1400 Shahed 136 Drone SWARM Vs NATO Patriot Battery | Digital Combat Simulator | DCS |
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- Опубликовано: 6 июл 2023
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The simple idea is, of course, to see what happens if the same swarm attacks a S400 site.
Could it work also against a CVBG Carrier Battle Group?
Please try it against iron-Dome too
And they said that Shahed136 destroyed 2 mig29 and 1 su27
Is this possible?!
Name of the soundtrack please! Amazing video
Crazy thing is that the whole 1400 drones are still cheaper at $20k a unit than 1 fighter jet lol
Ah, they're $20K at Middle East prices. At US DoD prices, they're $1M each.
@@csjrogerson2377buy them from Iran 😂
Yet a fighter jet or 2 could possibly have done this mission without any losses at all
@@knifeduck5336and you think the few rockets or missiles it can carry wouldn't have been intercepted? Or the plane itself if it comes to dropping bombs?
@@leon-vfonai7931Not a stealth fighter firing stealth missiles and stealth bombs
Cost of 1400 Shahed: 28 million USD
Cost of 1 Patriot missile: 4 million USD
So basically 1400 Shahed = 7 Patriot missiles
Correct.
Yeah but can a shahed shoot down a fighter jet? No. They have a place, but they are not a replacement for a Patriot battery
@@alphazuluzno one said they’re a replacement
they already shot down two ukrainian mig 29 tho :))))@@alphazuluz
so basically it is not the patriot hunting down shaheds
it is shaheds hunting patriots
Those CIWS opening up are always so beautiful, especially in dawn/dusk/night lighting
Spoken like a true Grunt. (That is not an insult.)
Do patriots standard have the Cram with them? And does this work well too against missiles that slip thru? (cruise, ballistic)
bro really predicted the future
Anyone else old enough to remember the old Atari classic "Missile Command"? Well if it had a final boss level, this would be it.
Missile Command?
Thanks, now i feel old af 🤣🤣🤣🤣
We have a local retro arcade that has it. its awesome.
It’s what John Connor was playing in T2 if anyone is unfamiliar
I was thinking it's more like the tank rush tactic from the original Command and Conquer.
Great video as always, GS. One realism change they could make with the DCS Shahed module would be to have the sound not be a sleek rocket sound, but to have it sound like a lawnmower engine. In large quanties, the sound of a swarm of flying lawnmowers might even cause some real dread like the Stukas did during WWII.
If you have an untamed loathing for mowing lawns (like i do), it will indeed cause dread.
Aren't they rocket assisted on take off? I also dread the ways of lawn mowing. And also washing dishes.
Veterans who survive will never be able to cut their grass or live in a suburban neighborhood again.
I think he used fast forward for a good portion of the video, otherwise they were going way faster than 120mph.
@@Nathan-vt1jznope, just cuts. The rocket sounds from the beginning were the rocket boosters, the whistling after was cause unlike what OP suggests, thise turboprops moving at 120mph do not sound like lawnmowers when you’re standing there watching em.
I feel like an offset line of CIWS would be very effective against slow moving weapons like that
You want to put your short range stuff out a ways on whatever the expected direction of attack is, it's called a primary target line
Until they need to reload.
@@11kungfu11yeah...that's true for everything though.
It is. Especially cruise missiles
I'd prefer 57mm aa guns.
Just imagine how much more effective this drones swarm would be if cruise missiles with radiation detection sensors were launched alongside it
Iran is a force to be reckoned with now they got nukes too 😮
Ah, last time I checked a Patriot battery doesn't usually (never) pack 1400 missiles so this is pretty much a foregone conclusion.
I looked up an LG 10,000 BTU air conditioner and this video was one of the options. I fail to see the relation but hey I like it!
Lol ur right that’s a weird thing to recommend this video on. I guess the RUclips algorithm is having an off day. Thanks for stopping by though.
