Star Wars vs Star Trek: The Empire at War with The Federation!! Part 2 of 2
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- Опубликовано: 22 авг 2024
- Be sure to watch part 1 first! • Star Wars Vs Star Trek...
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Sorry about the 'voice shift' in the middle!
After the wormhole shift, the expansionist empire comes through and gains a foothold in the Milky Way galaxy, and now faces the Federation, Klingons, and Romulans!
Will the Federation out-wit the Empire? Is the Empire's military might and thousands of years of technological development too much for the Federation?
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a vulcan with a lightsaber.
anything you say against that, has no value.
it's just pure win.
It is illogical to resist
@@artembentsionov if the Borg assimilated a vulcan
Throw in the clone of Kahless as well.
Tbh my mind cannot even comprehend the magnitude of Awesomeness that is.
No... Words...
"Oh, sure, blame me for everything again."
- Q
Classic, just classic.
lmao
This does feel like something Q would do after getting bored.
I really don't think the empire would ever go through the effort of outfitting tie fighters with warp drives
They don't even bother to give them shields
Some how right still thrawn would say they should and palpatine also build for this blue boi The defender class a tie Fighter with shields and hyperdrive
@@stwlord5119 And then he would be ignored because the Empire is run by idiots.
@@kaicreech7336 not really palpatine would defjnetly understand and Do that bc He really trusts thrawn
But you are Kind of right everyone EXCEPT thrawn and palpatine are idiots
I don't think tie fighers would even pose a threat to Star Fleet vessels, they would be easy targets for phaser beam arrays. It'd be one hit kills and no way to evade as Star Fleet vessels tend to have 360 degree firing arcs. Tie fighters against the Enterprise would be like gnats attacking a horse.
@@asvarien
While the Federation does have 360 firing arcs, phasers are always capable of hitting small, fast-moving targets like TIE's. While the standard TIE fighter doesn't have the ability to penetrate the shields of anything, a Squadron of TIE bombers could use a successive series of strikes to break throufh, but they are much slower.
The TIE Defender would have the potential to pose a threat to a federation vessel in paper, though that doesn't account for the increased speed and manuverability of Federation vessels compared to capitol ships in the Star Wars universe.
And of course, all this implies anyone in the Imperial Navy that isn't Thrawn, Vader, and maybe Yularren are competant.
I think part of the problem is the way the two forces have been shown to use their technology. You never really hear anything in SW about adjusting anything. Shields are just shields, blasters are just blasters. ST was written so that most of their tech was adjustable in multiple ways.
It could be explained tat the Galactic Empire has become complacent in their apex domination of the galaxy. any new tech is made by them, so they wouldnt make something that could destroy a star destroyer in one hit. they also would certainly not give tat tech to anyone outside the higher echolons of the empire. So shields being shields stay that way cause they never need to be more powerful, or modulate, or be able to extend to envelope an asteroid.
its also that in wiritng a star wars story shields are shields and thats that, they dont have to do more cause the story is focussed elsewhere. like with engines, tey get the character from point A to B it doesnt matter too much how fast tey do it
There are some stories about upgrading turbo lasers. The Clone War era ships still used by the Empire were to be upgraded. Not sure where these stories are, most of my Star Wars information is from memories that includes fan content.
Actually, both the Federation and the Empire gets killed by a small, ragtag group of franchise assassins... commanded by 5 Star General JJ Abrahms!
I believe three years later it was Disney Sith Lord's in conjunction with Woke Leftist Snowflakes that brought them both to their knees.
Lol
@@sp9392 He may be a silent consultant for Dr. Who too?!
Lol
Oh god it’s too accurate😂
Hey, Empire, psst, there’s this other dimension just ripe for the taking. It’s called “fluidic space”. Good luck!
Death Star vs. Species 8472. Now that's a fight I'd buy tickets to see.
Tarkin: "Fear will keep them in line"... "Oh. They have a giant planet killing laser too. Never mind."
@@duanscott2490 and, if I'm not mistaken, Species 8472 has more then one of these giant planet killing lasers.
Now we know you are the ultimate evil in the Galaxy
Vader: The Force will allow us to destroy them...
Species 8472: Actually, we’re powerful psychics in our own right, each and every one of us. And only 2 of you
Not to worry, they definitely don't have more planet killing lasers than you...
Vader has underestimated the power of real life physics.
No he has not as he would say " do not underestimate the power of the force"
@@aidanfallon68 God that's stupid
@@aidanfallon68 as we would say, "your religious cultism means nothing here, Vader. Your powers are useless here."
@@kaicreech7336 😂😂 don't care pal
@@aidanfallon68
Your lack of competance ain't my responsibility pal.
You're missing one of the federation's greatest advantages, computer guided weapons. 90% of all empirical weapons miss, while 100% of all federation weapons will hit.
Not true. You can watch Star trek and see them miss all over the place. All it takes is evasive maneuver. Star trek mentiones that also. "Take evasive action". If they always hit there target, movement in battles wouldn't matter because they would hit there mark everytime.
Imperial, not empirical
This is completely wrong. When you see the Empire missing, you're seeing large turbo lasers shooting at small snub fighters. Against something the size of the Enterprise D, they wouldn't miss.
@@Tinfoil_Hardhat - they would. The Enterprise D is incredibly nimble compared to Imperial Ships.
@@gaffawebber It's somewhat nimble. It's not nimble enough to avoid fire. Something like the defiant would be far better against Imperial Star Destroyers.
It's always my fault.
Who else would have a sadistic enough mind to do it? *cough*
XDD
XDDD
I blame The Borg. You and your friends in the continuum probably got pretty scared of them. Heck, I would be too even if I was Darth Vader. Considering they could possibly assimilate sentient energy which was similar in nature to the living force.
Just stop gallivanting around the galaxy, using your omnipotence to impress females of every species!
Why am I not surprise that Q is involved in this hypothetical intergalactic shenanigans? That's right because he's the galaxy's scapegoat.
Nah, sometimes it’s 0, or Gargan, or The One, or (*)
Personally I think the Q Continuum would be eradicated by the Sith. The reason why I think this is simple: when Q flings the Enterprise into the Federation's 'first' encounter with the Borg, Q shows in his dialogue with Picard that even HIS race is wary of the Borg's power.
The Sith (Emperor Palpatine and Darth Vader) are FAR more powerful than the Borg because they can use the Force. I personally think that the Prophets, or 'wormhole aliens' would not only defeat the Q Continuum but also the Sith and the Empire.
Remember that the 'Prophets' are NOT linear, meaning that they can see ALL possible futures.
I personally think that the Q Continuum tries NOT to cross/anger the 'Prophets/wormhole aliens'.
Again, this is just my own personal opinion.
@@nakedgamer7310 your ignorant opinion buddy
Naked Gamer The Q only worry about the borg as they do not wish for them to take over the galaxy. Like us humans want diversity in the wilderness, the Q want diversity in the galaxy
As much as I love the character of Q he is a terribly tempting plot device for all kinds of nonsense
Warp can be used to great effect in combat, that would give the Federation a massive advantage in fights. The Empire would be limited to fighting at sublight speeds, whereas the Federation could hop all around the star destroyers.
And what about the discovery?
(To be fair, it uses something like a network from our galaxy so it wouldn't work in the other one)
They wouldn't need to hop around because all the Empire has its laser blasters
Starflower can use some of their weapons during warp. The crew will feel dizzy while circling the isd
After watching both star trek and star wars the UFP and friends would mop the floor with the Empire judging by the level of technology they both have. A galaxy class or a war bird would be enough to take out a star destroyer. The super powers of star trek would be flipping a coin to see witch one gets to bring down the Empire and bring home the booty. The Empire would do best to stay home and pick on people that hangout with bigfoot. LOL.
@@simply2187 I agree, starflower is a better name for Starfleet. After watching most of star trek, I can understand why the are bully magnets.
I'd like to see the Dark Star Trek Universe go against the Empire.
Empire should attack federation first🤣 because if not, they'll just use the slow diplomacy 🤣
@@lancelot1546 Not in the Mirror Universe, against the Terran Empire.
@@chrismaguire3667 I think the Empire could beat those guys. They are so power-hungry, there'd be no shortage of spies/saboteurs trying to curry favor with the Emperor. The Empire wouldn't need a fleet, they'd just need to send in a few negotiators, backed-up by Vader and a few dozen expendables. I say Palpatine is on the throne inside a month, tops.
@@michaelmorris1741 More likely they'd end up as allies. But it would be an uneasy one....
@@chrismaguire3667 at the end of the day,the emperor gets overthrown by the ambition of one single named character who has murdered his way up into the ranks.
He tapes warp nacelles to a tie striker, genius, just pure genius.
The Clone Gamers spat out my drink laughing as I thought the same thing XD
It makes then in many ways superior to an X-wing if you do that with a Tie Advanced. Remember, Tie were mostly sublight with no hyperdrive because they didn't have the space for the navigation computers. They were parasite ships.
