The Single Best Overheating Fix For All Classic Cars
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- Опубликовано: 1 фев 2023
- Overheating classic car? Yeah, me too. This is the best way we have found to permanently fix the notorious overheating issue.
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Single best advice for cooling is running the correct heat range plug and vacuum advance. Magic Pill: vacuum advance. Every time. None of the cars I set up require electric fans. Because I set them up correctly. Yes. Even my .030 over 10.66/1, Avgas burning, Iron head Pontiac runs 175° in the Texas heat with the AC on. Factory radiator, fan and clutch. Advance. It’s everything.
All I needed was 10 degrees of timing from my vacuum advance?
So if I have a distributor without a vacuum advance , a distributor with a vacuum advance all I’d need?
Well I need your know how here in Texas with my Mopar BB .
I was just thinking that the recommended RC12YC plugs in my ProMaxx heads for my FE that's been overheating were a bit hot. I'm going down a few numbers to see if that helps along with your other tips.
Bill is 100% correct on all points, people. And there's zero reason to remove vacuum advance. You don't actually have a race car you drive around town in, no matter how badass your car seems. If your car runs "better" without vacuum advance, you have done something wrong, frankly, in thinking your car is actually a race car. Don't take my word for it, read the many explanations from the engineers that designed the engines and the racers who know why their racing cars don't need vacuum advance. And stop using f'ing ported vacuum. That's a band-aid for a problem you don't have. AT WOT you have no vacuum to pull. At idle you want the ignition advanced more to be at the right spot on the curve because you have LESS air and fuel at idle. This is where you need MORE ignition timing. Not less! And if your classic overheats, get rid of the flex fan. Make sure your STEEL fan is the proper distance in the shroud, And USE a fan shroud. See if you need a new clutch if you have a clutch fan. Next, use the damned overflow tank or surge tank the car is supposed to have. Use a radiator that isn't gunked up! replace your radiator hoses so they don't collapse.Not rocket science. "Oh, I don't want to lose the horsepower". Jesus! stop de-tuning your engine!
I've had 10 hot rods in the last 45 years, and without exception, every one of them, except the last one had overheating issues at one time or another. My last car though was a freak, a 1969 Nova with a 505 cu in supposedly making 657 HP. I bought it from a classic car dealer, I test drove it, and then let it idle for 20 minutes waiting for the dreaded heat issues to show up. I was shocked that it stayed at 180 on an 80-degree day too. It had 2 1/8 ceramic headers which ran at 245 degrees middles tubes, and 230 outer via laser heat gun. Under hood temp shocked me because it was so cool. Radiator was a modern aluminum with shroud and flex fan to boot. I wish all my other cars ran as cool as that one. I sold the car after 7 years due to taking it out on a Banzai run and almost flipping it. Excellent video!!!!
Good advice, and good content. Also...if you want to eliminate the need for an extra temp switch, you can set up the Holley Sniper to control the fans.
Yes, the setup you used will work and by the time you pay a shop to install it you'll spend $2500-$3000 or more depending on the mess they find installing it. An AcDelco fan clutch, 6 blade 17"-18" fan and a shroud will fix this every time on anything Chevrolet, Buick, Pontiac, Olds, AMC, etc for around $300 in parts given you have an engine and radiator that are in good working condition, setup right and room for the fan. Running a 160 degree thermostat is not good advise, neither is how you set it up with the holley sniper system. An engine does not run at it's most effiecient in that heat range, scientific fact. Neither does the aftermarket EFI. The Sniper system is setup from holley to not allow closed loop operation below 160 degrees for starters. You should have put a 195 degree thermostat in it, throw away the temp switch you put in to control the fans and wired them into the Sniper system to control them with a trinary switch for his Air conditioning so the fans will not only turn on/off with the temperature set up in the holley but they will also turn on when he switches the air conditioning on and cycle as they should with the AC system. They can also be programmed to shut off over a given throttle position for added performance. A better option if your going to spend that kind of money but don't have an EFI system to control an electric fan setup is to use a controller from someone like Dakota Digital with pulse width modulated fans that operate like a newer vehicle. For years now the manufacturer's have used 2 temp senders, one that sends a reading to the gauge and a second sender that sends a reading to the ECM. The gauge tells the driver their car is running at 195 deg, the one for the ECM is telling it the real running temp which is 205-210 degrees. They did this because the public has been used to seeing their vehicles run at 195 forever and when they figured out what we originally thought was the best temp for an engine to run at (195*) was wrong most people freaked out when they saw the temps running at 210*. The easiest way to make the public feel at ease was to just toss another sender in and program it to show it was running at 195 when it really is at 205-210 degrees. Looking at OEM programming with HpTuners, EFI live or using a J2534 will show you this.
