You should do radio you have a great voice. I can listen to you talk all day. Now that’s out of the way. Great video I always learn something new. Thanks.
Hi Peter Thanks for your quick reply, I’m 75 years old going to build my first kitchen watching your vidios has inspired me to have a go thanks very much Regards John
Fully agree with gluing the panel. It's mad that so many people think you can't glue MDF or plywood panels, it absolutely fine even if the rails and styles are form solid wood. The panel only needs to float if its solid wood.
Just made my first door using this method. Tracksaw, bench mounted router and one of those big old Wealden bits! went really well considering it's my first ever shaker door. Got a few to make to finish off a big lockdown project. This is definitely the way to go for quality finish. Next time I will wait for a cooler day as the glue going a bit quick! Bit stressful!!! Another fine video with lots of good advice. Thanks
I'm impressed. I have lived in houses with Shaker style doors, a long time ago (my 45 year old son was 2 or 3 years old.) That house was a very old house, probably turn of the last century or older. Thanks, Jim MacLaughlin, Halifax, NS Canada
brendan ford This one is just for my own house so if it does I won’t have the embarrassment of returning to a customers property to make good. Reason I’ve gone this way with is it the height of the door is 1900 so I wanted as much strength in it as possible so I thought of doing it this way. If they bow then I can change them for a panel made in the Style of Peters but I’ve nothing to lose really.
Hey Peter can you start another channel where you read bed time stories? It would definitely help me sleep and possibly "calm" me throughout the next day. I'm 38 years old. Oh and great video by the way, I'm going to have a go at these doors for my kitchen. Cheers.
I love the easy way shaker style doors. Also, I start to love using my new track saw that calls for an MFT top ;-) Tomorrow I go to install the big wine rack (it's done finally) Have a nice weekend Peter best wishes Tim
Hi Peter, Thanks so much for this video, it was really good and I especially like the simplicity and use of loose tenons. I will just need to get a groove cutter bit which I am going to need in the future anyway. Thanks again.
Just adding to the comment on quality of video produced. I’m just surprised that some TV diy show haven’t snapped you up yet Peter. You would make a really good presenter.👍🏻😎
Thanks for the great idea used this method but with a tablesaw instead of router made 30 of them and they all turned out perfect all your tips where bang on
Love these videos Peter I really am a student of yours. I am making fitted wardrobes in our home at the moment using techniques from your videos. Thank you for sharing. 😊
Peter, thank you very much for all of your videos, but especially this one. It gave me the confidence to build a cabinet with four shaker doors and it turned out great. I am pretty sure that what I did in four weekends you could have done in four hours, but no matter! Thank you again!
I made all my kitchen cabinet doors and larger drawer fronts like this about 15 years ago...still going strong, just re-painted a couple of times when my wife wanted to freshen things up and change colour.
Just found your channel. Just in time... I was very nearly going to buy a new kitchen - but I reckon I'll have a crack at making one first. You explain things so clearly. Make it look really easy. Thanks. Looking forward to crunching through your videos for a bit.
Thanks and welcome! Honestly, for a kitchen, unless you’re determined to make one, or want to use the build as an excuse to buy some tools, it’s something that I’d recommend you buy in, assuming you’re here in the UK. Kitchen cabinet sizes are standard, and widely available at prices you couldn’t hope to match if you were building your own. Personally I’d rather put my time & effort into the details, the doors and end panels, than the factory work of kitchen carcasses. Whatever you decide, I hope it goes well. 👍👍
I make mine with 9mm strips planted onto 18mm backer, headless pinner and glue. I usually plane a small bevel on the inside edges of the stiles and the inside and ends of the rails to get the "genuine" shaker look.
Well done. I have done Shaker doors all the ways you've shown and more. I really really like the extra durability of the thick back door. But I know it's honestly not needed lol. If a client breaks a door then they did something wrong and they can pay for it to be fixed. I'm honestly not sure which I will use long term going forward. I also really like using a stopped dado for the inset panel and then using a domino. Less clean up work. No trimming needed. Straight to sanding without using a filler. And the faces are a little more flat and accurate. But honestly they are all great methods of making doors.
Thanks! Funny, I find the ‘stopped groove then Domino’ to be more work, but whatever works for you, right? As long as you get a strong flat door out of it - that’s the right size - then that’s what counts! 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop I had to Google "Heath Robinson" and discovered that he's your Rube Goldberg! It took until 3:44PM but I finally learned something new today!
I built some cupboards around the chimney about 5 years ago, I put of making the doors as it was too much effort. I was going to just slap on some 18mm sheets of painted MDF and call it 'modern design' but the more I see this design, the simpler they look to make. I don't have my router with me, but I could probably get away with cutting the slot on the table saw in a few passes Also, I set RUclips to remind me when the Premiere was about to start and it ended coming through an hour and a half after it ended! I think next time I need to set a reminder on my phone as well!
Watching this on repeat as I’m planning a fairly hefty fitted office project - something’s bugging me - those rails and styles are 80mm, not 18 😉 But thank you Peter, this is hugely appreciated
I actually have all the equipment and I still make MDF doors the "easiest" way. I use barge contact cement to adhere the 1/4 material down to the 1/2 material. Once the edge is sanded, I've never needed to fill in any gaps around the edge. You definitely might need to if you only use two buckets to clamp down your glue up. Both methods work just fine
Peter - I made a door for my sons house to close opening on side of their stairs, 1315mm high and 916mm wide. I made it from 18mm pine stiles & rails , with 9mm birch ply rebated inset panel. It had a sloped top rail - all joined with pocket screws & panel glued in. It warped!! ☹️☹️☹️ Do you think 22mm MDF stiles & rails, with maybe 9mm rebated MDF inset panel would be sturdy enough? I was concerned about 6mm panel being that large. Appreciate your views? Pat
@@pat1walls Hi Pat. That's pretty wide! 22mm MRMDF for the rails and stiles would be fine, and a 6mm panel would probably be OK too, but if I were making it I'd go for 9mm, I think - gives a bit more heft to a door that wide, especially with an angled top rail. 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop thanks Peter - appreciate that! Will get some MDF sourced - there is only one place locally I know does 22mm! Will drop you a pic once sorted 👍
Hodor! 😆😆hahahha😆😆 Well that is a pretty quick and easy method. Looks like you're set up to crank these out rather quickly. 👌🏾 Cheers for sharing, mate. 👍🏾
@@10MinuteWorkshop Ha, wouldn't that be a waking nightmare, all these doors, and none will let me out!😳 oh damn, they're just the doors for the new cabinet build coming up...😏😆 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Very informative. I remember most of the information from your previous videos. In this one you don't cover the difficulty of fitting hinges to the "easy" door, which is what would put me off that method.
