Game engine doesn't really matter in terms of success of selling a game. I just changes what you can do in the engine. There's nothing wrong with a simple easy game engine or a super complex powerful engine like unreal. Just focus on making your gameplay loop fun and interesting to expand and come back to.
100% true! Game engine will not make a game itself! For 2D games you could even use something like RayLib and create a masterpiece ;-) Or SDXL (say hello to Factorio!). Or be that weirdo and create you game in OGRE (Kenshi).
Vampire Survivors ended up being ported to a completely different engine, they stoped using Phaser when they started thinking about bringing it to consoles.
@@MA-xb2yz That's where my memory of that fact came from, already watched it but been a long time (since it came out) so my memory might have been off.
I'm not sure if baba is you was also made with LOVE, but I remember opening its data to find its assets to see how coloring was done (fun fact: all sprites are white and color is added in game) and found the entire source code there written in Lua. It was one of my most interesting find. Another fun fact: baba is you has hidden rules that aren't shown in game. "text is push", "level is stop", "cursor is select". Devs used the game itself to program it.
It's nice to see games that can still be easily modded. A lot of modern stuff is about like, encrypting assets and making sure it's all signed and specifically making sure nothing is tampered with, but a lot of older games had fantastic modding communities because there were no such protections in place against it.
@@Aeduo yeah, that's the best thing about most indie games. They are fun, don't have DRM (that slows down the game) and tamper protection. And they treat their players as intelligent human being. I wish industry goes back to the times that they open sourced their game engine when they were finished with them. (id tech 0-4, build engine, ...)
Are there real somewhat commercially successful games made with it? I remember also one obscure framework in Scheme, Maybe it was ChickenScheme that some relatively successful indie games were made with it. The tech and language doesn’t matter as long as you judge them by what you need, Many cutting edge stuff Unreal has for example may not be needed at all for your particular kind of game you are planning and may be better without a “Theory of Everything Game Engine”.
Love2D is simply awesome to work with. I built my own game prototype with it, despite being a less experienced programmer. Admittedly, my game code may not adhere to best practices, and I don't fully grasp them yet. However, it functions, and that brought me immense satisfaction. Love2D offers a great experience, even for those who aren't seasoned programmers.
LOVE2D is awesome, I made my first mobile game prototype in it. It can seem kinda old but I'd still recommend it especially for people first getting into game dev
Love2D is pretty nice, I always recommend it as good option to start with game dev and for game jams. Low complexity, has a good framework and features to get started without getting too much in the way. The deploy is a bit cumbersome, but other than that, a good option for 2D
It's fascinating thay you can extract the source directly from the compuled binary. I guess thats a side effect of how Love2d builds/bundles its games. I'm definitely going to be perusing through the source later
Just curious how did you know to uncompressing the exe? Godot, Unity, etc is overwelming for me. The cool thing about those apps is it lets you "see" what is going to be displayed on the screen. The bad thing is as least for me is a beginner is there is a massive learning curb for the interface and scripting. Love2d doesn't have all those options but there is still a massive learning curb for things like simulated physics and collision detection.
Just finished Gravity Circuit (fantastic game) and was very pleasantly surprised to see in the credits that it was made with Love. As someone currently working with PICO-8 and Lua, it seems that Love would be the next logical step to building a full commercial indie game.
Such a terribly underrated framework. With stellar performance, I might add, a hell of a lot better than Godot's (at least in all of my own comparisons). There's plenty of nice libraries for it too. And there's 3DreamEngine, which adds 3D support to Love2d. It's still in the works, but seems usable.
So interesting note about vampire survivors, the version you get is actually a Unity build but the way they develop is: 1. Luca Galante creates the features/gameplay in phaser.js because he knows it the best 2. Luca sends that build to his team to Unity-fi it due to performance reasons with phaser.js. Best engine you use is the engine you actually use. It's easier to move a project to a new engine than it is to create a brand-new game in one. So pick an engine that you find "easier" and run with your idea. Worry about performance later.
Don't be reckless ofcourse. Like performance should be a thought but don't worry about turning a set of 3 IF statements into some complex switch statement that calls static classes. Just keep it simple. The engines are fast, and the low-end hardware nowadays can take the load.
I only care about a few things in an engine, and it must be cross platform and ideally support ads, there must be decent materials explaining and tutorializing and it must be free. Side bonus if making games moddable on pc isnt actively opposed
I started with SDL2, then moved to LinGDX for making Android games. Then Unity, then Godot. I highly recommend starting with a graphics library over a full scale engine.
