This happens every so many decades or so. It’ll play out and later down the road the NCAA will prolly implode and things will change again. Conferences have always been shifting tho
I live in Chicago as a PSU alum. Northwestern is the B1G's academic crown jewel and they're not going anywhere. If you don't know the power of Northwestern then you don't know their alums. They raised over $6 billion in a simple capital call to supporters. You should also look at how they win national research funding by forming consortiums with schools like Illinois, Wisconsin, and U. Chicago. And no way will ND want to join with Northwestern leaving. The entire conference benefits from sharing research with Northwestern. And yes, as a PSU alum, the B1G would not have any legal standing to kick out Northwestern based on "hazing" when PSU wasn't kicked out for a coach raping children in the athletic facilities. You need actual precedent to force a university to lose hundreds of millions over time.
@@GrizrazRex The B1G is headquartered here for God sakes. LOL! If/when the Bears get their domed stadium, they can also start playing bowl games here including the B1G championship. And yes, I hate hearing "no one watched Rutgers games." It's not about Rutgers fans and alums. It's about having access to the TV market so the B1G Network has 24/7/365 day programming. There are thousands of B1G alums who live in the NYC area who still want to watch their teams play. The last time I checked, basketball and women's volleyball is played more than football. So that's more opportunities for the B1G Network to sell commercial space to advertisers. Same thing in Chicago which has the largest concentration of B1G alums. Northwestern being in the B1G allows me to go to the PSU game in Chicago at the end of September which is a huge cost savings on my time and pockets. The B1G signed the richest TV deal in conference history despite having a lesser quality product than the SEC. The formula is clearly working so why mess it up because the 2 games every 4 years that Ohio State may have to play Northwestern or Rutgers?
But Joel Klatt, with Fox has had podcasts saying just that. The Northwesterns and Rutgers of the conference are in borrowed time and will get the old heave hoe. Surely he knows what’s what since he’s a Fox analyst on the B1G conference. LOL. Where do they find these guys?!
@@jansonroberts2616 Joel Klatt? My niece is a supervisor at a local McDonald's. Want to know the next item on McDonald's menu? 😂 You might want to read what happened in 1989 the last time Northwestern felt threatened. The only reason PSU is in the B1G is because of them and Wisconsin. I'm pretty sure PSU is ready to return the favor.
The annual value of the ACC's TV contract is NOT $40 million per year closer to $17-24 million (you included ACC's incentive payouts). 2:00 You didn't include incentives for the Big 12, end-of-year revenue distribution with sponsors, etc. The Big 12 distributed about $42-45 million with incentives last year (on its OLD contract), whereas the ACC distributed about $38-39 million in incentives per year. The Big 12's payout is higher than the ACC's just based on the old TV deal. With the NEW Big 12 Tv deal, incentives and sponsors (playoffs, etc.), the Big 12's new TV contract is predicted to boost its earnings to closer to $50 million per school. The ACC's is at a $40 million threshold for the most part limited to that cap. P4 average breakdown allocation with sponsor/incentive payments for '22: Big Ten: $58.8 million dollars SEC: $49.9m Big 12: $42m-$44.9m ACC: $39.4m Source Front Office Sports
@@timmyjohnson2099 I think FSU realizes the fact Orlando is a bigger market and good recruiting hot spot and will be making p4 money and they're terrified in the long run
I think the Big10 also values Rutgers for having its teams play games against them in the NYC area. It gives them exposure which can help with recruiting.
I got Rutgers for NYC but like Maryland has never made sense to me, you could've gotten a Virginia, a UConn, a Syracuse, those schools give you bigger markets, maybe for Baltimore ???
@@yorkqueer Maryland plays in College Park which is very close to Washington DC. So obviously they were trying to lock up the DC market. I'm not sure it made sense, but that's why they did it.
It is lazy reporting and greedy to consider kicking a team out of a conference based on football performance, especially in the BIG Ten. If you kick out the bottom teams.....somebody else will move to the bottom. You can never have all winning teams in a conference. Some teams will always have significant losses. Imagine this year if Ohio State/Michigan each went 8-1 and Penn State/Wisconsin went 7-2 in conference games. That would cause 30 losses in conference just from 4 teams! Somebody has to lose! As for Rutgers, they haven't had many years getting a full revenue distribution to get on equal footing in facilities with traditional powers. Also if Rutgers ever starts winning more recruiting battles in New Jersey, they could rise in football, and could over take your favorite team in the pecking order. Maybe in the future Rutgers will rise above Iowa or Wisconsin after a string of bad coaching and recruiting years.....are you going to kick them out in the future for bad football performance? There are also numerous non football reasons for not kicking anyone out that should be mentioned.
This is a point rarely made for some reason. "Kicking out" the bottom teams just moves other teams to the bottom. Should the Big 10 and SEC just be Michigan and Ohio State and Alabama and Georgia?
Great point. Kick out NW, then someone else like Illinois or Indiana will take their place as the B1G punching bag. Then are those schools next on the relegation merry go round?
This whole thing stems from FSU (ACC) making less than UCF (Big12). The ACC makes less and will make considerably less than the BIG12 in the coming years. I have no idea why you would think the ACC makes more than the BIG 12
He counted the full revenue distribution of incentives (playoffs, sponsors etc) for ACC and didn't count Big 12's incetive distribution. You're correct ACC's TV contract is less at around $20-25 million per team. Big 12 made more off incentives last year than ACC.
@@BrownieCFB I know that article and again you're going off of revenue distribution of incentives. The article even states the next sentence it is expected ACC will finish fourth amongst P5 schools, behind Big 12. We're talking in terms of TV contract alone. NOT revenue incentive distribution. If it was competitive than Clemson and FSU administration wouldn't be openly admitting its behind the other three conferences.
KU fan here, would love mizzou to come on back home to the big 12. Obviously not having the SEC money would suck but in terms of national relevance I think their brand would rebound in football and especially basketball.
Mizzou fan here. The SEC has made us feel like a part of the SEC. I never wanted Mizzou to leave the Big Xll, but I was relieved to get away from Texas. I would love for Mizzou to come home to the Big Xll. We're a Midwest school. Keep your fingers crossed. Vaughn
Mizzou is the one school that started all this conference jumping. I for one do not feel sorry for them. They did not like the Big 12 and started the departure of Nebraska, Colorado, and ATM.
I do not see relegation as it is used in European soccer would work in college football. The schools will never agree to be kicked out of the big-money media deals if they have a bad couple of seasons. I think what's more likely to happen is once all the realignment is over and 15-20 years down the road the broadcasters will probably push for a super league and the weak programs will be left out of the new arrangement. Being weaker in this context does not necessarily mean just poor on-field performance but in terms of attendance, ratings, brand recognition, and on-field performance. To me, that seems to be the logical progression of realignment. Programs like Rutgers, Northwestern, Vanderbilt, and others just do not have the pull to remain if it goes that way. I do think having football programs completely separate themselves from other sports may also be coming. Do I want any kind of college football super league to happen? Hell NO. However, I think its a possibility.
Rutgers is the only team in the NYC market of 7.4 million TV sets. South Jersey is at least another 1.5 million, so the total is around 9 million TV sets. What other schools have a market of 9 million TV sets and no other team in the market? Zero. The $7 to $8 billion dollar contracts the B1G just entered are predicated on the league going from NYC to Chicago to LA, per the TV execs who are writing huge checks. There is no other team anywhere close to the NYC market. In case you are wondering, Syracuse in 250 miles from NYC and UConn about 150. Neither are anywhere near the NYC market, while RU is 20 miles from midtown Manhattan. Kick Rutgers out and perhaps lose billions of dollars. Makes sense to me. Northwestern is Chicago. Northwestern and Vandy are the best academic schools in their conferences. That matters to the B1G, and presumably to the SEC.
Speak for yourself. I'm an SEC guy and graduated from an SEC school. Vanderbilt gives us academics and baseball. Academics really don't matter anymore. My school is one of the ones that has one national championships, and it's not going to be long before everyone starts asking why are we giving schools like Vanderbilt and Missouri the same amount of money, when we're the ones making it all? I don't want to kick them out but I have already heard fans asking why do we have to share what we make with Miss St and Vandy for example. Not to pick on those teams, but pretty soon the big dogs are going to start pulling a Florida state and demanding more of a share in the big two conferences from the teams simply riding coattails of the big dogs.
@@GR-bn3xj LOL. You agreed to the terms when Mizzou joined. Why did you do that if you're so great and deserving of so much more? Too late to demand more now. Plus, why do you care if your team is winning championships?