The closer we get to 2025, the more technology is looking like Black Ops 2 .
I never thought I'd see a Macross Missile Massacre in DCS but here we are! Thanks!
Like the battle of Carrhae. There, too, the Persians defeated the Romans with tens of thousands of arrows and spears. it's really creepy.
Well I guess flack is back... But seriously, we have rifles and tank rounds that can be programed by the gun to explode at a given range deploying shrapnel in a specified direction or just burst in all directions. New age flack with this tech would be a great anti swarm counter measure.
I believe rheinmetall was already working on something similar to your idea.
@@SabertoothedFrostbite yeah its called the mantis, kinda like cram but it fires at targets and explodes into tungsten sub projectiles that can shred a target.
@@Justin-dv7ul and it's actually "deployed" or rather tested in the north of germany
And I have to admit, those turrets of the MANTIS look damn good
I think that's the German variant you are talking of...Mantis
It’s not flack, it’s flak which is an acronym for Flugabwehrkanone.
Cool video! I know a drone swarm is not what the Patriot system is designed to defend against. The new DEW’s are probably the best way to handle a drone swarm. It will be interesting to see how drone swarms and DEW’s are going to change the future of warfare.
It was a battle between $28mil and $1.1bil...that's terrifying
This makes me think of those 30mm German AA guns that unleash shrapnel from the sides of the shells as they fly.
really besides AA laser technology their main defense is their intel gathering tools seeing a large build up of these launch vehicles and pre-emptively striking them before they can launch
Or if each missile would carry multiple smaller warheads, instead of a single big warhead, that would deploy while at speed and be able to engage multiple targets at once. Even better if each sub-munition could communicate with the IADS for target deconfliction.
Preemptive strikes for sure- get to it Israel
Preemptive strikes is the best option but are not a guarantee. Those launcher can be, imo, be well hidden.
CIWS and passive defense might be the answer.
Dont forget GPS jamming, nor forget that the US controls Selective Availability, ie the ability to make GPS less accurate. No need for a pre-emptive strike, just make them miss the target or get lost.
The German Mantis System will solve the problem 😊
What an interesting video. Great cinematography and music as always. That's a huge amount of money spent. Damn those Shahed drones.
Gotta buy Raytheon and Lockheed stock ASAP
😂😂
I love the sound of geran in the morning... sounds like - victory
This makes me thankful we are dedicating so much R&D to DEWs, which is really the only defense against swarms like this.
Yup until they get into hands of pelosi/newsom gang and are used to burn down California (this happened)
Short range EMP pulsers and microwave emitters
@@usonumabeach300 Are MASERs still a thing? I read about them in some encyclopaedia back when they were more concept than anything
@@ettcha You don't really need MASERs for EMP do you? I know an Indian program using explosively pumped flux compression generators as an EMP warhead for a SDB-style air-dropped munition.
@@usonumabeach300I have been thinking the same thing, EMP’s and airspace denial.
Fantastic choice! That was gripping man. What a way to showcase modern warfare tactics.
8:18 That C-RAM quits like a hero 😔
Thank goodness that the new high-power anti-air LASER systems have recently been approved for deployment. Of course, ANY system can be overwhelmed, but at about $10 per shot, a strong defense will at least be a lot more affordable.
I imagine smth like an M163 or the Gepard would be a decent substitute, though nothing beats $10 per shor
I feel like with that amount of targets the lasers would over heat. Id say the best defense for that is simply good ol classic air burst munitions
@@CaptainSpacedOut it's been discovered that the new striker-based laser system is only limited by power. The heat dissipation is adequate for continuous use although it wouldn't be used that way. And all that would need to be done to overcome the instantaneous shot capacity from the capacitors would be to connect it directly to an installations power plant giving it an extremely long firing time.
Time to update the M51 Skysweeper.
Laser is now a real word and not an acronym, no need to spell it in all caps.