However, warp engines don't require nearly the complex calculations to use, and so you could put something like warp drives on Tie Bombers and Tie Advanced to project a sizable force which could easily deal with smaller Federation ships. Basically, the death of a thousand cuts, striking out at dozens of systems simultaneously, forcing the Federation to maintain a very defensive pose and diverting a major percentage of their fleets to defensive actions to avoid massive civilian losses. It would have, at the very least, minimized their opponent's ability to amass fleets to harass and attack their main star destroyer fleets, and been a massive pain for the Federation.
Now the scary thing is that the warp nacells and duturium crystal matricies gives you the power budget to put a Federation-style multi-phasic shield on a Tie Advanced or Tie Bomber...
I guess if the Empire did retorfit fighters with phasers and sheilds they could overwhelm a large battleship in star trek. I still think that federation ships like voyager can turn on a dim. (always though those star destroyers turned slowly)
Shields yeah, phasers, no point. The weapons of the SW universe would be capable enough to do the job required. And as for maneuverability, even an Intrepid class wouldn't be able to keep up with the swarms of fighters as the dime a TIE can turn on is far smaller than the cruisers just thanks to the relative size of both ships.
+Rhodri Davies Star wars battles take longer, more shots to kill a ship.
while in star trek, 3 shots, dead.
Id say the Trek weapons are obviously better.
Fighters?
100 shuttles/smallass ships can beat them.
Epilogue, One day in the distant future, a new republic fleet is patrolling the outer rim territories when they come across a ship, of a design they have never seen before. They try to establish communication with the alien craft. The craft simply responds "We are the borg, lower your defenses and surrender your ships. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance... is futile".
IMHO, Luke Skywalker would make an excellent Locutus.
Vaping Saves Lives that would make for an interesting story for sure. but how far in the future are we talking here? if a new Jedi order is already established there's no way the Borg can take them down.
Perhaps. It would be interesting to see if the borg were able to assimilate a Jedi or 2, if they would be able to adapt, and render the Jedi's unique abilities useless. That IS the borg's biggest asset after all.
what about: Epilogue, one day in the distant future a new republic fleet is patrolling when siddenly a yellowish portal opens up and dozens of organic yellow ships come out.
8472 was scary AF
You can bring the Empire down to its knees with one fell swoop. Send in Q.
Vader: "You underestimate the power of the dark side..."
Q: "and YOU underestimate the power of bug spray!"
Vader: "Wha-" Transforms into a bug in a flash of light
Q: "See?" Sprays buggie Vader
@@simplebott4812 I mean if you want to do that than Vader immediately atomizes Q(yes he’s done this before).
if the Q dont bother taking out the borg then they wouldnt with the empire
@@simplebott4812 I'm in before the fanboys try to explain how Q would be no match for Vader. Anyway, I'm convinced that 'Q' did intervene, and has altered reality to the point where the Empire is now nothing more than the 'heavy' in a make-believe drama that has sold billions of dollars worth of merchandise.
I find it hard to believe that The Empire would leave their galaxy before defeating The Rebels first.
Wormhole opens new conquest opportunities. The Empire has, apart from the force-enhanced foresight (force-sight?) of Emperor Palpatine, not a lot of strategic acumen. HitIer fought a war on two fronts while suffering losses by the French Resistance (although in that historical example it was the other way 'round - the leader overriding his generals' advice with fanatical ambition). Imperial officers fit the description Spielberg offers in "The Last Crusade" : "goose-stepping morons." The Sith, and Thrawn, were the real strategic intelligence behing the empire, like a Gung-Fu master wielding a staff or a Krat Maga expert wielding a simple hammer.
the rebellion is anyone who has empathy or a yearning for freedom in their heart and mind. Just like Gowron asked Picard "Have you ever fought an idea, picard?" so too must the Empire fight the movement of the rebellion. The rebellion is a disgust, distrust, or even just an annoyance with how the Empire runs things. Even if you arnt knowledgable to the empires atrocities paying a toll at every spaceport to the local Empire Policing Cruiser seems pointless and cutting into your smuggling profits. that seed right there of annoyance is enough to at least have someone look the other way if a rebel spy needs to hide in your cargo container.
Defeating the rebellion in this way although possible would take generations of indoctrination and a level of control unattainable by the Empire. but try do try.
As stated in the video Grand Mof Tarkin wanted newer resources from the Milkyway galaxy to build the death star in order to avoid taxing the local systems too much. This would avoid angering the population and watering the seed of rebellion. If you had to build the death star would you take away what a population had left to build it? "Iv got nothing to live for, which means I have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Im joining the rebellion"
If the Federation gets the Hyperdrive...
The Empire... RUN.
They don't really need it.
@@KH4444444444N They could combine both. Warp speed inside hyperspace.
Probably enough to travel galaxies and to escape the Borg, or perhaps vaporise them with sheer speed AT THEIR PRIME
Where is the Dominion in all of this? The Dominion wouldn't take kindly with another empire traveling through its territory.
they're 90,000 light years away in the Gamma Quadrent
So it isn't the same wormhole?
of course it is, but q has put the exit to another place, so for thedominion the wormhole disappeared
Fred Calabrese And the Iconians, and the Sphere Builders, and 8472, the list goes on. Empire may not be ready to deal with some of the heavy hitters in ST. Unlikely in fact that they ever would be. The Iconian and Herald forces depicted in the STO game, and a few books greatly outnumber the Empire-s combined military might, and then some. They built the Dyson Spheres that Scotty got trapped near in TNG
@@JettMann8
Dyson Spheres are an integration from real-life futurism; a Dyson Sphere houses the population and energy output of an entire galactic civilization in a single structure.
You forgot the Federation's most powerful weapon: Tribbles.
Awww the sheer cuteness of tribbles might give them cuteness overload and short circuit their brains
Actually that's a hilariously devastating idea
The shields go down, just transport some tribbles over and enjoy the rest of the fight
@@Illyrikalaufeyson ....and don't forgot their rapid breeding!
So in part 1 it was stated that the Empire (and all predecessors) had developed hyperspace drives because transporter tech would not work in that galaxy due to slightly different physics, but in part 2 the Rebels are able to use it?? Deus Ex Machina?
I think, maybe reading between the lines, he meant that differences in physics led down easier paths of innovation, so the technologies were just never invented there. The Federation could undoubtedly analyze the differences and compensate. I mean isn't that what saves like 50% of TNG episodes, is simply reconfiguring the transporters? ;) ... speaking of Deus Ex...
@@jdjonsson Nope, definitely busted on continuity.
And 'Deus Ex' is a good insight; one of the many techonological assets at the Federation's command is Nanites (who are their own civilization by now. Also the Binars. Also the Exocoms. Also (potentially, if they resolved the social disparity with their veterans) the enhanced soldiers of Angosia III (see TNG episode "The Hunted"). Also the phasing cloak (TNG Episode "The Pegasus").
... there's more, but those are highlights. The Federation has tech out the yin-yang they can field in an asymmetric conflict.
he could have retconned it because it makes for a better story
but I agree with IvyMikes response. perhaps, given time, the Star Wars universe developes transporter tech, given the subtle differences in the two universes transporter tech for star wars is just harder and would take longer to invent and also perfect
My stars..
Sisko VS Thrawn in a strategy war game.
Do it.
No, Thrawn would easy win.
Sisko would win if they're at the same table... It's punching distance.
Sisko for the win. Sisko would just shut down the wormhole, or make.it a one way road from the federation.
Just like was done to the Dominion.
The Star Wars universe already had cloaking technology.
@The Archangel that's not the way star trek cloaking works. Scanning sweeps simply are channeled around cloaking fields to continue into space. That's why it appears to sensors that nothing is there. Sort of the way light bends around a massive object like stars. Also the reason that the star field behind a cloaked is visible. The ship isn't invisible. Light and radiation bends around it.
@@CoryLeith-nv6wb yes and it was hilarious in the books
Yes, they do. It's very costly to install. The Federation can simply replicate cloaking devices as they need them.
Lasers ?!? Don't they know lasers won't even penetrate our navigation screens ?
That is just a bunch of BS and I believe it is navigation Shields
Super heated plasma with a yeild upwards of 250 megatons
What about the ion cannons on Imperial Star Destroyers?
This video is stupid as f****** he's not making any kind of damn senselasers won't even penetrate the federation shield or romulan shield or Klingons shield what the f*** is he talkin
What Star Wars calls lasers are actually plasma weapons, just like lightsabers
During this era in ST history the federation possesses something the Imperials do not. They possess time ships that work with temporal mechanics. Federation runs into trouble? Delete the Imperials past, simple.
