Thanks for the video(s), guys! I get a lot from just the way you work the machines. I like the casual, fun, and obviously coffee-obsessed way you present the material. Keep them coming, as I am in the market for my first machine and these are super helpful...especially the videos where Gail and the team are actually using the machines.
We don't ship our machines outside of the US; there are retailers of the Rocket Machines, though, in Asia - check out their main website for a list of folks that you could purchase from - Kat
We do recommend that you have some kind of filter in place if you're going to plumb it in ... however, you do have the ability to descale these convertible models in the tank setup, so you can also just plan to do that every year or so. The machine has a rotary pump which you will adjust to meet your line pressure, so you shouldn't need additional pressure regulation. - Kat
Did you order specifically the V2 model? If so, then you should have received the V2 model. We have separate products for these, as they have a price/feature differential. If you purchased a V2 and received the previous version, it was a shipping error. Best to contact our service team directly with your order information and they'll resolve for you. - Kat
We don't adjust it; it's the factory setting. If you are using the Evo model with the rotary pump, you can adjust this; otherwise, I don't believe there is a method for you to do it easily. Is it hitting up at the 9 bars without the portafilter in? - Kat
We had a Giotto Evo on the floor that we used for demos that had been cranked up too high, so it often let off a bunch of steam during the flush. This is not typical and your Cellini's non-steam flush is what you should be looking for. If you check out any of the Giotto Evo V2 videos from here on out, you'll notice there's a difference with that flush. - Kat
Yes; Gail did practical testing wherein she did her usual cooling flush and then pulled shots vs. pulling shots based on the brew head temperature reading. Invariably, the latter produced sour shots. We didn't think it offered any benefit or more precision than if you just do the cooling flush (if the machine has been sitting unused for awhile, that is.) - Kat
I still LOVE my V1 Giotto but it's starting to look a little dull and has some fine scratches around the drip tray (and areas that are used the most) - any chance you guys could do a video on recommended methods for polishing stainless steel machines?
Yup! Your brand new brew head gasket is going to keep the portafilter off to the left for awhile, then, as it ages, it will move further and further to the right. When it moves almost all the way to the right in order to engage/seal, you'll know it's time to change the brew head gasket. - Kat
That's the back pressure - adjust your grind a bit and you'll see it go down. 9 Bar is ideal, but I think it's going to be different depending on the coffee you're using. Pressure profiling is something that people are messing with on commercial machines, so it's worth experimenting a bit I think - Kat
I'd focus on the shot timing and the flavor; if it's going up close to 10 BARs during the extraction but it's coming out at the right rate and tastes good, then no worries. You could also experiment with finer coffee and a lighter tamp. - Kat
What I mean is, does water come out in the middle position? If water is not dispensed then it would not 'prewet' with a portafilter inserted. I believe that position is purely for the solenoid valve. Passive preinfusion /progressive pre-infusion is the result of the e-61 group design. As far as I know, if the pump doesn't activate and there is no line pressure due to internal water tank then there will be no pre-infusion or wetting.
Oh. So what is your take on all the info out there about the need to cool flush before pulling the shot on an E61? I thought the purpose of the thermometer was to be able to calculate how long a flush you needed to get to a desired temp. Are you saying that the thermometer was not able to get this desired effect?
Ok, you were correct as I made the grind more coarse, the pressure went lower. But, now my question is: suppose that I find the grind that gives me exactly 9 bars, but the shot comes out to be too fast. Normally, I would think to make the grind more fine, but that would increase the pressure. How do you deal with this? Do I ignore the pressure and just go for 25-30 secs for 60 mls, or go for 9 bars and ignore the time it takes for 60 mls?
Hi Kat -- I just received my Cellini v2. I was watching the dvd you guys created with it and your machine has a cool thermometer installed above the brew head where mine doesn't. How did you do that, where did you get it, and does it void the warrantee? Thx!
