I would not drink the toxin until I have measured it. First, I shall add the toxin to today's dinner (Goose) and then I will serve it to Gringo's step-father. Then I will ask from him an hourly update about his condition and take notes of my own to keep track of the toxin's effects. Should the parameters be deemed acceptable, I shall sign a legal document where I agree to drink the toxin tomorrow afternoon, thus proving beyond reasonable doubt that I intent to drink the toxin. At least, that is how I would solve it, if not because I am the billionaire asking people to do this because I want to experiment my toxin on humans.
I love the interactions between FC and Bowl. They're genuine friends who will shit on each other freely but defend each other when a 3rd party joins. I am envious of these two lads.
Being part of this friend group would just bring 20 mental dilemmas daily, and to be completely honest that is something I did not think was conceivable, it looks like tons of fun
I love it! Used to do something similar with a few close friends from secondary school, not too dissimilar to what they do on this channel, light hearted name calling included, minus throwing coffee at each other.
Not gonna lie, Gringo really stepped it up in this conversation and actually had some really good points. Good for him. That being said, y'all missed a pretty obvious way to secure the intent to drink the potion, and make a heck of a lot more money: the Billionaires claim that this potion will cause "no damage" to you, is unequivocally false. It may be true from a physical perspective, but from a legal perspective there are way to many different kinds of "damage" that you could sue this guy for. For instance, extreme pain, even without physical damage, can lead to massive mental damages. Like that one plant that makes you want to game end yourself if you touch it. In order to offset this, the potion would either need to have a massive payoff at the end, to make the experience worth it for your brain, or erase your memory of the pain. The first scenario would moat likely make the substance addictive. As massive mental payouts are the exact reason people take addictive drugs that put a massive strain on their body. The second, could easily be construed as physical damage to the brain, as the potion most likely would have destroyed the neurons containing the memory. All you need to get him to do is sign a notarized statement that "no damages" will come to you from drinking this potion. If he does it, you can trust that drinking the potion is worth your while. If not, he is lying about the potion, and he is hiding something that makes the million dollars worth less to him than putting you through that pain. You should question what that is in that case, because it likely means the million dollars should be worth less to you as well. But if he signs, that seals his fate. Because even if he is being honest, you have left your contract vague enough to pursue him legally after drinking the potion. And in this case, you should drink the potion, because the monetary gains you receive from the lawsuit for breach of contract and damages could end up being worth more than the original million he gave you.
Unfortunately, this probably isn’t possible in real life, as rich people have lawyers. But the puzzle doesn’t specify, so I guess this would be the best course of action if possible! Always check the contract!
@@joaquincortescasas8114 That's not true. Right in the beginning of the video the billionaire claims it will not kill you OR have any lasting effects. Even if that billionaire was 100 percent honest in that regard, and magically the potion doesn't cause any lasting harms, mental or physical (which I contest would be impossible irl), the contract still secures my intent to drink it on the off chance he is lying. Because I not only will intend to drink the potion at midnight if he signs the contract, I WILL drink the potion on the chance he has no magical mcguffin preventing lasting effects, be they metal damage, physical damage, or any other kind of damages, I have those covered. This method not only potentially makes me more money, but secures my intent.
“Say hello to the new family friendly Faux Cares!” Oh ok, seems neato, wonder what the video is gonna be about *Fucking Goddamn Fucker* _wheezing intensifies_
For the record, profanity is still allowed on my videos... I just gotta tone it down. Apparently my username constantly popping is "too much". Either I kept the Judge's username accurate or mine. Couldn't be both.
Now we all know that Santa Claus is a sadist immortal billionaire who sends gifts to everyone he likes and laughs at those who don't get a gift because he doesn't like them.
An interesting part of puzzles and riddles few people realize, is that you can have more than one solution. Anyone who came up with a solution gets the money. Em says she intends to drink the poison because she likes pain, ergo she intends to drink it even without the money. Bowl would get the money as he wants(intends) to drink the poison to prove he intends to drink the poison, leading to a circular argument where disproving his intent, would then prove his intent because it needed DISproving.
Bro these debates always got me thinking about shit for 5 hours afterwards. Gotta say I'm with you on the "no intent without initiative" boat. Though I'm also with Goblin "on the mix that shit with whiskey" train. Also your name changing every few minutes had me chuckling.
Mmm but consider this. When I play poker, I resolve to take an action on a condition (usually the completion of a good hand) regardless of the circumstances when that condition is met. For example I have a king of hearts and a jack of hearts, I say to myself “I will go all in if there is a queen jack and ace”. There is a queen jack and ace but they are spades, and another player is playing like they have a flush, or god forbid a royal flush. I will still go all in, I do not break promises to myself, even if there is a good chance it will just hurt me. Now sometimes, very rarely, I chicken out, but even then I fully intend to go all in the whole time. Had the man read my mind I believe he would give me the money.
Wait, so are we operating under the assumption that the billionaire can automatically know what our intention is, or are we burdened with proving it to them? If it's the latter, then don't go for it. The whole thing is a sadistic trap. To get the money, you must prove that, at that specific moment, that you intend to drink the poison later. That's literally impossible to do without this billionaire being some form of supernatural higher being with the power to know your intentions in a way that even you yourself cannot. Right out of the gate, the only way to prove that you would ever consider doing it at any point is to actually do it, so there's already no way of getting the money without taking a swig. One would assume that means you should just drink it to guarantee the payment, but even downing it when the time comes doesn't actually do anything to prove that you originally intended to go through with it. As an example, you could initially lie, fully intending to "change your mind" before getting nervous and actually changing your mind when you start to fear that you could lose the prize because of some loophole you just can't find. You end up drinking it, but because you can't prove that was what you initially meant to do (and in this scenario it actually wasn't), you get nothing. The intent detail isn't there so you can use it get out of drinking the poison, it's there so billionaire can get out of paying those who are dumb enough to agree to the deal. For the billionaire, the worst case scenario is that nothing happens, but the best case scenario is that they get to watch as some idiot poisons themselves for no reason. If they already know your intentions, then you can get the money but you have to drink it, barring some outside interference that you can't be aware of beforehand. The fact that you're made aware of the opportunity to change your mind from the get-go actually renders it useless because you have to make your decision with that detail in mind. Assuming nothing out of your control happens between your decision and the time you'd be drinking it, you have to be fully committed to doing it, regardless of whether you get the money or not. Like they said, the trick to getting the money is to not be doing it for the money in the first place.
With all due respect to anyone that replies to me, I'm sure you are making very good points, but I wasn't commenting to address my entire opinion on the video. Just some things I agreed with and found funny.
I told my mom about this puzzle and she came with a genius solution: You can intend to take the toxin and get the money. Then you use part of the money to somehow lessen or erase the pain (like a sedative knocking you unconcious) Your intention is real and it was never stated you weren't allowed to use the money yet. Afterwards you wake up without ever feeling any pain...🤯🤯🤯
I think that I would drink the potion even after getting the money, because it might be a valuable experience. I've heard that cancer survivors feel this extacy when the get to live a normal life again, because they feel grateful for what they have now that they've almost lost it. Also I like to think of myself as a man of my word, and being known as 'the guy who could have not drunk the potion but did so anyway' is a good reputation to have that may benefit me in the future.
So, even if it's not the main focus, you're already thinking of long-term social benefits to drinking it? 🤔 I think the potion is just hot sauce tho (? You _can_ (somewhat) take this to real life.
I think I'd drink the potion because I'd be suspicious of the millionaire taking back my money if I don't. He says he won't but I am paranoid, so I'll drink. By that logic I wouldn't believe he'd actually give me money either, but by the point to drink I already have it, so I'm committed.
If the toxin is 100% survivable with no long-term consequences (this includes mental strain and whatnot) then this would be an extremely beneficial experience because it would show you what *true* pain is, and thus would make anything else pale in comparison, right? At worst it'd give you a superiority complex since you lived through the worst pain imaginable and everyone else didn't, that is if we take the billionaire's words for granted.
Gringo makes a lot of really good points, but the true winner of this is Bowl. Hear me out: Bowl’s argument is that if he’d get two he’d not only make more money, but prove his intent by drinking the first beforehand, and going a bit farther by buying a second if he wasn’t freely given the second just to prove the point. He’d then drink it just to make sure FC and the gang know he’s superior to them. His Chaotic Neutral energy would allow him to win no matter what. He’s unpredictable, and so it’s safe to assume that he’d absolutely do something that stupid.
Everyone strategizes on whether it's possible to intent to drink the potion while knowing they won't drink it in the end, meanwhile Em is just "fuck it imma drink this" Exactly what I would try to do. Don't think, just accept you're gonna drink it. Might as well actually drink it in order to preserve the timeline.
