What did ya'll think of this? Expand on it, or close the file? Also got a pretty sweet road trip coming up, might have some slack time to meet some ppl across the west and shoot some bows! Go follow the instagram for more on that... Now go shoot your bow!
I’d question whether the peak is the arrow hitting the target? Maybe run an experiment with one bow shooting into gel or something soft with one of the bows to ensure the readings are bow only.
Those are stock bows. Add a bunch or rubber on them snd see if it makes a difference? Dampeners on risers, limbs, string stop, strings...etc. bunch you could expand on to see if it makes a real difference. Nice video!
Entertaining as always! I would love to see a tinkering video with the goal being getting a bow as quiet as possible. You could go two ways - serious and educational and ridiculously overbuilt. Also I think string stops may be an underrated noise controlling component ripe for tinkering.
Mr Scientist here, Make sure you have thought about the following: The sound arrow of the arrowing hitting the target isn't getting measured ( I would move the target 40 yards away or more), each bow is at the same lbs/Drawlength, and use the same arrow for each bow. Microphone Location should be the same for each bow as well. As far as is this relevant content: IMO, I been killing deer for over 20 years, and old bows were loud. Thus, from hunting standpoint I don't think it matters much. I am more worried good yardage judgement and shot placement than sound. If I am spending 2000 dollars on a new bow, its nice to know all the details to help make a decision. I would include this in your future reviews. Love the content, Josh thanks for sending my Rhinehart insert replacement to North Carolina!
Very cool to see! I also do sound testing in an outdoor setting, and got much lower values (about 73-74 dB) for the LIFT 33, but pretty similar values around 79-81 dB for most other bows on test. Notably, you have to be careful that your dB meter is picking up the sound of the bow itself, and not the sound of the arrow hitting the target and/or echoing of the shot. I've had cases where these values are similar despite the target being about 10-15 yards downfield. I usually double check this by checking the soundwave in the video recording with the timing of the readings on the dB meter to ensure that I'm getting the correct reading. Love your content! Thanks for this video and testing.
That Ethos is a very underrated, rarely talked about sleeper this year. Lots of hype for other bows, but that thing just flat out shoots, quiet & nearly vibe free.
My entire family shoots wire except me. I want an ethos. The specs are perfect in my opinion for me anyways. And I already work on elites so it would just make my life easy.
The Kairos is even more underrated. It’s an absolute smoke-show for the speed you get out of it at 27-28in draw. I haven’t seen anyone give it a good review, but it holds like a rock! I tried it after I bought my Lift33 and between its string angle and hold, I wish I’d have shot it earlier.
Evolve 33 ds even more underrated. Amazing bow.Accurate very smooth and a pleasure to shoot. I tried Ethos Kayros and Alpha 33.. Bought the Evy ds. The most accurate at least in my hands
The Kairos is right there with the Ethos. I owned and shot the Lift 33, Alpha X 33 and Kairos at the same time. The Kairos was the fastest, quietest and has the least vibe of the 3. It's also the most efficient bow I've ever owned at my 28" DL.
👆 THIS. This is why some suppressors might sound quieter even though they’re a higher decibel. Hense the “woosh” vs “pop” tones. Also key to note that as with suppressor testing, the average human ear won’t notice a decibel difference less than around 4 or 5 decibels.
Quick search on line I found this about a 3 decibel difference: Although an increase of 3 dB represents a doubling of the sound pressure, an increase of about 10 dB is required before the sound subjectively appears to be twice as loud. The smallest change we can hear is about 3 dB. The subjective or perceived loudness of a sound is determined by several complex factors. Take from this what you will. That is based on what a human can hear, animals( I would assume) are a lot more sensitive - but does that equate to causing a buck/bull jump as the shot goes off?? Would love tests on different dampeners and stabilizers! Great Video!
I’m not sure the difference decibel level is considerable but the actual frequency of the noises might be? Last time I shot a Hoyt, the sound was like slapping a piece of paper. Not that it was loud or anything, just a sharper sound than the other bows I shot.
Tim just makes great videos no matter what the topic. He does all the little things that make his videos seem more professional and creative - while still maintaining a laid back vibe that lets you feel like you're opening RUclips to hang w a friend. Got a true talent for this stuff
This is important. The difference of 2.3 db between the highest and lowest represents a volume difference of an additional 70%. In other words the loudest is 70% louder than the quietest. 10^(2.3/10)
Great video! I think the noise of the bow does make a difference. Mostly in the enjoyment of shooting the bow. For me, a quiet and dead in the hand bow is much more fun to shoot. I think that deer “ jump “ the sound of the arrow in flight , more so than the sound of the bow itself. I like that all the bows were left bare to test this. I would like to see a test with the bow and the DB mic set up in door, with the target outside. Not sure if it would make a difference??? I wonder if part of the decibel reading is the noise that the arrow makes in flight and the sound of the arrow impacting the target? Each bow will hit the target with a bit more or less force. Hope I didn’t miss something on the video 😬. The noise level of a bow is a huge factor for me. All in all , great job. I can’t get enough of you, Josh, and Dan’s videos! Oh and pod casts!!!
Exactly. For instance how much of the sound is from the string hitting the string stop? What effect does the string stop material and distance from the string have to do with sound?
I bought an elite Ethos about a month ago, my first time ever messing around with an elite and I had a feeling that it was very similar to the “quietness” of a Mathews. I gotta say elite is making some good stuff these days, hopefully next year they work on some type of integration of the accessories. Great video!
I think this test is awesome. I love seeing stuff like this, especially veins broadheads cuz they make a lot of different noises and that makes a difference
Awesome test. Please expand upon things like heavy arrow / light arrow, string silencers, quiver with arrows in it, stabilizer bars. Maybe rig out the two quietest bows the way they would be hunted with and redo it?
I have been waiting for this one! You should do this with all bows! I prefer quiet over speed. Compare flagship bows to midrange budget bows. How much a heavier arrow really quiets a bow. I'm interested!
Great idea. I would like to see thiss added to MFJJ's bow reviews. Id like to see the difference between ourdoor and indoor at longer rannges to eliminate the noise of the arrow hitting the target.
Interesting topic. Two or three decibels separates all of them and how does that translate in the woods? I primarily hunt whitetail and they are wired tight at birth and I’ve seen them jump strings at ridiculously close ranges. Ultimately I believe that this is something that you should consider testing in your reviews. Not as much for how well it translates in the woods but to better inform the customers and assuming the manufacturers are watching, to make the products even better! Just my thoughts.
dB is a log function if I remember right. So the difference between the loudest and quietest is a lot more than what the raw numbers indicate. I liked the video.
I will also chime in that the SPL meter is reading the target report. The other issue that can gave an affect is the room dynamics. As long as you use the same room every time you have a consistent reading. Just remember sound is waves so don’t conduct the test outside. Do you wanna conduct it in a room so that it will contain those waves. As long as the room is the same and all of the items in the room stay the same you’re readings will be consistent.
I'd love to see the target noose fully isolated (placed outdoors). I'm also really interested in seeing you test bow noise differences with varying arrow weights. I also want to see target bows tested just for comparison purposes. Great video!! Revist this topic soon please!!!
Great idea! I think this is totally relevant. Bow noise is an important thing to consider. I bet the engineers for the manufacturers are all upset you guys just brought to light a new source of competition for them deal with. 😂😂
Definitely should throw in the Darron consequence. The first time I ever heard that bow I immediately turned around to check it out and how quiet it was!
I think you guys have something here. I would like to see the test you were talking about at the end of this video. Testing: monkey tails, arrow weight, stabilizers, exc.... do they make a difference?
I always hear how quiet my Mathew’s is and it’s very important when hunting. I would think that sound is very important and it coincides with the vibration because the vibration is going to put off a sound. VERY IMPORTANT! Josh needs to add.
Great video. I find it interesting the one bow that was really tuned to the arrow’s was quieter. Not taking anything away from the ethos because that bow is super smooth and quiet. Just curiosity if a bow is out of tune is it more loud?
I think the second sound of the arrow hitting the target is loudest?? Great info!! Would love to see a longer shot maybe shooting from indoors to a longer target outdoors for better results?? Love your vids!!
Something everyone does need to remember is that the decibel scale is logarithmic. Which means for every 10db it goes up, the sound doubles. 80 is twice as loud as 70. So that 3 db spread is huge. I’d love to see this in lieu of the vibration test on MFJJ’s bow reviews, with the addition of tone. Plus I’d like to see what stabilizers and additional weight on stabilizers does. In my anecdotal experience, with a second bar, and tripling the weight on the stabs, I’ve removed the string silencers (18 grains apiece) which turns my 70 yard pin into about a 74 yard pin. Edit: I was initially wrong, it goes up by factors of 10. So a 3db difference is almost a doubling of sound intensity. From 70 to 80 would be a 10x louder noise.
Does that mean 3 decibels is not always the same? Like the difference from 67-70 is not as drastic as 77-80? I’m just asking because I really don’t know how decibels work
@@lgentry4832 oh shit, you’re right. My bad. So that means for every 10db it’s 10 louder and for every 3 ish it doubles in sound. So the quietest bows are half the volume of the loudest bows. They’ll hear it, but the distance at which they’ll react changes, and with enough speed you can get to a point where their reaction simply isn’t fast enough.
Good stuff. It may be worth digging into the science from a sound point of view to determine what is a 'significant' difference in terms of dbs. Also, I like that you distanced yourself from the target. There are a few other archery channels that measure sound, but they are so close to the target its hard to tell if they are measuring the sound of the bow or the arrow hitting the target.
Great video , I'm sure many people talk about how loud a bow is , but do companies ever advertise the loudness of a bow ? thank guys MFJJ - Tim for your Chanel , I watch you guys all the time ... Peace from Germany Tim
Id be curious to see back to back tests indoors and outdoors just to see how they track. Though i know the airport being just down the road wont help ha
I think this interesting topic. I would think you are on the right track with heavier bow would be quieter for the fact that when the bow is shot and makes contact with the sting stop you essentially are ringing out the natural frequency of the bow. when an object has more mass, the natural frequency tends to be a lower frequency and lower frequency has a lower perceive sound intensity or sharpness. think of striking a tuning fork the difference would be the initial strike being the sound we hear, and the ring down would be vibration in the bow. Things like stabilizers and other dampening devices I would think play a role in the natural frequency's amplitude. I would think that draw weight would be a factor because the natural frequency or resonant frequency is equal to square root of k/m where is k is spring stiffness and m is mass. But if you are shooting identical arrows the impact would be larger in amplitude. These are things that just come to mind but I only pretend to understand physics to get through school.
Functionally, i don't see enough difference to really matter. Scientifically there is a decent difference. