I grew up with an abusive mother. It's true that sometimes they can be really kind and sweet. This is what makes it all so confusing and causes abused children to blame themselves. How can a mother one day be kind and the next day be raging and beating you and ridiculing you. It took me until many many years of therapy and questioning myself before I accepted that I was abused. I let her do it until I was about 45 before I walked away for good. I'm 60 now and still have confused feelings about it. The thing with abusive parents is that you don't stop loving the parent, you stop loving yourself. It takes an awful lot of training to change that.
I wish more people understood this. It's annoying how many comments i see blaming the brothers for not leaving and reportingl to police. Because they're rich, they're physically strong they could've just left. Like damn if only it was that simple
@@crazywhirlwind Yes, it's easy to blame the victim when you were never around to witness the chaos of their childhood. The hardest thing to do is walk away from your parents, eventhough or maybe especially when they are abusive.
Thank you for sharing that. You’re not alone at all. I’m so glad you are in a better place and space, somewhere safe you always deserved. It can be hard to accept that because almost no one is 100% bad all of the time but that does not mean you deserve a second of the pain or hurt that a caregiver should never show a child. It is their responsibility to care for the child & not the other way around, & I’m sorry your early years were so warped. I pray you have supportive & kind & unconditionally loving people around you now as you always deserved ❤
@@crazywhirlwindyup, absolutely not that simple. Children are programmed to listen to, love, & need their parents, especially if they are young, but really through their whole childhood, adolescence, & adulthood. It is never, ever their fault for receiving abuse. Often the perpetrator can tell them incorrect information about the abuse, like it’s common, or deserved, or an accident, or telling will result in more harm… but it should never happen period & adults know better. Kids do not know, so I am disheartened at people with so little empathy to know how much bravery & strength to ask for help, particularly when kids are not always believed the first time or any time they tell.
Very well-said! Especially "You don't stop loving the parent, you stop loving yourself." And I'm so proud of you for walking away ans retraining yourself. You deserve love without judgment, friend.
The major issue with shows like this are they are inherently exploitative and twist the truth for drama. A lot of people will not do research on it and take it at face value. What's worse is that people will believe whatever narrative the show sells. Also media literacy among the general watchers is pretty bad. They really don't know how to tell truth from fiction. EDIT: if my comment makes you feel pissed off for some reason, You're weird and you have issues. If you're as smart as you think you are, this general comment would have never gotten under your skin.
Regarding Eric Menendez's complicated feelings toward his sexuality- if you're assualted multiple times/ regularly, some of those times you might have a biological response. From a child or young teenager's basic understanding wouldn't a biological response be viewed as liking it to some degree? That could confuse just about anyone let alone someone who has had only limited experiences. They simply do not know better. With regards to the use of the word "nice"- anything less than violent, less than uncomfortable, with even the bare minimum of softness could be categorised as "nice". This would of course be relative to his prior experiences with his father.
A great many men--look to Rome, Greece, or even now where a lot of people have secrets--are bisexual. I can only assume sexual abuse makes such issues more complicated
I think Ryan Murphy really sexualized the brothers the sexy dances and having sexual tension and the shower scene felt very gross and exploitive I'm fine with showing different perspectives but he made it tasteless. And him showing the boys side what he did show he didn't get a lot of it accurate. And the portrayal of lyle too. It all just bled together to the point where I was just like this is icky. Even my younger sister watching this who knows nothing about this case was like omg are the two brothers together. People who haven't done the research are getting the wrong idea and when they look up stuff see how exploitative it is
Okay the tapes with lyle talking on the phone aren't incriminating I have listened to them and he sound douchey but it corroborates what the boys said. He doesn't say anything about fake crying or anything. Because the police late searched the women's home and was like we listened to the tapes no one where on there does he say these thing Also the women that supposedly heard lyle say these thing came out and said Dominic DUnne had payed her to lie on lyle because he was pro prosecution
I do really get where Murphy is coming from when he tries to include different possible theories and perspectives on the story. However, the way it was executed did not sit well with me at all... I am all for nuance, but as we generally view things through the linear story telling, and the "truth" is usually slowly unravelled during a show... The last episodes do carry the most weight. By showing the brothers discussing premeditated murder of their parents, by showing the parents being a flawed but decent couple and by hardly focusing on the abuse in the later episodes, it -at least to me- felt as if this was the supposed main message of the show: that they did not act out of fear for their lives, but that it was premeditated. And because of this, it felt as if the show DID take a stance on what it believed to be te truth, siding with the opposition and framing the brothers as using the "abuse excuse".
Right. The thing is that there weren't too many different perspectives about the parents when it came to friends, family, associates, teachers, coaches, neighbors, etc. They all thought the parents were weird/awful/domineering/abusive/pathological/liars etc. To add nuance to the story Ryan had to lie, I mean, *cough*, get really creative. The show could have explored the nuance of mental stability when it comes to childhood trauma. It could have explored the nuance of spousal abuse. It could have done so many things with the truth. But he chose not to. I just don't get it.
My husband was watching this and I was just doing other stuff and Nicholas Chavez made me stop in my tracks and become obsessed with this show. What an incredible performance
The thumbnail for this is fucking hilarious 😂 I've been looking forward to your review. I literally watched this series so I could watch your review lmao
I would have watched Netflix's Mendez Series: Monsters even if Marshall had not planned on reviewing it, but I binged it to watch the video immediately.
I disagree with some of your conclusions but I actually enjoyed this review and seeing this show from a different perspective. I totally get what Ryan Murphy was trying to do with the show but don’t think it was executed well. I came away thinking the show was kind of a confusing mess. Other than that my main gripes were some of the weird inaccuracies/creative liberties they took. Lyle’s characterisation in particular was just so ridiculous to me (even though the actor was great). He was just so over the top that it wasn’t believable but I guess if you view it from the angle of an exaggerated version of how the media at the time portrayed them then it kind of makes sense. Lyle also never told Norma Novelli that he fooled the jury. He certainly comes across as obnoxious and somewhat manipulative on those tapes in real life but he never suggests that anything was fake. Overall I mostly enjoyed the show for the performances but the execution just wasn’t there for me.
Yeah, for me, this show was my first introduction to the case. I definitely thought that Lyle was the manipulator/had ASPD, and Eric was "just" dragged into it. But after additional (albeit limited) research, I think the show did a rather bad job at portraying the brothers. Especially Lyle, but somewhat Eric as well.
@@SammyLammy1D The expert who evaluated Lyle also concluded that he didn't have ASPD. He was just extremely repressed due to the abuse and brainwashing he experienced
Ok never watched a video from you before but jeepers you really get it, you are smart af. Everyone is so busy pearl-clutching after watching half the show they don’t see how amazing this achievement is
Absolutely agree with you, this show was very much about painting the picture that the prosecution, defense, media, were serculating at the time, unfortunately i dont feel that the show was very clear about it. Maybe if they had explored it through the eyes of each juror on the trial, each episode use a different juror it would have been clear that this is how people thought opposed to what the boys were like. I didn't realize what the show was doing till i read the book by Robert Rand. It took me almost 2 days to realize that the director was saying, we know the boys are guilty but did they deserve life in prison, and we know the parents were guilty of abuse but did they deserve to die? Great concept, maybe not the best execution
The disproportionality of the backlash, and how uninformed it seems, is apparently becoming the norm for media. 'Transgressive', or simply honest, is out. I do believe that the biggest problem with the series is that it's about real people, but after seeing the reaction to Dahmer I don't know if the sort who levy that criticism are serious individuals who actually WATCHED either of the shows in their entirety.
