Dom, gouf is more useful for a ace on the ground but dom got more firepower and I think it might have tougher armor which are rookie friendly features, Speed matters the most with ace pilots.
Good video but I think tactically you're wrong, by the same reasons the Dom is more versatile in variants many of the standard Doms that survived Earth were simple converted to R-Dom while the Goufs just became useless, in so The Dom could be used in space which became the main theater of the war making the Dom much more versatile in terms of tactics since in space they performed even better.
I have to wonder if the Dom's "superiority" in customizability is in part due to the war ramping up and designers just going with the arguably more technically advanced model
I still need to finish the video. But I'm on team dom. Besides some forest or a bad mountain region does are just better everywhere else. Better core, maneuverability, weapons. The only goufs that might be better are the ones from seed but even their zakus are better than most gundams from other timelines.
@@popburnsy3207 nonetheless they still chose the dom because technically it is the more advanced suit out of them two it was literally made with beam weapons in mind they just lacked the technology at the time so it was just relegated into a flash bang until they made the gelgoog and figured out how to make a really compact and more powerful engine and not to mention the Dom was still capable of using a beam bazooka compare that to the gouf which wasn't made with beam weapons in mind meanwhile the Dom finally realized it's design of being able to use beam weapons and even funnels with the future model dreisse and dwadge being more efficient in ground combat even in UC96 while the gouf flight type only became the basis for the byarlant and nothing of the goufs influence was taken other than it's flight capabilities something that would be very common in future mobile suits
You know there's nothing stopping them from just outright making a Gouf space type. The Dom had to undergo an identical process as previously it too was a ground only unit before Rick Dom modification. And considering the existence of the Gouf flight type you could basically have a hi-mo zaku but better right off the bat which at least puts it on the same level as a Rick Dom.
I’d have to say the Dom seems to be a more reliable model, as it could be used in space and variants like the Dowadge and Dom tropen were used to great effect by Zeon remnants after the one year war. And it’s design was contined with Neo-Zeons Dresien
Funny thing about the space use. There's nothing stopping them from making a space version of a Gouf, which they also had to do for the Dom. Its called a Rick Dom in space for a reason. I mean consider the Gouf flight type, its already got 90% of the hardware needed for serious space work. Thats basically a hi-mo zaku backpack on it after all.
The Dom was a "cavalry" unit, fast in, fast out, heavy weapons. The Gouf was a "infantry" unit, using the same external weapons of the Zaku. Two different units, to use on different missions. So - as usual - it was the high officers fault in not understanding this.
I really liked that you set aside your personal preference and used the best objective criteria you could to answer a very tough question of which suit is better. I myself prefer the Gouf by far over the Dom. I found myself agreeing with pretty much all your findings. The analysis of cost benefit analysis was extremely astute and is a very poignant factor in the larger issue of the OYW for a resource strapped Zeon.
I think the most difficult part is about the Tactical use. It's important to consider a lot of support vehicles seen in MSG because while they have a small role in the series, they are CRUCIAL when it comes to Zeon logistics.
@@gundamfacts I second what Gunpla Customs said. I appreciate you setting aside your personal preference and just explaining which one was better in all criteria. Whether it was between the weight of the suits to the weaponry. With that being said, I also agree with Gunpla Customs that the Gouf is my personal favorite. I never did care for the Dom.
@@gundamfacts I agree with this. Tbh the Dom was chosen because that's what the creators of the show went with, and some obscure suits have a bigger in lore role
I feel like the Dom's blinder might actually be sufficient to burn infantry. And it likely has bouncing betty last ditch infantry killers like the Zakus from 08th MS team.
If I had to pick..I would choose the Dom.. higher performance cheaper and with more loadouts.. it's the comanders fault for using it in close combat and not giving proper training for the pilots.
The Gouf (specifically the Gouf Custom and Gouf Flight Type) was the one the only Zeonic mobile suits I actually liked. I've never really liked Zeon's mobile suit designs
The Gouf Custom and Flight Type are tied for my favorite Zeon MS, followed closely by the Gelgoog Jaeger, and the Zaku F2. Still despite that - I actually would consider the Dom the better mobile suit. Yes its more expensive but you get two major advantages with it: - The better generator made it capable of using much more weapons including the beam bazooka. - It could be fitted for space combat which made the Gouf completely useless since the OYW moved to space where the Gouf was impossible to deploy.
I find the insistence that you can't count the Gouf Custom, the Flight Type, etc. because they're descended from the A-type rather than the B-type to be odd and nonsensical. Additionally, let's consider mobile suits based on/derived from the Gouf and Dom: The only mobile suit derived from the Gouf was the MS-08 Efreet, which had higher performance but was so prohibitively expensive they only made eight units before ending production. You don't get another Gouf-derived MS until Mars Zeon rolls out the RF Gouf decades later. The Dom, on the other hand, not only got space variants, unlike the Gouf, it also had the MS-10 Pezun Dwadge, the Dreissen, the Rick Dias, and the RF Dom. I think the fact that the Gouf was abandoned in the OYW, while the Dom continued to see spinoffs for decades, speaks volumes.
I agree with what you say but the thing is that the regular Gouf is from a separate branch than the Custom and Flight, they are more akin to cousin units than daughter units to the Gouf, and that should still count. For the legacy, the Gouf still has some spawn before the Late UC, like the whole Gallus series or the Geara Doga Type B (which I guess we can bypass considering how niche it is)
19:38 Gundam Mudrock....the RX-78 Gundam variant that deserves more chance to shine itself. If only it give to Yuu Kajima/other ace pilot not Agar I'm sure this thing will show what the true potential of Gundam and Guncannon combined.
Completely agree.having such an amazing suit and having it be destroyed by just one shot to the back ...just a waste .they did the same thing with the guncannon mass type hmm 🤔 guess it's a mid range thing.
@@thomasadams4267 well at least we saw what the Guncannon MP was capable of when in the hands of Aces like the White Dingos. Because that's the point of Gundam, machines can carry you until some point but in the end its the pilot who makes the difference
The Gouf is a more general purpose mass production suit being built with tactical flexibility in mind. Where the Dom is more of a heavy Hit and Run mass production suit. They don't fill the same tactical rolls. Comparing the two suits is like comparing standard infantry to Delta Force units. yha they both can kick ass but one of the is just traind to do so much more than the other.
A more accurate analogy would be like comparing the US Army to the US Marine Corps as using delta force implies outright performance superiority per unit.
Number of variants is poor to track, it's more "How many compatible vs incompatible parts are needed to make a variant?" that determines if the frame is truly versatile.
Agreed. IMO, the issues for the Gouf is it's lack of modular design or difficulty to modify the base design w/o radical redesigns, future proofing, overspecialization, pilot skill requirement, and its non-standard weapon load-out, which had like some of it fixed with the MS-07B-3. The Dom was just easier to pilot and modify due to like the ample space within, which made it an easy choice over the Gouf. And, ty, for bringing up tactical usage and the Doms limitations
As much as I love the Gouf custom type, Dom is right behind it but if e had to be honest. The Zaku 2 had unlimited potential if the Zeon's military resources pooled together instead of compete against each other. But Zeon was plagued with so much shit internally from political affairs, military companies under mining each other for the sake of profit, and even coup's from the likes of Char. I firmly like to believe if this was irl Zeon would of really doubled down on a better redesign of their base unit. Considering that's exactly what the federation did with project v. The feddies based everything off the success of the RX-78 along with the Guncannon too. Zeon was just all over the board to make 1 suit that was actually solid for all situations like you get with the GM and Gundam Ground types.
Gouf has some interesting variants, i really like the G-2 with its Gunpod arm. but overall the DOM is definitely the better Mass-Production unit. ALSO, I love the epic Intro your channel has!
I always wondered how fast a Dom can run without hovering. We know they can walk, we've seen them do it in 08th MS, but how fast can they move with locomotion instead of hovering?
