UNDERCOVER RV Tech reviews Grand Design, Brinkley & Alliance RVs
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- Опубликовано: 18 июн 2024
- Who makes the best 5th Wheel? Grand Design, Brinkley or Alliance? In today's episode of "Undercover RV Tech" I review six 2023 5th Wheels - a "high-end" and "low-end" from each manufacturer - in an attempt to answer the question of who makes the best RV?
1) 2023 Grand Design - Reflection - 337RLS - 35'6" - Avg. Retail $76,300 - Floorplan - www.granddesignrv.com/fifth-w...
2) 2023 Grand Design - Solitude - 390RK - 41'5" - Avg. Retail $115,450 - Floorplan - www.granddesignrv.com/fifth-w...
3) 2023 Alliance - Avenue - 32RLS - 35'3" - Avg. Retail $77,650 - Floorplan - www.alliancerv.com/fifth-whee...
4) 2023 Alliance - Paradigm - 340RL - 37'10" - Avg. Retail $103,300 - Floorplan - www.alliancerv.com/fifth-whee...
5) 2023 Brinkley - Model Z - 2900 - 32'11" - Avg. Retail $102,250 - Floorplan - www.brinkleyrv.com/rvs/fifth-...
6) 2023 Brinkley - Model Z - 3100 - 36' - Avg. Retail $103,850 - Floorplan - www.brinkleyrv/rvs/fifth-whee...
Things I reference in the video:
FREE "Don't Get Stranded!" Checklist - undercoverrvshopper.com/
FREE RV Shopping Mini-Course - www.undercoverrvshopper.com/m...
Full RV Shopping Course - undercoverrvshopper.com/rv-sh...
Tool-Free RV Maintenance Course - undercoverrvshopper.com/tool-...
- RUclips video on BAL Accu-slides - • The Worst RV Slideout ...
- RUclips video on Common RV Plumbing issues - • COMMON plumbing issue ...
- Episode 1 of Undercover RV Tech - • Tech reviews RVs under...
Brinkley's response - Adjusted "Rigor" score should now be 97 for both models
My wife and I are planning to purchase a 5th wheel in the not-too-distant future. Brinkley “Z” models have been at the top of our list. This video gave me pause. It is a very helpful video and the detailed, knowledgeable information is much appreciated. However, as a prospective buyer of a Brinkley, I wanted to get a response directly from Brinkley rather than secondhand.
The following are the 4 items noted as negative grades per the “Rigor scale” against Brinkley:
- Minus 10 points due to the flex plumbing hose connecting to brass fittings;
- Minus 2 points for the Furrion water heater sensor issue;
- Minus 1 for “fit and finish” lumber core use
- Minus 2 for Furrion vs. Norcold refrigerator
- = Minus 15 points
I did not bother to ask Brinkley about the use of lumber core, as that is a small issue and they have done a great job protecting and covering the core pieces in my personal opinion.
Brinkley’s responses to the other 3 items:
Add back 10 points: Flex plumbing hose connecting to brass fittings:
- Brinkley’s response and actual production line changes:
“We have had zero issues with our plumbing connections in the field (over 1,600 units registered) or through our prototyping and testing. Everything we have done has been approved by our suppliers for the application they are used. We use PEX water lines wherever possible and brass plumbing connections throughout the entire unit. In a few specific locations, we are using an upgraded no kink flex tube that no one in the industry has previously used. It has a semi rigid inner lining with the flex mesh exterior. The quality of the hose is a HUGE factor in leading to problems that have been an issue with other manufacturers. It is recommended by the manufacturer of our water pump to use a flex tube coming off of the water pump to reduce vibration and noise.
In most units in the field, we have used a ribbed brass PEX fitting with the no kink flex hose and an oetiker clamp coming off of the water pump and under the sink on the Model Z 2900. Using a brass fitting (as opposed to plastic) allows to ensure the clamp is tight and the fitting itself will not have “flex” making it much less likely for a leak to develop.
Although we have had no issues with our connections, for customer peace of mind, we have eliminated all factory installed connections on flex supply lines. We have gone to a riser fitting hydraulicly preinstalled from the supplier on the water lines running to the water pump and below the sink in the 2900. Again, we have had no issue with the connection we are using and stand behind our product, but we are always looking for ways to improve and added peace of mind.
Add back 2 points: Furrion water heater sensor issue:
- Brinkley’s response:
“The issue he brought up with the Furrion water heater sensor was a concern in the first generation Furrion tankless water heaters but was resolved about two years ago. Every Furrion tankless water heater we have used has been the second-generation version and this is a non-issue.
No points regained. Furrion vs. Norcold refrigerator
- Brinkley’s response:
“The refrigerator we elected to use the Furrion 16 cubic foot 12V refrigerator based on its size and reliability. The Norcold refrigerator he mentions is a completely different size unit and would not be an option in our Model Z line. I do not know what criteria he used to determine one being superior to the other as he gives no data or rationale to his rating.
