The book “The Origins & History of Judo” is now available on Amazon worldwide, not just the links below. You can search for it in the Amazon of your own country. Amazon EU: amzn.eu/d/bfEkJmQ Amazon US: a.co/d/dNyMInt Amazon Asia: amzn.asia/d/aRU8ZXn Thank you all.
In TKD 80s-early 2000s was the "power era" because you needed hard hits that could be detected by human judges whereas today's version utilizing electronic hit detection gets called "foot fencing." It'd revolutionize the sport if they simply took it to its natural conclusion and had a computer determine who would "win" in the street using tkd.
The IJF screwed up judo. It’s already one of the most popular martial arts… if it can still be called that… yet, the IJF suits wanted to make it more interesting for spectators… well done (not).
As someone who started in wrestling and got into Judo in my early 20's I would tend to agree that Judo is a lot different that Wrestling. Good stuff Chadi
The over "sportification" of the art has changed the purpose, and also the intention/mechanisms of this and many other arts. Thanks for the good information
Great video. When I trained at the Kodokan (Tokyo) I used to go to their wonderful library and archives before class. I used to watch and study all their videos. Brings back memories. You are the best Judo scholar on RUclips.
Some people say that Judo was boring when we had leg grabbing techniques because people would keep spamming them, but I can't find fights on RUclips where this happens, in fact, it's hard to see morote-gari and kibisu-gaeshi in these old videos. So did this actually occur?
It was boring! And yes there were lots of direct leg grabbing attacks. Also there was loads and loads of boring kumi kata as there were no shidos for passivity. I do not know why but people have a tendency to say that things were better in the past (not just judo ) Actually the current rule set makes today's judo much (!) more entertaining than it has ever been.
@@tobelli I think people who are more comprehensively into martial arts or even just grappling in general just can't take it seriously now, as it's very incomplete with these artificial limitations. It's not natural. Like tae kwon do with the lack of hand strikes or the utter absurdity of the point karate on the last olympics where a guy landed a perfect head kick KO and lost the gold medal, because it was not allowed. Yeah, it's a sport, there will be specifics in the rules, which dictate the "meta" of what is optimal, objectives, etc, etc, but it's also a martial art, you can't go too far away from actual hand to hand combat and maintain a pretense of efficacy. If we're just doing it for health purposes and to look cool, there are a myriad of other, safer sports.
Great breakdown! I will say that this type of Judo is way more applicable to jiu jitsu. I feel like there would be a lot more cross training if Judo was still taught this way.
In Russia they feel that it’s all wrestling. What are we wearing and what are the rules. This doesn’t translate well, but to them the wheel barrel is wrestling. The tires on the sides are judo and sambo.
Judo needs to bring back ground work! The fight should keep going when they hit the ground! Like freestyle that has a 5 pt throw. Award the high level throw that lands them on the back but keep the fight going It would win over wrestling and bjj fans!
groundwork hasnt gone anywhere - in fact I went to a Judo class last night that was only groundwork. The could giv emore time in cometition sure - but that isnt "Judo"
I liked the Mongolian judoka's Sukui nage because they were so unique. I don't really remember the old Judo scoring system anymore. I think the athletes fought without fear of foul play as they do now.
One thing I'm always puzzling when watching Chadi videos (which I love) is this idea that there is a "truer", "older" Judo that is tougher and more useful. I don't doubt it, but where can you find gyms that practice this form of Judo? If Chadi encourages people to do Judo instead of BJJ, because Judo has the potential to include a great deal of ground fighting, then where can one find a place to practice it? I almost feel like there should be an App, to tell you where to go, lol. We can say "It's what you personally make of it", but is that accessible to beginners?
My judo coach blends BJJ and MMA techniques into our lessons sometimes as he is also a black belt in BJJ and an MMA fighter, the problem is that all the tournaments are under IJF rule. If you want to compete you still have to follow that ruleset so most of the curriculum is still geared towards that.
People crying about judo being boring due to competition rules aren't judoka and judo obviously isn't your sport. . .same goes for BJJ newaza comps and people complaining it's boring. Last of all, these arts are not meant to be entertainment for spectators. There meant for effectiveness and not for your entertainment.
If you were a judoka you'd understand there's Judo competition w)rules and there's the art of Judo which has all the banned techniques still taught and learned.