Thank you for the advice
I have 50 chevy that runs hot and currently building 66 Nova. I will incorporate your good advice on my Nova
My 58 Bel Air with mechanical fan and OG radiator runs like a champ in West Texas.
I definitely saw those fans 30 years ago on TV. It was during an old episode of General Ben.
For my 460 in my Gran Torino. I converted to electric fans. I got an aluminum 3 row from Champion with their shroud. I got two high volume Spal fans that pull. Pusher fans are kind of dumb. It's like a hurricane when the fans start.
The water temp actually DROPS at stoplights on really hot days.
I've done a few cars. Electric fans and electric fuel pump (with a return) are the first two mods I'd make on any old car. No overheating and no vapor lock.
Yeah on most of our cars you can hear the fans over the sound of the car running, they're no joke. If you're not careful, they might pull you through a stoplight lol
Damn...you guys are cracking on homies Camaro😂
your pops looks like a younger version of Ethan Hawke and an amazing mechanic!! love your videos guys
I thought you were gonna say move to Alaska! Thats a sweet set up.
Hi, Love watching you guys. Do you guys have a video on replacing shocks and coils on 62 impala
Hi , Pretty good
I cure most of my overheating issues the same way
1. ensure ignition timing is set no more that 6 degrees at idle, much more and it strains the thump/thump of the starter - note when a engine is hot and you switch of it has more heat and the heat gives more thermal timing advance - so when you come back 5 to 10mins later it is harder to start
2. clutch fans need to be checked, most times they work ok, but if temperatures creep up in traffic, then you are suffering lack of air flow, it happens to me, in 5 mins it went from 1/4 to 1/2, 5 mins later approaching 3/4 and i could feel the bad idle starting, so i turned into the next street and drove 3 to 5 mins in quiet roads and the temperature went back to 1/2 then 1/4 - issue was clutch fan - a quick test is engine off, roll up some newspaper and hold it against the blades, have some one start the car - i good fan or clutch fan should push the newspaper away ** that is a proper say 20 page newspaper rolled not a singe A4 sheet **
Mine the paper held back the fan at idle and at revs so it was just slipping mainly
i purchased a new one and problem solved the car sat a 1/4 idle all summer in traffic with air on
3. fan should is important, it is not a finger protector it is a funnel !! , if funnels the air over the blades so all the air going through the fan is centered or concentrated rather than being scattered
4. you should use the max size fan that fits without hitting shroud or water hoses, plus more blades at a aggressive angle = more air but also more noise
5. more hp = more heat = hotter engine, thus need for larger radiator
6. 2 core radiators are fine, you can go 3 core, but get the cores ofsett, it they are lined up straight the air flow hits the first one and does almost noting on the 2nd and 3rd row behind it
Also large diameter cores dont work that well, as the amount of water in the tube has more surface area volume in relation to a smaller tube when the water volume has a higher percentage of copper or aluminium cores around it - think of say a large cold tube, if the water inside is "skinny" the water should cool, but if the diameter is to big there is not enough metal cooling in relation to the water
7. Aluminum radiator Vs copper, Identical sec and design Aluminium is 20 degrees cooler - the drawback is most radiator shops cannot repair them ** note while most new ebay aluminium radiators are cheap - be careful of the ones with plastic fittings - plastic does not cool and if it splits it basically need to go in the bin, copper can be fixed many times
8. a coolant recovery catch can and the special cap is a must, no more water to blow out the rubber hose so your water level is always 100%
9. electric fans - while fitting up front is easier, hey do impede air flow, however mounting at the rear is slightly better as the air has passed the core and is only being obstructed after the fact, while this is not perfect it is better than obstructing up front
10. i large electric fan is better than 2 smaller ones as the larger fan cover s more radiator area, however if the fan fails you have no standby, if 1 fan in a dual dies you still have 50% available
