Advice to a Med School Applicant with a 2.85 GPA | Application Renovation (S2 E2)
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- Опубликовано: 22 июл 2024
- Today I'm doing a full med school application review for a student who applied late in the 2018 application cycle. Along with a low GPA (2.85 cGPA and 2.53 sGPA), she believes her MCAT score and applying late in the cycle held her back. Let's walk through her full TMDSAS application to identify what she needs to improve.
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So, our student is a Texas resident who applied to AMCAS and TMDSAS. She applied in October, which is quite late in the cycle, which really matters because of the rolling admissions that medical schools use.
One of the first things I notice when looking at her TMDSAS application is that she applied to a bunch of public out-of-state schools. Unless she had close ties to those states or those schools, this is likely a mistake, as a lot of these schools are going to heavily bias toward in-state applicants.
Our student is active-duty military now, and we talked a little about her getting permission to apply to medical school from that position and how that process went for her.
We also look at her personal statement. She mentions that one of the first meaningful experiences that led her to pursue this path was a premed meeting she attended. I mention that listing a meeting before actual healthcare experiences with patients could make admissions committees wonder if she has the experiences to really let her know what she's getting into.
I also have concerns with the focus in her personal statement on excitement, adrenaline, and war stories she heard from an ENT physician, as well as the mentions of respect and gratitude that physicians receive. Both of these things could suggest that she may not know how medicine actually is, and she could get bored, disappointed, or burned out when it doesn't deliver these things.
We touch on her Personal Characteristics Essay and her Optional Essay on a Unique Experience, which are both part of the TMDSAS application.
Looking at her activities, she doesn't have any research experience, which may be a weakness, but in my opinion, it's not a major issue. With her activity descriptions, she needs to focus more on the clinical side of what she did for each position-the patient interactions, not cleaning hospital rooms.
Based on her 2.85 cGPA and 2.53 sGPA, her application was likely filtered out by many of the schools she applied to. Her grades just hadn't yet shown that she is capable of handling the academic rigor of med school. Likewise with her MCAT: She had two MCAT attempts, a 493 and a 498, so those are also holding her back.
Steps forward for her:
• Postbac, SMP, or a Master's degree in the hard sciences with as close to a 4.0 GPA as possible.
• Improving her MCAT score
• Applying to a better list of schools for her-not so many public out-of-state schools.
• Getting more clinical experiences that reinforce why she wants to do this, so she can tell her story better.
She already retook some of her med school prereqs, and she's considering a Master's program.
To overcome her earlier grades, she'll probably want to get 20, 30, or even 40 credit hours of postbac or graduate classes with better grades to show that upward trend.
When I saw "S2 E2" I initially thought it was referring to organic chemistry.....
hahaha
seriously, same
I'm so happy I don't need to study for the MCAT anymore haha
@@jonathonchio4724 I thought Dr. Webb said orgo could possibly appear on boards as well 😂
Right!!!!
She is so brave. I would've been crying and throwing up at some of his points.
why would you do any of that? its like you dont know how to take constructive criticism to heart. you should be using that as fuel and drive to do better. cmon now.
@@RichObiQuan ever heard of a joke
@@sumsum404 i have. that was one of the worst one of the year. do better.
@@RichObiQuanchill......
@@AC-mp7cx 😂
props to her for showing up with an app like this. she has no fear
HAHAHAHAHA
Helpful video as always! I know the series is called application renovation, but it would also be really interesting to see a video or two reviewing in-depth the applications of a few people who have been accepted into medical school.
Yes! We'll try to add some more success stories. I do a lot of those on my Premed Years podcast, but don't do a full review of the application.
Medical School Headquarters please do mine! Got 5 interviews and acceptance
@@MedicalSchoolHQ I agree! I would loooove this
@@MedicalSchoolHQyes please 🙏
The comment about the use of the title “provider” and “practitioner” is super interesting!
yes! It's a huge topic in the physician world
I love these episodes! They are so helpful. Thanks!!
