I've seen a truly disturbing amount of Anti-Semitic comments on this video so I wanna make this absolutely clear- If you make anti-semitic comments you will be banned from this channel. Fuck off with that shit!
Really? where does antisemitism fit into star trek? really confusing Star trek earth is how the world should be, one a unified earth built on mutual respect and a common human goal of exploration, knowledge, bettering the whole of our species.
@@ashleyeldorado7750 Chuds abound everywhere, even among the fandom built around one of the most conceptually progressive sci-fi universes. Steve Shives (from whence The Algorithm doubtless delivered me here) has dealt with the whole "get your SJW politics out of my silly sci-fi" phenomenon quite a bit in his Star Trek analysis videos.
It really ought to go without saying - and so, so sad that it must be said anyway. So, since it apparently must be - thank you for saying it. And more so, engaging in the labor of taking out the trash. I hate to imagine all the filth that you have to deal with so that we don't have to.
@Sir Ackbar You might be a little naive on this. I think you'll find that if you scratch the surface on these jokes, they're often reflective of an actual hatred and disgust, if you care to listen to the people making them, and ask them a few questions.
From one dimensional silly villains, to a three dimensional nuanced species. It's quite an epic journey. You've got to love Star Trek. And a lot of that is owed to Armin Shimerman.
To be all fair, many factions was made silly in TNG by replacing real world inspired factions with fantasy archetypes. In TOS we have Space America (Federation), Space Russia (Klingons) and Space Romans (Vulcans/Romulans) In TNG they are Space Empire, Space Barbarians, and Space Elves respectively. Space Goblins (Ferengi) and Space Undead (Borg) just followed the suit. In a hindsight, what DS9 writers did to make them look somehow realistic again, without breaking TNG lore, is nothing short of miracle work.
@Jimmy De'Souza I think the conclusions you are supposed to draw is that since Quark and Rom are greedy Ferengi but aren't completely and totally horrible, that it is their culture which is flawed, not them as a people.
Star Trek has always suffered from the Planet Of Hats trope. What makes Armin Shimerman & his DS9 family stand out is, you can see people under the hats.
His best imho was about how hypocritical the Federation is and about how they destroy individuality and different cultures just like the Borg and Dominion do, but with better pr.
@@xury12 You can find a full list of them online somewhere, I've seen them. Recognize that they were constructed by Hollywood writers intent on making Capitalism look bad, so they're not as consistent as you might want.
I really liked the moment when Quark went back to Fereginar and found his old Marauder Mo action figures. It was a nice callback to the original designs, and Quark playing with them was brilliant.
I liked that, too. I always hoped DS9 would establish that Armin Shimmerman's Ferengi from The Last Outpost was Quark's cousin. They could have poked fun at how silly the Ferengi military was.
When your show spans decades of lore and you really want to use something iconic. I don't see the issue with what Enterprise did. At least it didn't pull an STD or STP. Acquisition was, in fact, a decent episode and they never did really know much about the Ferengi in that episode and the Ferengi had never heard of Starfleet. It was innocent enough.
I always marvel with how many things DS9 did right with Star Trek, despite how much that show was supposedly antithetical to Roddenberry's vision of the series. Ferengi are just one of many examples of this in Trek.
The Ferengi ship design is actually reminiscent of their emblem, that of course looks like two opposing hands grasping the same object, to infer their greediness.
I think about the only time the Ferengi really "redeemed" themselves was one episode of DS9 where Quark and Sisko were stuck on some planet or something (I don't recall all the details) and Quark was defending the Ferengi culture to Sisko. He mentioned something along lines of "5000 years without war among our people. Can you humans say the same?"
Overall I think the Ferengi are a wonderful SciFi species. Much more complexly drawn than many others. But no one ever mentions that they are the sharpest dressers out there! (Cardassian Garek as tailor deserves mention here too) The colors, the fabrics, the patterns! So refreshing against a plethora of uniforms, or worse the continual same clothing items across an entire planet!
A friend pointed out how many of the metal collar adornments they wear are evocative of bow ties or Southern gentleman type string ties, which was somewhat revelatory to me. lol
@@williamdavis9562 Doubtful. Fashion is often rather silly, yes, but most people have personal sensibilities about our own appearances. Whether its as simple as preferring certain colors and/or materials, or as complex as feelings associated with historical context of different clothing styles, we all like to dress somewhat uniquely. It's part of our individuality, and I see no logical reason for it to ever go away.
@@williamdavis9562 Fashion is about expression. If you throw away fashion then you throw away art as well which at that point how are we any different from bland automatons?
There's a line in one of the old 'The Best of Trek' books written just before TNG aired, in which it's speculated that the major reason for the Klingon-Federation alliance was to counter the 'Ferengi threat' That did not age well
Nog's arc is, I think, one of the most compelling arcs in all of DS9. To see him go from trying to be a "good Ferengi" to realizing he is never going to be one, and finally to realizing he doesn't need to be one. Then, in the end, becoming incredibly successful by metrics he chose rather than the ones society tried to put on him. Also, I want to see Ishka and Lwaxana Troi working together on some plot. They would be completely unstoppable. Honestly, the Tal Shiar and Obsidian Order should have just took those two to the Founder's world. The war would have been over by dinner.
"Acquisition" is not really a continuity error. Prior to "The Last Outpost', it's established that there were many "rumors" about the Ferengi. They're even mentioned in "Encounter at Far Point" and are known to the Federation. "The Battle" established that there was at least unofficial contact with them. No reason that the events of "Acquisition" couldn't even be part of that long tradition of Ferengi lore, rumors and speculation.
And given the Borg's unusually low species designation for them, it's clear that at least some Ferengi were very far trveled. So a group of them being so far from home fits nicely as well.
@@OmegablueWolf and even though the Archer Enterprise crew had come across the name before there was nothing said about what they looked like or any tech or bio info
I've always wanted to write the scene of Archer and crew giving the mission report to Starfleet of their encounter with the strange big eared aliens that had giant tushies for heads...
I never liked them until DS9, I think making their culture basically the epitome of capitalism with all it's stereotypes not just intact but embraced, was a good move even if a little cheesy.
I am just so upset Nog is dead. His character was so tenderly rendered. I'm just a year older than Aron. And the guy who played the Grand Nagus is one of my favorite actors of all time. Such a sweet man, still with us.
I think the Farengi, as the 'space goblins' of Star Trek, actually had a big impact on how goblins in general are portrayed in other fantasy settings as well, when you look at modern portrayals of goblins in other media they can range from primal and violent to something not unlike DS9 Farengi
For sure a wise decision to reassign Ferengi as die-hard capitalists (with some minor exclusions) instead of main antagonists. I think it was a good idea having species like that, they might not be very likeable for several reasons but they definitely provided some sort of diversity into Star Trek universe... Anyway I`m disappointed not to see D`kora destroying a couple of Bird of Prey`s 🙃
Well they were still meant to be die-hard capitalists as the main antagonist, but I'm glad they're not both. I mean TNG is basically meant to show that socialism and social equality is the future and how we will eventually be prosperous. So of course the ferengi's were meant to be capitalist bad guys since capitalism is directly contrary to socialism.
