tried 2 clarify as much as i could in the video, but let me just say that: i know i kind of mashed up queercoding and stereotypes in general at parts; they're distinct things, but it worked out since this is about use of stereotypes in media with a queercoded character at the center of it. i already feel kinda bad about bashing heartstopper, but i've done this so many times now, where i tell myself "nnnaahhh c'mon it's cute ur just a hater !!" then i watch the whole series or read the whole comic and. immediately forget everything sssooo...it deserves some scrutiny for being so dreadfully boring imo. i know this was kinda all over the place but i hope it made sense ?? also i dare u to guess which turtle brother i relate to most based just off my current sprites. you'll never guess who it's so shocking and unexpected- /sarcasm.
Rise of the tmnt leo is just ben schwartz just being himself being himself i meant using his normal voice i don't know why i do not like the new generation
0:42 April and Leo see each other as siblings, and she is said to be apart of the family, metaphorically. We _could_ technically ship them, but this isn’t TMNT 2012. We aren’t making Leo like his sister, we have standards.
very true, that's why i wanted 2 stress technically since the dynamic of it would b rlly off lmao, but w my overall point being with how fandoms in general will usually ship ANY appropriately aged guy and girl i thought it was interesting how rottmnt fandom gravitated towards leosagi.
@@nuclearw0rmzz Leosagi has been around since 2003, that I know of. Could be further back since they did a crossover of the comics in the 1990s (Usagi Yojimbo and TMNT) of which the 2003 series is based on. Hell, Usagi appeared in the 1987 TV series too.
But that didn’t stop people from shipping Rise Donnie and April. Their rare but I’ve seen fanfics with that ship. And I don’t know if you were joking when you said the last part about the Rise fandom having standards because tcest is a thing including in the Rise fandom.
@@molly_parker_1847 True, it's like they want to bring a 12k ship to the rise universe. Every fandom have that kind of weird shippers tbh. What i think is more importan, is that the show doesn't ship any turtle with April. I don't remember a lot of the 12k show, but i heard a lot of people say it has super weird and toxic ships. One thing is weird people in a fandom, another is weird producers in a show :'3 Rise seems a lot better in that regard.
@@rociovaldezguisen6897 Yeah thank god they treated April has their big sister then a love interest like in 12k. The Rise show was more about family love then romantic love when 12k thought the best way to show them as teenagers is to experience crushes.
0:41 Leosagi is actually a very long lasting ship in the TMNT franchise dating all the way back to the 2003 series. I made a video on it to try and explain everything going on with it.
A fun fact, one of the writers pretty much also confirmed that April likes girls in a tweet where a fan was talking about a prom episode idea and I think it was Russ that mentioned April’s date being a girl. I love seeing writers view on the characters so much that we dont always get to see in the show.
I think that's the whole message from the rise. It's okay to be yourself. You don't have to fit to any standards that they put on you. You can be loved no matter what they tell you. Shit, this series deserve so much better
As a cis person (who is not gay/trans/etc) who has never been big in queer culture before RISE, I really didn't notice Leo's queerness until the "Senor Hueso fuses with his Bro"-Episode! Then something clicked for me and I was like: JO, is that guy gay? I really relate to Leo in a lot of ways that go beyond his sexual orientation and that's such a neat thing! That I can relate to a gay person even though I'm cis! I know that should be, like, the norm, but I really like how the writers made it so easy! I love Leo and I wish there was a 3rd season! (Also In hindsight it's like, really obvious! This kid is a fruit basket haha)
ok let's not use "cis" pronoun to describe non-trans people please. Im sure there is no bad intentions underneath it but that word's history isn't good and it was even used as a swear word in the past I think. So please don't commonly these pronouns for people who didn't get a right to say anything about them. When you're trans or non-binary ofc you can use any pronouns but don't invade others's space either. We can have acceptance and kindness without needing to downgrade everything to a label. Other than that YES I agree, Leo's queer coding didn't even strike me as "weird", it was just him being unapologetically himself and his family understanding it. Nobody questioned it nor red much into it. İt's so wholesome tbh
this is suuuper late, but,, i don't think the original commenter used "cis" as a pronoun??? It was used as a descriptive for someone who identify with the gender they were assigned to at birth??? Counter-example of that same sentence "As a trans person [...]" Did you mean "cis word"??? cuz that ain't a pronoun-- besides that,,, "cis" was never used as a (in your words) swear word (slur?) in the past. Though (to share a bit more knowledge for funsies) it is, quite literally, a scientific word (abt something completely different), but it's now often used to (once again) describe someone who identify with the gender they were assigned to at birth, it's a bit like the same way the word "trans" is used to describe the opposite (someone who does NOT identify with the gender they were assigned to at birth). There is no reason why it shouldn't be used, it's just a way to describe someone??? (more free knowledge: I am pretty certain that the words "cisgender" and "transgender" (more specifically the "cis" and "trans" part) come from "Cis-trans isomerism") I might have misunderstood something,,, uhhhh,,,,,
""Senor Hueso fuses with his Bro"-Episode" One of the writers told about this that Don Suave (the fusion) is so handsome, that pretty much anyone would fall for him, so, yeah.
I just genuinely love how you scripted this video. You hit all the topics and ticked all the boxes, covered every subject not only in a way that I finally actually understand, but generally enjoyed watching. I honestly just love the examples you used and how you spoke of them (I wholeheartedly agree with the Heartstopper thing and I love how you phrased it). Ngl I’d love to see you addressing why Donnie gives non-binary vibes sometime in the future. Queer headcanons have always been interesting to me because I’ve never been able to understand or explain/convey how/why I think they’re so popular or why I agree with them, and I generally dislike watching videos of people addressing it because it just never hits home for me, but this one really did so thank you for explaining your theories(?) in a way I can actually understand and enjoy watching :)
i am so glad to hear this !! the fact is that video essays can sometimes be pretty inaccessible (bc of the length or the lack of context etc), and i was honestly worried i still didn't give enough context lol, so knowing it really connected with someone for who this style of video usually wouldn't is lovely to hear. i will also b so honest and say that i'm not personally a nonbinary donnie truther- like i do get why that headcanon is super popular but it doesn't resonate for me personally, so if i made a video on it, it would probably be bad !! lol. maybe i could talk 2 ppl in the rottmnt community who rlly believe in nonbinary donnie and make a video about it with their thoughts (all credited, obviously) hhhmm-
I think I can very quickly figure out why Donnie gives non-binary vibes. He's autistic. While of course autism and being non-binary isn't always connected, and you can have one without being the other of vice versa, the typical stereotypes that we recognize as someone being non-binary are also the same ones we recognize in autistic people. Remembering that stereotyping isn't bad, it's just pattern recognition. It's only bad when you make it the rule.