Sorta. Hell Divers uses Stingray, which was previously the BitSquid engine. Autodesk owned it and did a pretty crap job with it. I say sorta though as this engine, or at least forks of it, have powered some very high profile games, including the Warhammer Vermintide games as well as the new 40k shooter.
How does using Defold differ from Löve2d? (Defold is an engine that uses Lua as it's scripting language.) Question for anyone who has experience with both?
It showed once again: It's not about the engine, it's absolutely only about the one using it. Engines are tools, it's about knowing what you work with and using it to create. There are stunning games created with pygame and awful ones created with unreal.
I don't really know if I agree that Love is easier than Godot. Having a GUI I think is often more intuitive and easier to get into, than just pure code and reading docs.
Is is possible to include raw bytecode instead of Lua source files. It's takes some know-how to do though and for many games there is no reason for it. Why would you care if someone can read your code? You've still got copyright so it can't be copied or used in any other project without your permission. In any case, no code in an indie is unique enough to hide and data-miners can understand everything about a game even if source code is not included so it isn't even good for keeping "secrets".
Are you afraid of other nerds looking at the code? Unreal shares their code for everyone to see including Nanite and no problem, Same thing about research papers freely available online about AI, Computer Graphics, Math etc. stuff that could be applicable to achieve some particular effect within your game. Only parts of multiplayer games like servers are crucial to make closed source, The rest doesn’t that matter.
Can certainly be a good introduction to game development. Not sure if there are many hugely successful titles made with PyGame, but I do know in the Visual Novel space, Python is certainly an option. Really it comes down to the type of game. Both of the hits mentioned here could probably have been made with PyGame, certainly Balatro. I do think it has some performance issues when it comes to huge numbers of sprites, so Vampire Survivors may not be ideal.
There’s a RUclipsr who makes games using Pygame called dafluffypotato and he built various systems which bypasses the performance issues of python and Pygame.
It's a viable option for those who prefer using Python. The youtuber DaFluffyPotato has been making some really neat stuff with it, as well as tutorials.
@@ryuuzakiuchiha9712 It has Box2D which has physics for 2D objects, and as seen in the video yes, you can easily see the source code for a love project by just unzipping the .exe
The biggest myth is that each engine is made for a specific type of game for example, “Use unity for 2d games”, “Use UE for AAA games” when in reality now adays the skys the limit. You can achieve almost anything with every engine and get good results. Use whatever your comfortable with and continue making games 🥂👏
Well the issue is that some engines don't really have great built-in tools for working on a specific type of game more than anything else. If you are working in Godot for instance, you have all kinds of in-engine interfaces for working on tilemap graphics and sprite animation and the like, meanwhile in something like Unreal you don't get much of that and get a lot of stuff for working on skeletal animation and 3D geometry instead. Obviously you can create whatever you want in both really, but there are definitely engines that are better suited to one type of game than another.
I don't think it's a myth. I mean, there is some truth to what you're saying. If you really put in the effort, you can use any engine to make just about any game, but the devil will be in the details. Each engine will require certain compromises, as each engine has its pros and cons. Some things are easier done in one engine or another, and that's why people tend to recommend engines for certain specific things. Heck, if you're planning on making something as performance intensive as Noita or Terraria, then you're gonna have a hard time with Godot or Unity. A lightweight framework like Love2D or Raylib will give you greater performance with a lot less effort.
Reminder, Vampire Survivors is a clone rip-off of a Chinese indie mobile game called Magic Survival, they straight cloned the game and now everyone gives them credit for "creating a new genre"
The idea may not be as far fetched as you might think! Look up the 3DreamEngine. It adds 3D to Love2D, and the performance is pretty great. :) Hopefully this comment doesn't get disappeared for no reason like my last one...
the only difference is you cant have random people trying to push bad code. The source is available to compile and modify in any way you like for your project. I wouldn't say that's a big difference IMO but yes there not exactly the same@@gamefromscratch
Links
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gamefromscratch.com/gamedev-for-complete-beginners-tutorial-series/
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It’s not Love it’s Löve, it’s an ö not an o. 😂
@semydev not possible on physical keyboard
Game engine doesn't really matter in terms of success of selling a game. I just changes what you can do in the engine. There's nothing wrong with a simple easy game engine or a super complex powerful engine like unreal. Just focus on making your gameplay loop fun and interesting to expand and come back to.
100% true!