You know what, I really appreciate the creativity that they did in the show, the way that it shows different perspectives for atleast every single episode is really bold and smart. I think the series itself is great. But is this the type of show that the Menendez Brothers really need? Considering the situation that they're in right now? I think that's the reason why I cannot fully love the show, because instead of showing the audience the whole truth, the series kind of takes back the audience to the view of the general public during the times of the trial, which was very conflicting at the time. So is that really what the Menendez Brothers really need?
This happened over 20 years ago, and they’ve had over multiple documentaries published. It’s not about what they need, it’s something Murphy brought attention to just like Dahmer. He has the right to do so and we have the right to critique his work.
I honestly agree with everything you have said! People don’t use critical thinking with most things and the way media is normally portrayed dulls people’s understanding of levels of abuse/emotion and how this affects every person in any situation.
They play Milli Vanilli because Milli Vanilli were two guys that faked it for money and greed, and some of the other guys, and they completely say that they were conceited
Another amazing review! I love how you pointed out how the show produces a confused reaction from the audience as both sides of the case are depicted, which also mirrors the experience of Eric and other abuse victims as their abusers aren't abusing 24/7. I feel like in that way the show subtly provides another defense for the brothers as it shows their inner conflict despite the abuse. The only this i disagree with is I felt like the show was dragging after halfway. And especially during the Dom episode because I felt like his dinner party scenes were repeated a lot. Although, I will admit part of that was because I found the content of the show (as someone not familar with the case) very upsetting and I wanted it to end.
was waiting for your review to come out! i think the uproar on social media is going a little bit crazy but i know it’s caused by them seeing clips completely out of context. i agree with what you said of its portrayal of erik’s sexuality and how messy that was. i just think more people should actually watch the show in its entirety before writing think pieces about how bad it is. great video my friend
This show is a gross exploitation of a tragedy and failure of our legal system . Rather than waste your time with this Ryan Murphy cash grab dramatization you should look into the case and watch their testimonies or a documentary that doesn’t paint them as monsters. While the crime of killing their parents is of course horrid, the parents were sick child predators and all you have to do is watch their testimony to understand what led up to their brutal act. Their first trial ended with a hung jury and their second convicted them because the prosecution got the judge to ignore key evidence and testimony of their ongoing childhood r*pe and m*lestaion by their parents. They should have gotten manslaughter and had the chance to live their lives outside of prison again. I also recommend the documentary Menudo as this grants outside claim to Jose Menendez being a child pr*dator outside of his own family.
I love this show. It was the perfect make sure between campiness and and a counterculture and even a make sure of postmodernism in the show. I love monster season two Nicolas Chavez did a great job. He’s going to bigger things since he’s been on General Hospital if you don’t know about that, this is a great show. I love you.
Despite people's criticism, I think it was pretty good. Ryan Murphy commented and he has good points. They did do their research and this is a SHOW bot a documentary. But this is definitely not superior to Dahmer, no way.
Agreed!! It’s crazy people are saying this show is full of nothing but lies 😂 I mean no, not everything but a lot of the events DID happen. I do agree though, Dahmer is the superior show. This was a wacky media circus of a case so I get in tone going the dark comedy route…but I think it cheapened the heaviness as opposed to Dahmer.
Oh, this analysis was perfect! I agree with pretty much everything - I do think you’re able to appreciate it more though when you know the case well. I guess the only thing I push back on is Erik’s sexuality - he did say he was confused but because he has said he’s straight so many times…I do think Ryan went overboard. It’s like throughout the show & the shower scene 🥴 For the ending, yea it lost steam but I also think maybe that was the energy because that’s how the 2nd trial felt. The final scene is very nuanced though and think it’s gone above a lot of people’s heads. Thanks for communicating how nuanced the ending is.
I watched Dahmer and it was chilling. Maybe more than I expected. I know this is a different case by far but I only watched an episode and a half because rather than being scary I found it comedic and I doubt it was meant to be. The Milli Vanilli and Vanilla Ice didn't help. Perhaps, I'll give it another try.
I think what it is is that this is so counterculture for people that they just can’t understand the counterculture in the show and it is counterculture impulse modern at the same time people used to as much as they used to postmodern that’s what I think about it. See you when you see when season three.
disgusting show. a lot of lies in there. didn't like it. just make a fictional show about killers. no need to sexualize the brothers and making a fake narrative. also, NOW you "kinda" believe that they were abused? with all the evidence and psychologists confirming that they didn't fake emotions on the stand? oh okay.
Here's the thing people are going to believe what they want . There defense pays people to say what they need them to. The menudo member accused someone else first. The family stood behind the boys its not absurd to believe they lied for them or that anyone could've wrote the letter. When people are facing the death penalty the fear of that can drum up a lot of emotion. The truth is the prosecution could have DNA for a case proving a person guilty and the defense will convince people it's wrong. Many people don't believe the brothers thought their parents were going to kill them and that they made that up .
I didn't like the interpretation of Lyle in the Netflix show, if you watch the real trial, he is nothing like the show, in the movie he is totally insane
They’re showing many people’s perspectives of the boys at the same time to create a confusing feeling that was felt in the 90’s during that time…not knowing back then what to believe. It’s an artistic interpretation that you just didn’t get….
I’ve only really ever seen episode I’ve only ever seen seven episodes of this show but a really retweet the critical race theory narrative of the critical theory narrative of the of the other boys and really mixed together
That’s really Republican of me, but Eric Mendez doesn’t seem like they’re doing the innocent fraud kind of thing so they can get out of jail, but nothing has ever been in my history has not been book of them saying that they didn’t deserve. The guy deserve to be in jail for years.😅 that’s my opinion. My name is K1 Republican guy.
The question is, why did Ryan Murphy feel the need to lie and make the brothers seem incestuous when they were child sexual abuse victims? What is with Hollywood's incessant need to sexualize teenagers (which is the age he showed them in the shower together (something that never happened without their dad, btw)? Why did Ryan need to fabricate Erik questioning his sexuality? And why did Ryan need to make Lyle seem like an asshole psychopath that could cry on command? It's all so strange. The true story is JUST AS INTERESTING. I can only assume that Ryan Murphy got off on some weird thoughts about the brothers (mostly Erik), and then wrote it into the story.
Chloe Savigney was amazing. She is such an underrated actress. I also love her on AHS and wish they would give her more screen time. The song is called "Dirty Cash" by The Adventures of Stevie V. Amazing 90s dance song. That whole Stevie V album was so good!
I do believe that they wanted their parents' money, But the abuse is what made them capable of doing what they did. I don't think they're psychopaths, Or sociopaths. They're traumatized. They deserved prison, But with a chance of parole.
there is no nuance in this case. The parents were child rapists and their two sons weren't the only victims. there's no excuse for defending child rapists and painting them in a good light, as Murphy has tried to do in this garbage show.
I really tried to watch the Netflix version with open mind but having watched the actual trial and all the other documentaries related to this I think the “twisting of truth for tv” is kinda too much. Its probably good for people who doesn’t know or heard of the Menendez Brothers before this series.