@@nuclearw0rmzz honestly, as someone who headcanons Donnie as nonbinary, there is no rhyme or reason other than he looks like the type of guy to look gender in its face, say, "Nah, not for me," then kick it in the leg and roll it off a cliff. I don't know how else to explain it, it's kind of an energy of, "I don't have time for gender, I'm too busy with my tech." lmao
ngl i did not expect to see a cameo of me in the intro lmao I like hearing your perspective on the other major queer medias that have come out recently! I've not watched most of the stuff you mentioned, especially Q-Force because I heard a lot of negative stuff about it, but it's interesting to hear different takes on it. Plus I never thought of it from a difference in understanding by generation, so that's a good point. Good work and good luck on making more essays, it's so much work but it's so much fun too 😭
omg i didn't expect you to see my video !! lmao. yea i rlly felt like i needed 2 give you a mention since our topics overlapped in places (plus ur video is a lot more about rise itself; mine is more putting leo in the context of our current representation landscape) and also ur analysis was great; esp ur points on warren and hypno, i care them so much. also yeah q-force is DEF not for everyone, i just knew i always wanted to make a video on it because i rlly liked it...and no one else did LMAO. it's worth giving a chance if you can stand crude humor/nudity/etc. i rlly appreciate hearing ur thoughts and feedback, tysm !!
I had that exact same thought process when Leo dressed as Bowie lmao. Also lowkey warmed my heart since Bowie is one of the queer icons I've adored since I was a teenager too.
Just started the video and, another point for why people don't ship Leo(or any of the boys) with April, is because she's a sister figure in this show. At least, most of the fandom accepts that as her role. Leosagi, meanwhile, has been a ship for a LONG time, since the first crossovers. It isn't just Rise!Leo who gets that ship, its any Leo.
I remember that in one episode, the one where they were dressing up and their memories were being messed with by the magic hippo dude, Raph had the pan flag on his outfit. it was s2 is all I remember
i really wish they would've kept going with rise... there's so much positive rep in that show. the characters are unashamedly themselves no mater if they are different for what ever reason. i really hope they bring it back, but i doubt they will. at least for a little while we had a great cartoon. here's hoping more like this are made. :)
Very nice video! Came for leo and ended up learning a lot abt other shows too :) what I like about Leo's coding is that it's not *just* his vibes coming off as queer like a lot of other queer-coding is, he's not just flamboyant and got a lilted voice, rottmnt is very reference heavy and they use it to their advantage! There's multiple bowie references like you mentioned, but there's also nods to madonna, prince and some others, vogue-ing, and in a few different episodes of season 2 there's even rainbow imagery put sneakily behind him, basically the coding goes further than just his mannerisms and that makes me really happy lol
7:08 i agree. i was born in 2003, watched the show and i got only one joke at the very last episode. Also the trailer did the show REALLY dirty, stereotypes aside.
This video sort of reminded me of my problems with some people. (Not you just people who think stereotypes are what make us gay.) I’m gay. I have a lover, but the journey I took to realize that I’m gay! Made me angry. I thought I really loved boys, then i thought I loved only girls, i thought binary people were cute! But that’s when I realized that I didn’t care what gender! Or what they wear sometimes! Then I realized that I’m pan! I loved the fact that I was finally happy with my sexuality, but then when I came out. Everyone told me I didn’t look gay, they said I don’t do any of the stereotypes! they said that I wasn’t gay! For two years they said I wasn’t gay. I let that get to my head. I acted straight for two more years… but then I found out I’m also transgender 🏳️⚧️. But I got scared I would get yelled at again. So I kept my mouth shut. For one whole year. But my life changed when I met someone that made my heart race, but since i acted like I was the same gender that I was when I was born.They were technically the same gender the person I didn’t like. (My original gender) I would run, hide. I would do anything to not get yelled at because I was being myself. But turns out. They liked me too. And when they came to me and told me even though I was trying to leave the room. I got excited and said I liked them back. But was shaking after I said that.( because my family used to yell at me when I told them I was pan. And I have a severe fear of loud noises. But my family changed so thank goodness they don’t yell at me anymore.) never told her this. I instead loved her anyways! And I felt great! Of course my family excepted that was gay after a while. But I’m still scared what my lover or my family will think if I tell them I’m pan. And no body knows yet. I’m really mad that it took me like four years for me to come out cause I was scared of being yelled at. Worse part my family loved the bible, And church! So I’m still scared to tell all of my family. I hope I will get to tell people I’m trans. In the meantime I love your video. And I’m sorry that I said to much. It’s just so much better typing then saying. Sorry again.
I used to really hate the headcanon of leo being gay. I find it hard to except because he doesn't have a canon gay love interest nor has it been explicitly said in the show. I thought everyone headcanoned it purely because he displays some stereotypes like being flamboyant, but I found that wasn't the case. Some people really are just projecting themselves onto him. They see a character that acts like themselves so they give the character attributes to make the character more like themselves. After coming to that realization, it's been easier for me to expect headcanons within the show, and other fandoms, and this video just reminded me of that. This was a great video and I can't wait to see more from you 💙
A lot of headcanons when it comes to sexuality and neurodivergency are indeed projecting! It’s important to note that most gay headcanons are from queer people themselves. I’m glad you came to that realization, I completely understand being uncomfortable with sexuality headcanons that are based on stereotypes
I respectfully envy you because I struggle to accept sexuality headcanons in my favorite fandoms. It's hard to understand when a character isn't explicitly (insert sexuality) and people start shipping. It makes me feel alienated from the characters and that I'm not allowed to like them anymore. I know, strange, but I'm trying to improve myself.
I think a character doesn’t have to have a lover to be a valid queer character, not all queer characters have lovers and just exist as themselves and it doesn’t matter. So yeah a lot of people relate to him just for who he is and how he acts!! Also I don’t remember if it was mentioned in tbe video, but Leo being gay IS confirmed by Ron
@@niki7411I don't remember the crew actually confirming Leo is gay. Iirc they mostly sidestepped the question when someone asked why Leo was drooling over Don Suave. From what I can tell Leo's orientation is still technically ambiguous, but maybe if the series gets another shot they might be more willing to give a straight (lol) answer. Afaik tho the only characters that have canonically shown romantic attraction at all (without any form of plausible deniability) are Splinter and Donnie.
Man your channel has some good vibes, thanks for sharing your points! this video gave me a lot to think about, especially as someone just getting into writing!
this is more of a head cannon for the whole community instead of basically being cannon like Le Donnie is seen as non binary or just not cis( there's evidence) but basically what I'm trying to say is that its so so cool to have representation in a nickelodeon show that is also just good
Heart Stopper is *supposed* to be sanitized. The characters are *supposed* to align with certain character tropes. This is an entire sub-genre of teen romance, which isn't your cup of tea and that's ok.
The thing about heart stopper is that there’s this one comic called autophobia that I think does most of what heartstopper does but way better. Like the characters and their relationship dramas are more compelling, their dynamics are more interesting, the exploration of mental health struggles and queer self-discovery. It’s also one of the only pieces of LGBT media i’ve seen that focuses on a character discovering their queer feelings and has that character actually have past experiences with same sex attraction, rather than never feeling attracted to someone of the same sex before meeting the love interest. And the relationship just sort of works on a level that heartstopper could never. I don’t remember how the first I love you happened in heartstopper. Maybe the scene on the beach. I don’t feel it enough. But I remember exactly how it happened in Autophobia. Also I personally prefer how horny the autophobia boys are as opposed to the chaste Heartstopper boys. Like these kids act like I imagine two hormonal teens who really want to have sex with each other but haven’t had sex yet would act. I also feel like this is how i’d be if I had a boyfriend in high school. Also I guarantee that some conservative nut job thinks that this is literally porn or something, and offending homophobes is always going to make me feel better about something. It’s funny to imagine alex jones getting mad about this wholesome comic series and calling it degenerate and inappropriate for teens because it had a boy playfully smack his crushes butt.