11. donot delete the thermostat, if in doubt you can test in in a glass of water and a thermometer, but for the price of a thermostat get a new one that opens 10 or 20 degrees earlier 150-160 is a good all year and 170-180 if you live in snow land so that your heater will function earlier
Other than pub talk - the no thermostat will run colder for the most part, but the water goes so fast through the radiator it does not stay there long enough to cool down
12. use a thermal meter / gun n heads / thermostat housing, water pump , top tank of radiator bottom tank of radiator, you should see at least 10 degrees difference ** top and bottom tank of radiator should be 20 to 30 degrees difference if the water has been cooled down
13. i believe the rule of thumb is 12-15 fins per inch on radiator ( almost the same magic number as a dozen or the carby air to fuel ratio ) to may fins are not enough to disburse into the air, to many dont allow air flow between them
14. EFI and return fuel line of hot fuel is your best friend, most temperamental carby engines respond well to a conversion to EFI and fuel return line with using the same colling system
15. Use a proper radiator ant freeze anti boil and follow the instruction, do not mix brands , do not mix red and green together - it may not drop temperatures much but it will stop your engine block and head getting rust in the water chambers - when i was 16 and my first cheap 20 year old car, i spent about 30 min dumping rusty radiator water, top up, run engine 1 minute , dump rusty water , this process took about 30 mins with at least 5 or 6 top up / run and dump cycles
Oh my worse head baser was fixed after 8 years - the problem was when it had a welsh plug leak, i removed the old one, only to find some prior clown had changed the welsh plugs before and pushed 2 of them into the block - thank for nothing mr unknown !!
Whats better on a carburated 350 on hot summer season 160 or 180 degrees thermostat? Nice work
You couild run 2 overlapping plastic mechanical fans with a pulley system . then you could get them lower and spread apart .On one car I built , I put a second rad , flat over the fuel tank , with an electric fan . I ran tubing in series with the front rad , and you can make the rear rad as big as you want , because its hidden . It worked very well .
I have a '52 Chevy with a 350 and A/C. I run a brass/copper triple flow radiator with a mechanical fan and my car runs at 180 on the hottest day with the A/C on. With the A/C off, it runs at 145 around town.
Manual fan , an a shroud !!!, electric fans are a joke on a streetcar, I could sit in tx summer heat in traffic on the freeway with no problem, with a 40 over engine
What pressure is the cooling system running at? Maybe a higher pressure cap will keep it from over heating.
I would love a 5.7 swap in my Blazer ZR2. Mine is doing the same at regular driving
Do you have it set for both fans to come on at the same time or one at a time?
Those back tires are on the wrong side the are spinning the wrong direction boys 😮 I love your guys channel especially the master m he’s totally funny 😂❤
Yeah we noticed that later on after the video😂 thank you, appreciate the constant support 👍
I love the catch can addition, you never see that. However, I disagree on the switch; I like the 160 switch instead of the 180. I also use PERFORMANCE high CfM expensive fans. On top of that, I use a 160-165 thermostat instead of a 180. Other than that; this is a perfect recipe. I would look into high cfm ($230 a piece) fans though. And I have an eBay aluminum 4 core radiator and it has dual fan mounts, and my cars are doing better temp wise than what you were hoping for with this build.
So maybe the owner prefers old school relays to power dual Spals (about 30 amps combined) ON-OFF-ON-OFF, or maybe you do. It can't be cost, since I know how stupid expensive Ron Davis radiators are. I used to use relays until I discovered there are now modern PWM fan controllers that will allow those fans to begin at about 20% when they sense a need. With that setup, those fan would never need to see full power again. I use controllers from autocoolguy. One controller will easily do those dual fans. You should read about them.