@@1hybodus I`m sure TNG was meant to be communist since it`s the final stage that was never achieved as for now, whereas socialism is something in the middle of the way that took it`s place in certian countries, including mine. But this is just a lyrical digression. So yeah, the main diffeence between TNG Ferengi and DS9 is that the second ones wouldn`t attack the Federation flagship neither do other similar acts haha. Both were capitalists, true. I also didn`t like TNG Ferengi moved kinda like chimps which was too ridiculous
@@1hybodus Technically it’s not really socialism. Socialism (or at least how Karl Marx saw it) is when the workers rise up against the factory or business owners and take direct control of the businesses themselves, then the workers control the means of production.
Quark was possibly the most complex character in all of star trek. The way armin portrayed him was brilliant. I can't wait for him to return in season two of Picard. (Yes he'll reprise the role) There's a RUclips video of armin on a talkshow changing from himself to quark and how he got into character in real live is just amazing.
I hate the ferangi in the early characterisations, they were just ‘silly’ however in DSP 9, they were fantastic, full rich deep characters that developed nicely. Dax really helped support their role
I once read a comment which I am going to paraphrase here: "In TNG when I saw a Ferengi I thought 'oh no...', in DS9 when I saw a Ferengi I though 'alright, what's next?'".
How TNG treated the Ferengi really made that show feel very intolerant and sour, DS9 made them deeper and more relatable. TNG had a habit of portraying itself as woke and tolerant but anyone that was different was painted in a very unflattering light, and that often holds true in many parts of society today.
It's almost like the socialist view of "everyone who is like us and obeys our collective is a saint and anyone who violates our ideas of purity is Satan" is kind of part of why they can never create anything lasting.
I always thought of it as a product of Gene and the time he was born to. He was very forward thinking and progressive.... For his time. By the time of TNG he was old. He had not grown past where he was when he was younger and had in fact become stuck in his ways. Meanwhile those around him were half his age and as a result inherently more progressive thanks to having been exposed to a more liberal world and thus having developed deeper understandings and less surfical considerations of the topics. Whenever someone acts like gene was super progressive just remember: Gene didn't have to put all the women in "dresses", more appropriately called long shirts, that barely covered their bums while standing perfectly still let alone while active. (Yes some males wore the same outfit but it didn't make sense for either and that was highly uncommon)
TNG began in the mid-80s. This is b/4 the collapse of the Soviet Union; a collapse which vastly discredited socialist idealism, at least for a few years. Roddenberry insisted on portraying the TNG Federation as some kind of post-economic paradise, dedicated to art & intellectual pursuits. This quite different to the TOS Federation, there is no pretense of a perfect political order in the earlier series. If you look @ the examples Federation officials, at least the civilian ones, they are usually portrayed as obnoxious pompous asses. We have no sense the Federation is ideal. They have money, greed, ambition & narcissisml just an ordinary flawed human like society. The change of the Ferengi is a reflection of the rightward drift of the world post-Soviet Union.
It's too bad you didn't go to Las Vegas a couple of decades ago. The Hilton Casino and Resort had a whole Star Trek theme going, including Quark's Bar (where you could buy Klingon Blood Wine), and a motion simulator ride that included a live action Borg attack. I'm sure there was a Dabo game, but it's been a while, maybe not.
@@UncaAlbyGmail "live long and make profit" i believe was the motto at that establishment. (i saw a small piece about it on a commercial on the scifi channel many many years ago)
@@omnimonramone8459 that's because, unlike Kurtzman, MacFarlane is actually a fan of Star Trek. The Orville has people who have previously worked on Star Trek. He wanted to make an actual Star Trek show, but CBS turned him down in favor of Abrams. And, well, we can see how that's turning out.
@@mrtkeynotes7889 Ah yes, gore, excessive violence, and disrespecting everyone is a return to old Trek. Keep hanging onto this trash show as it gets cancelled, since no one wants to pay for it. Licensees have fled, CBS All Access is a complete failure. Netflix and Amazon want nothing further with NuTrek. All will be right in the world when Star Trek purges shills like you from the fanbase. Begone shill bot.
Umm... Also Deep Space 9, when it talked of the horrors of war, Voyager when they had to do moral corrupt things to get home. Star Trek's darkness did not start with Discovery or Picard. It started long before and it never left. Let's not forget that time Archer tortured a man, then later left a crew of innocents stranded to their possible deaths by stealing their warp coils
My main quibble with how the Ferenghi were portrayed isn't really with Ferenghi themselves (although I agree with pretty much every point in this video); it's with the way the crew of the Enterprise reacted to them. S2:EP5, The Perfect Mate, was problematic for a lot of reasons many other people have named. But it caught my eye when they beam the two "stranded" Ferenghi on board and Riker says, "Find them a room far away from mine" or words to that effect. For their ongoing claims to have eliminated racism, that stood out to me even as a kid. Like Lily said in First Contact, where were your "evolved sensibilities" then?
As a kid, I always referred to them as "butt-heads", whenever I mentioned them to my mother. I haven't seen this show in years and looking at them now, I can see why I referred to them as such haha.
Funny how they were going to portray the main villains as the ultimate capitalists (The Ferengi) but ended up with the main villains being the ultimate communists (The Borg).
Even in TNG the last outpost wasn't the actual first encounter with the ferangi. Just the first official one. The whole story of the Stargazer was that Picard lost it after a battle with an unknown assailant that ended up being the Ferangi.
My wife and I record most of our tv programs and that includes DS9. If it has Ferengi involvement it will be watched first!! I understand the introduction and involvement of Ferengi is a bit out of context but it really doesn't matter to us.
I hope Armin understands that lots of fans just chalk up The Last Outpost to the “early-installment weirdness” that always exists in Sci-Fi. Rather than any complaint about his particular performance.
I agree that the shift in tone the species took in DS9 was a huge improvement but, one thing from their original appearance I'd have liked to see retained is those Marauder starships. It would make sense to see the Grand Nagus transported by one.
I personal head canon for how the original TNG Ferengi were so different from the DS9 ones, was that these were Ferengi on the fringe of their own territory. And that puts makes them rough and almost pirate like because of their distance from centers of commerce, they would be viewed as unsophisticated hicks by other Ferengi for their clumsy negotiating and resorting to force and cowardice so quickly. Where the Federation sends it's best at the frontier, the Ferengi send their worst.
I like how Startrek makes first contact with aliens they only heard of. They dont understand each other's culture so it can lead to conflict. Then by the next series they either have a truce or are allies. Its also interesting that even when people are doing their best to be open, there can be biases that get ingrained. Worf was loved and given every chance to be whatever he wanted to be. He wanted to be Klingon, but for some reason he thought they were angry all the time, that they only cared about fighting. Then he meets them, and find its all been a romantic ideal made up by clues instead of conversation. The Klingons care about being honorable, more or less, at least the perception of it, its a powerful political tool. And the fighting? Well, they want to be remembered, and it takes grandiose actions to do it. The cost is often death. They don't want to die, but they aren't lying to themselves about whether itll happen or not. Rather than cry about it, their humor is very dark. The laughter is often louder than it makes sense to be, strained, and bitter.
