The good and the bad part 2
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- Опубликовано: 9 июл 2024
- This video is a follow up to last weeks video. There were many other topics that I wanted to cover with my experience using the Hammer A3-41 jointer planer combo machine. If you haven't seen part one, check it out after this video.
#jointer #planer #woodworkingtools
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Хобби
I have the Hammer A3-41 combo machine. I moved about a year ago and the movers didn't strap my band saw down. It fell over on top of the jointer outfeed table. Luckily my insurance company took care of me and Hammer came onsite, replaced the damaged fence and got everything recalibrated. The technician told me the most common repairs on Combo jointer planers are people not locking the planer bed because the mechanism that supports it gets damaged, and not holding the start button long enough or stopping and starting the motor too quickly and it burns out the start capacitor. Moral of the story always lock the planer table and if you start your machine leave it running while you check material thickness with the calipers or go to grab the next board.
Joe, I was told the same about the capacitor, hold the button for a count of 5 and the let go. I will definitely lock my bed going forward, I am guilty of skipping that. Stay safe !
Thank you for sharing!!
Thanks and well done!
BTW folks, Jason got back to me (promptly) shortly after he got this machine. I purchased one like it. Waited over a year :( "covid delays" Finally got it last fall. Don't expect much help from Felder it takes weeks for a return call or even an email. After spending that much $ I thought they might at least follow up better. Machine is GREAT though. The silent wave cutter head leaves a surface that you would darn near put finish on, and it is quiet (relative to the Powermatic HH tools I replaced) I made a traditional style mobile base so I could move it in any direction. Hardest part was getting it on the base w/o lifting it by the bed. Next mod might be a stepper motor for height adjust. Hooked it to a "Supercell" dust collector all, works well together. Performs better than the Powermatics did in either mode. The two PMs I compare with are 8" parallelogram hh jointer, and 15hh planer. I was clinging to the PMs, but no more, they are going on the market.
Hahaha! I work in a 12'x16', roughly 200 sq ft space. I always chuckle when I hear people say "Yeah, I'd love to have multiple machines, several layout tables, etc, etc." 🤣 😂 🤣
Good video, thanks! I'll never have one of these, but it's fun to dream and interesting to hear about. 😎
Glad you found it interesting
This machine is functionally very similar to my Jet 12" Planer / Jointer 3HP | JPJ-12BHH. My Jet has the Shelix cutter, which I love. I’ve had virtually no sniping problem. It was new in 2011 and I’m still on the first SIDE of the cutters except for 2 that nicely planed a buried fence staple. I’ve installed an iGaging digital readout which is very nice. I still measure with calipers to confirm thickness. The dust collection is exceptional, being as good as my previous stand-alone 12” planer and much better than either my previous 6” & 8” jointers. I use a Jet DC-1100VX-CK Dust Collector, 1.5HP 1PH 115/230V, 2-Micron Canister.
I have the A3-31 and I never ever had any snipe. So I am the lucky one, who got a perfect adjusted machine. ;-) To get rid of the snipe on the planer, just release a bit of the pressure of the infeed and outfeed rolls. There is a video somewhere on youtube, which shows how to do that. And yes, I am very, very lucky with that machine!! 🙂
Just fired up a new A3-31, your vids definitely helped influence my purchase. They were excellent and informative. I ran my first board through and I am now in love. I was only “by hand” guy, until diagnosed with severe stenosis. This obviously presented me with some decisions that needed to be made….I chose to add this combo machine to take the load off my back by removing the most physically difficult tasks and arguably the most boring ones to boot. I’m counting on this big guy to keep me in the shop until moving it is someone else’s problem! Thanks for all the helpful insight!! 🎉
Appreciate the follow up video!!
Thank you for the follow up discussion, Jason
You’re welcome
Thank you so much for the great review as I'm getting ready to jump on board to the A3 41 just hung up on the accessories, basically upgrading from my old 8" DJ 20 jointer 3 cutter head and figure the16" planer is a bonus and back up as I have a 20"HH Powermatic Planer that I love. I have my own band saw mill and process a lot of flooring and siding thats pays the bills but also build custom furniture and everything in between.
Awesome follow up Jason, appreciate you doing this! Stay safe!
Glad you found it helpful!
Great follow up!
Jason, I prefer porkchop style guards to the euro, mainly because you don't have to adjust them, and they will accommodate whatever size board you slide through it. I do wish Hammer and Felder made accommodations for an infeed table extension on the thickness planer. I use a caliper when I thickness plane too, but the analog/digital gauge is very accurate. I used mine on my A3-31 and then moved it over to my AD-531, it is surprising how well it works.
Great content Jason!