Thanks
I loved this. My husband is a Naval Officer and I was asking for help on my PS and he was like you need hours and numbers to show why you're "qualified" to be a doctor. Little did he realize is that is the exact opposite of what I should do lol. I think with her the military midset of always displaying your preparedness kind of "clouded" her PS. It was interesting to see pre-med and military aspects in one person.
Yay!! Love these episodes!! It’s definitely helped me with my application as well, wish me luck for this cycle🤞🏽
thanks!
Good luck Malia
I think she would be an amazing physician. She has a great attitude.
Actually, I take it back. In the close up shot the set looks amazing! 😍
too late, you've voiced your concerns already! :) Don't worry. I"m always looking for more fun stuff!
She actually has some solid experiences and will most likely be a good physician. I think that she has to prove that she can handle the coursework. I have a similar struggle with coursework working fulltime and I had to extend myself academically and it took a while, but I have improved my learning ability to do well in my sciences. I also had to transition from having to work full time to be able to afford part-time work. I think its a great idea to do a master's program, especially if its science-focused.
Living for the Dr Gray tough love!
haha, why do people think I give tough love?!? :)
Medical School Headquarters it’s blunt and honest feedback!! You’re not afraid to question someone’s true intentions and burst their bubble about the *idea* of what Med school is! Our friends and family aren’t going to say “stop trying to sell me on yourself” or “you don’t know what being a doctor is like so don’t try to convince me that you do”
If you’ve done the requirements of clinical experience, shadowing, and even research you know “the rush” barely happens. She needs more time and experiences to actually figure out if this is what she wants
I just discovered your channel, and I love that you’re doing this. I don’t know if you have done this with an applicant, but have you reviewed an applicant who did their post bacc in a community college? And would that be a worthy candidate for you? I’m pretty much going to do that cause of finances and very personal and immigrational reasons. I’m worried that medical schools wouldn’t see that and would reject me cause I didn’t take the majority of my classes at a 4-year institution
I’ve done a few episodes on The Premed Years podcast!
It’s extremely hard to get into Umich and UCLA as out of state. Those are both T10 schools with moderate instate bias.
UMich is actually around 50/50 in-state vs out-of-state (last year's matriculant data was 88 OOS, 78 IS)!!
If you’re seeking the adrenaline rush, you’re going to be very sad 👌🏼
yep :)
Dr. Gray, for the TMDSAS application, if you did not take your SAT or ACT, can you still apply and if so how would I go about doing so?
Can you do a diy postbacc at two different schools?
Not me binge watching this channel 😩
Dr. Gray, what is your opinion on stating your intentions post-medical school in your medical school application? My story is too personal to include in the comment section, but I want to work in psychiatry. I understand it can be a demanding specialty, but it is my calling to do everything I can possibly do to help people who suffer with mental illness. I have several stories I could share that inspired this. It truly is the core reason behind my desire to pursue medical school. If I mention these stories, I don't know if it would be looked at as "appropriate" because they are not necessarily clinical or employment-related. Not to say that those other experiences do not also exist, but my reason for pursuing this began well before I could ever have begun my college education, and all those formal "experiences."
you get in?
Too bad there's only one Dr Gray.. can't wait for you to review my app. 2022
I got you! :)
I hope you want him to review your app after you've been "accepted".
@@victoro.8385 There's no point.
@@Pete-da-peter If you say so
How do you send him info for him to review?
Great video 👍
I wish I could have my application reviewed ☺️
Hello! If Someone can just clarify this for me... but I was always told that when redoing science courses (such as physics math chem bio etc), to avoid taking them at a community school/2 year school (I saw that she was currently enrolled at a community school for science classes)... It is preferred to take these classes at a 4 year college/university that has a science backed program like a medical/dental/vet school. IF they do not, to do any post-bacc classes at the very least at 4 year college (state or private).
I am currently studying for MCAT and am debating redoing chemistry since I have a C and C+ in chem 2 lecture and lab respectively on my transcript... If it makes a difference, I am a NY Resident that attended university in Long Island, NY.