Hello Mr. Chadi. We had one visiting Sensi, I forgot his name. There were times that he'd show us stuff that could really hurt people, with the elbows, fists and knees before and after a throw. He didn't say not to use those techniques, but it was considered to be dirty Judo. In a street fight though, the fights usually ended quickly. The stuff that you show is how we used to fight. More than once I returned home bruised. I toughed it out, it was apart of the thing. Now, what we were taught may be considered dirty Judo today . I will say, it made you tough, I only weighed between 125 to 130 pounds at the time. So at school or, else where, it was good to know the now considered bad things. Thank you.
Oh, Mr. Diocasta, a red and white belt, a huge bear of a man! I enjoyed watching him and our Sensi go at it, it was amazing! They could break your neck just by thinking about it. Mr. Diocasta had a great sense of humor too. Once, me and my sister let him try out our moped. Mr. Bonar said he looked like a bear riding a bicycle at a circus! We all laughed so hard. I miss the small Dojo days, we were like a little family.
Ura-gatame looks like it's from a time when everyone carried swords and stuff. It makes sense to focus on the arm if it's holding a weapon and putting your body in the way gives you time to steal it from them. A lot of the weird stuff in judo/jujutsu started making more sense when I saw similar techniques drawn in European medieval fighting treatises. It's cool how both cultures independently found the same solutions
What is this narrative of "wrestlers coming into judo". As if judo needs to be pure. Judo is just an expression of a time when things were changing in Japan. Where Jujitsu was fading because the samurai class was out of favor. Jigaro Kano even admitted to adding wrestling techniques in the creation of Judo.
Why not simply make it a rule that to touch the legs, the player needs to have at least one hand on the jacket? That would limit shooting from distance for singles and doubles like classic wrestling, but it would enable, say, kata guruma, kuchiki taoshi etc. If a home can't be found for morote gari, that's a small price to pay for reconnecting judo with leg grabs in a way that is consistent with judo traditions.
I started in 1989. Miss the leg grabs. The "wrestling" nations came more into upper level judo a bit later? I remember watching many international fights consisting of variations of kata guruma and sprawls. We got a high level eastern european coach here to coach the national team before 2000 and that was most of his coaching as well.
In the Netherlands the greatest heavy weight judo champions Anton Geesink, Wim Ruska and most Chris Dolman were also the Dutch champions in Greco-Roman wrestling - not mainly because of their judo skills but of course because of their higher body strength and because they were also excellent wrestlers. It was difficult to find competitive heavy weight wrestlers. On world level the Russian and German wrestlers were better. Of course they were even stronger because the judo players in that time did not weigh much more than 100 kg. Anton Geesink was 6th in the super heavy class on the world championships in Greco-Roman. Of course the Russian were doped. Geesink was not strong and heavy enough to beat the super strong Wilfried Dietrich, who was also a top German national weight lifter in the superheavy weigt class, who could throw even wrestlers of over 180 kg. Of course Dietrich was also the technical better wrestler. Nowadays the super heavy weigt wrestlers have weight restrictions because they have to be enabled to gripe around the waist. On the other hand now there are judoka having a body weight of 150 + kg which is one and a half of that in those times.
Chadi you have to mention that some judokas had a bent over style even in the old days. Youre right that generally it's not true. Another thing: Gordon Ryan generally has an upright style in his grappling and he is probably the GOAT in nogi grappling (also integrates Judo to his style)
Judo never looked like wrestling. But neither did Jujutsu. But some styles of Jujutsu did. In fact, their submissions and holds all look like catch wrestling.
Well, there's a lot of old soviet satellites judokas here, because there're the ones with the less moves and technics that went hard on legs (and counter attacks which is probably the strongest point of their school). So it's good to see light weight, heavy weight, men and women, but there's missing judo cultures which differ greatly from a country to another. If we take Japan and France, those are two different kind of judo. If we have a look at Brazil or Cuba, it'll differ from the other two as well. As for the former soviet countries, that's the school a lot closer to wrestling and which isn't much appreciated by other schools and the public. Now, the problem is the Golden Score which favors tactics over dynamism. To the public, it has to be dynamic to be impressive and entertaining. From the point of view of a judoka and many schools, tactics are a huge part of competitive judo. So, globally, they chose to apply new rules to favor our sport in our eyes, not the eyes of the public, which is rare in sports. Now during the last years, we had some impressive and dynamic fights despite the Golden Score rule, and many judokas will have to rely on a tactic to score before the end of the 4 minutes because they know they won't be able to have enough stamina during the Golden Score.
Everything said in this video is 100% correct. However, fast forward to 2008, and it's a different story. Something went wrong. What stands out here to me is that people went out there with one intention: dump the other person. Not win with shidos or by gaming the rules, but to win by Ippon. By 2008, this mindset had changed. And IMO it's still present.