Final general quote from Brinkley:
“Know that we stand behind our product 100% and will take care of any issue that may arise (with this or anything else that we may have fallen short on). Our goal is to build the best RV on the market and something that will last for years to come.”
I hope this info helps folks who may have been turned off to Brinkley after watching the video. It would be great to have the video updated with the corrected scores.
Concur. I brought this up to Brinkley and as you said, they are fully aware. The person I spoke to said one of the fittings may look like a compression but was actually a barbed fitting and another they had changed. They indicated they tried to contact @undercoverrvtech but were told he won't talk with dealers to remain unbiased. I respect that but am also wondering how/when any corrections they are making will be verified and taken into account? I assume the next time he checks a Brinkley that was recently produced?
I would like for him to go back to the current year of the same models he inspected to recheck for the changes and publish an updated video comparison. That, I believe, is due to the manufacturer and to the customer!
Chandler Tenney, the sales director in Brinkley in one of the YT videos pointed out that the reason they put brass joints in their plumbing is because the issue they have seen in the warranty repairs. So I would not say that Brinkley was free of all the plumbing leaks. But I like that they take the initiative of addressing the issues and making sure that it doesn’t happen again. They definitely have the potential to reach the 💯 score
Thank you for your research, it has been very helpful. Based on your reply from Brinkley, we’ll be purchasing one soon 😊
It's not that we're looking for perfection,but getting these things serviced is close to impossible. Unless you live next to a certified rv repair that will repair your rv or any other , under warranty. Our son purchased a 2023 Integra and had a list of 26 items to check and repair after he took it home. That's an $800k coach...We picked it up a week later and they repaired 5 items and were waiting for authorization from their manufacturers to ok repairs. The rear drive axle caster adjust bolt was loose and moved and clunked when accelerating and stopping. Quality control is horrible in this field no matter the manufacturer.
30 yr Master tech retired here debating which 5th wheel to spend my hard earned retirement money on is like gambling. 🫤
As someone who reviews and sells All of these Brands I appreciate this video! I will send this to GD Alliance and Brinkley so they can ALL Improve! Thank you for the video!
Ps I own a Alliance Delta 262RB ;)
Love your channel and meeting you guys at the rally
I think the manufacturers already know how they designed their product and make a cost decision to hit a price point. If they don't know about the plumbing tradeoffs why are they building RVs?
👏 I'd make note that Brinkley has already responded and clarified that the product they are using is different than the rest of the industry. It's approved for this application and has had zero issues with it within the first year of production. Bravo to Brinkley for taking the time to go outside the industry to find products designed and engineered for their application and not using whatever is cheapest.
@@RV_Reviews LMAO "not using whats cheapest"
As their entire camper is filled with all the cheapest (furrion junk) on the market.
also it's different, that doesn't mean it approved by anybody other then them.
Zero failures in their whole 10 months of existence?
We greatly appreciate your objective evaluation of our product. One of our core values is to continuously strive for relentless improvement. If you ever find yourself in the Elkhart area, we would like to extend an invitation for a campus and factory tour.
Do you concur that the slide mechanism is a Accu-slide? When I asked the dealer today about the unit we're considering purchasing, they stated it has an Exact-Slide mechanism. Does it vary by unit or model?
Ok I have a used Valor 2021.My experience with Alliance has been no warranty, no service. Four to six month wait for service doesn't work. We are looking elsewhere for our next rig.
For what it's worth, I'd pay extra for solid surface counter tops. I've had issues with counter tops melting and warping due to a failed seal before and it sucks.
@alliancerv Even the tech is showing to everybody that your slide mechanism in the avenue is garbage you just decide to installed the same on the paradigms for 2024, I though your goal is the customer satisfaction.
@@scottl303 We just bought a 2024 (built in 11-23 according to the sticker) Alliance Paradigm 310RL. Our bedroom slide is an Exact-Slide, not an Accu-Slide. Rigor RV put out a video saying that the Exact-Slide avoids the problems of the Accu-Slide. Yay!
I'm so glad you have the courage to make these videos!! Thanks!
Jacob tells it like it is! An excellent expose, that shows the soft underbelly of the RV industry. Cost is king, shove them out the door as fast as you can, for whatever you can get, and caveat emptor. If you've tried to get RV service and repairs lately, let me tell you it's like the plumber in "The Money Pit" movie, who shows up in a Cadillac, and laughs at you. I don't understand how they stay in business. At least Brinkley appears to have a lot better build quality. Maybe we need Jacob to start a "Consumer Reports" type channel for RVs. Things will only get better if the consumer demands changes.
Amazing Liz has started doing that type of content. She’s got a few out where she got some traction.
I like the way you support your assessments with logic and reason; and not just an arbitrary opinion!
Subscribed!
Looking forward to your assessments of the Keystone Cougar, Montana and Outback brands.