This puzzle actually isn't about "intention" at all. This is a logical paradox, similar in flavor to Cantor's diagonalization argument or the Halting Problem. Suppose I follow this plan: if I get the million dollars, I will not drink the poison, and if do not get the million dollars, I will drink the poison. Will I get the million dollars or not? If the billionaire gives me the million dollars, then they know I do not intend to drink the poison according to my strategy, which is a contradiction. If the billionaire does not give the million dollars, then they know I intend to drink the poison, which is also a contradiction. As such, the billionaire cannot possibly exist, because I can hinge my intention on whether I get the million dollars.
No it isn't. Because you do not intend on drinking the toxin by midnight, you only intend on fooling him. Your real intention of drinking the poison would come tomorrow morning when you didn't get the money, but that wouldn't suffice, since you should have had the intention to drink it by midnight
The billionaire either wants you to drink or wants to keep their money. This isn't a philosophical or analytical problem, it's a game theory problem. They have whatever interests, but you cannot know them given the parameters of the problem. There may be fair assumptions, and one such assumption is that they want to keep their money. If they want to keep their money and you present this reasoning, they will tell you at 12am that you will get the money, thus determining your intent at that moment to be *not to drink* the toxin. At 12:01am however they will update you with the information that you did not actually successfully intended at midnight to drink, and thus you will be out of luck, even if you maintain your reasoning and thus decide to drink it again. Their problem only cares about the moment that has passed. Assuming you keep your word, they may even fulfill the other presumable objective, actually getting you to drink (though if that was their primary goal it would be fair to argue they would simply offer you the money without strings attached). My point is that your conditional resolve will be weaponized against you by a billionaire because they are self interested and have conflicting interests. At least those are my axioms.
@@Petitmoi74 funny thing is if you say what's heavier 1 pound of feathers or 1 pound of gold, the answer is a pound of feathers is heavier, because avardupois pounds are heavier than troy pounds which are used for gold
FC and Gringo: Trying to have an actual philosophical argument about the nature of intent and reason Goblin Tyrant and Bowl: Gimme that *p a i n j u i c e*
I started crying with laughter when it got the Bowl’s argument, god I love this channel. Really good argument btw, we got to see members new and old, learned some more definitions and it’s nice to see Gringo improving his arguments. Makes sense since he’s the apprentice of Phoenix in the game. Good video 👍
I think the fundamental issue is that the term "intent" is undefined, and can only be judged in hindsight or with information that provides additional context. You COULD, however, take steps at/before midnight to ensure that all through tomorrow you'd have no choice BUT to take the toxin, such as constructing a device that will forcibly administer the toxin come the appointed time, and having it active and operational by midnight. I would be taking the initiative needed to solidify intent in the now in such a manner that the results would not occur until tomorrow. Alternatively of course, you could use Em or Bowl's strategy of having additional motivations to earnestly take the toxin besides the money, but that still falls into the loop of how you can define intent before action. Personally however, I would not get the money, because I do not trust omniscient billionaires, and would never be willing to take the toxin even in the first place, even if it was just an ordinary glass of water instead.
But building the machine could indicate intention to drink the toxin or intention of indicating intention of drinking the toxin. Either way, an intention exists before the initiative , but it’s unknowable what it is before any kind of hindsight. I think initiative is only a way to give evidence to yourself of what your intentions are, and that evidence would imply something that may not be true. For example, freeing up the day and buying pain medication before the time you have to drink the toxin could imply you have the intention to drink the toxin, or it could imply you have the intention of convincing yourself you have the intention to drink the toxin. Besides that, i think intention is just what we call the external triggers for our actions in hindsight to trick ourselves into the idea that we have free will, and aren’t just flesh machines responding to the multitude of factors in our environment.
I thought the same thing about being forced to take the toxin by an external means (I personnally thought about paying someone to force-feed me the thing come the right time, but same idea) But then I wondered, would I intend to drink the potion at midnight ? Or would I just expect to drink it ? There seems to be some kind of distinction. Can you intend to do something when you have no choice in the matter ?
“Intend to drink the stuff before or by tomorrow afternoon, however drinking is unnecessary” is the operative mind game of this puzzle. There is nowhere within the mind game that the billionaire does not have some psycho-ESP bullshit to simply tell if your intention is there, however I believe that regardless of this information there is no way to “intend” to drink this potion (or at least, there is no way to reasonably expect someone to intend to do this); allow me to explain why. Intention (or to intend) is defined as “having an objective / plan”. From a purely analytic standpoint, arbitrarily making a plan can be argued as an intention. From a philosophical standpoint, it can be argued that without determination and initiative, an intention cannot exist as there is no proof the action was ever internally humored in the first place. There has to be a PERSONAL BELIEF that the action is DESIRED with absolute certainty with a full grasp on the consequences. If we purely argue from the analytical position, then this problem is moot as you have already decided and planned ahead that the action would be taken, regardless of your conviction. However, from the philosophical standpoint, in which conviction is, essentially, the FOUNDATION of your intention, it gets a little more complicated. As soon as you are offered this problem, you need to undeniably be convicted to drink that potion or else you will not get the money. However, your conviction may falter when you are offered the idea that drinking the vial is unnecessary and the conviction is all that matters. In your head, you will say “I will drink the potion” but I don’t think any human will realistically say that unless they TRULY planned to go through with it knowing FULL WELL that even if they don’t they can still get the money. I’ll try explaining this more clearly just in case; the pure concept of drinking the vial is a way to sway your determination. If you acknowledge that drinking the vial is unnecessary, you will never have the intention of drinking the vial in the first place, your intention will be wanting to drink the vial until you have the money. The differentiation there being your conviction is towards the MONEY and not the act of drinking the VIAL. Unless you, personally, are convicted and believe that you have to, and most uncertainly will drink the vial, without any concept of the prize for doing so, you will not win the prize. The act of drinking the vial is a separate intention from getting the money, and the concept of not needed to drink the vial is, in fact, a paradoxical way of getting your convictions to falter. You have to either only want to drink the vial, or want both to drink the vial and to get the money. Any other conviction leaves this as impossible to circumnavigate, as I’m sure there are few humans who truly want to injure themselves in this way. Hopefully I explained this well. TLDR; wanting to drink the thing is different from wanting the money.
You could still trick the system. Your intention has reasons, right? If the reason is money, then yes, you lose anyway. But what if the reason is... spite? You set this kind of intention - 'I will drink the poison if I DON'T get the money just to mess with the billionaire'. You think this through - if you don't get the money, then your intention was true all along, you drink the poison and the billionaire is paradoxed. He failed. But he would still do that because he is smug. He believes the task is impossible for you. And he is wrong! You drink the poison not for the money, but for pure outplay, jokes on him! So when you actually get the money, it comes as a surprise to you. And when you do, you can cancel out your decision and don't drink. The reason? You already outplayed him, and drinking would be a final nail in his obligation's coffin, an even bigger outplay!
In a way this means Gringo is right Intentions can change, you are forced to intend to drink the toxin to get the money, and after you get the money (which is already a sign that you intended to drtink the toxin) you should drink the toxin, but if the moment you get the money you change your mind? This is not planned, you intended to drink the toxin before the huge amount of money in your possession made you reasonate with your mind, that could be a natural outcome Or what if external causes may interfere with you drinking the toxin? You still intend to drink the toxin, but maybe someone else (possibly a friend) may destroy the vial before drinking it, tho you wouldn't get the money if you planned something to interfere with you drinking the toxin
Time is an important factor. Some days I feel like I was unproductive all day and I'll intend to go to the gym the next. After waking up, I might just not feel like it but my intention to go at 9pm still existed. All they need is to feel ready to drink the poison at midnight and expect that determination to hold up in the afternoon.
You could have intention to drink the poison for more than one reason, you may want the money, but you could also have a strong moral compass. For example, Captain America would totally drink that poison, because once he got the money, or even just gave his word that he would drink that poison, then he would because that's his word. JoCat's alignment video explained Lawful Neutral in a similar way. "Your going to keep your promise because it IS a promise and therefor you're going to keep it."
I agree on that point, which is also why I believe the metaphor with wanting to swim tomorrow is bad. In this case, we assume that the person who wants to go swimming didn't watch the weather, so doesn't know that it will rain tomorrow - OR did watch the weather and it turned out to be wrong. In any case, that person had incomplete information. Their intent was based on what they knew at the time of the planning. The intent changed because of new information. The problem in this case is that we have all the information from the get-go, including the knowledge that drinking the toxin after receiving the money is unecessary. The intent cannot be pure, nor change, because we already know all the variable at the beginning. So, in my point of view anyways, like you said, either you focus on the money with the knowledge that you don't actually need to drink anything - then you don't get the money; either you (for whatever weird reason...) decide to drink the poison (to be spiteful, for the experience, whatever...) and thus you get the money. When you get (or don't get) the money, you already have made up your mind, even if you are not conscious of it. EDIT : The part with wiping memory actually support my theory. With her memory wiped, she doesn't have complete information anymore, just information that she believes to be complete. Thus, her intent to drink is based on that and she gets the money. Once she does get the money, information becomes complete, and back to case one - to not really since she already has the money.
