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So You Want a Rolex GMT Pre-Ceramic?
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- Опубликовано: 12 апр 2019
- Ash Ken's Comment:
Austin, I need your help. I’m trying to buy a pre-owned 16710 “Pepsi” or “Coke”. I’m mostly looking on Chrono24. Problem is that I’m educating myself on what to look for and I’m seeing conflicting images vs the information in the listing.
I know I want a No Holes case and would prefer as new a model as possible. I’m willing to spend towards the higher end for one in excellent condition.
I see some listings saying it’s dated “2007”, but pic shows a case with holes. Or, a no holes case has what looks like a Tritium dial (says T-25 on the dial).
What do I do? How can I make sense of out of the confusion and tell what is genuine and what isn’t?
Tasukette Kudasai!!
T
True that!
Yep I prefer the hollow end links, Super Luminova, holes case, marked Swiss Made and a pronounced serif font on dial and Bezel. There is a VERY small window, perhaps months that these were made, A serials. I just bought 2 of them in Japan and will be picking them up at the end of August! I agree, A through Y serial is the sweet spot to actually use and the 1997-1998 is the sweet spot for someone who wants the tritium aging but the better clasp.Really can't go wrong during that 5 year period. A lot of transition during that time.
Great discussion!
This is a very good watch discussion video.
Thanks!
Great video! A quick question, is the 3185 movement robust enough to wind the hour hand anti-clockwise 14-15 days to change the date? I know usually you should only ever wind clockwise. Thanks.
I think I saw the same watch referred to in the video. Some of the photos show a no holes case, some a holes case. Price is good, but the discrepancies made my radar go off.
Good Video Topic & Great advice! Something fishy with a few of those pieces and you're exactly right to just move on to another seller!!! The buyer seems to have done some research to notice these problems, with your input he is well on his way to getting a awesome timepiece!
I got the 1999 gmt coke holes case for a reason. I think it was the end of the classic Rolex before the modern day no holes case solid links ceramic bezel Rolex. Definitely has a spot in any Rolex collection.
Great choice!
Yup, holes case and solid end links is the sweet spot in my opinion
Hi Austin there is another variable luminova came in 1998-2000 and a improved version called super luminova was used between 2000 and 2008.
That's right. I've yet to read the article that John linked to - I will later today (Thanks John M!) - but I think those transitional pieces have just Swiss on the dial, as opposed to Swiss Made.
Thanks Austin!
You confirmed my suspicions. Seems like there are people out there trying to capitalize on the GMT craze and scam unsuspecting (and uneducated) buyers. I found a great web site that shows the history of the GMT and covers when dials, cases, laser etched crystals, solid end links, etc. were introduced. I use that as my reference when shopping.
Decided as you suggested to find a well reviewed online seller with brick and mortar as well. Thank you! Ended up finding a few in my area (So. Cal/OC) and I can go see them in person. I’ll also be in Tokyo and Osaka in May, so I might hold off until then. I did find a really nice one-owner Coke at a local dealer with original box and papers. It’s speedy but in great shape and documented. Beautiful. I like classic look of the five digit GMT over the current version. Love the ceramic bezel but the numbers are too big the case shape isn’t as sexy and the polished links on the bracelet (for me) are a deal breaker. There’s a guy at my office that has a Batman and it’s just not for me. I like the timeless/classic look.
Thanks again. Keep up the good work. Love your videos. Gambatte!
No problem - thanks for the topic. I like rattling on about GMT's. Taking a look here is a good move - as a tourist, you wouldn't have to pay the 8% sales tax, and there are lot's of GMT's on offer here. Just be sure to take your passport when you go shopping.
Hi Ash. Could you please link to the website you’re referring to re GMT history. Thanks
Here you go...
www.gmtmasterhistory.com/
Those little cuties surely wanted daddy's attention. 🤣
"M, Z serial, or F serial" -Austin
"F cereal hehe :D" -Daughter
Lol, I thought the same thing when she said that.
He needs to look on eBay also. Chrono 24 is English Euro market and pricier.
Ken should consider a holes case model....the GMT II can look great on a NATO strap.....many of the astronauts wore their GMTs into space on a NATO. It's an adventure travel timepiece and a holes case gives you more options for wear.
I was thinking the very same thing!
Nah. I like the no holes case for GMT Master II. I have many other watches each with their own unique characteristics and I like them all as-is. I don’t modify my timepieces. I have a Bell & Ross GMT with a NATO strap. I like the bracelet on the 16710.
16700 ❤💙🤍
Excellent content 👌🏼
J.
On 16710 Pepsi what is latest Serial before introduction of 3186 Movement ? Z serial 2006 or are there M serial 2007 with 3185 Movement ?