1. Sounds to me like you need more C-RAMs.
2. The patriot battery needs higher mobility.
3. Maybe create a patriot munition that is cheaper and has a shotgun effect.
4. Those Shaheds need to fly lower, maybe follow the terrain.
5. Overall, it looks to me like a very long range GRAD rocket barrage.
Given an attack like this hasn't happened yet I;d bet the patriots are already mobile enough to avoid it.
Did they quad pack PAC-3 CRI's in modern Patriot launchers? NASAMS with ESSM BII/AMRAAM and AIM-9X or python for mid-close range like tor or SEARAM and Iron Dome to assist the C-RAM's could be options to spread the load with some optimized for 'leakers'. Like the C-RAM was used as for heavy lifting in this sim.
DEW's will be on everyone's lips (fingertips?) but once they target lock they take a non-insignificant amount of time to 'burn-through' the weapon system or the warhead - one at a time per weapon - similar to CWIS/C-RAM, so they do have targeting-destruction refresh rates relative to # of targets incoming over a certain time and distance per system. They are not a perfect or magical panacea for saturation swarm attacks, but a very useful arrow in our quiver for such a task, when the technology has been matured sufficiently.
@@brendonwood7595Shaheed uses anti radiation seekers so if it sees radar somewhere it will target it
@@tanmaysingh267 then the easy solution is a radar transmitter, couple hundred metres of cable and a very cheap antenna. Decoy them all to a non target.
@@dannileigh6426Yes, PAC-3 CRIs, are slightly better and alot cheaper PAC-3s where are also 4 per tube.
The way the CRAM just gave up at 8:20😭😭😭
You make an interesting point with this video. I wonder if the USAF has any cluster munitions in mind for such scenarios.
I'd imagine going back and digging up some dedicated flak batteries would make more sense/be cheaper. It's not like there isn't almost 80 years of experience blowing up slow-flying prop planes out there...
They would see it on radar and bomb the launch site preemptively.
@@kirbyr558if they can do it, why do they don’t just bomb the Patriot site?
Burst missile
@@kirbyr558 you're going to see a truck on the ground, on a radar? Do you smoke crack?
So now you know how Custer felt like😟
This was awesome. The future counter will have to be ewar. Or lasers I guess.
I think The Iron Dome Laser system would fo it.
@@highlander723and/or the American DE M-SHORAD with a 50 kilowatt laser 😁
@@EricTheBlue2010 agreed. But I'm not sure we've made flak since Korea. Shouldn't be that hard to mass produce tho. Great idea!
imagine what a show it would be to watch this at night
@@renatoigmed its gonna look like a travis scott concert
Damn, Currenthill just pumps out great mods.
That was an amazing video. Job well done sir. Would love to see more of this.
So.... bring back barrage balloons and wire nets?
the intro of them launchng is the mosquitoes in my room coming at me while I'm sleeping
WW2 anti aircraft guns are gonna be making a comeback any moment now. Cant wait to see modern bofors and oerlikons lol
Seems we have returned to the need for AAA on mass aswell as SAM systems . Strange how warfare evolves .
How about electronic jamming?
The way to go seems to be lasers. Both the US and Israel decided to go that way for anti-swarm solutions because lasers are really cheap per shot (around $10) and they don’t really deplete. An example of such a solution for the US Army is the DE M-SHORAD (Directed Energy Maneuver SHOrt-Range Air Defense) based on the Stryker vehicle with a 50-kilowatt laser, and an example for Israel is the Iron Beam with a 150-kilowatt laser and its smaller version, the Lite Beam (7.5-kilowatt laser).
@@MaxIsStrange1 in my opinion an additional solution is to create a new weapon, manpads but which will be much cheaper since the target flies at low altitude and with a low speed and that all units should have. Like that large surfaces are covered since soldiers are scattered along the borders
@@steamconte4388 the problem is numbers. A new manpad would be great however it is inadequate since it requires dozens of soldiers at the exact same place to have the capacity of one M-shorad. It isn't practical.