If anyone can just comment what they heard it would help me with my decision to redo my chemistry class! Thank you! :)
If you’re AD as an O-1 but want to attend a masters program to get a better GPA for med school, is it possible to do that or do you have to finish out the AD contract first?
When you showed the list of schools she applied to and mentioned that she was applying to too many out of state schools you didn't highlight University of Puerto Rico School of Medicine which is an out-of-state public US MD school she obviously had no chances as she had no ties to Puerto Rico. Just wanted to know why you didn't highlight it?
Take this with a grain of salt, but I don't think UPR minds out of state applicants as much as the others he highlighted. I personally know ppl who have gone there with no ties whatsoever. Public state schools have a wide range of preferences for in state students I feel.
You mention that students are infatuated with saying that they saw death and conveying that "we won't win every time" and you don't know why. Is that not something we should include?
I believe in her :) I can see her being a physician.
Me too!
I don't know if it's my mirror neurons firing off, but I really, really want her to succeed! I will donate to whatever GoFundMe she needs to get there.
I’m going into Baylor University as a freshman in the fall of this year and I’m trying to get information for the required classes that will boost up my application. I’ve noticed during my research in med school requirements there are certain schools with different required undergrad classes, how do I go about this? I’m majoring in biochemistry with no pre-med track as well, & does not taking the pre-med track affect my application? Does going to BU increase my chances in getting into Baylor’s College of Medicine? :) I’m super excited and even more nervous for undergrad, I just don’t want to mess anything up that I could’ve fixed! :)
Take any major that you will DO WELL in and excel at the prerequisites. Also, usually it is better to go to graduate school at a different institution. Going to medical school at a different institution will help you become more well rounded as a person. I wish I knew I wanted to go into medicine when I was in high school. I decided that I want to go to medical school at age 35 during my successful battle with aggressive thyroid cancer. I studied to become a teacher. I was required to get a 3.0 and I got barely better than a 3.1. That 3.1 factored in a lot of A's in easy education classes. A lot of people just do the required level and during my early 20s I was no different. I now have a lot of hurdles to jump, a family to support, and more negatives to explain. I also have life experience that I can bring to the profession having served in the Army and also having taught elementary school for nearly a decade. I want to go into either pediatrics or child and adolescent psychiatry. I am not saying pick the easiest major. Just pick something that you have passion doing and let your passion shine on your application to medical schools.
The best major is the one where you can excel and have the highest possible gpa. Unique majors can actually help people stand out a little more in the admissions process. Make sure to ask other undergrads about the best professors to take a class with so you can avoid ones that have harsh grading curves. Make sure your ECs present a narrative that is consistent with your aspirations and what you want to do in medicine. Like if you're interested in pediatric medicine, volunteer or work with kids, have clinical experiences that involve kids, and shadow pediatric surgeons or pediatricians. Use the Reddit premed and Reddit MCAT sites and try to read Reddit MCAT tips on how to maximize your MCAT score. Also if you get involved in unique research projects, internships, or programs then that will help you stand out. Take my advice with a grain of salt but this is stuff I've learned about while going through the process.
Do you have any ideas where to get research experience post premed classes?
I am interested in focusing on infectious diseases, would an MPH before medschool be a good idea in this circumstance or are there better routes for epidemiology?
Hey Dr. Gray, great video! When you say that a graduate program might be best for someone with a low GPA, do you mean like a Masters degree or an SMP? Several med school admission advisors that I have spoken to have said that many, if not most, med schools will only look at your undergraduate GPA and post bacc GPA (if you have one) when reviewing your application, and regular a Masters degree is not taken into consideration regardless of an upward trend. What do you know about this?
Tristan Deck All of it should be taken into consideration. I don’t why they think why not?
How can we get featured in these videos lol?
Is AMCAS’s cumulative GPA including high school? Or is is just college?
Just college, unless you took college courses while in high school.
Did she get any acceptances?
Is it true that reapplying makes med schools less likely to choose you?
