Glad you took the time to do this. My Orient Star Classic was the most accurate watch I've ever owned. It was running at +1.5 sec/day consistently for a couple of months. Ended up selling it to finance another watch, which I still regret to this day.
The F6 movement does seem to be quite hardy. I’m curious about the F7 and F8 movements, but it seems like Orient only includes them in their top-of-the-line skeleton and moon phase watches.
@@saiyajedi There are some differences but each tier of Orient movement is comparable in quality to Seiko movement at each pricepoint. That's because they are basically Seiko derivative movements. Orient leaned on Seiko to "co-develop" their calibres and the design is heavily derivative of the Seiko 7r/4r/6r type movement design with a slightly different winding mechanism. Orient movements are also manufactured in an Epson factory, Epson FYI is part of Seiko Epson. Seiko Epson (the parent company behind Seiko) was majority shareholder in Orient since the early 2000s and now they own Orient outright so everything is even closer aligned.
Thanks for the video. Any of these fine watches can, with a bit of effort and some basic watchmaker tools, be regulated to an accuracy within a second or so per day. However, before regulating, consistency should be determined. What I mean by this is that we want to determine if the watch gains or loses the same amount of time per day. For example, a watch that loses or gains, say between 28 and 30 seconds per day consistently in a specific position, for example, dial-up can definitely be regulated to gain or lose 0 to 2 seconds per day in that position. However, if the watch isn't consistent it probably needs a service (or possibly some repair). Another factor to consider is something called positional errors meaning that the watch gains or loses a different number of seconds depending on its position (dial-up, dial-down, 12 down, 3 down, 6 down, 9 down). Positional errors are always present in a watch having a balance wheel, which all mechanical and automatic watches have, as the balance wheel is subject to gravity. However, the maximum positional difference in a healthy movement shouldn't be more than say about 20 seconds between the fastest and the slowest position. For example, gaining 7 seconds per day dial-up and losing 13 seconds a day 12 down would be OK. If the difference is too large however, say more than 30 seconds, the balance wheel needs to be poised which is a process to make the balance wheel have the same weight around its entire circumference. Posing is an advanced technique that requires removing metal from the balance wheel. As a side note, a watch gaining 7 seconds dial-up and loosing 13 seconds 12 down could, with a bit of luck, actually be accurate to down to a second or so per day when worn as wearing the watch would naturally shift the positions of the watch and so compensate for positional errors. The subject of accuracy is a very complex (and interesting) topic and there are many other factors that can affect the accuracy.
I positioned my Rolex Air King overnight either crown up or crown down to adjust the error. In the first SIX years of ownership, it was never off more than 2 secs.
Thanks for the video! I'm surprised at how much variance there is with these movements. In my own testing wearing the watches and tracking their accuracy using Toolwatch, I've found the following: Seiko 6R15 in a SARB065: +1.6s per day Seiko 7s26 in a SKX007: +6.7s per day (and +14.6s per day in a Seiko SNKL15K1S) Seiko NH35 in an Invicta 8926: + 5.4s per day Seiko 4R36 in an SRBP41: +4.1s per day Miyota 9011 in an NB0040: +6.2s per day Hamilton H10 in a Khaki Field: +1.7s per day ETA 2824-2 in a Victorinox Alliance: +3.8s per day ETA 2892 in a Hamilton Khaki Navy Pioneer: +3.1s per day Tissot Powermatic 80 COSC from a PR 100 COSC: +1s per day Grand Seiko 9F (just for fun) in an SBGX063: +0s per day I've been very lucky with the pieces I've picked up. Maybe a Tudor is in the cards in the near future? ;)
I have owned many watches over years and I bought an SKX007 last year. It was +/- under 1 second a day. I couldn't believe it I checked everyday for a whole week and it was really that accurate. I had good luck. Either way, reliable movement. I've owned watches with NH35, 4r35, 6R15, 7s26, Orient F6922, ETA 2824, ETA 2892, Sellita SW200, Omega Calibre 1151 (Valjoux 7751). ALL excellent movements and never had a problem with any of them.
I can also vouch my Seiko SPB089 Blue Alpinist (6R15) came with a +1 to +2 max sec variance per day right out of the box. And, I had been wearing that watch straight for an entire week for multiple weeks with consistently excellent results. But, not all 6R15's are the same and the one in my SBDC063 was more like +6 to 8 secs. As I commented above, ALL the movements mentioned have possibilities to perform equally well. It just depends on the brand and their mfg process and source movements and all the related QC issues that ultimately determine if you end up with an exemplary example or somewhat of a disappointing one.
@@vegandinner1731 mine has been also. That is recent as well as a Steinhart 39 GMT 500, both out of the box +2 secs max. Well, actually, another ecent, the CW C65 Trident Vintage GMT with Pepsi bezel has been - 0.5 secs. Just proving my personal point, there really isn't really any truly bad movements in any modern watch these days.
The deal with the Seiko movements is that they need to be well wound (aka. worn most of the day), to run consistently. But if they are, then COSC-equivalent rates are achievable for most of them, with a good regulation.
Yes. I have an old mini turtle that runs about -10 MINUTES while sitting. Runs about -15 to +10 seconds a day while being worn and consistently wound. As a result, I don’t end up wearing it much.
Interesting test, I've personally found expensive movement to have better consistency than better accuracy. For example, my Seiko Turtle varies in its daily deviations, but it averages out to be very accurate over a week. Whereas more expensive movements might not average out to be very accurate, but they tend to have the same daily deviation consistently.