Thanks! Yes, the loose-tenon method is still my preferred way - and the only way I've made these type of doors over the last 15 years or so - but the mock-panel method does produce a working door and many won't see the difference between them. My concerns about hinges remain the same, though as I say in this video, a 15mm backer with 6mm 'facing strips' produces a door with a bit more heft, and co-incidentally, satisfies my original concerns about hinges. 👍
I bought the Axcaliber tongue and groove router bits from Axminster Tools a while ago... they're a nightmare to line up so I've gone with the tennon method too. So much easier!
I use tongue and groove bits (not Axminster) or shaker bits and find that once you have the setting dialled in, if you measure the router bit height with a Trend Digital Depth Gauge (or similar) and record it for next time it's repeatable and pretty quick to set up - I always do a test piece or two for the final precise adjustment.
I saw a trick recently that I remember the old guys using when I was starting out. You referred to "swimmy" joints, when making your faux panel doors. Have you tried shaking a little salt on the surface? It'll add a little grab, but melt away quickly.
Hi, love the calm, unflappable delivery! Ever considered being the bearer of terrible news on U.K. Tv at about 5.00 pm? It would be very reassuring! I haven't seen a track saw track in that flip down right angle to a fence configuration before. Could that be done with a Marita track?
Hi and thanks! Let's just say I'm open to offers, lol! The hinged rail comes as standard on the Festool MFT - see videos #182 and #183 for more details - but AFAIK it remains a Festool patent. You can buy the spare parts to make your own, but they are pricey. I've never tried the Makita track, but it should fit as they follow the standard Festool-pattern pretty closely. 👍 👍
I’ve made a few mock shaker doors recently, worked out really well in the end, had a few issues with the hinges, but euro hinges solved any problems. I think in future I may try your first method though.
Hi Peter In a video of yours you mentioned that you were going to do a router series. I’ve been searching for it - I want to make the loose tenon version of these doors but don’t have a router table …. Or a router! If you’re planning on doing a router series that would be awesome. If not - would you mind saying how you would router the grooves without a router table, which bit … how do do it safely etc. I’m planning on getting a basic 1/4 inch router. Cheers
Thanks! Haven’t managed but yet - it is still planned, just other things getting in the way. Honestly, I wouldn’t recommend trying to use a grooving bit handheld - any slight wobble and you’d mess up the groove. A table doesn’t have to bell anything fancy - most of my grooving was dine with a basic router bolted to the underside of a bench. 👍👍
Excellent as always. First method is how I do it to although not made as many doors as you 😂 I think I made my last rails and styles at 50mm you seem to do yours at 70. Did you find less than 80 makes them to fragile or just you like the look of them?
Firstly...love the videos Peter, you’ve actually made me think about leaving kitchens and bathrooms and working solely on joiner projects.....just a quick question, your first method where you router a groove and the glue it floating tenons at the ends, how do you do 2 or more panel doors? Do you glue it small loose tenons for the middle rails or do you not route those sections?
Hi Peter I was watching this video as I'm planning to do a kitchen for my Daughter in a shaker door style and I was wondering if you have a video of Make interior shaker door thank you it has been beneficial
I had to make two cabinet doors recently, so I thought I'd use the Millard Method. Trouble was, my supplier didn't have 6mm MDF in stock so I had to use 6mm ply for the panel. As you know, 6mm ply isn't actually 6mm but my grooving cutter is - so I had to fiddle to make the slot 6-and-a-bit. First door was a disaster as the panel was too tight a fit once the glue was in there. Second attempt was a different disaster as the slot was too wide so nothing wanted to stay square or flush. So for the third attempt I went with stopped slots and dominos... success! Think I'll stick with that method ;-)
@@10MinuteWorkshop Normally they have everything - they blamed it on COVID-19 :-( It was you that got me addicted to dominos - now I use them for everything. What's that expression?... when your only tool is a DF500, everything looks like a job-for-a-domino 8-)
Nicely done, great production. When I have a bit of time tomorrow, I'll put 001 and this one side by side on the big pc monitor to see the difference. One point of criticism: not a fan of the Patreon credits on the bottom.
Thanks Caspar! Re Patreon credits, it's a work in progress - as discussed over on Patreon, it's trying to find the balance of readability vs lack of 'friction'. The scrolling credits work well, but the fall-off in viewing is dramatic as soon as they start, which effectively makes a 10-minute video look like it's only being watched 80% at best - which impacts how the algorithm promotes it. 🤷♂️
Great informative video as always Peter! I'm planning to use the second method with 18mm standard MDF and 6mm stiles and rails glued and pinned for a tall (full board height) 240cm wardrobe door. After reading comments on other videos and forums, worried about problems with warping when stuck to only one side causing an imbalance. Will warping be an issue with standard 18mm MDF? (Also plan to use 5 blum hinges per door)
Thank You. Excellent Video as always, MRMDF, surely once it has been painted preferably exterior paint it will become moisture resistant? obviously, I am not intending to use the MDF outside just indoors,I am looking at the cost between the two one MRMDF and one cheaper becomes made into MRMDF? Thanks.