Back in the 1980s, it wasn’t uncommon for independent football schools to have all of their other sports (including basketball) compete in non-football conferences, like Penn St. & Temple (Atlantic 10), Florida St & Louisville (Metro), Syracuse & Boston College (Big East). I think it would make more sense for the football programs to be in their own conferences that maximize TV revenue, but have the rest of the sports compete in regionally based leagues, like the traditional conferences we had prior to the realignment craze that started in the 1990s. It would shorten road trip swings & save every school $$$$. Isn’t that what everyone wants?
When the schools realize how much money their non-revenue sports (volleyball, softball, water polo, etc.) are squandering on cross country road trips, they are going to start looking for ways to save money on those sports.
@@SamWesting and immediately lose donations, but more importantly probably violate Title IX. There may be a little trimming around the edges, but nothing major will happen. Too dangerous for the schools
Title IX is about offering equal number of scholarships to men & women, not equal amount of air travel miles. My school, U. of Hawaii, has the football team playing in the Mountain West, while women’s teams play in the Big West. Dude, you’ve got a lot to learn about the subject.
@@SamWesting You may be a lawyer or not. I am and I have some familiarity with Title IX, so maybe you are the one who needs to study up. I am afraid that you are not correct. Title IX is much broader than that. What is the source of your knowledge that makes you so totally certain of your position? Here is a paragraph from an NCAA website: Other benefits: Title IX requires the equal treatment of female and male student-athletes in the provisions of: (a) equipment and supplies; (b) scheduling of games and practice times; (c) travel and daily allowance/per diem; (d) access to tutoring; (e) coaching, (f) locker rooms, practice and competitive facilities; (g) medical and training facilities and services; (h) housing and dining facilities and services; (i) publicity and promotions; (j) support services and (k) recruitment of student-athletes. www.ncaa.org/sports/2014/1/27/title-ix-frequently-asked-questions.aspx If a school decided to favor male students in even minor ways, they would be in Federal Court in a heartbeat and the Feds would be visiting to ensure compliance. Do some research before you are so convinced that you are correct.
The Big Ten is not demoting or otherwise kicking out teams. Northwestern has rivalry games. Others have rivalry games. And certainly it takes someone far removed from the Big Ten tradition and schools to post such nonsense.
I don’t believe that the SEC needs to change anything and all the ACC needs to do is make better deals because between the SEC and ACC they have won all but 1 national championship of the last 17 titles with the only exception being a fluke year for Ohio state. The only non SEC powerhouse in the last twenty year is USC other than that it’s been the SEC show with a few appearances by FSU and Clemson but the south has absolutely dominated the rest of the country in College Football period
@@observer46-vh5bm I took a look at the ACC teams that are playing SEC teams other than the normal rivalries as a possible way to determine which teams are trying to get in the SEC kinda like what Texas and Oklahoma did and what I came up with is Virginia North Carolina Georgia Tech FSU and Miami now I’m not saying that means anything necessarily but it could and as far as Clemson goes they are a natural fit in the SEC and Georgia Tech used to be in conference and have tried to get back in a couple of times
@@rodneydockins3485 Georgia Tech has problems. According to the Atlanta Journal Constitution, GaTech is fifth in popularity in Atlanta, its home city. First was UGa, the Alabama, Auburn and another school in that order. If a team is that low in its home city, no bigger conference will take them.
@@observer46-vh5bm you maybe right but they have history look how bad Alabama was before Saban got there they could make a comeback if they do they shoot way up that list
ACC's Tv deal isn't good lol. If that was the case teams wouldn't want to jump. ACC has somewhere around a 20 mil payout per team. That 40 million was for payouts for other revenue too like playoffs, basketball. Big 12 new TV deal is higher and you didn't include their other revenue for playoffs, basketball. Big 12 distributed more than ACC last year with playoffs, basketball and other revenue.
"teams wouldn't want to jump" The schools who want to jump want to jump to the Big Ten and SEC specifically because of how much more those conferences are making. If the Big 12 was truly making so much more than the ACC then there would have been no trouble finding an 8th school to dissolve the league back in the spring before the Big 12 absorbed the Pac 12 defections
I don’t think the conferences can kick anyone out due to litigation. I’m sure the lawyers would love it as the legal fees would be close to the amount of actual damages the schools kicked out would have. The trial would probably be in the state of the school getting relegated
No not really. The difference is NW would be kicked out because they aren’t wanted-PSU is absolutely wanted, and so there’s no desire by the B1G to kick out PSU.
Nobody's being kicked our of the Big Ten for their won-loss football record with the conference 's academic and research consortium. Purdue was a founding member in 1895; I believe Northwestern was too. Screw "brands" and TV ratings; anyone who believes this absurdity doesn't understand how college athletics works.
But they should! The B1G would be better if we didn’t have USC, UCLA, Washington, Oregon, Rutgers, Maryland and Nebraska who are the worst moves in realignment history next to everything from 2011 till now!
I think networks has to remember the big games are not only matchups…but the matchups have to have good records in Oct and Nov for those games to matter. The smaller schools are needed to beef up their records. Also for the Big 12 there is a “Blue Blood” school now but one one or two programs will dominate the conference and if they win in playoffs like TCU, the conference will be in a better place when it renegotiate its contract.
In 2 weeks Rutgers will have the number 1 2024 men’s basketball recruiting class in the country( when Dillon Harper signs). Football is not that far behind. Their defense this year should be top 5 in big ten .
How come no discussion about Indiana or Purdue? Why ONLY hate for Rutgers? Indiana finished last in the East division last year, not Rutgers. Also, Big Ten Network revenue went up 300% only after the addition of Rutgers (and Maryland). It wasn't about ratings, it was about cable boxes in the most densely populated area in the country. All that BTN revenue allowed the Big Ten to attract the best teams from other conferences to join.
@@vernonsheldon-witter1225 Northwestern has been there for a long time as well. If it's about football performance, then that will apply across the board. History doesn't matter, and if you don't believe me, you should talk to someone from the Pac-12.
Northwestern brings the Chicago media market. With the Big 10 having New York (Rutgers) Los Angeles both USC and UCLA it’s more “virtual eyes watching “ and is used for negotiating purposes. It’s all about the $$$$ these days. Look at the PAC12 having a crappy streaming only platform.
Northwestern isn't going anywhere. Period. They are an original member of the conference whose academics/research tops all of the other schools in the B1G. Their endowment is almost $15 billion, second only to Michigan ($17b). Third is Ohio State at $7b You are correct in that the football team has been down in the last couple of years, but won the division in 2018 and 2020 (and their bowl games that year). If you want to dismiss the Big Ten as weak, then what does that say about all of the other teams in the west? Nebraska has been forever bad. Illinois and Purdue have been bad for awhile and just now are on the rise. It seems like the west was where any team could be good one year and bad the next. The hazing situation is bad, no doubt. Is that a reason to kick them out? If so, then Penn State is the poster child of bad things. They're still playing sports. NW is planning to build a new stadium that should be the envy of most teams. It's not going to hold 100K like Michigan or Ohio, but it will be modern. NW is the smallest of the B1G schools. And how would relegation really work anyway? Because you are bad at football, all of your other sports teams are kicked out of the conference too? NW football may have been bad in the past three years, but several of the non-revenue sports teams do quite well. How would it work if football is bad but basketball is good (not that NW basketball is much better, but the point remains for any school.) Plus the HQ for B1G is Chicago and kicking out the university that it can practically call it home is not a good look.
The Big Time wouldn't kick out Northwestern because it would be afraid of losing the Chicago market. Plus they are very good at all the sports nobody cares about like Notre Dame which they are trying to recruit.
As an Ohio State fan I'm 100% behind kicking Northwestern out of the conference. The rest of the B1G is subsidizing their athletic department, and for what? No one gets excited when they see Northwestern on the schedule in the revenue sports. They're a drain on the rest of the conference and replacing them with almost any other team in the P5 would be an upgrade. I'm all for replacing Indiana or Purdue while we're at it. The B1G doesn't need 2 schools in Indiana, that state doesn't produce enough high school talent to sustain 3 ( counting Notre Dame) P5 schools, and both schools have been pretty terrible in football historically speaking. Cutting the dead weight in this conference is the only way the B1G can continue to keep up with the SEC in revenue, especially after the SEC will most likely add FSU, Clemson UNC etc.