@@MaxIsStrange1 yeah thats a good point . How far out are we from mass produced systems ready to go though ? i know isreal managed to make a full operational one just not sure if its been put into production .
Crazy! wow. GS, you created an amazing video mate!
I did a fireworks show during late evening in Causasus with a bunch of UFOs against Iron Dome and it was wonderful to watch lol.
6 launchers per truck, 233 trucks in order to launch all at the same time as a swarm. Good luck with that logistics. Interesting scenario though!
Shaheed 136 can be launched in many many platforms. By trucks, boats, on top of a toyota, one the ground especially for russia. Air launched. Large cargo ships.on top of a building.
The old saying "Quantity is its own Quality" is very apt.
The maximum we've been shelled is about 40 on New Year's Eve. Very nice fireshow. In this case - Skynex or Gepard will solve the problem if all these Shaheds are trying to hit the target in the same position. They intercept dron mostly from the first or second try so it's 10 ammos...
GPS spoofing, jamming, MASERs, microwave transmitters, laser defense systems, all would be more effective at stopping entire swarms in their tracks.
It looks like the night between years,
Happy new year! 🎉
Loitering munitions are one of THE key for future warfare.
That was really cool. Thanks.
That would be such a large radar signature.
Similar to a mass Kamakazi attack against a carrier task force. It works pretty well the first time. Then the superior force goes out and destroys all that shit on the ground before it can ever assemble en masse again.
send just one B-2 Spirit 🦇
LMAO. Pretty sure cranking up the radars on a Burke to max is enough to completely drown out the control signal on these toys and render them all inert.
Only works if you have a superior ground force in the first place.
There's no need to assemble en masse though. With anywhere close to the stated range, you can keep the launch vehicles spread out. You just need them to converge on the target at the same time. Command and control might be tricky, but there's no reason you could not relay the communications.
you sure you didn't miss the part where these can be loaded on commercial trucks that can be easily classified as civilian, and fly distances of up to 2000km?
Some Gepards with air burst rounds might work nicely on defense.
Phalanx systems as used in the video are much better and as i said used in the clip.
Can you imagine all the debris from this scenario? Raytheon investors would be happy about this expenditure.
The beauty of a bottomless defense budget.
I’m sure General Millie is on it. We are all 100% safe…
The problem is assembling the massive convoy of trucks without retaliation for setting up for an attack like this. It's almost like countermeasure like the Jeune École strategy, except the larger country with more resources can counter you with more things before you can even deploy. This idea is good in theory and against fixed targets, but it's not like the patriot battery is going to stick around for the dozen plus hours it takes these things to make it to them.
The point isn't the scale, because Patriot batteries also never deploy at a size like that. You can downscale this engagement with very similar results, thats the point imo.
@DerLoladin very true.
Though i would like to see this with the launchers and cwis spread out and placed in more optimal locations.
Assuming you this coming in the first place.
Good point. Also, an attack like this would be more effective if it were the opening phase of a manned aircraft strike. To me, it seems to be the least cost effective method of SEAD possible.
Well, with that range you don’t need to put all the trucks together firing from a single place, on smaller groups firing from different positions you could achieve the same effect
@@sergiotell8856 Time on Target...a well known artillery tactic to make counterbattery fire hard...
I liked this video. Alot better then the other guys doing same stuff. You don't talk whole time it's goin on and it's not paused alot. Keep it up GS
GS your videos is aways on point sir. Sometimes I just want to grab some popcorn. Great job
new type of vid, I like it!