I think he's bi/pan. And that's because he's so extra, so "I want everyone to love and admire me," so dramatic that I bet he wouldn't discriminate. And part of it is because I want him in my camp...also, I don't want ANY of the boys, Leo included, to have a love interest. And yes, that includes possible straight pairings like Raph/Mona. I actually like the show focusing only on family. If I'm being honest, romance is not TMNT's strong suit. But either way, let's all rally together to bring back Rise. We have petitions to sign, social media posts to make, and messages to send to Nickelodeon. This show deserved better!
100% agreed. As much as I love the Raph/Mona dynamic in 2012, one of the biggest falls in the show was it trying to give every turtle a love interest. And I am a sucker for family dynamics and found family specifically. Tmnt has so much potential for that, it literally being found family. One of my favorite scenes in rise is the quick conversation between April and Karai. “I’m not one of you!” “Oh my dear. You have always been one of us.” makes me tear up every time. I’m hoping that rise (both the show and movie) being in Netflix’s trending for the past 7 months will make nick realize how much they can profit off of this show
@@ssr8555 Unfortunately, it’s not enough. Fans have been keeping it trending on Twitter for a while and it’s still going strong, even with the new trailer for Mutant Mayhem. BUT Nickelodeon is peddling MM more, and the only way to get them to actually notice is to be more vocal, hound their emails, their social media, keep making art, get enough people into the show to demand it come back with full, original cast and crew. I’ve already emailed, and DM’d but we’d need a HUGE social media push, with everyone working together to bring it back, especially since it seems that execs are actively ignore it it. What makes me bummed is that this show was the one on TV I’ve seen so far that takes the most risks and I’m upset that it didn’t get rewarded. It’s truly a bummer these days that only brainless tween sitcomes, and old cash cows like SpongeBob stay on air. I miss the days of creativity, which was what made TMNT so successful in the first place.
I’m glad that we as a whole looked at Leo and said “yes gay Leo 👏👏👏” Loved the video btw 💖💖💖 Edit: Forgot to say, both me and my best friend though the Q-Force trailer was shit, but then watched the show and loved it. I’m sad that Netflix did them so dirty with that trailer, the crew said they had nothing to do with the trailers for the show so we think that whoever did make it purposefully made the trailer shit as a way to get people to not watch it so it would fail 😣 Also, Dead End is an amazing show and I’m pissed it was cancelled 😫
I love Leo and feel like he’s really gay I love this show/character. The queer coding is done very well in my opinion I just wish they would’ve made it canon. This is a great breakdown thank you for making this!
as a french person, I had moments when I didn't understand what you were saying exactly ^^'.. But fortunately I understood the general meaning! It was a really interesting video, I really enjoyed it!!!
Exactly! not all gay people in movie or media have to be as stereotypic, what i mean by that is gay cant be a personality. Its your sexuality, take Craig and Tweek (south park) they aren't wearing pink clothes and high heels and makeup. They are just normal citizens that are gay. You can make a gay character but they have to have personality than just being gay. Its really funny how some (not many! not trying to be rude) people actually think gay people are like this tbh. As a person in the LGBTQ+ community i like when gay characters are introduced, but its awful when they are so annoying like "IM GAY IM GAY IM GAY" every damn second. I legit want to get up and punch my tv when there's a gay character like that. Now its my opinion though so if you disagree just don't go typing in full caps like "NO YOUR WRONG, NUH UH" because you will look stupid.
I don't know if this has been said before in the comments but to add to the subtle reference they do w Leo (for example the David bowie reference or that his favourite genre of music is glam rock) in the episode where senior hueso and his brother fuse, before that he puts on a statue disguise. it could have been just a general greek look but he very closely resembles apollo(I think he is interpreted with the leaf crown thing the most), and Apollo is very much known as one of the queerer greek gods (I think, I didn't rly fact check this much I'm trying to recall multiple Tumblr posts from the top of my head). but yeah the queer references in this show are very good, still not over the turtles voguing and donnie pulling a jojo pose in "clothes don't make the turtle"
If you count the top 5 defining things about a main character, and one or more of those things is something biological the character cannot change (ie, sexuality, race, height, body type, neurological, cis/trans gender ) That what you have is stereotype. Leo. 1) Is the leader (or wants to be). 2) He causes problems tho by being hasty n over estimating himself. 3) badly times jokes! 4) swords. DIBS !! 5) smug. So smug. And THEN there's the gayness. After all his other character traits are developed, they are mixed WITH the gay. The gay isn't the main part, its an accessory. Same could go with marcy i guess from amphibia. 1) so much energy. But its from coffee. 2)study study study she needs knowledge. 3) nerd. Total gamer and d&d nerd. 4) she just wants people to like her SO BAD 5) clumsy. Like cause she is not paying attention. And THEN you get the ASD. Yeah it's mixed in with the other parts of her. Her energy also go into stimming. Her studies and games can becomes hyperfixations. She wants people to like her, and it's hard for her when people don't understand her. Clumsy, since asd can cause some motor skills problems, impulsive behaviour, reduced perspective of risk, hyperfixation, etc. Try it for yourself
I love how Shirtaloon handles that stuff in his book "He who fights with monsters". It isn't important and nobody cares when characters are gay. Rufus has a boyfriend? Great for him. Anna has a wife? Sure, no problem. They are just normal characters with personalities who happen to be gay, which is exactly how it is supposed to be in my opinion.
i actually loved that show so much since i felt seen in a lot of different aspects (the autism representation especially is like. immaculate), and yeah the presentation of darren and cash is so important because of how complicated and real their kind of dynamic is. heartbreak high is up there with sex education as one of my favorite "teen drama" shows !!
i have yet to actually watch toh !! i'm hesitant on the idea of a video both because i'm not sure the show will resonate with me like it did for a lot of people, and i'm not sure what i can add to the conversation; a lot of people have made a lot of fantastic analyses about this show already. if i were to talk about toh, it'd probably be in the context of a larger video, but i'll try the show out once i find the time and see where it takes me !!
I only found out I'm fully gay after playing genshin and started to think how i see women i see them as pritty but not atractive I'm Also genderfluid and love how pyritty dresses are
I never saw the character as gay i just enjoy the show and no questions asked Unless it's about where is their tail then i have so much questions i don't really care
Bruh "vibes" don't define someone gender or sexuality. Promoting that anything of how you act, dress, or level WALK is straight up wrong Why wrong? Because someone who is not from a certain sexuality might think they do. Let's say that someone is AroAce, yet everyone tells him "oh you are so gay!!" and even tries to show evidence and slowly that boy (or generally anyone) would think he is gay just because he fits those so called "vibes" who are pretty much masked stereotypes. It's bad even if it's fictional, because at the end of the day, it's still promoting stereotypes. I am not talking about projecting here by the way. The majority of those people aren't even gay men/boys. Just stop masking stereotypes as "vibes". The only thing that defines someone sexuality or whatever is how they feel on the inside.