Game engine will not make a game itself! For 2D games you could even use something like RayLib and create a masterpiece ;-) Or SDXL (say hello to Factorio!).
Or be that weirdo and create you game in OGRE (Kenshi).
not if you are a Roblox developer
Love 2D is not just a great engine but a great way to learn software dev in general
Vampire Survivors ended up being ported to a completely different engine, they stoped using Phaser when they started thinking about bringing it to consoles.
Doesn't the original creator still use phaser and then the devs port it to Unity after?
@@WizardofWestmarchyes to add content. Watch no clip doc.
@@WizardofWestmarchYep, one of his devs said so.
@@MA-xb2yz That's where my memory of that fact came from, already watched it but been a long time (since it came out) so my memory might have been off.
I'm not sure if baba is you was also made with LOVE, but I remember opening its data to find its assets to see how coloring was done (fun fact: all sprites are white and color is added in game) and found the entire source code there written in Lua.
It was one of my most interesting find.
Another fun fact: baba is you has hidden rules that aren't shown in game. "text is push", "level is stop", "cursor is select". Devs used the game itself to program it.
@@callmeargo and I Wanna Be The Guy
It's nice to see games that can still be easily modded. A lot of modern stuff is about like, encrypting assets and making sure it's all signed and specifically making sure nothing is tampered with, but a lot of older games had fantastic modding communities because there were no such protections in place against it.
ye, they just love using Lua. Noita was also built in Lua using an in house engine they call "falling everything"
@@Aeduo yeah, that's the best thing about most indie games.
They are fun, don't have DRM (that slows down the game) and tamper protection.
And they treat their players as intelligent human being.
I wish industry goes back to the times that they open sourced their game engine when they were finished with them. (id tech 0-4, build engine, ...)
@@TheVideogamemaster9IWBTG was made in GameMaker.
I love how quickly you can prototype games in Love2d
Yes, don't worry about Game Engine. My first games were made in a framework called BlitzBASIC and it too was super super easy to use.
Are there real somewhat commercially successful games made with it?
I remember also one obscure framework in Scheme, Maybe it was ChickenScheme that some relatively successful indie games were made with it.
The tech and language doesn’t matter as long as you judge them by what you need, Many cutting edge stuff Unreal has for example may not be needed at all for your particular kind of game you are planning and may be better without a “Theory of Everything Game Engine”.
@@PRIMARYATIASthough it is free, scp containment breach was made in blitz3D which uses blitzBASIC as a scripting language
@@Redcactus5Thank you 🙏
Bro wtf is that obscure engine 🥶💀
Mike, it’s March.
Love is timeless.
@@sicfxmusic Love2D is spaceless
@MagicianofBlackChaos you're not wrong!
he was kinda right though lol
This comment aged like milk
Love2D is simply awesome to work with. I built my own game prototype with it, despite being a less experienced programmer. Admittedly, my game code may not adhere to best practices, and I don't fully grasp them yet. However, it functions, and that brought me immense satisfaction. Love2D offers a great experience, even for those who aren't seasoned programmers.
Vampire Survivors was ported to Unity a few time ago.
Mike, I beg you to continue your series on Love2D. The engine has way more potential than one thinks.
LOVE2D is awesome, I made my first mobile game prototype in it. It can seem kinda old but I'd still recommend it especially for people first getting into game dev
Love2D is pretty nice, I always recommend it as good option to start with game dev and for game jams. Low complexity, has a good framework and features to get started without getting too much in the way. The deploy is a bit cumbersome, but other than that, a good option for 2D
It's fascinating thay you can extract the source directly from the compuled binary. I guess thats a side effect of how Love2d builds/bundles its games. I'm definitely going to be perusing through the source later
Yeah not really compiled, the love exe just loads a lua file you specify. It’s pretty cool, do check it out!
As soon as I saw what it was made with I thought "Oh that's what Gamefromscratch is always talking about"
summing up: "It's the man that can make the way great not the way that can make man great."
Been messing with Playdate dev lately, Lua is a nice (and quirky) language!
Just curious how did you know to uncompressing the exe? Godot, Unity, etc is overwelming for me. The cool thing about those apps is it lets you "see" what is going to be displayed on the screen. The bad thing is as least for me is a beginner is there is a massive learning curb for the interface and scripting. Love2d doesn't have all those options but there is still a massive learning curb for things like simulated physics and collision detection.
Just finished Gravity Circuit (fantastic game) and was very pleasantly surprised to see in the credits that it was made with Love.