I just forwarded this video to my Brinkley salesman with instructions to pass it on to his company rep. I’m disappointed they missed this.
Thanks for doing that, and thanks for watching!
I forwarded as well to the customer service I’ve been speaking to as I’m considering a Brinkley.
I sure hope they take this video to heart. I was ready to pull the trigger on a Brinkley because I think they came up with a near perfect product. Then I saw this video and I'm thinking twice about my choice.
Brinkley! If you're reading this, please give it serious consideration. I'll be checking for it when I attend the Tampa RV show in January.
I wouldn't believe this video 100%, we have a Brinkely and it's amazing. @@fantastiqueberliotz1209
@@fantastiqueberliotz1209 oooh can you report back after you attend. They aren’t going to my city this year it looks like.
Anxiously awaiting Part 2. Your videos are very useful in narrowing down our choice. Thank you, Jacob!
I love what I learned about any RV just from watching this ONE video. I’m subscribing!
Your videos are so great, and well done. I've been an RV'er for a long time and consider myself experienced and can fix most the problems I encounter. But, that pales in comparison to your real-world experience working as a tech in the industry. Your insight is remarkable, I love your attention to detail. Probably my new favorite RUclips channel that I wish I found sooner! Cheers from south Alabama!
Just today I was looking at trailers and was in a few alliance models and everyone of them the fit and finish still had the splinter drawers in both premier and avenues. I was floored at so many issues in them like you spoke of, I had to just walk on. These were all 2023 & 2024 models. The cougars I viewed had better fit/finish but the counters and other things were on the poor end which just makes me sad. Glad I found your videos and web site because it made it that much better to “see” the reality to what I’m looking for in my next unit which will be for full time living so I make a much better selection. So I keep Loki h as I tick off the list ones that may end up being those lemons and I don’t get stuck unhappy and major broke in the wallet!! Ty soooo much for being so open with all of your fantastic information!!
Your reviews are the most informative on the net. I am shopping for a towable and looked at the Rockwood. The incorrect plumbing was everywhere. I told the salesman and he called the manufacturer's rep who advised it was the most efficient way to do the plumbing and they have not had any complaints.
Contrary to that statement, there are complaints on the internet about these types of connections.
Keep up the good work and my prediction is you will have a very popular channel.
Wow this is some of the best content I’ve seen on this topic on RVs on RUclips. Thanks for all your hard work. I’m finding your videos very helpful as we search for our first family bunkhouse for our family of 6! I think a great idea for a video would be to look at some of the most popular bunkhouse floor plans like the imagine 2800 bh, jayco jayflight 285 bhs, jay feather 27bhb and heartland mallard m26 just to name a few. Looking forward to your future videos !
Super info. I am going through my 2018 VanLeigh Vilano using the info provided in this video, your lemon checklist, and plumbing video. So far not bad but not as good as I thought. Today I am going to check plumbing and what I know so far it has pinch connections on the flex tubing and that has been a problem. The line going into the water heater popped off and trashed my bay. 1100 at night. Not fun. I have been fultiming for 6 years and your info is really good. Thanks
There's a young couple that have a YT channel (Wild RV Life ?), they recently purchased the Brinkley 3100 and have non stop issues with their AC units, they also had issues with their trailer brakes (there was a recall) and a few other issues that Brinkley has been able to correct (shipping them parts, etc.). They are still dealing with the AC issues - the techs tell them "it can't be freezing over, that's impossible" and yet ... they have both AC's with ice.
I got to see the same model in person and LOVED it! We had looked at other 5th wheels prior and everything was such poor quality - they want way too much money for the garbage they sell as "new" and then you're stuck with the monthly payment + all the repairs, what a nightmare!
Thank you so much for this review, I really needed the education on the plumbing system (and the systems used for the slides). I had the RK model on my short list but it's gone gone gone now! Saved me a mountain of misery - thank you again!
RUclips suggested your channel to me yesterday. Very informative. The things you talk about arene't mentioned on any of the RV review channels I follow, but their focus is sales so not really surprising. I've been watching review videos in preparation for buying my first RV (fifth wheel no longer that 32 feet) in advance of retirement. These 3 manufacturers were at the top (though Brinkleys are out of my price range), along with the Keystone Cougar fifth wheels. Your info has made me rethink the whole plan. Your aside on the sensor problem with the Furrion water heaters is interesting, and I shared your tip with the camper group I'm in as I've seen so many posts on water heaters that stopped working. I also gave the name of your channel in case others want to check it out.
Great video. First one of your videos that I have come across. Just subscribed and will look back through you prior videos. This one was perfect. It had the 3 brands I have been considering.... specifically the 340RL and Model Z 3100. I have run into the owners of Alliance and Brinkley at RV shows. In talking to them they seemed genuinely interested in feedback and improving their products.... hopefully that will continue as they get bigger and videos like this can help. Thanks!