Great info. On my experience, had a Seiko sarg005 (with 6r15 movement) which I managed to regulate at +5 seconds a day at best. I also have a Tudor Bronze that runs 2 seconds a day - which is tremendously impressive on their part. At the moment besides the Tudor I have a skx which I moded (by myself) to nh36 movement but didn’t regulate yet. I’d say it loses about 25-30 seconds a day. But I uses it rarely so it’s really a non issue at this point. I also have a Bulova quartz chronograph- which is totally champion of keeping accuracy.
Thanks for this video comparison. I have two watches with similar movements: Seiko SARB017 6R15 -1.9 sec/d (over 50 non-continuous days) Seiko SKX modded NH36a +1.7 sex/d (over 30 non-continuous days) My other automatics run as follows: Glycine Airman 42 GL0067 (modified ETA2893) +1.8 sec/d Christopher Ward C60 Trident Bronze 600 (Sellita SW200-1) +2.4 sec/d Baum & Mercier Capeland Chronograph (ETA 7750) +6.5 sec/d Orient Bambino (in-house movement) -5.8 sec/d Squale 1521 (ETA2824-2) +11.9 sec/d I must be very lucky, all of them are well within spec, most much better than spec. Even my 72y.o. Vintage Omega is only -35 sec/d, which is really amazing considering.
Really enjoyed watching your video thanks. I have a small collection of inexpensive watches running either NH35A/4R36 or ETA 2824-2/SW200 plus a couple of Seiko solar movements. The most consistent is the ETA 2824-2 which gains 3 SPD during wear. Always. The most accurate of the mechanical movements is one of the NH35A's which loses 1 sec every 3 or 4 days. (Better than one of the Seiko solar movements!) My numbers are taken after 24 hours on wrist using an online atomic clock for reference. Whilst I have regulated some I find that the NH35A is nearly always acceptable as is, the Swiss made movements tend to be less accurate (smaller sample size of 5 in total) but make up for it with their extremely easy and precise adjustment method. Something very satisfying about a collection of gears and springs that with a little energy input keep such accurate time.
Interesting comparison. I managed to regulate a Seiko 5 with a 7s26 recently to +2s/d dial up (-1.75s/d on the wrist). Although I used a timegrapher it was just luck I think. Including an ON- WRIST accuracy report for your watches would also be interesting as it can be quite different to the static accuracy tests.
I agree, great value for money as well. The only thing I don’t like is the feel of the manual wind (mind you I only normally give it a few winds to get it started).
I assume you have not had any of these watches adjusted. So what this shows is accuracy as they came from the factory. Which is good to know. My 7s26 lost 30 minutes in a week until I adjusted it. Now it is still on the same minute after 4 days. I am still testing it. But I am much happier with it's performance now.
It did regulate my SKX013 and mine now runs about +10- to about +15. Before it was doing -20 to -25 which bothered me. I do not have a time-grapher so my quoted results are observational while wearing the watch. My Hamilton Khaki Auto performs exactly as yours, I was actually expecting more from an ETA/H10.
Well, I get your disclaimer and the parameters in which this test and observation is based on. I supposed it's a good representation of your own watch collection's various movements and their respective performances. I can't say I am surprised as, honestly, I believe any and all of the watches and their movements have the potential to perform equally as well. Doesn't matter Swiss, Japanese or German, or whatever. In my experience, most modern watches, even certain vintage ones, do not have truly bad movements. However, to really set a better test, all the watches should have had their movements regulated to the best of their ability and balanced where applicable and possible. THEN, do the test in at least 1 position as a static baseline. THEN, do another set of tests with watch worn over a course of a least a couple of days, if not a full week. And, THEN, I think we will have some better head to head accuracy readings to compare and contrast. But, even then, not all movements within the same models are made totally equally and variances in parts, tolerances and QC will all play a factor. BUT, I know that's a hell of a lot of work, probably money to get them all optimized, and time you probably have no interest to do. So, fair to say we will never see it. That all being said, it's still interesting to see how your personal watches perform and maybe help set some limited expectations on these models if some are interested in getting one or even own one or more already.
Yes exactly, this is perhaps a good representation of the accuracy of my watches and it can probably be some kind of guideline what to expect from similar movements. But as you said, there are to many variables involved to draw any definitive conclusions Agreed, that would be the perfect scenario, and it would indeed be very interesting to have all watches regulated and tested. Perhaps that's something I can do in the future. Regards GAW
I have experienced the Japanese movement of 7s36 and Miyota both works well in +/- 10 sec/day if they on your wrist most of the time. You may get -2sec on some good days, but not always. And they can stop if they are not winding enough for store for whole day while on the paper saying 40 hours. They are simple affordable and reliable watches for enthusiasm people who love mechanical movement and 10sec is not a issue with their daily routine (check and correct time sometimes in a week) and love to wearing most of the time. Quartz watches or smart watches are more suitable for today's trend and the solar watches is a better option. 😀
I had an awful experience with the 6R15D. It was fully would and not magnetized but it would run +25 one day and -30 the next. I gave it a couple weeks to break in the movement because it was new but it didn't help. Upon further research I found these movements have terrible amplitude readings and I was not the only one experiencing this issue. Done with Seiko unless it's spring drive.
Same problem here. Mine could be magnetized or poor oiled since at time I lost or gain 10-15 minutes. It's a gamble with them now, poor quality control.
For Eta 2824, I was able to regulate it to about +1 seconds a day. Great movement. The new H10 movements for hamilton gets annoying with a free sprung balance so you can't really regulate it unless you know what you are doing.
I have 3 Tudors and they are all within -1 to +3 - most of the times they are on par with my Rolex at 1.5 secs/day fast. I do have another basic ETA that works in the same area (lucky draw). Also the Seikos do perform much better in my experience when worn versus static positions.