As someone currently working with PICO-8 and Lua, it seems that Love would be the next logical step to building a full commercial indie game.
i remember looking at love2d for the first time because of Mari0 (mario x portal)
I thought Mike was about to say Helldivers 2 was made in LOVE :D
Such a terribly underrated framework. With stellar performance, I might add, a hell of a lot better than Godot's (at least in all of my own comparisons). There's plenty of nice libraries for it too.
And there's 3DreamEngine, which adds 3D support to Love2d. It's still in the works, but seems usable.
as a beginning develpper, I find the idea that my code would be right out in the open like that, terrifying.
I love how easy love2d is
Sad to hear about balatro getting unfairly rated because of its theme
Thanks, that was a great video!!
Intravenous is also made with Love2D
So interesting note about vampire survivors, the version you get is actually a Unity build but the way they develop is:
1. Luca Galante creates the features/gameplay in phaser.js because he knows it the best
2. Luca sends that build to his team to Unity-fi it due to performance reasons with phaser.js.
Best engine you use is the engine you actually use. It's easier to move a project to a new engine than it is to create a brand-new game in one. So pick an engine that you find "easier" and run with your idea. Worry about performance later.
Don't be reckless ofcourse. Like performance should be a thought but don't worry about turning a set of 3 IF statements into some complex switch statement that calls static classes. Just keep it simple. The engines are fast, and the low-end hardware nowadays can take the load.
Have you seen the new Pico 8 Version and the Picotron?
I only care about a few things in an engine, and it must be cross platform and ideally support ads, there must be decent materials explaining and tutorializing and it must be free. Side bonus if making games moddable on pc isnt actively opposed
Nice, put a point on the framework little! Just the right tool for the right stuff, and yes your possibilities!
Should or not be löve (pronouncing the umlaut o (ö) as if you were about to barf) instead of love?
Or is that another case of Metal Umlauts?
Lol I am certainly no expert of pronunciation... I suck bad enough at just working with English ;)
I think it is without umlaut. It is just to stand out like Motörhead and Ragnarök
So a case of Metal Umlauts then
@@bexplosion "Ragnarök" is the actual (modern) spelling of that word though... 😅
LUA MENTIONED 🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣🔥🔥🔥🔥
Thx for the videos and tutorials. Doubts: Can you compare Love2D with Solar2D? I am more interest in how easy is to deploy to Android
I started with SDL2, then moved to LinGDX for making Android games. Then Unity, then Godot.
I highly recommend starting with a graphics library over a full scale engine.
This is what I call "CONTENT"
thank you mike!
best ad for Balatro ever
Isn't Helldivers 2 also using an obscure engine?
They use some Autodesk engine that got deprecated so they patched it themselves 🔥
Sorta.
Hell Divers uses Stingray, which was previously the BitSquid engine.
Autodesk owned it and did a pretty crap job with it.
I say sorta though as this engine, or at least forks of it, have powered some very high profile games, including the Warhammer Vermintide games as well as the new 40k shooter.
How does using Defold differ from Löve2d? (Defold is an engine that uses Lua as it's scripting language.) Question for anyone who has experience with both?
"Objection" , One Game actually had this idea but was never added again , that was Megaman X Command Mission , "Spider's Special"
It showed once again: It's not about the engine, it's absolutely only about the one using it. Engines are tools, it's about knowing what you work with and using it to create. There are stunning games created with pygame and awful ones created with unreal.
That's cool and all but.... I can't even install it on Ubuntu for some reason. Not sure what I'm missing but the ppa does not seem to work.
I LÖVE this!
I know it was a different engine, but imagine the irony if Undertale was made with this 😂
God, remaking balatro in unreal would be painful
YAY! Now for Lovr.
this channel is so great
Isn't Palworld 2024's biggest indie hit though?
I don't really know if I agree that Love is easier than Godot. Having a GUI I think is often more intuitive and easier to get into, than just pure code and reading docs.
but Love2d...allows for others to easily see your code by just unzipping the .exe? wtf?
wondering about exactly the same
Is is possible to include raw bytecode instead of Lua source files. It's takes some know-how to do though and for many games there is no reason for it. Why would you care if someone can read your code? You've still got copyright so it can't be copied or used in any other project without your permission. In any case, no code in an indie is unique enough to hide and data-miners can understand everything about a game even if source code is not included so it isn't even good for keeping "secrets".
Are you afraid of other nerds looking at the code? Unreal shares their code for everyone to see including Nanite and no problem, Same thing about research papers freely available online about AI, Computer Graphics, Math etc. stuff that could be applicable to achieve some particular effect within your game.