I have always found them to be pretty much completely silly. It's as if they tried to make them menacing and people found them silly, so they just leaned in to that silliness. While there were some serious, even poignant moments in DS9, there was still decidedly more Grand Nagus and Brunt silliness. They are silly, just silly.
A Ferengi was on the bridge once.. true it was the episode where Warff is traveling in many dimensions of possibility but for one brief alternate universe, he's on the helm with one as I think navigator. :3
The Ferengi are French. Hear me out... As mentioned in the video, "farangi" is the Arabic word for foreigner. Interesting because "farang" in the Thai language is also used for foreigners. The word, "farang" in Thai is the derived from the word for "FRENCH," as that is who was attempting to invade... long story. Thus, the Ferengi are French.
REQUEST: Please watch and review "Eureka" and "Warehouse 13". We lost both of these so SciFy could pay for "Defiance" which was interesting, but not as good IMHO.
I noticed that the introduction of the cardassians actually seems to have replaced the ferengi war with the cardassian war, as the stargazer was a ship that until the cardassian introduction, only was mentioned when it battled ferengi.
There were missed opportunities with the Ferengi on DS9. Suppose, during the wars with the Dominion ( or the Borg) that the Ferengi Fleet shows up on the pretense that “Any percent of nothing is still nothing”. The Ferengi would be well justified with handling the supply lines and contributing troops and technology because they don’t want to be conquered next after the Federation.
Too many comments to see if this is mentioned previously. The creators of the TNG Ferengi and Cardassians had somebody around them who knew modern Greek. Both races are almost the exact opposites of the closest related Greek word, so its like some kind of a practical joke. In modern Greek "Ferengios" means reliable, scrupulously honest and trustworthy... how's that for a complete polarity reversal? Similarly, "Kardassis" means one with a big open heart, warm and emotional. Also the people from Thessaloniki region where I once worked are called by that moniker. Have you ever seen a Cardassian other than Gul Dukat or Garak smile? Another practical joke played on us. Somebody involved with TNG clearly knew Greek...
"Go on do it, kill me. That's what you want isn't it? This fight might as well be an execution. The only reason why you want me to fight is so you can have your precious honor. Well I'm not gonna make it that easy for you. So go on, kill me. And when you tell your children how your house rose to power remember it was because you murdered a helpless unarmed Ferengi." - Quark to Klingon High Council.
there is a mistake here, Farangi is not an Arabic word, but a Persian word ,Farang (فرنگ) is a Persian and southeast Asian word that originally referred to the Franks (the major Germanic tribe) and later came to refer to Europeans in general. The word "Farang" is a cognate and originates from old french: "franc".
Yes, the rootbeer speech given by Quark is memorable. I noticed a couple others while rewatching ST:DS9.In the episode where Sisko and Quark were captured on a planet by the Jem/Dominion Quark said that post capitalist Federation Humans saw themselves superior to Ferengi because they are reminded of how they used to be except Quark added Ferengi were better than humans because never put their own in concentration camps or exterminated whole civilizations on their homeworld.
Making Ferengi bad guys again(in some new series) can be done, but it has to be done correctly. Turn down the goofiness(as mentioned) and turn up the viciousness. All of this while keeping Ferengi characters like Quark and Rom who are civilian business owners. Civilian Ferengi can remain (somewhat) personable while military Ferengi remain vicious.
I see some folk still don't know I have other channels, so here are some links - Gaming Channel - ruclips.net/channel/UC4AQjWVhQBOoHlOrKn_SJqA Second Channel - ruclips.net/channel/UCuRTWD6C2lqy-y-0HMwRoNQ
I want to say that DS9 is also MY favorite Star Trek. I also think Armin Shimerman was absolutely FANTASTIC as Quark - he was one of my favorite characters. And "Little Green Men," as well as "Business as Usual" are some of my favorite episodes.
It's kind of funny how the Ferengi were introduced as the big threat, evil and almost bestial characters in TNG, then by the end of DS-9 they were had become comic relief, more fun and silly than any sort of serious threat.
I would like to think that most ‘first contact’ situations are actually the 5th or tenth contact with a lot of undocumented and unofficial contacts, some of which inevitably being due to time travel. After all, Vulcans had been on earth several times in the 20th century with Spock regularly time traveling as well as the carbon creek incident.
I've always imagined the Ferengi to be like modern day americans (or at least financial-political conservatives) and Ferenginar to be a reflection of modern day america. I dunno, it seems that maybe Gene could see the writing on the wall and even though america's embrace with capitalism was still- relatively- benign back in the 80s, he could see that the nation and its people were heading inexorably towards the most extreme form of extreme capitalism and so he wrote the Ferengi as both pointed political commentary AND a warning. Maybe he could see that currency was fast becoming the newest religion among americans and so decided to make the Ferengi spirituality and afterlife be all about money/ currency, again as both commentary and a warning; a prediction of 21st century america...
Ah, yes, the Ferengi. The race I got one glimpse of when older family members were watching "Star Tracks", as 6-year-old me thought it was called, and I was like "Nope! Not watching any show that has anything that ugly in it!"
I saw a post online once that was something like “when you’ve watched enough Star Trek to find some of the weird aliens hot” and showed Garak and Weyoun and Shran and a couple others, lol
I liked the original version. They were really alien and different. But Star Trek writers as always can't handle alieness and instead formed them into humans with funny makeup and running gags, like what happened with all other aliens in Star Trek. Instead of making a way so that we understand their alien nature better.
they didnt have the budget to make aliens alien. so vast majority of species are humanoids with different foreheads or something. same way as they didnt have the budget to make spaceships land on planets. hence they resorted to teleportation
One thing I’ve come to wonder is that typically in fiction is that species or cultures that are portrayed as inherently greedy are portrayed as hyper capitalists as a critique of capitalism. But from a world building perspective wouldn’t such a species/culture trend more towards socialism than capitalism? After all if a species/culture truly was driven by a desire to acquire wealth why would they embrace a system where they give up the vast majority of the wealth produced by their labor to a small handful of individuals. Wouldn’t make more sense for them to embrace a system that allows the individuals to maximize their individual power through collective bargaining and voting? Now one could argue an inherently greedy species would be selfish and lack the pro-social tendencies in order to form unions and co-ops. However if that were true than this species would not be able to form any kind of civilization. As they would lack the ability for even simple organization. If your species is to anti-social to form a small collective whose leaders are elected by popular vote to represent their interests (I.E a union) than its not going to be able to form of large scale civilization.
Yes, have you ever read Animal Farm.....where the pigs stood on their hind legs at the end and you couldn't tell the difference between the humans and the pigs. There are always a few bullies that will run the show in a socialist (communist) gov't and they take over, look at China, USSR, N.Korea and how the people are really treated, manipulated and who's in charge.