Unfortunately yeah. But a lot of it is what ur reapplication vs OG looks like. If u can majorly improve on shortfalls, I know plenty of ppl getting accepted the second time around.
It depends some people reapply after getting more experience and get accepted
When you say, “not an MPH or a SMP” at 24:44 are you implying that SMPs are not as good as postbacc programs? Great vid as always
the comment was basically, "continued academic success in a postbac or masters (not an MPH), or an SMP. Does that make sense?
@@MedicalSchoolHQ So to clarify: a postbacc, masters, or SMP would be fine, but an MPH would not be the best for students in a similar situation?
Medical School Headquarters what is an SMP
@@MedicalSchoolHQ Hello! Just to re-ask sipwhiteraven's question, a MPH would not be the best for students with a similar situation?
@@iggy5895 MPH isn’t a hard science degree- so no it doesn’t help
How can I get on this show?
www.applicationrenovation.com/apply
Is EMT/EMS clinical experience?
EEK Productions If you are interacting with patients as an EMT, absolutely!
Yes
should try DO schools and 4 HBCU with 3.0+ gpa and 500+MCAT
Big no to HBCU. Lol ew.
Why?
@@S3din watch your mouth
I followed a wound doc in a snf while I was in nursing school and honestly from my perspective being a doctor is pretty boring lol and I hate how how students romanticize being a physician because it’s nothing like how it’s commonly portrayed, idk tho this is just anecdotal
I have an idea for her...Take a CNA course..that is what I do for a living right now and you will have tons of clinical experience..you will do vital signs..bath the patient...you will have the chance of being part of the CPR team when incidents come on the ER..I t only takes about a month this course.!!! I am currently doing an LPN just to have more exposure to medicines and data entry but also working on my prerequisites to apply to a postbacc or graduate program..hopefully you can consider this option for clinical experience..plus you will meet a lot of physician and nurses that can give you a recommendation letter..!!!
so did he say NO SMP??
does a person with that low of a GPA even have a chance?
I think so. I have a low gpa myself African American urm. Found out my mom had cancer and my freshman and sophomore year was horrible. Ended junior year with a 3.8 gpa and I have a 2.9 overall. I’m applying this upcoming cycle but I hope I have a chance at DO atleast
@@tyronehill3010 how did it go for you?
GPA misses the cutoff, she won't get pass the filters.
ok and
If you read MSAR you’d know many schools have no filter/screen.
I'm guilty I wrote about death in my personal statement
you're in good company! :)
Broo, I strongly dislike when people try to use their military service as a spring board for their applications. Yes, you served, that doesn’t qualify you to become a doctor more than someone else. If that’s the bulk of your statement that just means you lack substance past that service. Andddd a 2.85 ? Bruhhh (I’m in the Air Force btw)
Just because you don't feel any pride in your service doesn't mean someone else can't. Military offers a plethora of experiences other people simply can't get, and as a result, should be used. It qualifies you more for being a doctor than the average kid coming out of high school who has never held a job.
Eric Uher Never said I don’t have pride in my service, nice assumption though. I don’t use that has my golden ticket to get things I want to achieve. We’re not comparing kids out of high school, we’re comparing college graduates to veterans and how qualified they are to pursue medicine . Do you know many service members or veterans? Just because they know how to fire a rifle or serve food (services) doesn’t mean they’ll do well in medical school
She could definitely get in with a 2.85, I have a friend that got into medical school with a 2.1 undergrad gpa so anything is possible lol...
Adrienne P. What medical school is that and what kind of IN DID HE HAVE WITH THAT GPA MY GOD
Denis Gabrilovich Tulane University it’s an allopathic school. She got a 2.1 gpa in undergrad but did a special masters program to show that she could handle the rigor of med school. Along with a lot of volunteer hours and strong letters of recommendations + great personal statement, she was able to get in. So basically it’s not impossible 🤷🏽♀️ sometimes you do bad in undergrad that doesn’t mean you’re not fit to be a doctor lol
Move your face lol