I can literally show you a guy who wear dresses, puts make up, fits every single gay stereotype out there and he can be genuinely straight/repulsed AroAce and not trans no matter how you cry about it being a "closed queer person" Just simply because those stereotypes do not define a sexuality. They are unhealthy even if they were fictional
I mostly like this video, but I feel like your perspective of heartstopper was ultimately biased to your own experience and harmful quite harmful. You (along with many others, i don't want it to seem like I'm targeting you as an individual here. This is a common viewpoint) really seem to be pushing this idea that queer people all act over the top and that somehow showing a group of privileged kids acting like everyone else is "erasing" queer identities. You act like there aren't queer kids that act like this and that there's no depth at all to these characters. Which is just so untrue. I will be the first to admit that compared to other queer people my experiences are quite privileged and that this is something really minor to be upset over. I grew up in a family that was (mostly) accepting. I went to a school where the homophones were the weird ones. That's not to say the queer kids where I grew up had no oppression at all. We got death threats and called slurs, all of us knew someone who'd be (or was) disowned and there were trans kids who's parents didn't respect their identity. And pretty much all of has had experienced at least some aspect of violence for being queer at least once. But we were and are privileged in that these weren't daily fears. And to put it down quite clearly, heartstopper was very relatable to us. Almost every character there has at least one person irl I know I can connect it to. So it's always just very sad to hear people say "oh they have no character" like, excuse me? There's two reasons heartstopper connects with people, and that's either people who find it healing, or people who find it relatable. It's fine if your not in either groups, but acting like it's a completely unrealistic show just because you personally don't find anything you relate to I think means you should potentially give it a bit of thought. Your perceptions of the characters is also just so sad. You put Charlie down as just a shy nerd, but you don't take any time to account the trauma he faced or how his eating disorder, SH issues and even the fact he's been SAed might play into why he comes off at first glace as "shy nerd." He's a quiet person for his own emotional protection and that influences every bit of how he behaves. He likes playing the drums and reading but his mothers (quite blatant if you read solitaire) emotional abuse sucks a lot of personality out of him and his sister so they come across as very bland. You call Nick a "kind jock," which I guess is true. But he's someone who's grown up in a single parent household with a very homophobic older brother who is only just figuring out his sexuality and slowly realizing he's friends with a few not great people. He's a people pleaser, and I'll admit, kind of a boring person. But in a way where I can say I've met him so so so many times throughout my life. The comics spend a huge amount of time showing how the two bring out the best in each other, but also how Charlie unhealthily leans on Nick for emotional support he actually can't provide. Everything about that relationship is realistic to me. Every part of it. I think apart of your interpretation here might be because it's either been ages since you read any hearstopper (like, wow, how surprising the sexual abuse victim and the kid just figuring out he likes men don't jump at the chance to have sex, what a shocker), or you've just watched the show (I have some strong feelings about the way the show turns the character into child friendly versions, but anyway). Either way, I think if your gonna mention it in a video critically you might wanna actually, oh idk, read the thing your talking about first? It's fine if you just don't relate to it yourself, but that's no reason to bash other queer people who act like them.
The reason I like the Hearstopper series version is because It's MADE FOR KIDS!!!! There really isn't any shows for kids, where the whole series is about being queer and questioning your sexual orientation. All the other series are made for teenagers or older like Love Victor.
I’m not a homophob, but I have a crush on Rise Leo and I’m a girl. And I would be disappointed if it turns out that Leo is officially gay. But I’m an open minded person. I love Ruby and Sapphire from Steven Universe and I adore Luz and Amity from The owl house. It’s beautiful when this gets represented positively in media. But if Leo turns out to be gay that’s great. Like I said I would feel disappointed, but after a while I’m going to be fine. Hope I’m it doesn’t make me a bad person. Let’s see if it happens or not. I love you Leo no matter what
Something you forgot. Weapons. Donnie, who is pretty much the straightest Turtle in this series, actively showing interest in females (even if he is doing it in an Autistic way), has a staff, which he is very effective with. His Mystic Ability takes time to develop, but at the end he's using it for He can use it to crate a large array of guns. And powering up his drill. his Mystic Ability can create a HUGE DRILL WHICH HE RAMS IN AN EVIL MALE ALIEN'S FACE. Leo's got two swords which break at the beginning. He has only one sword now - the Odachi, which is ludicrously big. But Leo's Mystic Ability, which he has from the very start is... a hole. A FRIKKIN' HOLE. He's not very good with it, either. Often ends up in the wrong place. Hell, once he ends up in Paris. (You know, the love capital of the world?) But he gets much better when he has two swords again.
Bro, I was watching the most Random shit till this video popped up on my fyp, I have only seen small clips of Rise and I gotta say the Fandom is...it's what I was expecting and not what I was expecting as well lol, You guys do you lol,
Another instance of companies making non gay characters into gay characters for representation purposes. Like don’t get me wrong, it’s good to have diverse characters, but how about making new characters instead of changing the old ones.
i mean rise of the tmnt already changed so much about their version of leo + his dynamics in the series; he pretty much IS a different character from other iterations.
TMNT in general has changed several aspects of the characters in other incarnations. Off the top of my head, April wasn't a teenager before 2012, and she wasn't Leo's love interest before 2023
![[LAST REUPLOAD] Donnie being autistic for like... so many minutes](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/V6k-7z5gQjQ/mqdefault.jpg)
tried 2 clarify as much as i could in the video, but let me just say that: i know i kind of mashed up queercoding and stereotypes in general at parts; they're distinct things, but it worked out since this is about use of stereotypes in media with a queercoded character at the center of it. i already feel kinda bad about bashing heartstopper, but i've done this so many times now, where i tell myself "nnnaahhh c'mon it's cute ur just a hater !!" then i watch the whole series or read the whole comic and. immediately forget everything sssooo...it deserves some scrutiny for being so dreadfully boring imo. i know this was kinda all over the place but i hope it made sense ?? also i dare u to guess which turtle brother i relate to most based just off my current sprites. you'll never guess who it's so shocking and unexpected- /sarcasm.
Rise of the tmnt leo is just ben schwartz just being himself being himself i meant using his normal voice i don't know why i do not like the new generation
"This show is lovely comfort food" I'm using this to explain shows/special interests now
it dose work i can't explain why i like my special interests shows as much as i do "comfort food" works
0:42
April and Leo see each other as siblings, and she is said to be apart of the family, metaphorically.
We _could_ technically ship them, but this isn’t TMNT 2012. We aren’t making Leo like his sister, we have standards.
very true, that's why i wanted 2 stress technically since the dynamic of it would b rlly off lmao, but w my overall point being with how fandoms in general will usually ship ANY appropriately aged guy and girl i thought it was interesting how rottmnt fandom gravitated towards leosagi.
@@nuclearw0rmzz Leosagi has been around since 2003, that I know of. Could be further back since they did a crossover of the comics in the 1990s (Usagi Yojimbo and TMNT) of which the 2003 series is based on. Hell, Usagi appeared in the 1987 TV series too.