Hi Kat. On my new Cellini the brew pressure is a steady 10 bars (same with backflush) and it looks like from this video that your new machine was close to 10 as well. I am wondering if it was set that way by Rocket or if you guys adjust it to that pressure? From what I am reading, most people out there think this is too high and should be closer to 9 for best results. Do you agree/disagree? Thx.
Ah, got it. Yeah, we set these up as separate products in tandem with launching this video; so sorry that it wasn't clear :( The machine you got is a great one, though! I'm sure you will be very happy with it :) - Kat
Hey, Kat, do you have this machine just plugged in into a regular outlet? I would like to know because I'm only 17 but when I get a lot of money I want to buy this
Ok, so about how many seconds of a cooling flush would you recommend I do if it is idle (or the first shot after warming up), and how many seconds of a cooling flush do you recommend if it hasn't been idle (i.e. pulled a shot in the last 3-5 mins)? Thanks!
Man I have been searching for hrs to no avail. Kat please help! I live in Victoria bc and we have soft water probably the same as Seattle, same weather that's for sure. Can the machine be directly plumbed into the house line with no filtration also does there need to be an external pressure regulator installed before the water enters the machine or is the water pressure adjusted at the machines pump? Thanks so much! Planning on buying this bad boy soon
wow, now i'm even more bummed out. Your order page now reflexs the different available options. When I placed my order, sunday midnight or so, there was no indication. Though totally my fault, I suppose. I certainly would've been more than willing to spend a little extra for the features if it had been available during my order. I saw your video, showing off the new v2 and thought: YES!
@7:47 Does this machine have pre-infusion? The switch on my home machine (similar to the one in this video) has three positions, Off, On and third being the middle position of the switch only takes affect when stopping a shot. It is linked to the solenoid valve. Does the middle position dispense water from the group head without a portafilter fitted?
Hi Kat. Another question I have about my new Cellini V2 is the water flow. If you compare it to the Giotto machine's flush on one of your many videos, mine is like a fine shower coming out vs the Giotto's very strong stream. Is that a problem or is that how it should be? Are they that different because of the Vibratory vs Rotary pump? How can both of them produce the same product?! I have a youtube video of mine but was unable to post it here. Let me know if you would like to see it.
We've spent the first few days using the Cellini V2 and are getting good shots, but our portafilter will not twist in very far. We can get it turned maybe 60 degrees and that is while holding the side of the machine for leverage. It won't even come close to perpendicular to the machine. Is this normal for a new machine?
No, without the PF in, it isn't that high. But, with the backflush disk and a normal shot it is consistent at 10. Do you think it is Rocket's intention to set it that high? Do you agree it should be closer to 9 for best results? It is not an evo, it is a premium plus.
Currently pricing around Europe for a Giotto Evo. I was wondering if you could tell me how long it takes to get to the required temperature? Loving your videos BTW.
i'm so unhappy. I ordered through you guys, cause you all seem fairly awesome, last week. was really hoping to get the v2 but when the package arrived today, it wasn't. are you folks getting rid of your old stock first?
+Abdullah Saady If you think down the line you may want to plumb it in, then it may be a good idea to think about. But if not, it would be hard to make that recommendation :)
Yeah; I said prewet because water does come out at that midway point, although with no real pressure behind it. If no water came out, I wouldn't have said that it prewet the coffee ;) - Kat
Talk about embracing social media in brick and mortar instead of shunning away and let it be a business killer. Well done! I would definitely pay a visit if I lived closer, but since I live in Sweden it might be a while.
Hey guys (love your vids btw, have watched a LOT of them), I have never understood pre-infusion with a tank machine - with 3-way valve opened towards the espresso, but no pump activated, surely there's no pressure at all in the water? (unless it's plumbed). I have a evoluzione in my kitchen and with the lever in this position (and I am tanked) I barely see a drip coming out. Or is the pressure of a full tank meant to be enough?? thanks!