I was literally losing my shit over Bowl's first comments, this man's humor is getting to levels of legendarily that shouldn't be possible at this point. Also saying "Faux Cares" is just such a good way of getting away around RUclips's censorship laws. I had to like the video
Every FC name 0:01 FC 0:10 Faux Cares 3:20 French Cakes 9:19 Fun Capes 11:07 Forklift Certified 11:29 Font Chier 12:59 Cuck Fares 17:11 Faux Cares (again) 18:45 Fwuww Cawes 19:27 Forni Cator 19:51 French Cuisine 20:03 Vulgar Expression of Indifference 23:34 Five Continents 23:50 Faux Cares (at last)
I'd say in order to receive the money, you have one of two ways of obtaining it. 1) The billionaire is "eccentric" because he is omniscient to the point he can read your intentions due to some divine insights or 2) Trust. The billionaire would need to have a sufficient amount of trust in your intentions in order to agree to the payout. The former is - suprisingly - trickier, as it requires a more concrete resolve of intent to be manifested into your thoughts and to be resolute enough to prove it to the billionaire who has the deepest form of insight. The latter is just what people do on the day-to-day.
There is no need to debate about this. Milliner know your intention. We can only debate how to make a perfect intention of drinking without excluding an option of not drinking.
As someone with adhd, where I find myself in the incredibly common situation of intending to do something, just for me to get easily distracted and completely forget to do it, This whole conversation is incredibly funny and thought provoking for me. If I were in the situation where, at precisely midnight, I must intend to drink the toxin tomorrow afternoon, I don't think I'd even get the money in the first place. Say the billionaire tells me all this at around five pm. I may intend to intend to, at midnight, intend to drink the toxin tomorrow afternoon, but by that time, I would have completely forgotten to do the intending necessary to receive the money in the first place. There's too many degrees of separation, and I would need an external reminder to force me to do any intending at all. Even then, the forcing to do the intending may put me off intending for later, and by that point, its past midnight and I will no longer receive the money. I may be able to intend at the time the billionaire tells me to, but I would not be able to do the actual necessary intending needed. The act of drinking the toxin, nor the money reward have any sway in these factors, I'm just like this all the time
Watching this mental dilemma debate paired with FC’s name changing every so often and all the little details added to the animations such as when Gringo face planted on the table really shows these videos are worth every second of watching! Amazing job as always.
I would drink it out of pure pride and spite. “How dare you doubt my abilities? My courage? My decisions? I know you will chicken out. Your a billionaire sadist. I don’t care. It’s no longer about you. It’s about me,” or something like that.
Lesson of the day? Bowl, Em, and goblin would play 99 bottles of beer on the wall with deadly toxins just to compare the taste, FC and bowl literally have an echo chamber just for them, and the human mind has the astonishing ability to confuse itself over what it wants to do.
I just love when people are trying to include new elements in set-in-stone logical puzzles, heh. "But what if I smack the billionaire with a stick?" "What if I gulp just a little?" "Can I erase my memory for a day?" It's just like with those puzzles with two dudes, who always lie or tell only truth. And you answer with shooting 'em.
I believe you found a way to overthink a problem to the point where basic human experience and intuition is deemed unfounded at best. It’s like thinking about walking; everyone* knows how to walk, but the moment you think about it you start looking like something is physically wrong with your stride.
Or when you spell/speak one specific word enough times that you start questioning if that's _really_ they way it's spelt/spoken, & then after fact-checking, you start questioning why the fuck it's like that in the first place.
You are now breathing manually. It's a matter of your subconscious typically taking responsibility for performing an action and your conscious being handed the reigns and disrupting the very flow and lack of complications that makes those trivial tasks trivial in the first place
Gringo seemed to sway back and forth a bit, but he made some really pithy points along the way. I'm not sure I concur with his logic of "if you drink the toxin you fail", but it was a VERY interesting avenue to explore. I also feel a lot of time was spent tackling the puzzle in bad faith, as it's a thought experiment of sorts. Trying to game the scenario is counter to the discussion, but half the time the relevancy of extending the scenario had proven merit, so I can't critique that too much.
I feel like the antidote solution was kinda undermined there; you have no reason not to look for an antidote, and if you find one, you have no reason not to drink the potion either, which means your intent to drink it cannot be compromised by the consequences of it. Now obviously, if there is no antidote, you're screwed and you will have to take it. But I would definitely try that first if I get in this situation.
Another solution ; if being hit in the head with a brick to not have memories of the puzzle anymore is a possibility, I feel like the second person that hits you would just have to explain the puzzle to you again, but this time just say "you have until midnight to decide if you drink this potion or not. If you drink it, you win a million dollars". In this case, the puzzle is much simpler and you still follow the original rules.
video should just be renamed to Gringo goes insane for 24 minutes. What an interesting cast of characters glad you all can start the new year right with some chaos.👍 also love it how FC's names just change throughout the vid.
Knew of your existence thanks to your christmas video, and i gotta admire the passion and detailed editing that goes on here, hope that you and your loved ones are having a nice start of the year :D
I knew of his because someone sent me the video about Latinx (I dunno why but it’s just autocorrected it so that it’s a pronoun, oh dear.) in a discord server. Thanks for your 18 minute cancer of a video, FBI.
This question doesn't take into account masochism and I feel personally attacked. It also doesn't account for being a dumbass who'll eat anything. So I feel double attacked.
The issue here is the timeline, I can intend to drink the toxin before midnight, but once I realize I can get the money without actually drinking it, the intent dissolves away. If the realization happens before midnight, I fail, but if it happens on or after, I succeed. In other words, I agree with Em.
I am not finished with the video, but my take is that I would want to sign a contract the night before to provide premeditation and then drink it the day after to show the full intention. I believe it is still necessary to drink it because it could be argued that you did not actually intend to drink the toxin, but to misguide the patron and receive one million dollars. If you do change your mind the next day about the toxin, you better pray some third-party person/event prevents you from drinking the toxin. You would still be able to show a prior indication about your intention to drink it and that you were actively prevented from taking the final step. This may not actually be a good piece of evidence to show your intentions, but I'm trying to think about how to argue your intentions in a court of law.
Oh! Well if you need a third party event, that’s surprisingly simple. Leave the potion open, and dangerously close to the edge of a table. Sometime between midnight and the next afternoon, you’re bound to (unfortunately) accidentally knock it over, preventing you from consuming it. Edit: Unless it perfectly bottle flips when it lands, in which case holy shit
@@directrix777TrixieKagami I don't think that works because you were still involved in the act, so it could be argued that it was purposeful. Also you actively chose to put it in a precarious position. Never mind the fact that we also don't know when we receive the toxin.
@@directrix777TrixieKagami you: (goes out of your way to make this vial empty itself.) God: *_Okay, but what does it taste like?_* (Vial lands perfectly with every drop still inside)
This one gets you thinking in all types of angles, you may never know what may happen. If anything, I’d ask the billionaire to drink with me as a cheers for our new found association, maybe switch his drink in case his was a fake one, then go about my merry way.
I'm only six minutes in, but I can't stand everyone missing the point. The assumption should be that the billionaire has perfect knowledge and knows your true intentions. If you plan to change your mind after getting the money, then your intention was false to begin with, and you won't get the money. The only ways to get the money without drinking the poison are to a: chicken out at the last second, or b: have intervening circumstances prevent you from drinking the poison through no plan of your own.
I think Gringo had the most solid solution half way through the video… then it just kept going XD Everyone had different approaches: - Em would drink it because of another reason - Pixie would get an antidote, which would be useless unless she INTENDED to drink it - Bowl would drink it because why the hell not? - FC and Harry would use a contract that overcomes the loophole - Gringo figured out how the loophole works and therefore could bypass it completely Goblin and Seraphina didn’t really have a solve so I can’t comment. Highly entertaining stuff though :)
That was a very cool subject honestly. This has helped me a bit, as someone that is considered gifted, my biggest hurdle was always that I didn’t want to go all out, while still wanting the results. That is mostly because I did not want to take a necessary detour to get what I want. It also doesn’t help that I have been ingrained with the thought that I can probably do a come back later. This has helped me a lot with understanding my problem.
This is circular reasoning; Gringo supposes that he already has the money; but if he doesn't actually plan to drink it once he gets the money, then he does not have the intention and therefore will not have the money. One could imagine that the billionaire already knows that Gringo fully intends to run away with the money and thus won't give it to him.
Oh here's an idea. I would have drunk the poison anyway, i clearly wanted to. But i ask my friend to stop me when im about to after midnight comes around. Therefore, i try to drink the poison but my friend stops me and destroys the vial, therefore i can no longer drink it. I had intention and action, but something prevented me from achieving it
This is actually a valuable solution - you make a competition between yourself and one or more other people, where you attempt to drink the toxin and they attempt to stop you. You can trust that they might be able to save you, and all you have to do is try your hardest to drink it anyway - since it's not your own lack of intent that stops you, you will still get the money
I think you should tell your friend that if they want, they can stop you. That removes the agency away from you because it's possible your intention was to be stopped but when you give that agency and choice to your friend, and you go to commit to the action, you may want him to stop you but your intention is still drinking it, therefore you win.