MRMDF is a much better quality board - it has a much denser core, and is essentially formaldehyde free due to the binding agents used. It’s not really about the moisture resistance. 👍👍
Surprised that in the first way you made the door that you glued the panel into the frame. I would have left it loose - but then I'm not used to using MDF.
As I say in the vid, I don’t get extremes of temperature and humidity where I live and this door is made entirely of the same material, which is exceptionally stable. You shouldn’t confuse MR MDF with regular MDF btw, different animal altogether. 👍👍
Thanks! There are links in the video description to everything used or featured 👍👍 Heavy duty groover - bit.ly/HD_Groover Arcbor for above - bit.ly/Arbor_8
Hi Peter, thank you for these. Apart from safety could you do a stopped grove then put a domino/dowel/biscuit on the corners to connect the rails and styles?
This technique will only work with man made materials such as MDF. Your loose tenon approach would still work with real wood from a tree (remember those!). Would not put glue on panel, just have it floating. As always you show what can be achieved if you have thousands of pounds of woodworking tools (god that never gets old!!!!)
Well, I show two techniques, the second of which can be done with just a saw. 🤷♂️ And a cheap saw, too. For natural timber I’d always go with a stub tenon as I prefer the look. 👍👍
peter and others i use a small roller tray and line it with tin foil saves a fortune and you can roll it up cover the roller reline tray and use again.......happy days
Hi, any reason you couldn't do the Grooves with just a router I.e not on a router table? I was thinking of doing a few rails in a row with some sacrificial bits on the end for support. Thanks in advance for your support andvgreat channel.
On a 22mm rail/stile it leaves quite a large lip to the panel; making one side 6/7mm just looks better, and also leaves the other side deeper so that when clients say ' you know I think I'd prefer a 'Victorian' panel door...' you can just flip it over and add some moulding. 👍
i had to google Keith Robinson thought he was a very clever woodworker that came up with ingenious solutions for a small shop .you where haven a laugh Peter
Great video - thanks. I’m about to start on some (painted) kitchen cabinet doors, and was planning on using MDF for the panels, and poplar for the rails and stiles. Could you please comment on the pros and cons of this approach, versus the full-MDF approach. Thanks in advance for your response.
Thanks! Poplar / tulipwood is a popular choice for door rails and stiles as it’s pretty stable, and obviously a harder material than MDF so likely to take knocks better - not that I’ve had any issues with MR MDF tbh. Not sure if I’d glue in the panel or not - the MDF won’t move, but the poplar may - so probably one for you to assess your environment for heat & moisture. No problem in principle with the plan though. 👍👍
Hi and thanks! It’s an off-the-shelf Festool MFT or Multi-function table & the hinged rail comes as standard. See videos #182 and #183 for more details. 👍 Video 182 ruclips.net/video/0V-p5F7SjO4/видео.html
I make cabinet doors using exactly the loose tenon technique described and it's great. The only difference I normally have is I use beaded pine cladding for the panel. It's extra work but I like the look. Quick question, are you using an extension on your router so you can do above table bit changes? If so, is it any good and which brand did you go for?
Great video. I’ve subscribed. I didn’t think PVA alone would hold the trim. I need to make two large wardrobe doors and I’ll try this. Can I ask why you trim to size after gluing and not just make it the right size to start with, or is it just impossible to ever get it bang on that way?
Hi Peter just found your channel & subbed you Amazing projects you are super talented , I and buying my first plunge /track saw so i have watched all your uploads on them thanks ,i have an old powerline plunge router and was thinking of putting it into a router table do you have any videos on making one as i would like to try to make on many thanks , take care stay safe , kind regards , clive.
Love your vids Peter! In Australia we only have access to 18 or 25mm MR MDF. If making large 2000 x 450mm cabinet doors, which thickness would you recommend using?
25mm at that height. I had problems with 18mm bowing at 1900, they all went away when I switched to 22mm. With 25mm I’d be tempted to use a 9mm panel. 👍
Yes, I did glass doors in the ‘cabinets and shelves’ series, videos 165-167. Screws take fine in MDF as long as you pilot hole and use the right size. 👍
Funny, I've been making doors this morning and here I am, having a cup of coffee, watching a video about making doors! It's an illness. Hodor gag gave me a giggle. You have a great way with these simple instructionals mate. I should take notes for my vids! Did you get my email btw Peter? You interested?
Hi Peter, I missed this video and only just watched it. You said you no longer make shaker doors the easier way and have a video for it (which I have now also watched) where your point, for which was a good one, was the hinge screws either fall on the gap between the panels. I am curious if you made loads of doors like this, how much come back did you get from customers with any issues with this method?