I'm not a big fan of the Ferengi. They have their moments and uses for the sake of storytelling, and the lore is solid enough, but I usually don't like Ferengi episodes much.
If your only experience with Romulans is from watching CBS/Kurtzman 'faux-trek', then your statement is totally accurate. But the Roms were definitely fleshed out in TNG and DS9.
Ferengi became comic relief for the most part, but DS9 really did give them some nuance and dignity, especially when Quark says to Sisko that, for all humanity's snobbery towards their way of life, they never stooped to the barbarity that we had in the past. It seems to be a mirror of how Humans were initially looked down on by Vulcans as being reckless and dangerous, when they nearly drove themselves to extinction centuries before.
I think of the first appearance Ferengi as their soldiers. Like maybe the Ferengi has a very strange and primitive form of martial arts that only the fighters learn that just looks weird. A majority of the people are capitalists and conmen, but maybe the one that don't have the lobes enlist as fighters. Quark has the action figures of those Ferengis with the laser whips. I do like their appearance in Enterprise. The crew never find out what they were so it doesn't contradict Next Generations. Just like the Borg episode.
i hope you can help me with this one ... this is a question i have for many years now .. the bluray of tng have no japanese audio but i know the japanese audio exists since i have a bluray backup file of a bluray of tng several episodes with japanese audio .. when you ask others they streight out say it doesnt exist in japanese well it does ... now the thing is i have deep space 9 in 5 languages english german spanish italian french .. and im wondering if there are more translation of ds9 available for example russian chinese japanese .. anything else. do you have any information that might hint to some aditional translation (not just subtext) whole audio into other languages .. any information are welcome thx in advance
I was under the impression that Ferengi was derived from the Persian/Farsi word for foreigner which would be Farang or Farangj. Though it would be more closer to the Hindi "Firangi". Not sure, just a thought.
Deep space nine really made the Ferengi a lovable race. Quark while greedy is very much product of the ferengi culture and has his own moral code that he follows.
Oddly enough, DS9 cannot help their socialist leanings and turned The ferengi race much more liberal and social program leaning. The ferengi episodes in DS9 are some of the best
I would like to see a conversation between the ferengi Quark, the bar owner from Deep Space Nine, and the human Ralph Offenhouse, from the TNG episode "The Neutral Zone".
fun fact in the EU Offenhouse became the federation advisor on the Ferengi. Federation anthropologists couldn't make heads or tails on how the Ferengi acted until Offenhouse enlightened them.
@@toomanyaccounts, this is excellent. Exactly what I tought could happen. I hope that mr. Offenhouse have fond some new meaning in his life by serving the Federation in this way.
TNG novel Debtors Planet by W. Thompson has Offenhouse acting as the Federations ambassador negotiating with the Ferengi (who are closet Cardassian minions) in this manner...
i hated the ferengi when i first seen them in star trek from their whines and screams to their selfish ways i just couldnt stand them . BUTT in deep space 9 i absolutely loved Quark and Nog it has always thrown me off a bit they never Followed Nog on his journey to become Captain like that has really bothered me i think they could of made alot of great stories with it and i really want to see Quark make an appearance or 2 in piccard season 2 that would really be epic in my opinion
I've seen a truly disturbing amount of Anti-Semitic comments on this video so I wanna make this absolutely clear-
If you make anti-semitic comments you will be banned from this channel.
Fuck off with that shit!
Really? where does antisemitism fit into star trek? really confusing Star trek earth is how the world should be, one a unified earth built on mutual respect and a common human goal of exploration, knowledge, bettering the whole of our species.
@@ashleyeldorado7750 Chuds abound everywhere, even among the fandom built around one of the most conceptually progressive sci-fi universes.
Steve Shives (from whence The Algorithm doubtless delivered me here) has dealt with the whole "get your SJW politics out of my silly sci-fi" phenomenon quite a bit in his Star Trek analysis videos.
It really ought to go without saying - and so, so sad that it must be said anyway. So, since it apparently must be - thank you for saying it.
And more so, engaging in the labor of taking out the trash. I hate to imagine all the filth that you have to deal with so that we don't have to.
@Sir Ackbar You might be a little naive on this. I think you'll find that if you scratch the surface on these jokes, they're often reflective of an actual hatred and disgust, if you care to listen to the people making them, and ask them a few questions.
I can't believe there are Star Trek fans who are racists filled with hate. It's so absurd
From one dimensional silly villains, to a three dimensional nuanced species. It's quite an epic journey. You've got to love Star Trek. And a lot of that is owed to Armin Shimerman.
Thank you Armin!!,great job brother!😊
To be all fair, many factions was made silly in TNG by replacing real world inspired factions with fantasy archetypes.
In TOS we have Space America (Federation), Space Russia (Klingons) and Space Romans (Vulcans/Romulans)
In TNG they are Space Empire, Space Barbarians, and Space Elves respectively. Space Goblins (Ferengi) and Space Undead (Borg) just followed the suit.
In a hindsight, what DS9 writers did to make them look somehow realistic again, without breaking TNG lore, is nothing short of miracle work.
be assured, with the modern ST ,its right back to one dimensional silly villains.
@Jimmy De'Souza I think the conclusions you are supposed to draw is that since Quark and Rom are greedy Ferengi but aren't completely and totally horrible, that it is their culture which is flawed, not them as a people.
Star Trek has always suffered from the Planet Of Hats trope. What makes Armin Shimerman & his DS9 family stand out is, you can see people under the hats.
Quark had some Picard quality speeches
and a literal Picard speech near the end
His best imho was about how hypocritical the Federation is and about how they destroy individuality and different cultures just like the Borg and Dominion do, but with better pr.
And one lifted word for word.... Which rule of acquisition covers that?
@@lucasvincent2875 Oh probably the mid 100's or so. Heh heh. Actually I'd love to see a full list of all of them. The ones I've seen are fragmented.
@@xury12 You can find a full list of them online somewhere, I've seen them. Recognize that they were constructed by Hollywood writers intent on making Capitalism look bad, so they're not as consistent as you might want.
You know it’s gonna be a good episode when you hear “Liquidator Brunt, FCA”
Strange. We have a FCA (Financial Conduct Authority) in the UK with similar extensive powers 😂
"I don't want to be around these, POOR, people."
I really liked the moment when Quark went back to Fereginar and found his old Marauder Mo action figures. It was a nice callback to the original designs, and Quark playing with them was brilliant.
Marauder Mo, Ferenginar's G.I. Joe!
CSGraves Profit is half the battle! 😎
I liked that, too. I always hoped DS9 would establish that Armin Shimmerman's Ferengi from The Last Outpost was Quark's cousin. They could have poked fun at how silly the Ferengi military was.
@Afqwa wasn't that Leck
@Afqwa Except the Klingon Chef on DS9.
A continuity error in enterprise? Why I've never herd of such an outlandish statement
Continuity is non existent in star trek by design lol
When your show spans decades of lore and you really want to use something iconic. I don't see the issue with what Enterprise did. At least it didn't pull an STD or STP.