The show showed both sides of the story, including the media. Ryan Murphy makes his shows and gives his art for what the viewer takes with it. This two sides to the story however we’ll never know as the parents aren’t alive to tell it. I think Ryan did a respectful job with not saying too much but also not saying too little, absolutely amazing performances and very complexed in seeing the lies and truths of the living.
Also noticed that Lyle never called his parents mom and dad he always said kitty and José in the court room calling their real name or my parents but with Eric he always said my brother😢 i feel like he killed his parents for Eric's freedom from his dad sexual abuse and i think he was guilty to blame him self for what he did to Eric when they were young the wood story😢 ,that's why he so emotional and over protective to his brother he stood up for his brother trew every thing he has for eric
With this cast it could have been an amazing show. The acting was incredible. It was funny. It was sad. It was scary. It depressed me especially the ending. The system failed. The abuse, the torture they went through and the show BARLEY touched just how bad it was for these boys. The incest was not needed to be shown between the boys or hinting that they were lying, because viewers who dont understand the story or the way tramua works. They label them liars and its heartbreaking to be called a liar when youre telling the world you were abused by your parents. I wish they would be released. Its surrel to think they hsve been in prison this long. Also agree the outfits are insanely good. I like a spoiled boy character in tv and movies. Im a sucker for it.
I loved this show. I think Murphy is a visionary of television. He has been pushing boundaries for years now. He’s added real style and true substance to pop culture television and I am 100% here for it every single time. It is truly strange to me what people choose to be outraged by. Film is art. Good art comforts the disturbed and disturbs the comfortable.
Finally someone that agrees with me. I think the show was great and depicts the complex relationships that a family dynamic has. This case is so tragic, it also shows how we have grown as a society. I don't belive they would've gotten the same sentence today as they did in the 90's. Also refreshing to not watch a show about yet another serial killer that already has had their story told a million of times. This case is so interesting in so many different ways, the case itself, the public, the 90's and the messy trails.
I am in the middle of it and I have watched the trial and interviews and the personality of Lyle does not fit the one shown in the show. I also find it inappropiate to sexualize the brothers because sex in the whole story is a very serious and harmful matter. Unnecessary.
ryan murphy should never be trusted for accuracy, he could have made this show but changed the names and had it “inspired” by the brothers rather than making it seem like an actual dramatic biopic. then people would NOT have the same issues with the weird incest and exaggerations and it would probably do a lot better tbh.
Hi guys so, my section on “DIMES” at around 30-35 mins in got butchered by copyright so some of what I say has been removed Basically I loved the section- loved Eric’s body language and Lyle stepping into protect, it was incredibly captivating, well edited, satisfying and compelling, probably my fave part of the show, ashame I couldn’t include my section
my problem with the show is why they felt the need to make things up when the real story is right there? in the court videos, told by actual witnesses? anybody who thinks that the people who hated the show are over reacting obviously never watched the court videos or know a lot about the case. it was grossly exaggerated and about 70% of it was dramatized or completely made up bs. Lyle was basically a fictional character it was laughable
Regarding showing that "theory" or line of thinking by the prosecution that because Eric was confused about his sexuality, or experimenting himself sometimes, that was the basis of his narrative on his SA by Jose- Is it homophobic? Yes. It was also the 90s. And even though it seems offensive to even think it in 2024, people do think it. It was a part of the prosecution's argument. I think Ryan Murphy including that angle makes sense. It isn't nice and extremely offensive. But the goal was to reflect what came up in the trials and all that.
I just think they ruined the character with Lyle I can’t tell you how many times I was pissed off at the character for doing stupid shit over and over again. “Fulling the jury” that was just stupid.
I think people are kind of missing the point of this show in a way- It’s to truly show ALL sides of the different stories. Because at the end of the day- we don’t know what is true and what isn’t. And I think that comment at the shrinks office was supposed to portray that- when he said “an aggravated circumstance” and Erik says “yeah they were really aggravating.” I don’t think that was supposed to be comedic relief, I think that was supposed to truly buckle you in for a roller coaster of so what is it? I know I speak for almost everyone when I say no one what’s to deny a victims story, no one wants to questions a victims account of something- BUT, this entire show is to truly capture the fact that it all could just be that. A story- but how it could also be a mix of a lot of different truths. I love how in the final 2 episodes they really show every single possible scenario, of how the boys are brats and abusive to their parents, and that there may also be some abuse from their parents as well, or how the boys are just abusive, and there was no abuse, and this was a fabrication. Or a mix of both. Lyle having those recorded conversations of him basically saying it’s false, or them never bringing it up to the therapist, even when Erik was suicidal at a point riddled with guilt, and the therapist was trying to coax him into telling him something to make it self defense and he was blank- Lyle hyping Erik up, multiple times, telling him he’s an actor. The proof that Lyle was writing and calling friends and family trying to get them to lie for them at trial. I really think the show does an amazing job of covering every possible aspect and situation. The parents eating ice cream watching tv- or that they could have been asleep together on the couch. Every bit of it is to show not the monster in everyone but the innocence in everyone. To show that this could have gone so many ways and at the end of the day we will NEVER know the truth.
I haven't finished it yet (on ep 5 rn) but I'm liking it so far. The only thing that I do agree with twt and clutching-pearls type of people is that since this is based on real people, its definitely side eyeing how they portrayed part of the brothers relationship. If this wasn't a real case, I'd be totally fine with it because ykw, fiction is fiction and I'm tired of people making it as if you're condoning stuff irl just bc you consummed it. However, talking only about the show itself, you're right that it did a great job with the storytelling, acting, the reveals and technical aspect. I just wish such cases didn't exist in real life, it's heartbreaking to think about that.
My friend and I literally were talking about how the show would be much better if he based it on these events but made it very clear it was a stand alone show for entertainment. Like change the names and some other things out of respect and it would be much more watchable, I only have a problem with it being real ppl.
from even before the show started, i was like, is ryan murphy gonna be weird about the brothers, will this be an incest thing. by the end of the show, it's clear that's not something they're interested in beyond the rumor of. so the shower scene very much read like just that, a rumor that people were speculating about, it was put in with other speculations, it was mean to not be taken seriously. but the scene that bothered me was the one in episode, where coked up lyle kisses eric and they get weirdly sensual on the dance floor with people watching them weird. because, yeah maybe that's also part of "how the public viewed them" with the lavish lifestyle and everything, but that scene felt like it was not there for a narrative purpose. it was there because it's episode 2 of a netflix show, and they wanted a tantalizing clip that would make people talk about them, have people get mad and not click off the show, and be like "look, sexy guys dancing together, they might kiss!" basically everything about that scene, in the context of the show, felt like it was there for exploitative reasons, and it was really unfortunate, considering the show is good, why are you tainting it with this scene
*Vision I’ve been patiently waiting for this video since I watched The Hurt Man episode and was like damn, this is actually really good? In that aspect at least
Lyle’s character was actually so charming and funny to me lmao but yeah about what people are complaining about-the show was just visualizing different theories it wasn’t saying that the brothers for sure kissed or had a love affair so I think people are being dramatic like even at the end the show said “we probably won’t ever know what happened between that family”. And I get that it can get confusing to the audience but a documentary from the brothers side is coming out soon so there’s that to clear it up. Also I loved their style ALOT. As well ass every-time people get mad at the portrayal I’m like it’s the same thing with gypsy like I’m on their side regardless but they still…killed their parents like stop acting like they’re babies. Also I feel like if they were lying why would they also say Lyle touched him with how close they are like I believe them.
To be fair it’s understandable that people would be mad about presenting a theory that the brothers were incestous with each other because it’s beyond ludicrous and is backed up by no evidence whatsoever. I get what Ryan was trying to do with the show but the execution isn’t great.
That’s funny, I always thought Ryan Murphy used the Don’t Dream it’s Over song because it is by a band called Crowded House and that was sort of a wink to the viewer that the house was too crowded for the whole family to continue existing with each other…or something along those lines.
I agree wholeheartedly with this video's thesis, BUT... it's really no surprise the show was so misunderstood. It was so subtle in its portrayal of the brother's characters, I think in a world as media-literacy-uncultured as ours, it was inevitable people would dislike it. I watched it with my mom (she's not stupid, it's just that schools don't really teach us peoper media literacy) and her take-away was that the parents were utterly innocent.
Marshall Stannus be THE MAN! Thank you for such a thoughtful, insightful, highly intelligent, and well-researched review. How, oh how, I wish I had Netflix. Thirty years ago, I was disgusted by the court of popular opinion around the Menendez brothers. However, I knew that if one hasn't experienced that kind of abuse firsthand, it would be rather difficult to wrap one's head around such drastic behavior. I was abused every which way growing up. My heart goes out to the Menendez brothers. I believe they acted out of desperation, not knowing how to get proper outside help. (Perhaps, there was no outside help to be had.) Extremely sad situation. Fortunately, my own generational abuse story ends with me. Bless you, Marshall. So very impressive you are.
Lyle never said he fooled the jury, he just gave the overall impression that the jury siding with the defense was ultimately more important to him than the truth (at the time)
as much as i get your view about the dramatization i think he should not have done it about real traumatized people, especially at this time where they are waiting for a retrial. Painting them in this light for millions of people to see (a lot of people who are not educated on the case) is i think pretty harmful, especially as the rumors scenes and real life scenes are not particularly distinguishable. Also the way lyle is portrayed is completely off from the truth and i don’t understand how that could have happened
pretty crazy for murphy to write lyle as a egotistical angry maniac based off oziels testimony saying he was angry when he called to say his brother confessed vs all of his family member saying he was charming and one of the most kindest people ever since he was a kid
It feels like whenever lyle expressed anger when rightly so. They ran with it as if that is his whole character trait. When everybody who knew him said he was a calm and quiet person.
Very good review. The series is nuanced so not everyone is going to get the artistic approach which represents the various opinions in the 1990s. I recall that opinions were split down gender lines. My girlfriends mostly believed the brothers and the majority of our male friends didn’t believe them at all. Our culture has changed significantly so I do think it’s moved a new generation who didn’t live it in the 90s to potentially view it through less biased eyes. I’m extremely impressed with what the brothers contributed to the prison system. They have utilized their privileged education to give back significantly. I wish the series would have ended by showing who the brothers are today.
It’s like “Blonde”. Using the story of Marilyn Monroe to make a very sexual, morbid movie. With this brothers, Netflix uses again the seemingly mandatory need to make every character a gay person and laying stress on violence and twisted minds…
ryan murphy has never actually caref about victims- he’s maxe that clear throughout his work. and youve made i clear within eleven minutes of this video. “at the end of the day, they did murder their parents” you clearly do not know how traumatic and torturous it is to go through familial abuse. to show someone who was molested their entire childhood, verbally abused, physically abused and encouraged to do that to other, and to act as if they are “monsters” for defending themsleves, that’s ridiculous. he showed the world in the first season how much he absolutely did not care about families snd he pushes that narrative further now. and YOU makw it even worse with your blasè, nonchalant way in which these people are affected. “yeah ik this was mean but 🤷♀️ “ like are you kidding me??
Great review. I do agree with the idea of all the different perspectives recreated showing just how hard people didn’t know what to think of the whole situation at the time. That last scene was really interesting the earlier comment about fishing for sharks late in the day and how that was suspicious to the boys but then Jose saying he doesn’t know the first thing about fishing sharks..
ah, what a shame the docu recommendations that were in the description are gone. could anyone share a timestamp? after finishing the series, I really want to see what could suggest some plotlines for the screenwritters
Were you purposely wearing a sweater that was all the rage in 1989? I’m the same age as Lyle Menendez. That sweater you’re wearing, every preppy boy wore one in ‘89. It’s like you’re trying to look like the Menendez brothers. 🤣
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I grew up with an abusive mother. It's true that sometimes they can be really kind and sweet. This is what makes it all so confusing and causes abused children to blame themselves. How can a mother one day be kind and the next day be raging and beating you and ridiculing you. It took me until many many years of therapy and questioning myself before I accepted that I was abused. I let her do it until I was about 45 before I walked away for good. I'm 60 now and still have confused feelings about it. The thing with abusive parents is that you don't stop loving the parent, you stop loving yourself. It takes an awful lot of training to change that.
I wish more people understood this. It's annoying how many comments i see blaming the brothers for not leaving and reportingl to police. Because they're rich, they're physically strong they could've just left. Like damn if only it was that simple
@@crazywhirlwind Yes, it's easy to blame the victim when you were never around to witness the chaos of their childhood. The hardest thing to do is walk away from your parents, eventhough or maybe especially when they are abusive.
Thank you for sharing that. You’re not alone at all. I’m so glad you are in a better place and space, somewhere safe you always deserved. It can be hard to accept that because almost no one is 100% bad all of the time but that does not mean you deserve a second of the pain or hurt that a caregiver should never show a child. It is their responsibility to care for the child & not the other way around, & I’m sorry your early years were so warped. I pray you have supportive & kind & unconditionally loving people around you now as you always deserved ❤
@@crazywhirlwindyup, absolutely not that simple. Children are programmed to listen to, love, & need their parents, especially if they are young, but really through their whole childhood, adolescence, & adulthood. It is never, ever their fault for receiving abuse. Often the perpetrator can tell them incorrect information about the abuse, like it’s common, or deserved, or an accident, or telling will result in more harm… but it should never happen period & adults know better. Kids do not know, so I am disheartened at people with so little empathy to know how much bravery & strength to ask for help, particularly when kids are not always believed the first time or any time they tell.
Very well-said! Especially "You don't stop loving the parent, you stop loving yourself." And I'm so proud of you for walking away ans retraining yourself. You deserve love without judgment, friend.
The major issue with shows like this are they are inherently exploitative and twist the truth for drama. A lot of people will not do research on it and take it at face value. What's worse is that people will believe whatever narrative the show sells. Also media literacy among the general watchers is pretty bad. They really don't know how to tell truth from fiction.
EDIT: if my comment makes you feel pissed off for some reason,
You're weird and you have issues. If you're as smart as you think you are, this general comment would have never gotten under your skin.
"media literacy" ..... you people love repeating buzzwords you see on the internet....
@@alejandromolinaclol this is so true. My 17 year old knew it was exaggerated.
@alejandromolinac did you feel personally targeted because you're one of those people I was talking about? Haha
@@may.k_me clearly you did or you wouldn't have @ me ,good try but you're very transparent
Of course it’s exaggerated it’s not a Documentary. If you watch the whole show different episodes play from a different point of view.