I guess it varies from watch to watch. I have a 26 year old seiko 5 which gains 9.3 sec a day. That's incredible, but you could always learn how to regulate it.
A movement that runs faster or slower but keeps the same rate everyday, is very accurate but unregulated. Consistency is what is relevant in time keeping. In this respect, your comparision is irrelevant.
If the 7S26 is a C version, you can "back hack" the movement where you find the sweet spot and you can make the second hand stop and pause or as I can on mine run backwards. You have to get the hand setting at a certain position to make it happen. The official way to zero in the 7S26 is to watch your time source noting the seconds position on your watch, 2 secs before your time source matches your second hand give the movement a decent oscillation as it takes about 2 secs to power up via the magic fingers. I bought both the NH35 and 36 in watches this year, the 35 is flawless, doesn't lose any time which I would expect from a brand new Sii movt... the 36 though was well out of whack, losing a min or two a day and I had to regulate it where it now loses very little secs and keeps good time again.
On my wrist today is my newly arrived somewhat battered 1974 Slava "tank" export, the rare rare one with the screw on acrylic screen... keeping marvellous time and since polishing up looks like a million roubles on my wrist and its a Soviet automatic with twin mainsprings... hehe take that every other watch company with their single mainspring :P
Glad i saw this video. Got my sarb033 in -2 to +3 secs. per day on a manual hand wind, but +6-8sec on the spot when i shake it. Not sure where’s the issue.
Hi, I have a Hamilton jazzmaster automatic cronograph I have had it on the watch winder in the vertical position for over a week and it is bang on time I am in total disbelief .I have tested it many times its unbelievable.
Well said, i just got orient star dk05004k, worth for cent to cent, happy with that watch. Even seiko owned orient but they have their own in-house movement so i see them as seperate company
I have a Marlin and love it, put a eulit perlon on it and wear it daily. Keeps great time if wound 24 hrs, will lose time near the end of the power reserve (after 30+hrs). Its a cheap chinese movement, the junghans movement will be better quality to be sure BUT, I have heard it ticks loudly and I hate that - the marlin is basically silent unless you hold it up to your ear. For some, that's not an issue. Other than sound then consider if you want a silver dial or white. Marlin is so much cheaper Timex gave me 25% off for signing up to their newsletter, look for a deal and you will get it for like 150. And I love the silver dial it makes it has a great looking sunburst finish which really looks proper vintage and the numerals are actually stamped from behind into the dial so it looks very well made for the price.
Steve E. Brown i have tried on a Junghans Max Bill 38mm Automatic and it really looks and wears nice. However what I can’t get past is the very loud sound that it makes when rotor winds. I have a video of this on my humble channel that shows how loud it is. So yes, I am more inclined to get the Marin 34 but am also considering the LMM-01 Vintage as well
The only automatic I have is in my Steeldive Submariner, it’s the NH35 and I love it. I prefer quartz though and love a cheap Miyota 2115, and my ETA F06.115 with three jewels, it’s seriously impressive only gaining 7 seconds in 4+ months. I think the NH35 is where it’s at for me, I like a Japanese movement, that’s reliable and pretty accurate, while being really affordable as well. I’d love a Miyota 8 or 9 series though, and the Powermatic 80 would be nice to have in the collection.
I have an eta 2897, an h-10, and eta 2801-2. My 2801-2 powered watch runs within chronometer spec(+1.3 seconds)s while h-10 is almost similar to yours with 7 secs, and eta 2897 powered watch runs about 3 seconds in a day. And i have two other Orient calibers(48c40 hand wound and 6724 automatic) runs at +5 secs in day.
Well. You need review with the prices of these movement bro. My opinion. Miyota 9015 is the beast with its price. 28.800, high accurate, hacking stop and hand winding. I got a homemage watch with this movement and gain +1 per day. Really impress...
Aren't these Hamilton H movements supposed to be very accurate (+/- 3s a day) since they are not so easy to regulate? I would love one of these khaki automatics but can't bring myself to spend money on one. Currently I have 2 Seikos, one with 6R15, one with 7S26,both are around minus 0.5s a day so I'm bit spoiled.
One point the skx was the k version. My j version performs well I figure about - 30 seconds a week so maybe 4.5 seconds a day. It is brand new so may get less accurate over time but still pretty impressive for the price.
I regulated an orient ray 2 to within 3 sec a day. Not bad for a watch I paid about £125 for. I also had a Seiko monster mk2 that was also only a few seconds a day out from the factory
Why do people insist testing watches in the dial up position? What watch spends it's days with it's dial pointing up? 3 down or 12 down would be much more common I think. (except of course night time, but during the night you can just set it down whichever way works best for the accuracy)
Thank you for the comparison, but I think you have tested the watches for how well they are regulated; not their accuracy. In your test I could bump up the high-dollar Tudor's regulator, make the watch gain one-minute daily, making it the most "inaccurate" watch of the lot.
It would be interesting to actually regulate each of these and then check 24 hr accuracy for several days to get at accuracy and test-retest reliability (i.e., repeatability).
My 3045 'Grand Diver' INVICTA arrived poorly adjusted. After a 'magic touch' to the racket, I am spinning it between - 1and +1seconds 24 hours !!! Imo the NH35A is the winner. (P. S. : I'm sorry, excluding the TUDOR)
Would be cool if you would set up the watches to their best and then determine wich watch is better. The cheaper seiko's must cut cost so they are probably not set up properly
I have a ETA in my hamiliton . A 6R in my Sarb035. And a NH 35 in my San Martin . All are good . The HN35 is a few seconds fast a day. No big deal . I'm looking at a new watch with the PT5000 in it .