Acquisition was, in fact, a decent episode and they never did really know much about the Ferengi in that episode and the Ferengi had never heard of Starfleet. It was innocent enough.
I always marvel with how many things DS9 did right with Star Trek, despite how much that show was supposedly antithetical to Roddenberry's vision of the series. Ferengi are just one of many examples of this in Trek.
Not going to lie, the Ferengi stun whip is awesome! And they still fly around in croissants which I love.
The stun whip and the marauder are awesome :)
I still use the whip in STO.
The Ferengi ship design is actually reminiscent of their emblem, that of course looks like two opposing hands grasping the same object, to infer their greediness.
Its taken 25 years for me to come to fully realize this, but Quark is the best written and most 3 dimensional character in all of Star Trek
Quark, Rom and Nog are some of my favorite characters in all of Trek.
@Super Abound, agreed.
Quark added an element of depth to the show.
I think about the only time the Ferengi really "redeemed" themselves was one episode of DS9 where Quark and Sisko were stuck on some planet or something (I don't recall all the details) and Quark was defending the Ferengi culture to Sisko. He mentioned something along lines of "5000 years without war among our people. Can you humans say the same?"
Indeed, that was well done.
Which seems to break the 34th Rule Of Acquisition: War is good for business.
@@ryandowney8743 but it agrees with the 35th rule “peace is good for business”
@@ryandowney8743 And rule #76!
Of course Quark leaves out the rampant and legally enforced sexism ...
Overall I think the Ferengi are a wonderful SciFi species. Much more complexly drawn than many others. But no one ever mentions that they are the sharpest dressers out there! (Cardassian Garek as tailor deserves mention here too) The colors, the fabrics, the patterns! So refreshing against a plethora of uniforms, or worse the continual same clothing items across an entire planet!
A friend pointed out how many of the metal collar adornments they wear are evocative of bow ties or Southern gentleman type string ties, which was somewhat revelatory to me. lol
I'd imagine as a species evolves to a point they can travel the stars irrelevant, childish and backward concepts like fashion are cast away.
@@kaitlyn__L 0+l
@@williamdavis9562 Doubtful. Fashion is often rather silly, yes, but most people have personal sensibilities about our own appearances.
Whether its as simple as preferring certain colors and/or materials, or as complex as feelings associated with historical context of different clothing styles, we all like to dress somewhat uniquely. It's part of our individuality, and I see no logical reason for it to ever go away.
@@williamdavis9562 Fashion is about expression. If you throw away fashion then you throw away art as well which at that point how are we any different from bland automatons?
There's a line in one of the old 'The Best of Trek' books written just before TNG aired, in which it's speculated that the major reason for the Klingon-Federation alliance was to counter the 'Ferengi threat'
That did not age well
The Ferengi were made awesome in DS9. Also how could you forget "Little Green Men?"
*slaps ear*
They showed a brief clip from it tho
"It's poisonous. Also highly addictive."
Nog's arc is, I think, one of the most compelling arcs in all of DS9. To see him go from trying to be a "good Ferengi" to realizing he is never going to be one, and finally to realizing he doesn't need to be one. Then, in the end, becoming incredibly successful by metrics he chose rather than the ones society tried to put on him.
Also, I want to see Ishka and Lwaxana Troi working together on some plot. They would be completely unstoppable. Honestly, the Tal Shiar and Obsidian Order should have just took those two to the Founder's world. The war would have been over by dinner.
"Acquisition" is not really a continuity error. Prior to "The Last Outpost', it's established that there were many "rumors" about the Ferengi. They're even mentioned in "Encounter at Far Point" and are known to the Federation. "The Battle" established that there was at least unofficial contact with them. No reason that the events of "Acquisition" couldn't even be part of that long tradition of Ferengi lore, rumors and speculation.
And given the Borg's unusually low species designation for them, it's clear that at least some Ferengi were very far trveled. So a group of them being so far from home fits nicely as well.
Plus the Ferengi in Acquisition never mention their species name.
@@OmegablueWolf and even though the Archer Enterprise crew had come across the name before there was nothing said about what they looked like or any tech or bio info
I've always wanted to write the scene of Archer and crew giving the mission report to Starfleet of their encounter with the strange big eared aliens that had giant tushies for heads...
I never liked them until DS9, I think making their culture basically the epitome of capitalism with all it's stereotypes not just intact but embraced, was a good move even if a little cheesy.
I am just so upset Nog is dead. His character was so tenderly rendered. I'm just a year older than Aron. And the guy who played the Grand Nagus is one of my favorite actors of all time. Such a sweet man, still with us.
Liquidator Brunt F.C.A!
One of my favourite things from DS9.
I think the Farengi, as the 'space goblins' of Star Trek, actually had a big impact on how goblins in general are portrayed in other fantasy settings as well, when you look at modern portrayals of goblins in other media they can range from primal and violent to something not unlike DS9 Farengi
mmmm no
Like wow goblins.
@@denisesilveira3427 Actually those ones seem based on people from New Jersey
@@denisesilveira3427 "Ah...a potential customer!"
Pulled from the vault new to the world
The Persian word “faranji” was coined from and referred originally to the Franks and later was adopted in Arabic to refer to Europeans in general.
Oy bey!
This must have led to the Thai word "farang" for white foreigners.
TNG made me hate the Ferengi, DS9 made me appreciate them.
"The Battle" was a quite good episode. I wouldn't say the Ferengi ruined it.
TNG didn't make me hate the Ferengi; it actually made me notice the arrogance of the Federation.
FordGTGuy I hope it is a two way street because TNG ferengi were just as arrogant, just with money rather then interstellar politics.
That was the idea !!
Personally, I liked the TNG Ferengi.
For sure a wise decision to reassign Ferengi as die-hard capitalists (with some minor exclusions) instead of main antagonists. I think it was a good idea having species like that, they might not be very likeable for several reasons but they definitely provided some sort of diversity into Star Trek universe...
Anyway I`m disappointed not to see D`kora destroying a couple of Bird of Prey`s 🙃
Well they were still meant to be die-hard capitalists as the main antagonist, but I'm glad they're not both. I mean TNG is basically meant to show that socialism and social equality is the future and how we will eventually be prosperous. So of course the ferengi's were meant to be capitalist bad guys since capitalism is directly contrary to socialism.
@@1hybodus I`m sure TNG was meant to be communist since it`s the final stage that was never achieved as for now, whereas socialism is something in the middle of the way that took it`s place in certian countries, including mine.
But this is just a lyrical digression. So yeah, the main diffeence between TNG Ferengi and DS9 is that the second ones wouldn`t attack the Federation flagship neither do other similar acts haha. Both were capitalists, true. I also didn`t like TNG Ferengi moved kinda like chimps which was too ridiculous
Star Trek was created by a bunch of Lefties so, of course, the Capitalists were the "bad guys". That's just their reality.