All the Best, Chuck
Thanks for sharing Chuck.
I've got the A3-31 and just replaced the plastic square to round dust boot with a larger 6". I find my dust collection much better! Easy and cheap modification that I would recommend.
I used a 5” hose over top of their 120mm plastic shroud , fit great, before that had a reducer to a 4 “ hose. The 5” is on a A3-41. Made a huge difference. Love that machine now. Stay safe.
That sounds great Blake, I might try that on my A3-31.
Where exactly did you find the 6" replacement?
Hi Tom - just made a video about it. Just google "heating supplier" or "HVAC supplier" and ask where the local duct sheet metal shop is. Call that fab shop and ask for a short square to round round. Think it's 5x7 to 6" round. You could share a screenshot from my video or take your old one off and take it to them.
@@chippychippy8291 Hi Chippy, that sounds interesting, where did you source the 5" hose? And would that source maybe carry a 6"-5" reducer?
@@tomgirotti Hi Tom, I am in Canada and Lee Valley Tools sells a 5” hose, as well as a 5” metal blast gate. The 6” to 5” reducer was harder to find, I was looking at one from England, but that was going to take too long. There is a company in the states that make a pvc 6 to 5 reducer it was expensive, duties, shipping etc, so I ended up with a rubber reducer from fernco. I thought clearvue sells 6to 5 one as well. I switched from 4” pvc to a 6” pvc for all the main runs, made a huge difference. Stay safe!
Separate jointer and planer plus table saw, plus extractors, plus router table, plus bandsaw, plus lathe, plus etc needs a 1000sq.ft shop. I have a 500 sq.ft shop and have ordered the A3-31. The A3-41 is €1100 more. A fellow 4 miles down the road has a big shop with machinery to joint and plane 20" and sand 36", if I go down there once a year to mill something greater then 12" and he charges €50 each time it will take me 22 years to spend the extra €1100. I think it is more efficient to save the space and money and go with the A3-31 combo machine.
It's also smart going with the same machine as your friend's shop for networking..... You each might have a given part the other needs in a pinch or something like that
Thanks Jason, great stuff!
You’re welcome
You forgot to mention that by having a combo you only need 1 shelix cutting blade. Of course that can be a curse if it’s totally screwed and damaged because then you can’t use either but because of the square shelix cutter heads you can easily turn the cutter 90 degrees 3 times before replacing a specific cutter blade. The cost of those things overall are very expensive so only having to invest in 1 is a big cost savings out of the gate plus as you mentioned the cost of 2 individual machines exceeds the combo cost anyway and if you’re smart with your projects you do like tasks together so you’d only need to joint everything together 1 times (making a few extras) then convert once for the planing that happens at some point if at all in you project. That space saving capability is the obvious other major plus. I’ve been wanting both tools but once I learned about these and now seen your videos I’m definitely going to buy one regardless of how much space I have
I pretty much eliminated snipe on my machine (before I sold it) by covering the planer bed with a slab of 1/2" UHMW plastic, shimmed to raise it above the rollers. It was slippery enough that the top drive rollers would push the work through easily. No bottom rollers = no snipe.
Jason, you are spot-on in your observations. I've had an A3-31 for 4 years with no regrets.
I want to highlight 2 additional things you might want to mention in the future. First, as per Hammer's manual, which was reinforced with my call to Felder, you must keep the green button depressed until the motor has fully spun-up. Quoting from the manual: "Press the green button on the control panel and hold it pressed down. Release the push button once the machine has reached the maximum rotational speed." My understanding is if you don't, the startup capacitors can and will blow. Personally I think this is a slight design deficiency by Hammer/Felder, but this is what they require. Second, my call to Felder about the breaker size resulted in a different answer. I was told to put in a 30 amp breaker. I don't know why we got different answers (different technicians, or perhaps code requirements--I'm in CA), but your answer of 20 amp breaker was definitely not the answer I got.
Thank you for sharing. Not sure why we got different answers on the breaker size.
Hey, I love the people at Felder/Hammer, but they are only trying to translate European spec's that state 25amps? I have no idea where that comes from (electrically speaking) other than the manual. But here are the facts:
The A3-41 motor has a has power rating of 3.0kW which is equal to 4HP. 746 watts= 1Hp, 746x4=2984 or 3000 watts, or 3.0kW. OHM’s law states Amps x Volts = Watts so, Watts / Volts = Amps. 3000w / 240vac = 12.5 amps. That’s it, 12.5 amps is all the A3-41 will draw at "full load". So, a 30amp breaker and 10-gauge wire is not needed to operate it, plain and simple. A 20amp circuit (20amp breaker w/12-gauge wire) is more than enough to supply the energy demand. It has been for me for over three years without issue.