The 7s26 can be a great performer when regulated. (-22s/d is outrageous, even if within spec. I would get it regulated.) My three 7s26 mov'ts ran at +0.5s/day, +1.8s/day and +5s/day respectively. (The last two I got regulated.) My 4r36 (which is based on the 7s26) runs at +1.3s/day.
I could have bought a La Vallie watch with a 2892A2 movement in it for $279 but I was unfamiliar with the brand and didn't care about the movement. Did I blow it?
The most accurate watch I owned was an srp637 at PERFECT time. The variance is only -0.3 to +0.2 spd Regardless of position. This is even better than my bb58 at -0.8 spd. I've since sold the watch but to this day I wonder how it was possible that it ran so accurately.
My new Longines hydroconquest with L888,2 based on eta 2892-a2 is insane preformer it is 3 sec fast after 7 days. I was using it normaly waring it abot 14 h a day. So it is about 0,4 sec fast a day.
Rubbish my 9015 it running around this all the time. I've got a NH-38, that's not far of to. Now I'm not saying they all will run this good but on a whole my Japanese movements are every bit as good as the Swiss counterparts...
Mechanical movements are pretty much luck of the draw. Of course with more regulated/adjusted, more high end, more expensive movements, the chances of getting a more accurate one increase. My most two accurate watches I ever had (and still have them) are a Seiko with a 4R35 and a Hamilton with ETA 2825-2. And this is accuracy in any position of use, and they both outperform the 2 Rolex I had by quite a margin (Explorer 1 and Yacht Master). But I admit with the Seiko is more of a luck than with the ETA for sure, especially for positional variation, I can’t really explain how I got such well adjusted movement since they don’t come adjusted from the factory (It’s a Samurai Padi but don’t think that’s relevant) My other Seikos do keep great time but I know how to compensate the positions, so in the end it’s not really such a big deal, if I’d really care I’d get a quartz and be done with it.
7S26 is in real disadvantage unless you are wesring it as it doesn't have hand winding or hacking to either charge the spring or set the time accurately.
Sorry, but the sample size of 1 tells absolutely nothing about the performance of the movements in general. Leaving aside factors like positional stability and so on...
Thanks for the suggestion, but I actually used WatchCheck. Good app, but it doesn't completely eliminate the human factor. It certainly makes it a lot more consistent though. Regards GAW Regards GAW
This test is not really relevant as you can regulate each one of them. It’s only a matter of caliber but watchmaker regulation. I do regulate my all watches to 0/+3 s/day even the 7s26 in a Seiko 5. Tudor movement is usually -4/+2 s/day. Seiko is known for not being the best on QC as regulating their watches out of factory. Bottom line, if you buy a watch at watchmaker that has been regulated properly you should have a -2/+4 s/day with any caliber. Some brands are already good out of factory even with a chinese movement because they do service and regulate them.
Glad you took the time to do this. My Orient Star Classic was the most accurate watch I've ever owned. It was running at +1.5 sec/day consistently for a couple of months. Ended up selling it to finance another watch, which I still regret to this day.
The F6 movement does seem to be quite hardy. I’m curious about the F7 and F8 movements, but it seems like Orient only includes them in their top-of-the-line skeleton and moon phase watches.
@@saiyajedi There are some differences but each tier of Orient movement is comparable in quality to Seiko movement at each pricepoint.
That's because they are basically Seiko derivative movements.
Orient leaned on Seiko to "co-develop" their calibres and the design is heavily derivative of the Seiko 7r/4r/6r type movement design with a slightly different winding mechanism. Orient movements are also manufactured in an Epson factory, Epson FYI is part of Seiko Epson.
Seiko Epson (the parent company behind Seiko) was majority shareholder in Orient since the early 2000s and now they own Orient outright so everything is even closer aligned.
Great video, keep it up!
The 7S26 in my Seiko gains 15s in a week (~2/d), more than 10 years after the last service. Ridiculous.
How much time reserve you have?
Excellent video! I haven't gotten that much information from any other watch video out there.
Thanks, that means a lot to hear!
Regards
GAW
My NH35 in 60$ pagani design gains 1 secs per day. That is simply amazing.
Thanks for the video. Any of these fine watches can, with a bit of effort and some basic watchmaker tools, be regulated to an accuracy within a second or so per day. However, before regulating, consistency should be determined. What I mean by this is that we want to determine if the watch gains or loses the same amount of time per day. For example, a watch that loses or gains, say between 28 and 30 seconds per day consistently in a specific position, for example, dial-up can definitely be regulated to gain or lose 0 to 2 seconds per day in that position. However, if the watch isn't consistent it probably needs a service (or possibly some repair).
Another factor to consider is something called positional errors meaning that the watch gains or loses a different number of seconds depending on its position (dial-up, dial-down, 12 down, 3 down, 6 down, 9 down). Positional errors are always present in a watch having a balance wheel, which all mechanical and automatic watches have, as the balance wheel is subject to gravity. However, the maximum positional difference in a healthy movement shouldn't be more than say about 20 seconds between the fastest and the slowest position. For example, gaining 7 seconds per day dial-up and losing 13 seconds a day 12 down would be OK. If the difference is too large however, say more than 30 seconds, the balance wheel needs to be poised which is a process to make the balance wheel have the same weight around its entire circumference. Posing is an advanced technique that requires removing metal from the balance wheel. As a side note, a watch gaining 7 seconds dial-up and loosing 13 seconds 12 down could, with a bit of luck, actually be accurate to down to a second or so per day when worn as wearing the watch would naturally shift the positions of the watch and so compensate for positional errors.
The subject of accuracy is a very complex (and interesting) topic and there are many other factors that can affect the accuracy.
I positioned my Rolex Air King overnight either crown up or crown down to adjust the error. In the first SIX years of ownership, it was never off more than 2 secs.