@@1hybodus Technically it’s not really socialism. Socialism (or at least how Karl Marx saw it) is when the workers rise up against the factory or business owners and take direct control of the businesses themselves, then the workers control the means of production.
Quark was possibly the most complex character in all of star trek. The way armin portrayed him was brilliant.
I can't wait for him to return in season two of Picard. (Yes he'll reprise the role)
There's a RUclips video of armin on a talkshow changing from himself to quark and how he got into character in real live is just amazing.
I hate the ferangi in the early characterisations, they were just ‘silly’ however in DSP 9, they were fantastic, full rich deep characters that developed nicely. Dax really helped support their role
I once read a comment which I am going to paraphrase here:
"In TNG when I saw a Ferengi I thought 'oh no...', in DS9 when I saw a Ferengi I though 'alright, what's next?'".
@@marnie4629 Haha yeah when a Ferengi like Quark, Rom, Nog and the Nagus to name a few appears first thin DS9, you know it’s ‘showtime’ 😂
How TNG treated the Ferengi really made that show feel very intolerant and sour, DS9 made them deeper and more relatable. TNG had a habit of portraying itself as woke and tolerant but anyone that was different was painted in a very unflattering light, and that often holds true in many parts of society today.
It's almost like the socialist view of "everyone who is like us and obeys our collective is a saint and anyone who violates our ideas of purity is Satan" is kind of part of why they can never create anything lasting.
I always thought of it as a product of Gene and the time he was born to.
He was very forward thinking and progressive.... For his time.
By the time of TNG he was old. He had not grown past where he was when he was younger and had in fact become stuck in his ways. Meanwhile those around him were half his age and as a result inherently more progressive thanks to having been exposed to a more liberal world and thus having developed deeper understandings and less surfical considerations of the topics.
Whenever someone acts like gene was super progressive just remember:
Gene didn't have to put all the women in "dresses", more appropriately called long shirts, that barely covered their bums while standing perfectly still let alone while active.
(Yes some males wore the same outfit but it didn't make sense for either and that was highly uncommon)
TNG began in the mid-80s. This is b/4 the collapse of the Soviet Union; a collapse which vastly discredited socialist idealism, at least for a few years. Roddenberry insisted on portraying the TNG Federation as some kind of post-economic paradise, dedicated to art & intellectual pursuits. This quite different to the TOS Federation, there is no pretense of a perfect political order in the earlier series. If you look @ the examples Federation officials, at least the civilian ones, they are usually portrayed as obnoxious pompous asses. We have no sense the Federation is ideal. They have money, greed, ambition & narcissisml just an ordinary flawed human like society.
The change of the Ferengi is a reflection of the rightward drift of the world post-Soviet Union.
always refreshing when we get a Trek ep on this channel
Quark was, and is, one of my favourite characters in all of ST.
Something so funny about the way Brunt says"Quaaarrrrrk!" That and when Grand Nagus says "A FEEEMAAALLLLEE?!"
I loved Zek.
I would love to have a drink and play some dabo in Quarks bar, shake his hand after winning. But I would count my fingers after that handshake 😉
It's too bad you didn't go to Las Vegas a couple of decades ago. The Hilton Casino and Resort had a whole Star Trek theme going, including Quark's Bar (where you could buy Klingon Blood Wine), and a motion simulator ride that included a live action Borg attack. I'm sure there was a Dabo game, but it's been a while, maybe not.
@@UncaAlbyGmail "live long and make profit" i believe was the motto at that establishment. (i saw a small piece about it on a commercial on the scifi channel many many years ago)
@@UncaAlbyGmail I rode that ride -- it was great!
"...this is a family show..."
Said no one at the STD or Picard meetings.
My family didn't like Discovery,dismissed Picard,but loved Orville😂
@@omnimonramone8459 that's because, unlike Kurtzman, MacFarlane is actually a fan of Star Trek. The Orville has people who have previously worked on Star Trek. He wanted to make an actual Star Trek show, but CBS turned him down in favor of Abrams. And, well, we can see how that's turning out.
@@Balandrus dafuq std s3 has already returned to the old motto of star trek. Shut up and skip s1 and 2, then watch s3
@@mrtkeynotes7889 Ah yes, gore, excessive violence, and disrespecting everyone is a return to old Trek. Keep hanging onto this trash show as it gets cancelled, since no one wants to pay for it. Licensees have fled, CBS All Access is a complete failure. Netflix and Amazon want nothing further with NuTrek. All will be right in the world when Star Trek purges shills like you from the fanbase. Begone shill bot.
Umm... Also Deep Space 9, when it talked of the horrors of war, Voyager when they had to do moral corrupt things to get home.
Star Trek's darkness did not start with Discovery or Picard. It started long before and it never left. Let's not forget that time Archer tortured a man, then later left a crew of innocents stranded to their possible deaths by stealing their warp coils
My main quibble with how the Ferenghi were portrayed isn't really with Ferenghi themselves (although I agree with pretty much every point in this video); it's with the way the crew of the Enterprise reacted to them. S2:EP5, The Perfect Mate, was problematic for a lot of reasons many other people have named. But it caught my eye when they beam the two "stranded" Ferenghi on board and Riker says, "Find them a room far away from mine" or words to that effect. For their ongoing claims to have eliminated racism, that stood out to me even as a kid. Like Lily said in First Contact, where were your "evolved sensibilities" then?
The ferengi are very loyal to their familes. I love how they evolved in DS9 and you could find respect for them once you understood them
As a kid, I always referred to them as "butt-heads", whenever I mentioned them to my mother. I haven't seen this show in years and looking at them now, I can see why I referred to them as such haha.
Funny how they were going to portray the main villains as the ultimate capitalists (The Ferengi) but ended up with the main villains being the ultimate communists (The Borg).
Even in TNG the last outpost wasn't the actual first encounter with the ferangi. Just the first official one. The whole story of the Stargazer was that Picard lost it after a battle with an unknown assailant that ended up being the Ferangi.
Well Star Trek has changed beyond recognition since JJ and Kurtzman got hold of it!
My wife and I record most of our tv programs and that includes DS9. If it has Ferengi involvement it will be watched first!! I understand the introduction and involvement of Ferengi is a bit out of context but it really doesn't matter to us.
I hope Armin understands that lots of fans just chalk up The Last Outpost to the “early-installment weirdness” that always exists in Sci-Fi. Rather than any complaint about his particular performance.
I agree that the shift in tone the species took in DS9 was a huge improvement but, one thing from their original appearance I'd have liked to see retained is those Marauder starships. It would make sense to see the Grand Nagus transported by one.
I personal head canon for how the original TNG Ferengi were so different from the DS9 ones, was that these were Ferengi on the fringe of their own territory. And that puts makes them rough and almost pirate like because of their distance from centers of commerce, they would be viewed as unsophisticated hicks by other Ferengi for their clumsy negotiating and resorting to force and cowardice so quickly. Where the Federation sends it's best at the frontier, the Ferengi send their worst.
I like how Startrek makes first contact with aliens they only heard of. They dont understand each other's culture so it can lead to conflict. Then by the next series they either have a truce or are allies. Its also interesting that even when people are doing their best to be open, there can be biases that get ingrained.