I love your videos GS they’re so calming and they show planes, i aspire to be a fighter pilot some day and these are very entertaining keep up the good work congrats on almost 500k
Dude THAT WAS SO FREAKING AWESOME!!! BBRRRRRAAA!!! BBBAARRRUUMMM!!! DADOWWWWWW!!! SKKKEEEOOWW!!! BRAAATTT BRRATTTT!!! RAABBBOOOSSSHHH!!! SEEEOOOWWW!!! DADOWWWW!!! OMFG DUDE PLZ MORE!!! I JUST WENT PSYCHO FANBOY FOR THIS MECHANIZED OPERA OF EXPLOSIVE GREATNESS AND SADNESS!!! PLEASE PLEASE WE DEMAND MORE OF THIS!!! ANYTHING EVEN REMOTELY ALIKE EVEN FROM A SIDE EYE ASKEWED VIEW PLZ!!! PLZ!!!
better than all 2023 movies
I guess that is where a Laser Defense System like LaWS would be useful...
But wouldn't Iron Dome be more useful in that scenario as well?
Taking a break from all the flying huh😂😂😂
I was just really curious about this scenario tbh lol, my curiosity got the best of me.
@@GrowlingSidewinder
The three most terrifying minutes of that Patriot operator's life...
This has me curious about what a swarm versus squadron scenario might look like. What exists to counter, the attack of a swarm on ground, troops, Maple, resources, etc.?
Communications and sensor jamming? As there arent enough missiles and cwiz to handle this beast.
This is why we need things like Iron Beam. It's not economically viable to defend against these types of swarms with current anti-air tech.
At least the AMG survived. Those AMG guys are like roaches (in a loving way). They can survive a nuclear attack.
Reminds of the opening scene from The Gladiator with all the Roman flaming arrows in flight.
Considering that a patriot Missile is 4M USD each vs 20k each Shahed theres no way to defend against it without bankrupcy, and the C-RAMs would probably overheat or run out of ammo in this situation
I wonder How the Iron Dome system would do...
Probably fairly well. It was designed with saturation attacks from Hezbollah who are incidentally supplied largely by the Iranians.
@@Reaper_03-01 Those rockets, fired from Gaza are not from Iran, they are backyard-made in Gaza out of scrap. Each of them costs $50 max.
and thats why development of laser tech is our priority, as well as other short range to medium range platforms such as the M-SHORAD and multi mission launcher
Airborne cluster bomblets can be used in the patriot missile warhead. Also fragmentation type warheads. Something similar to a shotgun cartridge.
assuming theyre all gonna be next to each other like in the animation. im sure they will be shot from different direction.
A scenario many military planners are wide awake middle of the night thinking about
or even having nightmares about it thinking about a solution that doesn't break the budget of the State Ministry of Defense.
@@renatoigmed the solution is existing recon assets and moving the target. Why do you think there haven't been any strikes like this successfully carried out yet?
Volume wins... flawless victory.
I always find it funny how ineffective the CRAM is portrayed as in DCS
Now do the same but same thing with s400 and pantsir s1
Rapid Dragon vs S-400
I like this style of video as well as your dogfight videos. Great what if scenario. We all know the Shahed launchers would be destroyed before they could deploy but this is a cool scenario.
How? They can launch these almost 1000km away
@@hippoace the radar control units on modern surface to air interceptor missiles can see more than 1000km away.
I know that the most advanced AA platforms currently in the world can network multiple radar units together to expand the search area, even units that are dissimilar in nature such as a nearby destroyers long range radar or even a nearby AWACS providing electronic support
I dont think the worlds superpowers are really that threatened by some slightly-better-than-north-korea irrelevant 3rd world nation with delusions of gradeur.
I'd even go far as to say the US is itching to show iran just where it belongs on the global food chain. we've already seen the capabilities of the "mighty" russia and how it fairs against western hardware, what chance does a country poorer and worse equipped than the russians stand?
@@War_Daddy103 lol you forgot about LOS and curvature of earth. Shahed typically fly 500m or less.
@@hippoace datalink with AEW assets
Impressive by both sides. Now, since we know it's possible to do so, we can now compensate for it.
I've never been so mesmerized by 1.1 billion dollars on fire.