Hi Colin. I didn't make many doors the 'faker-shaker' way, with just planted-on strips of MDF, because I just didn't like them very much, but I've never had one fail, either because of screws or the construction method. But it's not best practise, and the loose tenon way is better, if you have the means to produce them. 👍
Hi Peter, I am an electronics engineer by trade but your channel has inspired me to get into making furniture ! I have made a shaker style dressing table with draws and bed side cabinets mostly from 18mm MR MDF painted white. The the built in wardrobes are in place but awaiting 4 large doors approximately 700 x 2200mm. I intend to use the floating tenant method . Would you recommend using 9mm panels rather than for this size door and 3 or 4 euro hinges? Any help would be much appreciated
Hi Mike! Wow, 700mm is a pretty wide door! Biggest I've done is 600 x 2200 with 22/6mm and it was fine. A 9mm panel would certainly give a bit more heft to it. I'd also use a deeper bottom rail, and a mid-rail. I'd have to do the maths on it, but I'd expect 3 hinges to be fine. FYI 18mm MRMDF is 15kg/sq m. Each hinge can take ~5Kg max. Work out the weights pro-rata, and see how many hinges you need. 4 might just be safest anyway! 👍
Hi Peter, thanks for this re-made episode. Finally on the verge of putting your guidance into practice! I have the Festool OF1010 router. If I had it mounted in a table, home made, do you think it would have enough ‘grunt’ to use the groover you linked to? Perhaps a question I could/should pose to Wealdon!? Thanks Dave
Hi Dave. It’s a big bit to swing, but if anything can the the OF1010 would - you’d need an 8mm arbor and collet for it though, I think. Wealden do a smaller groover, gives a ~13mm groove - lots of guys O know use that one and it works fine. HTH. P👍
Great video Peter. Quick question if I may? I see from the links you're using the Wealden Groover. I'm guessing you're using the 6.35mm cutter? What size bearing guides are you using? I suppose it comes down to ratios of stiles / rails to panel but curious what size you use and if you change them? Cheers Greg
Hi Greg, and thanks! I use whatever bearing comes with the arbor tbh - never changed it. From memory it gives a ~21.5mm deep groove or thereabouts; if I need a shallower fierce I use the fence. 👍👍
Really informative, thank you! You mentioned a router table is the safest way to cut the grooves- how else could you do it? I am thinking of investing in a table saw and I am wondering if I could use that. I’m also wondering if would you use the same method for building the panel door if you were using hardwood instead of MDF?
Thanks! It’s possible to use the same grooving but freehand in a router, but I wouldn’t recommend it as it’s for experienced router users only. And yes it would be possible to make the grooves with a table saw, but using an unguarded blade is a real no-no here in the UK - it’s a 5-figure fine in a commercial workshop, so I couldn’t recommend it.
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You good Sir with your genteel presentation are the Bob Ross of the wood workshop.
Its like watching a chef and getting hungry! I have no need of such doors but watching you, makes me want to make some. ???
Cheers Keith! 👍
You should do radio you have a great voice. I can listen to you talk all day. Now that’s out of the way. Great video I always learn something new. Thanks.
Thank you! 👍👍
Hi Peter
Thanks for your quick reply, I’m 75 years old going to build my first kitchen watching your vidios has inspired me to have a go thanks very much
Regards
John
Just the video I was looking for! Excellently explained and kept it simple enough that I feel confident to do it myself! Thank you Peter!
Glad it was helpful! 👍
Fully agree with gluing the panel. It's mad that so many people think you can't glue MDF or plywood panels, it absolutely fine even if the rails and styles are form solid wood. The panel only needs to float if its solid wood.
Exactly! 👍👍
Why does the panel need to float if it's solid Wood?
@@mellie4174 Expansion and contraction with temperature changes
Your original shaker door vid , the first ever vid #001, was what got me hooked Pete.. and you've come a long say since then !
😎👍☘️🍺
Ha! Thanks Peter - and you’re still here! Amazing! 😂👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop ya'll hafta beat me away with a shtick.. 😂
😎👍☘🍺
Enjoyed the updated video. Happily watch all the oldies remastered. Hodor 😂. Even watched “tall” the way through 😉
👍👍
These videos are so well produced, they're a joy to watch.
Thank you! 👍
I really admire your scripting and editing. You are very watchable.
Thank you! 👍👍
I substituted a biscuit joiner for the router and cut the slots that way. Worked just as well
Peter, you often manage to achieve the Goldilocks rule... not to heavy, not too light, just right. Well done and thanks for your help.
Thanks Stephen! 👍
Just made my first door using this method. Tracksaw, bench mounted router and one of those big old Wealden bits! went really well considering it's my first ever shaker door. Got a few to make to finish off a big lockdown project. This is definitely the way to go for quality finish. Next time I will wait for a cooler day as the glue going a bit quick! Bit stressful!!! Another fine video with lots of good advice. Thanks
Great to hear, thanks! 👍👍
I'm impressed. I have lived in houses with Shaker style doors, a long time ago (my 45 year old son was 2 or 3 years old.) That house was a very old house, probably turn of the last century or older.
Thanks, Jim MacLaughlin, Halifax, NS Canada
Thanks! 👍
Brilliant!
Quality video as always, Peter. I'll be using the tips you taught to make a cabinet in the next few weeks hopefully!!!
Thanks Sammy! 👍👍
That tracksaw setup is awesome
Ya I totally want this whole thing and I've no place to put anything like this 😢
Nice quick way to do that. I must keep an eye out for MR MDF.
Currently knocking up some MDF Shaker style doors but I’m just pinning on the shaker rails on to a panel door. Proper faker shaker.
It works! 👍
You might find they will bow in time, usually after painting
I made some recently and stuck 6mm to 18mm
brendan ford This one is just for my own house so if it does I won’t have the embarrassment of returning to a customers property to make good. Reason I’ve gone this way with is it the height of the door is 1900 so I wanted as much strength in it as possible so I thought of doing it this way. If they bow then I can change them for a panel made in the Style of Peters but I’ve nothing to lose really.
Hey Peter can you start another channel where you read bed time stories?
It would definitely help me sleep and possibly "calm" me throughout the next day.
I'm 38 years old.
Oh and great video by the way, I'm going to have a go at these doors for my kitchen.
Cheers.
Haha, thanks! 👍👍
I love the easy way shaker style doors. Also, I start to love using my new track saw that calls for an MFT top ;-)
Tomorrow I go to install the big wine rack (it's done finally) Have a nice weekend Peter
best wishes Tim
Thanks Tim! Hope the install goes well! 👍👍
Hi Peter, Thanks so much for this video, it was really good and I especially like the simplicity and use of loose tenons. I will just need to get a groove cutter bit which I am going to need in the future anyway. Thanks again.
Great to hear, thanks! 👍
Just adding to the comment on quality of video produced. I’m just surprised that some TV diy show haven’t snapped you up yet Peter. You would make a really good presenter.👍🏻😎
Thanks Mark! Very kind of you to say so! 🙌👍
Peter, thanks for sharing this technique for making doors for a novice.
Pleasure! 👍
Such a quality resource. I’m baffled why you don’t have a million subscribers!
Spread the word.
Thanks! 👍👍
I was literally thinking the same thing! I don't get it. ;)
I love the "simple sled" it looks pretty nifty. I may need to build one for my self. Great video!
Thanks! 👍👍
Thanks Peter I'll check them out. Keep up the good work 😊😊
Thanks for the great idea used this method but with a tablesaw instead of router made 30 of them and they all turned out perfect all your tips where bang on
Love these videos Peter I really am a student of yours. I am making fitted wardrobes in our home at the moment using techniques from your videos. Thank you for sharing. 😊
Thanks Karl! 👍👍
Smashing! You looked under a bit of pressure in your previous video...good to see you back to normal again! 👍
Thanks! ha - previous video was from a job back in February, and yes, the heat was on to get that job done! 👍
Peter, thank you very much for all of your videos, but especially this one. It gave me the confidence to build a cabinet with four shaker doors and it turned out great. I am pretty sure that what I did in four weekends you could have done in four hours, but no matter! Thank you again!
That’s great to hear Roger, thanks for letting me know - much appreciated. 👍👍
My first Shaker-style project involved 20 doors (30 panels) in the Millard method - worked brilliantly. Thank you!
Fantastic - glad it helped! 👍
I made all my kitchen cabinet doors and larger drawer fronts like this about 15 years ago...still going strong, just re-painted a couple of times when my wife wanted to freshen things up and change colour.
Yep, it's a great way to do them! 👍
I love shaker style. Thank you for these easy methods.
Thanks Frits! 👍
All for simplicity Peter, Great Stay Safe Mate !!!.
Thanks Brian!👍
Big thanks for these videos. Managed to make kitchen cabinets, media center and wardrobe on a budget using your videos.
That is awesome! Glad they helped! 👍
A master class in practicality. Thank You Peter.
Thanks! 👍👍
Just found your channel. Just in time...
I was very nearly going to buy a new kitchen - but I reckon I'll have a crack at making one first.
You explain things so clearly. Make it look really easy.
Thanks. Looking forward to crunching through your videos for a bit.
Thanks and welcome! Honestly, for a kitchen, unless you’re determined to make one, or want to use the build as an excuse to buy some tools, it’s something that I’d recommend you buy in, assuming you’re here in the UK. Kitchen cabinet sizes are standard, and widely available at prices you couldn’t hope to match if you were building your own. Personally I’d rather put my time & effort into the details, the doors and end panels, than the factory work of kitchen carcasses.
Whatever you decide, I hope it goes well. 👍👍
That's a neatly produced video
Thanks! 👍
I make mine with 9mm strips planted onto 18mm backer, headless pinner and glue. I usually plane a small bevel on the inside edges of the stiles and the inside and ends of the rails to get the "genuine" shaker look.
Good job Mr Peter greeting to you , I'm from Iraq
Thank you Ali. Best wishes from London! 👍
very nice video.
Well done. I have done Shaker doors all the ways you've shown and more. I really really like the extra durability of the thick back door. But I know it's honestly not needed lol. If a client breaks a door then they did something wrong and they can pay for it to be fixed. I'm honestly not sure which I will use long term going forward.
I also really like using a stopped dado for the inset panel and then using a domino. Less clean up work. No trimming needed. Straight to sanding without using a filler. And the faces are a little more flat and accurate. But honestly they are all great methods of making doors.
Thanks! Funny, I find the ‘stopped groove then Domino’ to be more work, but whatever works for you, right? As long as you get a strong flat door out of it - that’s the right size - then that’s what counts! 👍👍
Golden oldie! 👍
Great video Peter! Extra points for the Heath Robinson reference!
Thanks Chris! 😂👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop I had to Google "Heath Robinson" and discovered that he's your Rube Goldberg! It took until 3:44PM but I finally learned something new today!
'Watch tall the way'? That's what we'd say in Yorkshire after we've seen it!
I built some cupboards around the chimney about 5 years ago, I put of making the doors as it was too much effort. I was going to just slap on some 18mm sheets of painted MDF and call it 'modern design' but the more I see this design, the simpler they look to make. I don't have my router with me, but I could probably get away with cutting the slot on the table saw in a few passes
Also, I set RUclips to remind me when the Premiere was about to start and it ended coming through an hour and a half after it ended! I think next time I need to set a reminder on my phone as well!
Yes, RUclips reminders can be a bit flakey! 👍
Watching this on repeat as I’m planning a fairly hefty fitted office project - something’s bugging me - those rails and styles are 80mm, not 18 😉 But thank you Peter, this is hugely appreciated
I actually have all the equipment and I still make MDF doors the "easiest" way. I use barge contact cement to adhere the 1/4 material down to the 1/2 material. Once the edge is sanded, I've never needed to fill in any gaps around the edge. You definitely might need to if you only use two buckets to clamp down your glue up. Both methods work just fine
Hi Peter! Ready and waiting.
Thanks Martin - you and me both! 👍
Excellent video Peter - thanks 👍
Thanks Pat! 👍
Peter - I made a door for my sons house to close opening on side of their stairs, 1315mm high and 916mm wide. I made it from 18mm pine stiles & rails , with 9mm birch ply rebated inset panel. It had a sloped top rail - all joined with pocket screws & panel glued in. It warped!! ☹️☹️☹️
Do you think 22mm MDF stiles & rails, with maybe 9mm rebated MDF inset panel would be sturdy enough? I was concerned about 6mm panel being that large.
Appreciate your views?