But that didn’t stop people from shipping Rise Donnie and April. Their rare but I’ve seen fanfics with that ship. And I don’t know if you were joking when you said the last part about the Rise fandom having standards because tcest is a thing including in the Rise fandom.
@@molly_parker_1847 True, it's like they want to bring a 12k ship to the rise universe. Every fandom have that kind of weird shippers tbh. What i think is more importan, is that the show doesn't ship any turtle with April. I don't remember a lot of the 12k show, but i heard a lot of people say it has super weird and toxic ships. One thing is weird people in a fandom, another is weird producers in a show :'3 Rise seems a lot better in that regard.
@@rociovaldezguisen6897 Yeah thank god they treated April has their big sister then a love interest like in 12k. The Rise show was more about family love then romantic love when 12k thought the best way to show them as teenagers is to experience crushes.
0:41 Leosagi is actually a very long lasting ship in the TMNT franchise dating all the way back to the 2003 series. I made a video on it to try and explain everything going on with it.
I watched your video! It really informed me on what was going on there because it confused me quite a bit. Thank you for making it!
Usagi does show up in earlier series and comics though
A fun fact, one of the writers pretty much also confirmed that April likes girls in a tweet where a fan was talking about a prom episode idea and I think it was Russ that mentioned April’s date being a girl. I love seeing writers view on the characters so much that we dont always get to see in the show.
I think that's the whole message from the rise. It's okay to be yourself. You don't have to fit to any standards that they put on you. You can be loved no matter what they tell you. Shit, this series deserve so much better
"schrodinger's gay person (c)"
i love this already
Edit: "chekov's microaggression"
As a cis person (who is not gay/trans/etc) who has never been big in queer culture before RISE, I really didn't notice Leo's queerness until the "Senor Hueso fuses with his Bro"-Episode!
Then something clicked for me and I was like: JO, is that guy gay?
I really relate to Leo in a lot of ways that go beyond his sexual orientation and that's such a neat thing! That I can relate to a gay person even though I'm cis! I know that should be, like, the norm, but I really like how the writers made it so easy! I love Leo and I wish there was a 3rd season!
(Also In hindsight it's like, really obvious! This kid is a fruit basket haha)
ok let's not use "cis" pronoun to describe non-trans people please. Im sure there is no bad intentions underneath it but that word's history isn't good and it was even used as a swear word in the past I think. So please don't commonly these pronouns for people who didn't get a right to say anything about them. When you're trans or non-binary ofc you can use any pronouns but don't invade others's space either. We can have acceptance and kindness without needing to downgrade everything to a label.
Other than that YES I agree, Leo's queer coding didn't even strike me as "weird", it was just him being unapologetically himself and his family understanding it. Nobody questioned it nor red much into it. İt's so wholesome tbh
this is suuuper late, but,,
i don't think the original commenter used "cis" as a pronoun??? It was used as a descriptive for someone who identify with the gender they were assigned to at birth??? Counter-example of that same sentence "As a trans person [...]"
Did you mean "cis word"??? cuz that ain't a pronoun--
besides that,,, "cis" was never used as a (in your words) swear word (slur?) in the past. Though (to share a bit more knowledge for funsies) it is, quite literally, a scientific word (abt something completely different), but it's now often used to (once again) describe someone who identify with the gender they were assigned to at birth, it's a bit like the same way the word "trans" is used to describe the opposite (someone who does NOT identify with the gender they were assigned to at birth). There is no reason why it shouldn't be used, it's just a way to describe someone??? (more free knowledge: I am pretty certain that the words "cisgender" and "transgender" (more specifically the "cis" and "trans" part) come from "Cis-trans isomerism")
I might have misunderstood something,,, uhhhh,,,,,
@@k-quenouille Nah, I'm pretty sure you're right, that's how I was using it
""Senor Hueso fuses with his Bro"-Episode"
One of the writers told about this that Don Suave (the fusion) is so handsome, that pretty much anyone would fall for him, so, yeah.
I just genuinely love how you scripted this video. You hit all the topics and ticked all the boxes, covered every subject not only in a way that I finally actually understand, but generally enjoyed watching. I honestly just love the examples you used and how you spoke of them (I wholeheartedly agree with the Heartstopper thing and I love how you phrased it). Ngl I’d love to see you addressing why Donnie gives non-binary vibes sometime in the future. Queer headcanons have always been interesting to me because I’ve never been able to understand or explain/convey how/why I think they’re so popular or why I agree with them, and I generally dislike watching videos of people addressing it because it just never hits home for me, but this one really did so thank you for explaining your theories(?) in a way I can actually understand and enjoy watching :)
i am so glad to hear this !! the fact is that video essays can sometimes be pretty inaccessible (bc of the length or the lack of context etc), and i was honestly worried i still didn't give enough context lol, so knowing it really connected with someone for who this style of video usually wouldn't is lovely to hear. i will also b so honest and say that i'm not personally a nonbinary donnie truther- like i do get why that headcanon is super popular but it doesn't resonate for me personally, so if i made a video on it, it would probably be bad !! lol. maybe i could talk 2 ppl in the rottmnt community who rlly believe in nonbinary donnie and make a video about it with their thoughts (all credited, obviously) hhhmm-
I think I can very quickly figure out why Donnie gives non-binary vibes. He's autistic. While of course autism and being non-binary isn't always connected, and you can have one without being the other of vice versa, the typical stereotypes that we recognize as someone being non-binary are also the same ones we recognize in autistic people. Remembering that stereotyping isn't bad, it's just pattern recognition. It's only bad when you make it the rule.
@@nuclearw0rmzz honestly, as someone who headcanons Donnie as nonbinary, there is no rhyme or reason other than he looks like the type of guy to look gender in its face, say, "Nah, not for me," then kick it in the leg and roll it off a cliff. I don't know how else to explain it, it's kind of an energy of, "I don't have time for gender, I'm too busy with my tech." lmao
ngl i did not expect to see a cameo of me in the intro lmao I like hearing your perspective on the other major queer medias that have come out recently! I've not watched most of the stuff you mentioned, especially Q-Force because I heard a lot of negative stuff about it, but it's interesting to hear different takes on it. Plus I never thought of it from a difference in understanding by generation, so that's a good point. Good work and good luck on making more essays, it's so much work but it's so much fun too 😭
omg i didn't expect you to see my video !! lmao. yea i rlly felt like i needed 2 give you a mention since our topics overlapped in places (plus ur video is a lot more about rise itself; mine is more putting leo in the context of our current representation landscape) and also ur analysis was great; esp ur points on warren and hypno, i care them so much. also yeah q-force is DEF not for everyone, i just knew i always wanted to make a video on it because i rlly liked it...and no one else did LMAO. it's worth giving a chance if you can stand crude humor/nudity/etc. i rlly appreciate hearing ur thoughts and feedback, tysm !!
I had that exact same thought process when Leo dressed as Bowie lmao. Also lowkey warmed my heart since Bowie is one of the queer icons I've adored since I was a teenager too.