That's my hope as well! My goal is that customers will start demanding better quality and the manufacturers that care will listen and the ones that don't will go out of business.
Like your videos ,I am a retired auto tech and still learn from your inspections and tests,very informative and you are right they all seem to be built kinda crappy due to regulation on standards.
Wow, what a awesome video and a big. Thank you for having the bravery to show. What really goes on in the RV industry This is a must watch video for everyone planning to buy a RV i wish you would do more brands and to continue to tell the truth.
Thanks for your diligence and oversight to keep them honest and improve the quality of rv industry and protecting us!
I just watched this and it was informative. I have a 2017 Cedar Creek and do all my work myself. I never realized that soft pipe was an issue. I checked mine after watching and the only place there was soft pipe was in and out of the 12v water pump. It used gear clamps and not pex clamps. I've done a bunch of work on my unit and its the things that you can't see are the scariest. I removed the entire bottom of mine to remove a couple of stinky dead mice.( you pay that much money you would think the thing would be sealed up to stop them from getting in). When open i sealed everything up. Found the fresh water tank almost ready to fall out. Missing fasteners! Then also missing on all tanks. Fixed a window that leaked - not installed correctly, but couldn tell until it already leaked.
Love your insight. My RV has some pros and some cons based on your review methods… but that’s Great information to know!!! Thank you
I've been an RV tech for 18 years, and prior to that I also worked as a plumber. 10 years ago, I probably would have agreed with you about the plumbing quality. But speaking from experience in the field, we simply don't see issues arise from braided flex hose crimped to pex fittings. Remeber that the psi ratings in an RV differ greatly from household standards, and there are weaker points in an RV plumbing system that will.fail.before these connections. I absolutely agree that brass fittings should be standard. Pex or braided flex hose with brass fittings will usually even survive freezing.
We had the opportunity to visit all 3 factories while in Elkhart earlier this year. Firstly the difference between the factories was very noticeable. The Brinkley factory was brand new and was obviously absolutely spotless and their young guy showing us around was very knowledgeable about how Brinkley are doing it differently. The Grand Design factory was a different story, yes the roof system was noticeably inferior and the factory was very messy. The Alliance factory was more tidy than Grand Design but we did spot a few things about the cabinets I was disappointed in. FYI we have been in the furniture & Flooring retail business for over 38 years so we do have a reasonable idea as to what is acceptable or not.
We currently own an Alliance Valor 40 v 13 and have had a few issues, cabinets, plumbing etc. But we have nothing but good things to say about Alliance customer service. In fact they are amazing.
Would we buy a Brinkley, HELL YES. Their interior design is absolutely gorgeous compared to Alliance and Grand Design.
Just need to stick with the Alliance for a few years until Brinkley gets all the bugs ironed out.
Thank you for your video and evaluation of these brands and models. Your expertise is greatly needed!!
Another excellent video. And amazing to hear that the companies are watching, we will all benefit from that.
I hope so!
They know already.
Lots to look out for when buying a new or used RV. This is really helpful. Appreciate the tips.
Excellent video and information. I have been dealing with plumbing and electrical issues that are a mess in my new "high end" 5th wheel. Replacing it with the correct components rewiring and replumbing myself. Also, see the issue with fit and finish across the board and how sloppy some manufacturers are. It's almost a choice as to the best of several evils. What are you willing to live with and compromise on. It's hard to find a good model and manufacturer. I remember when I bought this current 5th wheel I have, the unit I looked at and heavily inspected for every detail, wasn't the same unit they tried to get me to take delivery of after the dealer "prep". I would love to see the "RIGOR" scale applied to an Airstream.
Fantastic Video Jacob !!!
Also I have your course on dont break your RV and its AMAZING. To those looking at purchasing, stop looking and get it. It will pay for itself in no time at all.
Thanks for you work on keeping us informed . I would love to here your experiences with the Northwood Manufacturing Arctic Fox ,we have owned a 27.5 L for 2 years now and have been very satisfied with it .
I stumbled across your video after watching a ton of RV videos and I'm shocked you're the first person to mention the plumbing. As a fellow mech, I've noticed a lot of these RVs look to be plumbing and electrical nightmares. I'm a little surprised they get away with selling some of this stuff because a lot of these practices are flat out illegal in almost every other industry.
because no regulation
I watch a ton of rv videos and this has singlehandedly been by far the most informative ❤
Glad to find this channel. Hope your still keeping up with undercover. Hearing to many mishaps this year!
Great video. We ordered a 340RL Alliance in January of 21. Overall, we have been very happy.
Our biggest issue has been the slide skis. After many replacements under warranty, Alliance reworked our slide. That lasted only about 6 months. They have since then started using a different slide ski. It's a heavier & wider plastic. We had custom-made stainless steel skis made & installed for our unit. So far, so good.