Done that, i even tried putting bigger oil cooler, but the thing i did that fixed the overheat, is change the exhaust and the muffler, to manage the backflow, make sure the backflow is just enough, i think it affects everything, like engine and turbo, cant prove it but it eliminated my overheating problem
A stock type mechanical fan with shroud does work; 220 in not overheating but maximum. My BMW 325 runs at 212. A closed system works better with air chamber on top like BMW, this way it never leaks and stays pressurized. This keep radiator full at all times; 180 degree thermostat is best.
I see alot of videos that say normal engine temp should be 180-200. I have a chevy c10 that has no thermostat and engine stays at 160-180. I want to put a thermostat because every video says you should have it but Im afraid that as soon as I install the truck will overheat. Im currently running a single electric fan. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks.
I would like to know what the rear gear ratio and trans high gear?
Will this radiator work on a 1981 el Camino
What kinda water pump is that with the 2 nipples sticking out of it u usually see the standard with 1 heater hose attachment
In my 70 Z/28 4 speed I am using a 4 core rad, factory clutch fan with a 180* stat. The temp stays at 180* even in 93* weather.
the best fix is the ignition curve
My 91 camaro did the same after dual fans didn't help turn out to be gum or something stuck between the fins on the radiator clean it never overheated again
My favorite ride 1962 🇺🇲
How did it cost just for the radiator setup?
I use 4 corner cooling and my big block runs cool and beautiful.
What is 4 corner cooling?
@@davidgalea6113 You draw coolant from the back of the heads as well as the front. Some intakes come with the ports already available, but you have to drill and tap most intakes.
@@joe-hp4nk interesting.. thanks for the info.
I seen a vid on a 5.7 Suburban, Summit dual fan kit & he said that he needed a 240a Alternator. Anything lower, his lights weren't bright enough & it was killing his battery.
This is the only reason I haven't swapped to an electric fan kit for my 02' 4.3 Vortec.
That seems crazy! Twin fans only pull 50 to 60 amps maaaax while running. Start up it's probably a bit higher like maybe 100amps.
Those engines require much more amperage stock to run because of all the electrical components. A 240 amp alternator sounds about right, especially if you have a stereo or other things drawing power. You might need to get a different alternator bracket for it as the 240 amp alternators have a bigger body than the ones with less amps.
My 02' Blazer ZR2 4.3 Vortec has always ran around 200° w/ a 195° thermostat in the hot summers & cold winters here in SE Texas.
Now she's slowly creeping up to 210°or higher the further i drive her. I'm very OCD about my cars & I love "shade tree tinkering "
I've flushed her twice, tried 3 different thermostats & a new Severe Duty Clutch Fan with no success. There's no leaks or coolant loss.
I'm installing a new waterpump, hoses, belt, tensioner, idler pulley a replacement SevereDutyClutchFan & coolant tomorrow.
The only thing i can think of is a weak pump. I've had about everything else replaced. Maybe I'm worried over nothing & 210 plus temp is ok for this truck. It's just ran cooler in the past
Yeah, boiling for water is 212, add a bit of anti freeze, and it's probably 220, now add 15 psi pressure it bumps up. I'm sure there is a chart on this. As long as it doesn't boil, you should be fine.
Pure water, with "water wetter" additive, cools better than a strong antifreeze mix.
I personally prefer to use the the EFI to control/set the fan on and off temperature instead of the sensor.
Hi - funny thing most modern efi cars dont have a heating issue as they use correct air fuel mixture and spark advance
Good tip
Cool an over heated engine to operating temperature, before shutting it down, if at all possible
Just let it run and hit the radiator with a garden hose.
It's messy.
Fans are gonna pull water through the radiator and mist the engine pulling radiant heat.
I go in from the grill, then pop the hood and alternate to the rad cap/tanks, cooling the rad and condensing steam to fluid.
This avoids heat soak induced casting cracks and head gasket blow out.
It will save an engine, just use your own judgement if you have to drive to water.
I would never shock cool any hot metal like that...slow and steady cooling would produce the least stress on components.
Yes, my thought exactly. Shock cooling a hot metal is never a good idea.
the 10 degree gap between the on and off temperature is too close in my opinion, the fans draw a lot when they start and a lot of cars cook the relays on drag n drive type events
Curious if there was any voltage drop as well with the fans?
