳 with slow growth , Communist China with Corruption induced growth and Philippines 🇵🇭 with incompetence. Trying hard to prove that West is all well and East is all worse .
@@s9ka972 Wow thank you, now I don't feel so bad.
@@kwimmie Philipines is a nice country . It takes time to grow , what's wrong in that . None of us colonise or loot wealth from other nations like US or British .
@@s9ka972 America never had colonies. And America certainly isn't rich from running the Philippines for a couple decades if that's what you mean.
I am so fucking glad people are calling out that awful "trendline" lol
polymatter often misrepresent data to fit his narrative
@@sleepyjoe4529 ohh too bad. That data interpreration really ruin the vids credibility in my eyes.
2:00 that graph is absolutely terrible.
You can overlay a linear regression line and call it "trend line", but it's useless if it's not perceivable.
The main change would definitely have to be to change the x-axis (change in absolute GDP). Either take log(abs GDP) or zoom into the main field for the trend line (0-4 instead of 0-12) and then only afterwards zoom out for China.
Also, it would have been more intuitive to swap x and y axis.
@@benjif2424 polymatter often misrepresent data to fit his narrative
I really love the contain of this channel. Plenty of astonishing ideas and great data storytelling
I am also looking for more sources with similar contents like this but in written format. Any suggestions?
check out Chinese platforms 8 years ago you can get similar ideas posted everywhere with a conclusion that China is a hopeless ungodly country. Now more and more Chinese people look around the world and find they actually have the most efficient and responsible government. these ideas are no longer popular and buried in silence -- we literally call people recycling these speeches tomb digger.
Do u get any source or ig twitter page
I already knew what this going to be about, having read her book, but once you open the video, you cant shut it down, it really engages with you well.
1:51 What a incredibly well fit trend line there.
It’s akin to “Permit Opium Trade” in HOI4.
Ah yes, a fellow ginger enjoyer
1:48 There is absolutely no linear correlation here though.
Love your videos
Do you wanna help rebuild the Persian empire? Read my nam*
Such an insightful video!
This basically a video summary of Yuen Yuen Ang so I would really recommend people read her book if they’re interested in more on the topic
2 main points I feel the video failed to explain:
1) Accountability - 2 government offering contract to build bridges. 1st takes so much money from the successful bidder that bidder failed to construct the bridge, that corruption is an obstacle. 2nd takes some money from the bidder but build still gets built to specifications, that corruption is just another cost of business. Bidding process can be competitive in both government, but the outcome is different cos there is a consequence for not completing the bridge.
2) Public resource transfer to private hands increases efficiency. Contract, permits and raw resource can be converted into more valuable products via private sector. This transfer is just another cost of business. As long as it is kept in check, corruption actually improve economic efficiency. Key factor in China is that she values stability. Officials knows bribery can only be successful if the underlying jobs gets done. If they hinder too much, they risk getting caught.
Every government spends money, issue is if the money spent will be able to meet its political objectives. Corruption is just how effective the translation is. If money was spent but achieve no goals, it’s high corruption. If money was spent but achieve goals, it’s Low corruption. Thing with China is even if this translation efficiency is low(aka high corruption), the market efficiency increment from public to private hands makes up for it to achieve initial goals set out.
Stability is the highest political objective in China, hence the system must work. If it does not work, someone will be brought in to replace you.
You got this very right. A lot of East Asian economic miracles were built on some healthy dose of corruption, basically your 2nd point. It accelerates the process at which public resources transfer to the private sector for completing actual work, instead of being caught in red tape (reason why Western nations with low corruption are so inefficient at doing infrastructure). This makes it very efficient to use government spending to drive GDP growth. That's how Japan, South Korea, Taiwan to name a few achieved miraculous economic growth in the 20th Century. It's not the fairest way but the fastest way to lift a developing nation out of poverty. Corruption becomes a problem when the nation no longer needs constant infrastructure projects but instead rely on domestic consumption for economic growth. At that point corruption only increases inequality and its cost becomes more of an obstacle.
Would like to hear an explanation for what happened in the GDP/CPI graph
For starters, what are they? I'm assuming GDP is in % but i have no idea what CPI is.
Did something go wrong with the x graph or is it supposed to be like that? And in what way did you extrapolate that trend line? The change in GDP increases just as much on high (low?) levels of corruption as the opposite, although more countries with high corruption seem to be stagnant in GDP I suppose. Did you look at this and felt this was an accurate portrayal of the info?
The x axis is GDP change over 2 decades (1995 - 2016) in percentage but the largest value is 1100% which make everything else really small thus they clump together like that. CPI is Corruption Perception Index which basically a corruption ranking of country. I have no idea why he choose this graph, it makes no sense.
it's a pragerU graph.
Corruption is the evil that slowly kills you
Good vid. Well presented.
I approved payment for a us subsidiary co in china in the early 2000s. we had consultants who managed our government relations because you couldn't do it without kickbacks and the constant entertainment of officials. This was done openly as normal operations in Chinese businesses. FCPAct meant we couldn't touch this but had to turn s blind eye to operate. In 2018-19 i again worked there and the entertainment part was completely gone and the kickbacks were done in secrecy that left foreigners completely out of the loop. The change was jaw dropping