That’s against the temporal prime directive just kidding the time agents are incompetent at their very best
Yeah I as a star wars fan find that the star wars universe is often overestimated by many people its very dumb and stupid say star wars beats star trek is just as dumb as the flat earth theory, so for all my fellow star wars fans stop overestimatign our franchaise so much its getting very immature and atleast try to know what side the opposite franchaise has aganist our franchaises because even grand admiral thrawn says to defeat and enemy you must know them and do you think we know our oppoinent frnachaise absouetly we are just being a bunch of biased cyberjerks now in fact I personally think now that star trek demolishes star wars and its coming from a person who has watched and loves both francahises. So in conclusion just don't be biased guys.
I feel bad for Thrawn. He was sent there just to clean up Tarkin's mess. Btw, great video, everything played out splendidly.
He always did get the short end of the stick between him and Tarkin. Probably because Tarkin kept kissing Palpatine's ass while Thrawn didn't.
No doubt
Thrawn is also non canon... if you bring him in you must also include the shatnerverse.
Rayray Schnapps He is Canon because of the new Thrawn novel and Star Wars Rebels
Thrawn might've actually stood a chance at taking the Federation down. Like if he were the representative in that meeting, he would have probably taken the chance at exchanging cultures and technologies and studied everything to learn how to better combat them.
Another thumbs up from me. If the Empire has a major weakness, that is the internal unrest. Overall, i think you made an excellent what-if scenario and maintained a level of neutrality not often encountered in the SF circles. Kudos!
ilejovcevski79 My sentiments exactly.
I think that the internal unrest in the Milky Way is a much bigger weakness. Romulan's have shown in the past that they would take advantage of an incursion and the Cardasians would definitely side with the Empire. Also, the Klingons wouldn't be so ready to share their tech... I find that the unity of the Milky Way forces to be WAY too exaggerated. Of course if you are going to say that all the mental racial abilities of the Federation side will be enhanced in the galaxy far, far away then entire planets of force sensitives going through the worm hole would probably still give the Fed side the win.
Dunno, maybe. The way i see it, after the Dominion war, and the resent events on Remus and Romulus, the Alpha quadrant is quite stable. The Romulan-Federation relations are the best they've been since... well.....since ever and the Cardasians are not an issue, still recovering from the war. On the other hand, no force would ever make the Rebel Alliance side with the Empire.
The ability augmentation i find to be a nice little touch, so some level playing field can be established without bringing in Organians, Q and other "exotic" species into the mix. After all, it is a what-if scenario, not an actual conflict.
Jean-Luc Martel Now that you mention it 😂😂😂
The Cardassians would probably be in recovery mode at this point and still recovering. Given their situation of military and public support exhaustion they would remain politically neutral. Likely they would do underhand tech trades with the Empire. Sign non-aggression pacts. I don't think they would be interested in another war given their losses in manpower and likely territory.
The three major powers of the Federation, Klingons, and Romulans would likely see the Empire as another Dominion threat and would be able to easily set aside differences again. They just got done doing this in the last war which is still fresh in everyone's mind so uniting quickly against the Empire would not be a far stretch.
If is after the Nemesis event then the Romulans would be inclined to work with the Federation seeing how their senate was assassinated and the old guard that schemed against the Federation would be gone. A new senate would likely be pro-peace with its former enemy. I agree completely that the Klingons would not share any tech.
When you say the wormhole exits in a galaxy "Far, Far Away" I can't help but think of Shrek.
It’s never ogre til I say it’s ogre
Federation has multiple unmentioned technologys 1. spore drive 2. Intrepid class armor 3. Quantum torpedoes 4. Chroniton torpedo 5. Transwarp
even if we were to rule out spore drive due to discovery stuff, but still.
When the part of Grand Admiral Thrawn came up. I was thinking Holy Shit, they're fucked.
I did enjoy how this played out. Very well done and thought out.
Maybe the next one could be the Imperials vs the Galmans/Gamilons from the Space Battleship Yamato series.
That would be interesting, I wonder how they'd deal with those weird space submarines, sure it's similar to cloaking but with the adwnatage of not being physically present in real space.
I would hope during this conflict there would be a time when Thrawn and Picard get a chance to have a conversation. Those two would be respectful enimes, or even friends in another life.
Yeah. About as well thought out as raw eggs for breakfast.
Jon Mcgee I like to see the Grand Admiral vs the wraith from Stargate Atlantis
It is very easy to overlook what other toys the Federation has in the basement. For example, there is the cloaking device developed by the Federation, which not only cloaks, but also allows flight through solid matter. Featured in the TNG show where Riker meets his former captain of the USS Pegasus, now an admiral in Starfleet Intelligence. The Romulans know about it, but the Federation never dug up that "weapon" again. I wouldn't be surprised if this extragalactic threat justified the use of this remedy. Because one thing is very clear and I'm betting dollars against pesos: the guys from the engineering corps are guaranteed to have continued to tinker with it in private...
Just shows to go ya, "when in doubt, blame Q."
If I was the Federation, I'd broadcast a message, "Hey Borg! Here's a new species for you to assimilate! Come and get 'em..."
love both, but I will offer two arguments in favor of the Federation: First, technology in the Federation progresses quickly: a Galaxy class starship gets surprised by Jemhadar fighters; a couple years later, the saucer/arrow section of a Prometheus class cruiser, manned by confused holograms, takes a heavily shielded D'deridex class warbird apart in seconds, using only phasers. If the Federation were really in trouble, they'd outfit an Akira class cruiser with the Pegasus phase cloak and arm it with Omega Particle torpedoes (for when you gotta wipe out an enemy navy, plus the entire solar system it's in, with one shot). The Empire would have to subdue the Federation (and probably other Alpha Quadrant powers) really fast, and that might be tough if they needed to first map out hyperspace routes that took centuries to chart in their own galaxy.
Second, I understand why you wanted to avoid using real physics in a fantasy sci-fi matchup, but it's hard for me to ignore the fact that Starfleet uses antimatter, while I only ever remember ships in the SW universe using fusion reactors (maybe that's my mistake; I'm more familiar with ST). Assuming nuclear fusion works the same way in the SW and ST universes, an antimatter reaction is vastly more energetic than a fusion reaction. Presumably, this would allow shields and weapons on Federation ships to be more powerful than those of the Imperial Navy.
I mean, Star Wars ships also use ion engines...so...
The only technology the Empire has that is strictly superior to UFP tech is the hyperdrive, and even that needs hyperspace lanes to use most efficiently. Voyager reverse engineered Quantum Slipstream drive, which is technically standard issue in the "soft canon" Star Trek Online, so take that for what you will. The Empire over-relies on slow weapons that cannot track at relativistic velocities, while Trek _Shuttlecraft_ can fly up to seven tenths of the speed of light. You only need to reach 5% of light speed to be relativistic by the way. Oh, and warp speed can be used for combat purposes.
Then there's transporters, which every single race in Trek has some form of. They developed their shielding technology in such a way that transporters cannot pierce them. There's also insanely broken things like Iconian gateways laying around, there's the Romulan Thaleron weapons, there's the fact that 20 battleships wiped out 15% of a planet's crust in one volley. Unless Extended Universe content is brought in, the Empire is just not a threat to the UFP. Or the Klingons. Or the Romulans. There's also things like protomatter which can purge a planet's surface of its life forms and reconstitute it when used properly (the Genesis device,) the Cardassian Dreadnought torpedo (1,000kg of matter and antimatter, enough to crack a planet in half,) as I mentioned the Romulan Thaleron weapons and ships that can fire while cloaked, the Klingons have succeeded in creating that last bit as well, but are more limited in the whole unique superweapon aspect.
Then there's the Borg. The Federation was prepping to fight the Borg for decades by the 25th century, which the Dominion War ended less than twenty years before, the Defiant, Sovereign, Prometheus, and more ships were designed with confrontations with the Borg in mind. Even with how much the OP limited the UFP's tech, if you take that limit away, literally the only advantage that the Star Wars ships have is their hyperdrives. Hyperdrives are quite a bit faster than warp drives, sure. If the UFP ever captures any ship with a hyperdrive, they'll reverse engineer it. This isn't even bringing up the Tholians, the Breen, the Dominion, the Borg, or Species 8472. Trek tech is better, except when it comes to FTL speed. It isn't a contest. Only EU numbers tip the balance the other way.
I'm baffled that people still think that it is something that can be compared.
@@Cleptro Ermmmm Ion Engines versus Antimatter Engines.......
@@nuclearsimian3281 Though SW's EU is still has its canoncity disputed.
Hell,even the Q of SW is said to be childish.
That ended better than anticipated. I thought it was some fan boy claiming the empire would steam roll because force. Nope this was well thought out and you crossed everything perfectly. Great job! You added a new sub for this amazing and well thought out series
In truth, the steam roll would go the other way... force or no...
Sameson223VIDS they would tho
Lol, you're laughable, end of conversation.
Sameson223VIDS I smell some ripe bias....