Regarding Eric Menendez's complicated feelings toward his sexuality- if you're assualted multiple times/ regularly, some of those times you might have a biological response.
From a child or young teenager's basic understanding wouldn't a biological response be viewed as liking it to some degree? That could confuse just about anyone let alone someone who has had only limited experiences. They simply do not know better.
With regards to the use of the word "nice"- anything less than violent, less than uncomfortable, with even the bare minimum of softness could be categorised as "nice". This would of course be relative to his prior experiences with his father.
💯
A great many men--look to Rome, Greece, or even now where a lot of people have secrets--are bisexual. I can only assume sexual abuse makes such issues more complicated
I think Ryan Murphy really sexualized the brothers the sexy dances and having sexual tension and the shower scene felt very gross and exploitive I'm fine with showing different perspectives but he made it tasteless. And him showing the boys side what he did show he didn't get a lot of it accurate. And the portrayal of lyle too. It all just bled together to the point where I was just like this is icky. Even my younger sister watching this who knows nothing about this case was like omg are the two brothers together. People who haven't done the research are getting the wrong idea and when they look up stuff see how exploitative it is
Wow. You didnt get the point of this
You are so right!!!!!
Icky is the right word. I can't stand Ryan Murphy. He gives me the ick.
Child abuse is icky.
Was the scene where they blasted the parents to oblivion ya know, when they murdered the parents with shotguns, was that "icky"
Okay the tapes with lyle talking on the phone aren't incriminating I have listened to them and he sound douchey but it corroborates what the boys said. He doesn't say anything about fake crying or anything. Because the police late searched the women's home and was like we listened to the tapes no one where on there does he say these thing Also the women that supposedly heard lyle say these thing came out and said Dominic DUnne had payed her to lie on lyle because he was pro prosecution
Omg i was wondering about that too, good to know
Even in the show, I felt the tapes were only evidence of Lyle’s need for attention and brattiness
I do really get where Murphy is coming from when he tries to include different possible theories and perspectives on the story. However, the way it was executed did not sit well with me at all... I am all for nuance, but as we generally view things through the linear story telling, and the "truth" is usually slowly unravelled during a show... The last episodes do carry the most weight. By showing the brothers discussing premeditated murder of their parents, by showing the parents being a flawed but decent couple and by hardly focusing on the abuse in the later episodes, it -at least to me- felt as if this was the supposed main message of the show: that they did not act out of fear for their lives, but that it was premeditated. And because of this, it felt as if the show DID take a stance on what it believed to be te truth, siding with the opposition and framing the brothers as using the "abuse excuse".
Right. The thing is that there weren't too many different perspectives about the parents when it came to friends, family, associates, teachers, coaches, neighbors, etc. They all thought the parents were weird/awful/domineering/abusive/pathological/liars etc. To add nuance to the story Ryan had to lie, I mean, *cough*, get really creative.
The show could have explored the nuance of mental stability when it comes to childhood trauma. It could have explored the nuance of spousal abuse. It could have done so many things with the truth. But he chose not to. I just don't get it.
@@wb6266 I totally agree, there is so much wasted potential... It's sad
I simply loved the scenes of him freaking out and screaming for 10 cent coins😭 he was a millionaire and they couldn't get simple coins for him
😂
My husband was watching this and I was just doing other stuff and Nicholas Chavez made me stop in my tracks and become obsessed with this show. What an incredible performance
Both of the "brothers" gave stellar perfomances. Cooper Koch in episode 5 was gut wrenching.
The thumbnail for this is fucking hilarious 😂 I've been looking forward to your review. I literally watched this series so I could watch your review lmao
I would have watched Netflix's Mendez Series: Monsters even if Marshall had not planned on reviewing it, but I binged it to watch the video immediately.
I disagree with some of your conclusions but I actually enjoyed this review and seeing this show from a different perspective. I totally get what Ryan Murphy was trying to do with the show but don’t think it was executed well. I came away thinking the show was kind of a confusing mess. Other than that my main gripes were some of the weird inaccuracies/creative liberties they took. Lyle’s characterisation in particular was just so ridiculous to me (even though the actor was great). He was just so over the top that it wasn’t believable but I guess if you view it from the angle of an exaggerated version of how the media at the time portrayed them then it kind of makes sense. Lyle also never told Norma Novelli that he fooled the jury. He certainly comes across as obnoxious and somewhat manipulative on those tapes in real life but he never suggests that anything was fake.
Overall I mostly enjoyed the show for the performances but the execution just wasn’t there for me.
Yeah, for me, this show was my first introduction to the case. I definitely thought that Lyle was the manipulator/had ASPD, and Eric was "just" dragged into it. But after additional (albeit limited) research, I think the show did a rather bad job at portraying the brothers. Especially Lyle, but somewhat Eric as well.
@@SammyLammy1D The expert who evaluated Lyle also concluded that he didn't have ASPD. He was just extremely repressed due to the abuse and brainwashing he experienced
@@YourEverydaySheep Yes complex trauma can cause people to act like they have personality disorders.
He wasn't a millionaire- his parents were.
@YourEverydaySheep yeah I know. But the show made it seem differently, IMO.
Ok never watched a video from you before but jeepers you really get it, you are smart af. Everyone is so busy pearl-clutching after watching half the show they don’t see how amazing this achievement is
Absolutely agree with you, this show was very much about painting the picture that the prosecution, defense, media, were serculating at the time, unfortunately i dont feel that the show was very clear about it. Maybe if they had explored it through the eyes of each juror on the trial, each episode use a different juror it would have been clear that this is how people thought opposed to what the boys were like. I didn't realize what the show was doing till i read the book by Robert Rand. It took me almost 2 days to realize that the director was saying, we know the boys are guilty but did they deserve life in prison, and we know the parents were guilty of abuse but did they deserve to die? Great concept, maybe not the best execution
The disproportionality of the backlash, and how uninformed it seems, is apparently becoming the norm for media. 'Transgressive', or simply honest, is out.
I do believe that the biggest problem with the series is that it's about real people, but after seeing the reaction to Dahmer I don't know if the sort who levy that criticism are serious individuals who actually WATCHED either of the shows in their entirety.
I'll be thinking about episode 5 for a really fucking long time. Really remarkable performance by the guy who plays Erik.
You look like you should be in the show. 😂 Love your commentary.
You know what, I really appreciate the creativity that they did in the show, the way that it shows different perspectives for atleast every single episode is really bold and smart. I think the series itself is great. But is this the type of show that the Menendez Brothers really need? Considering the situation that they're in right now? I think that's the reason why I cannot fully love the show, because instead of showing the audience the whole truth, the series kind of takes back the audience to the view of the general public during the times of the trial, which was very conflicting at the time. So is that really what the Menendez Brothers really need?
This happened over 20 years ago, and they’ve had over multiple documentaries published. It’s not about what they need, it’s something Murphy brought attention to just like Dahmer. He has the right to do so and we have the right to critique his work.
Loved it! Binged in one day. Glued to the screen. I’m still torn between what I believe…… it’s a crazy ride
Brilliant work Marshall totally appreciate your take on Monsters👏👏👏
The song is called Dirty Cash (Money Talks) by Adventures of Stevie V. 😉
I honestly agree with everything you have said! People don’t use critical thinking with most things and the way media is normally portrayed dulls people’s understanding of levels of abuse/emotion and how this affects every person in any situation.
