Tales of Symphonia HD - Zelos' Flanoir Scene

[@SuperLlama42]

Love how one of the most seemingly superficial characters in the game turns out to be one of the most complex.

[@kidkid146]

"Man, I can't believe I'm joining the weaker side."
Wow, that was a foreshadow I've never heard of in all my years of playing Symphonia.

[@enriqueu1319]

Or mostly The 90 percent of The RPG games hahaha

[@hilma8073]

"It was my mother's blood-" OH OKAY.

[@imackshungames4304]

Me: WOW...DAMN...Umm...Wasn't expecting the conversation to take such a serious turn. lol

[@devildogkogg8353]

Zelos, while flawed, is far more selfless and mature than he seems.
He never said a peep of how deeply he was suffering except in this one scene, which canonically, was not shared with Lloyd: he kept it to himself and stayed positive. And he did a great deal of making sure the group was optimistic. While it's true that he wanted to be free from his responsibilities as a chosen, his primary reason for wanting Seles to be the chosen is because he knows she actually wants to be, and also deserves it more.
Also, after Sheena lost Corrine, Zelos was the only one celebrating her victory over Volt while everyone else was sulking over Corrine. Zelos did this because he didn't want Sheena to stay in a depressing atmosphere and make her feel worse. This moment was his character personified. He does not want anyone to give in to their doom and gloom, he wants them to stay looking on the bright side even if it hurts.

[@bailinton4171]

zelos grew up with out knowing what it was like having friends
all those women only wanted to date the chosen not himself
no one ever saw that zelos was a human being with a tragic life

[@Ddangerdan]

Evidently Lloyd noticed.

[@jesuiscontent8271]

Zelos' character is so well written

[@RobinLeft]

So THAT'S what Zelos was talking about when I fought him! I was so confused, and I kept seeing people saying he was such a tragic character, while I was thinking that was just pulled out of nowhere. When I play this game again, I'm keeping Zelos alive.

[@Onigirli]

Even though I like having Kratos on my end-game team it's not worth seeing Zelos killed off in such a bitter, bitter way. "I just got tired of living."

[@MISTERX7725_]

Am I the only person that laughed when Lloyd replied "Hell yes!" when Zelos said he wanted everything to be destroyed?

[@zelos1826]

I love Zelos so much. And this scene reveals so much about his past... makes me sad. :(

[@RealEvilLordExdeath]

Well if you like him, don't Play him,
because if you do and have SoB Lloyd not in your Party
this Szene will not happen.
Fkn Lloyd worst Tales of Protagonist ever....well together with Jude, that rapist!

[@rayna_dakota2456]

@@RealEvilLordExdeath I don't think that's how the relationships work, i don't think they are related to your party though he is quite hard to get out of all the characters, spent ages cooking and cooking fro his scenes.

[@stonethemason12]

The scene where his mother tells him he should have never been born is actually depicted in the animation. Which you can find pretty easily by typing in Tales of Symphonia the Animation somewhere.

[@arizonakiller8892]

When you realize Zelos was the one who was hurt the most out of all your companions.

[@derpatwerknsubbers1680]

The girl that just fell in love was asked to give up what it meant to be human to save the world.
A small half elf boy, terrified of the world around him had questions the world wasn’t ready to answer.
A young girl with unique summoning arts seeks self-redemption by exiling herself; her mission: to kill the chosen of the dying world.
A young girl had her emotions locked away for 20 years, upon regaining them, she had much to learn and teach about the way people treat one another.
A man, eager to help the world, has created a system upon which the chosen few can become strong, at a terrible cost.

[@wevegottrouble5891]