I’ve got a samurai with a 4r35 movement (lesser movement than 6r15). Performs @ -5s/d consistently and is over 12 months old. Fantastic for the price.
Thanks for the video! I'm surprised at how much variance there is with these movements. In my own testing wearing the watches and tracking their accuracy using Toolwatch, I've found the following:
Seiko 6R15 in a SARB065: +1.6s per day
Seiko 7s26 in a SKX007: +6.7s per day (and +14.6s per day in a Seiko SNKL15K1S)
Seiko NH35 in an Invicta 8926: + 5.4s per day
Seiko 4R36 in an SRBP41: +4.1s per day
Miyota 9011 in an NB0040: +6.2s per day
Hamilton H10 in a Khaki Field: +1.7s per day
ETA 2824-2 in a Victorinox Alliance: +3.8s per day
ETA 2892 in a Hamilton Khaki Navy Pioneer: +3.1s per day
Tissot Powermatic 80 COSC from a PR 100 COSC: +1s per day
Grand Seiko 9F (just for fun) in an SBGX063: +0s per day
I've been very lucky with the pieces I've picked up. Maybe a Tudor is in the cards in the near future? ;)
ruclips.net/video/X_RJu14k_i0/видео.html
7S26 is a real gamble, mine did +14s/day the first two weeks then settled to +5 to +8s/day, super happy
I have owned many watches over years and I bought an SKX007 last year. It was +/- under 1 second a day. I couldn't believe it I checked everyday for a whole week and it was really that accurate. I had good luck. Either way, reliable movement. I've owned watches with NH35, 4r35, 6R15, 7s26, Orient F6922, ETA 2824, ETA 2892, Sellita SW200, Omega Calibre 1151 (Valjoux 7751). ALL excellent movements and never had a problem with any of them.
First time I've seen your channel good job I have the NH35 in the Invicta it runs incredibly well !!
Good video my friend, the most acurate watch I own is a seiko alpinist with the 6R15. It is +2 secs per day
I can also vouch my Seiko SPB089 Blue Alpinist (6R15) came with a +1 to +2 max sec variance per day right out of the box. And, I had been wearing that watch straight for an entire week for multiple weeks with consistently excellent results. But, not all 6R15's are the same and the one in my SBDC063 was more like +6 to 8 secs. As I commented above, ALL the movements mentioned have possibilities to perform equally well. It just depends on the brand and their mfg process and source movements and all the related QC issues that ultimately determine if you end up with an exemplary example or somewhat of a disappointing one.
Thanks mate!
The Alpinist is a fantastic. Congrats on a great watch.
Regards
GAW
@@vegandinner1731 mine has been also. That is recent as well as a Steinhart 39 GMT 500, both out of the box +2 secs max. Well, actually, another ecent, the CW C65 Trident Vintage GMT with Pepsi bezel has been - 0.5 secs. Just proving my personal point, there really isn't really any truly bad movements in any modern watch these days.
@@khronokraze Except for that awful 7s26...
My alpinist is also +2 per day!
The deal with the Seiko movements is that they need to be well wound (aka. worn most of the day), to run consistently. But if they are, then COSC-equivalent rates are achievable for most of them, with a good regulation.
Yes. I have an old mini turtle that runs about -10 MINUTES while sitting. Runs about -15 to +10 seconds a day while being worn and consistently wound. As a result, I don’t end up wearing it much.
Interesting test, I've personally found expensive movement to have better consistency than better accuracy. For example, my Seiko Turtle varies in its daily deviations, but it averages out to be very accurate over a week. Whereas more expensive movements might not average out to be very accurate, but they tend to have the same daily deviation consistently.
Yeah, I was more wondering about consistency. Then it is just a matter of regulating it
Fascinating video, just watched it for a second time.
Great Idea, congrats.
Keep it on
Great info.
On my experience, had a Seiko sarg005 (with 6r15 movement) which I managed to regulate at +5 seconds a day at best.
I also have a Tudor Bronze that runs 2 seconds a day - which is tremendously impressive on their part.
At the moment besides the Tudor I have a skx which I moded (by myself) to nh36 movement but didn’t regulate yet. I’d say it loses about 25-30 seconds a day. But I uses it rarely so it’s really a non issue at this point.
I also have a Bulova quartz chronograph- which is totally champion of keeping accuracy.
That camera quality is amazing ! Good purchase ! The videos come out great
Thanks for this video comparison. I have two watches with similar movements:
Seiko SARB017 6R15 -1.9 sec/d (over 50 non-continuous days)
Seiko SKX modded NH36a +1.7 sex/d (over 30 non-continuous days)
My other automatics run as follows:
Glycine Airman 42 GL0067 (modified ETA2893) +1.8 sec/d
Christopher Ward C60 Trident Bronze 600 (Sellita SW200-1) +2.4 sec/d
Baum & Mercier Capeland Chronograph (ETA 7750) +6.5 sec/d
Orient Bambino (in-house movement) -5.8 sec/d
Squale 1521 (ETA2824-2) +11.9 sec/d
I must be very lucky, all of them are well within spec, most much better than spec. Even my 72y.o. Vintage Omega is only -35 sec/d, which is really amazing considering.
Really enjoyed watching your video thanks. I have a small collection of inexpensive watches running either NH35A/4R36 or ETA 2824-2/SW200 plus a couple of Seiko solar movements. The most consistent is the ETA 2824-2 which gains 3 SPD during wear. Always. The most accurate of the mechanical movements is one of the NH35A's which loses 1 sec every 3 or 4 days. (Better than one of the Seiko solar movements!) My numbers are taken after 24 hours on wrist using an online atomic clock for reference. Whilst I have regulated some I find that the NH35A is nearly always acceptable as is, the Swiss made movements tend to be less accurate (smaller sample size of 5 in total) but make up for it with their extremely easy and precise adjustment method. Something very satisfying about a collection of gears and springs that with a little energy input keep such accurate time.