They play Milli Vanilli because Milli Vanilli were two guys that faked it for money and greed, and some of the other guys, and they completely say that they were conceited
You may want to look up the documentary on the duo. You might have another perspective on them
Another amazing review! I love how you pointed out how the show produces a confused reaction from the audience as both sides of the case are depicted, which also mirrors the experience of Eric and other abuse victims as their abusers aren't abusing 24/7. I feel like in that way the show subtly provides another defense for the brothers as it shows their inner conflict despite the abuse.
The only this i disagree with is I felt like the show was dragging after halfway. And especially during the Dom episode because I felt like his dinner party scenes were repeated a lot. Although, I will admit part of that was because I found the content of the show (as someone not familar with the case) very upsetting and I wanted it to end.
Nice review, especially not being familiar with the case.
was waiting for your review to come out! i think the uproar on social media is going a little bit crazy but i know it’s caused by them seeing clips completely out of context. i agree with what you said of its portrayal of erik’s sexuality and how messy that was. i just think more people should actually watch the show in its entirety before writing think pieces about how bad it is. great video my friend
This show is a gross exploitation of a tragedy and failure of our legal system . Rather than waste your time with this Ryan Murphy cash grab dramatization you should look into the case and watch their testimonies or a documentary that doesn’t paint them as monsters. While the crime of killing their parents is of course horrid, the parents were sick child predators and all you have to do is watch their testimony to understand what led up to their brutal act. Their first trial ended with a hung jury and their second convicted them because the prosecution got the judge to ignore key evidence and testimony of their ongoing childhood r*pe and m*lestaion by their parents. They should have gotten manslaughter and had the chance to live their lives outside of prison again. I also recommend the documentary Menudo as this grants outside claim to Jose Menendez being a child pr*dator outside of his own family.
You describing Nathan lane as “From Bo Is Afraid” just SENT ME lol! Great review!
Good job as usual. I couldn't wait for your review and you didn't disappoint. Impressive research too 👏🏾 🙏🏾👏🏾
YAY I’ve been waiting to hear from you king
I will be watching your video tomorrow. Thank you.
I love this show. It was the perfect make sure between campiness and and a counterculture and even a make sure of postmodernism in the show. I love monster season two Nicolas Chavez did a great job. He’s going to bigger things since he’s been on General Hospital if you don’t know about that, this is a great show. I love you.
Despite people's criticism, I think it was pretty good. Ryan Murphy commented and he has good points. They did do their research and this is a SHOW bot a documentary. But this is definitely not superior to Dahmer, no way.
Agreed!! It’s crazy people are saying this show is full of nothing but lies 😂 I mean no, not everything but a lot of the events DID happen. I do agree though, Dahmer is the superior show. This was a wacky media circus of a case so I get in tone going the dark comedy route…but I think it cheapened the heaviness as opposed to Dahmer.
Nathan Lane jump scare! What is he doing in this show?!?
I felt the same when I saw him in Dicks the Musical’ they must paid him the coins! 😂
Ruining it tbh
To me have something off , like some piece that is missing, mayb
Oh an hour and a half??? We eatin good tn🙂↕️🙏🏻
Oh, this analysis was perfect! I agree with pretty much everything - I do think you’re able to appreciate it more though when you know the case well.
I guess the only thing I push back on is Erik’s sexuality - he did say he was confused but because he has said he’s straight so many times…I do think Ryan went overboard. It’s like throughout the show & the shower scene 🥴
For the ending, yea it lost steam but I also think maybe that was the energy because that’s how the 2nd trial felt. The final scene is very nuanced though and think it’s gone above a lot of people’s heads. Thanks for communicating how nuanced the ending is.
I watched Dahmer and it was chilling. Maybe more than I expected. I know this is a different case by far but I only watched an episode and a half because rather than being scary I found it comedic and I doubt it was meant to be. The Milli Vanilli and Vanilla Ice didn't help. Perhaps, I'll give it another try.
I think what it is is that this is so counterculture for people that they just can’t understand the counterculture in the show and it is counterculture impulse modern at the same time people used to as much as they used to postmodern that’s what I think about it. See you when you see when season three.
Pls fix your grammar
disgusting show. a lot of lies in there. didn't like it. just make a fictional show about killers. no need to sexualize the brothers and making a fake narrative.
also, NOW you "kinda" believe that they were abused? with all the evidence and psychologists confirming that they didn't fake emotions on the stand? oh okay.
Here's the thing people are going to believe what they want . There defense pays people to say what they need them to. The menudo member accused someone else first. The family stood behind the boys its not absurd to believe they lied for them or that anyone could've wrote the letter. When people are facing the death penalty the fear of that can drum up a lot of emotion. The truth is the prosecution could have DNA for a case proving a person guilty and the defense will convince people it's wrong. Many people don't believe the brothers thought their parents were going to kill them and that they made that up .
I Stand by my Statement that if gypsy rose Blanchard is free they should be too
@@sleepysadpoetcrimes are executed differently ,not comparable in that way
I was a little hurt when he kept dissing the title “friends” 😭 that’s my comfort show man 😂
I didn't like the interpretation of Lyle in the Netflix show, if you watch the real trial, he is nothing like the show, in the movie he is totally insane
They’re showing many people’s perspectives of the boys at the same time to create a confusing feeling that was felt in the 90’s during that time…not knowing back then what to believe. It’s an artistic interpretation that you just didn’t get….
I think it was a great show, dahmer too
I’ve only really ever seen episode I’ve only ever seen seven episodes of this show but a really retweet the critical race theory narrative of the critical theory narrative of the of the other boys and really mixed together
That’s really Republican of me, but Eric Mendez doesn’t seem like they’re doing the innocent fraud kind of thing so they can get out of jail, but nothing has ever been in my history has not been book of them saying that they didn’t deserve. The guy deserve to be in jail for years.😅 that’s my opinion. My name is K1 Republican guy.
???weird
59:07 you mean legendary screen, broadway, and voice acting star Nathan Lane?
The question is, why did Ryan Murphy feel the need to lie and make the brothers seem incestuous when they were child sexual abuse victims? What is with Hollywood's incessant need to sexualize teenagers (which is the age he showed them in the shower together (something that never happened without their dad, btw)? Why did Ryan need to fabricate Erik questioning his sexuality? And why did Ryan need to make Lyle seem like an asshole psychopath that could cry on command? It's all so strange. The true story is JUST AS INTERESTING. I can only assume that Ryan Murphy got off on some weird thoughts about the brothers (mostly Erik), and then wrote it into the story.
Chloe Savigney was amazing. She is such an underrated actress. I also love her on AHS and wish they would give her more screen time. The song is called "Dirty Cash" by The Adventures of Stevie V. Amazing 90s dance song. That whole Stevie V album was so good!
I do believe that they wanted their parents' money, But the abuse is what made them capable of doing what they did. I don't think they're psychopaths, Or sociopaths. They're traumatized. They deserved prison, But with a chance of parole.
Top notch review, was seeking this kind of commentary with a critical, deep thinking lens outside of rotten tomatoes. Thank you!
I think the show said it best "what people hate the most is nuance."
there is no nuance in this case. The parents were child rapists and their two sons weren't the only victims. there's no excuse for defending child rapists and painting them in a good light, as Murphy has tried to do in this garbage show.