@@gummigamer4614 unnecessary, i would tell them after midnight, therefore my intentions have no bearing. Besides, my fight to not be stopped would be high enough indication my intentions not wavering. Potentially, ill ask a group of friends, so as not to have any chance at succeeding
But you would know before midnight that you would ask your friend to stop you after midnight. Therefore you no longer intend to drink the poison because you intend to stop halfway due to an obstruction of your making
Mmmm (in case you’re still reading) I think that intention derives from action and not the other way around, in this case, I believe that intention is based on a hypothetical action that one executes when confronted with a possibility. Intention should be the immovable inclination that one possesses to execute a certain action physically (instead of metaphysically) when presented with other possibilities and while the possibility to physically execute the hypothetical exists. I also think that intention might be some sort of spectrum since people often only intend things to a certain extent. Therefore I believe that to obtain the money fairly you have to drink it regardless of whether you receive the money or don’t, because some intentions can be overridden by others (such as receiving a million dollars) and if the possibility to drink the toxin still exists and you decide to not do it because you have received the million dollars then your intention never really existed because it wasn’t immovable while it was still possible to execute as a physical/real action. On the other hand I think intentions can be contained within other intentions (getting the money contains drinking the toxin) but even if you acquire the reward beforehand (underlying intention) you’d still have to drink the toxin since in that case money and drinking the toxin exist complimentarily and one isn’t there without the other (in contrast to only wanting the money which is when you don’t drink the toxin after you acquire the money). I think my definition also makes it a bit of a trick question in this case since the billionaire (who can supposedly tell without mistake if you’ll do it or not) will only judge as truthful those who drink the toxin even after their intentions are confirmed, which means that he can foresee some sort of singular and absolute future where they drink the toxin regardless of whether they have the money or not and essentially is a prick who will reward those who submit to him by providing an illusion of choice
Gringo finally having a standout good argument with that commitment bit. Well done, mate. Also the whole group admitting they’ve intended to and planned out violent murder is very on brand. Which of them wants to eat their victims, I wonder?
@@frenchbaguetteintelligence Of course one of you lot has the Cravings. 'Ethics of Cannibalism and the desire of the group to partake thereof' episode when? :p
I do love how every time I watch these there comes a point where I have to sit up in my chair and actually use my brain instead of just laughing through the video.
It may almost be impossible to determine one's intent in the situation the puzzle puts one in. Although in the world of law, conspiracy can be charged even without the execution of the crime as long as steps are taken, but unfortunately in this case there is no concrete definition that can be applied to this situation. You can intend to do an action but fail to do it due it when you change your mind part way just as said by Gringo in regards to learning a language, but quitting after trying due to finding the task daunting can be seen by yourself as an attempt that had failed which is a perspective that sees intent, but to someone on the outside it can be seen as a person not trying enough to overcome the challenge which is a perspective that doesn't see true intent. Therefore, the question of intent cannot be properly addressed unless both parties can agree on what a true sign of intent can be, but even then, even if a proper show of intent is shown, if you would change your mind after receiving the money then the intent would be gone. The end result of receiving the money and not drinking the toxin is an unattainable option that is paradoxical in nature. Even with both parties agreeing on a definition of intent for the situation, it would still be difficult to reach a proper outcome where money is received without a shadow of a doubt that the intention is present. TL:DR : It's a paradox regardless of the choice taken
an interesting point to bring up that i'm shocked Gringo didn't: some people intend to do something, but *forget* between the time they intend to and actually do it. If i get a message from someone while i'm busy, i *intend* to message them back, but if i forget to, *i don't do it*. my intention to do so hasn't changed, if i had remembered, i would have done it, but because it had slipped my mind in the meantime, it wouldn't get done. if at midnight tonight, i intend to drink the toxin, but forget in the morning (no memory erasing rocks involved here, just a simple bad memory), would i get the money? i say this because i personally have a dogshit memory, to a legitimately worrying degree but right now that doesn't matter. what does matter is that it's not outside the realm of possibility for me to intend to drink the toxin by midnight, go to sleep and completely forget the deal, wake up to the notification that i'm a million dollars richer and go "oh right, that was this afternoon, guess i don't have to do it anymore". even if my reasoning for drinking the toxin is just to get the million dollars (which has some merit to just disqualify me outright since i know of the loophole), if i really do think "fuck it, might as well just do it and get the money" at midnight, but when the time comes just completely not realize it, would i get the money?
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
I would not drink the toxin until I have measured it. First, I shall add the toxin to today's dinner (Goose) and then I will serve it to Gringo's step-father. Then I will ask from him an hourly update about his condition and take notes of my own to keep track of the toxin's effects. Should the parameters be deemed acceptable, I shall sign a legal document where I agree to drink the toxin tomorrow afternoon, thus proving beyond reasonable doubt that I intent to drink the toxin. At least, that is how I would solve it, if not because I am the billionaire asking people to do this because I want to experiment my toxin on humans.
*Goose*
Harry confirmed just as evil as the real host of Squid Game
Harry is what you get when everything the mad scientist says is hilarious.
Why Gringo's step-father tho? 0.o
I wonder how you'll get Gringo's step-father to drink it xD
Lmao immediately naming the judge "fucking goddamn fucker" after changing FC to Faux Cares was a plot twist I wasn't expecting
It's a power move, is what it is. He knows what he's doing.
laughed so hard i started sobbing honestly
that caught me offguard
"How would he know my intentions?"
"He is Santa Claus"
He's the Easter Old man. Santa is just the incorrect and peasant way to mention him.
**takes a gun**
*You forgotten me 10 years ago, fat man, you never gave me my bike
@@pablojn4826 "El viejo pascuero"
I love the interactions between FC and Bowl. They're genuine friends who will shit on each other freely but defend each other when a 3rd party joins. I am envious of these two lads.
You summed it up perfectly
They’re the very epitome of the French and British rivalry in a modern setting.
British and French people in a nutshell.
thats also how phoenix and miles act so it fits
"F-bombs will not be a part of the show anymore"
*Scene transition*
"Fucking Goddamn Fucker"
Absolutely incredible
Seeing FC’s name get changed after every few minutes is absolute gold.
"Vulgar expression of indifference"
Fuck Cares, but it's 10th century
Forklift certified is my personal favourite
Five continents
French Cakes
Fun Capes
Being part of this friend group would just bring 20 mental dilemmas daily, and to be completely honest that is something I did not think was conceivable, it looks like tons of fun
Honestly it looks like a great place to train the mind and arguing skill
@@omaroma6081 defo
I love it! Used to do something similar with a few close friends from secondary school, not too dissimilar to what they do on this channel, light hearted name calling included, minus throwing coffee at each other.
I'd bring a whole new perspective to the conversation ; would be much fun!
Honestly I would love to have friends like this, to debate random shit at any time
Not gonna lie, Gringo really stepped it up in this conversation and actually had some really good points. Good for him.
That being said, y'all missed a pretty obvious way to secure the intent to drink the potion, and make a heck of a lot more money: the Billionaires claim that this potion will cause "no damage" to you, is unequivocally false.
It may be true from a physical perspective, but from a legal perspective there are way to many different kinds of "damage" that you could sue this guy for.
For instance, extreme pain, even without physical damage, can lead to massive mental damages. Like that one plant that makes you want to game end yourself if you touch it.
In order to offset this, the potion would either need to have a massive payoff at the end, to make the experience worth it for your brain, or erase your memory of the pain.
The first scenario would moat likely make the substance addictive. As massive mental payouts are the exact reason people take addictive drugs that put a massive strain on their body.
The second, could easily be construed as physical damage to the brain, as the potion most likely would have destroyed the neurons containing the memory.
All you need to get him to do is sign a notarized statement that "no damages" will come to you from drinking this potion. If he does it, you can trust that drinking the potion is worth your while.
If not, he is lying about the potion, and he is hiding something that makes the million dollars worth less to him than putting you through that pain. You should question what that is in that case, because it likely means the million dollars should be worth less to you as well.
But if he signs, that seals his fate. Because even if he is being honest, you have left your contract vague enough to pursue him legally after drinking the potion. And in this case, you should drink the potion, because the monetary gains you receive from the lawsuit for breach of contract and damages could end up being worth more than the original million he gave you.
genius. As they say no pain no gain
it seems being in this group is honing his skills :p
Unfortunately, this probably isn’t possible in real life, as rich people have lawyers. But the puzzle doesn’t specify, so I guess this would be the best course of action if possible! Always check the contract!
the puzzle never said it wont damage you, it only said it wont kill you
@@joaquincortescasas8114 That's not true. Right in the beginning of the video the billionaire claims it will not kill you OR have any lasting effects.
Even if that billionaire was 100 percent honest in that regard, and magically the potion doesn't cause any lasting harms, mental or physical (which I contest would be impossible irl), the contract still secures my intent to drink it on the off chance he is lying.
Because I not only will intend to drink the potion at midnight if he signs the contract, I WILL drink the potion on the chance he has no magical mcguffin preventing lasting effects, be they metal damage, physical damage, or any other kind of damages, I have those covered.
This method not only potentially makes me more money, but secures my intent.
Capcom when they feature grizzly manslaughter: 😃
Capcom when RUclipsr says no-no word: 😐
Yeah man, gotta watch out for those bears. Some mauling scenes can be pretty grisly.
That's how mafia works
A lot of times they show people beat to death with blunt objects. And nearly show tits like half the time. And smoke. And say hell
“Say hello to the new family friendly Faux Cares!”
Oh ok, seems neato, wonder what the video is gonna be about
*Fucking Goddamn Fucker*
_wheezing intensifies_
I shall never be tamed fully.
I love how you removed the f word in fc but immediately put 2 of them in the next dialogue box
It’s a political statement.
Yes, I immediately burst out laughing when I saw that!
@@frenchbaguetteintelligence i laughed after that
"Fucking Goddamn Fucker"
@@noticeme6412 consider yourself noticed
20:25 "By hook or by crook, I shall have that liver."
"That's illegal!"
Oh my god I wheezed so much.
For the record, profanity is still allowed on my videos... I just gotta tone it down. Apparently my username constantly popping is "too much". Either I kept the Judge's username accurate or mine. Couldn't be both.
LOL but we still love you FC ♥️
Gosh dang it
Why do corporations have to ruin everything >:(
*sees the judge's name*
Oh ok.
RIP…
On the bright side, it was really funny seeing your alternate names while you were talking.
what about neither?
Have they never heard of the Phoenix Wrong memes?
we need harry to bring back his ethically questionable methods to unfaux this youtube situation
I like how everyone wants to know how good it tastes and Mr. E is like "HOLY SHIT, IT DIDNT SAW GODDAMNIT HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO REPEAT MYSELF!"
*Say
Bowl:”You underestimate my stupidity”
Also Bowl:”My genius…frightens me”
Me watching this:Ah yes, balance…as all things should be…
Now we all know that Santa Claus is a sadist immortal billionaire who sends gifts to everyone he likes and laughs at those who don't get a gift because he doesn't like them.
Unironically one of my fav channels on the platform.
An interesting part of puzzles and riddles few people realize, is that you can have more than one solution. Anyone who came up with a solution gets the money. Em says she intends to drink the poison because she likes pain, ergo she intends to drink it even without the money. Bowl would get the money as he wants(intends) to drink the poison to prove he intends to drink the poison, leading to a circular argument where disproving his intent, would then prove his intent because it needed DISproving.
I like Pixie, she makes good points and her persona seems calming.
15:18
I like how Gringo hit the desk so hard he pixelized himself.
In any case: Legitimately interesting and incredibly entertaining. Good stuff lol
Bro these debates always got me thinking about shit for 5 hours afterwards. Gotta say I'm with you on the "no intent without initiative" boat.
Though I'm also with Goblin "on the mix that shit with whiskey" train.
Also your name changing every few minutes had me chuckling.
Mmm but consider this. When I play poker, I resolve to take an action on a condition (usually the completion of a good hand) regardless of the circumstances when that condition is met. For example I have a king of hearts and a jack of hearts, I say to myself “I will go all in if there is a queen jack and ace”. There is a queen jack and ace but they are spades, and another player is playing like they have a flush, or god forbid a royal flush. I will still go all in, I do not break promises to myself, even if there is a good chance it will just hurt me. Now sometimes, very rarely, I chicken out, but even then I fully intend to go all in the whole time. Had the man read my mind I believe he would give me the money.
Wait, so are we operating under the assumption that the billionaire can automatically know what our intention is, or are we burdened with proving it to them?
If it's the latter, then don't go for it. The whole thing is a sadistic trap. To get the money, you must prove that, at that specific moment, that you intend to drink the poison later. That's literally impossible to do without this billionaire being some form of supernatural higher being with the power to know your intentions in a way that even you yourself cannot. Right out of the gate, the only way to prove that you would ever consider doing it at any point is to actually do it, so there's already no way of getting the money without taking a swig. One would assume that means you should just drink it to guarantee the payment, but even downing it when the time comes doesn't actually do anything to prove that you originally intended to go through with it. As an example, you could initially lie, fully intending to "change your mind" before getting nervous and actually changing your mind when you start to fear that you could lose the prize because of some loophole you just can't find. You end up drinking it, but because you can't prove that was what you initially meant to do (and in this scenario it actually wasn't), you get nothing. The intent detail isn't there so you can use it get out of drinking the poison, it's there so billionaire can get out of paying those who are dumb enough to agree to the deal. For the billionaire, the worst case scenario is that nothing happens, but the best case scenario is that they get to watch as some idiot poisons themselves for no reason.
If they already know your intentions, then you can get the money but you have to drink it, barring some outside interference that you can't be aware of beforehand. The fact that you're made aware of the opportunity to change your mind from the get-go actually renders it useless because you have to make your decision with that detail in mind. Assuming nothing out of your control happens between your decision and the time you'd be drinking it, you have to be fully committed to doing it, regardless of whether you get the money or not. Like they said, the trick to getting the money is to not be doing it for the money in the first place.
With all due respect to anyone that replies to me, I'm sure you are making very good points, but I wasn't commenting to address my entire opinion on the video. Just some things I agreed with and found funny.
@@Tetsuya217 If you want, I'll delete it, mate.
@@metanightmare4454 nah, dw abt it man, I might read it later anyways
I hope Pixie shows up in more of these debates, she seems like an interesting new member to the cast
"RUclips and Capcom don't like me being 'Fuck Cares' so I'll be 'Faux Cares'"
Immediately afterwards: "Fucking Goddamn Fucker"
I love this
I told my mom about this puzzle and she came with a genius solution:
You can intend to take the toxin and get the money. Then you use part of the money to somehow lessen or erase the pain (like a sedative knocking you unconcious)
Your intention is real and it was never stated you weren't allowed to use the money yet. Afterwards you wake up without ever feeling any pain...🤯🤯🤯
Like the antidote?
"Y E S! I like pain."
What I say whenever someone asks me if I'm about to browse reddit.
I think that I would drink the potion even after getting the money, because it might be a valuable experience. I've heard that cancer survivors feel this extacy when the get to live a normal life again, because they feel grateful for what they have now that they've almost lost it.
Also I like to think of myself as a man of my word, and being known as 'the guy who could have not drunk the potion but did so anyway' is a good reputation to have that may benefit me in the future.
So, even if it's not the main focus, you're already thinking of long-term social benefits to drinking it? 🤔 I think the potion is just hot sauce tho (? You _can_ (somewhat) take this to real life.
I think I'd drink the potion because I'd be suspicious of the millionaire taking back my money if I don't. He says he won't but I am paranoid, so I'll drink. By that logic I wouldn't believe he'd actually give me money either, but by the point to drink I already have it, so I'm committed.
If the toxin is 100% survivable with no long-term consequences (this includes mental strain and whatnot) then this would be an extremely beneficial experience because it would show you what *true* pain is, and thus would make anything else pale in comparison, right? At worst it'd give you a superiority complex since you lived through the worst pain imaginable and everyone else didn't, that is if we take the billionaire's words for granted.
Gringo makes a lot of really good points, but the true winner of this is Bowl. Hear me out:
Bowl’s argument is that if he’d get two he’d not only make more money, but prove his intent by drinking the first beforehand, and going a bit farther by buying a second if he wasn’t freely given the second just to prove the point. He’d then drink it just to make sure FC and the gang know he’s superior to them.
His Chaotic Neutral energy would allow him to win no matter what. He’s unpredictable, and so it’s safe to assume that he’d absolutely do something that stupid.
Everyone strategizes on whether it's possible to intent to drink the potion while knowing they won't drink it in the end, meanwhile Em is just "fuck it imma drink this"
Exactly what I would try to do. Don't think, just accept you're gonna drink it. Might as well actually drink it in order to preserve the timeline.
Let's drink it together and get $2m
This puzzle actually isn't about "intention" at all. This is a logical paradox, similar in flavor to Cantor's diagonalization argument or the Halting Problem.
Suppose I follow this plan: if I get the million dollars, I will not drink the poison, and if do not get the million dollars, I will drink the poison. Will I get the million dollars or not? If the billionaire gives me the million dollars, then they know I do not intend to drink the poison according to my strategy, which is a contradiction. If the billionaire does not give the million dollars, then they know I intend to drink the poison, which is also a contradiction. As such, the billionaire cannot possibly exist, because I can hinge my intention on whether I get the million dollars.