No one is jumping from the ACC this round. Only 2 days left to file. I think the plan to get out is not finalized at this time and the money isn’t there. I am also not sure there is a sure fire landing spot for the 2024 season. 😢
Your commentary shows an absolute lack of understanding of economics and of college sports. Either learn about it, or do not comment on it. Very sad. No college could ever deal with relegation. These are not professional soccer teams, they are university teams that hire coaches, build facilities, etc., based entirely on their expectation of future income. How could any school facing possible relegation hire coaches, upgrade stadiums, etc., or pay for projects to which they have committed? It would be the basis of total financial destruction for the sports at that university and almost certainly invite Congressional intervention. It would be a precipitous disaster for Title IX as any number of women's sports would be cut as well as men's sports. Try and explain in court or before Congress why that happened and the sudden loss of scholarships for all of those players, many of whom are disadvantaged minorities. Good luck with that. As an attorney, I can tell you that the litigation would be crippling to the league that tried it. I would suggest that every single player who lost a scholarship because of relegation would have a direct cause of action against the league for loss of future earning due to failure to be able to afford to graduate without the athletic scholarship. We are talking about the risk of at least many hundreds of millions of dollars, or more, in damages to the league. The $7 to $8 billion dollar B1G contracts are based on the national footprint from NYC to Chicago to LA, per the TV executives. Rutgers is 20 miles from Manhattan. Funny you think that being the only school in the NYC market is not important, but the people putting out billions of dollars disagree with you. Should I believe you or the people signing the huge checks? As others have pointed out, Northwestern, was a charter member of the predecessor to the B1G about 140 years ago, and is the Chicago in NYC to Chicago to LA. So what is a 140 year relationship worth? Not much to you it appears. By the way, do you know anything at all about the B1G Academic Alliance, which actually involves far more money than sports generate. It appears not. The B1G schools collaborate on huge research projects. As one example the NJ Cancer Institute in New Brunswick is part to Rutgers. Right now there is a huge cancer research project being done by the NJ Cancer Institute and four or five other B1G universities. The research is far more than any one institution could handle.
Here an example of why relegation will never happen, Down in Tuscaloosa, we had some very lean years in the 90s and were down right awful for most of the time between 2000-2007. Nobody would be able to convince Mike Slive & Greg Sankey to relegate ALABAMA in 2005.....nobody. And if you don't end up in a situation like that, then relegation is nearly pointless cause you'll just be swapping bottom feeders every couple years.
Few people outside Chicago and the B1G probably realize Northwestern and Rutgers exists. I'm not even sure 50% of the people that live in NYC knows Rutgers still has a football team. These teams are stealing money. This is about football and cash, not academics.
@@fadercreek The fact that the ACC rejected the Pac-12 schools rumored for expansion says the University Presidents in the conference make the final call, not athletic directors.
It should happen! These schools are nothing but dead weight and the university presidents and conference commissioners are ruining college football as we know it! Especially that no good Kevin Warren
Here's something that most people forget about. You have to have schools that are the weak ones. If you don't then your record will suffer. Schools like Alabama and Georgia could conceivably have 2 or 3 losses in a season. That's good in a way because teams like LSU, Tennessee, A&M and Mississippi are going to be the spoilers of the SEC. There's going to be spoilers in the Big 10 also. The more good teams that enter another conference the more havoc top to bottom. Your going to have years when a historic mid level teams are going to finish in last place in their conference. Mid level teams will upset top flight schools as well and upset the apple cart. 🍎 😢 Think about it. I love your shows. Vaughn
There's always going to be lower tier teams in every conference, but they don't have to be at the level of a Northwestern. They don't belong in one of the P2 conferences by any metric. I doubt very seriously that they'd be invited to join even the Big 12 or ACC, even if the ACC lost all of their top brands.
10:43 If football tv deals are the only way to fund Olympic sports, then how does Gonzaga sponsor their sports? What about the Big east, Big west and all the other non football conferences. How do they pay for their sports?
By having less sports. Gonzaga has a total of 16 varsity teams (eight men’s, eight women’s) while the University of Minnesota has 25 (12 men’s, 13 women’s)
@@Alohanate2004 Schools without lucrative TV deals fund their athletic programs mostly with money from corporate sponsors and private donations(boosters).
Vanderbilt was one of the SEC's founding members. The Ivy League would never accept a Southern school, it has always been and always will be the same eight schools.
You want to get rid of Rutgers? Great you replace the $150 to $180 million they help generate in cable subscriptions annually for the B1G Network local deal.
we've seen teams be kicked out of P5 conferences before (Temple in the Big East) but who would they kick out? NW is very important and founded the conference, maybe you get rid of a Maryland or Rutgers?? doubt Vandy as a founding member will be kicked out of the SEC only team I could see is Missouri who just makes 0 sense in everyway
The problem with relegation is there's a lot more involved in the TV deals than how good the teams are. The B1G'S TV deal is so good because of the major markets they're in. Northwestern may not be great, but it gives the B1G the Chicago market. If they kicked anyone for football it would be schools where they have multiple teams to cover the market. So think Indiana/Purdue or Michigan/Michigan State. The SEC could kick Vanderbilt and add Memphis to get basically the same market coverage.
Vanderbilt was a founding team of the SEC and with high academic standards an a private University with an emphasis on education they are not leaving the SEC!! Memphis will never be in the SEC so you can give up that dream!! Vanderbilt is University of Tennessee!!
@@siouxfan1716 and? Northwestern was a founding member of the B1G, but that does not stop people from talking about kicking them. In fact I mentioned 4 other B1G schools in this comment 3 of which are founding members and you said nothing of them so I guess that doesn't matter. The only reason I mentioned Memphis is because they occupy the same media market as Vandy so from a media perspective the SEC would not lose a media market by kicking Vandy and adding Memphis. I do not care about Memphis or the SEC for that matter so no it's not a dream to have Memphis in the SEC.
Big 10 Kickout: Nebraska (doesn’t provide a major media market and has underperformed) SEC Kickout: Vanderbilt (Can secure Nashville market without them and only baseball is good) ACC Kickout: No One BIG 12 Kickout: Iowa State (no major media market only good at wrestling) or WVU (no major market, underperformers)
You can't kick Northwestern out for hazing in the football program. Then you'd have to kick out Penn State for the Jerry Sandusky scandal 12 years ago.
Since they've basically ruined what college football is then they should adopt that system of demoting and promoting because conference association no longer matters in anyway, it's gone. My S..E..C chants wasted now
No one is leaving the ACC for at least 5 years. Even after that, not going to happen. THERE IS A VALID CONTRACT. By the way, its 8/16 and that is Happy FSU Is Still In the ACC Day! No one is kicking out NW or Vandy.
You people are ignorant. Since joining the B1G in 2014, Maryland has won 49 conference titles, a total exceeded by only Ohio State and Michigan. (Expansion partner Rutgers has won but three.) Athletic performance goes beyond football and men's basketball, whether you like it or not. College Park belongs.
Has the Rose Bowl said anything yet about the Pac12? If they just add teams, which is the simplest scenario, what does the Rose do with that auto bid? Are they gonna be ok with current MW/AAC schools facing off against the BIG10 team? Bowls have already lost their prestige but last year’s Rose Bowl is basically what many future ones could look like…kind of looking like the Fiesta Bowl
I'm all for a little fun thinking about promotion/relegation in college football... But, anyone taking this seriously shows they don't understand how things work in the real word. Besides the fact college presidents would never vote to kick anyone out (they would fear it could happen to them down the road) - the reality is the B1G revenue has increased 450% since the day Rutgers entered the league. No, Rutgers wasn't the sole reason for it-- but they began the road to massive paydays due to geography. And, while they may not play great on the field all the time - they certainly have earned their way in via the bank...
SMU has serious problems within DFW itself with small fanbase, almost total lack of support in North Texas, and poor attendance at athletics. We would have taken them in 1996 if we wanted them. Hard no. Memphis has applied more than once for Big 12 membership but has been rejected by our Presidents/Chancellors each time, I don't see that changing, hard no on Memphis. Boise was evaluated and rejected by the University Presidents- hard no on Boise. AFA might be the only possible service academy addition because their location is local to the majority of our universities and similar facilities. But I do not see this happening either.
Northwestern ain't going nowhere. In fact nobody in the Big 10 is budging. That is crazy talk. In reality Sranford Vanderbilt Duke, Notre Dame amd Northwestern would be in the same conference but we don'y live in a perfect world. We live in a money world. .
Not anymore. Missouri has proven itself a pain in the ass. They were trying to leave the Big 8 for the Big 10 long before the Big 12 was formed. They are greedy and juvenile and not worth the effort. Nebraska would make a preferable fit.
If everything you talk about with Northwestern was so much, then Stanford is even better, but yet they did not get invited into the big 10…think about that!
you plebes dont get that the bond of the AAU research designation is more important to the Big 10 than anything...and I mean anything. Nobody in the Big 10 is kicking out or relegating nobody. And Northwestern is in CHICAGO. LET ME SAY IT AGAIN...CHICAGO. The 3rd largest tv market in the country. So this talk is stupid...itll happen in the SEC before it ever happens in the Big 10.