I mean if it was Sidious yes. Considering he had become so strong in the Dark Side he was a wellspring of the Dark Side, a source, a physical embodiment of it, so even if the universe as a whole lacked the Dark Side he would still be at full power, and he was able to drain entire planets of life to further fuel his own, cobtrol the minds of star sytems, have some limited influence on the mind of almost every Imperial commander in the galaxy, wipe out planets with lightning or Force Storms, and so on. So in such a case that Sidious personally got involved it would steam roll.
It should also be noted that three star destroyers with no other support could wipe out the surface of a planet within hours.
I agree for the most part with the given scenario however the rebellion at this point was a minor event, it didn't have even enough men to crew more than maybe two star destroyers.
Guess giving up near instant site to site transport was a fairer exchange for crippling The Force than I originally assumed. Additionally, by placing this scenario after the Dominion War, I'd also expect better planetary defenses... perhaps even good enough to prevent a Death Star from firing! I'm not sure how well Star Trek's dilithium regulated antimatter annihilation reactors would compare to Star War's hypermatter annihilation reactors, but Starfleet is so technologically superior that the Galaxy class with families aboard is considered equivalent to the larger and purpose built Romulan Warbird! Additionally, while the sciences in Star Trek vastly improve over decades, the archives on Coruscant contain centuries of accumulated conclusions and most of the significant breakthroughs are just gathering the workforce together to assemble a more intimidating warship or mass production of complicated components to improve the survivability of usually disposable fighters.
The Galaxy Class is not known to be an equivalent to the 24th-century Romulan Warbird. Channel creator has done later videos indicating that, if anything, the D'deridex class Warbird outclasses the Federation's Galaxy Class, due to much more internal volume, more powerful weapons, and better power & defense systems. It's not nearly as flexible & multirole-capable as a Galaxy Class, just 'bigger-better-faster-more.'
'Planetary defenses'... you're talking about the level of defenses I saw playing Master of Orion II. I wouldn't expect the Federation to try that on every major planet. Their mainstay defense is starbases, which may not be able to withstand a Death Star, but in ST continuity can withstand hours to days of continuous fire..
@@HuntingTarg The D'deridex class Warbird internal volume was necessary to compensate for how bulky their inferior technology is, yet still couldn't come close to Galaxy class multi-role capability. The cloak and artificial black holes are the Romulans main advantages. The channel creator's interpretations is what I'm criticizing!
Although, I mostly agree with what you said about planetary defense. Just that with Star Wars invading after the Borg and Dominion should have resulted in better preparations for the next military crisis. I don't remember, was Section 31 mentioned in part 1 or were they overlooked as well?
The federation will wipe the floor with the empire.
yes you could use a old rusty Klingon bird of prey in cloak. beam torpedoes to the main power source of the imperial ships and detonate them without taking a scratch since they have no shields to stop something like that
Am I the only one who thinks Data would make a fantastic Jedi Master? He would execute the Jedi code perfectly and be able to train with the force ghost of Dr. Sung.
The Federation wins, on Technology.
@The Archangel Not necessarily. The range of Federation weapons are vastly superior to Imperial weapons. The v-150 Planet Defender deployed by the Rebel forces on Hoth, an ion cannon so bulky that it's planet-bound, has an optimal range of 4,000 km and a maximum range of 180,000 km. Federation weapons have a much further range, phasers being about 300,000 km and the range of photon torpedoes being in the millions of kilometers. At those ranges, the Federation ships wouldn't even need to use shields.
@The Archangel Let me grant you that the plasma weapons would make short work of any Federation defenses. Let me also grant you that phasers would stand no chance against a Star Destroyer's shields. I'll even grant that TIE fighters are extremely fast and accurate. Here are a few points I am considering though:
1. A Federation ship still has a firing range many times further than almost any Imperial weapon. They also have the ability to stay out of that firing range thanks to their warp engines which can be called upon on a moment's notice for an extended trip or a quick jump.
2. If TIE fighters are launched, they would be sitting ducks while they tried to close the distance. They have no shields and would be facing long-range computer-controlled weapons which almost never miss. Even if they did close the distance, again, warp engines would open the gap again.
3. The Federation wouldn't come charging in either, not unless the captain were reckless or stupid. The Federation are greatly made up of explorers and scientists. They've put a lot of time and resources into their sensors (thanks much to cloaking technology) and it would take very little time to determine the make-up of a Star Destroyer. They would quickly recognize the offensive and defensive capabilities of such a ship.
4. Finally, the ace in the hole for the Federation: torpedoes. If you recall from the movies, physical objects aren't stopped by the shields of the Star Destroyers. Recall how the Millennium Falcon got close enough to latch itself to one or how others were pummeled in the asteroid field. A photon torpedo is little more than an unmanned ship with an explosive charge. They could be directed at any point on the Star Destroyer, most likely the shield generators or bridge.
So both sides have weapons which the other can't defend against, but their range and maneuverability give the Federation ships the win.
-Note: I did some additional research and a TIE fighter going flat-out at 100 MGLT (1MGLT = 0.3 km/s) would be going 1,200,000 km/h while a starship going at one-quarter impulse would be going just shy of 270,000,000 km/h (1/4 the speed of light). Please correct my math if I'm wrong though.
-Note: I have to disagree with phasers being described as "literally just superheated lasers" as their beam can stun or fully disintegrate a target. A superheated beam would burn through a target (possibly setting them on fire), but wouldn't cause full disintegration and certainly not the ability to stun. This is true for a ship's phasers as well since they have been known to stun large areas.
Maybe in the beginning, but in this dudes scenario the Federation trades away technology to the Star Wars universe. The tech advantage is the only thing keeping the Federation alliance alive. But since he said the Federation alliance gives the Stars Wars Universe tech in trade, then the tech advantage wouldn't last long. The empire would eventually catch up.
@@TheBigExclusive The big mistake would actually be hyperspace routes. With intricate knowledge, the Empire would just "appear" well within attack range, shoot with a fully charged Ion, then pummel the VERY EXPOSED engines that are very large, of every enemy starfleet ship. also, with multiple locations to set up things like connor nets, the Empire gets a VERY UNFAIR advantage. Also, beaming and warp require shields to be down for ST, unlike SW so SW would just chase until ST ran out of fuel. Also, with intricate knowledge of every ally planet, SW would just 40k deep strike from behind. Also, the Empire wouldn't hesitate to 'cheat' with an alliance with Species 8472, like they did with the Hutts in a what if battle.
More realistic: The alliance wouldn't probably fall through because Palpatine would be furious if Tarkin tried something like that as the Rebels would take full advantage of that. Also, the Federation, as well as the Vulcans, would make huge allies, with the Klingons only making average because the Empire would already have more powerful weaponry at this point (through technicality only).
@@nicholasyost8400 Not sure 8472 would like to ally with a conquesting Empire tho.
If we are bringing Sith into this.... we get hero ships from Star Trek too.... Sisko and the USS Pimp Hand can handle this.
@Victor Nikolai Remember, Starfleet uses only the finest rocks in every console. They've shared the technology with the Klingons and Romulans. The Empire never stood a chance.
@@duanscott2490 "Wait SpongeBob! We're _not_ cavemen! We have technology..."
AWESOME! Keep em coming. I love the set up for this scenario and how informed and logical it all is. As a fan of both IPs I must say this is very well done.
yeah, if it is socially acceptable to completely ignore certain tech advantages for st and boost up the tech in sw and call it even.............
I just wonder what will happen to those trapped/captured when the wormhole reverts back to normal.
Will Star Fleet keep the prisoners indefinitly.....or find a "place" for them.
Same with those stuck in the other galexy........
They'll be sent to Seti Alpha 5 to begin a colony. It'll be great!
They'd probably let them settle somewhere. Really, what crime have the committed? With replicator technology so common, the Federation is a virtual Utopia. Those stuck in the other galaxy face quite a different fate.
The guys with the federation in the star wars universe probably either are killed go into hiding until the rebels win or join the rebellion
You've completely omitted the Borg technologies often used by Captain Janeway and Seven of Nine which are now advanced and parts of Star Fleet🤔 Maybe in part 3 😉
So the federation assimilated the Borg?
Was this in TNG?
quelorepario voyager
@@quelorepario No they just stole some Borg tech. Plus, Seven of Nine WAS a borg drone and she brought knowledge along when she was rescued from the collective.
"fire transphasic torpedoes"
@@gamingz5245 👍Those too. And don't forget the hull "ablative armor"😉
Klingons vs Mandalorians...be still, my beating heart!!!
*later dies of a serious heart attack*
Couldn't resist.
@@merafirewing6591 *on your mom*
Couldn’t resist!🤣
Surely Vader would struggle simply to survive being so cut off from the force like that?