Le judo originel peut-être pas. En revanche le jujutsu japonais traditionnel d'origine, L'AVANT JUDO, y avait bien de la lutte lors des combats en armure ! Les samouraï avaient pas de kimono ou de GI sur le champ de bataille au départ avec le Kumi-Uchi jujutsu (premier jujutsu). Ils devaient LUTTER avant de faire leurs projections de judo (les mêmes que en jujutsu traditionnel car le judo vient du jujutsu ancien et non l'inverse). A bon entendeur 😊
The new rule change will come out sometime in January 2025 and I have a feeling after this olympics we could see some of these come back and return to tradition. A lot of people want this style to come back and the rules changes from 2012 and 2016 are killing judo as BJJ grows.
I think this was a thoughtful and intelligent example. Note: Very few high level or low level judokas, Japanese or otherwise, spend time in a total upright or "natural posture. (Including yourself Chadi, go back and watch your own randori videos)It's a less athletic posture. Not fully bent over like a freestyle wrestler but more of the greco wrestler. 45 degrees. Heavyweights are usually the exceptions. Which is the same in wrestling. Also, great to see a few seconds of women on the channel. Very, very few female judokas on the channel. Yet, a great video as usual.
Not only that, but I clearly remember watching judo world and Olympic games before the stupid no leg grabs rule, and some judokas had bent over styles of posture. Some had more erect. Some in between. It wasn't a one rule fits all.
7:27 i completely disagree. Flying armbars are an important staple of judo. Using it in competition has very little chance of breaking your neck. Shoot, osoto gari is more dangerous because of concussions
You must always get the right distance. In wrestling it is very difficult because you can't pull the opponent easily to you. In judo having the grip can be the end because of the enormous force (or momentum) when the oponent reacts to late. Teddy Riner didn't give any chance to his final opponents because he was concentrated. Neither to Kim Minjong nor to Saito even at 165 kg. Lucas Krpalek made the mistake to let Tatsuro Saito gripe. Then he Saito could treat him as a feather. Riner however is much heavier than Krpalek and he can control Saito by his grip. Geno Petriasvilli, olympic champion in freestyle superheavy weight, made one good throw in the final. The famous sumo throw which was very difficult without having much hold in the hands. You must very agil as a wrestler because you have no certain control over your grip. You can try to press rhe opponent with your arm for a short time. Judoka pull with their arms or press with whole body. So they stand upright. The pulling force doesn't come from the arms but from the beck and certain back muscles groups. The main force comes from the waist. Hitoshi Saito just pushed Henry Stoehr slowly out of the tatami and won gold 1988. He had a low point of gravity and their enormous strength. The pushing forth comes from the waist. But also the legs must be strong for not si tall fighters to throw over head. Wrestlers need a very strong upper body to gripe the opponent around his waist, which is very difficult especially if the opponent doesn't stand upright. The waist need not push so much therefore they push from the legs. However they change the balance not only by strength. In the past they were extremely strong in lifting. No they rely on other less forth intensive techniques.
You can develope much more forth if you can find a grip in the clothes. How do you want to pull the opponent if you must must hold you in his body. The same in Olympics weiht lifting you can develop enormous force just because of the grip. If you should lift a big stone it is different. Judo is much more explosive than wrestling if you forget this overthrow which also exists in judo as uranage.
What the 2024 Olympics have proved is that judo rules have become so stupid that any biased referee can easily push a fight towards the outcome he/she wants, especially when the 3 referees decide not to step on each other's feet. I never talk like that about refereeing since I'm a referee myself, but what I've seen was unbelievable. Of course, it doesn't make sense for a referee to criticize the rules as he just has to apply them, but heck, in many situations I've seen them applied in a way that left me horrified. Apart from the usual 2-3 best referees, the rest was a total trainwreck. And those are considered the best of the best...
The IOC arguments against Judo and Wrestling similarity is nothing but a fallacy in my opinion. The concern about it came down to wrestler crossed competing in Judo according to Neil Adams in his conversation with Lex Fridman.