Just started the video and, another point for why people don't ship Leo(or any of the boys) with April, is because she's a sister figure in this show. At least, most of the fandom accepts that as her role. Leosagi, meanwhile, has been a ship for a LONG time, since the first crossovers. It isn't just Rise!Leo who gets that ship, its any Leo.
I remember that in one episode, the one where they were dressing up and their memories were being messed with by the magic hippo dude, Raph had the pan flag on his outfit. it was s2 is all I remember
i really wish they would've kept going with rise... there's so much positive rep in that show. the characters are unashamedly themselves no mater if they are different for what ever reason. i really hope they bring it back, but i doubt they will. at least for a little while we had a great cartoon. here's hoping more like this are made. :)
Very nice video! Came for leo and ended up learning a lot abt other shows too :) what I like about Leo's coding is that it's not *just* his vibes coming off as queer like a lot of other queer-coding is, he's not just flamboyant and got a lilted voice, rottmnt is very reference heavy and they use it to their advantage! There's multiple bowie references like you mentioned, but there's also nods to madonna, prince and some others, vogue-ing, and in a few different episodes of season 2 there's even rainbow imagery put sneakily behind him, basically the coding goes further than just his mannerisms and that makes me really happy lol
omg i didn't even notice the madonna nods or the sneaky rainbows that is so cool
We all got a epic gaydar
7:08 i agree. i was born in 2003, watched the show and i got only one joke at the very last episode. Also the trailer did the show REALLY dirty, stereotypes aside.
He literally has a rainbow flag in his room. He’s gay.
This video sort of reminded me of my problems with some people. (Not you just people who think stereotypes are what make us gay.) I’m gay. I have a lover, but the journey I took to realize that I’m gay! Made me angry. I thought I really loved boys, then i thought I loved only girls, i thought binary people were cute! But that’s when I realized that I didn’t care what gender! Or what they wear sometimes! Then I realized that I’m pan! I loved the fact that I was finally happy with my sexuality, but then when I came out. Everyone told me I didn’t look gay, they said I don’t do any of the stereotypes! they said that I wasn’t gay! For two years they said I wasn’t gay. I let that get to my head. I acted straight for two more years… but then I found out I’m also transgender 🏳️⚧️. But I got scared I would get yelled at again. So I kept my mouth shut. For one whole year. But my life changed when I met someone that made my heart race, but since i acted like I was the same gender that I was when I was born.They were technically the same gender the person I didn’t like. (My original gender) I would run, hide. I would do anything to not get yelled at because I was being myself. But turns out. They liked me too. And when they came to me and told me even though I was trying to leave the room. I got excited and said I liked them back. But was shaking after I said that.( because my family used to yell at me when I told them I was pan. And I have a severe fear of loud noises. But my family changed so thank goodness they don’t yell at me anymore.) never told her this. I instead loved her anyways! And I felt great! Of course my family excepted that was gay after a while. But I’m still scared what my lover or my family will think if I tell them I’m pan. And no body knows yet. I’m really mad that it took me like four years for me to come out cause I was scared of being yelled at. Worse part my family loved the bible, And church! So I’m still scared to tell all of my family. I hope I will get to tell people I’m trans. In the meantime I love your video. And I’m sorry that I said to much. It’s just so much better typing then saying. Sorry again.
This video was so well done!! Hope this gets a lot more views in the coming days ^^
i hope it doesn't the attention is already scaring me- /half joke. but tysm !!
awesome video! id love to see you make more like this in the future
I used to really hate the headcanon of leo being gay. I find it hard to except because he doesn't have a canon gay love interest nor has it been explicitly said in the show. I thought everyone headcanoned it purely because he displays some stereotypes like being flamboyant, but I found that wasn't the case. Some people really are just projecting themselves onto him. They see a character that acts like themselves so they give the character attributes to make the character more like themselves. After coming to that realization, it's been easier for me to expect headcanons within the show, and other fandoms, and this video just reminded me of that. This was a great video and I can't wait to see more from you 💙
A lot of headcanons when it comes to sexuality and neurodivergency are indeed projecting! It’s important to note that most gay headcanons are from queer people themselves. I’m glad you came to that realization, I completely understand being uncomfortable with sexuality headcanons that are based on stereotypes
I respectfully envy you because I struggle to accept sexuality headcanons in my favorite fandoms. It's hard to understand when a character isn't explicitly (insert sexuality) and people start shipping. It makes me feel alienated from the characters and that I'm not allowed to like them anymore. I know, strange, but I'm trying to improve myself.
I think a character doesn’t have to have a lover to be a valid queer character, not all queer characters have lovers and just exist as themselves and it doesn’t matter. So yeah a lot of people relate to him just for who he is and how he acts!! Also I don’t remember if it was mentioned in tbe video, but Leo being gay IS confirmed by Ron
What Niki said.
You missed the point.
Leo is gay. the projection is the effect, not the cause of this.
@@niki7411I don't remember the crew actually confirming Leo is gay. Iirc they mostly sidestepped the question when someone asked why Leo was drooling over Don Suave.
From what I can tell Leo's orientation is still technically ambiguous, but maybe if the series gets another shot they might be more willing to give a straight (lol) answer.
Afaik tho the only characters that have canonically shown romantic attraction at all (without any form of plausible deniability) are Splinter and Donnie.
As a non binary aroace person, who loves the nb Donnie and aroace Mikey headcannons I feel personaly attacked.
Just when I thought I was over this show, you suck me back in, it's Beastars all over again.
Man your channel has some good vibes, thanks for sharing your points! this video gave me a lot to think about, especially as someone just getting into writing!
this is more of a head cannon for the whole community instead of basically being cannon like Le Donnie is seen as non binary or just not cis( there's evidence) but basically what I'm trying to say is that its so so cool to have representation in a nickelodeon show that is also just good
Heart Stopper is *supposed* to be sanitized. The characters are *supposed* to align with certain character tropes. This is an entire sub-genre of teen romance, which isn't your cup of tea and that's ok.
The thing about heart stopper is that there’s this one comic called autophobia that I think does most of what heartstopper does but way better. Like the characters and their relationship dramas are more compelling, their dynamics are more interesting, the exploration of mental health struggles and queer self-discovery.
It’s also one of the only pieces of LGBT media i’ve seen that focuses on a character discovering their queer feelings and has that character actually have past experiences with same sex attraction, rather than never feeling attracted to someone of the same sex before meeting the love interest.
And the relationship just sort of works on a level that heartstopper could never. I don’t remember how the first I love you happened in heartstopper. Maybe the scene on the beach. I don’t feel it enough. But I remember exactly how it happened in Autophobia.
Also I personally prefer how horny the autophobia boys are as opposed to the chaste Heartstopper boys. Like these kids act like I imagine two hormonal teens who really want to have sex with each other but haven’t had sex yet would act. I also feel like this is how i’d be if I had a boyfriend in high school. Also I guarantee that some conservative nut job thinks that this is literally porn or something, and offending homophobes is always going to make me feel better about something. It’s funny to imagine alex jones getting mad about this wholesome comic series and calling it degenerate and inappropriate for teens because it had a boy playfully smack his crushes butt.
