I find that part of aoe2 rather annoying... especially the part where i have multiple town centres and lots of vill and many of them just can't seem to cut wood without supervision. But still... nostalgia keeps me chughing.
15:15 I'd always really wanted to see something like this: pro archer micro vs. an inexperienced player's micro. With pro vs. pro archer micro it can be more difficult to see the advantage since they're both so good, but this shows exactly why they do it.
the cool thing about aoe2 is that if your decision making is on point you will usually end up in a situation where you don't need to micro perfectly in order to succeed. However, if your micro is on point then you can succeed in situations, where your opponent made slightly better decisions than you. Its an extremely fascinating dynamic and one of the reasons why I still love aoe2 (and RTA games in general)
i can see why Grubby is confused by left click acting like a deselect, but its not a deselect. It is a select or reselect, but if you select nothing then it unselects what was previously selected. As if it isn't keeping it in memory.
The reason the archer right clicking wasn't working quite as expectedly is because despite the map being all explored, the individual LOS of each unit still matters, and when the right click is outside of the unit range more interesting things can happen. Including some archers moving back (because they lost target) or forget they're attacking a real target (walking straight though) although that latter one could be a misclick.
Remember how GL had the boys contractually obliged to offer coaching, and because they didn't have time they set it at 500€/hr. Grubby's going to have to sell the farm once the invoice arrives
Units are now actually behaving a lot smarter WHILE IN AGGRESSIVE STANCE. If you right click with stand ground they will actually all go for the unit you clicked which means you will hard lose against patrol.
It really depends on the scale of the fight. In feudal, when you only got like 3-4 units, stand ground is massivly better since you can actually focus all your hits on an enemy at a time. It also really helps to snipe spears in a scout/spear fight.
@@CG-eh6oe Or focus down a villager in a mass of villagers, I was so confused when why my scouts would attack 1 villager each instead of all to 1, now that I use stand ground attack they isolate their target like wolves
They DID in fact change the behavior of patrolling and attack moving, and made it considerably worse when T90 complained about how strong archer micro is.
@@BuyOrBye As far as I know, they just changed attack move to be like patrol. Which was a nerf as attack move was better, but as far as I know patrol wasn't touched
@@mrkirby8622 Attack move was never better. This is why nobody used it on pro level. They did (at least) two patches with improvements to attack move, to make it usable in DE.
Interesting that even viper didn't know about the changes made. In general tho it's probably best to patrol your unit's, I think one of the things they didn't capture on this was vision of units, if you attack the one that is not in fog of war while the rest are hidden how does the pathing get affected
Knowing that patrol is better is one of the most unintuitive things about AoE2. Hope pathfinding in general will one day finally be improved. Melee units, especially knights, seem to have overall gotten even worse than in classic.
however, they cannot fix it "completely" because that would throw the competetive balance out of the window as this game is designed around the bad path finding. Its kind of a dilemma, actually 11 I mean, look at the *perfectly balanced* stats of a knight ... :D
From an attacking point of view, yeah it is supposed to. If the units reach their destination without attacking, only patrol will cause the units to return to their original location (ie. actually patrolling)
Insta build (+ research) is a cheat which is in the game since Day 1. Type "aegis" (without quotation marks) into the chat box while having cheats enabled. Endless resources is a game setting since Definitive Edition.
![10 Tips for Late Game [Age of Empires 2]](/img/1.gif)
Little micro things like this are part of what makes Aoe2 so interesting to play.
I find that part of aoe2 rather annoying... especially the part where i have multiple town centres and lots of vill and many of them just can't seem to cut wood without supervision.
But still... nostalgia keeps me chughing.
15:15 I'd always really wanted to see something like this: pro archer micro vs. an inexperienced player's micro. With pro vs. pro archer micro it can be more difficult to see the advantage since they're both so good, but this shows exactly why they do it.
When the guy in your unranked “Noob 4v4 Amazon Tunnel” custom lobby does this, you know it’s over.
Imagine two kings being this cruel irl where they send vils to death just to test their army 22:00
it will make more sense if they play as japanese
this is what happens in a military exercise today
19:58 i got the Rickon battle of bastards - game of thrones scene in my head ... this is what he should have done lol
Only watched that episode yesterday and I was thinking the exact same thing. Funny how it'd actually work in IRL if something is THAT good with a bow
Lollll grubby and viper discovering new aoe facts like right clicking militia being better
I had no idea about some of the archer movements. I am 1700.
All this patrol movement blows my mind!
This shows how good you can get without knowing all the micro stuff. It's a strategy game for the most part and that's so cool about it.
I am 1500 and no idea as well on a lot of this
Daut is one of the best players and I doubt he does this. Seems like you can get really far without mastering micro.
the cool thing about aoe2 is that if your decision making is on point you will usually end up in a situation where you don't need to micro perfectly in order to succeed. However, if your micro is on point then you can succeed in situations, where your opponent made slightly better decisions than you.