How is Cantor's diagonalization argument a logical paradox?
Hence why the motivation can’t be based on whether you get the money, I suppose, like in Em’s case
No it isn't. Because you do not intend on drinking the toxin by midnight, you only intend on fooling him. Your real intention of drinking the poison would come tomorrow morning when you didn't get the money, but that wouldn't suffice, since you should have had the intention to drink it by midnight
Shöningers Bourgoise
The billionaire either wants you to drink or wants to keep their money. This isn't a philosophical or analytical problem, it's a game theory problem. They have whatever interests, but you cannot know them given the parameters of the problem. There may be fair assumptions, and one such assumption is that they want to keep their money. If they want to keep their money and you present this reasoning, they will tell you at 12am that you will get the money, thus determining your intent at that moment to be *not to drink* the toxin. At 12:01am however they will update you with the information that you did not actually successfully intended at midnight to drink, and thus you will be out of luck, even if you maintain your reasoning and thus decide to drink it again. Their problem only cares about the moment that has passed. Assuming you keep your word, they may even fulfill the other presumable objective, actually getting you to drink (though if that was their primary goal it would be fair to argue they would simply offer you the money without strings attached). My point is that your conditional resolve will be weaponized against you by a billionaire because they are self interested and have conflicting interests. At least those are my axioms.
Got me good with the "Steel is heavier than feathers" joke. 😂
Actually, could uexplainthat part te me?
@@thekightkeeper1988 What is heavier, 1kg of feathers or 1kg of steel ?
@@Petitmoi74 Look at the size o' that. That's cheatin'!
@@Petitmoi74 that's so obvious.
It's steel, isn't it?
@@Petitmoi74 funny thing is if you say what's heavier 1 pound of feathers or 1 pound of gold, the answer is a pound of feathers is heavier, because avardupois pounds are heavier than troy pounds which are used for gold
FC and Gringo: Trying to have an actual philosophical argument about the nature of intent and reason
Goblin Tyrant and Bowl: Gimme that *p a i n j u i c e*
You forgot Em.
@@frenchbaguetteintelligence got em
@@deki9827 Haha
I started crying with laughter when it got the Bowl’s argument, god I love this channel.
Really good argument btw, we got to see members new and old, learned some more definitions and it’s nice to see Gringo improving his arguments. Makes sense since he’s the apprentice of Phoenix in the game.
Good video 👍
It's really fun to watch and see everyone :>
Goblin Tyrant is quickly becoming my favorite of the gang, I live for his energy
This is the greatest argument in history; made in one minute, goddamn!
This is well - done!
Bit of an overstatement. I mean, I love this channel as well....
@@lautaroescarlon7501 That's my first time actually seeing this channel. But it's really great!
I swear, this friend group's conversations get more and more philosophical each day and I'm all here for it
this shouldn't be the group that legitimately enhances my critical thinking with these debates yet here we are
@@willo90li certainly didn't expect that to come from the fucking ace attorney fandom but hey, what works works.
I think the fundamental issue is that the term "intent" is undefined, and can only be judged in hindsight or with information that provides additional context. You COULD, however, take steps at/before midnight to ensure that all through tomorrow you'd have no choice BUT to take the toxin, such as constructing a device that will forcibly administer the toxin come the appointed time, and having it active and operational by midnight. I would be taking the initiative needed to solidify intent in the now in such a manner that the results would not occur until tomorrow.
Alternatively of course, you could use Em or Bowl's strategy of having additional motivations to earnestly take the toxin besides the money, but that still falls into the loop of how you can define intent before action.
Personally however, I would not get the money, because I do not trust omniscient billionaires, and would never be willing to take the toxin even in the first place, even if it was just an ordinary glass of water instead.
Plot twist, the "sickness with no lasting effects" is the suffering inherent to existence and it really is a glass of water
But building the machine could indicate intention to drink the toxin or intention of indicating intention of drinking the toxin. Either way, an intention exists before the initiative , but it’s unknowable what it is before any kind of hindsight. I think initiative is only a way to give evidence to yourself of what your intentions are, and that evidence would imply something that may not be true. For example, freeing up the day and buying pain medication before the time you have to drink the toxin could imply you have the intention to drink the toxin, or it could imply you have the intention of convincing yourself you have the intention to drink the toxin. Besides that, i think intention is just what we call the external triggers for our actions in hindsight to trick ourselves into the idea that we have free will, and aren’t just flesh machines responding to the multitude of factors in our environment.
I thought the same thing about being forced to take the toxin by an external means (I personnally thought about paying someone to force-feed me the thing come the right time, but same idea)
But then I wondered, would I intend to drink the potion at midnight ? Or would I just expect to drink it ? There seems to be some kind of distinction.
Can you intend to do something when you have no choice in the matter ?
“Intend to drink the stuff before or by tomorrow afternoon, however drinking is unnecessary” is the operative mind game of this puzzle. There is nowhere within the mind game that the billionaire does not have some psycho-ESP bullshit to simply tell if your intention is there, however I believe that regardless of this information there is no way to “intend” to drink this potion (or at least, there is no way to reasonably expect someone to intend to do this); allow me to explain why.
Intention (or to intend) is defined as “having an objective / plan”.
From a purely analytic standpoint, arbitrarily making a plan can be argued as an intention.
From a philosophical standpoint, it can be argued that without determination and initiative, an intention cannot exist as there is no proof the action was ever internally humored in the first place. There has to be a PERSONAL BELIEF that the action is DESIRED with absolute certainty with a full grasp on the consequences.
If we purely argue from the analytical position, then this problem is moot as you have already decided and planned ahead that the action would be taken, regardless of your conviction.
However, from the philosophical standpoint, in which conviction is, essentially, the FOUNDATION of your intention, it gets a little more complicated.
As soon as you are offered this problem, you need to undeniably be convicted to drink that potion or else you will not get the money. However, your conviction may falter when you are offered the idea that drinking the vial is unnecessary and the conviction is all that matters. In your head, you will say “I will drink the potion” but I don’t think any human will realistically say that unless they TRULY planned to go through with it knowing FULL WELL that even if they don’t they can still get the money.
I’ll try explaining this more clearly just in case; the pure concept of drinking the vial is a way to sway your determination. If you acknowledge that drinking the vial is unnecessary, you will never have the intention of drinking the vial in the first place, your intention will be wanting to drink the vial until you have the money. The differentiation there being your conviction is towards the MONEY and not the act of drinking the VIAL.
Unless you, personally, are convicted and believe that you have to, and most uncertainly will drink the vial, without any concept of the prize for doing so, you will not win the prize. The act of drinking the vial is a separate intention from getting the money, and the concept of not needed to drink the vial is, in fact, a paradoxical way of getting your convictions to falter.
You have to either only want to drink the vial, or want both to drink the vial and to get the money. Any other conviction leaves this as impossible to circumnavigate, as I’m sure there are few humans who truly want to injure themselves in this way.
Hopefully I explained this well.
TLDR; wanting to drink the thing is different from wanting the money.
You could still trick the system. Your intention has reasons, right? If the reason is money, then yes, you lose anyway. But what if the reason is... spite? You set this kind of intention - 'I will drink the poison if I DON'T get the money just to mess with the billionaire'. You think this through - if you don't get the money, then your intention was true all along, you drink the poison and the billionaire is paradoxed. He failed. But he would still do that because he is smug. He believes the task is impossible for you. And he is wrong! You drink the poison not for the money, but for pure outplay, jokes on him!
So when you actually get the money, it comes as a surprise to you. And when you do, you can cancel out your decision and don't drink. The reason? You already outplayed him, and drinking would be a final nail in his obligation's coffin, an even bigger outplay!
In a way this means Gringo is right
Intentions can change, you are forced to intend to drink the toxin to get the money, and after you get the money (which is already a sign that you intended to drtink the toxin) you should drink the toxin, but if the moment you get the money you change your mind? This is not planned, you intended to drink the toxin before the huge amount of money in your possession made you reasonate with your mind, that could be a natural outcome
Or what if external causes may interfere with you drinking the toxin?
You still intend to drink the toxin, but maybe someone else (possibly a friend) may destroy the vial before drinking it, tho you wouldn't get the money if you planned something to interfere with you drinking the toxin
Time is an important factor. Some days I feel like I was unproductive all day and I'll intend to go to the gym the next. After waking up, I might just not feel like it but my intention to go at 9pm still existed.
All they need is to feel ready to drink the poison at midnight and expect that determination to hold up in the afternoon.
You could have intention to drink the poison for more than one reason, you may want the money, but you could also have a strong moral compass. For example, Captain America would totally drink that poison, because once he got the money, or even just gave his word that he would drink that poison, then he would because that's his word. JoCat's alignment video explained Lawful Neutral in a similar way. "Your going to keep your promise because it IS a promise and therefor you're going to keep it."
I agree on that point, which is also why I believe the metaphor with wanting to swim tomorrow is bad.