I know. If you're a force user and you find yourself in a universe where the force never existed. That location and its inhabitants becomes the most terrifying thing you could imagine. At best Vader would struggle a lot to move and function like he used to and at worst, he'll be dead in minutes.
As a fan of both Star Wars and Star Trek, this was awesome..
Vader not having his powers is bull
Ever heard of Q? Ever watched Star Trek?
Have you ever heard of a different universe? Star Trek does not have a living force, so if Vader went into the Star Trek universe, it would not exist. He would be powerless. Now if the fight was in the Star Wars universe, he would have his powers.
Great touch adding Q in at the end. He is one of my favorite characters.
That was just fucking awesome.!!! I've been a huge Star Wars fan all my life, and I have always rooted for the Empire. When I started these vids I rooted for and naturally assumed the Empire would win. But the conclusions that were presented about the better skills and tactics of the Milky Way Galaxies forces were undeniable. I was surprised and pleased with the defeat of the empire. Well fucking done!! Never thought I'd see the day that Star Trek would out-do Star Wars in my mind, but you pulled it off. My hats off to you sir. You just earned a new subscriber.
"Casually tosses the Federation fleet aside." LOL. Yeah, I don't think so.
Again the size argument. But this is easily refuted. On many occasions a Galaxy Class is considered at least equal in power to a Warbird thus when you assume Warbirds simply due to their size are equal to Star Destroyers thus must be several ship classes of Starfleet, the Klingons and so on.Either one assumes a level playing field or one opens pandoras box on technology level and there Star Trek has major hints that they are way more advandced with haveing matter-energy efficient enough to use it on a large scale industrial level for several centuries. Also from real live examples size does not really matter on the question which ship takes out the other. Quite small ships can be very deadly to very large ones. In fact Destroyers were first invented because large Cruisers, Dreadnought, Battleships needed ships that could defend them from torpedo boats.
Add the size of some of the Starbases of Starfleet we saw. What war mobilisation in a highly automated and replicator driven economy truly means. Billions enlisted or conscripted from densly populated worlds. Ship production on a speed an economy without replicator tech can't hoe to achieve. New ships designed more along the idea of the Defaint Class, if need be ships with high automisation level to get more bank per invested manpower and so forth. I'm not sure the Empire would be able to maintain a numerical advantage esspecially when one assumes that they need to keep forces at home if only to keep themself in power.
Even if the force would work for Vader he wouldn't be able to shock Starfleet much. The Federation has several memberspecies with strange powers. Unleasing the stronger telepaths alone could drive whole Stormtrooper legions mad. Add what they additionally encountere Q and even with the force working Vader would really be nothing more than a footnote.
Yeah, I'm sick of the size crutch, too.
Or the federation could just show the Empire 4chan and the comments on youtube live streams and the empire would probably nope the F out of that galaxy.
All the 4chaners were wiped out in the nuclear war
@Sagrotan hahahahahahaha no
"The next crisis" There was that one episode. There is a shield around the entire milky way galexy put in place to protect it against something. With all galactic threats neutralize. The sphere builders, temporal fights, iconians. Maybe 8472 comes in for a fight. Or star trek enters an intergalactic age.
Enterprise-J's definitely equipped for intergalactic travel, but that's ~150 years ahead of this scenario's apparent timeframe.
Simple. The flood from halo invade :)
That tied together really well at the end . Great job
I don't know if I will ever do a cross-over ever ever again! Str wars videos YES, Star Trek videos YES - Crossover - NOPE! hahaha
LOL. You normally end up pissing off each side but, for me at least, it is all good.
Resurrected Starships I thought this was really good. That was a very well established scenario you came up with.
Resurrected Starships sadly yeah. crossovers, while fun in theory, can get ugly quickly. I do apologize if my comment on the previous vid seemed off-putting. that was not the intent.
It's like how Paul Feig will never do a reboot again.
Resurrected Starships I LOVED both parts of this series and I can't wait to see what you have in store.
I can't see the Empire outfitting Tie Fighters with warp drive, being that even within the Star Wars Universe the Empire deliberately builds Tie Fighters without hyperdrive capability.
Star Wars Fleet comes through the worm hole. Chuck Norris shows up and says no. They apologize and go back. The end.
Excellent analysis on both parts! It provides very plausible scenarios as a consequence of the different ways of life followed by both blocks!
i really doubt Tarkin would ignore thrawn.
to be fair tarkin was pretty cocky
Oh he would. Tarkin ignored evacuating the Death Star in Episode 4 and he ignored Director Krennic in Rogue One.
Yeah, Tarkin was kind of an ass whose strategies and philosophies, although they may have served him well in a prior time, ultimately proved his own undoing.
Remember, Thawn isn’t human. Tarkin is a xenophobic. He wouldn’t trust a Chiss
Interesting. However - The dawn of the 25th century - you forgot game changing stuff like Quantum Slip Stream Drive, Transwarp, Prometheus class (and other new classes) and other tech upgrades of the Federation etc. Please read this:
Star Trek TNG S07 E07 - The Pegasus
memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Phasing_cloaking_device
memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/USS_Pegasus?file=USS_Pegasus.jpg
memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Transwarp
memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Quantum_slipstream_drive
memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Coaxial_warp_drive
memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/USS_Prometheus_(Prometheus_class)
mmostorytellers.proboards.com/thread/626/odyssey-class-development-history
Just to give a taste. :)
Questions?
That was really a great pleasure to watch :) thanks for these videos. Not sure if you take requests, but would be great to see a video like this with Imperium of man from warhammer 40k vs Empire from Starwars
Wow, this is a fantastic breakdown.
I disagree with some minor details, but being a fan of both I feel you made a very fair assessment.
Thank you for your efforts bud, it's a very touchy project, and you've done very well.
So this how the Rebels really beat the empire, lol.
So anyone else notice that warp and transporter tech was disrupted in the star wars universe in the first video. But suddenly use able for the rebels in this video?
Well being able to transport rebels everywhere and back to base from anywhere is more than just a little advantage, wouldn't you think so?
Same would be for just being able to transport a lit bomb onto the gate of an ammo complex or something like that.
I only notice that transporter was disrupted, not warp. He also mentions the rebels and the Federation make it work eventually, not that it suddenly magically begins to work by itself.
now i wonder if the empaths in star trek would be force sensitive in the star wars universe
DevilJin - 6:50
actually he said in the first video that warp drive works exactly the same in the SW galaxy.
I played this in the background with the intent of having something to just play in my background, while doing something else, but this small series you've uploaded grabbed my undivided attention. I can see this taking hours, days, or even a few weeks to compile all of the information between both universes, and I bet it wasn't easy. I hope to see more of your content!
Here is what I believe imperial turbo lasers maybe more powerful than phasers but the targeting is based on large scale assaults by cruisers, star trek ships more maneuverable. And targeting sensors superior. Tactical officers concentrate fire on the crystal maze dome shaped object sticking out of the top of all star destroyers a couple of photons later shields are down and the star destroyers are vulnerable. Teams of security beam aboard, the bridges, close the blast doors and takeover.
Then the tie fighters attack but have no shielding, so are swatted away with phaser fire like little annoying mosquitoes
Starfleet accept the empires surrender and send them packing back through the wormhole.
and how would turbolasers be more powerful than phasers? almost every example of turbolasers has been weak as hell by comparison.
@@johnboggs1164 - I will give them the beneficial doubt that they are stronger, due to them being a plasma solid, but hey I do not know really. I think it is a guess. If anything Star Trek Vessels would win against the limited range of the Star Wars weaponry and less shielding.
Warp ships can use hyperdrives with almost no study.....
Ummmm
Im confused
Warp whips can use hyperdrive but hyperdrive ships cant use warp
Just give both sides warp and hyperspace not one
He said they can't retrofit large capital ships, but smaller ships like fighters can be outfitted just fine. What this likely meant was they would've had to develop a new class of Star Destroyer so they can fit a big enough drive in, and they just didn't have time.
Really the empire gains advantages with fighters? Have you seen how easely star trek ships deal with fighters?
Well I mean the Maqui mostly used fighters and did ultimately pretty well. Many argue that imperial fighters are not shileded - true of the standard tie, but not the tie-advanced, tie defender, or star wing assault gunboats...besides who's to say that duranium (star wars) is not outrageously strong compared to tritanium (star trek)? No one! :) Towards the end of the video though they learn how to deal with fighters. The empire (had they stayed) would have had to change tactics again.
you know all you really need to deal with even shielded TIE's is to grab them in a tractor beam and toss them into their carrier ship... We've seen the Enterprise(s) in canon tractor ships much much larger than themselves around, so how are tiny little fighters that mass MAYBE 25 to 100 tons (not really sure which, the weight of TIEs are not listed anywere I can find...) going to be able to resist star trek tractor beams, which have been shown as being able to grab even absurdly large vessels like Romulan D'Deridex class ships with full shield and pulling them around?