The B1G need to send Nebraska back to the Big 12. Nebraska is subpar academically, and lost its AAU membership. With Nebraska gone the B1G can add Cal and Stanford. With Cal and Stanford in the B1G Notre Dame would have better excuse to join the B1G. Northwestern is a charter a member of the B1G. They are staying put!!! With Cal, Stanford and Notre all teams in the B1G would belong to the AAU.
You keep comparing Big 12 grant of rights dollars to ACC grant of rights, plus additional income, like conferences and bowl games. According to Navigate the Big 12 payment is estimated to be higher through 2027. They estimate that the ACC could pull ahead at that time, but only by a couple millions dollars. More, but not a crazy amount ahead, like the SEC and Big 10 will receive.
I get that football is driving realignment. Nevertheless looking past football at the other sports and Clemson is a mid-level G5 at best. Clemson had a few good football years in the 1979-1983 timeframe and a few years ago but other than that they aren’t that great. They’ve doing a backslide the last couple of years nationally and if they can’t compete with Florida State this year than they won’t be attractive to the SEC as much. The way they are now the football would be middle of the SEC pack. Throw in the fact that the state of South Carolina is small and not a big recruiting state. SEC already has USC-lite. Greeneville-Spartanburg is a bad TV market. The next TV market geographically is Charlotte which is pretty good. Clemson needs SEC more than SEC needs them. In fact while FSU would be more attractive to the SEC the SEC doesn’t need to be in a hurry to add teams. While it’s better to be proactive than reactive the Big10 is not expanding right now and if they were they wouldn’t go after Clemson and FSU. If Big10 wanted a Florida school they’d go after AAU member Miami.
We are not talking about European Soccer. We are talking about American College athletics. There seems to be a total lack of appetite in Conferences for relegation. Vandy has been in the SEC since 1932, and there is no indication that they will boot them. The same with Missouri, which in truth is even a worse fit. Big 10 shows zero signs of relegating Nebraska. The ACC still keeps BC and Wake though they are admittedly the worst they have. This may work in the English Premier league, but I am not sure this will ever happen among the P4.
Northwestern and Vanderbilt are on the clock. They have to upgrade or I think by the time of the next TV deal they could be dropped from their conferences.
@@Lucas6l5 the Ivy is not inviting schools. Beyond that, Vandy enjoys being in the SEC. They may not enjoy losing, but the money and exposure are nice. Every time the SEC is on ESPN (always), Vandy gets advertising.
@@vernonsheldon-witter1225 Very true, I’m hoping these conferences get greedy and go to 24 teams, then we can return to regional based conferences when they implode.
The slippery slope that noone is talking about... Every RUclips president on here doesn't realize the long term affect. of expansion.. It could happen.. schools realize the tv revenue it 20-24 of total revenue... Sec could say to any school.. you don't add value... Vanderbilt ( rich school) sports is kinda important.. not most important... Jump to ACC not miss a beat.. they have been keeping the sec " GPA" for decades....
I think college football should adapt promotion relegation as they do with soccer. For example; the worst power 5 schools get pushed down to the group of 5 and the best group of 5 schools get promoted to the power 5
@@observer46-vh5bmthey wouldn’t. Some Americans have this stupid fetish for European pro-rel not realizing that the structure of European sports is totally different from American as well as the fact that European countries are the size of American states so travel costs are much lower.
@@terranceramirez4816 can you imagine trying to recruit while telling a player that we are in the SEC or B1G, but might be in the AAC, MWC, etc, when you graduate?
Wake Forest in the ACC is comparable to Vanderbilt as far as size and what not, but Wake is much more competitive overall in sports even though they’re a small school.
LOL, Vanderbilt plays in the toughest athletic conference against much better competition than Wake Forest. How is that comparable? It’s not. Size, sure but if Wake was over in the SEC playing the tougher competition week in and week out, it would be a disaster for them. Let’s get real. Both schools are fantastic Universities. In that, yes they can be compared. But saying Wake is more competitive isn’t realistic due to who they both have to play.
Lol i hope they start kicking teams out of the sec and big 10 you have Vanderbilt fans chanting sec like wth sre you guys chanting sec like you've done something
Northwestern was in the NCAA tournament in men's basketball show football will be better northwestern will be fine and so would the Scarlet knights of Rutgers University have a great week the depressed Ginger
#random but boston university, gw university, pepperdine, st louis and university of chicago have way more than enough money to start a football programs that could linkup with the pac 12
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Remember when college football was about football?
This happens every so many decades or so. It’ll play out and later down the road the NCAA will prolly implode and things will change again. Conferences have always been shifting tho
Pepperidge Farms Remembers
No, because this conference realignment part of the sport has been happening for well over 100 years.
What’s that ?? I thought we were playing Sim City 😂
I live in Chicago as a PSU alum. Northwestern is the B1G's academic crown jewel and they're not going anywhere. If you don't know the power of Northwestern then you don't know their alums. They raised over $6 billion in a simple capital call to supporters.
You should also look at how they win national research funding by forming consortiums with schools like Illinois, Wisconsin, and U. Chicago. And no way will ND want to join with Northwestern leaving. The entire conference benefits from sharing research with Northwestern.
And yes, as a PSU alum, the B1G would not have any legal standing to kick out Northwestern based on "hazing" when PSU wasn't kicked out for a coach raping children in the athletic facilities. You need actual precedent to force a university to lose hundreds of millions over time.
Not to mention that NWU is in the Chicagoland TV market, which is #3 in the nation. Similar rationale for NJSU. Rutgers is in the NYC #1 TV market.
@@GrizrazRex The B1G is headquartered here for God sakes. LOL! If/when the Bears get their domed stadium, they can also start playing bowl games here including the B1G championship.
And yes, I hate hearing "no one watched Rutgers games." It's not about Rutgers fans and alums. It's about having access to the TV market so the B1G Network has 24/7/365 day programming. There are thousands of B1G alums who live in the NYC area who still want to watch their teams play. The last time I checked, basketball and women's volleyball is played more than football. So that's more opportunities for the B1G Network to sell commercial space to advertisers.
Same thing in Chicago which has the largest concentration of B1G alums. Northwestern being in the B1G allows me to go to the PSU game in Chicago at the end of September which is a huge cost savings on my time and pockets.
The B1G signed the richest TV deal in conference history despite having a lesser quality product than the SEC. The formula is clearly working so why mess it up because the 2 games every 4 years that Ohio State may have to play Northwestern or Rutgers?
But Joel Klatt, with Fox has had podcasts saying just that. The Northwesterns and Rutgers of the conference are in borrowed time and will get the old heave hoe. Surely he knows what’s what since he’s a Fox analyst on the B1G conference. LOL. Where do they find these guys?!
@@jansonroberts2616 Joel Klatt? My niece is a supervisor at a local McDonald's. Want to know the next item on McDonald's menu? 😂
You might want to read what happened in 1989 the last time Northwestern felt threatened. The only reason PSU is in the B1G is because of them and Wisconsin. I'm pretty sure PSU is ready to return the favor.
The Big1G needs to include Stanford. Already having N.W. Stanford would be a great add! These two universities are so elite in so many ways...
The annual value of the ACC's TV contract is NOT $40 million per year closer to $17-24 million (you included ACC's incentive payouts). 2:00 You didn't include incentives for the Big 12, end-of-year revenue distribution with sponsors, etc. The Big 12 distributed about $42-45 million with incentives last year (on its OLD contract), whereas the ACC distributed about $38-39 million in incentives per year. The Big 12's payout is higher than the ACC's just based on the old TV deal. With the NEW Big 12 Tv deal, incentives and sponsors (playoffs, etc.), the Big 12's new TV contract is predicted to boost its earnings to closer to $50 million per school. The ACC's is at a $40 million threshold for the most part limited to that cap.
P4 average breakdown allocation with sponsor/incentive payments for '22:
Big Ten: $58.8 million dollars
SEC: $49.9m
Big 12: $42m-$44.9m
ACC: $39.4m
Source Front Office Sports
Exactly.
Thanks for putting this out here, for whatever reason mid pack acc fans think they got the same deal as the big 12 and are too boneheaded to realize.
I heard Miami and Florida state are pissed that UCF is making more money now.
@@timmyjohnson2099 Well, ain't that just too bad.
@@timmyjohnson2099 I think FSU realizes the fact Orlando is a bigger market and good recruiting hot spot and will be making p4 money and they're terrified in the long run
I think the Big10 also values Rutgers for having its teams play games against them in the NYC area. It gives them exposure which can help with recruiting.
Helps them get easy win
@@happynotredamefan3736 that too
I got Rutgers for NYC but like Maryland has never made sense to me, you could've gotten a Virginia, a UConn, a Syracuse, those schools give you bigger markets, maybe for Baltimore ???
@@yorkqueer Maryland plays in College Park which is very close to Washington DC. So obviously they were trying to lock up the DC market. I'm not sure it made sense, but that's why they did it.
It is lazy reporting and greedy to consider kicking a team out of a conference based on football performance, especially in the BIG Ten. If you kick out the bottom teams.....somebody else will move to the bottom. You can never have all winning teams in a conference. Some teams will always have significant losses. Imagine this year if Ohio State/Michigan each went 8-1 and Penn State/Wisconsin went 7-2 in conference games. That would cause 30 losses in conference just from 4 teams! Somebody has to lose! As for Rutgers, they haven't had many years getting a full revenue distribution to get on equal footing in facilities with traditional powers. Also if Rutgers ever starts winning more recruiting battles in New Jersey, they could rise in football, and could over take your favorite team in the pecking order. Maybe in the future Rutgers will rise above Iowa or Wisconsin after a string of bad coaching and recruiting years.....are you going to kick them out in the future for bad football performance? There are also numerous non football reasons for not kicking anyone out that should be mentioned.
This is a point rarely made for some reason. "Kicking out" the bottom teams just moves other teams to the bottom. Should the Big 10 and SEC just be Michigan and Ohio State and Alabama and Georgia?
Rutgers has never yet gotten a full share from the B1G. They are still paying back loans and will get a full share in 2027.
Great point. Kick out NW, then someone else like Illinois or Indiana will take their place as the B1G punching bag. Then are those schools next on the relegation merry go round?
This whole thing stems from FSU (ACC) making less than UCF (Big12). The ACC makes less and will make considerably less than the BIG12 in the coming years. I have no idea why you would think the ACC makes more than the BIG 12
He counted the full revenue distribution of incentives (playoffs, sponsors etc) for ACC and didn't count Big 12's incetive distribution. You're correct ACC's TV contract is less at around $20-25 million per team. Big 12 made more off incentives last year than ACC.
@@RivaledMediaAthletics The ACC is expected to make are least 30 mil per team next year, per CBS Sports
@@BrownieCFB I know that article and again you're going off of revenue distribution of incentives. The article even states the next sentence it is expected ACC will finish fourth amongst P5 schools, behind Big 12. We're talking in terms of TV contract alone. NOT revenue incentive distribution. If it was competitive than Clemson and FSU administration wouldn't be openly admitting its behind the other three conferences.
@@RivaledMediaAthletics I see, sorry for my negligence. I thought it was saying that’s what they would get before payouts.
@@BrownieCFB No worries. Clemson is a strong brand and will figure out something.
KU fan here, would love mizzou to come on back home to the big 12. Obviously not having the SEC money would suck but in terms of national relevance I think their brand would rebound in football and especially basketball.
I'm a Mizzou alum. I would also like to come back to the Big 12. I miss the KU rivalry game in football.
It would have been hilarious if Mizzou, A&M, and Nebraska joined Colorado in jumping back in the Big12. Just because Texas left
Mizzou fan here. The SEC has made us feel like a part of the SEC. I never wanted Mizzou to leave the Big Xll, but I was relieved to get away from Texas. I would love for Mizzou to come home to the Big Xll. We're a Midwest school. Keep your fingers crossed. Vaughn
Mizzou is the one school that started all this conference jumping. I for one do not feel sorry for them. They did not like the Big 12 and started the departure of Nebraska, Colorado, and
ATM.
Bring back the big 8
I do not see relegation as it is used in European soccer would work in college football. The schools will never agree to be kicked out of the big-money media deals if they have a bad couple of seasons. I think what's more likely to happen is once all the realignment is over and 15-20 years down the road the broadcasters will probably push for a super league and the weak programs will be left out of the new arrangement. Being weaker in this context does not necessarily mean just poor on-field performance but in terms of attendance, ratings, brand recognition, and on-field performance. To me, that seems to be the logical progression of realignment. Programs like Rutgers, Northwestern, Vanderbilt, and others just do not have the pull to remain if it goes that way. I do think having football programs completely separate themselves from other sports may also be coming. Do I want any kind of college football super league to happen? Hell NO. However, I think its a possibility.
Rutgers is the only team in the NYC market of 7.4 million TV sets. South Jersey is at least another 1.5 million, so the total is around 9 million TV sets. What other schools have a market of 9 million TV sets and no other team in the market? Zero.
The $7 to $8 billion dollar contracts the B1G just entered are predicated on the league going from NYC to Chicago to LA, per the TV execs who are writing huge checks. There is no other team anywhere close to the NYC market.
In case you are wondering, Syracuse in 250 miles from NYC and UConn about 150. Neither are anywhere near the NYC market, while RU is 20 miles from midtown Manhattan.
Kick Rutgers out and perhaps lose billions of dollars. Makes sense to me.
Northwestern is Chicago. Northwestern and Vandy are the best academic schools in their conferences. That matters to the B1G, and presumably to the SEC.
Remember when Geography mattered?
I am 65 and yes I remember our Conference in the 70s with much nostalgia. Things have changed materially however.
Every sec fan base would be pissed the fuck off if they try to remove Vandy. They’re SEC always
Speak for yourself. I'm an SEC guy and graduated from an SEC school. Vanderbilt gives us academics and baseball. Academics really don't matter anymore. My school is one of the ones that has one national championships, and it's not going to be long before everyone starts asking why are we giving schools like Vanderbilt and Missouri the same amount of money, when we're the ones making it all? I don't want to kick them out but I have already heard fans asking why do we have to share what we make with Miss St and Vandy for example. Not to pick on those teams, but pretty soon the big dogs are going to start pulling a Florida state and demanding more of a share in the big two conferences from the teams simply riding coattails of the big dogs.
@@GR-bn3xj LOL. You agreed to the terms when Mizzou joined. Why did you do that if you're so great and deserving of so much more? Too late to demand more now. Plus, why do you care if your team is winning championships?
I agree plus they are keeping the conference academics up.
Vanderbilt is just fine in the SEC. Founding member and an incredible University. Go Dawgs!
@@jansonroberts2616 My ex-wife works at Vandy so I root against them.
Back in the 1980s, it wasn’t uncommon for independent football schools to have all of their other sports (including basketball) compete in non-football conferences, like Penn St. & Temple (Atlantic 10), Florida St & Louisville (Metro), Syracuse & Boston College (Big East). I think it would make more sense for the football programs to be in their own conferences that maximize TV revenue, but have the rest of the sports compete in regionally based leagues, like the traditional conferences we had prior to the realignment craze that started in the 1990s. It would shorten road trip swings & save every school $$$$. Isn’t that what everyone wants?
No. The universities do not seem to agree with your opinion. So that is not what everyone wants.
When the schools realize how much money their non-revenue sports (volleyball, softball, water polo, etc.) are squandering on cross country road trips, they are going to start looking for ways to save money on those sports.
@@SamWesting and immediately lose donations, but more importantly probably violate Title IX. There may be a little trimming around the edges, but nothing major will happen. Too dangerous for the schools
Title IX is about offering equal number of scholarships to men & women, not equal amount of air travel miles. My school, U. of Hawaii, has the football team playing in the Mountain West, while women’s teams play in the Big West. Dude, you’ve got a lot to learn about the subject.
@@SamWesting You may be a lawyer or not. I am and I have some familiarity with Title IX, so maybe you are the one who needs to study up. I am afraid that you are not correct. Title IX is much broader than that.
What is the source of your knowledge that makes you so totally certain of your position?
Here is a paragraph from an NCAA website:
Other benefits: Title IX requires the equal treatment of female and male student-athletes in the provisions of: (a) equipment and supplies; (b) scheduling of games and practice times; (c) travel and daily allowance/per diem; (d) access to tutoring; (e) coaching, (f) locker rooms, practice and competitive facilities; (g) medical and training facilities and services; (h) housing and dining facilities and services; (i) publicity and promotions; (j) support services and (k) recruitment of student-athletes.
www.ncaa.org/sports/2014/1/27/title-ix-frequently-asked-questions.aspx
If a school decided to favor male students in even minor ways, they would be in Federal Court in a heartbeat and the Feds would be visiting to ensure compliance.
Do some research before you are so convinced that you are correct.
The Big Ten is not demoting or otherwise kicking out teams. Northwestern has rivalry games. Others have rivalry games.
And certainly it takes someone far removed from the Big Ten tradition and schools to post such nonsense.
I don’t believe that the SEC needs to change anything and all the ACC needs to do is make better deals because between the SEC and ACC they have won all but 1 national championship of the last 17 titles with the only exception being a fluke year for Ohio state. The only non SEC powerhouse in the last twenty year is USC other than that it’s been the SEC show with a few appearances by FSU and Clemson but the south has absolutely dominated the rest of the country in College Football period
You are correct, which is why the B1G would grab FSU in a minute. Not sure about Clemson, since SC is not FL.
@@observer46-vh5bm I took a look at the ACC teams that are playing SEC teams other than the normal rivalries as a possible way to determine which teams are trying to get in the SEC kinda like what Texas and Oklahoma did and what I came up with is Virginia North Carolina Georgia Tech FSU and Miami now I’m not saying that means anything necessarily but it could and as far as Clemson goes they are a natural fit in the SEC and Georgia Tech used to be in conference and have tried to get back in a couple of times
@@rodneydockins3485 Georgia Tech has problems. According to the Atlanta Journal Constitution, GaTech is fifth in popularity in Atlanta, its home city. First was UGa, the Alabama, Auburn and another school in that order. If a team is that low in its home city, no bigger conference will take them.
@@observer46-vh5bm you maybe right but they have history look how bad Alabama was before Saban got there they could make a comeback if they do they shoot way up that list
ACC's Tv deal isn't good lol. If that was the case teams wouldn't want to jump. ACC has somewhere around a 20 mil payout per team. That 40 million was for payouts for other revenue too like playoffs, basketball. Big 12 new TV deal is higher and you didn't include their other revenue for playoffs, basketball. Big 12 distributed more than ACC last year with playoffs, basketball and other revenue.
"teams wouldn't want to jump"
The schools who want to jump want to jump to the Big Ten and SEC specifically because of how much more those conferences are making. If the Big 12 was truly making so much more than the ACC then there would have been no trouble finding an 8th school to dissolve the league back in the spring before the Big 12 absorbed the Pac 12 defections
@@willpsoneit's only a matter of time for ACC. I tried to tell PAC-12 fans a year ago too they didn't want to listen.
I don’t think the conferences can kick anyone out due to litigation. I’m sure the lawyers would love it as the legal fees would be close to the amount of actual damages the schools kicked out would have. The trial would probably be in the state of the school getting relegated
Oh, the legal fees alone would be in the tens of millions, easily. Of course, as a lawyer, I understand that is a very nice piece of business.
They can’t kick out Northwestern for Hazing otherwise you would have to kick out Penn State for what happened inter Paterno.
Exceptions can be made when your team makes a lot of money....
No not really. The difference is NW would be kicked out because they aren’t wanted-PSU is absolutely wanted, and so there’s no desire by the B1G to kick out PSU.
Nobody's being kicked our of the Big Ten for their won-loss football record with the conference 's academic and research consortium. Purdue was a founding member in 1895; I believe Northwestern was too. Screw "brands" and TV ratings; anyone who believes this absurdity doesn't understand how college athletics works.
Exactly. The ignorance is amazing.
But they should! The B1G would be better if we didn’t have USC, UCLA, Washington, Oregon, Rutgers, Maryland and Nebraska who are the worst moves in realignment history next to everything from 2011 till now!
@@WDB2005amen
I think networks has to remember the big games are not only matchups…but the matchups have to have good records in Oct and Nov for those games to matter. The smaller schools are needed to beef up their records. Also for the Big 12 there is a “Blue Blood” school now but one one or two programs will dominate the conference and if they win in playoffs like TCU, the conference will be in a better place when it renegotiate its contract.
The big ten is not getting rid pf northwestern and get rid of the chicago market
In 2 weeks Rutgers will have the number 1 2024 men’s basketball recruiting class in the country( when Dillon Harper signs). Football is not that far behind. Their defense this year should be top 5 in big ten .
How come no discussion about Indiana or Purdue? Why ONLY hate for Rutgers? Indiana finished last in the East division last year, not Rutgers.
Also, Big Ten Network revenue went up 300% only after the addition of Rutgers (and Maryland). It wasn't about ratings, it was about cable boxes in the most densely populated area in the country.
All that BTN revenue allowed the Big Ten to attract the best teams from other conferences to join.
Indiana brings the Indianapolis market. Plus top tier medical school
Indiana and Purdue were founding memebrs of the Big 10, I don't see them relegated anywhere.
@@vernonsheldon-witter1225
Northwestern has been there for a long time as well. If it's about football performance, then that will apply across the board.
History doesn't matter, and if you don't believe me, you should talk to someone from the Pac-12.
@@slibertas1996
The what market???? Are they even top 20??
Northwestern brings the Chicago media market. With the Big 10 having New York (Rutgers) Los Angeles both USC and UCLA it’s more “virtual eyes watching “ and is used for negotiating purposes. It’s all about the $$$$ these days. Look at the PAC12 having a crappy streaming only platform.
Northwestern isn't going anywhere. Period. They are an original member of the conference whose academics/research tops all of the other schools in the B1G. Their endowment is almost $15 billion, second only to Michigan ($17b). Third is Ohio State at $7b
You are correct in that the football team has been down in the last couple of years, but won the division in 2018 and 2020 (and their bowl games that year). If you want to dismiss the Big Ten as weak, then what does that say about all of the other teams in the west? Nebraska has been forever bad. Illinois and Purdue have been bad for awhile and just now are on the rise. It seems like the west was where any team could be good one year and bad the next.
The hazing situation is bad, no doubt. Is that a reason to kick them out? If so, then Penn State is the poster child of bad things. They're still playing sports.
NW is planning to build a new stadium that should be the envy of most teams. It's not going to hold 100K like Michigan or Ohio, but it will be modern. NW is the smallest of the B1G schools.
And how would relegation really work anyway? Because you are bad at football, all of your other sports teams are kicked out of the conference too? NW football may have been bad in the past three years, but several of the non-revenue sports teams do quite well. How would it work if football is bad but basketball is good (not that NW basketball is much better, but the point remains for any school.)
Plus the HQ for B1G is Chicago and kicking out the university that it can practically call it home is not a good look.
The Big Time wouldn't kick out Northwestern because it would be afraid of losing the Chicago market. Plus they are very good at all the sports nobody cares about like Notre Dame which they are trying to recruit.
Next tV contract don’t be surprised if SEC & B10 have unequal revenue sharing.
Yes performance pay out.
As an Ohio State fan I'm 100% behind kicking Northwestern out of the conference. The rest of the B1G is subsidizing their athletic department, and for what? No one gets excited when they see Northwestern on the schedule in the revenue sports. They're a drain on the rest of the conference and replacing them with almost any other team in the P5 would be an upgrade. I'm all for replacing Indiana or Purdue while we're at it. The B1G doesn't need 2 schools in Indiana, that state doesn't produce enough high school talent to sustain 3 ( counting Notre Dame) P5 schools, and both schools have been pretty terrible in football historically speaking. Cutting the dead weight in this conference is the only way the B1G can continue to keep up with the SEC in revenue, especially after the SEC will most likely add FSU, Clemson UNC etc.
I don’t see how they could justify kicking Northwestern out because of hazing after what happened at Penn State and Michigan State
Northwestern was a charter member of the Big 10 and is still their Brain Trust. I don't see them ever being kicked out.
No one is jumping from the ACC this round. Only 2 days left to file. I think the plan to get out is not finalized at this time and the money isn’t there. I am also not sure there is a sure fire landing spot for the 2024 season. 😢
Your commentary shows an absolute lack of understanding of economics and of college sports. Either learn about it, or do not comment on it. Very sad.
No college could ever deal with relegation. These are not professional soccer teams, they are university teams that hire coaches, build facilities, etc., based entirely on their expectation of future income. How could any school facing possible relegation hire coaches, upgrade stadiums, etc., or pay for projects to which they have committed? It would be the basis of total financial destruction for the sports at that university and almost certainly invite Congressional intervention.
It would be a precipitous disaster for Title IX as any number of women's sports would be cut as well as men's sports. Try and explain in court or before Congress why that happened and the sudden loss of scholarships for all of those players, many of whom are disadvantaged minorities. Good luck with that.
As an attorney, I can tell you that the litigation would be crippling to the league that tried it. I would suggest that every single player who lost a scholarship because of relegation would have a direct cause of action against the league for loss of future earning due to failure to be able to afford to graduate without the athletic scholarship. We are talking about the risk of at least many hundreds of millions of dollars, or more, in damages to the league.
The $7 to $8 billion dollar B1G contracts are based on the national footprint from NYC to Chicago to LA, per the TV executives. Rutgers is 20 miles from Manhattan. Funny you think that being the only school in the NYC market is not important, but the people putting out billions of dollars disagree with you. Should I believe you or the people signing the huge checks?
As others have pointed out, Northwestern, was a charter member of the predecessor to the B1G about 140 years ago, and is the Chicago in NYC to Chicago to LA. So what is a 140 year relationship worth? Not much to you it appears.
By the way, do you know anything at all about the B1G Academic Alliance, which actually involves far more money than sports generate. It appears not.
The B1G schools collaborate on huge research projects. As one example the NJ Cancer Institute in New Brunswick is part to Rutgers. Right now there is a huge cancer research project being done by the NJ Cancer Institute and four or five other B1G universities. The research is far more than any one institution could handle.
Will just wait and see 😊
Here an example of why relegation will never happen,
Down in Tuscaloosa, we had some very lean years in the 90s and were down right awful for most of the time between 2000-2007. Nobody would be able to convince Mike Slive & Greg Sankey to relegate ALABAMA in 2005.....nobody.
And if you don't end up in a situation like that, then relegation is nearly pointless cause you'll just be swapping bottom feeders every couple years.
I’m gonna go sign the shrek thumbnail petition
No one’s getting kicked out
Few people outside Chicago and the B1G probably realize Northwestern and Rutgers exists. I'm not even sure 50% of the people that live in NYC knows Rutgers still has a football team. These teams are stealing money. This is about football and cash, not academics.
No way in hell Northwestern is being kicked out of the B1G.
Hopefully Rutgers does!
Rutgers has great men's and women basketball. Northwestern needs to go. We have Illinois.
Not happening. Pure clickbait..
yes it is certain schools are dead weight
@@fadercreek The fact that the ACC rejected the Pac-12 schools rumored for expansion says the University Presidents in the conference make the final call, not athletic directors.
@@dantesinfernopurgatory7826 not the point sooner than later relegation is gonna start and when that happens new conferences are gonna start forming
It should happen! These schools are nothing but dead weight and the university presidents and conference commissioners are ruining college football as we know it! Especially that no good Kevin Warren
@@fadercreek That's the only way it's gonna happen - when new conferences start forming.
Don't forget. There's more sports than just football.
Not really. Without football income all other college sports do not exist.
@@davidcase9848 Basketball. My school makes money on baseball too.
Here's something that most people forget about. You have to have schools that are the weak ones. If you don't then your record will suffer. Schools like Alabama and Georgia could conceivably have 2 or 3 losses in a season. That's good in a way because teams like LSU, Tennessee, A&M and Mississippi are going to be the spoilers of the SEC. There's going to be spoilers in the Big 10 also. The more good teams that enter another conference the more havoc top to bottom. Your going to have years when a historic mid level teams are going to finish in last place in their conference. Mid level teams will upset top flight schools as well and upset the apple cart. 🍎 😢 Think about it. I love your shows. Vaughn
There's always going to be lower tier teams in every conference, but they don't have to be at the level of a Northwestern. They don't belong in one of the P2 conferences by any metric. I doubt very seriously that they'd be invited to join even the Big 12 or ACC, even if the ACC lost all of their top brands.
If your not a blue blood get outa here
10:43 If football tv deals are the only way to fund Olympic sports, then how does Gonzaga sponsor their sports? What about the Big east, Big west and all the other non football conferences. How do they pay for their sports?
Thank you!!! When is the last time anyone saw Princeton vs Harvard football on ESPN or fox primetime...yet year after year they keep playing...
By having less sports. Gonzaga has a total of 16 varsity teams (eight men’s, eight women’s) while the University of Minnesota has 25 (12 men’s, 13 women’s)
@@terranceramirez4816UC San Diego has 23 sports and no football tv deal.
@@Alohanate2004 courtesy of the beleaguered taxpayers of the State of California that are currently fleeing to Texas in droves
@@Alohanate2004 Schools without lucrative TV deals fund their athletic programs mostly with money from corporate sponsors and private donations(boosters).
I’ve never understood why Vanderbilt is in the SEC when it’s a private Ivy League type of school. It needs to be Ivy League
Vanderbilt was one of the SEC's founding members. The Ivy League would never accept a Southern school, it has always been and always will be the same eight schools.
You want to get rid of Rutgers? Great you replace the $150 to $180 million they help generate in cable subscriptions annually for the B1G Network local deal.
yup i cant wait for that and they just hired andrew lucks father to build a more elite version of ivy league football
The more the realignment, the more the horses pull the limbs.
we've seen teams be kicked out of P5 conferences before (Temple in the Big East) but who would they kick out? NW is very important and founded the conference, maybe you get rid of a Maryland or Rutgers??
doubt Vandy as a founding member will be kicked out of the SEC only team I could see is Missouri who just makes 0 sense in everyway
The problem with relegation is there's a lot more involved in the TV deals than how good the teams are. The B1G'S TV deal is so good because of the major markets they're in. Northwestern may not be great, but it gives the B1G the Chicago market. If they kicked anyone for football it would be schools where they have multiple teams to cover the market. So think Indiana/Purdue or Michigan/Michigan State. The SEC could kick Vanderbilt and add Memphis to get basically the same market coverage.
Of course, Vandy is the best academic institution in the SEC. That might mean something.
Vanderbilt was a founding team of the SEC and with high academic standards an a private University with an emphasis on education they are not leaving the SEC!! Memphis will never be in the SEC so you can give up that dream!! Vanderbilt is University of Tennessee!!
@@siouxfan1716 and? Northwestern was a founding member of the B1G, but that does not stop people from talking about kicking them. In fact I mentioned 4 other B1G schools in this comment 3 of which are founding members and you said nothing of them so I guess that doesn't matter. The only reason I mentioned Memphis is because they occupy the same media market as Vandy so from a media perspective the SEC would not lose a media market by kicking Vandy and adding Memphis. I do not care about Memphis or the SEC for that matter so no it's not a dream to have Memphis in the SEC.
@@observer46-vh5bm Academics do not matter to the TV partners just ask the PAC.
Big 10 Kickout: Nebraska (doesn’t provide a major media market and has underperformed)
SEC Kickout: Vanderbilt (Can secure Nashville market without them and only baseball is good)
ACC Kickout: No One
BIG 12 Kickout: Iowa State (no major media market only good at wrestling) or WVU (no major market, underperformers)
You can't kick Northwestern out for hazing in the football program. Then you'd have to kick out Penn State for the Jerry Sandusky scandal 12 years ago.
Since they've basically ruined what college football is then they should adopt that system of demoting and promoting because conference association no longer matters in anyway, it's gone. My S..E..C chants wasted now
At one time Rutgers was a bettor's dream school. They couldn't score. Bettors would take Rutgers opponent for the whole season and clean up. I did.
No one is leaving the ACC for at least 5 years. Even after that, not going to happen. THERE IS A VALID CONTRACT. By the way, its 8/16 and that is Happy FSU Is Still In the ACC Day!
No one is kicking out NW or Vandy.
Is this even possible?
yup
No. Not without extremely lengthy and costly litigation.
Nah. The ramifications would be awful and shortsighted. College Football is not a Euro Soccer League.
Maryland hasn’t been relevant since joining the Big Ten.
They were not relevant in the ACC either
You people are ignorant. Since joining the B1G in 2014, Maryland has won 49 conference titles, a total exceeded by only Ohio State and Michigan. (Expansion partner Rutgers has won but three.) Athletic performance goes beyond football and men's basketball, whether you like it or not. College Park belongs.
@@VincentPaterno-hs2fv What have they won in? They're totally an after-thought in football, and a little bit better in basketball.
Has the Rose Bowl said anything yet about the Pac12? If they just add teams, which is the simplest scenario, what does the Rose do with that auto bid? Are they gonna be ok with current MW/AAC schools facing off against the BIG10 team? Bowls have already lost their prestige but last year’s Rose Bowl is basically what many future ones could look like…kind of looking like the Fiesta Bowl
The Rose Bowl is going to be apart of the 12 team playoff as a semifinal so it won't matter.
@@darrinthurston3308or the national title game
I'm all for a little fun thinking about promotion/relegation in college football...
But, anyone taking this seriously shows they don't understand how things work in the real word. Besides the fact college presidents would never vote to kick anyone out (they would fear it could happen to them down the road) - the reality is the B1G revenue has increased 450% since the day Rutgers entered the league. No, Rutgers wasn't the sole reason for it-- but they began the road to massive paydays due to geography. And, while they may not play great on the field all the time - they certainly have earned their way in via the bank...
Big 12 should add smu, Memphis, Boise State, and all 3 military ervice universities
SMU has serious problems within DFW itself with small fanbase, almost total lack of support in North Texas, and poor attendance at athletics. We would have taken them in 1996 if we wanted them. Hard no. Memphis has applied more than once for Big 12 membership but has been rejected by our Presidents/Chancellors each time, I don't see that changing, hard no on Memphis. Boise was evaluated and rejected by the University Presidents- hard no on Boise. AFA might be the only possible service academy addition because their location is local to the majority of our universities and similar facilities. But I do not see this happening either.