Worf was loved and given every chance to be whatever he wanted to be. He wanted to be Klingon, but for some reason he thought they were angry all the time, that they only cared about fighting. Then he meets them, and find its all been a romantic ideal made up by clues instead of conversation. The Klingons care about being honorable, more or less, at least the perception of it, its a powerful political tool.
And the fighting? Well, they want to be remembered, and it takes grandiose actions to do it. The cost is often death. They don't want to die, but they aren't lying to themselves about whether itll happen or not. Rather than cry about it, their humor is very dark. The laughter is often louder than it makes sense to be, strained, and bitter.
New sub. Upthumb on the video. PEACE
I have always found them to be pretty much completely silly. It's as if they tried to make them menacing and people found them silly, so they just leaned in to that silliness. While there were some serious, even poignant moments in DS9, there was still decidedly more Grand Nagus and Brunt silliness. They are silly, just silly.
A Ferengi was on the bridge once.. true it was the episode where Warff is traveling in many dimensions of possibility but for one brief alternate universe, he's on the helm with one as I think navigator. :3
Armin Shimmerman was the Ferengi. He made the race with him as model.
The Ferengi are French. Hear me out...
As mentioned in the video, "farangi" is the Arabic word for foreigner.
Interesting because "farang" in the Thai language is also used for foreigners.
The word, "farang" in Thai is the derived from the word for "FRENCH," as that is who was attempting to invade... long story.
Thus, the Ferengi are French.
REQUEST: Please watch and review "Eureka" and "Warehouse 13". We lost both of these so SciFy could pay for "Defiance" which was interesting, but not as good IMHO.
W13 started great but as the show went on, Flanderization ruined it. Shame, it had potential... and a badass HRW.
I noticed that the introduction of the cardassians actually seems to have replaced the ferengi war with the cardassian war, as the stargazer was a ship that until the cardassian introduction, only was mentioned when it battled ferengi.
There were missed opportunities with the Ferengi on DS9. Suppose, during the wars with the Dominion ( or the Borg) that the Ferengi Fleet shows up on the pretense that “Any percent of nothing is still nothing”. The Ferengi would be well justified with handling the supply lines and contributing troops and technology because they don’t want to be conquered next after the Federation.
A very good point! I agree, and that would've been awesome, if it had been written like that! ✨🍻✌✨
Too many comments to see if this is mentioned previously. The creators of the TNG Ferengi and Cardassians had somebody around them who knew modern Greek. Both races are almost the exact opposites of the closest related Greek word, so its like some kind of a practical joke. In modern Greek "Ferengios" means reliable, scrupulously honest and trustworthy... how's that for a complete polarity reversal? Similarly, "Kardassis" means one with a big open heart, warm and emotional. Also the people from Thessaloniki region where I once worked are called by that moniker. Have you ever seen a Cardassian other than Gul Dukat or Garak smile? Another practical joke played on us. Somebody involved with TNG clearly knew Greek...
Anyone remember a computer game called Trade Wars 2002? That game had as antagonists the "Ferrengi" who came from the planet "Ferrengal"... Hmmm...
"Go on do it, kill me. That's what you want isn't it? This fight might as well be an execution. The only reason why you want me to fight is so you can have your precious honor. Well I'm not gonna make it that easy for you. So go on, kill me. And when you tell your children how your house rose to power remember it was because you murdered a helpless unarmed Ferengi." - Quark to Klingon High Council.
there is a mistake here, Farangi is not an Arabic word, but a Persian word ,Farang (فرنگ) is a Persian and southeast Asian word that originally referred to the Franks (the major Germanic tribe) and later came to refer to Europeans in general. The word "Farang" is a cognate and originates from old french: "franc".
I look forward to RUclips flagging this as hate speech like they did with Lore Reloaded's video on the Ferengi...and that was with human review.
May I just say: “enterprise... was a bit of a continuity error” sums up much of the show
Yes, the rootbeer speech given by Quark is memorable. I noticed a couple others while rewatching ST:DS9.In the episode where Sisko and Quark were captured on a planet by the Jem/Dominion Quark said that post capitalist Federation Humans saw themselves superior to Ferengi because they are reminded of how they used to be except Quark added Ferengi were better than humans because never put their own in concentration camps or exterminated whole civilizations on their homeworld.
those things are bad for business;
ethically abhorrent not a factor
DS9 is the best of the Star Trek series.
DS9 was Like one long movie.
Let be serious here anything before DS9 were proto-Ferengi. Who know maybe all they encountered in TNG were the really bellow average Ferengi.
Making Ferengi bad guys again(in some new series) can be done, but it has to be done correctly. Turn down the goofiness(as mentioned) and turn up the viciousness. All of this while keeping Ferengi characters like Quark and Rom who are civilian business owners. Civilian Ferengi can remain (somewhat) personable while military Ferengi remain vicious.
Acquisition on paper should be be a terrible episode, Jeff Combs acting redeems it though.
I classify people by Star Trek Race.
Ferengi: From Garbage to Great
DS9 wouldn't have been as successful as it was without Quark, Rom, and Nog. I enjoyed the Ferengi episodes 🙂
I see some folk still don't know I have other channels, so here are some links -
Gaming Channel - ruclips.net/channel/UC4AQjWVhQBOoHlOrKn_SJqA
Second Channel - ruclips.net/channel/UCuRTWD6C2lqy-y-0HMwRoNQ
I want to say that DS9 is also MY favorite Star Trek. I also think Armin Shimerman was absolutely FANTASTIC as Quark - he was one of my favorite characters. And "Little Green Men," as well as "Business as Usual" are some of my favorite episodes.
I'm still haunted by the apocryphal stories about just how intensely sexual and gross the designs were that Gene wanted them to have.
Apparently Gene Roddenberry also had all these sexual ideas for Risa too... so....yeah...😶
@@RowanJColeman A fetish hmmm ven did he shtart hafing zeese thoughts?
@@RowanJColeman Not to mention most of the actresses in the cast.
Reminds me of the pervy side-rants Stephen King would put in his novels.
I really hope Gene didn't Weinstein anybody back in the day
When I was a child I hated and scared of quark those teeth 😨 now he's my favourite
It's kind of funny how the Ferengi were introduced as the big threat, evil and almost bestial characters in TNG, then by the end of DS-9 they were had become comic relief, more fun and silly than any sort of serious threat.
6:23 Technically it’s the United Earth/Human’s first real contact with the Ferengi since the Federation didn’t exist yet.
I would like to think that most ‘first contact’ situations are actually the 5th or tenth contact with a lot of undocumented and unofficial contacts, some of which inevitably being due to time travel. After all, Vulcans had been on earth several times in the 20th century with Spock regularly time traveling as well as the carbon creek incident.
Quark and Nog in DS9 made the Farengi my favorite Star Trek race despite originally hating them
The Farengi are the most hilariously non-subtle stereotype of an ethnic group I have ever seen
Stereotypes exist for a reason. I’m a walking example of the one you’re referring to. This wasn’t stereotypes tho. It was a parody as best.