Only parts of multiplayer games like servers are crucial to make closed source, The rest doesn’t that matter.
aw hell naw man..
What about Pygame
Can certainly be a good introduction to game development. Not sure if there are many hugely successful titles made with PyGame, but I do know in the Visual Novel space, Python is certainly an option. Really it comes down to the type of game. Both of the hits mentioned here could probably have been made with PyGame, certainly Balatro. I do think it has some performance issues when it comes to huge numbers of sprites, so Vampire Survivors may not be ideal.
There’s a RUclipsr who makes games using Pygame called dafluffypotato and he built various systems which bypasses the performance issues of python and Pygame.
It's a viable option for those who prefer using Python. The youtuber DaFluffyPotato has been making some really neat stuff with it, as well as tutorials.
@@gamefromscratch How about Raylib with Python bindings?
love2d有啥物理引擎方便使用的吗，lua是不是比较容易被破解？
Is there any physical engine works for love2d? lua based game easy to crack?
@@ryuuzakiuchiha9712 It has Box2D which has physics for 2D objects, and as seen in the video yes, you can easily see the source code for a love project by just unzipping the .exe
I wanted to install it a couple of months ago, but virus total said it contains viruses for some reason
The engine or the game?
If it was from the official site then it was a false alarm.
@@wellwellwelp the engine
@@DarkerCry okay, will check out, then. Thaks
@@ORANOID Pay attention what AVs think that it's a virus. Ignore obscure ones ;-)
Geometry Dash was made in Cocos-2DX, so this isnt a surprise
He said Obfuscated
Alright. My game engine of choice is Microsoft Excel.
I'm a löve user!
The biggest myth is that each engine is made for a specific type of game for example, “Use unity for 2d games”, “Use UE for AAA games” when in reality now adays the skys the limit. You can achieve almost anything with every engine and get good results. Use whatever your comfortable with and continue making games 🥂👏
Well the issue is that some engines don't really have great built-in tools for working on a specific type of game more than anything else. If you are working in Godot for instance, you have all kinds of in-engine interfaces for working on tilemap graphics and sprite animation and the like, meanwhile in something like Unreal you don't get much of that and get a lot of stuff for working on skeletal animation and 3D geometry instead. Obviously you can create whatever you want in both really, but there are definitely engines that are better suited to one type of game than another.
I mean… theres nuance to that, but yeah you can use pretty much whatever you want
I don't think it's a myth. I mean, there is some truth to what you're saying. If you really put in the effort, you can use any engine to make just about any game, but the devil will be in the details. Each engine will require certain compromises, as each engine has its pros and cons. Some things are easier done in one engine or another, and that's why people tend to recommend engines for certain specific things.
Heck, if you're planning on making something as performance intensive as Noita or Terraria, then you're gonna have a hard time with Godot or Unity. A lightweight framework like Love2D or Raylib will give you greater performance with a lot less effort.
nice
Reminder, Vampire Survivors is a clone rip-off of a Chinese indie mobile game called Magic Survival, they straight cloned the game and now everyone gives them credit for "creating a new genre"
That's the worst part, but Magic Survival shares part in the blame as they were pretty stubborn with wanting to port their game to PC.
Great video but everytime you said 'Survivor' and not 'Survivors' it hurt my soul
it's a bit scary how easy you can see and steal everything from a published love2D game :P
Imagine somebody using LOVE Lua to make Battlefield 2042
Maybe LÖVR?
Look up the 3DreamEngine. It adds 3D to love2D, and the performance is pretty damn good. :)
The idea may not be as far fetched as you might think! Look up the 3DreamEngine. It adds 3D to Love2D, and the performance is pretty great. :)
Hopefully this comment doesn't get disappeared for no reason like my last one...
its only march....
I like with godot its really eazy to decompile. and you basically can just press play and it will work. Looking other game source codes.
that's also how i learned programming by decompiling games in the game maker 8 days. so based.
How lövely
you mean 2023s
Can you talk about Roblox more?
UE5 is open source also
Edit : * source available
Their license permits users to access and modify the source code but because it still has restrictions it is not open source
!!!?... 🙄
It's source available, not open source.
UE5 is source available, there is a big LEGAL difference between open source and source available.
the only difference is you cant have random people trying to push bad code. The source is available to compile and modify in any way you like for your project. I wouldn't say that's a big difference IMO but yes there not exactly the same@@gamefromscratch
First! pin pls?