There is not a single playable character in Symphonia who doesn't have at least one trauma - but Zelos is very high up on the list for having the worst.
He is conceived not as a love child, but as an accessory to a lecherous Chosen One who forcefully marries a woman that loved someone else. He is also put into direct competition with Seles, who is conceived in the exact same way, except she's a girl and Zelos is picked instead of her. Both Zelos and Seles did nothing wrong, but they were both torn apart by an extremely toxic system that favored someone on principle of birth, not principle of talent.
Seles' mother tries to assassinate Zelos and Zelos' mother takes the blow meant for him. Her last words are "You should have never been born.", which caused an immediate trauma within Zelos considering that she died mere moments later.
The entire game, you are supposed to dislike Zelos for being the way he is. A man who chases panties over friendships, a spoiled narcissist who clearly bathes in the luxury of being the Chosen One - and it's only in this exact scene in Flanoir that you realize why he is that way. It's not because Zelos had an amazing life - it's because he had a terrible life, and his way of escaping from this terrible life is to seek immediate comfort in the present.
The love he never received from his mother, the church OR the royalty he was surrounded with?
A few dozen consorts will do.
His immense wealth, reputation and status?
He wants to run away from it and leaves as many times as he can. You actually indirectly find this out because Zelos even TELLS you how to get out of Meltokio (through the sewer system) because he was never allowed to leave by himself when he was younger, being the Chosen. There is also this scene in Sybak where a beggar boy wants to find his mother and tells the Chosen how awful rich people like him are for mistreating the poor - and guess what he says there as well? If everything comes to you for free, you become lazy, shitty, spoiled and provide nothing to the people. He indirectly tells the kid "If you were a rich snotsnob like me, you'd be an asshole too", which is why he hires that kid's mother to work hard for him for honest money. Partially because he feels bad for the kid, but also partially because he feels it's RIGHT that those who don't want to work hard shouldn't be allowed to sit atop a throne of gold. This is such a huge, overglossed point about Zelos that I think nobody ever acknowledges: Zelos KNOWS what being spoiled feels like, and he hates it. He wishes it on nobody, and that's why he's so strict on the little homeless boy, because he wants the boy to have the life Zelos couldn't have - a life of honest work and challenges for a worthy goal.
His lack of loyalty to Lloyd and the group?
Directly stems from the fact that Zelos never had anyone he could trust himself. His half-sister was separated from him, his mother was killed, his father was a lecherous harem man, the church hates him and other royals see him as an active threat.
Both Sylvarant and Tethe'alla have Chosen Ones, and they both have awful lives because of it.
Colette was born into a loving family and had a wonderful childhood followed by a terrible journey of suicide.
Zelos was born into a dismissive family and had a terrible childhood followed by a careless, happy-go-lucky journey.

[@MaxUltimata]

Worth noting that the tipping point is Lloyd's last words to him before they head to the Tower of Salvation. With every Flanoir scene except Kratos, Lloyd says "I trust you", which makes Zelos realize he was always welcome within the group. With Kratos, Lloyd says "Can I really trust you?", which makes him realize he was never fully trusted in the party and probably just used as a means to an end like everyone else he was ever around.

[@Ivetraventosperez]

I think Presea is definitely the one who has had it the worst. Motherless, at approximately 12 years of age, she underwent an experiment to help her father carve sacred wood. His sister went to work for a nobleman and has never seen her since. She lost all her emotions, her body stopped growing, and everyone in Ozette hated her. For a long time (we don't know how long), she was giving medicine to her father who had died and she wasn't able to perceive that his father had died. She realized it as soon as she got her emotions back. Imagine how traumatic it must be to realize that your father has been dead for a long time (probably even years) in bed and you haven't noticed it until now, because when she joins Lloyd on his journey she is about 28 years old. And when she finally gets news of her sister, it turns out that she turned into a monster and was murdered. The life of Zelos is also one of the most traumatic, but I don't think anyone has suffered as much as Presea. I find her events much more traumatic, as you can tell that she has a kind of identity crisis after everything that happened.

[@devildogkogg8353]

I think you are being unfair to Zelos' father. "Lecherous?" He did not have a choice in the matter either, and Zelos' mother was not the woman he loved. It was just as much against his will as hers.

[@ihavenoclevername8300]

She said “I should never have been born” ….Jesus Christ man I I think I need a drink after that holy shit!

[@darthakaya]

As much as I like having Collette or Sheena here, Zelos's scene is my favorite because of the lore. It's one of the few times you see him completely serious

[@loregasmic]

Zelos: "Your fervent enthusiasm is enough to melt all the snow in Flanoir."
Dawn of the New World:

[@recordkeepertype0662]

The best bro, indeed.

[@Saev]

So many years of not seeing this beautiful scene, thank you.

[@drewsuismclovin]

without this scene, Zelos's last words made absolute sht sense.