In this case, we assume that the person who wants to go swimming didn't watch the weather, so doesn't know that it will rain tomorrow - OR did watch the weather and it turned out to be wrong.
In any case, that person had incomplete information. Their intent was based on what they knew at the time of the planning. The intent changed because of new information.
The problem in this case is that we have all the information from the get-go, including the knowledge that drinking the toxin after receiving the money is unecessary. The intent cannot be pure, nor change, because we already know all the variable at the beginning.
So, in my point of view anyways, like you said, either you focus on the money with the knowledge that you don't actually need to drink anything - then you don't get the money; either you (for whatever weird reason...) decide to drink the poison (to be spiteful, for the experience, whatever...) and thus you get the money.
When you get (or don't get) the money, you already have made up your mind, even if you are not conscious of it.
EDIT : The part with wiping memory actually support my theory. With her memory wiped, she doesn't have complete information anymore, just information that she believes to be complete. Thus, her intent to drink is based on that and she gets the money. Once she does get the money, information becomes complete, and back to case one - to not really since she already has the money.
I was literally losing my shit over Bowl's first comments, this man's humor is getting to levels of legendarily that shouldn't be possible at this point.
Also saying "Faux Cares" is just such a good way of getting away around RUclips's censorship laws. I had to like the video
I've been loving these casual takes on philosophical ideas that go so in depth but also add the funniest tangents
Gotta drop what you’re doing when FBI posts. Always love your videos keep up the great work.
Every FC name
0:01 FC
0:10 Faux Cares
3:20 French Cakes
9:19 Fun Capes
11:07 Forklift Certified
11:29 Font Chier
12:59 Cuck Fares
17:11 Faux Cares (again)
18:45 Fwuww Cawes
19:27 Forni Cator
19:51 French Cuisine
20:03 Vulgar Expression of Indifference
23:34 Five Continents
23:50 Faux Cares (at last)
You forgot 'French Cuisine'.
@@Harry_von_Karma timestamp?
@@TodiToday 19:51.
@@Harry_von_Karma thank you!!
I'd say in order to receive the money, you have one of two ways of obtaining it.
1) The billionaire is "eccentric" because he is omniscient to the point he can read your intentions due to some divine insights
or
2) Trust. The billionaire would need to have a sufficient amount of trust in your intentions in order to agree to the payout.
The former is - suprisingly - trickier, as it requires a more concrete resolve of intent to be manifested into your thoughts and to be resolute enough to prove it to the billionaire who has the deepest form of insight. The latter is just what people do on the day-to-day.
How to win any argument: “That’s a nice argument. Unfortunately, I have less-than-flattering selfies that declare you a beta male.”
There is no need to debate about this. Milliner know your intention.
We can only debate how to make a perfect intention of drinking without excluding an option of not drinking.
As someone with adhd, where I find myself in the incredibly common situation of intending to do something, just for me to get easily distracted and completely forget to do it, This whole conversation is incredibly funny and thought provoking for me.
If I were in the situation where, at precisely midnight, I must intend to drink the toxin tomorrow afternoon, I don't think I'd even get the money in the first place. Say the billionaire tells me all this at around five pm. I may intend to intend to, at midnight, intend to drink the toxin tomorrow afternoon, but by that time, I would have completely forgotten to do the intending necessary to receive the money in the first place. There's too many degrees of separation, and I would need an external reminder to force me to do any intending at all. Even then, the forcing to do the intending may put me off intending for later, and by that point, its past midnight and I will no longer receive the money.
I may be able to intend at the time the billionaire tells me to, but I would not be able to do the actual necessary intending needed. The act of drinking the toxin, nor the money reward have any sway in these factors, I'm just like this all the time
Watching this mental dilemma debate paired with FC’s name changing every so often and all the little details added to the animations such as when Gringo face planted on the table really shows these videos are worth every second of watching! Amazing job as always.
I would drink it out of pure pride and spite. “How dare you doubt my abilities? My courage? My decisions? I know you will chicken out. Your a billionaire sadist. I don’t care. It’s no longer about you. It’s about me,” or something like that.
Lesson of the day? Bowl, Em, and goblin would play 99 bottles of beer on the wall with deadly toxins just to compare the taste, FC and bowl literally have an echo chamber just for them, and the human mind has the astonishing ability to confuse itself over what it wants to do.
FC: becomes Faux Cares
Also FBI: Yeah, this seems like a good name for the Judge
I just love when people are trying to include new elements in set-in-stone logical puzzles, heh.
"But what if I smack the billionaire with a stick?"
"What if I gulp just a little?"
"Can I erase my memory for a day?"
It's just like with those puzzles with two dudes, who always lie or tell only truth. And you answer with shooting 'em.
Better safe than sorry, anyone with self control to always/never lie is too dangerous to be left alive
I believe you found a way to overthink a problem to the point where basic human experience and intuition is deemed unfounded at best. It’s like thinking about walking; everyone* knows how to walk, but the moment you think about it you start looking like something is physically wrong with your stride.
Or when you spell/speak one specific word enough times that you start questioning if that's _really_ they way it's spelt/spoken, & then after fact-checking, you start questioning why the fuck it's like that in the first place.
You are now breathing manually. It's a matter of your subconscious typically taking responsibility for performing an action and your conscious being handed the reigns and disrupting the very flow and lack of complications that makes those trivial tasks trivial in the first place
Gringo seemed to sway back and forth a bit, but he made some really pithy points along the way. I'm not sure I concur with his logic of "if you drink the toxin you fail", but it was a VERY interesting avenue to explore. I also feel a lot of time was spent tackling the puzzle in bad faith, as it's a thought experiment of sorts. Trying to game the scenario is counter to the discussion, but half the time the relevancy of extending the scenario had proven merit, so I can't critique that too much.
I feel like the antidote solution was kinda undermined there; you have no reason not to look for an antidote, and if you find one, you have no reason not to drink the potion either, which means your intent to drink it cannot be compromised by the consequences of it. Now obviously, if there is no antidote, you're screwed and you will have to take it. But I would definitely try that first if I get in this situation.
Another solution ; if being hit in the head with a brick to not have memories of the puzzle anymore is a possibility, I feel like the second person that hits you would just have to explain the puzzle to you again, but this time just say "you have until midnight to decide if you drink this potion or not. If you drink it, you win a million dollars". In this case, the puzzle is much simpler and you still follow the original rules.
I like how they don’t even hit upon the actual crux of the thought experiment until about seven minutes in.
video should just be renamed to Gringo goes insane for 24 minutes. What an interesting cast of characters glad you all can start the new year right with some chaos.👍
also love it how FC's names just change throughout the vid.
I spent the entire video thinking: "if you have to do it to show your intent then bowl was right, just drink it twice"
Knew of your existence thanks to your christmas video, and i gotta admire the passion and detailed editing that goes on here, hope that you and your loved ones are having a nice start of the year :D
Thank you. Likewise.
I knew of his because someone sent me the video about Latinx (I dunno why but it’s just autocorrected it so that it’s a pronoun, oh dear.) in a discord server. Thanks for your 18 minute cancer of a video, FBI.
2:24
NGL, Bowl's logic is pretty on point in this moment. XD
I love this channel and the debates they have. very compelling and also entertaining.
Ive realised how unfunny I am lmao
I love how his name kept changing constantly
How the hell did Bowl went from classy Englishman lines to "Give me your liver" lol?
This question doesn't take into account masochism and I feel personally attacked. It also doesn't account for being a dumbass who'll eat anything. So I feel double attacked.
How can I make you feel triple-attacked?
I fucking love you guys. Favorite channel by far. Ya have me chuckling for days while also stimulating my philosophical side
The issue here is the timeline, I can intend to drink the toxin before midnight, but once I realize I can get the money without actually drinking it, the intent dissolves away. If the realization happens before midnight, I fail, but if it happens on or after, I succeed.
In other words, I agree with Em.
FC Discord debating the most inane things will always be great
Simple answer: I'd drink it purely to honor the deal.
I like Pixie, she raises some good points
I am not finished with the video, but my take is that I would want to sign a contract the night before to provide premeditation and then drink it the day after to show the full intention.
I believe it is still necessary to drink it because it could be argued that you did not actually intend to drink the toxin, but to misguide the patron and receive one million dollars.
If you do change your mind the next day about the toxin, you better pray some third-party person/event prevents you from drinking the toxin. You would still be able to show a prior indication about your intention to drink it and that you were actively prevented from taking the final step. This may not actually be a good piece of evidence to show your intentions, but I'm trying to think about how to argue your intentions in a court of law.
Oh! Well if you need a third party event, that’s surprisingly simple. Leave the potion open, and dangerously close to the edge of a table. Sometime between midnight and the next afternoon, you’re bound to (unfortunately) accidentally knock it over, preventing you from consuming it.