When you pull the lever up half way it just drips water onto the espresso with little pressure to create preinfusion. Then you pull the lever all the way up to begin the shot extraction with pressure. - Steven
Will the machine get damaged if you don't open the steam valve when you use it the first time? (after filling up the tank and turn on the power switch)
It could! We've never tried not opening the steam valve when starting up a new Rocket, so I'm not sure exactly what might happen. A possible explosion? Perhaps! It's best to open the steam valve to release the air while the boiler is filling for the first time. :-) ~ Sarah
Hello Dennis Lavin, Our current ETA for the Giotto Evoluzione V2 is Feb 13th. We do however have the Cellini Evoluzione V2 and R58 V2 in stock. ~ Sarah
How big of a difference does a PID make on a machine like this, really? I'm considering getting a Rocket and the possibility of eventually plumbing it is attractive, but considering the price of the R58 I gotta wonder if it's worth it.
An R58 is a dual boiler and it has a PID which has its advantages. It gives you the opportunity to set your brew temperature and temp of your steam boiler through the PID. The Evoluzione is a heat exchanger machine that is also plumbable. The heat exchanger stays consistent at about 200-202 degrees. It's not programable, but it is also less expensive. - Steven
I ended up pulling the trigger on the Evoluzione. It's a proven design (I read that some R58 show up DOA), it's less expensive, lighter, and less stuff to break. Thanks for the response!
Rocket or Oscar that is the question. Something nice to match my new Mazzer SJ I bought from you. Thank you for the amazing purchasing experience! Best price around I must say. Even less than used grinders! Thank you.
+Abdullah Saady You can turn it off if you are not using it. You will want to turn it on about 45 minutes before you plan to use it so that it can heat up. Are you enjoying your new machine??
i recently purchased giotto evo v2. my distributor here said that the machine doesn't have pre infusion feature and opening the group head valve half way like you did may actually damage the valve and pump. however, i found out from your video that you did it. can you explain what is the benefit of pre infusion and what damage could i possibly make to the pump or machine?
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Great to hear! Glad you're enjoying the videos and finding them useful :) - Kat
Thanks for the video(s), guys! I get a lot from just the way you work the machines. I like the casual, fun, and obviously coffee-obsessed way you present the material. Keep them coming, as I am in the market for my first machine and these are super helpful...especially the videos where Gail and the team are actually using the machines.
We don't ship our machines outside of the US; there are retailers of the Rocket Machines, though, in Asia - check out their main website for a list of folks that you could purchase from - Kat
We do recommend that you have some kind of filter in place if you're going to plumb it in ... however, you do have the ability to descale these convertible models in the tank setup, so you can also just plan to do that every year or so. The machine has a rotary pump which you will adjust to meet your line pressure, so you shouldn't need additional pressure regulation. - Kat
Did you order specifically the V2 model? If so, then you should have received the V2 model. We have separate products for these, as they have a price/feature differential. If you purchased a V2 and received the previous version, it was a shipping error. Best to contact our service team directly with your order information and they'll resolve for you. - Kat
My favourite channel on youtube (of all categories). You clearly love what you do :)
We don't adjust it; it's the factory setting. If you are using the Evo model with the rotary pump, you can adjust this; otherwise, I don't believe there is a method for you to do it easily. Is it hitting up at the 9 bars without the portafilter in? - Kat
We had a Giotto Evo on the floor that we used for demos that had been cranked up too high, so it often let off a bunch of steam during the flush. This is not typical and your Cellini's non-steam flush is what you should be looking for. If you check out any of the Giotto Evo V2 videos from here on out, you'll notice there's a difference with that flush. - Kat
Yes; Gail did practical testing wherein she did her usual cooling flush and then pulled shots vs. pulling shots based on the brew head temperature reading. Invariably, the latter produced sour shots. We didn't think it offered any benefit or more precision than if you just do the cooling flush (if the machine has been sitting unused for awhile, that is.) - Kat
I still LOVE my V1 Giotto but it's starting to look a little dull and has some fine scratches around the drip tray (and areas that are used the most) - any chance you guys could do a video on recommended methods for polishing stainless steel machines?