The voltage meter early in the video showed barely over 12 V, or maybe it was just the view point/angle?
"When you're going down the freeway, the fans don't need to be on." On my 944 Turbo, the secondary fan wasn't kicking in, and the car was running hot...on the race track at 130 mph. Replaced the switch, problem solved. You need the fans to be on when the temperature is too high, no matter how fast the car is going. If the fan(s) are running and it's still overheating, then you need more radiator. Where to locate the thermocouple? On the 944 Turbo, my oil temperature gauge was located where the oil was hottest--the turbo outlet to the sump. Put the sender where the water is flowing back to the radiator--get the worst possible reading.
Nobody has commented on a dual pass radiator which I used on my car and solved all the heating issues without doing all that other stuff
180 degree thermostat require for emission cars; best cooling with more water but some coolant to prevent corrosion.
Questions you have you ask yourself is when this car was new did it overheat?
🤔 why not?
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Rear tires look directional to me ...that are on backwards. 0:59
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Very interesting. You may want to spend a few bucks for fender covers.
If I had a dollar for every time someone told me to use fender covers, both of us could retire for the rest of our lives.
@@ZHPGarage Sounds like a lot of people believe like I do.
That’s good
First of all, a 4-core radiator is too thick for stop-and-go traffic.
A three-core would be more effective for that application.
195 is perfectly fine for when the fans come on.
modern cars use recovery tanks---if the system is full it has to puke some fluid, that is why old cars had a fill level that was a few inches below the neck
Hi, my daily driver is a 2005 ford territory ( australia ), it has what i considered a over complex a recovery system and cold engine ( closed thermostat ) bypass system
The recovery tank is about 3 to 4 litres.
More importantly it has used zero water since new, every service i am there, i have never added 1 drop neither has the mechanic the fluid is still green
That Radiator don't look right I had a heating problem on my corvette I put a 3 row all aluminum radiator it never goes past 190 now even where I live where it's triple digits in the summer
It's not the heat. It's the humidity.
Everything these guys did looked great, but I have to disagree with their thermostat advice. For the thermostat to actually control the temperature, it has to cycle open and shut. If the thermostat is staying open, the car will run hot. It may take a while, but it will.
Lol ,old cars you just leave the radiator cap off and go 35mph😊👍
So using an electric fan that draws 25 more amps doesn't suck anymore horsepower from the alternator to run it😒
Thermostat should not be open all the time. 160 stat don't work.
The way i fixed it was removing my thermostat in general and it runs great no more overheating
I hear so many stories saying sure that will work, but not on a realllly hot day.
I don't know what to think anymore.
I have a 160 t in it right now, with fans on, still goes to 200 degrees, and it's not even that hot out.
I originally tried no t-stat, but for what ever reason, put a 160 in it.
Another guy says to put a 195 t in it. Says this way, the t-stat will open and close, at the regular temp, allowing the water in the rad to cool, because it takes time.
Going to have to do some experiments.
I have a nice rad but also thinking about modding it to a "triple pass", maybe a bigger shroud and another fan
@@jakefriesenjake my 63 Chevy 2 nova runs perfect on 98 97 degree days I live in California so it gets real hot here in summer
@@The.jokes.on.you1997 good to hear!
@@jakefriesenjake yeah I figured on older cars a thermostat is the lowest not the highest in temp so once it opens it struggles too allow flow but with out it it constantly has coolant flow fast through the radiator and engine
Swap back tires they on wrong side.
Yes we figured that out after the video lol
Yep! $ 2400.00 + job.
Priceless when you can actually drive the car without worrying about it
@@ZHPGarage I can do the same thing with a other cie for half price!
Did I miss that? Did he say he charged $2400 parts and labor? If so, ok. I'm glad I know how to do all this myself, but I am glad there are guys like these that are willing and able to do this kind of work on this kind of car for those who don't have the skills, physical ability, tools or place to do it.
Well, I'm gonna call b******* I have a 180 thermostat and dural fans. Which are rated at 4000 C? F? M can't keep my car under 180
Evans coolant, you can thank me later.....