Very nice job , and great content!
Thank you, I appreciate it!
Regards
GAW
I want more videos like this. Great job.
Interesting comparison. I managed to regulate a Seiko 5 with a 7s26 recently to +2s/d dial up (-1.75s/d on the wrist). Although I used a timegrapher it was just luck I think. Including an ON- WRIST accuracy report for your watches would also be interesting as it can be quite different to the static accuracy tests.
That’s about what I got on my 7s26 after some fiddling. I surprised this comparison was on factory set/unregulated movements.
Keep up the good work!! I like your content and this video was insightful.
Yoooooooooo I am totally blown away by the figures from the tudor 💥💥💣
I was lucky enough to get a 7S26 in a Seiko SNK809 that gets +3.5 spd!
Thank you, accuracy is my topic!
then quarz would be your best choice lol
Really excellent performance from the mitiiyota. With regulation we can expect better results. It is one of my favorite movements
But routinley dissed by guys with RUclips shows.
Indeed
I agree, great value for money as well. The only thing I don’t like is the feel of the manual wind (mind you I only normally give it a few winds to get it started).
I assume you have not had any of these watches adjusted. So what this shows is accuracy as they came from the factory. Which is good to know. My 7s26 lost 30 minutes in a week until I adjusted it. Now it is still on the same minute after 4 days. I am still testing it. But I am much happier with it's performance now.
It did regulate my SKX013 and mine now runs about +10- to about +15. Before it was doing -20 to -25 which bothered me. I do not have a time-grapher so my quoted results are observational while wearing the watch. My Hamilton Khaki Auto performs exactly as yours, I was actually expecting more from an ETA/H10.
Well, I get your disclaimer and the parameters in which this test and observation is based on. I supposed it's a good representation of your own watch collection's various movements and their respective performances.
I can't say I am surprised as, honestly, I believe any and all of the watches and their movements have the potential to perform equally as well. Doesn't matter Swiss, Japanese or German, or whatever. In my experience, most modern watches, even certain vintage ones, do not have truly bad movements.
However, to really set a better test, all the watches should have had their movements regulated to the best of their ability and balanced where applicable and possible. THEN, do the test in at least 1 position as a static baseline. THEN, do another set of tests with watch worn over a course of a least a couple of days, if not a full week. And, THEN, I think we will have some better head to head accuracy readings to compare and contrast. But, even then, not all movements within the same models are made totally equally and variances in parts, tolerances and QC will all play a factor.
BUT, I know that's a hell of a lot of work, probably money to get them all optimized, and time you probably have no interest to do. So, fair to say we will never see it.
That all being said, it's still interesting to see how your personal watches perform and maybe help set some limited expectations on these models if some are interested in getting one or even own one or more already.
Yes exactly, this is perhaps a good representation of the accuracy of my watches and it can probably be some kind of guideline what to expect from similar movements. But as you said, there are to many variables involved to draw any definitive conclusions
Agreed, that would be the perfect scenario, and it would indeed be very interesting to have all watches regulated and tested.
Perhaps that's something I can do in the future.
Regards
GAW
Interesting how you pronounced ‘Hamilton’. Not bagging on you, I just never thought about that name that way. Good video overall my dude.
I have experienced the Japanese movement of 7s36 and Miyota both works well in +/- 10 sec/day if they on your wrist most of the time. You may get -2sec on some good days, but not always. And they can stop if they are not winding enough for store for whole day while on the paper saying 40 hours.
They are simple affordable and reliable watches for enthusiasm people who love mechanical movement and 10sec is not a issue with their daily routine (check and correct time sometimes in a week) and love to wearing most of the time.
Quartz watches or smart watches are more suitable for today's trend and the solar watches is a better option. 😀
I had an awful experience with the 6R15D. It was fully would and not magnetized but it would run +25 one day and -30 the next. I gave it a couple weeks to break in the movement because it was new but it didn't help. Upon further research I found these movements have terrible amplitude readings and I was not the only one experiencing this issue. Done with Seiko unless it's spring drive.
Same problem here. Mine could be magnetized or poor oiled since at time I lost or gain 10-15 minutes.
It's a gamble with them now, poor quality control.
Good content, thank you for this.
My Seiko 7S26 was also running fast but my watchmaker was able to regulate it to keep much more accurate time.
Man, I want this collection. Tired of cashed up nuffys showing off there branded shit. Nice video man
For Eta 2824, I was able to regulate it to about +1 seconds a day. Great movement. The new H10 movements for hamilton gets annoying with a free sprung balance so you can't really regulate it unless you know what you are doing.
I have 3 Tudors and they are all within -1 to +3 - most of the times they are on par with my Rolex at 1.5 secs/day fast. I do have another basic ETA that works in the same area (lucky draw). Also the Seikos do perform much better in my experience when worn versus static positions.
I guess it varies from watch to watch. I have a 26 year old seiko 5 which gains 9.3 sec a day. That's incredible, but you could always learn how to regulate it.
A movement that runs faster or slower but keeps the same rate everyday, is very accurate but unregulated.
Consistency is what is relevant in time keeping.
In this respect, your comparision is irrelevant.
Any of those can be regulate so I do get it neither.
Good comparison! My Tudor BB only does -2 sec day , still good though
Thanks man!
-2s/day is great accuracy. I would not worry about that.