No, they will bring in more schools 🔥🔥🔥
You can bet FSU and Clemson will attempt to get Mizzou booted.
Northwestern ain't going nowhere. In fact nobody in the Big 10 is budging. That is crazy talk. In reality Sranford Vanderbilt Duke, Notre Dame amd Northwestern would be in the same conference but we don'y live in a perfect world. We live in a money world. .
Absolutely. Explain Vanderbilt ?
U get 2 years to recover from less than 6 teams.
What if we just reset CFB to how it should be?
Try telling this to Sankey and the SEC or the Big 10. They would laugh at you.
Rutgers gives you the New York market… that’s why they stay.
What are you talking about? The big ten has money bank having rutgers. They have the new york market because of them.
Missouri would be a good fit in big12
Not anymore. Missouri has proven itself a pain in the ass. They were trying to leave the Big 8 for the Big 10 long before the Big 12 was formed. They are greedy and juvenile and not worth the effort. Nebraska would make a preferable fit.
We don't want Mizzou back.
Sure. Relegation time. If you don't invest in football, you're off. Just ask Stanford and California.
If everything you talk about with Northwestern was so much, then Stanford is even better, but yet they did not get invited into the big 10…think about that!
Big ten definitely. But it would be treacherous
I think you are off on the ACC payout per school amount.
Every conference needs some stiffs
you plebes dont get that the bond of the AAU research designation is more important to the Big 10 than anything...and I mean anything. Nobody in the Big 10 is kicking out or relegating nobody. And Northwestern is in CHICAGO. LET ME SAY IT AGAIN...CHICAGO. The 3rd largest tv market in the country. So this talk is stupid...itll happen in the SEC before it ever happens in the Big 10.
You mean the most overrated aspect of realignment?
Missouri and Nebraska should just call it a day and return to the BigXII. They just don't fit where they are
Not as long as they keep getting those welfare checks.
☹ Unfortunately, that is the TV Networks "Long Term Goal"! That is "Exactly Why" the Big-12 Needs to Go "All In" On Basketball! 🏀
The great thing about collage football is upsets! You never know.
You can make the same case for Nebraska they've done nothing
Why pick Rutgers, haven't they beaten Indiana?
Indiana is a puny shadow of what they once were.
The B1G need to send Nebraska back to the Big 12. Nebraska is subpar academically, and lost its AAU membership. With Nebraska gone the B1G can add Cal and Stanford. With Cal and Stanford in the B1G Notre Dame would have better excuse to join the B1G. Northwestern is a charter a member of the B1G. They are staying put!!! With Cal, Stanford and Notre all teams in the B1G would belong to the AAU.
While I would love to have Nebraska back, but Conferences have no desire to relegate universities.
Yea sure the SEC will kick out the #1 baseball program 😂
Yep that’s the next step
Academics matter as well... it's not all about football lmao
You keep comparing Big 12 grant of rights dollars to ACC grant of rights, plus additional income, like conferences and bowl games. According to Navigate the Big 12 payment is estimated to be higher through 2027. They estimate that the ACC could pull ahead at that time, but only by a couple millions dollars. More, but not a crazy amount ahead, like the SEC and Big 10 will receive.
They can but won't
I get that football is driving realignment. Nevertheless looking past football at the other sports and Clemson is a mid-level G5 at best. Clemson had a few good football years in the 1979-1983 timeframe and a few years ago but other than that they aren’t that great.
They’ve doing a backslide the last couple of years nationally and if they can’t compete with Florida State this year than they won’t be attractive to the SEC as much. The way they are now the football would be middle of the SEC pack. Throw in the fact that the state of South Carolina is small and not a big recruiting state. SEC already has USC-lite. Greeneville-Spartanburg is a bad TV market. The next TV market geographically is Charlotte which is pretty good.
Clemson needs SEC more than SEC needs them. In fact while FSU would be more attractive to the SEC the SEC doesn’t need to be in a hurry to add teams. While it’s better to be proactive than reactive the Big10 is not expanding right now and if they were they wouldn’t go after Clemson and FSU. If Big10 wanted a Florida school they’d go after AAU member Miami.
We are not talking about European Soccer. We are talking about American College athletics. There seems to be a total lack of appetite in Conferences for relegation. Vandy has been in the SEC since 1932, and there is no indication that they will boot them. The same with Missouri, which in truth is even a worse fit. Big 10 shows zero signs of relegating Nebraska. The ACC still keeps BC and Wake though they are admittedly the worst they have. This may work in the English Premier league, but I am not sure this will ever happen among the P4.
Follow the money 💵
Northwestern and Vanderbilt are on the clock. They have to upgrade or I think by the time of the next TV deal they could be dropped from their conferences.
Northwest is Chicago. That is a very big deal to the TV executives - from NYC to Chicago to LA.
Northwestern is founding member of the Big Ten they are a member for life unless they decide to leave on their own.
Vanderbilt serves the same function for the SEC as Northwestern does with Chicago - most of the SEC has a significant alumni presence in Nashville.
Vanderbilt is an Ivy League caliber school so they really should be in the Ivy League
@@Lucas6l5 the Ivy is not inviting schools. Beyond that, Vandy enjoys being in the SEC. They may not enjoy losing, but the money and exposure are nice. Every time the SEC is on ESPN (always), Vandy gets advertising.
The Big Ten should just add Stanford, California, Oregon State, and Washington State and have them play in a B1G Pacific conference for other sports.
I agree 100 pct that way the schools don't have to travel as much and you could still have the championship game in the Rose bowl
No chance but have fun with your fantasies.
I don't think the Big 10 has the appetite to add 4 more universities. Anything over 20 teams is unwieldy, ridiculously large, and doomed to break up.
@@observer46-vh5bm I never said it would happen?
@@vernonsheldon-witter1225 Very true, I’m hoping these conferences get greedy and go to 24 teams, then we can return to regional based conferences when they implode.
The slippery slope that noone is talking about... Every RUclips president on here doesn't realize the long term affect. of expansion.. It could happen.. schools realize the tv revenue it 20-24 of total revenue... Sec could say to any school.. you don't add value... Vanderbilt ( rich school) sports is kinda important.. not most important... Jump to ACC not miss a beat.. they have been keeping the sec " GPA" for decades....
I think college football should adapt promotion relegation as they do with soccer. For example; the worst power 5 schools get pushed down to the group of 5 and the best group of 5 schools get promoted to the power 5
I've thought of that myself. Thanks for bringing this to the surface. Vaughn
How would a school financially survive if they were relegated?
@@observer46-vh5bmthey wouldn’t. Some Americans have this stupid fetish for European pro-rel not realizing that the structure of European sports is totally different from American as well as the fact that European countries are the size of American states so travel costs are much lower.
@@terranceramirez4816 can you imagine trying to recruit while telling a player that we are in the SEC or B1G, but might be in the AAC, MWC, etc, when you graduate?
@@observer46-vh5bm no, it would be a complete shix show
lawsuits
Wake Forest in the ACC is comparable to Vanderbilt as far as size and what not, but Wake is much more competitive overall in sports even though they’re a small school.
LOL, Vanderbilt plays in the toughest athletic conference against much better competition than Wake Forest. How is that comparable? It’s not. Size, sure but if Wake was over in the SEC playing the tougher competition week in and week out, it would be a disaster for them. Let’s get real. Both schools are fantastic Universities. In that, yes they can be compared. But saying Wake is more competitive isn’t realistic due to who they both have to play.
@@jansonroberts2616Wake just beat Vandy…
The sec is top heavy but the other teams are mediocre. Same with the big10.
@@jansonroberts2616 Wake can only beat whos on the schedule.
@@BrownieCFBand?
Northwestern is Bigtens Chicago's market and a Academic power. Plus, Northwestern is building a brand new football stadium soon.
ND is Chicago’s market draw.
I always thought their should be a path for really good G5 teams to advance into the P5 and some really bad P5 schools to go to the G5.
None of the P5 conferences agree with you. Oh, well. Other than the recent grab by the Big 12 for survival, how many G5 programs have become P5?
Lol i hope they start kicking teams out of the sec and big 10 you have Vanderbilt fans chanting sec like wth sre you guys chanting sec like you've done something
Northwestern was in the NCAA tournament in men's basketball show football will be better northwestern will be fine and so would the Scarlet knights of Rutgers University have a great week the depressed Ginger
#random but boston university, gw university, pepperdine, st louis and university of chicago have way more than enough money to start a football programs that could linkup with the pac 12
Rutgers moving to the ACC would be nice
Bring Maryland as well
Bye Rutgers
Rutgers Maryland don’t deserve to be in big 10 same with candy
But look at the money that they bring in by having the East Coast from DC to NYC
THANK YOU! Someone gets it same goes for those PAC 12 teams and Nebraska