Wow this was a really nice video! I'm a surface level gundam fan only watching the anime and films and never knew or paid much attention about the background setting of the series like the mobile suit manufacturers and design variant compatibility but hearing you explain it all was very interesting! I'm still team Dom tho mostly because of nostalgia reasons of having a lot of fun playing as Doms on ps2 gundam games, the jet flow movement, rocket launcher and saber combination just made it an all rounder beast in the games as I could kill suits and tanks from afar as well as close the distance really fast with the jets and kill with the sabers. It is true tho that when terrain is uneven like theres buildings or mountains in the way it was kinda hard to jump on them haha
Glad you liked and hope the rest of the videos will please you as well ! Yeah the Dom was always a good pick, either in MSG vs ZG or even Encounter in Space
For a mass produced unit, it should be simple and multipurpose. So the Dom is a far better MS in this regard. The Gouf is way worse as a multipurpose unit, with the base model excelling in close-quarters combat and being mediocre or worse in every other area. So even though I think the Gouf is cooler, the Dom is better in this regard.
Oh man, this dude's information is great. Very useful! His accent is easier to understand in these older videos. Where he sounds a little more like just a dude tryin' to talk about some mobile suits. I hope more channels follow this example of good editing and an honest attempt at content. :D
Thanks for the heartwarming comment. This being said, I'm surprised you seem to prefer our older videos since it wasn't the peak in term of accent and pronunciation, and you seem content with it. On the other hand, if you miss the simplicity and honesty these first videos had, I can suggest you to follow the new design commenting shorts (since it's just me happily trash talking or praising designs for what they are/we're designed for/ bring new)
This is a remarkably good video. I'm definitely interested in seeing some more comparisons between mobile suits, especially ones from Zeon. Subbed, liked, waiting for more.
i admit, the judjement was a bit harsh, but the Dom, while it can hover at very high speeds, suffer from the same problem than the Big Tray land battleships: they cannot manouver very well when cornered around large obstacle and can't spin on themselves at high speed. The point is that in that situation where a Gouf would just jump backward to escape, a Dom would be cornered
@@gundamfacts to ba fair various media shows Doms having insane close combat ability to shift hover direction and done have just punch and "manhandled" other MS with just it's hands so if say having strong enough punches would also count as built-in weapons too.
I liked the Gouf as well the Gouf Custom and flight type. The Dom is kinda weird for me, mostly I would prefer Dom Tropen and Rick Dom II due wider weapon selection.
7:18 actually, weight doesnt seem to translate well with agility in gundam. seems like heavier mobile suit, and for some reason has a lost more "speed" compared to that of lighter mobile suit, sometimes its more reserve power so they last long during battle. one of the example of this is ZZ gundam and GP02A, which is huge and thicc boys but extremely fast and agile. idk how much this transfer much towards the Doms and Goufs.
That's the biggest issue I had across the entire franchise is how later on huge MS and MA's that could be considering mini warships have the ability to turn and dodge on a dime, not to mention fuel consumption seems to never been a thing. Like if you compare the gouf and dom, Dom only has high moving speed and heavier armor in it's favor, but its entire torso is very ridged and doesn't allow for much independent turning/movement compared to the Gouf or even Zaku. But yet it's often shown the dom doing movements that seem out of place for it's design. idk maybe it's me But again there is hardly any constancy when it comes to how mobile suits even preform, like fuel consumption, things like ultra fine motor skills from the mechs from just joysticks and foot peddles, like too many times you see the mechs moving like humans wearing armor than actual mechs in split seconds for input.
Good video. I have some qualms, but w/e. I do think pilot motivation/intentions should have been considered when using appearances though as a grunt and an ace are present on the battlefield for different reasons. While not considered but to reinforce my point. The gouf custom (3b) piloted by Noris Packard was on a distraction mission. Based on you criteria, it would rank low bc it's only visible outing resulted in destruction, even though pilot survivability and victory were different goals.
👍the gouf is my second favorite zeon suit.The hy-gogg being my number one .Just love the gouf's look, hell all the suits from the original series look amazing when the redo the animation . I mean a whole series done like that UC0081 battlefield clip with GM command at A Baoa Qu would be amazing.
Canon lore that these two are very good in their enviroments. Dom is going to absolutely dominate in open areas while the gouf is going to excel in tighter enviroments like a city or underground tunnels.
In CQC while fighting in orbit in urban environments I'd straight up go with the gouf, but if we are talking space and long ranged combat the DOM is straight up a no brainer
the doom is my favorite machine from the zeon classics with the ms-14 jeager. I see doom superior in firepower but worse as mobile suit anti mobile suit, but ultimately in ground battles unlike what we see in the series, the war was won with tanks and planes. the gouf may be great but zeon lost odessa in a battle where the federation used just under 100 mobile suits, not all with beam weapons but physical ones, then thousands of tanks. the gouf's missile launcher is good against mobile suits or tanks but bad against planes but it can use zaku weapons and both at the same time one equipped and the other on its back or skirt. I see the gouf as more limited to face the combined forces of the federation. In igloo we see how a gouf's light machine gun barely touches the rx-440 guntanks but the doom's missile launcher does hit one of these. considering that, I see more sense in simply producing dooms, after all the ground war was lost with or without GMs and the space war was one where the gouf would have no value in space as it was not designed for this and its weapons would be very ineffective at this. instead the doom can be modified to work in space or on the ground, which would allow more units to be taken out to put them back into active service.
If you want to fight a war the Dom is the better MS because its highly mobile for combat on the surface or in space and its weapon loadout is more varied. If you want an MS that brings out the best in Ace Pilots the Gouf is the best even if its an MS designed solely for fighting on the ground where you don't need to worry about control thrusters for space.
9:13 How is the GM Cannon using a beam spray with so little generator output? I thought you needed more than a Dom to run a beam weapon even with the proto-E-Cap the feddies had.
I love both these suits but the Dom definitely wins out. The Gouf is more effective - and especially more cost-effective - in the hands of an ace pilot, but when piloted by a regular soldier it doesn't offer a dramatic advantage over the Zaku II. As such, it's excellent as an elite machine for skilled pilots like Ral and Packard, but as a mass-produced MS it falls short. By contrast, the Dom's mass, armour and power mean that even if a regular pilot takes a few hits when piloting one, they can still come back alive and in a repairable machine.
@@gundamfacts I'm sorry to say this, but many of your criteria sound very flawed, for example: MS size. The Crossbone Vanguard MS were indeed smaller than EF's Jegan, but the real advantage was that they were a lot faster, even faster than the RGM-89R Jegan A-Type, which was supposed to be the faster of the 3 Jegan variants deployed at the time. They also had beam shields which were far more effective than the physical shields of the Jegan, or for the matter, the physical shields of the EF's also miniaturized RGM-109 Heavygun and F71 G-Cannon. In contrast, not only does the Dom has better armor than the Gouf, but it also has higher mobility and better firepower in the form of heavier weapons, which it can even fire while moving, something that units ranging from the MS-05B (Raketen Bazooka) to the MS-07B (Giant Bazooka) can't do, with games such as Zeonic Front outright depicting this as an advantage of the Dom over some older models. In fact, Ms Igloo 2's iconic White Ogre seems to go as far as suggesting that a Zaku type MS even needs to come to a full stop to fire the basic 280mm Zaku bazooka. Games like GBO2 take a more gameplay friendly approach, allowing most MS to fire bazooka while moving around, but to me this seems similar to the concept of "boosting around" even with some older OYW MS with very limited thrusting capabilities, which is another things not reflect in the anime On the other hand, ground hovering variants of the Zaku II and Gouf, like the Desert Zaku from ZZ and the MS-07H from Zeta Gundam, would further seem to point towards machines which such system overcoming the recoil problems that their non-hovering counterparts face and which require them to come to a full stop. The case of the MS-06K also comes to mind, infamously limited by its recoil problems, with more recent iterations now rather showing it and its derived unit, the MS-06JK Zaku Half Cannon, using shoulder gatling guns, while the actual ballistic cannons are used by the ground hovering MS-09K-1 & MS-09K-2 Dom Cannons or the YMS-16M Xamel. Factors like weight hardly matter to the Dom, even agility-wise: in ZZ we see how outdated MS-09G and MS-09H units outmaneuver Gryps era MS, even in close quarters, and showing even the capability to quickly doge to the sides to avoid direct beam shots. I would argue that the Dom's actual problem would be fighting in an area with many obstacles, like and urban zone, a rocky region (like the one outside Torrington) or the underground Jaburo. This reminds me of the AMX-101 Gallus J, which was machine said to be well suited for "urban combat", which would basically be the kind of machine well suited to the aforementioned scenarios where the Dom would have problems, and the kind of situations where a Gouf would likely be well more suited. The opposite is true also, with the Gouf considered a bad design for ranged combat, which resulted in the production of the MS-07C-3, and the MS-07G-2 to address that very issue. This is precisely what we observe in Odessa in MS Igloo 2, with the