Happy that worked for you! As I’m watching, I’m thinking about the slides and thought 🤔If it’s the failed slides, I would have to a modification right away! It helps that my hubby is a fantastic welder as me even better fabricator, it could be done. Although I still ask, when paying that kind of money for an RV, these issues should absolutely 💯 not be an issue! Come on engineers! Where did you get your training from? Toy tonka division? Now having said that, and not to diss men, women engineers rock! All that I have seen have attention to detail, and live and see how these mechanisms work. Like vacuum cleaners! How many men use them? Silly analogy, just saying!
I was ready to buy a Brinkley, after watching this, I’ve reconsidered. I cannot risk a leak. Thank you.
Love your video. As a fellow RV tech, your evaluation seems spot on. Just went to Tampa Super RV Show and was so disappointed with Alliance and GD.
One point I wish you would have covered was structural build between the three which one favors over the other. From my experience and inspections Brinkley has a superior build quality over Alliance and GD.
2021 GD 260RD. Have had no major roblems. Did a 10,000 mile run last fall. Yes that flex hose is wrong, but have had no plumbing issues yet. Been a plumbing contractor and general contractor for over 30 years, so I do keep it up and maintenced
Well done. Thanks. We didn't look for all the things you mentioned, but the main reason we didn't buy a Brinkley was frameless windows because they don't open all the way (lose cross-breeze that we love in good weather) and they're too dark (bad for nice views and more open interior feel). Idk why anyone would like frameless windows aside from the sleek appearance.
Thank you for this video. We almost bought a Brinkley but to me it just seemed like a mid-profile 5er ( shallow basement) with some very cool creature comforts on it. And then they charge the full-profile price for it. 100 plus. All of my research led us to the Alliance Paradigm 340 RL. We took delivery of our 2023 in mid August. Got it for 33% below MSRP. Fit and finish is excellent. We went through it with a fine tooth comb. Could not find one single thing wrong. I know there will be a shake down period but we are one trip in and so far perfect. 🤞 Thanks again for the review.
Some of the things brinkley is doing is pretty cool. But I 100% agree, it's still just a mid profile camper using super cheap furrion stuff at a full profile price. Can't wait to see the price of their full profile line when it comes out. If they think a midprofile is worth 105K I bet their full profile with the same cheap furrion stuff in it will be 135-140K
Well done video I hope your channel grows and helps the industry improve
My 2021 Cedar Creek is plumbed all wrong according to your video. I agree with you. Just replaced my water pump and had all kinds of problems.
Very interesting video.
Next time you're underneath a Grand Design, Jayco or Coleman and perhaps Rockwood, check the underside of the slideouts. They stopped using any protective barrier and just have thinly painted OSB. Any amount of water that wicks under there will quickly start to rot the floor out - and it's happening.
Really appreciate your work here! We are currently researching 5th wheels planning to purchase one for full timing in the next month or so. Your videos are EXTREMELY helpful! Waiting patiently for Undercover Tech video #3.
Glad to hear, thanks for watching!
Hi, we are as well. Just came back from Pennsylvania show. I'm just curious what you're thinking of getting. We are siding with Riverstone.
Just saw this. Hi Brenda. Riverstone looks great but might be too costly for us. My husband is very handy so we are looking at Alliance Paradigm rigs right now.@@brendaleonard1702
Hopefully you'll do some of the comparable legacy nameplates for Keystone and Jayco in similar price points to see how they stack against the new kids on the block
I think you're amazingly honest and for attack. I don't know who you are attacked for but they lost a good guy. I bought a Keystone bullet 331B. HS, and I've never taken it on a trip. It's only sad in my driveway on my acre. And I've not used any plumbing, thank goodness. For everything you found. The only thing I've ever done was. Use an air conditioner and watched television with my grandchildren. And I only paid 35000 came out of my pocket. It's not perfect but compared to these high dollar trailers. I love it. I.
Truly love it and thank you for your honesty. You are blessed and I feel blessed that I got to listen to you from beginning to end.
Tx for video! You "destroyed" my week! LOL I am going to RV show in Tampa, we are changing our MH to 5th wheel. All 3 of those Mfg were on my list. Your compare of Brinkley vs Alliance was spot on! About 6mos ago at dealer, we compared fit/finish and saw the same thing! Brinkley was winner, now I really don't know!
Sorry I "destroyed" your week lol! If you're seriously shopping you should check out my shopping course - www.undercoverrvshopper.com/mini-course/
Love the video! This is what the RV industry needs: accountability. My wife and I have a 2021 Rockwood Signature 8324SB that we purchased from a private buyer. I had a professional RV tech review and inspect before purchase. We love this RV. We have had very few issues and have owned it now for about a year and put over 10,000 miles and 2 months of nights in it. I have also been very impressed with Rockwood's support. Even though I was not the original owner, they treated me very well when I asked questions. They have gone so far as to provide me with the drawings and schematics for wiring and plumbing so I could troubleshoot my own issues if needed. Way more than I expected. They also answer questions promptly. Regarding suspension, one of the reasons I purchased Rockwood was their use of the torsion suspension. I have torsion suspension on a large utility trailer, and it pulls and handles like a dream. The Rockwood is the same. When we arrive, almost nothing has moved inside, and it goes over bumps very well. I do not see why all RV trailers would not use torsion suspension. The build quality has been excellent, and we would buy another Rockwood in a minute. I did have another question. When we store the trailer, should we bring in the slides every time, we park it next to my office, so we do go out and fix lunch and spend the night in it maybe once a week if we are too tired to drive home? Love your segments and look forward to more.