And remember 12.5 amps is at “Full load”, how often if ever is anyone going to meet that demand?
All the Best, Chuck.
Also, there is this statement in the manual, “Safeguarding: triggering characteristic C”.
This is referring to the breaker “Class trip curve”, of which they are requiring a “C” class rated breaker. A breaker with class C trip characteristic trips instantaneously when the current flowing through it reaches between 5 to 10 times the rated current. Suitable for Domestic and residential applications and electromagnetic starting loads with medium starting currents. It will trip in 1 second at 10 times the rating and in 5 seconds at 5 times the rating. Most all breakers such as Eaton, Siemens, Square-D, etc. for residential use are “C” rated. It is marked next to the voltage of the breaker on most of them. So, finding one should not be an issue as it is usually what is considered a standard breaker in the U.S., or at least any that I have seen.
All the Best, Chuck.
@@toolchuck Hi, the calculation you provided is for resistive loads, even for a DC motor you would have to account for efficiency.
With AC you need to account for power factor and efficiency with a motor. The full load current will be indicated on the machine nameplate, and will be higher than 12.5 amperes.
@@rodsheridan7048 Thank you for catching this mistake. The motor is hard to access, and the documentation contradicts itself. This may be why many are confused, even Felder U.S. I found a few online calculators that gave me a 16.5 amp as the highest result of the three. So, fortunately even though I was low by 4 amps, my recommendation of a 20amp C rated breaker with 12-gauge wire is still valid. I used a power factor of .85 and an efficiency of 95% for the calculations, average numbers for this size motor from what I could see. I use a 20-amp class C breaker and 12-gauge wire for both my 3kw (4hp) planer and bandsaw with reliable results.
All the Best, Chuck
i see few videos people didn't like guard thing on top said when using it, guard is in way to get full control of wood
I actually prefer having it
Good shit J!!! I love my A3-31, and like you on the fence for the out feed extension too. I can't say the ROI will be as quick as I like, but man it chews through rough walnut like a dream and that cost savings is nice for sure. Thanks for good info.
Glad you found it helpful
Thanks for the great vid. My only issue with a combo machine is if the machine goes down I have lost 2 machines to compared to losing only one compared to having separate machines.
My workflow just would not work. I often have my jointer, planer and tablet saw going at one time. I flatten then edge my board then go straight to the planer and get them to a rough thickness and straight to the tablesaw and rip and then put on cart and repeat. I do a lot of production work and it’s cheaper to just leave your machines on as you’re working and I’m working alone. I hope the incorporate a straight line rip saw to facilitate my work as edge joint From a wheelchair is a little difficult. Thanks for the great review on the you new combo machine.
Yeah, definitely not great for all situations. Really does depend on how you work.
Hey Jason, Great video. I almost purchased an A3-31 (12") but didn't because of space, plus my 2 units are running fine. Or they were at the time. I basement shop is in short a 2 car garage with the cars end-to-end. So all must go against the wall. At 9:20 I see how easy it is to remove the guard. So, I can bring the fence forward to cover the blade, push it against the wall, then remove the guard and lay it on the machine. I bet it won't stick out any more than my Dewalt 13" planer does now.
I've never used separate machines and when it came to an upgrade I too went for the A41 - there's a good 9-10 month wait to get one right now tho...
I think the wait will be worth it
So Jason....I have a grizzly combo that I`ve used for years which is so-so. The reason being the drive mechanism which no one seems to talk about.
Looking to upgrade, I want to know how the drive works. Mine is belt driven with basically a idler pulley that when engaged tighened the bely enough to turn the feed for the planer. Very very weak part of the tool for sure. How do they address this???? Thanks for your time and great videos
This two part series has been excellent. Please consider doing a calibration video. I found one for the A3 31, but the person doesn’t really show calibration. It starts out promisingly when he points out some screws to loosen, but doesn’t even mime what to do to make adjustments if any are needed.
Glad you found it helpful
FYI the Makita planer automated head clamp eliminates snipe and it works awesome, if only they made a bigger version but it's never been an issue for me, especially with my 25in drum sander.
It might be useful to mention metric and imperial sizes on your channel like Matt Cremona, it's just an idea.
Interestingly Jay Bates sold his machine but for the reason you stated had the space and opted for 2 separated machines to increase productivity.
Have just relocated and downsized I'm doing the opposite as I just don't have the space I once did however, there's a 2 month wait time to get the A3 41.
Well kind Sir, you did a great teaching of those 3 parts; of the "Hammer A3-41"; with ONE major problem.!That MOST of these machines have. And MANY people on RUclips; have claimed about it.