lone Gouf Custom shown easily falling prey to ranged weapons and safely finished off from a distance. It's also worth noting that even the MS-07C-3 souped up 85mm finger machine guns are said to be good enough to destroy "lightly armored MS with ease", which immediately raises the question of exactly how good the standard Gouf's 75mm finger machine gun actually was. We know that while the YMS-07A, YMS-07B and MS-07A well all completed before the 3rd landing operation, the 4 MS-07H units were converted from 3 YMS-07A and 1 YMS-07B, which makes me think that these weapons might have been specifically designed for AA combat, in other words, shooting down lightly armed fighters. As a quick side note, the development of the MS-07H suggests that project was cancelled around June (I can go in more detail if you want, but basically 2 weeks after the capture of California Base, 8 weeks of testing and 10 more days of testing of the remaining MS-07H-4 before it blew up in mid test), and that as a result the MS-07B was produced instead, meant to work with the Dodai YS, as a sort of replacement. The MS-07H was likely seen as the solution to the loss of mobility problem in Zeon's Mobile Suits once they began fighting on Earth. It's also important to note that, not only the MS-07A should have been able to work with the 3 different types of Dodai (YS, II & and the recent GA from MSV-R), but also the MS-06G & the MS-06D, both of which have leg jet thrusters, so the Dodai wouldn't have been something exclusive to the MS-07B. And let's not forget the external thrusters that MS-06F2 in 0083 and the MS-14D from Unicorn use for high power jumps. I do have concerns about their operational range though, since the Dodai YS is said to be frequently escorted by Dopps, as seen in the original TV series, and the later are said to have a very short range. The one seen in 0096 could have been modified after the OYW for greater range (for instance, disabling the missile launchers and reusing the space for more fuel, which is more or less the concept of the Dodai II from 08th Ms Team) or simply resupplied off screen. But I doubt they can fly long ranges, which is why Gaws that attacked Jaburo needed to carry the Goufs from California Base instead of being escorted by them in Dodais. In all fairness, even the MS-07H8 seems to have very limited range and it wouldn't be until the NRX-044 Asshimar that we see a MS sized machine (technically a MA) fly on its own power over long distances. This post is long enough as is, so I'll just skim over other concerns and we can talk more about particular issues if you want: -I frankly can't recall ever seeing a Dom running rather than hovering, not even units used by Zeon remnants. While I can admit the situation could happen, but I find more likely that the unit would be abandoned or adjusted to hover with any remaining thrusters. But for the sake of simplicity I think the only case to consider is a Dom's hovering speed versus a Zaku's/Gouf's running speed. Some game's depict older machines as capable of "boosting around" to move faster, but in the animation we don't this until 0087, with non-hovering MS running around and using their thrusters to jump around, not hover. -It would seem that the YMS-09 was produced in limited quantities as a pre-production version of the Dom, a MS-09A, which entered production in July and which served as the basis of the YMS-09D, MS-09K-1 and MS-09K-2. The MSM-03 Gogg apparently also got a run of pre-production MSM-03-1 units in May, with the proper MSM-03 being deployed until July. -Fixed weapons seem like a terrible criteria to me (specially without an equivalent criteria on other weapons), in part because on one hand we have cases unmentioned weapons, like the Gogg's head beams(?) that it uses underwater in the TV series or the anti-personnel S-Mine, called that in MS Igloo 2, but also seen at work with Topps' MS-05B in MS-08th MS Team, the assumption being that all Zeon machines (or at they very least all ground use Zakus) had such weapons all along. Also, they were the kind of non-compatible equipment that the UMP sought to eliminate, which is why we see that weapons like the MS-07B-3's 35mm gatling gun ending up also used by the other machines like Doug Schneid's MS-08TX, or the MS-06D arm mounted missile launcher use by the MS-09K series. The MS-07B seems to be the worst of the bunch, since both the MS-07H and MS-07C-5 seem to have the capacity to replace the ammo cartridge, and have two of these weapons, while the MS-07B seems to be restricted to the internal ammo and requires to be resupplied at a base once it runs out, which is another problem of fixed weapons (the Juagg's 3 large missile launchers always come to mind in this cases, seeming almost as single use weapons). -Zeonic Front allows you to bring 3 team of 3 Doms each and that is the most devastating combination: you don't clutter MS, which was a weakness of the Zaku due to its low mobility, but rather fan them out and have them clear multiple targets along different routes for maximum efficiency. -As for losses, figures given on the produced numbers point towards 200 MS-07B Goufs and 600 MS-09B Doms been produced during the war, and given their mobility, that would have allowed them to escape more easily, even on their own, and the fact that Zeon could convert them for space combat, likely meant that more survived the battles on Earth and were given priority to be sent back to space.
Love your videos! I appreciate you do this with your own voice and not a soulless ai and i can tell you’re also multilingual but please please work on your pronunciation.
Team Gouf but the Dom was strictly better as a general production MS but the Gouf was a better ground combat specialist suit. the Gouf had higher general mobility and agility, but the Dom was faster and more conducive to squad based raiding or hit and run actions.... which is actually much like how we see them used in series. Doms are almost never deployed as a single unit while Goufs were usually requisitioned for dedicated singular specialists to wreck havoc. The Dom also actually had a better chance against the Gundam or Gundam derived MS since it's primary armament was actually capable of damaging or destroying them outright (as what happened in the LN version of the OYW) In the long run though, we can see that the Dom design was long lasting, spawning numerous descendant designs and offshoots while the Gouf effectively led into the awesome but impractical (and unfortunately, dead end) Efreet designs.
I would choose base Dom over base Gouf all day because I really like the hover/sliding and there's also the Rick variant for space use. Gouf Custom is on another level tho. I'd like to know more about the Sisquiede(Titans) or Monoeye Gundam. Is it comparable to any UC machine?
If i want hit and run tactics, then the Dom would be the answer as shown by the Black Tri Star and even later Dwadge series. Their problem is that something that big and fast consumes too much energy and they offer no proper protection against beam. If i want a better all round unit for Ground warfare then it would be Gouf because rhe Gouf is just a better Zaku on ground with it's only problems being that tewrapons it can use are too limited and it's less flexible comapred to a Zaku II
Within the context of 0079 as a story it feels like the Dom is intended to the better unit. Because it's supposed to be tragic and dire for Ramba Ral that he was he was denied the shipment of the new Doms. This is further enforced by the likes of the Gihren's Greed what if stories where Ramba Ral captures the Gundam and The White Base if he actually does get the Doms. And when we only see the Dom later in the story where they're piloted by the Black Tri Stars. It feels like we're supposed to feel like things have escalated as one of the one screen kills they DO get from the Dom is one that's incredibly impactful for Amur as a character.
Agreed, but we should stop putting the Gihren greed argument on a pedestal. The most common turn of events that happens when Ramba get the Doms is that yes he captures the White Base, Gundam, Guncannon and Guntank, but Amuro escape with the Core fighter. If you play federation side, Amuro willy then return with the Pixy and butcher the entirety of Ramba group making the earlier victory a non factor
I somewhat disagree with being easily disarmed being a weakness, the disarmament generally happened because the weapon was targeted, in which case inbuilt weapons would still get wrecked, and if the disarmament was due to the weapon getting entangled, the suit is trapped and if it was due to the pilot dropping a not useful at the time weapon, it is dead weight.
I do agree, but having inbuilt weapons is a safety. If a Zaku fall In a crevasse and drop its 120mm rifle, it risks being unable to counter for example an ambushing GM. If a Gouf suffer the same fate, there is a certainty that the machinegun fingers and heat rod will still be available to counter the GM (unless it fall right on the arm and the weapons get crushed but that would be really bad luck)
Performance wise, the Dom. Cost wise, the Gouf. Material wise, the Gouf. Effectiveness to cost ratio? Pre- federation mass produced beam weapons, the Dom. Post, the Gouf. Versatility? The Gouf could be modified for long range combat and atmospheric flight, the Dom had a wider array of armaments and could be used in space, so Dom. Considering Zeons limited resources, both materials and pilots, the best idea would have been to skip the Dom and work on the Gelgoog. Failing that, Zeon should have used what they had to improve the Gouf series instead of the Dom and it's variants. Not that Zeon has ever been known for making intelligent choices
I don't know if the generator output of the Dom is really "superior" if the Dom's running speed is still less than the Gouf. It uses all that extra output just to come in behind the Gouf. Technically, true, but operationally not so much
Well the Gouf is meant to run. The Dom to hover which recquires more energy to power. If the Dom was meant to run it would have been crafted with different kind of feets
If you're not equipped for space combat (Gouf) that is a non-starter. How can a mobile suit be considered as a replacement if you can't even use it for the most important theater of the war which is space? As a systems/manufacturing engineer I would upgrade a proven model like the Zaku II into the Zaku II kai and have it complement the dom. That's much cheaper than developing a brand new expensive model like the Gouf which can't even perform in space. This is what I believe they were trying to do in the united maintenance plan and you can see it later in the war when you saw mostly Zakus and doms in space. Love Gundam. It's what got me interested in engineering as a kid lol.