Yup! Your brand new brew head gasket is going to keep the portafilter off to the left for awhile, then, as it ages, it will move further and further to the right. When it moves almost all the way to the right in order to engage/seal, you'll know it's time to change the brew head gasket. - Kat
That's the back pressure - adjust your grind a bit and you'll see it go down. 9 Bar is ideal, but I think it's going to be different depending on the coffee you're using. Pressure profiling is something that people are messing with on commercial machines, so it's worth experimenting a bit I think - Kat
I'd focus on the shot timing and the flavor; if it's going up close to 10 BARs during the extraction but it's coming out at the right rate and tastes good, then no worries. You could also experiment with finer coffee and a lighter tamp. - Kat
All the V2 versions are now insulated boilers - Kat
These have passive preinfusion, but you can move the lever to the middle position to 'prewet' the coffee if you like. - Kat
Just purchased the Cellini Premium Plus from SCG!! Arrives Wednesday..can't wait!
Updated; we didn't have these on the site when I posted this - Kat
We were testing that thermometer to see if it gave us any practical difference/benefit. It did not so we elected not to carry / market it. - Kat
My cellini v2 was at my doorstep on 20 march.. Way b4 u got yours i guess :-) thanx for all your vids guys you are the best!
Yay!!! That's an awesome compliment -- thank you :D - Kat
I think this was an addition after we shot this video (they're always iterating off these machines). - Kat
What I mean is, does water come out in the middle position? If water is not dispensed then it would not 'prewet' with a portafilter inserted. I believe that position is purely for the solenoid valve. Passive preinfusion /progressive pre-infusion is the result of the e-61 group design.
As far as I know, if the pump doesn't activate and there is no line pressure due to internal water tank then there will be no pre-infusion or wetting.
Oh. So what is your take on all the info out there about the need to cool flush before pulling the shot on an E61? I thought the purpose of the thermometer was to be able to calculate how long a flush you needed to get to a desired temp. Are you saying that the thermometer was not able to get this desired effect?
Ok, you were correct as I made the grind more coarse, the pressure went lower. But, now my question is: suppose that I find the grind that gives me exactly 9 bars, but the shot comes out to be too fast. Normally, I would think to make the grind more fine, but that would increase the pressure. How do you deal with this? Do I ignore the pressure and just go for 25-30 secs for 60 mls, or go for 9 bars and ignore the time it takes for 60 mls?
Hi Kat -- I just received my Cellini v2. I was watching the dvd you guys created with it and your machine has a cool thermometer installed above the brew head where mine doesn't. How did you do that, where did you get it, and does it void the warrantee? Thx!
Hi Kat. On my new Cellini the brew pressure is a steady 10 bars (same with backflush) and it looks like from this video that your new machine was close to 10 as well. I am wondering if it was set that way by Rocket or if you guys adjust it to that pressure? From what I am reading, most people out there think this is too high and should be closer to 9 for best results. Do you agree/disagree? Thx.
Ah, got it. Yeah, we set these up as separate products in tandem with launching this video; so sorry that it wasn't clear :( The machine you got is a great one, though! I'm sure you will be very happy with it :) - Kat
No flush needed if it's been sitting less than 10 mins IMHO; usually pull around 1/4 cup or so out otherwise. - Kat
Hey, Kat, do you have this machine just plugged in into a regular outlet? I would like to know because I'm only 17 but when I get a lot of money I want to buy this
Ok, so about how many seconds of a cooling flush would you recommend I do if it is idle (or the first shot after warming up), and how many seconds of a cooling flush do you recommend if it hasn't been idle (i.e. pulled a shot in the last 3-5 mins)? Thanks!