[@killingspeerx]

+drewsuismclovin INDEED, I MEAN I THOUGHT THAT HIS REASON WAS SHITTY WHEN HE BETRAYED US!!!
the problem is that not everyone can access this scene

[@bluerose8895]

Gotta love this scene. It's so sweet

[@niceguy4441]

Zelos isn't my favorite character, but he has the best VA.

[@ghost245353]

The writers could have added that Zelo's mother intentionally got in the way of the attack meant to kill Zelos so we could believe that she still loved him enough to sacrifice her life to save his. I believe the writers omitted writing anything to imply such selflessness because they want us to believe that she really did not love him and deeply regretted giving birth to him.

[@derpatwerknsubbers1680]

The unfortunate truth is that regardless of if she did that or not... Zelos didn’t believe that was the case. He spent his entire life thinking everyone resented him or viewed him as a potential threat.

[@HaseosAtoli]

They didn't add it because as Zelos said, they both loved other people. His mother's last words were "you should never have been born". A mother who loves her kid even a little bit would not let those be her last words.

[@wevegottrouble5891]

@@HaseosAtoli It's ambiguous.
There are two ways you can understand what she said to Zelos:
1. You should not have been born because I hate
2. You should not have been born because this world hates you
She's not wrong - Zelos really shouldn't have been born.
Not under the circumstances that he did; conceived as an accessory to a disloyal, lecherous Chosen One who tangoed with multiple women. It's a harsh reality, but Zelos was never meant to be born, not between these two people at least. Much like how a victim of SA could feel that the child they received on top of their trauma should not have been born. He was a victim of the system that required an heir to the title of the Chosen One, and when he finally WAS born he was surrounded by a jealous aristocracy and a faith that wanted him gone, effectively his mother had no choice but to birth a child that would never ever find true happiness.
The ambiguous part is that it's left to interpretation how his mother meant what she said because Zelos is the one telling the story, and Zelos obviously has his own horses in the race, being the victim in the situation. Whether she said what she did because she genuinely hated Zelos for being the product of her unwanted marriage to a jerk, or if she really only said what she did because she genuinely believed that Zelos was set up to fail from the start, put into a world where nobody could love him... one thing feels very clear to me: I don't think she accidentally caught the bullet for Zelos.
Between letting your own child die and continuing your abusive life with your forcefully married husband and choosing to die to protect your own child, I think even an abusive mother who doesn't think highly of her own son would choose the latter, especially when you know that that both Zelos and his mother suffer from the same problem: A life without love.

[@Rahbiel_AotD]

[SPOILERS]
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Y’know the real fucked up part? Even if he saw all that suffering he went thru was for the greater good and decided to become the Chosen and went on the Journey, Cruxis and the Desians would never have accepted him as the vessel and killed him on the spot. There’s no way in hell Mithos would want Martel’s soul inside Zelos’ body; I mean can you even imagine??

[@CaityRaindrop]

Aww my poor bambino

[@SammieWeiss]

This is great touching from a great character. And I like to ask sometime, is it fine if I use this scene and others like this for my LP of Tales of Symphonia?

[@redclanwool1590]

He says with a calm smile ..bandai

[@myffanwythecorgi555]

See and I had to come to youtube to see this scene cause I always saved him...aaahhhh!#

[@Onigirli]

Zeros-san, I...

[@RyanBlazeheart]

Which one do you feel is most Canon? Colette or Zelos?

[@ShiningLightVT]

I heard zelos was the hardest to have him trust you, how hard was it to get the flanoir scene with him?

[@CaramellNeko]

+Shining Light (Ace) It's not hard at all. Just be a little less friendly towards all the other characters (especially Colette, Genis and Raine), do all of his flashy things on the world map and you should get him in Flanoir. Now getting him at Altessa's place (or Dirk's, for that matter) is something else. If you want to see his conversations there, make sure to be a complete douchebag to all the other characters, do all of Zelos sidequests as soon as possible and pick him whenever you have the choice to do so, for example when someone has to cook curry for the gnomelette. It's pretty tricky, since Zelos really has issues with trusting people :'D

[@ShiningLightVT]

CaramellNeko ok. Got it.

[@sagenebula]

Never agree with anything Kratos ever says or does in Zelos' presence.

[@mukuroikusaba7998]

It's funny how that's both a gameplay thing AND a hint that Zelos dislikes Kratos.

[@smileplease_91]

The hardest person for me was freaking Presea. Good God, man.