How do you feel about the Montana?
I have a 2020 Grand Design 150 series and it is not plumbed like that. I checked while I was upgrading the converter for lithium batteries and it is all PEX. I was glad because I was easily able to plumb in an outdoor shower connection on the door side for my portable sink.
My 2019 grand design momentum fifth wheel toy hauler is also all pex as well! I’m wondering if they just used whatever was available at the time due to covid supply shortages on the models he reviewed
I also look underneath the pass through storage and under the bed storage to see if they used OSB for the floor and to check the welds.
Awesome really awesome inspection..I like you no nonsense approach to reviewing!! Thanks!
Great video! Appreciate you taking the time to share your experience. I would like to know your opinion about a crossroads, Redwoods quality compared to alliance paradigm? Thanks and keep up the good videos.
In 2018 I purchased a used private party 2015 Grand Design 303RLS with recommendations from other Grand Design customers. I soon found out they are not such a “grand design”. They in the same category as all rv manufacturers. First problem was air conditioning intake it was not sealed from hot air from ceiling space. Corrected that. After using the using the trailer a few times i noticed a leak on the ground area of water heater. No leaks around gas/electric screen area. Removed the hutch drawers, low behold there is the leak. During manufacturing somebody had cross threaded a fitting on water heater. Instead of fixing the problem they put some kind of goop around it. Corrected that problem. Soon found out another leak on the ground under water hook up area, it was not hose problem. Took the panel off in cargo hold area so I could see the piping, another fitting had been cross threaded, instead of correcting the problem they put some kind of goop around the fitting. After they put that goop around the fittings it had dried out and cracked. Took about 3 years for problem to show up. We love the layout of the coach❤. As of 2023 we have not had any other problems.
WOW I’m glad out of the RV lifestyle. Excellent video thanks. 👍👍
Was just watching Josh the RV Nerd and came across your video. Every RV owner, soon to be owner and manufacturer should subscribe to this. I wonder if you would do this type of check with Class B & C models since I have not purchased yet. This is wonderful for people that don't know what to look for or aren't handy or females. Keep up the good work!
Awesome video! Please continue this excellent work we need more people to know about this kind of thing! ❤️
Great stuff, thanks for all you do to bring us this info.
I have replumbed 3 RV that use the pex crimp on flex hose. It leaks everytime - thx for pointing this issue out in your video
As an RV inspector, I appreciate hearing your comments. The plumbing is something I wasn’t aware of. I assumed the brass fittings for the Brinkley was an upgrade. Wow! Thank you!
I don't really have to repair plastic PEX fittings. Brass is better if you plan to freeze the whole water system, but plastic is fine for the intended use. But PEX fitting with a flex hose crimped on...that is a potential leak and does not conform to NFPA 1192 7.3.2.2. The RVIA is not enforcing the code they adopt which is not just a shame, but more of a crime as many water leaks as it causes. Especially when a flex hose pops off of the water heater because the heat made it too soft to grip the PEX fitting any more. I hope that the industry will change as allowing bad plumbing is not fair to consumers. Thanks for watching!
Excellent video. I'm really happy I found your video at the beginning of my RV search.
Glad it was helpful!
Thanks for your brilliant work, I'd love to see more videos.
My Alliance Avenue has perfect fit n finish, not one thing out of place. So far no issues with the only schwenteck bedroom slide. Fingers crossed 🤞. Top notch customer service! No plumbing issues with either bathroom, counters holding up nicely n we've been living full time for almost a year! Still looks brand new!
I heard schwenteck is one of the worst slide system. When the slides have had problems on all kinds of RV this is the worst one that keeps getting stuck or becomes off balance, etc....
Well, we just bought a reflection 100. Took it out for the first time this past weekend. Just upgraded from an imagine 2400bhwe. So far, no major issues. Couple minor issues. Definitely will be keeping an eye on the plumbing...
thank you, grand design was on my mind. it looks like a really nice rig, but it's important to know what's behind the walls too.
Thanks for the honesty! Where can I find you when my as yet not purchased 5th wheel breaks down? Which of the (imperfect) units would YOU buy?