I'm sure that is actually a valid tactic, provided there are enough tractor emitters to deal with a large swarm of moving fighters - zooming in and out of range; we've never seen tractors with particularly great range. The borg do it though.
Resurrected Starships since the fields have been seen to be able to spread to grip a entire side of a ship I'd Imagine they are capable of grabbing a good few TIE'S. And I think a tractors range is at least a thousand or more kilometers range if not more, since we see the enterprise grab a old jet fighter from orbit when kirk accidentally goes back in time...
And even if the range isn't all that great, as little as 15 kilometers range would mean that TIEs can be grabbed and tossed or crushed before they get into range, since you never see TIE'S firing from really far away...
wrong; all it has to do is use a wide angle tractor, grab any fighters, and toss them back into the ISD's hanger decks.
I think you did a great job with this. A key here was the excellent choice of scenarios. Even if one disagrees with details, your final outcome is very defendable, regardless of which side you prefer. Plus it's consistent with the values of the governments involved. It's best Star Wars vs Star Trek scenario I have seen to date.
Thank you so much. Appreciate your narration style, it's laid back, it's not obnoxious, just perfect. New sub man here brother!
Vader arrives first...only to find his force powers severely diminished.
AKA...Vader is USELESS!
Until someone tells him to just travel to the edge of the galaxy for a power boost
Wow! This was very well thought out and presented. I agree that the Federation/Romulan/Klingon alliance would eventually win. However, I think the Federation would have mined the wormhole with self replicating mines far sooner than you stated.
I don't believe so, Feds are just too pacifist and moralist to do that. Just as they didn't destroy Borg straightaway after they first met them (by sending a borg Tim back as a "ticking bomb"). Klingons or Romulans however... :)
And as part 1 explained, it took no time at all to launch a huge incursion fleet and establish a Wormhole-head, and bomb the snot out of Bajor. Once The Empire controlled DS9 with enough huge Star Destroyers with their swarms of fighters - something the UFP just didn't have an instant counter for, then there was no option to mine the wormhole until the Empire retreated. It was pretty well thought out. I liked his take.
Yes not only was it very well thought out it was a nice narrative.
TheMultiGunMan where’s quark’s idiot brother when you need him?😂
Planetary defense system would keep the empire from attacking planets or base.
You should do a follow up(s) and play the scenario out differently where we see one side defeat the other. Say via a natural shift in the wormhole that doesn't stem from an outside source, and therefore never shifts back to normal. It'd be interesting to see how the Empire and Federation would deal with the tactical/technological challenges in the different galaxies, as well as seeing how the Empire and Federation might gain allies in each other's galaxies.
I really enjoyed the addition of Q causing the whole mess at the end. Great videos well done man thanks for the in depth look at such a crazy hypothetical situation
Excellent! Good to point out the potential diplomatic and espionage angles the Federation could exploit. Also, how the Romulans could spoil the Galactic Empire through espionage and sabotage.
I thought it would have been quite interesting had Klingons were to warp into the Star Wars galaxy and conduct numerous raids involving ground troops into the Galactic Empire's key assets. Urban combat between the Klingons and the Imperial Stormtroopers would be quite an interesting hypothetical scenario to delve into with high entertainment value!
Overall, I do not see this intergalactic war as a decisive war. Rather, I tend to see it as for both the Star Trek factions and the Galactic Empire to experience their capabilities and limits.
It's kinda funny star trek has ships that move at sunlight speed of 1/16 of the speed of light or roughly 18000 km/h. Compare this with the top speed 1100 km/h now capital ships have trouble catching fighter in star wars. These are 10 times the speed
I know this might be unpopular but I think that unless the Interdictor cruisers have a much much greater range than we've seen, single minor fed starship like the Stargazer could destroy the combined forces of the galactic empire. Starfleet ships can fight in warp. How does the Empire counter that? They can't even hit X wings and they don't travel anywhere near as fast as a starship at warp 2. A federation ship's phaser has a range of what, 15000 km? A photon torpedo twice that. Does the Interdictor have that kind of range? Why would they. They hyperspace everywhere. But let's say they do. I think the federation could develop a tactic of taking out any interdictor cruiser (and there's not a lot of them or otherwise we'd see them more) from long range and then mopping up all the Imperial ships.
The only thing I think the Federation would have a problem with is Jedi and Sith. I don't see how they could fight them head on.
Your point about the Empire's industrial capacity is excellent though. I think in the second war all the ships they sent over would have interdictor technology. But I think by that time Starfleet would have started arming the Rebellion. And if not Starfleet definitely the Romulans. Now you'd be seeing hit and fades with cloaked X wings. God am I geeking out.
Ok i must not laugh ok they can fight in warp and? The Star wars ships are in hyper space also they can attack in warp just other ships in warp lol
Pls try again.
Also yes the interdictor cruiser have a big range also they can decrease the precision of torpedos and Lasers because The interdictor Has 2 effects one interdictor field TWO Manipulation of torpedos and other stuff which are not phasers or turbo lasers/laser
Also about they cant Hit X wings yes there for they have The channecellor class
The cloaking Technik is also very popular in star wars first say they couldnt detect them but in minimum amount of time they find a way to find cloaked ships
The max phaser range isn't 15000km.
Its 300000 km.
that was an amazing pair of videos and what if idea. it make me think of how the Star Trek's federation would handle other fractions from other worlds. Like the Necrons from 40k and Reapers from Mass Effect.
Bravo! Very clever and entertaining. Now that both franchises have separately become very involved and self-referential, it takes something like this to regain the freshness and creativity that they had at the beginning. It's an idea whose time has come.
Here's my problem with the scenario you set up. You say the Empire has an overwhelming industrial advantage that completely and utterly dwarfs the combined might the Federation, Klingon, and Romulans. The numbers are massively in favor the Empire.
Yet in your scenario the Empire does not leverage this. The Empire could quite literally storm the Alpha Quadrant with sheer numbers. They could utterly blitzkrieg everything. You make it clear that a Star Destroyer can easily smash a Federation ship in 1v1. So the combat advantage for Star Trek isn't huge in your scenario.
Secondly, why is the Empire not capable of reverse engineering Transporters, or cloaking technology themselves? Only warp capable Tie Fighters? What? Sorry that wouldn't happen.
Realistically, just like in real life war the tech advantage would buy Star Trek time early in the war. But the moment the Empire gains Transporters, cloaks, and warp drives, then its over.
All the Empire needs to do is study the captured Federation ships, and get the missing technology.
The 2nd half of your scenario goes off the rails in favor of Star Trek. Remember The Federation alliance just barely beat the Dominion.
Warp drive is not special. Most primitive species eventually discover it in Trek. Secondly you don't necessarily need nacelles for warp. Just look at the Borg or those Delta quadrant species from Voyager. They all achieve warp in their own way.
thing that's bugging me the entire story is why is the empire thrown off by cloaking? cloaking exists in star wars hell the empire has Tie phantoms that cloak, invisible ships would not give federation some advantage with that tech cause the empires seen and has it themselves
The Empire would require mapped out hyperspace routes in order to blitzkrieg the Alpha Quadrant in the manner you describe. Otherwise, they would be reduced to traveling at sub-light speeds, meaning it would take them centuries or even millennia to travel between star systems.
As for the event in which the Empire successfully develops transporters, cloaking, and warp (either by reverse engineering or innovation), these advances wouldn't happen in days--more likely they would take years, during which the Federation would undoubtedly make advances of their own to counter or at least match the Empire's.
Although you are correct in saying that the tech advantage would buy Star Trek time in the early stages of the war, it's erroneous to assume that the addition of various Trek technologies to the Empire's arsenal would immediately tip the scales.
In the Vietnam War, the United States was a significantly larger force possessing overwhelmingly superior technology to that of their foe--North Vietnam. Despite this advantage, the North Vietnamese forces managed to prolong the engagement and inflict significant enough casualties that continuing the war ceased being "worth it" for the United States, essentially resulting in a North Vietnamese victory.
I find this analogy relevant as the only advantage North Vietnam had was 'home field', whereas the Federation has home field advantage, superior technology, and superior tactics, all of which make it quite clear to me who would emerge the victor in this hypothetical conflict. The Federation, Klingons, and Romulans combined could not defeat the Empire in a simple 'numbers game' style slugging match of who has the most firepower and largest fleet, but the Empire could never bring its full strength to bear in the Milky Way as that would require they leave many systems in their galaxy undefended, which would result in their eventual defeat as it would leave them completely open to attacks by the Rebel Alliance back home.
All of this doesn't even take into account that the weapons of Star Trek ships have vastly greater ranges than their Star Wars counterparts, and are computer targeted/operated, making shielded or unshielded fighters a non-factor in any engagement. And considering that Star Destroyers are significantly less maneuverable than Star Trek vessels of similar class and role, they would be hard pressed to close the distance into weapons range and bring their immense firepower to bear.