Its an extremely fascinating dynamic and one of the reasons why I still love aoe2 (and RTA games in general)
i can see why Grubby is confused by left click acting like a deselect, but its not a deselect. It is a select or reselect, but if you select nothing then it unselects what was previously selected. As if it isn't keeping it in memory.
The reason the archer right clicking wasn't working quite as expectedly is because despite the map being all explored, the individual LOS of each unit still matters, and when the right click is outside of the unit range more interesting things can happen. Including some archers moving back (because they lost target) or forget they're attacking a real target (walking straight though) although that latter one could be a misclick.
Remember how GL had the boys contractually obliged to offer coaching, and because they didn't have time they set it at 500€/hr.
Grubby's going to have to sell the farm once the invoice arrives
Grubby can play that with sub money, ez
Units are now actually behaving a lot smarter WHILE IN AGGRESSIVE STANCE.
If you right click with stand ground they will actually all go for the unit you clicked which means you will hard lose against patrol.
It really depends on the scale of the fight.
In feudal, when you only got like 3-4 units, stand ground is massivly better since you can actually focus all your hits on an enemy at a time. It also really helps to snipe spears in a scout/spear fight.
@@CG-eh6oe Or focus down a villager in a mass of villagers, I was so confused when why my scouts would attack 1 villager each instead of all to 1, now that I use stand ground attack they isolate their target like wolves
@@personalejcr thats the best use to stand ground actually, snipe vills with scouts
They DID in fact change the behavior of patrolling and attack moving, and made it considerably worse when T90 complained about how strong archer micro is.
They added a delay to attack move to match the patrol delay so they act the same in combat.
Thank god you pointed this out.
What did they change in patrolling? Because the delay was there from the AOK days
@@BuyOrBye As far as I know, they just changed attack move to be like patrol. Which was a nerf as attack move was better, but as far as I know patrol wasn't touched
@@mrkirby8622 Attack move was never better. This is why nobody used it on pro level. They did (at least) two patches with improvements to attack move, to make it usable in DE.
3:30 oh, I realize it, this should be because of the different behavior between attack stance and stand ground?
or maybe not
One of the most educationel Video. Go on with these Type of Videos!
seems to me the rightclick vs patrol thing was swayed alot by the fact that blue units went in doublefile whereas red units were in a line already
this always happens when you patrol though
Video where Viper doesnt just say "it depends". Great video, learned alot.
I mean the whole video is a breakdown of why the answer for everything is “it depends.”
@@MrJollyBear Yes
They recently made alot of improvements to shift click u it's. Even control shift click and move away which is amazing for scout macro.
back in the day on blood maps patrolling got you kills for upgrades like no other!!
I just love the vipi grubby combo
Please keep us up to date about what happened with atk move/patrol, when you find out more, Viper!
Interesting that even viper didn't know about the changes made. In general tho it's probably best to patrol your unit's, I think one of the things they didn't capture on this was vision of units, if you attack the one that is not in fog of war while the rest are hidden how does the pathing get affected
with the changes in pathing is this video still valid, in regards acceleration of units?
great educational content!!
What a weird and funny start .. whatever viper is going to prove is failing :D :D :D
sweet micro tutorial!
this video is gold
Great content! plz more
wtf so is patrolling not better than right-click?
Lol aegis!
Very cool video. Will use the concepts to train my wife.
Classic rookie mistake - product demo presentations never work the way they are intended 🙂🙂
Plz keep these up
Knowing that patrol is better is one of the most unintuitive things about AoE2. Hope pathfinding in general will one day finally be improved. Melee units, especially knights, seem to have overall gotten even worse than in classic.
however, they cannot fix it "completely" because that would throw the competetive balance out of the window as this game is designed around the bad path finding. Its kind of a dilemma, actually 11
I mean, look at the *perfectly balanced* stats of a knight ... :D
@@IschmarVI they could drop the knights' stats to compensate for them getting more hits in.
Didn't the devs confirm and multiple people test that the perceived archer movement speed was not real?
great vid but needs tags and timestamps
21:00
Does attack move work the same as patrol?
From an attacking point of view, yeah it is supposed to.
If the units reach their destination without attacking, only patrol will cause the units to return to their original location (ie. actually patrolling)
Grubby / Nili bo5 in 1month ?
What is this map or mode?
they are simply playing with infinite resource setting and are using the cheat code "aegis" which makes you build/train/research everything instantly.
is this insta-build and endless ressources a mod? can someone tell me that´s name or where to find?
Insta build (+ research) is a cheat which is in the game since Day 1. Type "aegis" (without quotation marks) into the chat box while having cheats enabled.
Endless resources is a game setting since Definitive Edition.
@@FloosWorld_AoE ty for the fast and easy answer :)
@varvarus