Yes. As you can see, they both wear white judogis. The red belt’s purpose is to differentiate between players, it does not reflect the rank. If you watch carefully, alongside the red belt he wears a black one , which is his rank. Nowadays problem is solved by using one white judogi and a blue one
Claro que hay diferencias y mas cuando los agarres dependen de un judogui ,se pelea descalso el que te tomen la espalda no dise nada ,hay trabajo de suelo , y la tecnicas de lanzamiento utilizando la cadera y los pies son utilizados con mas frecuencias que en el wrestling , hay otros aspectos a tener en cuenta ,pero si vamos a tecnicas de lanzamientos , el judo y el wrestling tienen mucha semejanza ,y no lo digo yo ,lo han expresados entrenadores de alto rendimientos y algunos atletas de maximo nivel , que hay sus diferencias claro que las hay
ruclips.net/video/eXXZAobbF9M/видео.htmlsi=Jangvu3FLon9sjTg Wer wirklich Kraft hat darf sie auf einsetzen. Das gilt mittlerweile auch im Judo - wenn es um gelungene schöne Würfe geht. Auch Keijji Suzuki verneint das nicht. Allerdings erklärt er, was diejenigen, denen es an Körperkraft mangelt versuchen können.
ruclips.net/video/YoJtx_Oy2iI/видео.htmlsi=P7g8FF8d2eTwiQJi Wim Ruska was also a good wrestler. He was the forgotten champ because of this trouble between with the Jewish mafia in Amsterdam. I think he should be honoured also in your channel.
🔥Of course Judo never looked like wrestling🌟 it's lapel grappling💥Judo kept changing its rules because it was terrified of wrestlers knowing that wrestling was about to be chopped off the Olympic schedule so JUDO was soon to be besieged by a bunch of unemployed hairy leg Grabbers from Russia, Islamic countries and Mongolia. The ijf and ioc didn't want any of that because they're totally focused on advertising Revenue not honoring the Olympic Heritage they were in charge of
@@KaitoYarikawa Chadi Doesn't Know much about wrestling and has political motivations to deny that Judo was afraid of wrestling but those of us that know the truth will always be around
@@pieterduits4638 NOPE... whenever a wrestler won with a technique they would ban it in the next round of rule changes, wrestling style Judo works very well so they want to eliminate it
@@pieterduits4638 there's nothing passive about leg attacks, the igf and ioc did not want a bunch of unemployed wrestlers showing up in JUDO after the Olympics dropped wrestling
The book “The Origins & History of Judo” is now available on Amazon worldwide, not just the links below. You can search for it in the Amazon of your own country.
Amazon EU:
amzn.eu/d/bfEkJmQ
Amazon US:
a.co/d/dNyMInt
Amazon Asia:
amzn.asia/d/aRU8ZXn
Thank you all.
Not shipping to Brazil yet.
Kindle?
Love your channel Chadi
When judo was judo😅
Police Judo evolved into a complete martial art in the 2000's.
You don’t like modern Shi-Do?
WAY better than todays Judo rules. WAY BETTER
In TKD 80s-early 2000s was the "power era" because you needed hard hits that could be detected by human judges whereas today's version utilizing electronic hit detection gets called "foot fencing." It'd revolutionize the sport if they simply took it to its natural conclusion and had a computer determine who would "win" in the street using tkd.
The IJF screwed up judo.
It’s already one of the most popular martial arts… if it can still be called that… yet, the IJF suits wanted to make it more interesting for spectators… well done (not).
@@uberroo6609 literally, can’t believe there are people out there arguing that it’s better now
As someone who started in wrestling and got into Judo in my early 20's I would tend to agree that Judo is a lot different that Wrestling. Good stuff Chadi
The over "sportification" of the art has changed the purpose, and also the intention/mechanisms of this and many other arts. Thanks for the good information
Great video. When I trained at the Kodokan (Tokyo) I used to go to their wonderful library and archives before class. I used to watch and study all their videos. Brings back memories. You are the best Judo scholar on RUclips.
Some people say that Judo was boring when we had leg grabbing techniques because people would keep spamming them, but I can't find fights on RUclips where this happens, in fact, it's hard to see morote-gari and kibisu-gaeshi in these old videos. So did this actually occur?
It was boring! And yes there were lots of direct leg grabbing attacks. Also there was loads and loads of boring kumi kata as there were no shidos for passivity.
I do not know why but people have a tendency to say that things were better in the past (not just judo )
Actually the current rule set makes today's judo much (!) more entertaining than it has ever been.
@@tobelliit’s not supposed to be entertaining it’s supposed to work
Except at the Olympics
@@tobelli I think people who are more comprehensively into martial arts or even just grappling in general just can't take it seriously now, as it's very incomplete with these artificial limitations. It's not natural.
Like tae kwon do with the lack of hand strikes or the utter absurdity of the point karate on the last olympics where a guy landed a perfect head kick KO and lost the gold medal, because it was not allowed.
Yeah, it's a sport, there will be specifics in the rules, which dictate the "meta" of what is optimal, objectives, etc, etc, but it's also a martial art, you can't go too far away from actual hand to hand combat and maintain a pretense of efficacy. If we're just doing it for health purposes and to look cool, there are a myriad of other, safer sports.