PLEASE READ THE FOLLOWING: HERE'S HOW YOU STOP OVERHEATING ISSUES WITH THE SMALL BLOCK CHEVY ONCE & FOR ALL, AND IT ONLY REQUIRES A SIMPLE MODIFICATION OF THE OE WATER PUMP: Remove the water pump and take it apart to expose the rotor assembly blades. Next: USE A CUT-OFF WHEEL TO CUT OFF EVERY OTHER ROTOR BLADE. There should be 8 total rotor blades, and this mod will leave you with 4 rotor blades directly opposite of each other, in the form of "a cross". Clean up, put back together, and re-install. SHAZAAM, NO MORE OVERHEATING ISSUES because this mod with fewer rotor blades slows down the flow of coolant throughout the heads, giving the slower moving coolant much more time for heat exchange....ie: the coolant can now remove more heat away from the heads more efficiently. IT REALLY WORKS, as you'll immediately notice your engine will now operate at 165 degree running temperature and your engine will run & perform much better as a result. THIS IS AN OLD CIRCLE TRACK TRICK AND IN NO WAY HARMS YOUR ENGINE. EVERYONE WHO LEARNS THIS TRICK SWEARS BY IT. The slower coolant flow is not enough to inhibit the use of a heater or windshield defroster in every day drivers. TOTALLY SAFE, 100% EFFECTIVE. PROBLEM SOLVED, WITHOUT SPENDING TONS OF MONEY ON "BETTER RADIATOR/FANS, ETC".........assuming of course that you're currently using a radiator/fan system that should be adequate.
Then why oh why do so many companies make hi flow waterpumps? Serious question. Doesn't the thermostat restrict the flow enough to let the radiator do its job and shed the heat while at the same time let the water transfer the heat away from the heads and block?
@@davidkeeton6716 Yes, but WHEN the thermostat is open, the water pump is circulating the coolant so fast in a modded small block Chevy that it doesn't get the chance to absorb the heat from the heads as efficiently as it could. Hey, don't take my word for it, go look this shit up for yourself. Search: "Water pump mods to stop overheating in small block Chevy engines". I just watched a video about it that popped up at random yesterday. The man demonstrated how to cut every other blade off the water pump rotor and gave all the other details. Furthermore: I once put a high flow water pump in a Mazda PU truck I had a long long time ago, and the damned thing started running hot, so there ya go. It depends on the engine and the combination you're running. There's no "standard method" for every set-up. But the circle track guys DO swear by modding an OE water pump for modded small block Chevy's to make them run much cooler AND much better.
@davidkeeton6716 I guess the question now is do circle track cars run a thermostat?
@@minni1094 I really don't know, but the video I watched just the other day showing this water pump mod stated that it can be used by anyone having overheating problems with a small block Chevy that has been hopped up.
Remove all blades then .
Physics much?
200 isn’t hot
A Griffin 3 core will keep any engine cool, a 160 degree thermostat and a solid bladed steel fan and radiator shroud is a must. Especially if you live anywhere near a warm state. Oh here’s a real novel idea how about actually moving the engine back a few inches to give room enough for the best cooling solution a mechanical fan
I put the entire factory LS1 fan and shroud set up from a 98-2002 F-body in my 1988 Formula years ago and it fixed my overheating problem CHEAP..The car is a WS6 Tuned Port 350 and always ran hot with it's dual factory electric fans that had no shroud...I read that someone tested the CFM's on the LS1 dual fan set up from the 98 thru 2002 camaro/firebird comes in at over 10,000 CFM‼A fan shroud is essential and you get that with the LS1 assembly...It seems like the factory electric fans pull ALOT more air than the aftermarket fans so if you can fit a factory set up with a shroud in a car that overheats its a cheap way to fix the problem...My 1999 Trans/Am NEVER overheated and the high speed mode rarely came on...Usually on hot summer days with the A/C on while idling...Even then they would go back to low speed after a few minutes..
Yeah all that power loss from a fan on a built BBC that is a cruser??? I think that is about the time i would walk out of that shop.
I had overheating problem in my 1965 Malibu ended up being a bad stall
Dont drive them?
Without having a vacuum advance connected you are just wasting your time here. Also, get rid of that useless electric fan, go to a factory style clutch fan with a shroud.
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