I think he's bi/pan. And that's because he's so extra, so "I want everyone to love and admire me," so dramatic that I bet he wouldn't discriminate. And part of it is because I want him in my camp...also, I don't want ANY of the boys, Leo included, to have a love interest. And yes, that includes possible straight pairings like Raph/Mona. I actually like the show focusing only on family. If I'm being honest, romance is not TMNT's strong suit. But either way, let's all rally together to bring back Rise. We have petitions to sign, social media posts to make, and messages to send to Nickelodeon. This show deserved better!
100% agreed. As much as I love the Raph/Mona dynamic in 2012, one of the biggest falls in the show was it trying to give every turtle a love interest. And I am a sucker for family dynamics and found family specifically. Tmnt has so much potential for that, it literally being found family. One of my favorite scenes in rise is the quick conversation between April and Karai. “I’m not one of you!” “Oh my dear. You have always been one of us.” makes me tear up every time.
I’m hoping that rise (both the show and movie) being in Netflix’s trending for the past 7 months will make nick realize how much they can profit off of this show
@@ssr8555 Unfortunately, it’s not enough. Fans have been keeping it trending on Twitter for a while and it’s still going strong, even with the new trailer for Mutant Mayhem. BUT Nickelodeon is peddling MM more, and the only way to get them to actually notice is to be more vocal, hound their emails, their social media, keep making art, get enough people into the show to demand it come back with full, original cast and crew. I’ve already emailed, and DM’d but we’d need a HUGE social media push, with everyone working together to bring it back, especially since it seems that execs are actively ignore it it. What makes me bummed is that this show was the one on TV I’ve seen so far that takes the most risks and I’m upset that it didn’t get rewarded. It’s truly a bummer these days that only brainless tween sitcomes, and old cash cows like SpongeBob stay on air. I miss the days of creativity, which was what made TMNT so successful in the first place.
I’m glad that we as a whole looked at Leo and said “yes gay Leo 👏👏👏” Loved the video btw 💖💖💖
Edit: Forgot to say, both me and my best friend though the Q-Force trailer was shit, but then watched the show and loved it. I’m sad that Netflix did them so dirty with that trailer, the crew said they had nothing to do with the trailers for the show so we think that whoever did make it purposefully made the trailer shit as a way to get people to not watch it so it would fail 😣 Also, Dead End is an amazing show and I’m pissed it was cancelled 😫
I love Leo and feel like he’s really gay I love this show/character. The queer coding is done very well in my opinion I just wish they would’ve made it canon. This is a great breakdown thank you for making this!
as a french person, I had moments when I didn't understand what you were saying exactly ^^'.. But fortunately I understood the general meaning! It was a really interesting video, I really enjoyed it!!!
“Pro hair? Let me guess, bluenouns?”
Exactly! not all gay people in movie or media have to be as stereotypic, what i mean by that is gay cant be a personality. Its your sexuality, take Craig and Tweek (south park) they aren't wearing pink clothes and high heels and makeup. They are just normal citizens that are gay. You can make a gay character but they have to have personality than just being gay. Its really funny how some (not many! not trying to be rude) people actually think gay people are like this tbh. As a person in the LGBTQ+ community i like when gay characters are introduced, but its awful when they are so annoying like "IM GAY IM GAY IM GAY" every damn second. I legit want to get up and punch my tv when there's a gay character like that. Now its my opinion though so if you disagree just don't go typing in full caps like "NO YOUR WRONG, NUH UH" because you will look stupid.
I love the design of Barney, he reminds me of my cozen who has blue hair and similar style 🥰
This video was amazing, and super well written. I entirely agree as well. Thank you so much, this was a lovely listen!
I don't know if this has been said before in the comments but to add to the subtle reference they do w Leo (for example the David bowie reference or that his favourite genre of music is glam rock) in the episode where senior hueso and his brother fuse, before that he puts on a statue disguise. it could have been just a general greek look but he very closely resembles apollo(I think he is interpreted with the leaf crown thing the most), and Apollo is very much known as one of the queerer greek gods (I think, I didn't rly fact check this much I'm trying to recall multiple Tumblr posts from the top of my head). but yeah the queer references in this show are very good, still not over the turtles voguing and donnie pulling a jojo pose in "clothes don't make the turtle"
leo is casually gay and is a lot like me and im gay + i think its gay as hell how he was all over that pretty man in the show
If you count the top 5 defining things about a main character, and one or more of those things is something biological the character cannot change (ie, sexuality, race, height, body type, neurological, cis/trans gender )
That what you have is stereotype.
Leo. 1) Is the leader (or wants to be). 2) He causes problems tho by being hasty n over estimating himself. 3) badly times jokes! 4) swords. DIBS !! 5) smug. So smug.
And THEN there's the gayness. After all his other character traits are developed, they are mixed WITH the gay. The gay isn't the main part, its an accessory.
Same could go with marcy i guess from amphibia.
1) so much energy. But its from coffee. 2)study study study she needs knowledge. 3) nerd. Total gamer and d&d nerd.
4) she just wants people to like her SO BAD
5) clumsy. Like cause she is not paying attention.
And THEN you get the ASD. Yeah it's mixed in with the other parts of her. Her energy also go into stimming. Her studies and games can becomes hyperfixations. She wants people to like her, and it's hard for her when people don't understand her. Clumsy, since asd can cause some motor skills problems, impulsive behaviour, reduced perspective of risk, hyperfixation, etc.
Try it for yourself
This is very well written! Great job!!!
I love how Shirtaloon handles that stuff in his book "He who fights with monsters". It isn't important and nobody cares when characters are gay. Rufus has a boyfriend? Great for him. Anna has a wife? Sure, no problem. They are just normal characters with personalities who happen to be gay, which is exactly how it is supposed to be in my opinion.
You should check out Heartbreak high and the dynamics between Daryl and Cash
i actually loved that show so much since i felt seen in a lot of different aspects (the autism representation especially is like. immaculate), and yeah the presentation of darren and cash is so important because of how complicated and real their kind of dynamic is. heartbreak high is up there with sex education as one of my favorite "teen drama" shows !!
wooah bsh really insulted my entire wardrobe their
Cool essay! I learned a lot about modern queer media
loved this!!
Great video! I'll definitely be back for more :D
Can you pls make a video about the Owl House you don’t have to if you don’t want to tho
i have yet to actually watch toh !! i'm hesitant on the idea of a video both because i'm not sure the show will resonate with me like it did for a lot of people, and i'm not sure what i can add to the conversation; a lot of people have made a lot of fantastic analyses about this show already. if i were to talk about toh, it'd probably be in the context of a larger video, but i'll try the show out once i find the time and see where it takes me !!
@@nuclearw0rmzz :)
I only found out I'm fully gay after playing genshin and started to think how i see women i see them as pritty but not atractive I'm Also genderfluid and love how pyritty dresses are
I never saw the character as gay i just enjoy the show and no questions asked Unless it's about where is their tail then i have so much questions i don't really care
did you draw ur character? i love ur artsyle if so!
yes the character sprite and the background is my own work. tysm !!