[@Multigameguy35]

what did the chosen's orb do?
also, anyone remember what the royal fam had against zelos?

[@Evilriku13]

The Chosen orb does alter the scene before the final hallway in the tower of salvation before fighting Pronyma. And it also is one of three once per playthrough key items alongside something you can get from Colette and something you can get from Kratos at their Flanoir scenes.

[@Zombie234-kq2yb]

❤😂🎉😢😢😮😅😊

[@Faithepengster]

How do you get a scene with Zelos?

[@TalesStuff]

You need to have the highest affection with him. Can find guides that say where to get affection for each character.

[@Lux_the_Lost]

Basically, there's a hidden bit of data in-game rating everyone's current affinity toward Lloyd. This can be affected by various choices you make throughout the game and during the optional skits you can sometimes find in spots around the world map.
Before this scene, Lloyd can be visited by up to four people; the three he has the highest affinity with, plus Kratos will show up somewhere in the lineup no matter what. You can accept or turn down any of them until you hit whoever is fourth, in which case you will view that person's scene without the choice.
It's particularly tricky to get Zelos here because I believe he starts with the lowest base affinity of anyone in the whole party; you practically have to hunt his optional skits and jump through hoops for this one. I actually never got it on a first playthrough.

[@jackleveille9319]

@@Lux_the_Lost That's because pretty much everyone got Colette on their first playthrough.

[@Lux_the_Lost]

@@jackleveille9319 Yep, myself included. Don't get me wrong, I like that one too but I do kinda wish you didn't have to jump through so many hoops for Zelos.

[@Neogears1312]

@@Lux_the_Lostthat’s game cube exclusive btw. Kratos not guaranteed on not GameCube rereleases.

[@kataraaang123]

how do i get all these cutscenes like how can i get zelos? how do i get sheena? or Colette? all i get is raine and genis and like WHY? i dont want them. lol please help D:

[@jaketriet7192]

The party members who stay behind in Flanoir are the ones who have the highest affection for Lloyd. On a normal playthrough, if you are nice to everyone in the dialogue options and don't do anything special, you will get Colette, Genis, Sheena, and Kratos as your options.
If you want someone different, you have to be exceptionally nice to that character while being mean to Colette and Genis. Agreeing with Raine a lot during the world regeneration quest will lower their values enough so that you can get someone else.
Keep in mind though that for the party members you recruit in Tethe'alla, you may need to do their individual side quests and find their glowing skit points on the world map in order to bring them ahead of Raine.
Cooking also affects affection values. If Lloyd cooks certain ingredients while cooking in battle, it will please or displease certain party members and change their affection accordingly. Characters will say which food they like or dislike in skits throughout the early parts of the game. For example, Colette likes fruits and hates bell peppers.
If you want Zelos, the best strategy is:
1) Agree with Raine from the beginning of the game until you visit the Tower of Salvation for the first time, annoying Genis and Colette. Tell Colette she can't come with you at the start, and generally be mean to every other non-player character you meet.
2) Agree with Zelos every chance you get after you recruit him. Choose him to cook in the Temple of Earth and to rescue Kate. Take him with Lloyd to fight Forcystus.
3) Make sure to save Princess Hilda and help the lost boy in Sybak, while also searching around and answering positively to all of his glowing skits on the world map after you have the rheiards.

[@TalesStuff]

To clarify the top, in the PS2/PS3 versions Kratos has to be in the top three like everyone else. It automatically chooses the third if you get to them.

[@GRios8627]

+Jake Triet that method has worked for you?

[@bluerose8895]

+kataraaang123 It's an affection system. You want to pick certain dialogue options that are different from how "Lloyd would answer" There are skit points around the map. Make sure you get ALL of those for the chracter you want. Zelos is the hardest to get. You wanna make sure you choose the options that give him your trust. For example when you are in the library with mithos and Zelos says "Are you sure we can trust Kratos?" Something to that effect. Make sure to choose "We can't be sure." so Zelos 's affection is raised. You can also do special events. There's lots of guides. I always take a note book and minus and add affection points. Great way to keep ontop of it!

[@KefkaFanatic]

I literally chose him to live in one playthrough. Kratos all the way.

[@JohnDoe-wy1zt]

Yes, Zelos is a tragic character, but I still can't despise him for betraying the group