And that is: the tables are NOT level in many directions. more or less. Oh yes. Now, I HOPE yours is perfect. But MOST are not. And we claim Fender for; that they have not fixed it; at least in the last older 4 yr ago's, Etc!. Which is mine. Because I bought it, in April, 2019.
Sad, but OH so True. And Felder should've SOLVE that MAJOR problem! Because, MANY are bitching all over the world. Really! Check on the RUclips! And they should bitch! Again kind Sir, you really do a GREAT DIY video! Keep it going Sir!
Quick question. I’m about to buy in a 341 but will only use it as a jointer. Do you think it’s worthwhile looking at a jointer only model from another company or sticking with Felder. I owned their A3 26 and it was fantastic. No where can I find a 16 inch jointer capacity for under $10,000.
thank you, just what I needed to get going with the A3-31. Especially compared to the videos Hammer is offering (which are just mediocre). I used my tractor to lift the machine off and onto the ground with some belts, that was easy and quick. My machine came with two black wires labeled 1 and 2. That is quite unusual and essentially a violation of the European color code, but there is a wiring diagram which explains that 2 is neutral. I understand that this machine is shipped world wide and I am in NZ, but I would have appreciated a proper color code like on the other Hammer machines I have. The machine draws around 8A in idle mode
I also have an A4-41, I love it. I get very little snipe, maybe because I usually lock the table after adjusting the bed.
I also like the "euro style" blade guard for the reasons you mention.
To your last questions about about two separate machines if space (or cost) doesn't matter, well I don't live in that world :-) For me, working alone it is fine.
FYI snipe is only caused on a machine like this by the weight of the board lifting and causing the trailing end to rise. There are no bottom rollers on the bed so there is no adjusting that can be done to eliminate or change anything. Larger dedicated planers have a greater distance from the the cutter head and in some case more top rollers to hold down the piece. That is what prevents snipe. As was mentioned if you support long boards or lift gently as the piece is exiting the planer there should be no issue. Not knowing this machine though....there could be some slop in the height adjustment or some other play. As pressure is released after the part passes the input side roller, the bed may move up slightly but again not likely.
BTW, nice set of reviews. Actually looking at the Felder AD 941 version.
These machines are normally calibrated to produce zero snipe, neither meausrable nor detectable by feel.
The infeed and outfeed rollers need to be adjusted to produce zero snipe.
I never use the locking mechanism.
Felder TV have the videos to explain the process.
Thanks for a straightforward & honest video!
You’re welcome
Jason. What can you tell me about Hammer or Felder Dealerships in the USA? Thanks for all your hard work on all your videos, they are great. Steve
Hello, my experience is with three machines (Hammer A3-31, Felder AD-531 and FB-510) over a two-and-a-half-year period. My local Nor Cal. Rep. Fergus has been great. And as far as service goes, outstanding. My experience with Felder/Hammer is unique and too long to get into here, again, but trust me, they stand behind their products.
All the Best, Chuck
I don’t know what locations have the tools on display. I dealt directly with Felder and was lucky enough to put my hands on one that a friend owned.
I have the same machine, a planer thicknesser ( I'm in uk) so that's what we call it. I purchased the long extension with the leg support, its fantastic and I use it on my hammer spindle and bandsaw as well. I would recommend it if you plane long lengths. The extension for the thicknesseser, I bought and haven't put it on, the extension slides on from side, this means you can't put in on and off easily. I interested to see how you get on.
If you don't mind me asking what do you use to clean the cutter head in your machine. I have A3 31 and K3 table saw and looking for decent cleaning solution for the blades.
@@derekrobertson1548 the magic solution I have found is worth (WURTH) wood slide solution. It's a three in one, it cleans it stops rust it clears rust and it lubricates blades and cutters. I have the spiral which fantastic but has loads of little blades that do collet resin. What you do is remove all saw dust after use spray on worth wood slide on blades leave 5 minutes go back and you can remove it with a cloth (easy) then spray good coat every were. It will look wet. Leave like that. The solvent dissolves leaving the protective coat and ludricating layer ready for next use. If your pushing loads through you can keep applying a thin coat and remove with eccess with a tissue. I used to use machine wax, its far better.
@@shamuso1596 thank you. Will look into this. Wurth have a store close to me so that is a bonus. Was looking at one from felder but its not in stock and thought is was rather pricey especially with delivery. Also looked at one by trend but reviews said to strips the paint of router bits. Thank you for your recommendation.
I still wish it had a pork chop style guard lol
Jealous of that machine
You know that there are just 4 countries that are not metric? North Korea amongst them…
Whaaaa? 🤷♂️