I love my autistic turtle Donatello 🐢
Nice analysis, watch Lego monkie kid btw
Give my man Ethan a better haircut 😭😭
"The rise" he'll nah look at its predecessor
The end of last TMNT was beautiful it made me cry
You didn't mention helluva boss
i haven't seen helluva boss !! the hazbin hotel pilot wasn't my thing, so i'm gonna leave those shows for another amateur video essayist to cover lol
@@nuclearw0rmzz helluva boss is so freaking good and it's keep getting better 💪💕💯
Bruh "vibes" don't define someone gender or sexuality.
Promoting that anything of how you act, dress, or level WALK is straight up wrong
Why wrong?
Because someone who is not from a certain sexuality might think they do. Let's say that someone is AroAce, yet everyone tells him "oh you are so gay!!" and even tries to show evidence and slowly that boy (or generally anyone) would think he is gay just because he fits those so called "vibes" who are pretty much masked stereotypes.
It's bad even if it's fictional, because at the end of the day, it's still promoting stereotypes.
I am not talking about projecting here by the way. The majority of those people aren't even gay men/boys.
Just stop masking stereotypes as "vibes". The only thing that defines someone sexuality or whatever is how they feel on the inside.
I can literally show you a guy who wear dresses, puts make up, fits every single gay stereotype out there and he can be genuinely straight/repulsed AroAce and not trans no matter how you cry about it being a "closed queer person"
Just simply because those stereotypes do not define a sexuality.
They are unhealthy even if they were fictional
I mostly like this video, but I feel like your perspective of heartstopper was ultimately biased to your own experience and harmful quite harmful. You (along with many others, i don't want it to seem like I'm targeting you as an individual here. This is a common viewpoint) really seem to be pushing this idea that queer people all act over the top and that somehow showing a group of privileged kids acting like everyone else is "erasing" queer identities. You act like there aren't queer kids that act like this and that there's no depth at all to these characters. Which is just so untrue.
I will be the first to admit that compared to other queer people my experiences are quite privileged and that this is something really minor to be upset over. I grew up in a family that was (mostly) accepting. I went to a school where the homophones were the weird ones. That's not to say the queer kids where I grew up had no oppression at all. We got death threats and called slurs, all of us knew someone who'd be (or was) disowned and there were trans kids who's parents didn't respect their identity. And pretty much all of has had experienced at least some aspect of violence for being queer at least once. But we were and are privileged in that these weren't daily fears. And to put it down quite clearly, heartstopper was very relatable to us. Almost every character there has at least one person irl I know I can connect it to. So it's always just very sad to hear people say "oh they have no character" like, excuse me? There's two reasons heartstopper connects with people, and that's either people who find it healing, or people who find it relatable. It's fine if your not in either groups, but acting like it's a completely unrealistic show just because you personally don't find anything you relate to I think means you should potentially give it a bit of thought.
Your perceptions of the characters is also just so sad. You put Charlie down as just a shy nerd, but you don't take any time to account the trauma he faced or how his eating disorder, SH issues and even the fact he's been SAed might play into why he comes off at first glace as "shy nerd." He's a quiet person for his own emotional protection and that influences every bit of how he behaves. He likes playing the drums and reading but his mothers (quite blatant if you read solitaire) emotional abuse sucks a lot of personality out of him and his sister so they come across as very bland. You call Nick a "kind jock," which I guess is true. But he's someone who's grown up in a single parent household with a very homophobic older brother who is only just figuring out his sexuality and slowly realizing he's friends with a few not great people. He's a people pleaser, and I'll admit, kind of a boring person. But in a way where I can say I've met him so so so many times throughout my life. The comics spend a huge amount of time showing how the two bring out the best in each other, but also how Charlie unhealthily leans on Nick for emotional support he actually can't provide. Everything about that relationship is realistic to me. Every part of it.
I think apart of your interpretation here might be because it's either been ages since you read any hearstopper (like, wow, how surprising the sexual abuse victim and the kid just figuring out he likes men don't jump at the chance to have sex, what a shocker), or you've just watched the show (I have some strong feelings about the way the show turns the character into child friendly versions, but anyway). Either way, I think if your gonna mention it in a video critically you might wanna actually, oh idk, read the thing your talking about first? It's fine if you just don't relate to it yourself, but that's no reason to bash other queer people who act like them.
This!!! Exactly what I was also thinking, hope he sees this comment!
The reason I like the Hearstopper series version is because It's MADE FOR KIDS!!!! There really isn't any shows for kids, where the whole series is about being queer and questioning your sexual orientation. All the other series are made for teenagers or older like Love Victor.
I’m not a homophob, but I have a crush on Rise Leo and I’m a girl. And I would be disappointed if it turns out that Leo is officially gay. But I’m an open minded person. I love Ruby and Sapphire from Steven Universe and I adore Luz and Amity from The owl house. It’s beautiful when this gets represented positively in media. But if Leo turns out to be gay that’s great. Like I said I would feel disappointed, but after a while I’m going to be fine. Hope I’m it doesn’t make me a bad person. Let’s see if it happens or not. I love you Leo no matter what
this comments seem like a discussion post from canvas lol
#saverottmnt
bro i agreee hes hekin gae >:D
Something you forgot. Weapons.
Donnie, who is pretty much the straightest Turtle in this series, actively showing interest in females (even if he is doing it in an Autistic way), has a staff, which he is very effective with. His Mystic Ability takes time to develop, but at the end he's using it for He can use it to crate a large array of guns. And powering up his drill. his Mystic Ability can create a HUGE DRILL WHICH HE RAMS IN AN EVIL MALE ALIEN'S FACE.
Leo's got two swords which break at the beginning. He has only one sword now - the Odachi, which is ludicrously big. But Leo's Mystic Ability, which he has from the very start is... a hole. A FRIKKIN' HOLE. He's not very good with it, either. Often ends up in the wrong place. Hell, once he ends up in Paris. (You know, the love capital of the world?) But he gets much better when he has two swords again.
He is gay.
Bro, I was watching the most Random shit till this video popped up on my fyp, I have only seen small clips of Rise and I gotta say the Fandom is...it's what I was expecting and not what I was expecting as well lol,
You guys do you lol,
Another instance of companies making non gay characters into gay characters for representation purposes. Like don’t get me wrong, it’s good to have diverse characters, but how about making new characters instead of changing the old ones.
i mean rise of the tmnt already changed so much about their version of leo + his dynamics in the series; he pretty much IS a different character from other iterations.
TMNT in general has changed several aspects of the characters in other incarnations. Off the top of my head, April wasn't a teenager before 2012, and she wasn't Leo's love interest before 2023
This video seems like some kind of parody /pol/locks would make to make fun of /co/.
your mothers house
None of those words are in the bible
@@r10tdotexe Neither is Hell, what does that have to do with anything.
@@alexanderchippel how do you feel about the french revolution of 1997
Who let the disease carrier out of it's cell
Yeah my childhood getting purged, getting tired of it
are u ten years old. the 2018 version of this franchise cannot be your childhood otherwise !!
Leave the turtle alone
as in stop calling him gay?
the creator confirmed that they wrote leo with the intention to gay code him
Let the turtle be gay!!
Nobody’s hurting a fictional mutant turtle by saying he’s gay lol. Don’t get upset
@@Brx125 smh these ppl r more worried about him being gay than everything that happened during the movie