In the end, the Empire finds itself in a no-win scenario if they commit to conquering the Milky Way. They either throw everything they have through the wormhole for a good chance at victory (assuming they overcome the lack of FTL capabilities in time to exploit their numbers and surprise attack), whereupon they fall prey to the Rebel Alliance and other insurgencies back in their home galaxy. Alternatively, they don't bring their full might to bear on the Alpha Quadrant, in which their best case is being stalled into an unbreakable stalemate and forced to withdraw and deal with the growing threat of Rebels at home.
You are equating the Empire's ability to adapt to the Federation's and it's not nearly the same, by a long shot.
Star Wars tech is really stagnant, you see one or other advances, increase in sizes, but not nearly the same as in Star Trek Universe. In 30.000 years their tech hasn't advanced that much,
Empire tech is mostly old stuff being repurposed or refitted, you can see in the comics that their advances in tech rarely get reproduced or mass replicated. The Death Star is said to be a big advance and it only has a very big weapon, a single Federation ship has more ways to destroy a planet, or even just render it uninhabitable.
I really doubt the Empire could reverse engineer a transporter that easily, their scientists are few and far between, and most of their officers are specialized in their role, whereas Federation officers are multi-disciplinary, with people needing Science degrees and a good understanding of things to be a junior officer. Many Fed Ship Engineers double as scientists, with actual Scientists in Star Trek being super-geniuses or something.
The Empire rarely has a science-focused approach, they are more industrial. Heck, most of their scientists were also extremely specialized and used to their own tech.
Whereas the Federation has a history of reverse engineering strange tech and understanding it all the time. They adapt really fast. Their ship crews have a lot more scientific knowledge, and the ships are much more equipped to reverse engineer stuff, they have replicators and on average advanced scientific equipment. Their sensors are extremely powerful, they can identify people by their biosignature from orbit. And can look up the molecular makeup of materials with them.
Star Wars sensors were fooled by a ship landing on their hull. They can't detect things among asteroid fields well, and have trouble if ships are hidden behind moons.
The Empire also rarely can spare hundreds or thousands of ships on call, they have surplus yes, IIRC they had around 25k ISDs but most of them had to patrol their systems, and keep a tight grip on them, any weakness would be exploited by the Rebel Alliance.
And Cloaking Tech would be REALLY hard to adapt to, Star Wars ships just have too much energy and are too big, Romulan Ships have been built from scratch to support those, AND Star Trek has ways to detect cloaked ships especially the Romulans, whereas I doubt the Empire's sensors could do it.
It's much more feasible for the Federation and it's Allies to reverse engineer Empire tech fast enough to apply it in the war, they have shown the capability to do it, their own ship crews can do some of the modifications, ISD crews and ships are just not that flexible, they are warships and their crews are well trained in operating them, not modifying them.
Federation tactical analysis and long range sensors are also superior, especially with the Empire's big ships, their ships are much more maneuverable, and their weapons more precise, and they can modify their weapons and shields to be more effective against the Empire.
@@zahector Star Trek cloaking technology is vastly superior to Star Wars cloaking technology. Cloaked ships in Star Trek can use their sensors, warp drive, and (with special technology) even fire weapons while cloaked. Star Wars ships are blinded and drained of power when cloaked.
The Empire knows about cloaking technology and has Weapons to fight them. After the First 3 Attacks they will use their Protontorpedoes that lock on the cloaking Field to fight those capital ships. The Star Wars Universe has cloaking technology but it is still in their beginnings. But that is because there are Weapons against cloaked ships. And the Empire wouldn't bombard a Planet without trying to take it before. I don't know a Lot about Star Trek but I know a Lot about Star Wars. Sure Hyperspace calculation takes time but not that much because of Droids. The Empire would use scouting Droids before they jump somewhere into Enemy Space. So fooling them to jump into Stars would only work at max. 3 times. The Interdictor Cruiser would also be used for pooling Ships out of Hyperspace or Warpspeed. Which will disrupt Major trade routes if the Empire finds some.
Sure, home advantage for the Federation but it would still be a bloody War. The Empire will lose this War because of the Rebellion so the Ending is good. But Transporter Technology in the Star Wars Galaxy shouldn't be possible, so rebels teleporting into Empire Bases shouldn't be possible. Youself said because of the different laws of Physics in the Star Wars Universe, they didn't develope Transporter Technology so it shouldn't be useable. But I still liked the Scenario.
Firstly cloaking technology in the Star Trek Universe works totally different than anything in Star Wars that barely manages to look like cloak, which defeats your entire point in that there are Imperial ways to defeat cloaked ships, secondly you can pull a ship out of Hyperspace, but you can’t just pull a ship out of Warp and thirdly he meant that Transporters just hadn’t been invented in the Star Wars Universe, there’s nothing to prevent them from working in a Star Wars Universe.
@@sigea5397 exactly
Early grats on 30k!!!
Epilogue: Ben Sisko enters wormhole.
"So...anyone wanna tell me what the f*ck that was?"
nice scenario, but I still gotta say, star wars knows cloak, no one uses it because... well... it's useless, any star wars ship can detect cloaked ships, they just need to know someone's cloaked. As soon as imperial captains notice the federation uses cloak, the adapt their sensors and are able to track them
Robin Weggeman yup
different styles of cloak. St sensors are much better than SW and they cant. ST cloaks not only cloak light, but all EM emissions as well.
starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Cloaking_device
Richie Brown I am not really that sure about that
The cloak used in Star Wars is different from those used in Star Trek. Star Wars cloak is similar to current stealth fighter technology where are in Star Trek it's a complete invisibility shield designed to absorb radiation and electromagnetic frequencies
The force versus Q. Vader has NO chance
Or that guy that wiped out whole race from existance and history with a single thought. I don't think puny shilords can do anything against force like that.
Sith Lords are very powerful, nearly insurmountable threats...to mortals. The Q probably consider them, relative to the Q, no more powerful than a common bag lady.
What a great idea for a cross-over series! The ratings would be "off the scales"!
This was actually way better than I thought it would be. Very interesting idea about the wormhole shifting. You would have to do more about the timeline. Like where in our timeline the star wars universe would take place, how many thousands of years ago the empire was established and how this fits into the star trek timeline.
In depth anlysis:
Star Trek Milky Way helps SG1 humans vs Ori galaxy Wraith Pegasus galaxy and Guoald on 3 Galaxy fronts (perhaps a parallel universe scenario) Good channel so far. Subscribed.
EDIT:
Oh and new acquired technologies by the Federation could be the Destiny drive as seen in SG:Universe, opening up a new era for Starfleet of traversing other galaxies and aiding its push towards taking the fight to the Pegasus galaxy and the Ori galaxy.
Janeway will make a deal with the Borg, to change the tide.
You fail to realize that the Empire has knowledge of cloaking devices, thus they wouldn't truly be all that caught off guard, and You allow the milky way factions to reverse engineer hyperdrive and apply it to their ships readily & easily whilst basically saying the empire is unable to do the same with warp for no logical reason. You also lend far too much credit to the relatively much slower warp drive to be able to find non-imperials quickly enough to discuss anything relevant with them, much less find out about an extremely secretive underground group of rebels. I doubt they'd discover anything but imperial outposts and such before war was already going on and they wouldn't be able to find the rebels to give them any assistance. Most likely any ships they had moving around after the initial encounter would be found by the empire and destroyed before they reach anything else, then their trail is traced to the entrance they used to leave the milky way and that would be blocked off by the imperial navy as you said. Then you underestimate the empire's ability to manipulate at least one milky way faction into joining it against the others for territorial gain, as this would swing local power even more into its favor both in raw naval capability and in that faction giving the imperials their maps so that they can begin to plot out hyperspace routes in the area, and it would give the other faction a swing in the balance of power toward itself while also giving it more territory and its rivals less. It also has an ally who'd likely be willing to expand again and if not the others think it is, so they won't go after that faction any time soon in fear of the empire. I suspect even if what I'm saying isn't exactly the same in the specific details that you knew all along that the scenario would actually be a relatively easy imperial victory, but that you did it this way to try to avoid backlash, which is understandable. The thing is that when you compare these two franchises like this, it doesn't matter what you say, there's gonna be hella backlash from both sides.
Warp Drives may be slower Strategically, but not tactically.
Let me explain, Hyperdrive is not something that is used in combat, save to leave or enter. It is a method of travelling interstellar distances. Warp Drive is both. So, assuming they have maps, the Empire would be able to reach systems faster than the Federation. In combat however, the Empire ships would actually be slower than Federation ships by a huge margin because they have to rely on their non FTL drives for propulsion. The Federation however *can* use their FTL drives whilst in combat. Which means Imperial ships are facing opponants that can effectively fight at a very high percentage of C, something they cannot do. That there is a huge advantage. Whilst in combat Imperial ships are effectively sitting still as far as Federation ships and weapons systems are concerned.