Just found your RUclips channel! It’s been a big help. My wife and I love camping and currently have a 2007 Jayco Eagle. We love the trailer but this last year we have put some major money into repairs. (Brakes, front landing jacks and new max air vents) I don’t look at this as a bad design just wear and tear. BUT I’m retiring I two years and we are going to buy a new 5th wheel. Not for full time living, but for some long Campout in the summer. Why am I dragging on about this. We love your content and will use you advice and knowledge as we keep looking for our next RV. As of now. We like the Montana 311rd and a similar Durango Gold. I haven’t heard you talk about either of those brands? If I just missed it, please forward that segment if you can. Keep up the great job!
I have not published reviews on Montana or Durango Gold yet, but that is coming!
Regarding landing jacks, it is common that those get damaged by improper use which is why I have a module on that specifically in my Tool Free RV Maintenance course.
Thanks for watching!
😱 holy cow, subbed! Use to have a GD lol! But this video is awesome. Gotta find your plumbing vid now. 🍻
At least we know what to look for. I will check my plumbing this week.
I could not agree more with all you said and for me the number one no go for buying an RV is the water system. We all know how much damage and what a pain is when you have a leak. I walk in and look at that first, if it is a no go in the area alone I walk right out. I don’t look at anything else. I don’t want the headache.
Great channel and I love the comparisons. You should do a Keystone Montana high country 351BH vs a Keystone cougar vs a Grand design 324MBS!
Have you performed any reviews on Luxe RV’s? I would be very interested to hear your opinion concerning their 5th wheels.
337RL Grand Design year 2021 has been EXCELLENT for us! We love it!
I have a 2021 Solitude S-class 2930 - just got finished fixing a plumbing issue and am replacing the flex line with led wherever I can. I invested in Govee leak sensors (have 6 placed throughout) - the recent plumbing leak was detected by the Govee leak sensor. It was caused by a seal in a threaded fitting that would leak when the hot water heater was activated - the cold water pressure increased causing the fitting to leak some.
I replaced some of the flex line with pex while I was in there.::
I have been eagerly awaiting this video because we, like a lot of folks, are weighing these three options. We went to the Hershey show and looked at all of them and I concur on the fit and finish. They all look good in a 360 tour on their websites but the Brinkley stands way out in person. Hopefully they address that potential plumbing issue. I think it's fair to point out that the GD is $15K more than the competition. Not sure what they're charging for. Hey, at about 10:39 you say you give the Brinkley a 0 out 10 on slides but I think you're still talking about the Avenue. Correct me if I'm wrong. Thanks for making these videos!
Sorry for the confusion. The way I edited it does make it sound like I'm saying "I give a 0/10 on the Brinkley" but what I was actually saying is "I give it a 0/10 [on the Avenue]. On the Brinkley, they are using a....." Skip to 10:56 to see the scores. Thanks for watching!
Outriggers on my KZ bent, it's old so bolted wood to each side, jacked up side of the camper and cranked the bolts until Outrigger straightened
Wow that was so helpful my husband loved the GD 2930rl they just discontinued. And we aren’t ready yet the Brinkley 2900 is a very close floor plan but we haven’t seen one yet. So guess we are going back to the drawing board.
I guess we got a GD unit that was built at the right time in 2021. We are fill time for over 2.5 years. Never had any plumbing issue to date. Maybe when the GD service center checked the system, while it was in for warranty work, that helped(?). Now I also keep our water pressure(45-50 psi vs 55 psi) a little bit under the 'max'.
Great Video, totally agree with the plumbing, also one other thing is the suspension on all these RV's a weak point. We have upgraded 8K axels and disk brakes and were still just barely under our weight limit. Any 5th wheel should come with a minimum 10,000 lb axels or at least give you the option for them. the 1& 3/4 leaf springs should only be put on utility trailers not something that weighs between 13,000 and 20,000 lbs. The wet bolts are terrible, you can't lube half of them because either the sewer pipe is in the way and you can't get the grease gun up in there to lube it OR the brass bushings are completely destroyed after 500 miles and they won't take any lube. It's such a garage system, they all need something way better. Im going with Morryde independent suspension on our next rig. I spoke with Morryde and they said there's are 9,000 lb axels so that's great news.
Keep in mind that >20% of the weight of a fifth wheel is on the tow vehicle and not the axles. I have a 15,000 gross weight fifth wheel and it came with 7,000 pound axles, that might seem too low, but over 3,000 pounds is on the pin, so the axles never see more than 12,000 pounds. When I put in disc brakes I did upgrade the outer bearings so the axles are now 8,000 pound rated, but even the 7,000 pound axles provided 2,000 of extra capacity versus what they should ever see.
Just subscribed, great topic! I'm in the market for a used 5th wheel and this popped up in my feed. I will be parking it permanently at the lake and there are only 3 things that matter to me. Roof, plumbing and AC....
Next review suggestion: Northwood Arctic Fox 27-5L. One of a very few that are built to last and have superior cold weather performance. I'd be interested to see your assessment (also one of the few who aren't in Elkhart)
Well, great my Brinkley Z3610 gets delivered next week. Seems like everything but the plumbing and the water heater sensor did well.