Yeah but the thing is that the Gouf and the Dom were created to replace the Zaku Ground Type, which itself cannot perform in space, unlike the Zaku II F Type or others Zakus. At the time Gouf and Dom were imagined, Zeon was solidly anchored to Earth to think it was the decisive remaining front. Being pushed back in space was not even considered in July/August UC79 where Federal MS were not yet introduced.
Technically Earth was the most important theatre of war, as most of the fighting was done there between federation tanks/artillery vs Zeon mobile suits. Once the federation drove Zeon into space, the Federation pretty much already won the war since Zeon's main purpose (taking over the Earth sphere) had failed. The remainder of the war was just to try and eliminate the Zeonic leadership to prevent a 2nd attempt in the future (after the fall of Odessa and the failure to take Jaburo, Zeon probably would have accepted a peace deal).So the Gouf could be considered important since Earth combat occurred for most of the war (even after Zeon pulled out, insurgent forces still used the left over ground weapons).
idk. when you compare the dom and gouf the amount of different doms to gouf ratio the dom is easy to slap on new shit and it works. as with the gouf its mostly the same but it does what it does best.
@@nathanielarthurhardy419 the Gouf Custom is...a particular case because it proves nothing and everything. As the B-3 Type, it's actually very close to the reg Gouf (B-1) and even have nearly the same stats. Now it has better aerodynamics due to spare parts from the Gouf Flight Type series and revisited weapons but it doesnt excel in any particular environment (you might argue as it work very well in urban areas) and the weapons are less powerful that the B-1 but just more practical. I could have included it but it wasn't the most significative example, at least from my POV.
@manny022 "Switch from ground to space type within minutes and with few parts": well, you just described the MS-09F Dom Funf. In all likelihood, the MS-09B Dom is the result of making the YMS-09/MS-09A pre-production Dom share as many parts with the MS-09R. Some MS-09A units are produced as early as July at California Base, but it isn't until September that the MS-09B & MS-09R begin production in space. In the meantime, the MS-09A units serve as the basis for the YMS-09D Tropical Dom and both the MS-09K-1 & MS-09K-2 Dom Cannons. It's also worth nothing that in July 31st, the decision was taken to use the Zimmad Rick Dom instead of Zeonic's MS-06R-2 as Zeon's space replacement for the aging MS-06F, which meshes well with the above: the Zimmad production lines that had been producing MS-06F until that point are modified during August to produce MS-09B and MS-09R instead and starting September they began rolling out 200 machines a month. Also, one thing that became evident during the OYW is that a good amphibious MS basically needs to be built from scratch for that particular environment, with machines like the Zaku Marine Type, Aqua GM and even the Gundam Marine Type notably underperforming in comparison. Instead the MS-09M Dom Mermaid (from MSV-R) uses of the Dom's hovering capabilities to make it glide over water more effectively. Games like Crossfire (PS3) already shoed the Dom capable of hovering over water, as long as it was already hovering before reaching the water surface and it doesn't stop in place, otherwise, the Dom would quickly sink like a brick and can't simply remerge to try again. As for a full armor or weapons type, the former was hardly necessary as the Dom was already one of Zeon's most heavily armored MS, and the later did happened in the form of units like the Dom Cannon Type 1 & Type 2, the MS-09F/Br Dom Barrage and more recently, the Dom Gnomides from Code Fairy and GBO2, which already looks more like a MA or even a small land battleship. As an extra, the Gundam Side Stories game (PS3) game Guy Helmuth's Rick Dom II aLarge Heat Saber, meant for anti-ship combat, while the YMS-09J Dom High Speed Experimental Type from MSV-R showed the unit using a Heat Lancer, essentially a long Heat Hawk, like the one used by Doug Schneid in his Efreet (Gundam Side Stories) or more recently, similar to the Giant Heat Hawk used by Ortega's Zaku II during the Battle of Loum, in The Origin OVAs.
What I love about the Efreet is that the Gouf is a Tactical close range fighter: it wins close combat with its specialized arsenal. The Efreet? It's a mf power fighter, it will just hammer that heat sword (boosted by the absurd Thrust output it has) until the opponent breaks
![Mobile Suits BEFORE the OYW: The Precursors to the Zaku series (Gundam Lore/ Universal Century[OYW])](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YnpQFl2Wevo/mqdefault.jpg)
And you? Team Gouf or Team Dom?
Gouf!
both
Gouf Troop!
Dom, gouf is more useful for a ace on the ground but dom got more firepower and I think it might have tougher armor which are rookie friendly features, Speed matters the most with ace pilots.
Team Dom
Reason?
.
*"FAMILY"*
Good video but I think tactically you're wrong, by the same reasons the Dom is more versatile in variants many of the standard Doms that survived Earth were simple converted to R-Dom while the Goufs just became useless, in so The Dom could be used in space which became the main theater of the war making the Dom much more versatile in terms of tactics since in space they performed even better.
I have to wonder if the Dom's "superiority" in customizability is in part due to the war ramping up and designers just going with the arguably more technically advanced model
I still need to finish the video. But I'm on team dom. Besides some forest or a bad mountain region does are just better everywhere else. Better core, maneuverability, weapons. The only goufs that might be better are the ones from seed but even their zakus are better than most gundams from other timelines.
@@popburnsy3207 nonetheless they still chose the dom because technically it is the more advanced suit out of them two it was literally made with beam weapons in mind they just lacked the technology at the time so it was just relegated into a flash bang until they made the gelgoog and figured out how to make a really compact and more powerful engine and not to mention the Dom was still capable of using a beam bazooka compare that to the gouf which wasn't made with beam weapons in mind meanwhile the Dom finally realized it's design of being able to use beam weapons and even funnels with the future model dreisse and dwadge being more efficient in ground combat even in UC96 while the gouf flight type only became the basis for the byarlant and nothing of the goufs influence was taken other than it's flight capabilities something that would be very common in future mobile suits
The Dom was awesome
You know there's nothing stopping them from just outright making a Gouf space type. The Dom had to undergo an identical process as previously it too was a ground only unit before Rick Dom modification. And considering the existence of the Gouf flight type you could basically have a hi-mo zaku but better right off the bat which at least puts it on the same level as a Rick Dom.
I’d have to say the Dom seems to be a more reliable model, as it could be used in space and variants like the Dowadge and Dom tropen were used to great effect by Zeon remnants after the one year war. And it’s design was contined with Neo-Zeons Dresien
Funny thing about the space use. There's nothing stopping them from making a space version of a Gouf, which they also had to do for the Dom. Its called a Rick Dom in space for a reason. I mean consider the Gouf flight type, its already got 90% of the hardware needed for serious space work. Thats basically a hi-mo zaku backpack on it after all.
The Dom was a "cavalry" unit, fast in, fast out, heavy weapons.
The Gouf was a "infantry" unit, using the same external weapons of the Zaku.
Two different units, to use on different missions. So - as usual - it was the high officers fault in not understanding this.
Yes, Dom and Gouf had different Purpose of use in battle field
I really liked that you set aside your personal preference and used the best objective criteria you could to answer a very tough question of which suit is better. I myself prefer the Gouf by far over the Dom. I found myself agreeing with pretty much all your findings. The analysis of cost benefit analysis was extremely astute and is a very poignant factor in the larger issue of the OYW for a resource strapped Zeon.
I think the most difficult part is about the Tactical use. It's important to consider a lot of support vehicles seen in MSG because while they have a small role in the series, they are CRUCIAL when it comes to Zeon logistics.
@@gundamfacts I second what Gunpla Customs said. I appreciate you setting aside your personal preference and just explaining which one was better in all criteria. Whether it was between the weight of the suits to the weaponry. With that being said, I also agree with Gunpla Customs that the Gouf is my personal favorite. I never did care for the Dom.
@@gundamfacts I agree with this. Tbh the Dom was chosen because that's what the creators of the show went with, and some obscure suits have a bigger in lore role
I don't normally like chunky mobile suits, but I've always really liked the original Dom. It's my favorite OYW Zeon suit.
I feel like the Dom's blinder might actually be sufficient to burn infantry. And it likely has bouncing betty last ditch infantry killers like the Zakus from 08th MS team.
exceptional video, love the dedication and the lore on it, perhaps in the future we can see the history of the machines made by the Titans Test Team.
I might explore AoZ at some point
If I had to pick..I would choose the Dom.. higher performance cheaper and with more loadouts.. it's the comanders fault for using it in close combat and not giving proper training for the pilots.
I like both but I'd have to go with the Dom.
Yeah despite the end result i would still go with a Dom High Speed Experimental Type
this sis literarily the gundam channel i've been looking for, it is literarily gundam facts, just what i want, and the quality is actually really good
Glad you enjoyed and found what you wanted here! Hope the next content will please you
@@gundamfacts until now i have a good feeling about your channel and videos
The Gouf (specifically the Gouf Custom and Gouf Flight Type) was the one the only Zeonic mobile suits I actually liked. I've never really liked Zeon's mobile suit designs
The Gouf Flight Type has to be my favorite design from the 8th MS Team. It has a sort of elegant yet agressive silhouette
The Gouf Custom and Flight Type are tied for my favorite Zeon MS, followed closely by the Gelgoog Jaeger, and the Zaku F2. Still despite that - I actually would consider the Dom the better mobile suit. Yes its more expensive but you get two major advantages with it:
- The better generator made it capable of using much more weapons including the beam bazooka.
- It could be fitted for space combat which made the Gouf completely useless since the OYW moved to space where the Gouf was impossible to deploy.
The Kampfer was the best design of Zeon for me ngl
That’s me with most GMs & Gundams: most models just stick to the same boring & generic archetype.
@@hachiroku7999 Kampfer is definitely in my top three, right up there with the Gouf and Geara Doga.
I’d prefer to pilot a Gouf, but if I can only pilot a Dom I’d be more than happy to.
hail Zeon !
My favorite looking regular Dom B type is the design from Gundam The Origin Manga. I really like that artistic style for the Dom
The Gouf was better as a close quarters combat suit whereas the the Dom was the best ground based general purpose suit to replace the J -type Zaku 2.
I take it back, the Dom needs tactics, not numbers.
I totally agree with that
The Gouf is better in the hands of an Ace who pushes ahead where as the Dom is best with elite squads who don't want a standout operator.
I find the insistence that you can't count the Gouf Custom, the Flight Type, etc. because they're descended from the A-type rather than the B-type to be odd and nonsensical. Additionally, let's consider mobile suits based on/derived from the Gouf and Dom:
The only mobile suit derived from the Gouf was the MS-08 Efreet, which had higher performance but was so prohibitively expensive they only made eight units before ending production. You don't get another Gouf-derived MS until Mars Zeon rolls out the RF Gouf decades later. The Dom, on the other hand, not only got space variants, unlike the Gouf, it also had the MS-10 Pezun Dwadge, the Dreissen, the Rick Dias, and the RF Dom. I think the fact that the Gouf was abandoned in the OYW, while the Dom continued to see spinoffs for decades, speaks volumes.
I agree with what you say but the thing is that the regular Gouf is from a separate branch than the Custom and Flight, they are more akin to cousin units than daughter units to the Gouf, and that should still count. For the legacy, the Gouf still has some spawn before the Late UC, like the whole Gallus series or the Geara Doga Type B (which I guess we can bypass considering how niche it is)
@@gundamfacts But the Dowas, Dwadge, etc. don't count as separate branches from the regular Dom?
19:38 Gundam Mudrock....the RX-78 Gundam variant that deserves more chance to shine itself. If only it give to Yuu Kajima/other ace pilot not Agar I'm sure this thing will show what the true potential of Gundam and Guncannon combined.
Completely agree.having such an amazing suit and having it be destroyed by just one shot to the back ...just a waste .they did the same thing with the guncannon mass type hmm 🤔 guess it's a mid range thing.
@@thomasadams4267 well at least we saw what the Guncannon MP was capable of when in the hands of Aces like the White Dingos. Because that's the point of Gundam, machines can carry you until some point but in the end its the pilot who makes the difference
The Gouf is a more general purpose mass production suit being built with tactical flexibility in mind. Where the Dom is more of a heavy Hit and Run mass production suit. They don't fill the same tactical rolls. Comparing the two suits is like comparing standard infantry to Delta Force units. yha they both can kick ass but one of the is just traind to do so much more than the other.
A more accurate analogy would be like comparing the US Army to the US Marine Corps as using delta force implies outright performance superiority per unit.
@@CountSpartula true true. Between crayon eaters and green goons is far more realistic than green goons and deltards.
Number of variants is poor to track, it's more "How many compatible vs incompatible parts are needed to make a variant?" that determines if the frame is truly versatile.
That, and you don't need to make a variant if the mecha can already do the job.
@@stevenschnepp576 That too.
good to know you've improved your audio setup.
Agreed. IMO, the issues for the Gouf is it's lack of modular design or difficulty to modify the base design w/o radical redesigns, future proofing, overspecialization, pilot skill requirement, and its non-standard weapon load-out, which had like some of it fixed with the MS-07B-3. The Dom was just easier to pilot and modify due to like the ample space within, which made it an easy choice over the Gouf. And, ty, for bringing up tactical usage and the Doms limitations
As much as I love the Gouf custom type, Dom is right behind it but if e had to be honest. The Zaku 2 had unlimited potential if the Zeon's military resources pooled together instead of compete against each other. But Zeon was plagued with so much shit internally from political affairs, military companies under mining each other for the sake of profit, and even coup's from the likes of Char.
I firmly like to believe if this was irl Zeon would of really doubled down on a better redesign of their base unit. Considering that's exactly what the federation did with project v. The feddies based everything off the success of the RX-78 along with the Guncannon too. Zeon was just all over the board to make 1 suit that was actually solid for all situations like you get with the GM and Gundam Ground types.
Gouf has some interesting variants, i really like the G-2 with its Gunpod arm. but overall the DOM is definitely the better Mass-Production unit. ALSO, I love the epic Intro your channel has!
Old or new Intro?
Doms can do way more. Less melee specialization but who cares when the other perks far out weight it.
I always wondered how fast a Dom can run without hovering. We know they can walk, we've seen them do it in 08th MS, but how fast can they move with locomotion instead of hovering?
Man I wish it was more episodes like these like the gm versus something if this was a really good episode 10/10
The Dom is better for mass production- but the Gouf is an awesome unit for Ace pilots operating on colonies or planet side.
Quality as always keep up the great video
Wow this was a really nice video! I'm a surface level gundam fan only watching the anime and films and never knew or paid much attention about the background setting of the series like the mobile suit manufacturers and design variant compatibility but hearing you explain it all was very interesting! I'm still team Dom tho mostly because of nostalgia reasons of having a lot of fun playing as Doms on ps2 gundam games, the jet flow movement, rocket launcher and saber combination just made it an all rounder beast in the games as I could kill suits and tanks from afar as well as close the distance really fast with the jets and kill with the sabers. It is true tho that when terrain is uneven like theres buildings or mountains in the way it was kinda hard to jump on them haha
Glad you liked and hope the rest of the videos will please you as well ! Yeah the Dom was always a good pick, either in MSG vs ZG or even Encounter in Space
For a mass produced unit, it should be simple and multipurpose. So the Dom is a far better MS in this regard. The Gouf is way worse as a multipurpose unit, with the base model excelling in close-quarters combat and being mediocre or worse in every other area. So even though I think the Gouf is cooler, the Dom is better in this regard.
Oh man, this dude's information is great. Very useful!
His accent is easier to understand in these older videos. Where he sounds a little more like just a dude tryin' to talk about some mobile suits. I hope more channels follow this example of good editing and an honest attempt at content. :D
Thanks for the heartwarming comment. This being said, I'm surprised you seem to prefer our older videos since it wasn't the peak in term of accent and pronunciation, and you seem content with it. On the other hand, if you miss the simplicity and honesty these first videos had, I can suggest you to follow the new design commenting shorts (since it's just me happily trash talking or praising designs for what they are/we're designed for/ bring new)
This is a remarkably good video. I'm definitely interested in seeing some more comparisons between mobile suits, especially ones from Zeon.