I've always imagined the Ferengi to be like modern day americans (or at least financial-political conservatives) and Ferenginar to be a reflection of modern day america. I dunno, it seems that maybe Gene could see the writing on the wall and even though america's embrace with capitalism was still- relatively- benign back in the 80s, he could see that the nation and its people were heading inexorably towards the most extreme form of extreme capitalism and so he wrote the Ferengi as both pointed political commentary AND a warning. Maybe he could see that currency was fast becoming the newest religion among americans and so decided to make the Ferengi spirituality and afterlife be all about money/ currency, again as both commentary and a warning; a prediction of 21st century america...
Yeah I agree
DS9 definitely wouldn't have been the same, or as good, without Quark, Rom, Nog, and the rest.
Ah, yes, the Ferengi. The race I got one glimpse of when older family members were watching "Star Tracks", as 6-year-old me thought it was called, and I was like "Nope! Not watching any show that has anything that ugly in it!"
I saw a post online once that was something like “when you’ve watched enough Star Trek to find some of the weird aliens hot” and showed Garak and Weyoun and Shran and a couple others, lol
I liked the original version. They were really alien and different. But Star Trek writers as always can't handle alieness and instead formed them into humans with funny makeup and running gags, like what happened with all other aliens in Star Trek. Instead of making a way so that we understand their alien nature better.
they didnt have the budget to make aliens alien.
so vast majority of species are humanoids with different foreheads or something.
same way as they didnt have the budget to make spaceships land on planets.
hence they resorted to teleportation
Fantastic summation of the Ferengi and their appearances. DS9 wouldn't have been the same without Quark, Rom and Nog.
Space Jews
One thing I’ve come to wonder is that typically in fiction is that species or cultures that are portrayed as inherently greedy are portrayed as hyper capitalists as a critique of capitalism.
But from a world building perspective wouldn’t such a species/culture trend more towards socialism than capitalism? After all if a species/culture truly was driven by a desire to acquire wealth why would they embrace a system where they give up the vast majority of the wealth produced by their labor to a small handful of individuals. Wouldn’t make more sense for them to embrace a system that allows the individuals to maximize their individual power through collective bargaining and voting?
Now one could argue an inherently greedy species would be selfish and lack the pro-social tendencies in order to form unions and co-ops. However if that were true than this species would not be able to form any kind of civilization. As they would lack the ability for even simple organization.
If your species is to anti-social to form a small collective whose leaders are elected by popular vote to represent their interests (I.E a union) than its not going to be able to form of large scale civilization.
Yes, have you ever read Animal Farm.....where the pigs stood on their hind legs at the end and you couldn't tell the difference between the humans and the pigs. There are always a few bullies that will run the show in a socialist (communist) gov't and they take over, look at China, USSR, N.Korea and how the people are really treated, manipulated and who's in charge.
I'm not a big fan of the Ferengi. They have their moments and uses for the sake of storytelling, and the lore is solid enough, but I usually don't like Ferengi episodes much.
The romulans have nuance? To me they are one of the most flat race.
Exactly. Just vulcans thinking like 'Romans'. The most fleshed out species for me, were the Klingons, Ferengi.... And most of the aliens from DS9
If your only experience with Romulans is from watching CBS/Kurtzman 'faux-trek', then your statement is totally accurate. But the Roms were definitely fleshed out in TNG and DS9.
Ferengi became comic relief for the most part, but DS9 really did give them some nuance and dignity, especially when Quark says to Sisko that, for all humanity's snobbery towards their way of life, they never stooped to the barbarity that we had in the past. It seems to be a mirror of how Humans were initially looked down on by Vulcans as being reckless and dangerous, when they nearly drove themselves to extinction centuries before.
I think of the first appearance Ferengi as their soldiers. Like maybe the Ferengi has a very strange and primitive form of martial arts that only the fighters learn that just looks weird. A majority of the people are capitalists and conmen, but maybe the one that don't have the lobes enlist as fighters. Quark has the action figures of those Ferengis with the laser whips. I do like their appearance in Enterprise. The crew never find out what they were so it doesn't contradict Next Generations. Just like the Borg episode.
i hope you can help me with this one ... this is a question i have for many years now .. the bluray of tng have no japanese audio but i know the japanese audio exists since i have a bluray backup file of a bluray of tng several episodes with japanese audio .. when you ask others they streight out say it doesnt exist in japanese well it does ... now the thing is i have deep space 9 in 5 languages english german spanish italian french .. and im wondering if there are more translation of ds9 available for example russian chinese japanese .. anything else. do you have any information that might hint to some aditional translation (not just subtext) whole audio into other languages .. any information are welcome thx in advance
I was under the impression that Ferengi was derived from the Persian/Farsi word for foreigner which would be Farang or Farangj. Though it would be more closer to the Hindi "Firangi". Not sure, just a thought.
Based on the Jewish culture
Have you read Tom King's Omega Men from a few years back?
Deep space nine really made the Ferengi a lovable race. Quark while greedy is very much product of the ferengi culture and has his own moral code that he follows.
My favorite ferengi episode is little green men
Oddly enough, DS9 cannot help their socialist leanings and turned The ferengi race much more liberal and social program leaning. The ferengi episodes in DS9 are some of the best
I would like to see a conversation between the ferengi Quark, the bar owner from Deep Space Nine, and the human Ralph Offenhouse, from the TNG episode "The Neutral Zone".
fun fact in the EU Offenhouse became the federation advisor on the Ferengi. Federation anthropologists couldn't make heads or tails on how the Ferengi acted until Offenhouse enlightened them.
@@toomanyaccounts, this is excellent. Exactly what I tought could happen.
I hope that mr. Offenhouse have fond some new meaning in his life by serving the Federation in this way.
TNG novel Debtors Planet by W. Thompson has Offenhouse acting as the Federations ambassador negotiating with the Ferengi (who are closet Cardassian minions) in this manner...
@@agbottan Offenhouse being a capitalistic narcissist always served himself before the Federation...
They remind me of WOW’s Horde goblins...
They're basically like the Kazon, but the latter were never reinvisioned.
Funny coming from a Hew-man... lol
Armin was BORN to play Quark. There is no way his character would have been so successful had it not been for him.
The ferengi are awesome. I loved them
you're talking about great heroes ships can't forget the serenity
i hated the ferengi when i first seen them in star trek from their whines and screams to their selfish ways i just couldnt stand them . BUTT in deep space 9 i absolutely loved Quark and Nog it has always thrown me off a bit they never Followed Nog on his journey to become Captain like that has really bothered me i think they could of made alot of great stories with it and i really want to see Quark make an appearance or 2 in piccard season 2 that would really be epic in my opinion
They become my favorite Star Trek non-human species. You didn’t mention Wallace Shawn as the Grand Nagus. That’s a severe nerd oversight.
Just like a man to not include Andrea Martin as one of the iconic guest star Ferengi in this retrospective....