Regards
GAW
If the 7S26 is a C version, you can "back hack" the movement where you find the sweet spot and you can make the second hand stop and pause or as I can on mine run backwards. You have to get the hand setting at a certain position to make it happen. The official way to zero in the 7S26 is to watch your time source noting the seconds position on your watch, 2 secs before your time source matches your second hand give the movement a decent oscillation as it takes about 2 secs to power up via the magic fingers. I bought both the NH35 and 36 in watches this year, the 35 is flawless, doesn't lose any time which I would expect from a brand new Sii movt... the 36 though was well out of whack, losing a min or two a day and I had to regulate it where it now loses very little secs and keeps good time again.
On my wrist today is my newly arrived somewhat battered 1974 Slava "tank" export, the rare rare one with the screw on acrylic screen... keeping marvellous time and since polishing up looks like a million roubles on my wrist and its a Soviet automatic with twin mainsprings... hehe take that every other watch company with their single mainspring :P
After full servicing and overhauled by authorised Seiko SC, my 6R15 running +1/-1 spd... Crazy
Great video thanks 👍
This is an excellent video. Can you also compare the Orient movements?
My Hamilton khaki king 2(H10) runs at -0.4 seconds consistently. Had it almost a year now. Awesome watch especially for the price!
you mean 4 seconds, and not .4 second
@@romybuenaventura3133 Yes thats what I meant. You look extremely smart pointing that out. Great job boy
From my experience I knew the Tudor would win. My new Seiko SRPE61 with the 4R35 runs at a surprising -4 per day.
Glad i saw this video. Got my sarb033 in -2 to +3 secs. per day on a manual hand wind, but +6-8sec on the spot when i shake it. Not sure where’s the issue.
Hi, I have a Hamilton jazzmaster automatic cronograph I have had it on the watch winder in the vertical position for over a week and it is bang on time I am in total disbelief .I have tested it many times its unbelievable.
Very interesting video!! You should also add an Orient Japanese movement.
Well said, i just got orient star dk05004k, worth for cent to cent, happy with that watch. Even seiko owned orient but they have their own in-house movement so i see them as seperate company
very good review
Which dress watch is a better value? Timex Marlin 34mm vs Junghans Max Bill 34mm Handwind
Timex Marlin. Junghans is overrated and overpriced (2-3x), perhaps only standing out due to its origination from Max Bill's original Bauhaus designs.
I have a Marlin and love it, put a eulit perlon on it and wear it daily. Keeps great time if wound 24 hrs, will lose time near the end of the power reserve (after 30+hrs). Its a cheap chinese movement, the junghans movement will be better quality to be sure BUT, I have heard it ticks loudly and I hate that - the marlin is basically silent unless you hold it up to your ear. For some, that's not an issue. Other than sound then consider if you want a silver dial or white. Marlin is so much cheaper Timex gave me 25% off for signing up to their newsletter, look for a deal and you will get it for like 150. And I love the silver dial it makes it has a great looking sunburst finish which really looks proper vintage and the numerals are actually stamped from behind into the dial so it looks very well made for the price.
Steve E. Brown i have tried on a Junghans Max Bill 38mm Automatic and it really looks and wears nice. However what I can’t get past is the very loud sound that it makes when rotor winds. I have a video of this on my humble channel that shows how loud it is. So yes, I am more inclined to get the Marin 34 but am also considering the LMM-01 Vintage as well
Nice review. Would be great if you used timegrapher. Always wonder the exact variance, the amplitude and beat error between the movements.
Cool vid 👍
Thanks! :)
Regards
GAW
The only automatic I have is in my Steeldive Submariner, it’s the NH35 and I love it. I prefer quartz though and love a cheap Miyota 2115, and my ETA F06.115 with three jewels, it’s seriously impressive only gaining 7 seconds in 4+ months. I think the NH35 is where it’s at for me, I like a Japanese movement, that’s reliable and pretty accurate, while being really affordable as well. I’d love a Miyota 8 or 9 series though, and the Powermatic 80 would be nice to have in the collection.
Great videos William! I'm curious to hear your thoughts on the Seiko SARY025. I can't find enough information and reviews on this sexy watch.
And you can regulate and fix beat error of those movements with a phone app and a toothpick so...
I have an eta 2897, an h-10, and eta 2801-2. My 2801-2 powered watch runs within chronometer spec(+1.3 seconds)s while h-10 is almost similar to yours with 7 secs, and eta 2897 powered watch runs about 3 seconds in a day. And i have two other Orient calibers(48c40 hand wound and 6724 automatic) runs at +5 secs in day.
Well. You need review with the prices of these movement bro. My opinion. Miyota 9015 is the beast with its price. 28.800, high accurate, hacking stop and hand winding. I got a homemage watch with this movement and gain +1 per day. Really impress...
My Tudor black bay 79230N. + -0 per day. - 2 after 6 months moved one hour ahead day light savings. Cheers
Aren't these Hamilton H movements supposed to be very accurate (+/- 3s a day) since they are not so easy to regulate? I would love one of these khaki automatics but can't bring myself to spend money on one. Currently I have 2 Seikos, one with 6R15, one with 7S26,both are around minus 0.5s a day so I'm bit spoiled.
One point the skx was the k version. My j version performs well I figure about - 30 seconds a week so maybe 4.5 seconds a day. It is brand new so may get less accurate over time but still pretty impressive for the price.
FYI seiko presage is not powered by 6r15 it is 4r35..