Subbed, liked, waiting for more.
Dom: literally hovers over the ground
gundam facts: Dom is sluggish and not maneuverable
i admit, the judjement was a bit harsh, but the Dom, while it can hover at very high speeds, suffer from the same problem than the Big Tray land battleships: they cannot manouver very well when cornered around large obstacle and can't spin on themselves at high speed. The point is that in that situation where a Gouf would just jump backward to escape, a Dom would be cornered
@@gundamfacts to ba fair various media shows Doms having insane close combat ability to shift hover direction and done have just punch and "manhandled" other MS with just it's hands so if say having strong enough punches would also count as built-in weapons too.
I liked the Gouf as well the Gouf Custom and flight type. The Dom is kinda weird for me, mostly I would prefer Dom Tropen and Rick Dom II due wider weapon selection.
I so wish Garma could have piloted that Gouf Combined Type. I'm also surprised none of the G Generation games have it. Excellent video as always!
the Dopp is a design i have mixed feeling for but the Little Dopp managed to make me like it
Gouf for the win!!! Great vid. Never noticed all the variations of the dom though. Solid video as always.
That's only the basic variants of the base Dom not any of the other variants of the Rick Dom or the specialized Dom types
how come RUclips just recommend me this marvelous insight of a video
Hope you will enjoy the rest of the channel as well!
@@gundamfacts as long as the content has logistics, side story n techno stuff I'm all ears
7:18 actually, weight doesnt seem to translate well with agility in gundam.
seems like heavier mobile suit, and for some reason has a lost more "speed" compared to that of lighter mobile suit, sometimes its more reserve power so they last long during battle.
one of the example of this is ZZ gundam and GP02A, which is huge and thicc boys but extremely fast and agile. idk how much this transfer much towards the Doms and Goufs.
That's the biggest issue I had across the entire franchise is how later on huge MS and MA's that could be considering mini warships have the ability to turn and dodge on a dime, not to mention fuel consumption seems to never been a thing.
Like if you compare the gouf and dom, Dom only has high moving speed and heavier armor in it's favor, but its entire torso is very ridged and doesn't allow for much independent turning/movement compared to the Gouf or even Zaku. But yet it's often shown the dom doing movements that seem out of place for it's design. idk maybe it's me
But again there is hardly any constancy when it comes to how mobile suits even preform, like fuel consumption, things like ultra fine motor skills from the mechs from just joysticks and foot peddles, like too many times you see the mechs moving like humans wearing armor than actual mechs in split seconds for input.
Im trippin hard rn guys
This is my favorite video
Your accent sounds quarter mobile suit
Subscribe and like Gundam Facts!!!!!!!
Good video. I have some qualms, but w/e. I do think pilot motivation/intentions should have been considered when using appearances though as a grunt and an ace are present on the battlefield for different reasons.
While not considered but to reinforce my point. The gouf custom (3b) piloted by Noris Packard was on a distraction mission. Based on you criteria, it would rank low bc it's only visible outing resulted in destruction, even though pilot survivability and victory were different goals.
Obviously the Gouf. Because you can make jokes about the Gouf troop.
I'm team gelgoog
Don't worry we have plans for the Gelgoog
Doms are better, spec-wise, but no Dom pilot was better than either Ramba Ral or Norris Packard...
👍the gouf is my second favorite zeon suit.The hy-gogg being my number one .Just love the gouf's look, hell all the suits from the original series look amazing when the redo the animation . I mean a whole series done like that UC0081 battlefield clip with GM command at A Baoa Qu would be amazing.
Then I advise you to check the Gogg series video! Plenty of Hy-Gogg materials including the Hygogg II and Hygogg Kai!
With all things considered, the Gouf would be my choice.
Canon lore that these two are very good in their enviroments. Dom is going to absolutely dominate in open areas while the gouf is going to excel in tighter enviroments like a city or underground tunnels.
Loving all you videos man!
Glad you do! If you have a soft spot for OYW, UC ships and Late UC, then we have good content for you !
Yes! Loved the Clop-class! Hope you do a video on the Gelgoog soon! Cheers!
I mean, the Gouf is the chosen ride of Ramba Ral, while the Dom is first seen with the goofy Black Tristars. It's no contest.
I’m with the Gouf Troop!
kinda noticed you skipped the gouf custom
In CQC while fighting in orbit in urban environments I'd straight up go with the gouf, but if we are talking space and long ranged combat the DOM is straight up a no brainer
I like the Dom better at least in the fact it looks less unnecessarily ornate, and more like something built with serious military production in mind.
Let's Fucking gooooooooo new video out
the doom is my favorite machine from the zeon classics with the ms-14 jeager.
I see doom superior in firepower but worse as mobile suit anti mobile suit, but ultimately in ground battles unlike what we see in the series, the war was won with tanks and planes.
the gouf may be great but zeon lost odessa in a battle where the federation used just under 100 mobile suits, not all with beam weapons but physical ones, then thousands of tanks.
the gouf's missile launcher is good against mobile suits or tanks but bad against planes but it can use zaku weapons and both at the same time one equipped and the other on its back or skirt.
I see the gouf as more limited to face the combined forces of the federation.
In igloo we see how a gouf's light machine gun barely touches the rx-440 guntanks but the doom's missile launcher does hit one of these.
considering that, I see more sense in simply producing dooms, after all the ground war was lost with or without GMs and the space war was one where the gouf would have no value in space as it was not designed for this and its weapons would be very ineffective at this. instead the doom can be modified to work in space or on the ground, which would allow more units to be taken out to put them back into active service.
If you want to fight a war the Dom is the better MS because its highly mobile for combat on the surface or in space and its weapon loadout is more varied. If you want an MS that brings out the best in Ace Pilots the Gouf is the best even if its an MS designed solely for fighting on the ground where you don't need to worry about control thrusters for space.
9:13 How is the GM Cannon using a beam spray with so little generator output? I thought you needed more than a Dom to run a beam weapon even with the proto-E-Cap the feddies had.
BSG are less powerful.
@@ANDREALEONE95 True, but they're still not easy to run.
I love both these suits but the Dom definitely wins out.
The Gouf is more effective - and especially more cost-effective - in the hands of an ace pilot, but when piloted by a regular soldier it doesn't offer a dramatic advantage over the Zaku II. As such, it's excellent as an elite machine for skilled pilots like Ral and Packard, but as a mass-produced MS it falls short.
By contrast, the Dom's mass, armour and power mean that even if a regular pilot takes a few hits when piloting one, they can still come back alive and in a repairable machine.
Not the outcome I expected
Wasn't expecting this result till the end as well. Still it remain an arbitrary result based on documentation
@@gundamfacts I'm sorry to say this, but many of your criteria sound very flawed, for example: MS size. The Crossbone Vanguard MS were indeed smaller than EF's Jegan, but the real advantage was that they were a lot faster, even faster than the RGM-89R Jegan A-Type, which was supposed to be the faster of the 3 Jegan variants deployed at the time. They also had beam shields which were far more effective than the physical shields of the Jegan, or for the matter, the physical shields of the EF's also miniaturized RGM-109 Heavygun and F71 G-Cannon.
In contrast, not only does the Dom has better armor than the Gouf, but it also has higher mobility and better firepower in the form of heavier weapons, which it can even fire while moving, something that units ranging from the MS-05B (Raketen Bazooka) to the MS-07B (Giant Bazooka) can't do, with games such as Zeonic Front outright depicting this as an advantage of the Dom over some older models. In fact, Ms Igloo 2's iconic White Ogre seems to go as far as suggesting that a Zaku type MS even needs to come to a full stop to fire the basic 280mm Zaku bazooka. Games like GBO2 take a more gameplay friendly approach, allowing most MS to fire bazooka while moving around, but to me this seems similar to the concept of "boosting around" even with some older OYW MS with very limited thrusting capabilities, which is another things not reflect in the anime
On the other hand, ground hovering variants of the Zaku II and Gouf, like the Desert Zaku from ZZ and the MS-07H from Zeta Gundam, would further seem to point towards machines which such system overcoming the recoil problems that their non-hovering counterparts face and which require them to come to a full stop. The case of the MS-06K also comes to mind, infamously limited by its recoil problems, with more recent iterations now rather showing it and its derived unit, the MS-06JK Zaku Half Cannon, using shoulder gatling guns, while the actual ballistic cannons are used by the ground hovering MS-09K-1 & MS-09K-2 Dom Cannons or the YMS-16M Xamel.