Are you getting a full independent inspection? Would you come back and share your findings if you did? I emailed my Brinkley contact over the weekend and they said they saw this video already.
Thank you for your honesty!! We love your insight on all things RV. Have you reviewed the InTech Terra Willow 26ft travel trailer? They seem like they’re building a solid unit.
I've not yet, but just added to my list. Thanks for watching!
This was great!!!! Alot of information to look at for other brand trailers. Currently I am in the market for newer trailer and I am looking at the Heartland Torque T285, love the layout, after watching this video I am definitely going look it more over. I currently have a 2009 Weekend Warrior FS2500, so going to the Heartland will be a major step up, but I dont want to drop big bucks on poor quality.
I can't wait for you to do a next round of 5th wheel trailers. I know it takes a lot of time but dam this is great. I pray you go through them all.
Would love to see comp on a Cougar vs Reflection
This is fantastic. Potential plumbing disasters are a death nell for RVs. This helps us soooo much when looking at buying an RV.
I think u are honest and tell it like it is good job I'm a follower now
I've long been an GD fan just due to what I can see. But I never knew that how bad they were doing plumbing. Wish you do this on more travel trailer or smaller units such as the NuCamp Barefoot
Great review!! Thank you for taking your time to help us all spend our hard earned money in a better way. 🙂
I walked an Alliance Paradigm recently, and all the drawers in the kitchen were tilted out at the bottom, giving it a washboard appearance among many other finish issues.
What is your grade for the side wall construction of these three manufacturers?
Thanks! That is kind of you to say😊
Regarding wall construction, I really can't comment on quality without seeing inside the walls and checking welds. I think they all have aluminum frames which is theoretically better quality than wood frame, but either way it is essential that every seam be properly sealed to prevent water damage.
Great video. Spot on about Alliance. I own a 310RL and QC is not a strong suit for them. It is a good RV though but just too pricey.
Thanks for the video. Great insight.
Did you ever inspect a Durango Gold rv?
Thanks for the helpful video! From what I understand grand design has moved away from the schwintek slides (thanks goodness) at least in the models we’ve looked at. Very concerned about the plumbing now and glad you’ve brought this to light. I hope they’ll modify this in the future.
God thank you for pointing out the plumbing. Been loving my grand design for the most part, but they don't know how to do plumbing at all. Has cost me hundreds in diy repairs on leaking lines in multiple places, that ruins all the mdf constructed cabinetry. And they put one of the main electronic control box right under the bathroom sink plumbing with 0 water protection. If I had to pay a professional for repairs I would easily be looking at thousands by now.
I am very impressed with your analysis of rv's. Well done. Please, please do a report on outdoors rv. Specifically the 25 rds but i would think they are all similar. Thanks.
Awesome video! super informative!
Glad it was helpful!
Thank You - Appreciate You / Show. Very Imformnative 👍🏼
Glad it was helpful!
Great video!! Full of truth thru and thru!! Grand design imagine owner here 2022 2400bh. Very disappointed with the quality of this unit. I know these things can't be built to the same standards as an actual home but come on the craftsmanship is like something my toddler would slap together. What happened to quality control??? It's non existent these days.. Clearly there's little to no pride on the production line and the lack thereof shows. I'm glad I'm handy to be able to fix most of the issues with my RV but why should I have too for the high price point?????? This is just my 2 cents
I was all set to get a Brinkley 2900, went to see it at the Hershey show. You were lucky to get a unit with nice fit and finish. The unit they brought to the show was a mess of misaligned cabinet doors, and showed a lack of foresight for installing an actual entertainment system. The excuse from the factory rep was that everyone has those problems. WRONG ANSWER! Two GD solitudes at two different dealers had washer dryer doors that would not latch, and water closet side storage doors with more misalignment than my 17 year old Montana. Don't even get me started on the ugly sealer job on the front cap. Wood trim around the slide still had saw marks on it. Off the list they fell as well. Montana and Paradigm looked PRETTY good, but Keystone customer support is a nightmare, and in my area, Camping World is their dealer. I appreciate good support, especially for all the small stuff that comes up, and don't want to be mugged the Chicago mobsters, which currently leaves me with Alliance. Do you have any thoughts on the KZ Durango Gold?
Awesome video . I now know why certain celeb YT grand design have / had such tremendous water troubles.
Yup! Because the plumbing is awful
Great content. Thanks for providing all the details.
You are welcome!
Thanks for the honest reviews backed up with expertise.
Awesome video! You hit on 3 of the 4 manufacturers I'm considering. Any change you can review Montana? Specifically, I'm considering the Montana 3123RL. I looked to see if you'd already reviewed Montana but didn't find a review of it. Thank you for helping protect those of us who aren't as fluent in the intricacies of RVs!
I have several other Montanas coming up this season but not that specific one. I've added it to my list for next season, thanks for watching!