Man I have been searching for hrs to no avail. Kat please help! I live in Victoria bc and we have soft water probably the same as Seattle, same weather that's for sure. Can the machine be directly plumbed into the house line with no filtration also does there need to be an external pressure regulator installed before the water enters the machine or is the water pressure adjusted at the machines pump? Thanks so much! Planning on buying this bad boy soon
wow, now i'm even more bummed out. Your order page now reflexs the different available options. When I placed my order, sunday midnight or so, there was no indication. Though totally my fault, I suppose. I certainly would've been more than willing to spend a little extra for the features if it had been available during my order. I saw your video, showing off the new v2 and thought: YES!
@7:47 Does this machine have pre-infusion? The switch on my home machine (similar to the one in this video) has three positions, Off, On and third being the middle position of the switch only takes affect when stopping a shot. It is linked to the solenoid valve. Does the middle position dispense water from the group head without a portafilter fitted?
Hi Kat. Another question I have about my new Cellini V2 is the water flow. If you compare it to the Giotto machine's flush on one of your many videos, mine is like a fine shower coming out vs the Giotto's very strong stream. Is that a problem or is that how it should be? Are they that different because of the Vibratory vs Rotary pump? How can both of them produce the same product?! I have a youtube video of mine but was unable to post it here. Let me know if you would like to see it.
Your V1 Cellini Evo still rocks the casbah ! :) - Kat
We've spent the first few days using the Cellini V2 and are getting good shots, but our portafilter will not twist in very far. We can get it turned maybe 60 degrees and that is while holding the side of the machine for leverage. It won't even come close to perpendicular to the machine. Is this normal for a new machine?
No, without the PF in, it isn't that high. But, with the backflush disk and a normal shot it is consistent at 10. Do you think it is Rocket's intention to set it that high? Do you agree it should be closer to 9 for best results? It is not an evo, it is a premium plus.
Currently pricing around Europe for a Giotto Evo.
I was wondering if you could tell me how long it takes to get to the required temperature?
Loving your videos BTW.
alan hall Warm up time on the Giotto for brewing is about 11 minutes. Of course, the longer you warm it up the more stable it will be ;)
For the Evoluzione models, yes - Kat
on the plus is there a wrap on the boiler
Yay!!! That's a tough call, though .... I love them both for different reasons :) - Kat
Do these new one stilll have the plum switch and the drain away hose
i'm so unhappy. I ordered through you guys, cause you all seem fairly awesome, last week. was really hoping to get the v2 but when the package arrived today, it wasn't. are you folks getting rid of your old stock first?
Why do they cost more than the premium plus with PID versions?
can i use this machine for a small catering?
If im going to be using the water tank, would it be worth upgrading to the Evoluzione because of the rotary pump?
+Abdullah Saady If you think down the line you may want to plumb it in, then it may be a good idea to think about. But if not, it would be hard to make that recommendation :)
Very useful review as always! Well done. I would buy one of them.
Yeah; I said prewet because water does come out at that midway point, although with no real pressure behind it. If no water came out, I wouldn't have said that it prewet the coffee ;) - Kat
Talk about embracing social media in brick and mortar instead of shunning away and let it be a business killer. Well done! I would definitely pay a visit if I lived closer, but since I live in Sweden it might be a while.
Hey guys (love your vids btw, have watched a LOT of them), I have never understood pre-infusion with a tank machine - with 3-way valve opened towards the espresso, but no pump activated, surely there's no pressure at all in the water? (unless it's plumbed). I have a evoluzione in my kitchen and with the lever in this position (and I am tanked) I barely see a drip coming out. Or is the pressure of a full tank meant to be enough?? thanks!
When you pull the lever up half way it just drips water onto the espresso with little pressure to create preinfusion. Then you pull the lever all the way up to begin the shot extraction with pressure. - Steven
I'll check with Gail to see if she has any tips for a video - Kat
Thank you! :) - Kat
Thanks! :)
Yay!