Edit: Unless it perfectly bottle flips when it lands, in which case holy shit
@@directrix777TrixieKagami I don't think that works because you were still involved in the act, so it could be argued that it was purposeful. Also you actively chose to put it in a precarious position.
Never mind the fact that we also don't know when we receive the toxin.
@@directrix777TrixieKagami you: (goes out of your way to make this vial empty itself.)
God: *_Okay, but what does it taste like?_* (Vial lands perfectly with every drop still inside)
everytime bowl and FC argue is a blessing on this earth
This one gets you thinking in all types of angles, you may never know what may happen. If anything, I’d ask the billionaire to drink with me as a cheers for our new found association, maybe switch his drink in case his was a fake one, then go about my merry way.
Billionaire has probably outsmarted a Sicilian. Both drinks are poisoned and he already has immunity.
This channel deserves way more subscribes than it has.
Bowl with the sick Princess Bride reference.
Yes!!!
"that's a nice argument. Unfortunarely, i posses less than-flattering selfies of you that declare you a beta-male" i choked XD
I'm only six minutes in, but I can't stand everyone missing the point. The assumption should be that the billionaire has perfect knowledge and knows your true intentions. If you plan to change your mind after getting the money, then your intention was false to begin with, and you won't get the money. The only ways to get the money without drinking the poison are to a: chicken out at the last second, or b: have intervening circumstances prevent you from drinking the poison through no plan of your own.
Gringo just wanted to focus on a different question because he thought it was more interesting, not because he missed the point.
I think Gringo had the most solid solution half way through the video… then it just kept going XD
Everyone had different approaches:
- Em would drink it because of another reason
- Pixie would get an antidote, which would be useless unless she INTENDED to drink it
- Bowl would drink it because why the hell not?
- FC and Harry would use a contract that overcomes the loophole
- Gringo figured out how the loophole works and therefore could bypass it completely
Goblin and Seraphina didn’t really have a solve so I can’t comment.
Highly entertaining stuff though :)
Came for laughs, got out a philosophy master
you could add honor to the agreement also proving reputation can sometimes be meaning full enough to go through.
That was a very cool subject honestly. This has helped me a bit, as someone that is considered gifted, my biggest hurdle was always that I didn’t want to go all out, while still wanting the results. That is mostly because I did not want to take a necessary detour to get what I want. It also doesn’t help that I have been ingrained with the thought that I can probably do a come back later. This has helped me a lot with understanding my problem.
Once again Goblin Tyrant says what's on my mind in the coolest way possible what a cool dude.
It's only fair for the guy being represented by a hot PW character
Omg I just stumbled across this channel today and it is freaking brilliant!!! Can’t wait for more!!
This is circular reasoning; Gringo supposes that he already has the money; but if he doesn't actually plan to drink it once he gets the money, then he does not have the intention and therefore will not have the money. One could imagine that the billionaire already knows that Gringo fully intends to run away with the money and thus won't give it to him.
I agree with Gringo, he seems reasonable to me
9:15 oftentimes when someone says they intended to do something, it turns out they never ended up going through with it for one reason or another...
I would drink the toxin because of honor, thus bypassing the entirety of the puzzle by removing logic from it :D
Ah yes, my favorite tuber, Forklift Certified.
Oh here's an idea. I would have drunk the poison anyway, i clearly wanted to. But i ask my friend to stop me when im about to after midnight comes around. Therefore, i try to drink the poison but my friend stops me and destroys the vial, therefore i can no longer drink it. I had intention and action, but something prevented me from achieving it
This is actually a valuable solution - you make a competition between yourself and one or more other people, where you attempt to drink the toxin and they attempt to stop you. You can trust that they might be able to save you, and all you have to do is try your hardest to drink it anyway - since it's not your own lack of intent that stops you, you will still get the money
I think you should tell your friend that if they want, they can stop you. That removes the agency away from you because it's possible your intention was to be stopped but when you give that agency and choice to your friend, and you go to commit to the action, you may want him to stop you but your intention is still drinking it, therefore you win.
@@gummigamer4614 unnecessary, i would tell them after midnight, therefore my intentions have no bearing. Besides, my fight to not be stopped would be high enough indication my intentions not wavering. Potentially, ill ask a group of friends, so as not to have any chance at succeeding
But you would know before midnight that you would ask your friend to stop you after midnight. Therefore you no longer intend to drink the poison because you intend to stop halfway due to an obstruction of your making
No, by taking steps to stop yourself, you falsified your previous intentions and don't get the money.
So i get out of whatever i'm doing for that day, don't die, and 1 million dollars, fuck it, hell yeah
This was fascinating and really well-thought out.
Thanks for sharing this to we random strangers.
Mmmm (in case you’re still reading) I think that intention derives from action and not the other way around, in this case, I believe that intention is based on a hypothetical action that one executes when confronted with a possibility. Intention should be the immovable inclination that one possesses to execute a certain action physically (instead of metaphysically) when presented with other possibilities and while the possibility to physically execute the hypothetical exists. I also think that intention might be some sort of spectrum since people often only intend things to a certain extent. Therefore I believe that to obtain the money fairly you have to drink it regardless of whether you receive the money or don’t, because some intentions can be overridden by others (such as receiving a million dollars) and if the possibility to drink the toxin still exists and you decide to not do it because you have received the million dollars then your intention never really existed because it wasn’t immovable while it was still possible to execute as a physical/real action. On the other hand I think intentions can be contained within other intentions (getting the money contains drinking the toxin) but even if you acquire the reward beforehand (underlying intention) you’d still have to drink the toxin since in that case money and drinking the toxin exist complimentarily and one isn’t there without the other (in contrast to only wanting the money which is when you don’t drink the toxin after you acquire the money). I think my definition also makes it a bit of a trick question in this case since the billionaire (who can supposedly tell without mistake if you’ll do it or not) will only judge as truthful those who drink the toxin even after their intentions are confirmed, which means that he can foresee some sort of singular and absolute future where they drink the toxin regardless of whether they have the money or not and essentially is a prick who will reward those who submit to him by providing an illusion of choice
Gringo finally having a standout good argument with that commitment bit. Well done, mate.
Also the whole group admitting they’ve intended to and planned out violent murder is very on brand. Which of them wants to eat their victims, I wonder?
How funny you should ask. Someone was talking about that a few days ago.
@@frenchbaguetteintelligence Of course one of you lot has the Cravings. 'Ethics of Cannibalism and the desire of the group to partake thereof' episode when? :p
I do love how every time I watch these there comes a point where I have to sit up in my chair and actually use my brain instead of just laughing through the video.
It may almost be impossible to determine one's intent in the situation the puzzle puts one in. Although in the world of law, conspiracy can be charged even without the execution of the crime as long as steps are taken, but unfortunately in this case there is no concrete definition that can be applied to this situation. You can intend to do an action but fail to do it due it when you change your mind part way just as said by Gringo in regards to learning a language, but quitting after trying due to finding the task daunting can be seen by yourself as an attempt that had failed which is a perspective that sees intent, but to someone on the outside it can be seen as a person not trying enough to overcome the challenge which is a perspective that doesn't see true intent. Therefore, the question of intent cannot be properly addressed unless both parties can agree on what a true sign of intent can be, but even then, even if a proper show of intent is shown, if you would change your mind after receiving the money then the intent would be gone. The end result of receiving the money and not drinking the toxin is an unattainable option that is paradoxical in nature. Even with both parties agreeing on a definition of intent for the situation, it would still be difficult to reach a proper outcome where money is received without a shadow of a doubt that the intention is present.
TL:DR : It's a paradox regardless of the choice taken
an interesting point to bring up that i'm shocked Gringo didn't: some people intend to do something, but *forget* between the time they intend to and actually do it. If i get a message from someone while i'm busy, i *intend* to message them back, but if i forget to, *i don't do it*. my intention to do so hasn't changed, if i had remembered, i would have done it, but because it had slipped my mind in the meantime, it wouldn't get done. if at midnight tonight, i intend to drink the toxin, but forget in the morning (no memory erasing rocks involved here, just a simple bad memory), would i get the money?
i say this because i personally have a dogshit memory, to a legitimately worrying degree but right now that doesn't matter. what does matter is that it's not outside the realm of possibility for me to intend to drink the toxin by midnight, go to sleep and completely forget the deal, wake up to the notification that i'm a million dollars richer and go "oh right, that was this afternoon, guess i don't have to do it anymore". even if my reasoning for drinking the toxin is just to get the million dollars (which has some merit to just disqualify me outright since i know of the loophole), if i really do think "fuck it, might as well just do it and get the money" at midnight, but when the time comes just completely not realize it, would i get the money?
I like how FC's name changes everytime he talks, and at 5:15 it's faux cul lmao
I love the logic of, "It doesn't matter if I get the money or not from not drinking, because I'm gonna drink it anyway"
this video is much more "normal" than the others but is awesome nontheless
Great video Five Continents
definitely the best video so far I was laughing constantly
Also, the incessant name changes had this way funnier than it needs to be.