No sport-based fighting will "work." There will always be restrictive rules.@@xXTherapistdogXx
Excellent presentation of the core values of Judo.
Great breakdown! I will say that this type of Judo is way more applicable to jiu jitsu. I feel like there would be a lot more cross training if Judo was still taught this way.
there is a lot of cross training
Great material as always - thank you
❤ this channel
Thank you so much for this
I want this back!!!!
To me judo is JACKET WRESTLING. With pin, takedown, suplex, etc.
Yes! It might not look like modern day forms of wrestling in the spotlight, but it does look like a lot of other traditional jacket wrestling styles.
@@MaodifiAlso worth to mention that most traditional wrestling is in fact jacket/belt wrestling!
In Russia they feel that it’s all wrestling. What are we wearing and what are the rules. This doesn’t translate well, but to them the wheel barrel is wrestling. The tires on the sides are judo and sambo.
Most eastern European and central Asia traditional wrestling styles look much more similar to judo than freestyle or greco roman wrestling.
I wish judo could return to its roots
Muito obrigado pelo vídeo e pela legenda 🙏
fully agree. like the author
Judo needs to bring back ground work! The fight should keep going when they hit the ground! Like freestyle that has a 5 pt throw. Award the high level throw that lands them on the back but keep the fight going
It would win over wrestling and bjj fans!
But why win over fans when they already have a sport?
This is why BJJ was created, just train both
@@matalolNot practical for a lot of people
groundwork hasnt gone anywhere - in fact I went to a Judo class last night that was only groundwork. The could giv emore time in cometition sure - but that isnt "Judo"
Judo has ground work
I liked the Mongolian judoka's Sukui nage because they were so unique.
I don't really remember the old Judo scoring system anymore.
I think the athletes fought without fear of foul play as they do now.
Old scoring system: Koka, Yuko, Waza-ari, Ippon. But 4 Yukos were not an Ippon. And one Waza-ari was still superior to 2 or more Yukos.
Your best video ever, fantastic 👏👏👏
One thing I'm always puzzling when watching Chadi videos (which I love) is this idea that there is a "truer", "older" Judo that is tougher and more useful. I don't doubt it, but where can you find gyms that practice this form of Judo? If Chadi encourages people to do Judo instead of BJJ, because Judo has the potential to include a great deal of ground fighting, then where can one find a place to practice it? I almost feel like there should be an App, to tell you where to go, lol. We can say "It's what you personally make of it", but is that accessible to beginners?
You need a good teacher, someone who encourages these techniques as well as veteran training partners who know these techniques.
Go to a bjj gym with a judo or wrestling class.
These old school Judo places don't seem to exist anymore.
My judo coach blends BJJ and MMA techniques into our lessons sometimes as he is also a black belt in BJJ and an MMA fighter, the problem is that all the tournaments are under IJF rule. If you want to compete you still have to follow that ruleset so most of the curriculum is still geared towards that.
Find a bjj gym that teaches judo. Typically they will teach in a manner that blends both arts.
Freestyle rules allow for the older style of competition. You'll find it in Midwestern America. My first competition was freestyle.
Freestyle wrestling? That's so cool
@@Tungdil_01 freestyle judo
Freestyle judo uses the older rules or at least it's more in line with the older rules.
People crying about judo being boring due to competition rules aren't judoka and judo obviously isn't your sport. . .same goes for BJJ newaza comps and people complaining it's boring.
Last of all, these arts are not meant to be entertainment for spectators.
There meant for effectiveness and not for your entertainment.
Much more dynamic and for my entertaining I think if they kept leg grabs if anything it would teach Judokas how to deal with leg grab heavy styles.
100%
Jiujitsu: “why would you ignore 50% of the human body”
Judo: 👀
Shamefully
If you were a judoka you'd understand there's Judo competition w)rules and there's the art of Judo which has all the banned techniques still taught and learned.
Just to play devils advocate, isn’t that the the rule set of Greco- Roman?
@@SoldierDrew They're not taught and learned in that many places anymore.
lmfao hey I’d still rather just have upper body throws , with some trips and sweeps than to become a guard puller
Hello Mr. Chadi. We had one visiting Sensi, I forgot his name. There were times that he'd show us stuff that could really hurt people, with the elbows, fists and knees before and after a throw. He didn't say not to use those techniques, but it was considered to be dirty Judo. In a street fight though, the fights usually ended quickly. The stuff that you show is how we used to fight. More than once I returned home bruised. I toughed it out, it was apart of the thing. Now, what we were taught may be considered dirty Judo today . I will say, it made you tough, I only weighed between 125 to 130 pounds at the time. So at school or, else where, it was good to know the now considered bad things. Thank you.
Oh, Mr. Diocasta, a red and white belt, a huge bear of a man! I enjoyed watching him and our Sensi go at it, it was amazing! They could break your neck just by thinking about it. Mr. Diocasta had a great sense of humor too. Once, me and my sister let him try out our moped. Mr. Bonar said he looked like a bear riding a bicycle at a circus! We all laughed so hard. I miss the small Dojo days, we were like a little family.
Golden times for Judo. The sport should go back to this, from where it should never have left in the first place.
5:11 te-guruma*
Interesting video. 😉
Ura-gatame looks like it's from a time when everyone carried swords and stuff. It makes sense to focus on the arm if it's holding a weapon and putting your body in the way gives you time to steal it from them.
A lot of the weird stuff in judo/jujutsu started making more sense when I saw similar techniques drawn in European medieval fighting treatises. It's cool how both cultures independently found the same solutions
that escape at 0:57 !
I agree with your ideas and your rules that should bring it back
What is this narrative of "wrestlers coming into judo". As if judo needs to be pure. Judo is just an expression of a time when things were changing in Japan. Where Jujitsu was fading because the samurai class was out of favor. Jigaro Kano even admitted to adding wrestling techniques in the creation of Judo.
Under 3 minutes in and I'm screaming "bring back the old rules!"
Why not simply make it a rule that to touch the legs, the player needs to have at least one hand on the jacket?
That would limit shooting from distance for singles and doubles like classic wrestling, but it would enable, say, kata guruma, kuchiki taoshi etc.
If a home can't be found for morote gari, that's a small price to pay for reconnecting judo with leg grabs in a way that is consistent with judo traditions.
Wish it was still like that
Wow this is cool 😎
I think dojo judoka should learn all the classic moves whether they are legal in competition or not. Most hobbyist don't compete anyway.
let's hope that judo can make a come back
I started in 1989. Miss the leg grabs. The "wrestling" nations came more into upper level judo a bit later? I remember watching many international fights consisting of variations of kata guruma and sprawls. We got a high level eastern european coach here to coach the national team before 2000 and that was most of his coaching as well.
In the olympics this year Japan bring back 3 golds in judo and 8 in wrestling. Best wrestling nation at the Olympics this year
Chadi there is a Mantis form of Judo - Shuai Shou Tang Lang. I understand it combines well with Red Fist and Dragon Ground Fighting.
In the Netherlands the greatest heavy weight judo champions Anton Geesink, Wim Ruska and most Chris Dolman were also the Dutch champions in Greco-Roman wrestling - not mainly because of their judo skills but of course because of their higher body strength and because they were also excellent wrestlers. It was difficult to find competitive heavy weight wrestlers.
On world level the Russian and German wrestlers were better. Of course they were even stronger because the judo players in that time did not weigh much more than 100 kg.
Anton Geesink was 6th in the super heavy class on the world championships in Greco-Roman.
Of course the Russian were doped. Geesink was not strong and heavy enough to beat the super strong Wilfried Dietrich, who was also a top German national weight lifter in the superheavy weigt class, who could throw even wrestlers of over 180 kg. Of course Dietrich was also the technical better wrestler. Nowadays the super heavy weigt wrestlers have weight restrictions because they have to be enabled to gripe around the waist. On the other hand now there are judoka having a body weight of 150 + kg which is one and a half of that in those times.
Chadi you have to mention that some judokas had a bent over style even in the old days. Youre right that generally it's not true.
Another thing: Gordon Ryan generally has an upright style in his grappling and he is probably the GOAT in nogi grappling (also integrates Judo to his style)
Sup chadi
Judo never looked like wrestling. But neither did Jujutsu. But some styles of Jujutsu did. In fact, their submissions and holds all look like catch wrestling.
Well, there's a lot of old soviet satellites judokas here, because there're the ones with the less moves and technics that went hard on legs (and counter attacks which is probably the strongest point of their school). So it's good to see light weight, heavy weight, men and women, but there's missing judo cultures which differ greatly from a country to another. If we take Japan and France, those are two different kind of judo. If we have a look at Brazil or Cuba, it'll differ from the other two as well. As for the former soviet countries, that's the school a lot closer to wrestling and which isn't much appreciated by other schools and the public.
Now, the problem is the Golden Score which favors tactics over dynamism. To the public, it has to be dynamic to be impressive and entertaining. From the point of view of a judoka and many schools, tactics are a huge part of competitive judo. So, globally, they chose to apply new rules to favor our sport in our eyes, not the eyes of the public, which is rare in sports. Now during the last years, we had some impressive and dynamic fights despite the Golden Score rule, and many judokas will have to rely on a tactic to score before the end of the 4 minutes because they know they won't be able to have enough stamina during the Golden Score.
Current Judo should at least allow for a leg grab combine with a upper body grab.
Everything said in this video is 100% correct. However, fast forward to 2008, and it's a different story. Something went wrong.
What stands out here to me is that people went out there with one intention: dump the other person. Not win with shidos or by gaming the rules, but to win by Ippon.
By 2008, this mindset had changed. And IMO it's still present.
Yeah it did
Hunched over posture
It doesnt have the same mechanics, the movements, the execution of it and way more
Judo is like if you put gis on Greco guys, and let them do foot sweeps. It has a bit of all types of wrestling, but isn't the same as any of them.
Le judo originel peut-être pas.
En revanche le jujutsu japonais traditionnel d'origine, L'AVANT JUDO, y avait bien de la lutte lors des combats en armure !
Les samouraï avaient pas de kimono ou de GI sur le champ de bataille au départ avec le Kumi-Uchi jujutsu (premier jujutsu). Ils devaient LUTTER avant de faire leurs projections de judo (les mêmes que en jujutsu traditionnel car le judo vient du jujutsu ancien et non l'inverse). A bon entendeur 😊
The new rule change will come out sometime in January 2025 and I have a feeling after this olympics we could see some of these come back and return to tradition. A lot of people want this style to come back and the rules changes from 2012 and 2016 are killing judo as BJJ grows.
Excellent thank you
It seems to be able to do old school judo now ironically enough, you have to train in BJJ.
I think this was a thoughtful and intelligent example. Note: Very few high level or low level judokas, Japanese or otherwise, spend time in a total upright or "natural posture. (Including yourself Chadi, go back and watch your own randori videos)It's a less athletic posture. Not fully bent over like a freestyle wrestler but more of the greco wrestler. 45 degrees. Heavyweights are usually the exceptions. Which is the same in wrestling. Also, great to see a few seconds of women on the channel. Very, very few female judokas on the channel. Yet, a great video as usual.
Not only that, but I clearly remember watching judo world and Olympic games before the stupid no leg grabs rule, and some judokas had bent over styles of posture. Some had more erect. Some in between. It wasn't a one rule fits all.
Naw it's Jacket Wrasslin. lol
that's more Shuai jiao
@@TroyIndureTillTheEndjudo is literally jacket wrestling as well
Judo needs to tell the IOC to pound sand.
The Olympics need Judo, Judo doesn't need the Olympics.
7:27 i completely disagree. Flying armbars are an important staple of judo. Using it in competition has very little chance of breaking your neck. Shoot, osoto gari is more dangerous because of concussions
RIP judo!
24’ Paris Olympic Judo was so disappointing.
You must always get the right distance. In wrestling it is very difficult because you can't pull the opponent easily to you.
In judo having the grip can be the end because of the enormous force (or momentum) when the oponent reacts to late. Teddy Riner didn't give any chance to his final opponents because he was concentrated. Neither to Kim Minjong nor to Saito even at 165 kg. Lucas Krpalek made the mistake to let Tatsuro Saito gripe. Then he Saito could treat him as a feather. Riner however is much heavier than Krpalek and he can control Saito by his grip.
Geno Petriasvilli, olympic champion in freestyle superheavy weight, made one good throw in the final. The famous sumo throw which was very difficult without having much hold in the hands. You must very agil as a wrestler because you have no certain control over your grip. You can try to press rhe opponent with your arm for a short time.
Judoka pull with their arms or press with whole body. So they stand upright. The pulling force doesn't come from the arms but from the beck and certain back muscles groups. The main force comes from the waist. Hitoshi Saito just pushed Henry Stoehr slowly out of the tatami and won gold 1988. He had a low point of gravity and their enormous strength. The pushing forth comes from the waist. But also the legs must be strong for not si tall fighters to throw over head.
Wrestlers need a very strong upper body to gripe the opponent around his waist, which is very difficult especially if the opponent doesn't stand upright. The waist need not push so much therefore they push from the legs. However they change the balance not only by strength. In the past they were extremely strong in lifting. No they rely on other less forth intensive techniques.
The heavy Japanese judoka wrestle like Sumo wrestlers not like Greco-Roman wrestlers.
Chadi
You were stopped if you did not have contact with the fight area.
You can develope much more forth if you can find a grip in the clothes. How do you want to pull the opponent if you must must hold you in his body.
The same in Olympics weiht lifting you can develop enormous force just because of the grip. If you should lift a big stone it is different.
Judo is much more explosive than wrestling if you forget this overthrow which also exists in judo as uranage.
it's not that judo looked like wrestling it's that wrestlers came to judo championships to participate and did wrestling instead of judo
And what is bad about that? It just advanced the sport
If the 2024 Olympics taught us anything is that degeneracy is rampant and Judo is no longer Judo.
Make Judo, Judo again!
What the 2024 Olympics have proved is that judo rules have become so stupid that any biased referee can easily push a fight towards the outcome he/she wants, especially when the 3 referees decide not to step on each other's feet. I never talk like that about refereeing since I'm a referee myself, but what I've seen was unbelievable. Of course, it doesn't make sense for a referee to criticize the rules as he just has to apply them, but heck, in many situations I've seen them applied in a way that left me horrified. Apart from the usual 2-3 best referees, the rest was a total trainwreck. And those are considered the best of the best...
@@ilVecchioKoala it basically become like how BJJ refereeing is. They ref in favor towards Brazilians. Judo is now a shido waza game too.
Judo became tkd now 😂😂😂 both were actual combat sports and now it’s just something weird
The IOC arguments against Judo and Wrestling similarity is nothing but a fallacy in my opinion.
The concern about it came down to wrestler crossed competing in Judo according to Neil Adams in his conversation with Lex Fridman.
how old judo didnt look like wrestling? u kidding me?
at 1:49 why is a red belt competing with a black belt, is it normal ?
Yes. As you can see, they both wear white judogis. The red belt’s purpose is to differentiate between players, it does not reflect the rank. If you watch carefully, alongside the red belt he wears a black one , which is his rank. Nowadays problem is solved by using one white judogi and a blue one
If you hate olympic, like this comment. Olympic ruined every martial arts it touched.
Claro que hay diferencias y mas cuando los agarres dependen de un judogui ,se pelea descalso el que te tomen la espalda no dise nada ,hay trabajo de suelo , y la tecnicas de lanzamiento utilizando la cadera y los pies son utilizados con mas frecuencias que en el wrestling , hay otros aspectos a tener en cuenta ,pero si vamos a tecnicas de lanzamientos , el judo y el wrestling tienen mucha semejanza ,y no lo digo yo ,lo han expresados entrenadores de alto rendimientos y algunos atletas de maximo nivel , que hay sus diferencias claro que las hay
ruclips.net/video/eXXZAobbF9M/видео.htmlsi=Jangvu3FLon9sjTg
Wer wirklich Kraft hat darf sie auf einsetzen. Das gilt mittlerweile auch im Judo - wenn es um gelungene schöne Würfe geht.
Auch Keijji Suzuki verneint das nicht. Allerdings erklärt er, was diejenigen, denen es an Körperkraft mangelt versuchen können.
Who cares of its Japanese wrestling
ruclips.net/video/YoJtx_Oy2iI/видео.htmlsi=P7g8FF8d2eTwiQJi
Wim Ruska was also a good wrestler. He was the forgotten champ because of this trouble between with the Jewish mafia in Amsterdam. I think he should be honoured also in your channel.
Very selective footage supporting confirmation bias
JUDO IS WRESTLING!
もろ手刈りだけ禁止にしたらどうですか？それ以外は別にレスリングのような柔道には見えません。
Хм... Почему не похоже
1st
Дзюдо обрезали, кастрировали.
🔥Of course Judo never looked like wrestling🌟 it's lapel grappling💥Judo kept changing its rules because it was terrified of wrestlers knowing that wrestling was about to be chopped off the Olympic schedule so JUDO was soon to be besieged by a bunch of unemployed hairy leg Grabbers from Russia, Islamic countries and Mongolia. The ijf and ioc didn't want any of that because they're totally focused on advertising Revenue not honoring the Olympic Heritage they were in charge of
Chadi talked about this and he said that this is not true, this conversation is in his fourth recent video about the olympics, go an watch it
Was because leg grabs made the game passive
@@KaitoYarikawa Chadi Doesn't Know much about wrestling and has political motivations to deny that Judo was afraid of wrestling but those of us that know the truth will always be around
@@pieterduits4638 NOPE... whenever a wrestler won with a technique they would ban it in the next round of rule changes, wrestling style Judo works very well so they want to eliminate it
@@pieterduits4638 there's nothing passive about leg attacks, the igf and ioc did not want a bunch of unemployed wrestlers showing up in JUDO after the Olympics dropped wrestling