Will the machine get damaged if you don't open the steam valve when you use it the first time? (after filling up the tank and turn on the power switch)
It could! We've never tried not opening the steam valve when starting up a new Rocket, so I'm not sure exactly what might happen. A possible explosion? Perhaps! It's best to open the steam valve to release the air while the boiler is filling for the first time. :-) ~ Sarah
Seattle Coffee Gear Thanks for the info !
when in the world will these be back in stock? I want to buy one!
Hello Dennis Lavin, Our current ETA for the Giotto Evoluzione V2 is Feb 13th. We do however have the Cellini Evoluzione V2 and R58 V2 in stock. ~ Sarah
How big of a difference does a PID make on a machine like this, really?
I'm considering getting a Rocket and the possibility of eventually plumbing it is attractive, but considering the price of the R58 I gotta wonder if it's worth it.
An R58 is a dual boiler and it has a PID which has its advantages. It gives you the opportunity to set your brew temperature and temp of your steam boiler through the PID.
The Evoluzione is a heat exchanger machine that is also plumbable. The heat exchanger stays consistent at about 200-202 degrees. It's not programable, but it is also less expensive. - Steven
I ended up pulling the trigger on the Evoluzione. It's a proven design (I read that some R58 show up DOA), it's less expensive, lighter, and less stuff to break.
Thanks for the response!
Cool!
Rocket or Oscar that is the question. Something nice to match my new Mazzer SJ I bought from you. Thank you for the amazing purchasing experience! Best price around I must say. Even less than used grinders! Thank you.
Should I turn my espresso machine off at night or keep it on all the time?
+Abdullah Saady You can turn it off if you are not using it. You will want to turn it on about 45 minutes before you plan to use it so that it can heat up. Are you enjoying your new machine??
+Seattle Coffee Gear I love my new machine =D
These are 58mm - Kat
I will forward your request to her ... but don't get your hopes up ;) - Kat
I have faith in your ability to still find something to knock about it ;) - Kat
Well please do if you're ever around these parts! :) - Kat
I hear ya! - Kat
They still have the crappy plastic tray surround?
Wish they were selling them separately, but they are not. Just the fancydancy Rocket ones ... - Kat
Yup - these are 15 AMP 110v machines - Kat
You gels are awesome!
Totally
Def!
That latte u made sure looks good!
+James W Dorsett Twas tasty :D
hahaBig ups !!! cause the winter is Seattle ..is heavy ;*)
I'm not sure what this means! - Kat
Wahooooo!!!!! - Kat
It's more of a 'pre-wetting' - Kat
I can't make fun of a new Rocket's tamper any more. Darn. Its real now.
Ooooo... I want a tamper for my 2011 Evo! :)
Hahaha - yeah, it was 11AM :D - Kat
free hand late art techniques are the future ..let me tell ya ;)
I do want one! :-)
Wish I had one :(
very cool.
OK, I am sold! Do you have a payment plan or take organ donations, first born child perhaps? Let me know I need my espresso asap! ;)
Skinny Girls Guide to Paleo Unfortunately at this time we cannot accept organ donations. :)
Yay~~~~~~~~~~
Still a plastic surround, yep - Kat
Freaks me out when you lift machines by the portafilter :/
I feel like entered a time machine
Quatro
it has the new Espresso micheen smell
LoL.. thank you for the insight.
:D
If it's on latte art ... I'm sorry to say that she probably won't watch it ;) - Kat
snake charmer!
heheh giotto!
ghat-to* art history
shh, don't let my v1 cellini evo hear!
hahaha
send me one your toy love it is nice, beautiful, elegante
Hahaha, like kids on Christmas.
i recently purchased giotto evo v2. my distributor here said that the machine doesn't have pre infusion feature and opening the group head valve half way like you did may actually damage the valve and pump. however, i found out from your video that you did it. can you explain what is the benefit of pre infusion and what damage could i possibly make to the pump or machine?