Is This The Future of Mid-Tier Mirrorless Right Here? LUMIX Leading All-Rounder Stakes? | Matt Irwin
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- Опубликовано: 14 июн 2024
- #nikon #canon #sony #panasonic
The Z6 III (?) will it be even more than what the S5 IIx is offering today?
In this analysis piece I look at what is being offered by all the camera companies in the Mid-Tier mirrorless catagory and discuss what I think is in store for Canon, Nikon and Sony moving forward.
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00:00 The future of mid-tier cameras
00:22 Panasonic S5 IIx the future of mid-tier?
00:45 Why I purchased it
02:12 Short history of Panasonic Full frame Mirrorless
03:10 Is this most important their of the market
03:40 Panasonic S5 IIx pricing
04:00 Looking at pricing of the mid-tier mirrorless systems
06:00 Panasonic S5 IIx 6K open gate !!!
07:40 Does any other camera at this price point shoot 6K open gate?
08:25 Exploring why the Panasonic S5 IIx is highly spec’ed
09:50 SSD recording Panasonic S5 IIx
11:00 Card slots?
11:36 Pro Res from Panasonic S5 IIx
12:00 Z 6III the next mid-tier camera?
13:36 WIFI streaming Panasonic S5 IIx
14:35 Wifi Camera to cloud Panasonic S5 IIx
14:50 Inbuilt active cooling Panasonic S5 IIx
15:55 Panasonic’s video heritage coming through strong
17:00 Panasonic S5 IIx ibis any good?
18:54 Pixel shift Panasonic S5 IIx
19:20 Hand Held pixel shift Panasonic S5 IIx
20:10 Motion correction in pixel shift !!!
20:42 Frame rates Panasonic S5 IIx
21:15 HDMI PORTS Panasonic S5 IIx
22:14 Anomorphic lenses and luts Panasonic S5 IIx
22:22 L mount alliance
23:33 Subject detection modes
24:50 Not moving away from from Nikon Z
25:08 Why Panasonic?
25:22 35mm - what is my experience with APS-C
26:03 My medium formats
26:30 Buidling a wider test kit
27:50 Z going nowhere
28:40 Long journey to be across multiple brands
29:20 Your turn to comment - is this the future of mid-tier?
30:20 D70 / 20
30:40 industry hug!
30:50 Why do we do this?
31:10 Bye !!
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I also have the S5IIx and it’s a fantastic camera for the price. Really sets a bar for other manufacturers to match
I’m with you on this one.
A great IBIS is key for people using manual focus lenses. It's so much easier to manually focus when the image is stabilized, more even when using longer focal ranges, 135mm, 200mm or so. That's what makes me want a S5II, but Panasonic isn't longer in my country. I hope they come back in the future
slightly off topic but, my D70 still gets out and about occasionally. it’s still does a fantastic job.
So does my D70s
Maybe you are a small channel in numbers, but you're a HUGE channel in value for time spent by viewer. Thank you, Matt. This video has the same kind of depth and value as your past videos about slipping a larger sensor in behind a Z lens mount. :) I hope you continue with the creative and mind-stretching content.
Great video about the future of mid-range cameras in in the FF.
I have a Nikon Z6ii and am very satisfied with it. I have doing great photopgraphy with it. It will. I am sure, serve me for a longtime to come. I do not feel the need to upgrade. I may add more lenses and accessories. Please keep your reviews and conversations coming in. They help one to keep uptodate with the happenings in the world of photography.
Thanks for introducing me to the Lumix, Matt. Looks like a contender in that space. Can't wait to see what the Z6III brings.
Hello Matt, You are so right, about it does tqke time to know a camera. This is one of the reason you/me/us should look very close at so many reviews. Some nice thoughts as always.
you are not small , a giant of real information
As always thanks for the conversation. I love the small channel vibe. Cheers
Really good overview and perspective.
A very good analogy Matt. I'm sure you are on the money here. Personally I'm not so interested in video capabilities but bought a Z8 for speed, autofocus, blackout free viewfinder and 48mp sensor. The video is a bonus. I still use my Z6ii for street, night photography etc..
The Lumix camera's have a wonderful feel and satisfying shutter sound that make them a joy to take out. Sigma makes some fantastic lenses for the L mount. I moved on from mine as it didn't make sense to have 3 systems but enjoyed the time with it.
I'm waiting to upgrade from Z 5 to a camera with Expeed 7 but Lumix seems very interesting piece of technology.
Another excellent video, great summary and thoughts. Thank you Matt.
Nice video Matt - great to see you getting into some other systems so that you can better understand the market and compare products - I think this is a great evolution for the channel, and as you have rightly pointed out will serve to better predict future products from Nikon (and other brands).
-PD
Yeah good work Matt.
The Lumix I would be interested in is the rumored full frame fixed lens rangefinder style camera to compete with the Fujifilm X100VI.
Great info Matt. As we advance the level of video in hybrid bodies, there is a need to overcome the heat generated by them. Being in South East Asia, the Z8 is being challenged when shooting in the high daily temps here. My FX30 is managing better due to the built in fan. The Lumix S5 IIX has caught my attention but, I can't find a demo version to try out, some places have a couple in stock and are not opening to let you try them out. I'm really hoping the Z6 III comes with active cooling and up to 6K RAW internally.
I bought my z6 II in Feb right after it came out. I've had it a little over 3 years now. I had a d750 before that with 2 lenses. I can't remember if it before I bought the d750 or after it died that I looked at the S1. What held me back from buying it was that it only had contrast detection and no phase detection. The auto focus was fine for stills but not much use for action. If they had put the phase detection in their first full frame bodies I just might have considered getting one. But I'm glad I bought the z6 II. I recently bought a z8 so I won't be buying a new camera any time soon. When it comes time to replace my z6 II I'll look into the z6 III. But that will be a while. Back in April I picked up a Canon AE-1 at a flea market for $85. I bought a battery and some film and tried it out. I bracketed my shots using 3 different shutter speeds to see how I needed to shoot it because film is different than digital. The photos came out good and I found out what I needed to know. It does have that Canon shutter wheeze. A few drops of oil will have it running like new.
Excellent video Matt, ambitious thoughts for all the brands that any low budget photographer would like to achieve.
Matt, I saw that you have the Vitrox 16mm f/1.8 lens mounted on the Nikon Z f, you plan to present a review of this lens on Nikon bodies soon, this lens has been available for Sony for a few months now. Thank you very much for your thoughts.
A phenomenon is that in case of Panasonic we commonly tend to ignore the... brand name "Lumix." Why don't we call the camera "a Lumix"? By compare, every Lexus could be called "a Toyota." They make Lexus, just line Panasonic makes the Lumix cameras. Good name, "L" for Leica alliance and the common L-Mount.
Good point Thomas. LUMIX for me from this day forth.
Matt, I currently have a Nikon FullFrame Z - I am seriously considering a Z APS-C when the new one may be released .... one thing I haven't seen online or on your channel is how my Full Frame Z lenses will work on a Z APS-C variant. That might be useful to your subscribers.
Camera Body is just one part of the equation equally important to that specify body is the lenses associated with its the pricing and quality. Your next video: all about lenses that will keep you busy and out of mischief for a while.
Matt, a useful check by YOU would be Z full frame on a Z APS-C camera - how can I use my existing Z FF Lenses on the Z APS-C cameras?
You’ve just pushed back the release date for the Ziii by 6 months !
lol.
I heard update made autofocus real competitive
My biggest obstacle to going for this is AF. My subjects professionally,(dogs in action) really requires great AF. The best DSLR's can handle this, and obviously the Canon and Sony mirrorless cameras + Z8 and Z9. I love the features but have heard the AF is closer to Z6ii, which I know is not good enough.
I would consider it if it came close to the AF of what I mentioned. With new firmware, how do you think it compares?
Anyone regularly trying to use AI-upscale or Super Resolution as a substitute for actual higher megapixel cameras are going to be sadly disappointed. It is somewhat passable on some images, looks downright terrible on others. I own both 33MP and 61MP cameras (and have owned 24MP and lower bodies as well). If you want/need higher resolution for printing/cropping/etc.. There is no substitute for actual native megapixels. And yes, the difference between 33 and 24 is noticeable. Though, with that said, 24mp is probably good enough for many, I understand not everyone needs/wants a higher mp camera. 🙂
Tempting. I'l. As a NIkon shooter I'll wait for the Z6III to come out before I make a decision. Shooting to a usb drive and full size hdmi are features I hope Nikon incorporates.
IMPORTANT MATTER - Hey Matt, this is an interesting topic that deserve some attention in my opinion. RED had a contract with Canon for their RF lenses (and I believe mount). Obviously everything is covered by contracts, patents, copyrights etc. The issue is that now Nikon owns RED. Where does this leave Canon? I mean, could potentially Nikon create an adaptor to adapt RF lenses to Nikon bodies (since the flange distance would allow that)? Do you have any info on that? (We know that Canon allows now third party lenses to make glass, but that is strictly limited to their APS-C format and not FF).
Im not a working pro. I am an enthusiast amateur who cut his teeth on black and white 35mm and medium format in the highschool darkroom in the late 70s to early 80s. Yes , i am a dinosaur.
I believe that i have shot less than 10 minutes of video in the last 15 years.
I currently shoot Canon DSLRs ,full frame and aps-c.
With retirement rapidly approaching, i am looking to move to mirrorless, mainly for the improved autofocus tracking for birds in flight . Canon is has ruled itself out due to the lack of 3rd party glass and the lack of low/reasonably priced used lenses . To a slightly lesser extent , Nikon is in the same boat.
I am seriously looking to Sony. A used A9 , A7iii , or an A7Riv , make up my current short list.
I'd be more keen on this camera if I did video. Frankly; I've been thinking the Z6ii will NOT be traded in - I do like the form factor (compared to the Z8 & 9). Also waiting now for the Fuji X-pro 4 - which will likely be next year now. sigh
I wonder if the Z6iii will compete well in this market. I won’t be purchasing one as I just got myself a Z8 for my birthday a few days ago. I do think the price to performance of the Z6iii will make or break its success at this price point.
Interesting, but still, I never use video.
There are only going to be more and more mirrorless cameras out there ~ Do we have to jump in early?
Z9 $300 S52 $300
No not early. It’ll be a long before they are that price. A 17 year old D3 is still not that cheap here.
I use Sigma L mount lenses on my Leica. Without a shadow of doubt they are superb, no need to spend mega bucks on Leica lenses.
onything they need is 50mpx version of s5ss
I have the S5 II , while it's a great camera and very feature packed , I don't like it ,
Not sure why , but it ends up sitting on the shelf 90% of the times , I need to force myself to pick it up.
I am on the fence selling it... My z9 is the work horse , but I reach for the ZF when I don't want to take the Z9.
I bought the S5 II as Video centric camera , but I just end up flicking either the Z9 or ZF to video ... my poor S5II
As an A7IV user, I think you’ve undersold it significantly. The resolution is more significant and the image quality is definitely superior to the other sensors. The slow read out is an issue, but you’re not really shooting with the electronic shutter of the other cameras either.
The high ISO performance is also great.
A lot of what I was talking about was video related. Rolling shutter is an issue there. And as for 33MP. No open gate on the Sony.
i think the point is the other sensors are already quite slow, at the end of usable.
the sony sensor read modes are too limited
Subject detection modes don't mean much , they are no information about actual AF performance. Tests of the S5ii with the new firmware don't show it as a great performer. I use the A7iv and the A6700 . The A6700 is better for subject recognition , both are excellent for tracking in the EVF , but both aren't reliable enough for sports . The overall hit rate depends very much on available light, especially for the A6700 . Sometimes they fail on one subject , which is very annoying when it's the race winner. Sony seems to do well with stacked sensors, but their algorithms are not as good as Canon's for slow sensors (A6700/R7 tests by the Northrups). I hope the next generation has a 33 MP stacked sensor. Depending on the competition, I may be gone before it's released .
Let me comment on this, Nikon needs to do a better job of marketing their video features. When Sony launches a camera, they talk about all the things to showcase the features of the camera, their manual is more in depth as far as how to use the features and how to set things up, Nikon should do the same. As an example, the eVR on the Z8 works very well however, the manual doesn't explain how to setup the camera to get the best performance. This led to practically every video that was out on the launch of the camera to say it isn't working as the competition. in the manual, there is no info on the eVR use in video, it sends you back to the photo menu, that doesn't provide any useful info on video use. We can only hope Nikon will do a better job or marketing the Z6 III and that they will produce a feature packed device like the Z8 that will become the leader in its price point.
I'm a photographer, not a videographer. I just want a camera body that can help me better achieve my artistic vision for wildlife and landscape photography. From my perspective the only advantage mirrorless has over dslr is the autofocus system. And unless I'm shooting birds in flight, that advantage falls away.
I agree..I do not need video and I have found that the AF in mirrorless cameras is arguably not as good as my D500
Il faut au minimum un capteur stacked pour photographier des oiseaux en vol sur des Mirrorless avec du confort car il n'y aura pas de blackout dans le viseur électronique (EVF)
Parcontre les prix sont encore trop élevés à mon goût
Stacked sensor is a slight aid. The X-H2S is stacked, but with no blackout you will be able to see all the slightly out of focus photos you take in real time. I just sold mine for this reason.
Interesting video about Panasonic, but I'm looking forward to seeing how you will accept a future Nikon camera with a 33 megapixel sensor (from Sony), when you think there is basically no need for that sensor.
If pixelshift is important to you because you only have a 24 megapixel sensor, but remember it's bad with subjects that move, so maybe more pixels isn't so bad after all, or have I misunderstood your point?
Furthermore, Panasonic's autofocus is not at all in the same league as what you get with the other three, and it is a dealbreaker in 2024 for some who run a one man show.
In addition, I have tried both the Nikon Z8 and the Sony A7RV and the autofocus is a little bit better with the Sony, but maybe not something that matters in daily work. But how are you going to defend the autofocus in the next top model from Nikon when you don't acknowledge improvements? But maybe a little better autofocus means nothing to you the next time Nikon comes out with a top model, and then of course I understand you, because I also think that maybe we don't need better autofocus anymore!
Jess. Relax. You know I’m not a birder or sports photographer. I have never chased bleeding edge focus. As for the boxes I am talking about in this video, I say these cameras do it. I don’t talk about speed. AF has become a very tiring subject in 2024. 99% of people will be very happy with any modern focus system from the latest processors from each brand. The real world is very different from trying to make something break.
I've owned both the A7R V and the Z8, I traded the A7R V for the Z8 as I found the Z8's AF to be on par and a bit better in some scenarios. Sony has a trick feature, Pre AF, that allows the camera to start focusing prior to touching the shutter button, which in essence gets you to the subject faster. When I tested the A7R V before purchasing it, I didn't see fantastic AF as people talked about Sony having, until the sales person activated that feature. The Z8 is the better camera between the 2 as it offers more features and is a much more rounded camera for the price point. If Nikon adds a 33 MP sensor to the Z6 III, it won't be the one from Sony Imaging's A7 IV, it will be something of their own design that is manufactured by Sony Semiconductor for Nikon. While having 33MP, the A7 IV's sensor was limited in its video features to be similar and a bit less than what the Z6/ 6II provided. Both do 4K60 in crop mode however, the Z6/6 II allows for ProRes and Blacmagic RAW externally. While Nikon touted it's video creds when those launched, most Nikon shooters were photo people and not many in the price point cared about those features as they do now. The Zf has improved AF which I find to be somewhat snappier than the Z8 when it launched but, since the latest FW 2.0 for Z8, it seemed to also have been improved. I haven't tested a Zf since then to compare. In the grand scheme, people are going to choose what is better for their use. I have a Sony FX30 and the Z8 and am thinking about a Panasonic S5 IIX or maybe the S1H II, if the Z6 III doesn't come with what I want, I may add a Panasonic.
@@waynerm002 You're probably hit by G.A.S., but it's cool that you can 👍When Nikon gets Sony's 33 megapixel sensor it is still a Sony sensor, but of course Nikon will adjusted it like everyone else. However, I do not completely agree that 24 megapixels is the best sweet spot as Matt Irwin believes, and therefore I also think it is a bit of a shame that the Sony A9III only has 24 megapixels. I don't agree about the autofocus, but it's perfectly fine that you prefer Nikon's cameras!
@@JessDemant It could be that manufacturers are keeping to that resolution due as a “sweet spot” for a price point, as they work on developing better sensors or processors to take advantage of where they want to go with devices in the future. Most people don’t need more than the 24 MP, most of us aren’t printing our work these days and there is still limit for posting online. Those that need more will get the cameras that will afford them the improved quality from larger sensors.
I can’t believe that 8 TB SSD isn’t a base standard in machines at this point, I felt we would be looking at a 32 TB SSD drive as the $1000 upgrade that’s out of reach for most. While SSD speeds are getting faster, the size isn’t getting much bigger.
@@waynerm002 You have some good arguments, but regarding pixels, I personally think that the 33 megapixels just give my photography the extra that makes it my sweet spot 🙂
I am getting more and more sure that Nikon Z6iii wil be launched with a 24 MP New sensor as it will be similar or the specs will be similar to Panasonic.