I regulated an orient ray 2 to within 3 sec a day. Not bad for a watch I paid about £125 for. I also had a Seiko monster mk2 that was also only a few seconds a day out from the factory
Why do people insist testing watches in the dial up position? What watch spends it's days with it's dial pointing up? 3 down or 12 down would be much more common I think. (except of course night time, but during the night you can just set it down whichever way works best for the accuracy)
Thank you for the comparison, but I think you have tested the watches for how well they are regulated; not their accuracy. In your test I could bump up the high-dollar Tudor's regulator, make the watch gain one-minute daily, making it the most "inaccurate" watch of the lot.
It would be interesting to actually regulate each of these and then check 24 hr accuracy for several days to get at accuracy and test-retest reliability (i.e., repeatability).
My 3045 'Grand Diver' INVICTA arrived poorly adjusted. After a 'magic touch' to the racket, I am spinning it between - 1and +1seconds 24 hours !!!
Imo the NH35A is the winner.
(P. S. : I'm sorry, excluding the TUDOR)
I think, it can be also useful to compare the movement decoration...
Would be cool if you would set up the watches to their best and then determine wich watch is better. The cheaper seiko's must cut cost so they are probably not set up properly
I have a ETA in my hamiliton . A 6R in my Sarb035. And a NH 35 in my San Martin . All are good . The HN35 is a few seconds fast a day. No big deal . I'm looking at a new watch with the PT5000 in it .
The 7s26 can be a great performer when regulated. (-22s/d is outrageous, even if within spec. I would get it regulated.) My three 7s26 mov'ts ran at +0.5s/day, +1.8s/day and +5s/day respectively. (The last two I got regulated.) My 4r36 (which is based on the 7s26) runs at +1.3s/day.
I have an nh35a and a 9015 that are less than +1 per day
I could have bought a La Vallie watch with a 2892A2 movement in it for $279 but I was unfamiliar with the brand and didn't care about the movement. Did I blow it?
The most accurate watch I owned was an srp637 at PERFECT time. The variance is only -0.3 to +0.2 spd Regardless of position. This is even better than my bb58 at -0.8 spd. I've since sold the watch but to this day I wonder how it was possible that it ran so accurately.
My new Longines hydroconquest with L888,2 based on eta 2892-a2 is insane preformer it is 3 sec fast after 7 days. I was using it normaly waring it abot 14 h a day. So it is about 0,4 sec fast a day.
Just +1 second in 30 days! ruclips.net/video/X_RJu14k_i0/видео.html
@@accuracychannel.7242 that is impressiv. Omega is my favorite... i have aqua terra with cal 8900 and it plus 0.2 a day..
20 degrees Celsius is so comfortable.
It's over 32 over here.
its over 33 here at night
wow for the 9015 and NH 35 talk about bang for buck. My heart is still with the Tudor though.
Good video
The Tudor wins by a long way, which proves that if you want accuracy you'll need to pay big bucks.
Rubbish my 9015 it running around this all the time. I've got a NH-38, that's not far of to. Now I'm not saying they all will run this good but on a whole my Japanese movements are every bit as good as the Swiss counterparts...
How can you compare without regulating first???
I like the 9015 too. Just not a fan of the rotor spin oh though not as bad as the 8000 series.
Hey arrange these seiko movements in their year of release plesse
Mechanical movements are pretty much luck of the draw. Of course with more regulated/adjusted, more high end, more expensive movements, the chances of getting a more accurate one increase. My most two accurate watches I ever had (and still have them) are a Seiko with a 4R35 and a Hamilton with ETA 2825-2. And this is accuracy in any position of use, and they both outperform the 2 Rolex I had by quite a margin (Explorer 1 and Yacht Master). But I admit with the Seiko is more of a luck than with the ETA for sure, especially for positional variation, I can’t really explain how I got such well adjusted movement since they don’t come adjusted from the factory (It’s a Samurai Padi but don’t think that’s relevant) My other Seikos do keep great time but I know how to compensate the positions, so in the end it’s not really such a big deal, if I’d really care I’d get a quartz and be done with it.
ruclips.net/video/X_RJu14k_i0/видео.html
this is why quartz is king
20 winds doesn't sound so much? My Hamilton needs about 80-90 winds to have a full power reserve.
NY0040 Miyota 8203A ...1sec per day
regulated 6R15 is really impressive. you can achieve -+ 1 second per day.
Did your times include resting over night?
0:48 so... only Tudor has an inhouse movement, hmmmm
Were can we buy the blue watch?
My 7s36 loses 2.8 per day and crown is at 3 o'clock position. Everyday wear no timegraphing.... Around 1 min/1.25 min per month loss
What are the SEIKO models? (Not movements)
7S26 is in real disadvantage unless you are wesring it as it doesn't have hand winding or hacking to either charge the spring or set the time accurately.
I have gigandet Sea Ground with nh35 . It runs +2,75 seconds / day
Sorry, but the sample size of 1 tells absolutely nothing about the performance of the movements in general. Leaving aside factors like positional stability and so on...
There are many timing apps to give you a much better result for your test. I use watchcheck.
Thanks for the suggestion, but I actually used WatchCheck. Good app, but it doesn't completely eliminate the human factor. It certainly makes it a lot more consistent though.
Regards
GAW
Regards
GAW
Sarb my dream watch will buy one day
From what I can see the last movt on the right is ticking a tad faster..... lol
My 6R15 gains 8 secs per day constantly for about 6 months...
This test is not really relevant as you can regulate each one of them.
It’s only a matter of caliber but watchmaker regulation.
I do regulate my all watches to 0/+3 s/day even the 7s26 in a Seiko 5.
Tudor movement is usually -4/+2 s/day.
Seiko is known for not being the best on QC as regulating their watches out of factory.
Bottom line, if you buy a watch at watchmaker that has been regulated properly you should have a -2/+4 s/day with any caliber.
Some brands are already good out of factory even with a chinese movement because they do service and regulate them.