Also, while Warp Drives are slower, they are strategically more flexible as they do not rely on features that have to be explored and mapped. The cloaking, well I am pretty certain the Romulans and Klingons cloaking technology is different to that described in Star Wars, so the idea that the Empire would be able to detect them does not hold up. They would not neccesarily be able to detect Klingon possibly and Romulan certainly. This could well be born out by the fact Federation cannot reliably detect either and everything I have read suggests Federation Sensor Technology is leagues ahead of Imperial.
He did not say that the Empire couldnt reverse engineer Hyperdrive, he said they could not apply it to their CURRENT ship designs with a few exceptions. I assume it has something to do with nacelle placement or some such. One thing the Federation *could* do much faster than the Empire is produce new ship designs, after all industry in the Federation is based entirely on replicators. It strikes me (though I am not really a fan of either series) that the only real bottleneck to the Federations ship building is in training crews, not in actually building ships. So, the Empire would be able to use Warp Drive, but they would have to design and build new ship classes to be able to utilise the technology.
That actually makes sense in many ways, look at the design of the Star Destroyers. That arrowhead is not an accident, its not like that simply because it looks good. This is one of those places where they actually thought out a reasoning behind the design. Imperial Star Destroyers are designed for a closing engagement, the arrowhead design means that the weapons systems placed on the broadsides of the ship can all fire forwards, thus the highest proportion of a Star Destroyers firepower is directed in front of it. Get directly to either beam and you effectively half the firepower the Star Destroyer can apply, get to the Stern, and the Star Destroyer has almost nothing there. With the insane speed and maneuverability Federation ships have over Star Destroyers I cannot, quite literally cannot see a single instance where the Federation ship could not get into the stern shadow of an SD and remain there. To utilise Warp Drive effectively the Empire would need ships with a far more flexible aura of fire. So I think the issue is not with the engine placement, but the weapons placements.
Finally, the military resources available are larger for the a far larger area, and not all those huge resources can be used in what is effectively a new and unexpected front. Much of the Imperial strength will have to remain withing Imperial space, they have threats other than the Rebellion lingering over them after all, and not all of them are internal. True, same could be said of the Federation, but to a much lesser degree. At least in the time zone this scenario is based in.
@@alganhar1 - warp drive is NOT special. Primitive species in Trek eventually discover it all the time. Voyager had so many of them running around with warp. It's clearly a common form of space travel...not hard to grasp.
And it does NOT require nacelles. Just look at the Borg with their geometric ships, or a large number of aliens from ST: Voyager. They all achieve warp in their own way with a bunch of different exotic ship designs. Same thing with Transporters. So many species have their own version of it. I find it hard to believe that the Empire couldn't adapt it.
Hell, the Empire could probably bribe the Ferengi with wealth and the Ferengi would probably sell all the Technology to then Empire.
The harsh truth is that the tech advantage would buy the Federation alliance victories early on (just like in real life World War 2).
BUT the moment the Empire studies Trek technology, and adapts it, then it's all over. A temporary technology advantage is the only thing keeping the Federation Alliance from losing right away (just like how the Soviets nearly caught up to Germans in WW2).
Trek doesn't have the numbers to counter attack the Star Wars Galaxy. So the entire war is just a defensive one.
The poster noted that this is because the battle takes place in Federation space. That's what the Federation does, it explores, observes, collects data, analyzes data, rinse/repeat.
I'll give you a good, observed reason of why the Empire/Republic/Whatever would have trouble reverse engineering a toaster, let alone the complexity of warp technology: they've been using the same basic tech for tens of thousands of years. They seem intelligent, but they don't seem to be very curious. They could eventually adapt it, but that would mean changing how things are done, and the Space Nazis don't seem too big on change.
@@TheBigExclusive Sorry, the Empire (all of the civilizations) utilizes millennia old technology, what makes you think they CAN reverse engineer Federation tech? You should focus on your one, though excellent, argument: The Empire buying from corrupt species who'd line up to sell them the best technology they can find, and for extra, they'd install it/explain how it works (or buy someone who does).
The Empire, in this case, is Nazi Germany, not the other way around. The Soviets, too, were fighting with help from the U.S. and Great Britain and they were fighting a defensive war (at first). The German forces had to deal with the insanely arbitrary/idiotic commands given from their saw-off little dictator.
I agree, a counter-attack is highly unlikely.
I really enjoyed it. Thank you for this entertaining glimpse into a clash of cannons.
Hmm. I like how you actually tied both universes together in that they helped each other to improve and have a better outcome in their home galaxy in the end.
Would the Genesis Device work on the Death Star?
Genesis Device is more of a Terraforming agent turned into a de-facto bioweapon.
Not sure if detonated at the reactor tho.
It works by 'reorganizing' all matter within range at the sub-atomic level. It turned a nebula into a planet, complete with (mal) functioning biomes/ecology/etc. in mere seconds. It's right up there with time travel, in my opinion.
I love this and I also love how this isn’t supposed to be a war between the two universes it’s a war between factions in each
This was very well done. The story had a gradual progression of events that appeared to be believable. Excellent video.👍
So to put this simply, the federation arrived in the only time period that they stood a chance.
Good job its wasn't the 31st century star fleet then, time travel mastered, you get the picture.
Well they mastered timetravell in the 23th century trew the slingshot effect, but untill later there was the consensus that fucking around with time would not ne the smartest idea.
Gups Star Trek could compete, but the thing is they have to much conflict in there Galaxy in kirks time
Clash Mine bro Studios What?
But the Federation can control time if they want, so that statement would not be considered valid.
So, Germany invading the Soviet Union...
Nice work, though! Subbed!
Can't you guys stop making Germany bad for everything, while the USA mainly caused the war in Near east and other where!!
I think you have it backwards. The Soviet Union is the Empire here in this scenario. They are much bigger than the Federation alliance. But are behind in technology.
The Federation alliance is Germany. They have a big tech lead.
This dudes RUclips video basically came down to two sides reverse engineering eachothers tech and invading eachother. Which is kinda dumb since the moment you give Empire any Trek tech, then the advantage Trek has is gone.
No, this is 1940's Germany invading the 2000's United States.
The Federation would block the wormhole against the Empire the same way they did against the Dominion. Cloaked self-replicating mines would decimate any fleet that the Empire would be able to send through.
To quote Gul Dukat during the start of the Dominion War....
"I've found it wise to never underestimate the Federation's technical skill or Captain Sisko's resourcefulness."
sudden peace in star trek universe, and take away the imperial death star and the force which connects all living things...
can´t say that wasn´t biased
meetasheep there are even more biased scenarios because of the Star Wars Fanboys vote that the empire would win
hmm, lemme think... star trek has been robbed of weaponry range, sensors capabilities and weaponmry accuracy (yes, they do actually hit from literaly lightseconds reange)- also, the "sudden peace " is the on screen cannon reaction to the last invasion through the bajoran wormhole, which is ACTRUALLY STILL IN EFFECT. THeres no sudden peace, there speace since the dopminion invaded.
The death star is a too large and therefore cant possibly travel through the wormhole, would not be deployed in such an endeavor and itsd usefulness would be questionable at best, cannon fodder at worst. If you want to include the force... theres lots of stuff thats gonna f you up then.
You see, Q likes humanity and the federation, I'd go so far as to argue he actually made the force useless as the federation itself cant deal with it (it was Q's test afterall.) And if Q makes sopmething useless its useless. No exceptions.
not mentioning that, as stated in this or the other video (i don't remember exactly wich one), the empire is looking to expand to get resources to avoid overtaxing its systems for the construction of the death star, ergo the death star doesn't exist yet
@@platiuscyndar9017 well I have to disagree on q bieng able to influence the force but as far as bringing good like powers into I agree on leaving them out lol oh and before u say q can influence the force the reason I say that's a no is because the force in essence is the force of creations and essentially god in star wars q though nigh omnipotent is not god.
@@jeremyharris2980 The difference between Q and the force is that Q is a sapient entity, whilst the force is simply a cosmic anomaly.
Q can act with guided interest and agency, the force is… well forced by others to do their bidding, far less effectively then it COULD be.
Q could probably figure out how to make the force essentially useless with 0 necessity to actually influence the force itself - for instance, he could severely decrease the amount of midichlorians force users carry inside themselves the moment they step through the wormhole.
yo generation tech sent me
OH YEAS
YOU GAINED A NEW SUB
IT WAS AWESOME
I ACTUALLY WANT THIS TO BE IN A 3D FULL MOVIE ANIMATIONNNNNNN
In my opinion, this is the best SW vs ST videos on youtube. You clearly highlighted both franchises' best traits...ST talk now, fight later attitude. And star wars' military might. A great story, well told.
It's certainly the most watchable. It at least gives the Empire a chance (which I really don't think they'd have, save on defense).