Factors like weight hardly matter to the Dom, even agility-wise: in ZZ we see how outdated MS-09G and MS-09H units outmaneuver Gryps era MS, even in close quarters, and showing even the capability to quickly doge to the sides to avoid direct beam shots. I would argue that the Dom's actual problem would be fighting in an area with many obstacles, like and urban zone, a rocky region (like the one outside Torrington) or the underground Jaburo. This reminds me of the AMX-101 Gallus J, which was machine said to be well suited for "urban combat", which would basically be the kind of machine well suited to the aforementioned scenarios where the Dom would have problems, and the kind of situations where a Gouf would likely be well more suited.
The opposite is true also, with the Gouf considered a bad design for ranged combat, which resulted in the production of the MS-07C-3, and the MS-07G-2 to address that very issue. This is precisely what we observe in Odessa in MS Igloo 2, with the lone Gouf Custom shown easily falling prey to ranged weapons and safely finished off from a distance. It's also worth noting that even the MS-07C-3 souped up 85mm finger machine guns are said to be good enough to destroy "lightly armored MS with ease", which immediately raises the question of exactly how good the standard Gouf's 75mm finger machine gun actually was.
We know that while the YMS-07A, YMS-07B and MS-07A well all completed before the 3rd landing operation, the 4 MS-07H units were converted from 3 YMS-07A and 1 YMS-07B, which makes me think that these weapons might have been specifically designed for AA combat, in other words, shooting down lightly armed fighters.
As a quick side note, the development of the MS-07H suggests that project was cancelled around June (I can go in more detail if you want, but basically 2 weeks after the capture of California Base, 8 weeks of testing and 10 more days of testing of the remaining MS-07H-4 before it blew up in mid test), and that as a result the MS-07B was produced instead, meant to work with the Dodai YS, as a sort of replacement. The MS-07H was likely seen as the solution to the loss of mobility problem in Zeon's Mobile Suits once they began fighting on Earth. It's also important to note that, not only the MS-07A should have been able to work with the 3 different types of Dodai (YS, II & and the recent GA from MSV-R), but also the MS-06G & the MS-06D, both of which have leg jet thrusters, so the Dodai wouldn't have been something exclusive to the MS-07B. And let's not forget the external thrusters that MS-06F2 in 0083 and the MS-14D from Unicorn use for high power jumps.
I do have concerns about their operational range though, since the Dodai YS is said to be frequently escorted by Dopps, as seen in the original TV series, and the later are said to have a very short range. The one seen in 0096 could have been modified after the OYW for greater range (for instance, disabling the missile launchers and reusing the space for more fuel, which is more or less the concept of the Dodai II from 08th Ms Team) or simply resupplied off screen. But I doubt they can fly long ranges, which is why Gaws that attacked Jaburo needed to carry the Goufs from California Base instead of being escorted by them in Dodais. In all fairness, even the MS-07H8 seems to have very limited range and it wouldn't be until the NRX-044 Asshimar that we see a MS sized machine (technically a MA) fly on its own power over long distances.
This post is long enough as is, so I'll just skim over other concerns and we can talk more about particular issues if you want:
-I frankly can't recall ever seeing a Dom running rather than hovering, not even units used by Zeon remnants. While I can admit the situation could happen, but I find more likely that the unit would be abandoned or adjusted to hover with any remaining thrusters. But for the sake of simplicity I think the only case to consider is a Dom's hovering speed versus a Zaku's/Gouf's running speed. Some game's depict older machines as capable of "boosting around" to move faster, but in the animation we don't this until 0087, with non-hovering MS running around and using their thrusters to jump around, not hover.
-It would seem that the YMS-09 was produced in limited quantities as a pre-production version of the Dom, a MS-09A, which entered production in July and which served as the basis of the YMS-09D, MS-09K-1 and MS-09K-2. The MSM-03 Gogg apparently also got a run of pre-production MSM-03-1 units in May, with the proper MSM-03 being deployed until July.
-Fixed weapons seem like a terrible criteria to me (specially without an equivalent criteria on other weapons), in part because on one hand we have cases unmentioned weapons, like the Gogg's head beams(?) that it uses underwater in the TV series or the anti-personnel S-Mine, called that in MS Igloo 2, but also seen at work with Topps' MS-05B in MS-08th MS Team, the assumption being that all Zeon machines (or at they very least all ground use Zakus) had such weapons all along. Also, they were the kind of non-compatible equipment that the UMP sought to eliminate, which is why we see that weapons like the MS-07B-3's 35mm gatling gun ending up also used by the other machines like Doug Schneid's MS-08TX, or the MS-06D arm mounted missile launcher use by the MS-09K series. The MS-07B seems to be the worst of the bunch, since both the MS-07H and MS-07C-5 seem to have the capacity to replace the ammo cartridge, and have two of these weapons, while the MS-07B seems to be restricted to the internal ammo and requires to be resupplied at a base once it runs out, which is another problem of fixed weapons (the Juagg's 3 large missile launchers always come to mind in this cases, seeming almost as single use weapons).
-Zeonic Front allows you to bring 3 team of 3 Doms each and that is the most devastating combination: you don't clutter MS, which was a weakness of the Zaku due to its low mobility, but rather fan them out and have them clear multiple targets along different routes for maximum efficiency.
-As for losses, figures given on the produced numbers point towards 200 MS-07B Goufs and 600 MS-09B Doms been produced during the war, and given their mobility, that would have allowed them to escape more easily, even on their own, and the fact that Zeon could convert them for space combat, likely meant that more survived the battles on Earth and were given priority to be sent back to space.
The correct answer is actually Zaku II
I so want to get a of both love the look of them
Love your videos! I appreciate you do this with your own voice and not a soulless ai and i can tell you’re also multilingual but please please work on your pronunciation.
I can perhaps suggest you the newer video then?
Team Gouf but the Dom was strictly better as a general production MS but the Gouf was a better ground combat specialist suit.
the Gouf had higher general mobility and agility, but the Dom was faster and more conducive to squad based raiding or hit and run actions.... which is actually much like how we see them used in series. Doms are almost never deployed as a single unit while Goufs were usually requisitioned for dedicated singular specialists to wreck havoc.
The Dom also actually had a better chance against the Gundam or Gundam derived MS since it's primary armament was actually capable of damaging or destroying them outright (as what happened in the LN version of the OYW)
In the long run though, we can see that the Dom design was long lasting, spawning numerous descendant designs and offshoots while the Gouf effectively led into the awesome but impractical (and unfortunately, dead end) Efreet designs.
I would choose base Dom over base Gouf all day because I really like the hover/sliding and there's also the Rick variant for space use. Gouf Custom is on another level tho.
I'd like to know more about the Sisquiede(Titans) or Monoeye Gundam. Is it comparable to any UC machine?
Imagine Dom in desert, a place where there's no obstacle.
Didn't they try to settle this question in one of Ark Performance's Gundam mangas?
My heart says Gouf. My brain says Dom.
If i want hit and run tactics, then the Dom would be the answer as shown by the Black Tri Star and even later Dwadge series. Their problem is that something that big and fast consumes too much energy and they offer no proper protection against beam. If i want a better all round unit for Ground warfare then it would be Gouf because rhe Gouf is just a better Zaku on ground with it's only problems being that tewrapons it can use are too limited and it's less flexible comapred to a Zaku II
Love your videos and your accent!
It's a relief to see that the accent is understandable
Within the context of 0079 as a story it feels like the Dom is intended to the better unit. Because it's supposed to be tragic and dire for Ramba Ral that he was he was denied the shipment of the new Doms. This is further enforced by the likes of the Gihren's Greed what if stories where Ramba Ral captures the Gundam and The White Base if he actually does get the Doms. And when we only see the Dom later in the story where they're piloted by the Black Tri Stars. It feels like we're supposed to feel like things have escalated as one of the one screen kills they DO get from the Dom is one that's incredibly impactful for Amur as a character.