I really tried to watch the Netflix version with open mind but having watched the actual trial and all the other documentaries related to this I think the “twisting of truth for tv” is kinda too much. Its probably good for people who doesn’t know or heard of the Menendez Brothers before this series.
I’m on episode five and I doubt I can finish it because of the inappropriate relationships🤢 like I’m quite grossed out
The show showed both sides of the story, including the media. Ryan Murphy makes his shows and gives his art for what the viewer takes with it. This two sides to the story however we’ll never know as the parents aren’t alive to tell it. I think Ryan did a respectful job with not saying too much but also not saying too little, absolutely amazing performances and very complexed in seeing the lies and truths of the living.
Also noticed that Lyle never called his parents mom and dad he always said kitty and José in the court room calling their real name or my parents but with Eric he always said my brother😢 i feel like he killed his parents for Eric's freedom from his dad sexual abuse and i think he was guilty to blame him self for what he did to Eric when they were young the wood story😢 ,that's why he so emotional and over protective to his brother he stood up for his brother trew every thing he has for eric
Kitty actress is in Feud as One of the group of women whom Trueman Capote wrote about. She is a top actress along with Javier.
My mom was so disturbed by the cinnamon thing. She was like “ok, enough of this series for tonight” it took both my mom and dad by surprise haha.
Good acting, good casting, excellent!
With this cast it could have been an amazing show. The acting was incredible. It was funny. It was sad. It was scary. It depressed me especially the ending. The system failed. The abuse, the torture they went through and the show BARLEY touched just how bad it was for these boys. The incest was not needed to be shown between the boys or hinting that they were lying, because viewers who dont understand the story or the way tramua works. They label them liars and its heartbreaking to be called a liar when youre telling the world you were abused by your parents. I wish they would be released. Its surrel to think they hsve been in prison this long.
Also agree the outfits are insanely good. I like a spoiled boy character in tv and movies. Im a sucker for it.
I loved this show. I think Murphy is a visionary of television. He has been pushing boundaries for years now. He’s added real style and true substance to pop culture television and I am 100% here for it every single time. It is truly strange to me what people choose to be outraged by. Film is art. Good art comforts the disturbed and disturbs the comfortable.
Finally someone that agrees with me. I think the show was great and depicts the complex relationships that a family dynamic has. This case is so tragic, it also shows how we have grown as a society. I don't belive they would've gotten the same sentence today as they did in the 90's. Also refreshing to not watch a show about yet another serial killer that already has had their story told a million of times. This case is so interesting in so many different ways, the case itself, the public, the 90's and the messy trails.
Oh man, when Erik was telling his lawyer his story, I had to remember to breathe. It was so sad and disturbing 😢
Why’re you getting all involved in the thumbnail 😭😭
the way i watched this show just so i could watch your review with the whole context in mind
I am in the middle of it and I have watched the trial and interviews and the personality of Lyle does not fit the one shown in the show. I also find it inappropiate to sexualize the brothers because sex in the whole story is a very serious and harmful matter. Unnecessary.
Mainly here for Nathan frickin Lane. Love of my life.
ryan murphy should never be trusted for accuracy, he could have made this show but changed the names and had it “inspired” by the brothers rather than making it seem like an actual dramatic biopic. then people would NOT have the same issues with the weird incest and exaggerations and it would probably do a lot better tbh.
episode 5 was a directional work of art.
Hi guys so, my section on “DIMES” at around 30-35 mins in got butchered by copyright so some of what I say has been removed
Basically I loved the section- loved Eric’s body language and Lyle stepping into protect, it was incredibly captivating, well edited, satisfying and compelling, probably my fave part of the show, ashame I couldn’t include my section
my problem with the show is why they felt the need to make things up when the real story is right there? in the court videos, told by actual witnesses?
anybody who thinks that the people who hated the show are over reacting obviously never watched the court videos or know a lot about the case. it was grossly exaggerated and about 70% of it was dramatized or completely made up bs. Lyle was basically a fictional character it was laughable
Regarding showing that "theory" or line of thinking by the prosecution that because Eric was confused about his sexuality, or experimenting himself sometimes, that was the basis of his narrative on his SA by Jose-
Is it homophobic? Yes. It was also the 90s. And even though it seems offensive to even think it in 2024, people do think it. It was a part of the prosecution's argument. I think Ryan Murphy including that angle makes sense. It isn't nice and extremely offensive. But the goal was to reflect what came up in the trials and all that.
Yes but adding fabricated credibility and presenting it as a 50/50 when it's really a 20/80 is unethical and exploitative...
@@sparksfly5877 agreed
I just think they ruined the character with Lyle I can’t tell you how many times I was pissed off at the character for doing stupid shit over and over again. “Fulling the jury” that was just stupid.
@@daltonhartwell like i read the book with his recordings and he NEVER SAID THAT WTF
I think people are kind of missing the point of this show in a way-
It’s to truly show ALL sides of the different stories. Because at the end of the day- we don’t know what is true and what isn’t.
And I think that comment at the shrinks office was supposed to portray that- when he said “an aggravated circumstance” and Erik says “yeah they were really aggravating.” I don’t think that was supposed to be comedic relief, I think that was supposed to truly buckle you in for a roller coaster of so what is it?
I know I speak for almost everyone when I say no one what’s to deny a victims story, no one wants to questions a victims account of something- BUT, this entire show is to truly capture the fact that it all could just be that. A story- but how it could also be a mix of a lot of different truths.
I love how in the final 2 episodes they really show every single possible scenario, of how the boys are brats and abusive to their parents, and that there may also be some abuse from their parents as well, or how the boys are just abusive, and there was no abuse, and this was a fabrication. Or a mix of both.
Lyle having those recorded conversations of him basically saying it’s false, or them never bringing it up to the therapist, even when Erik was suicidal at a point riddled with guilt, and the therapist was trying to coax him into telling him something to make it self defense and he was blank-
Lyle hyping Erik up, multiple times, telling him he’s an actor.
The proof that Lyle was writing and calling friends and family trying to get them to lie for them at trial.
I really think the show does an amazing job of covering every possible aspect and situation.
The parents eating ice cream watching tv- or that they could have been asleep together on the couch.
Every bit of it is to show not the monster in everyone but the innocence in everyone.
To show that this could have gone so many ways and at the end of the day we will NEVER know the truth.
I haven't finished it yet (on ep 5 rn) but I'm liking it so far. The only thing that I do agree with twt and clutching-pearls type of people is that since this is based on real people, its definitely side eyeing how they portrayed part of the brothers relationship. If this wasn't a real case, I'd be totally fine with it because ykw, fiction is fiction and I'm tired of people making it as if you're condoning stuff irl just bc you consummed it. However, talking only about the show itself, you're right that it did a great job with the storytelling, acting, the reveals and technical aspect. I just wish such cases didn't exist in real life, it's heartbreaking to think about that.