Pat
@@pat1walls Hi Pat. That's pretty wide! 22mm MRMDF for the rails and stiles would be fine, and a 6mm panel would probably be OK too, but if I were making it I'd go for 9mm, I think - gives a bit more heft to a door that wide, especially with an angled top rail. 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop thanks Peter - appreciate that! Will get some MDF sourced - there is only one place locally I know does 22mm! Will drop you a pic once sorted 👍
Hodor! 😆😆hahahha😆😆
Well that is a pretty quick and easy method.
Looks like you're set up to crank these out rather quickly. 👌🏾
Cheers for sharing, mate. 👍🏾
Cheers Bill! Yes, I've made so many of these I could probably do them in my sleep! 👍😂
@@10MinuteWorkshop
Ha, wouldn't that be a waking nightmare, all these doors, and none will let me out!😳
oh damn, they're just the doors for the new cabinet build coming up...😏😆
🤣🤣🤣🤣
Well done Peter
Thank you! 👍
Really enjoyed the video Peter thanks
Thanks 👍
Very informative. I remember most of the information from your previous videos. In this one you don't cover the difficulty of fitting hinges to the "easy" door, which is what would put me off that method.
Thanks! Yes, the loose-tenon method is still my preferred way - and the only way I've made these type of doors over the last 15 years or so - but the mock-panel method does produce a working door and many won't see the difference between them. My concerns about hinges remain the same, though as I say in this video, a 15mm backer with 6mm 'facing strips' produces a door with a bit more heft, and co-incidentally, satisfies my original concerns about hinges. 👍
Just depends on the hinge you're using. I've never had problems with hinges using the easy method
Great video; very informative, and fun to watch. My favourite RUclips joinery channel, keep up the good work.
Thanks! 👍👍
I bought the Axcaliber tongue and groove router bits from Axminster Tools a while ago... they're a nightmare to line up so I've gone with the tennon method too. So much easier!
Yep, been there! 👍
I use tongue and groove bits (not Axminster) or shaker bits and find that once you have the setting dialled in, if you measure the router bit height with a Trend Digital Depth Gauge (or similar) and record it for next time it's repeatable and pretty quick to set up - I always do a test piece or two for the final precise adjustment.
Lovely as always. Thank you for sharing.
🇧🇷
Thank you! 👍👍
I used mitre glue, obviously got to be 100% in right place as it sticks instantly
Another top tip
Thanks Ray!
I saw a trick recently that I remember the old guys using when I was starting out. You referred to "swimmy" joints, when making your faux panel doors. Have you tried shaking a little salt on the surface? It'll add a little grab, but melt away quickly.
Thanks, yes - I’ve heard that trick; never tried it as I never seem to have salt in the workshop! Must give it a try next time.👍👍
Hi, love the calm, unflappable delivery! Ever considered being the bearer of terrible news on U.K. Tv at about 5.00 pm? It would be very reassuring! I haven't seen a track saw track in that flip down right angle to a fence configuration before. Could that be done with a Marita track?
Hi and thanks! Let's just say I'm open to offers, lol! The hinged rail comes as standard on the Festool MFT - see videos #182 and #183 for more details - but AFAIK it remains a Festool patent. You can buy the spare parts to make your own, but they are pricey. I've never tried the Makita track, but it should fit as they follow the standard Festool-pattern pretty closely. 👍 👍
I’ve made a few mock shaker doors recently, worked out really well in the end, had a few issues with the hinges, but euro hinges solved any problems. I think in future I may try your first method though.
Honestly, the ‘faker shaker’ works well, but you do need to be careful with the edges, especially with hinges; euro hinges are good 👌👍
great stuff
Thanks! 👍
LEGEND
Hi Peter
In a video of yours you mentioned that you were going to do a router series. I’ve been searching for it - I want to make the loose tenon version of these doors but don’t have a router table …. Or a router! If you’re planning on doing a router series that would be awesome. If not - would you mind saying how you would router the grooves without a router table, which bit … how do do it safely etc. I’m planning on getting a basic 1/4 inch router. Cheers
Thanks! Haven’t managed but yet - it is still planned, just other things getting in the way. Honestly, I wouldn’t recommend trying to use a grooving bit handheld - any slight wobble and you’d mess up the groove. A table doesn’t have to bell anything fancy - most of my grooving was dine with a basic router bolted to the underside of a bench. 👍👍
Excellent as always. First method is how I do it to although not made as many doors as you 😂 I think I made my last rails and styles at 50mm you seem to do yours at 70. Did you find less than 80 makes them to fragile or just you like the look of them?
Thanks! 70mm just worked out as a good starting point for the kind of doors I made, but every job was different! 👍
I found this video very valuable, thank you. Do you recommend making the cabinet or the doors first?
Thanks! Cabinet first, always. 👍
Firstly...love the videos Peter, you’ve actually made me think about leaving kitchens and bathrooms and working solely on joiner projects.....just a quick question, your first method where you router a groove and the glue it floating tenons at the ends, how do you do 2 or more panel doors? Do you glue it small loose tenons for the middle rails or do you not route those sections?
Thanks! Yes, for doors with a mid-rail I glue in a small loose tenon. Not sure if it makes a difference tbh, but J always feel happier doing it. 👍👍
Hi Peter I was watching this video as I'm planning to do a kitchen for my Daughter in a shaker door style and I was wondering if you have a video of Make interior shaker door thank you it has been beneficial
I had to make two cabinet doors recently, so I thought I'd use the Millard Method. Trouble was, my supplier didn't have 6mm MDF in stock so I had to use 6mm ply for the panel. As you know, 6mm ply isn't actually 6mm but my grooving cutter is - so I had to fiddle to make the slot 6-and-a-bit. First door was a disaster as the panel was too tight a fit once the glue was in there. Second attempt was a different disaster as the slot was too wide so nothing wanted to stay square or flush. So for the third attempt I went with stopped slots and dominos... success! Think I'll stick with that method ;-)
Fair enough Jeremy - though I have to wonder what kind of supplier doesn't have 6mm MDF in stock! Glad you got it sorted, anyway! 👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop Normally they have everything - they blamed it on COVID-19 :-(
It was you that got me addicted to dominos - now I use them for everything. What's that expression?... when your only tool is a DF500, everything looks like a job-for-a-domino 8-)
Nicely done, great production. When I have a bit of time tomorrow, I'll put 001 and this one side by side on the big pc monitor to see the difference. One point of criticism: not a fan of the Patreon credits on the bottom.