Agreed, but we should stop putting the Gihren greed argument on a pedestal. The most common turn of events that happens when Ramba get the Doms is that yes he captures the White Base, Gundam, Guncannon and Guntank, but Amuro escape with the Core fighter. If you play federation side, Amuro willy then return with the Pixy and butcher the entirety of Ramba group making the earlier victory a non factor
Gouf = Guerilla tactics
Dom = Raid tactics
I somewhat disagree with being easily disarmed being a weakness, the disarmament generally happened because the weapon was targeted, in which case inbuilt weapons would still get wrecked, and if the disarmament was due to the weapon getting entangled, the suit is trapped and if it was due to the pilot dropping a not useful at the time weapon, it is dead weight.
I do agree, but having inbuilt weapons is a safety. If a Zaku fall In a crevasse and drop its 120mm rifle, it risks being unable to counter for example an ambushing GM. If a Gouf suffer the same fate, there is a certainty that the machinegun fingers and heat rod will still be available to counter the GM (unless it fall right on the arm and the weapons get crushed but that would be really bad luck)
Performance wise, the Dom. Cost wise, the Gouf. Material wise, the Gouf. Effectiveness to cost ratio? Pre- federation mass produced beam weapons, the Dom. Post, the Gouf. Versatility? The Gouf could be modified for long range combat and atmospheric flight, the Dom had a wider array of armaments and could be used in space, so Dom.
Considering Zeons limited resources, both materials and pilots, the best idea would have been to skip the Dom and work on the Gelgoog. Failing that, Zeon should have used what they had to improve the Gouf series instead of the Dom and it's variants. Not that Zeon has ever been known for making intelligent choices
this is a good analisis, i agree with you
You did leave the DOM II out. I can see why, though, as its frame is coming from the Dreissen instead.
I don't know if the generator output of the Dom is really "superior" if the Dom's running speed is still less than the Gouf. It uses all that extra output just to come in behind the Gouf. Technically, true, but operationally not so much
Well the Gouf is meant to run. The Dom to hover which recquires more energy to power. If the Dom was meant to run it would have been crafted with different kind of feets
Its not the machine. Its the pilot. TopGun 😎
No the Gouf is better ground unit but overall the DOM is better. That said very enjoyable video and amazing job.
If you're not equipped for space combat (Gouf) that is a non-starter. How can a mobile suit be considered as a replacement if you can't even use it for the most important theater of the war which is space? As a systems/manufacturing engineer I would upgrade a proven model like the Zaku II into the Zaku II kai and have it complement the dom. That's much cheaper than developing a brand new expensive model like the Gouf which can't even perform in space. This is what I believe they were trying to do in the united maintenance plan and you can see it later in the war when you saw mostly Zakus and doms in space. Love Gundam. It's what got me interested in engineering as a kid lol.
Yeah but the thing is that the Gouf and the Dom were created to replace the Zaku Ground Type, which itself cannot perform in space, unlike the Zaku II F Type or others Zakus. At the time Gouf and Dom were imagined, Zeon was solidly anchored to Earth to think it was the decisive remaining front. Being pushed back in space was not even considered in July/August UC79 where Federal MS were not yet introduced.
Technically Earth was the most important theatre of war, as most of the fighting was done there between federation tanks/artillery vs Zeon mobile suits. Once the federation drove Zeon into space, the Federation pretty much already won the war since Zeon's main purpose (taking over the Earth sphere) had failed. The remainder of the war was just to try and eliminate the Zeonic leadership to prevent a 2nd attempt in the future (after the fall of Odessa and the failure to take Jaburo, Zeon probably would have accepted a peace deal).So the Gouf could be considered important since Earth combat occurred for most of the war (even after Zeon pulled out, insurgent forces still used the left over ground weapons).
Gelgoog
Can you make a video about the galbaldy development line?
Sure !
@@gundamfacts much obliged mann!!
Team Dom. Speed and mobility all the day. Also Dom carries better weapons. I will always be team Z’Gok.
Hmmm interesting
i like the Dom Tropen
idk. when you compare the dom and gouf the amount of different doms to gouf ratio the dom is easy to slap on new shit and it works. as with the gouf its mostly the same but it does what it does best.
I love the goof more than the dom but I do think the dom is better
Did the Gouf Custom not count?
He was comparing base models unless he had to delve into variants.
@@gunplacustoms5444 But he went through a list of variants as part of the versatility, I was surprised to see that it wasn't mentioned.
@@nathanielarthurhardy419 the Gouf Custom is...a particular case because it proves nothing and everything. As the B-3 Type, it's actually very close to the reg Gouf (B-1) and even have nearly the same stats. Now it has better aerodynamics due to spare parts from the Gouf Flight Type series and revisited weapons but it doesnt excel in any particular environment (you might argue as it work very well in urban areas) and the weapons are less powerful that the B-1 but just more practical. I could have included it but it wasn't the most significative example, at least from my POV.
This is NO Zaku boy!
The Gelgoog: ._.
Honestly I prefer Doms
@manny022 "Switch from ground to space type within minutes and with few parts": well, you just described the MS-09F Dom Funf. In all likelihood, the MS-09B Dom is the result of making the YMS-09/MS-09A pre-production Dom share as many parts with the MS-09R. Some MS-09A units are produced as early as July at California Base, but it isn't until September that the MS-09B & MS-09R begin production in space. In the meantime, the MS-09A units serve as the basis for the YMS-09D Tropical Dom and both the MS-09K-1 & MS-09K-2 Dom Cannons. It's also worth nothing that in July 31st, the decision was taken to use the Zimmad Rick Dom instead of Zeonic's MS-06R-2 as Zeon's space replacement for the aging MS-06F, which meshes well with the above: the Zimmad production lines that had been producing MS-06F until that point are modified during August to produce MS-09B and MS-09R instead and starting September they began rolling out 200 machines a month.
Also, one thing that became evident during the OYW is that a good amphibious MS basically needs to be built from scratch for that particular environment, with machines like the Zaku Marine Type, Aqua GM and even the Gundam Marine Type notably underperforming in comparison. Instead the MS-09M Dom Mermaid (from MSV-R) uses of the Dom's hovering capabilities to make it glide over water more effectively. Games like Crossfire (PS3) already shoed the Dom capable of hovering over water, as long as it was already hovering before reaching the water surface and it doesn't stop in place, otherwise, the Dom would quickly sink like a brick and can't simply remerge to try again.
As for a full armor or weapons type, the former was hardly necessary as the Dom was already one of Zeon's most heavily armored MS, and the later did happened in the form of units like the Dom Cannon Type 1 & Type 2, the MS-09F/Br Dom Barrage and more recently, the Dom Gnomides from Code Fairy and GBO2, which already looks more like a MA or even a small land battleship. As an extra, the Gundam Side Stories game (PS3) game Guy Helmuth's Rick Dom II aLarge Heat Saber, meant for anti-ship combat, while the YMS-09J Dom High Speed Experimental Type from MSV-R showed the unit using a Heat Lancer, essentially a long Heat Hawk, like the one used by Doug Schneid in his Efreet (Gundam Side Stories) or more recently, similar to the Giant Heat Hawk used by Ortega's Zaku II during the Battle of Loum, in The Origin OVAs.
Hi, does anyone know what this mobile suit is???? 0:06
Ebihru S
@@gundamfacts thank you
Ramble Ral will be proud
Gouf my beloved
Yay, my MS-08 Efreet wins over both Gouf and Dom!
What I love about the Efreet is that the Gouf is a Tactical close range fighter: it wins close combat with its specialized arsenal. The Efreet? It's a mf power fighter, it will just hammer that heat sword (boosted by the absurd Thrust output it has) until the opponent breaks
@@gundamfacts Spot on. 🙂 Thank you for answering. Hopefully there will be a vid on Efreet as well 😉. Kind regards, subbed.
I don't see why the gouf was never developed into a space use machine in terms of marketability by bandai
Eheh, probably because without a space use Gouf, they had a reason to fit the Gyan and Gelgoog $$
@@gundamfacts
Smart.
Dom win btw, and its evolve and still being use until late U.C. anyway
I mean, the RF Gouf is also there, and earlier the Dreissen may represent the Dom line, but the Gallus is there to represent the Gouf's
The Gouf just looks better 😅
I mean there main armaments are swords in the far future so.
zaku was still better
Team Gouf
Dom 4 life
This is No zaku!😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭
i immediately didn't like the dom as soon as I saw it "farting" on screen
Team Gouf PERIOD