My friend and I literally were talking about how the show would be much better if he based it on these events but made it very clear it was a stand alone show for entertainment. Like change the names and some other things out of respect and it would be much more watchable, I only have a problem with it being real ppl.
from even before the show started, i was like, is ryan murphy gonna be weird about the brothers, will this be an incest thing. by the end of the show, it's clear that's not something they're interested in beyond the rumor of. so the shower scene very much read like just that, a rumor that people were speculating about, it was put in with other speculations, it was mean to not be taken seriously. but the scene that bothered me was the one in episode, where coked up lyle kisses eric and they get weirdly sensual on the dance floor with people watching them weird. because, yeah maybe that's also part of "how the public viewed them" with the lavish lifestyle and everything, but that scene felt like it was not there for a narrative purpose. it was there because it's episode 2 of a netflix show, and they wanted a tantalizing clip that would make people talk about them, have people get mad and not click off the show, and be like "look, sexy guys dancing together, they might kiss!" basically everything about that scene, in the context of the show, felt like it was there for exploitative reasons, and it was really unfortunate, considering the show is good, why are you tainting it with this scene
I didn’t take it as “are they monsters?” But rather it’s their parents who ended up being the monsters.
i love the way you broke this show down, and love your perspective on things!
I think the director was personally attracted to the idea of incest between the brothers
*Vision
I’ve been patiently waiting for this video since I watched The Hurt Man episode and was like damn, this is actually really good? In that aspect at least
Take a shot every time he says hero-ing
Lyle’s character was actually so charming and funny to me lmao but yeah about what people are complaining about-the show was just visualizing different theories it wasn’t saying that the brothers for sure kissed or had a love affair so I think people are being dramatic like even at the end the show said “we probably won’t ever know what happened between that family”. And I get that it can get confusing to the audience but a documentary from the brothers side is coming out soon so there’s that to clear it up. Also I loved their style ALOT. As well ass every-time people get mad at the portrayal I’m like it’s the same thing with gypsy like I’m on their side regardless but they still…killed their parents like stop acting like they’re babies.
Also I feel like if they were lying why would they also say Lyle touched him with how close they are like I believe them.
To be fair it’s understandable that people would be mad about presenting a theory that the brothers were incestous with each other because it’s beyond ludicrous and is backed up by no evidence whatsoever.
I get what Ryan was trying to do with the show but the execution isn’t great.
@@YourEverydaySheepI saw it as just visualizing a theory that people had at the time. Really seeing the different “sides” per day
@princesswells9469 most people watching will not see it just a "visualising" theory...
Marshall, thanks for your step by step on how to watch a TV show. Next week, can you walk us through Sesame Street!? 😂
That’s funny, I always thought Ryan Murphy used the Don’t Dream it’s Over song because it is by a band called Crowded House and that was sort of a wink to the viewer that the house was too crowded for the whole family to continue existing with each other…or something along those lines.
I agree wholeheartedly with this video's thesis, BUT... it's really no surprise the show was so misunderstood. It was so subtle in its portrayal of the brother's characters, I think in a world as media-literacy-uncultured as ours, it was inevitable people would dislike it. I watched it with my mom (she's not stupid, it's just that schools don't really teach us peoper media literacy) and her take-away was that the parents were utterly innocent.
Marshall Stannus be THE MAN! Thank you for such a thoughtful, insightful, highly intelligent, and well-researched review. How, oh how, I wish I had Netflix. Thirty years ago, I was disgusted by the court of popular opinion around the Menendez brothers. However, I knew that if one hasn't experienced that kind of abuse firsthand, it would be rather difficult to wrap one's head around such drastic behavior. I was abused every which way growing up. My heart goes out to the Menendez brothers. I believe they acted out of desperation, not knowing how to get proper outside help. (Perhaps, there was no outside help to be had.) Extremely sad situation. Fortunately, my own generational abuse story ends with me. Bless you, Marshall. So very impressive you are.
Lyle never said he fooled the jury, he just gave the overall impression that the jury siding with the defense was ultimately more important to him than the truth (at the time)
as much as i get your view about the dramatization i think he should not have done it about real traumatized people, especially at this time where they are waiting for a retrial. Painting them in this light for millions of people to see (a lot of people who are not educated on the case) is i think pretty harmful, especially as the rumors scenes and real life scenes are not particularly distinguishable. Also the way lyle is portrayed is completely off from the truth and i don’t understand how that could have happened
pretty crazy for murphy to write lyle as a egotistical angry maniac based off oziels testimony saying he was angry when he called to say his brother confessed vs all of his family member saying he was charming and one of the most kindest people ever since he was a kid
It feels like whenever lyle expressed anger when rightly so. They ran with it as if that is his whole character trait. When everybody who knew him said he was a calm and quiet person.
@@ILikeTheIvy exactly, ryan murphy played with his anger just like the court did to make him seem like a sociopath
what was that clip at 27:05 ???? its really fast and you'll miss it if you don't slow it down. it looked like real footage of the crime scene.
Very good review. The series is nuanced so not everyone is going to get the artistic approach which represents the various opinions in the 1990s. I recall that opinions were split down gender lines. My girlfriends mostly believed the brothers and the majority of our male friends didn’t believe them at all. Our culture has changed significantly so I do think it’s moved a new generation who didn’t live it in the 90s to potentially view it through less biased eyes. I’m extremely impressed with what the brothers contributed to the prison system. They have utilized their privileged education to give back significantly. I wish the series would have ended by showing who the brothers are today.
It’s like “Blonde”. Using the story of Marilyn Monroe to make a very sexual, morbid movie. With this brothers, Netflix uses again the seemingly mandatory need to make every character a gay person and laying stress on violence and twisted minds…
I’m at 20 minutes and I’m loving your well articulated review of this movie, so far! You’re making me come to a new appreciation of this series
Thank you so much!!
ryan murphy has never actually caref about victims- he’s maxe that clear throughout his work. and youve made i clear within eleven minutes of this video. “at the end of the day, they did murder their parents” you clearly do not know how traumatic and torturous it is to go through familial abuse. to show someone who was molested their entire childhood, verbally abused, physically abused and encouraged to do that to other, and to act as if they are “monsters” for defending themsleves, that’s ridiculous. he showed the world in the first season how much he absolutely did not care about families snd he pushes that narrative further now. and YOU makw it even worse with your blasè, nonchalant way in which these people are affected. “yeah ik this was mean but 🤷♀️ “ like are you kidding me??
Great review. I do agree with the idea of all the different perspectives recreated showing just how hard people didn’t know what to think of the whole situation at the time. That last scene was really interesting the earlier comment about fishing for sharks late in the day and how that was suspicious to the boys but then Jose saying he doesn’t know the first thing about fishing sharks..
I thought this was done really well. Great acting. Worth watching 👍
ah, what a shame the docu recommendations that were in the description are gone. could anyone share a timestamp?
after finishing the series, I really want to see what could suggest some plotlines for the screenwritters
It was victims or villains
The menendez murders: Erik tells all
Law and order true crime
Robert rands menendez book
Were you purposely wearing a sweater that was all the rage in 1989? I’m the same age as Lyle Menendez. That sweater you’re wearing, every preppy boy wore one in ‘89. It’s like you’re trying to look like the Menendez brothers. 🤣
Spot on, good spotting ;)
Forgot how funny the snickers bit was 😂😂
Genuinely impressed on how much info n knowledge you got so quickly after the show came out
What are your thoughts on the only scene where we get to see the jurors deliberating?
its crazy you talk about baby riendeer because i was thinking the same thing but then come to find out, this came out in 2022!
this show just came out. the jeffrey dahmer season came out in 2022
oh! they used the same guy from the people vs oj, cool.