You got it right; the earlier Z serials (2006) were the last of the 3185's. All M serials should have the 3186.
Austin Daniels thanks I am looking for 16710 in next few months and wanted get 2006 with 3185 Movement still way to much premium for 2007 with 3186 Movement. Although, I did see one sell from private seller under 15k and was in very good condition. Thanks I appreciate your prompt response and feedback 👌. I enjoy watching videos. I just bought 126710 BLNR grey market in SD and got Sub C black dial on grey market 6 months ago ....
Austin Daniels how do you value 16710 Pepsi with different years etc I know condition and box papers bracelet etc but prices are all over ?
Basically points out the obvious and tells you to so you home work and Google things.. so much for the advice
You should do more videos like this!
how can you see if its a M or Y serial ... is there a "M" stamped. ?
Take the bracelet off, and between the lugs you'll see a serial number starting with a letter. The letter tells you the year.
thanks ... so I have an seller wanting to sell me a 2003 gmt coke..... he says its 2003 model but it has holes ... I like the holes but here you say they stopped making with holes in the case in mid 2002? @@watchsymposium
Odd, but only slightly so. I saw an A serial the other day with solid end links, whereas my A serial GMT has hollow end links. According to Larry of the Rolex Forum, "Rolex has never stopped producing one letter prefix before beginning another, there was always overlap in both directions over several years. They have also never used a serial prefix as a cut-off or beginning for any feature."
So, it sounds legit. Now if that was a 2007 with holes case that would be a little too strange. Out of curiosity, what serial letter is it? An F?
This is the information source I am using on my GMT quest. It checks out against every other reliable resource so I think it’s very accurate. It has part numbers for bracelets and bezels, etc.
www.gmtmasterhistory.com/
No
Explain
He's a troll Austin ignore him
Great watch simply not worth it. Just sayin
Ya, when you see a Sub for 8 grand, and then a GMT next to it for 13 grand...you have to wonder if it's really a Datejust's worth better.
Nope. Ceramic maxi case. All this love for the old watches is just an attempt to drive up the market on a depreciated item. Go new.
Who is it exactly that's trying to drive up the market on deprecated items?
@@watchsymposium The youtube "watch experts".... Not calling you out specifically. In the end it all comes down to personal preference but it really does seem that there are those that go and buy up older rolex's and the create videos about how special they are so they can sell them at a later date for a premium. I'd rather have a new one than old one so that's how my money is spent. The new gmts and subs just look better (IMO). I think the hulk looks better than the kermit and the newer pepsi looks better than the pre-ceramic. I'd rather have solid links than the rolex rattle. I looked at many iterations of the no date sub before finally buying my 114060. Only way I could/would buy a pre-ceramic would be if it were being offered for about $3,500.00. Just feels to flimsy. I think the newer models feel more substantial and offer more than the look and better somewhat justify the price. This is particularly more evident when you look at the older hollow and semi-hollow gold and two tone versions. My Oris beater feels way more substantial and well built than the older rolex models. So for me, I say buy new if you can afford it. My advice would be, If you're buying a used non-current model think long and hard about paying close to retail. Think really hard about paying retail and slap yourself if your thinking about paying above retail.
If you're buying used because it's the only way you can afford your first rolex, Fairplay. But money not being a factor, I'm buying ceramic over pre-ceramic evertime. I'd only pay over retail on something new that I wanted and could only get grey market. Used is used. Pay used prices. Don't let a hype video make you think paying a current price for an old watch is a good deal.
Again this is my opinion. There may be a guy looking for a 1984 model Daytona because that's the watch he lost in a divorce and willing to pay any price. If i were in the same position I'd buy the new Daytona to signify a rebirth.
If you apply these same pricing schemes to let's say...... I phones. The absurdity becomes evident.
Watch gurus don't have that kind of influence. And honestly, I don't think they have that kind of agenda. If they do play a role it's a small one. What I'm saying is that it's not some well organized conspiracy. There are many of us that simply prefer the older aesthetic of the newer.
OK, next question. You use the term "depreciated items". Would you say a Sub 5513 is a depreciated item? How about a GMT 16710?
@@watchsymposium sure they do. Some have thousands of followers. As far a depreciated? Used is used. Use apple products. Would you long for an iphone 5s? Would you pay more for it than an XR? No because its depreciated. Just because it may hold a little more value in you eye doesn't change the fact that it's an old watch. Take a mint 57 Chevy into carmax for an appraisal. I'm sure you'll be thoroughly disappointed.
Name some RUclips people that are doing that. (no offence taken if you name me)That's a false equivalence, comparing an iPhone to a Rolex. You don't see that? Essentially, it sounds like your philosophy is "newer is always better". Is that a fair characterization?