Yeah it just feels different lol
This is a job for the German Mantis. It has airburst munitions which would have a high chance of taking out more than one at a time for a fraction of the cost per shot. Considering it shoots rounds with tungsten balls inside of each round pretty much a shotgun round inside each round😂😂 so it would be cheaper and a lot more efficient and effective
China and Germany both invested in flak guns on tank treads
Your videos are top notch!
😱😱😱😱😱 More videos like this one, PLEASE !
Nice video but 1000 missiles intercepted? The patriot doesn’t have those many missiles to begin with. Just 8 launchers per battery (either 32 pac 2 or 128 pac 3 missiles) did you missed adding a 0 in all those comments?
Don't forget everything the cannons C-Ram intercepted in addition to the missiles.
I wonder how much warning the Patriot site would get of the incoming assault. How long does it take to move a Patriot site? At least the radar anyway.
more warning than it takes time to move would be my guess for anyone that owns a patriot battery. They would have airborne radar platforms as well.
to move the radar? minutes if all safeties are thrown into the wind, we can detect the incoming flying lawnmowers as theyre launched across the gulf, if we determine its a swarm attack that we possibly couldnt hope to defend against then the higher ups will determine to either stand and fight to the last missile, or pack up and leave and send everyone into bunkers to hold out, there would be more than enough time to do so
Then they are leaving a vulnerable valuable asset to become the target that the Patriots were set up to protect, like an airfield and surrounding aircrafts and personnel.
Dude the intro is epic!!!!
I have a feeling that coordinated drone attacks would happen from a lower altitude.
Like what happened in 2019.
Interesting scenario.....the Patriot did hold....The PAC 3 missiles are faster than people realize!...good job bro!
It'd be awesome if Habitual Linecrosser reviewed and gave an analysis of this.
Was just thinking about this. I mean the patriot afaik isn't made for this type of stuff but it shows a type of scenario that might happen.
The ass kicking that comes next: priceless. The world has never seen the US fight, except maybe Kasham.
So the Shahed flies much lower than in the vid, and Patriots were not made to defend against small loitering ammunitions. Especially at such low altitudes. The lauch of the Shaheds looks like something from Star Wars lol
PAC 4 version of Patriot was very well designed to also intercept small targets.
8:18 bro accepted his fate 🤧
LOL!!, I thought the same!!!
You are a fortune teller. It was done exactly as you predicted
1.3 B against only 28 million dollars 😂😂
They need some AOE for the zerg.
wonder if taxes would go up after the missile spam XD
Can you run it again but with the Shahed coming in from different directions and far more dispersion between them. seems like a single missile was taking out multiple Shaheds which isnt accurate.
That's what I suppose they do in reality, attack from different directions. In addition to the fact that the launchers of this version of the Patriot can only fire in one sector, not in all 360, to cover more they must deploy around, which reduces the number of missiles per sector.
I wonder, would flak batteries be effective against large swarms like this that fly close together?
Probably
In the near future laser weapons like the THEL will be able to help neutralize a swarm like this. It’s one or two pennies per shot and if you keep it plugged into a power source then it’ll keep firing forever
awesome vid, do more like it in the future plz=)
I can watch this video and then witness roughly the same thing the same night out of my window
There could be a significant arguement for the equivalent of rapid fire canister shot for final defensive fire in situations like this... gigantic rapid fire shotguns that just fire into a specific cone of sky with overlapping fields of fire. Nothing gets through.
Huge Patriot site! Thanks GS :)
Not enough reloads available to repel a second wave anyway.
They are going to need high speed laser anti-air weapons to handle asymmetric attacks such as swarm drone strikes.
A far cheaper and infinitely more effective counter-tactic is to pack up and more 500 m to a side.
I would move 5km to the side, just to be sure.
Or a false radar signal....
Triple smashed that like button for this one my dude, more like this please and thanks as always for creating so much outstanding content for us all to enjoy for free!