Thanks Caspar! Re Patreon credits, it's a work in progress - as discussed over on Patreon, it's trying to find the balance of readability vs lack of 'friction'. The scrolling credits work well, but the fall-off in viewing is dramatic as soon as they start, which effectively makes a 10-minute video look like it's only being watched 80% at best - which impacts how the algorithm promotes it. 🤷♂️
Great informative video as always Peter! I'm planning to use the second method with 18mm standard MDF and 6mm stiles and rails glued and pinned for a tall (full board height) 240cm wardrobe door. After reading comments on other videos and forums, worried about problems with warping when stuck to only one side causing an imbalance. Will warping be an issue with standard 18mm MDF? (Also plan to use 5 blum hinges per door)
Thank You. Excellent Video as always, MRMDF, surely once it has been painted preferably exterior paint it will become moisture resistant? obviously, I am not intending to use the MDF outside just indoors,I am looking at the cost between the two one MRMDF and one cheaper becomes made into MRMDF?
Thanks.
MRMDF is a much better quality board - it has a much denser core, and is essentially formaldehyde free due to the binding agents used. It’s not really about the moisture resistance. 👍👍
Surprised that in the first way you made the door that you glued the panel into the frame. I would have left it loose - but then I'm not used to using MDF.
As I say in the vid, I don’t get extremes of temperature and humidity where I live and this door is made entirely of the same material, which is exceptionally stable. You shouldn’t confuse MR MDF with regular MDF btw, different animal altogether. 👍👍
Great video, can you recommend a router bit can't find one with the same depth of cut as yours
Thanks! There are links in the video description to everything used or featured 👍👍 Heavy duty groover - bit.ly/HD_Groover Arcbor for above - bit.ly/Arbor_8
Hi Peter wealden tools is out of stock of the cutter you recommend and won't have any for a month do you know of any others?
Hi Peter, thank you for these. Apart from safety could you do a stopped grove then put a domino/dowel/biscuit on the corners to connect the rails and styles?
Hi Matthew. Yes, you could do; I always found it easier just to continue the groove up the door tbh, but whatever works! 👍👍
This technique will only work with man made materials such as MDF. Your loose tenon approach would still work with real wood from a tree (remember those!). Would not put glue on panel, just have it floating. As always you show what can be achieved if you have thousands of pounds of woodworking tools (god that never gets old!!!!)
Well, I show two techniques, the second of which can be done with just a saw. 🤷♂️ And a cheap saw, too. For natural timber I’d always go with a stub tenon as I prefer the look. 👍👍
Peter Millard as always a pleasure to watch a craftsman at work....
peter and others i use a small roller tray and line it with tin foil saves a fortune and you can roll it up cover the roller reline tray and use again.......happy days
Thanks! I use tray liners, but foil’s a good trick, and way better than plastic bags! 👍👍
Hi, any reason you couldn't do the Grooves with just a router I.e not on a router table? I was thinking of doing a few rails in a row with some sacrificial bits on the end for support. Thanks in advance for your support andvgreat channel.
It’s do-able but *much* easier / safer to use a table.
What’s the reason for cutting the grove just below centre? Love the videos!
On a 22mm rail/stile it leaves quite a large lip to the panel; making one side 6/7mm just looks better, and also leaves the other side deeper so that when clients say ' you know I think I'd prefer a 'Victorian' panel door...' you can just flip it over and add some moulding. 👍
i had to google Keith Robinson thought he was a very clever woodworker that came up with ingenious solutions for a small shop .you where haven a laugh Peter
Great video - thanks. I’m about to start on some (painted) kitchen cabinet doors, and was planning on using MDF for the panels, and poplar for the rails and stiles. Could you please comment on the pros and cons of this approach, versus the full-MDF approach. Thanks in advance for your response.
Thanks! Poplar / tulipwood is a popular choice for door rails and stiles as it’s pretty stable, and obviously a harder material than MDF so likely to take knocks better - not that I’ve had any issues with MR MDF tbh. Not sure if I’d glue in the panel or not - the MDF won’t move, but the poplar may - so probably one for you to assess your environment for heat & moisture. No problem in principle with the plan though. 👍👍
Great Video sir excellent,love your system of cutting mdf boards. Could
you Pls explain about it..
Hi and thanks! It’s an off-the-shelf Festool MFT or Multi-function table & the hinged rail comes as standard. See videos #182 and #183 for more details. 👍 Video 182 ruclips.net/video/0V-p5F7SjO4/видео.html
@@10MinuteWorkshop Thank you sir
Is it important to make a groove larger tham 6 mm to insert the panel ? Thanks Peter to all the things you share, it is amazing. 👍🏻
Thanks! It makes it easier, yes. With my first doors I used a 6mm bit and it was a very tight fit and an uncomfortable glue-up! 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop thanks a lot Peter
I make cabinet doors using exactly the loose tenon technique described and it's great. The only difference I normally have is I use beaded pine cladding for the panel. It's extra work but I like the look. Quick question, are you using an extension on your router so you can do above table bit changes? If so, is it any good and which brand did you go for?
Thanks! No, no extension on this one - it’s the old Triton TRA001, has enough reach to get the collet all the way through. 👍👍
Great video. I’ve subscribed. I didn’t think PVA alone would hold the trim. I need to make two large wardrobe doors and I’ll try this. Can I ask why you trim to size after gluing and not just make it the right size to start with, or is it just impossible to ever get it bang on that way?
Trimming back to size after the glue-up just ensures that the edges are as clean as possible prior to painting. 👍
Hi Peter just found your channel & subbed you Amazing projects you are super talented ,
I and buying my first plunge /track saw so i have watched all your uploads on them thanks ,i have an old powerline plunge router and was thinking of putting it into a router table do you have any videos on making one as i would like to try to make on many thanks ,
take care stay safe ,
kind regards ,
clive.
Hi Clive and welcome. I'll be replacing my router bench before too long, so keep your eyes out for that one. 👍
Love your vids Peter! In Australia we only have access to 18 or 25mm MR MDF. If making large 2000 x 450mm cabinet doors, which thickness would you recommend using?
25mm at that height. I had problems with 18mm bowing at 1900, they all went away when I switched to 22mm. With 25mm I’d be tempted to use a 9mm panel. 👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop Thanks Peter. Much appreciated
Do you have any videos on adding a glass panel to a mdf door? How do you hold the glass in? Do screws not hold well on mdf?
Yes, I did glass doors in the ‘cabinets and shelves’ series, videos 165-167. Screws take fine in MDF as long as you pilot hole and use the right size. 👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop Thank you for your response. Love the videos. Keep up the great work.
Funny, I've been making doors this morning and here I am, having a cup of coffee, watching a video about making doors! It's an illness. Hodor gag gave me a giggle. You have a great way with these simple instructionals mate. I should take notes for my vids! Did you get my email btw Peter? You interested?
Always the way Stew - and thanks! Very kind of you to say. I owe you an email reply, just haven’t made it into the workshop yet! 🤷♂️👍
Hi Peter, I missed this video and only just watched it. You said you no longer make shaker doors the easier way and have a video for it (which I have now also watched) where your point, for which was a good one, was the hinge screws either fall on the gap between the panels. I am curious if you made loads of doors like this, how much come back did you get from customers with any issues with this method?
Hi Colin. I didn't make many doors the 'faker-shaker' way, with just planted-on strips of MDF, because I just didn't like them very much, but I've never had one fail, either because of screws or the construction method. But it's not best practise, and the loose tenon way is better, if you have the means to produce them. 👍
Perer, you cut the ¼" groove 6.35mm down - which side of your doors face out? also, if you were doing 2m doors would you use 9mm panels? many thanks!!
On a shaker door it’s usually the 1/4” side facing out; I use the deeper one if I’m applying moulding to make a ‘Victorian’ door. 👍
Hi Peter, I am an electronics engineer by trade but your channel has inspired me to get into making furniture ! I have made a shaker style dressing table with draws and bed side cabinets mostly from 18mm MR MDF painted white. The the built in wardrobes are in place but awaiting 4 large doors approximately 700 x 2200mm. I intend to use the floating tenant method . Would you recommend using 9mm panels rather than for this size door and 3 or 4 euro hinges? Any help would be much appreciated
Hi Mike! Wow, 700mm is a pretty wide door! Biggest I've done is 600 x 2200 with 22/6mm and it was fine. A 9mm panel would certainly give a bit more heft to it. I'd also use a deeper bottom rail, and a mid-rail. I'd have to do the maths on it, but I'd expect 3 hinges to be fine. FYI 18mm MRMDF is 15kg/sq m. Each hinge can take ~5Kg max. Work out the weights pro-rata, and see how many hinges you need. 4 might just be safest anyway! 👍
Hi Peter, thanks for this re-made episode. Finally on the verge of putting your guidance into practice!
I have the Festool OF1010 router. If I had it mounted in a table, home made, do you think it would have enough ‘grunt’ to use the groover you linked to?
Perhaps a question I could/should pose to Wealdon!?
Thanks Dave
Hi Dave. It’s a big bit to swing, but if anything can the the OF1010 would - you’d need an 8mm arbor and collet for it though, I think. Wealden do a smaller groover, gives a ~13mm groove - lots of guys O know use that one and it works fine. HTH. P👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop That’s great, thanks for your thoughts 👍
Rgds Dave
Hey Pete. Was wondering what the max depth the domino 500 plunges too with 8or 10mm tenons??? You da best pal👍👍
Hiya. Max depth is 28mm on the DF500, 70mm on the DF700 👍
Great video Peter. Quick question if I may? I see from the links you're using the Wealden Groover. I'm guessing you're using the 6.35mm cutter? What size bearing guides are you using? I suppose it comes down to ratios of stiles / rails to panel but curious what size you use and if you change them? Cheers Greg
Hi Greg, and thanks! I use whatever bearing comes with the arbor tbh - never changed it. From memory it gives a ~21.5mm deep groove or thereabouts; if I need a shallower fierce I use the fence. 👍👍
Is it ok to use 22 Mrmdf + 6 Mrmdf for panels on a 1800 x 600 kitchen unit door thanks
Sure. Most of my doors were made like that. The 22mm rails and stiles give the door enough ‘heft’ that the thinner panel isn’t an issue. 👍
Really informative, thank you! You mentioned a router table is the safest way to cut the grooves- how else could you do it? I am thinking of investing in a table saw and I am wondering if I could use that. I’m also wondering if would you use the same method for building the panel door if you were using hardwood instead of MDF?
Thanks! It’s possible to use the same grooving but freehand in a router, but I wouldn’t recommend it as it’s for experienced router users only. And yes it would be possible to make the grooves with a table saw, but using an unguarded blade is a real no-no here in the UK - it’s a 5-figure fine in a commercial workshop, so I couldn’t recommend it.
Hi Peter sorry to bother you but I can only find a 12.7 slotting router bit is that ok to do my doors as your bit seems a lot bigger thank
John
Hi John. 12.7mm is OK - lots of guys use them - but I do prefer the HD grooving bit as it gives a 20-odd mm groove. 👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop thanks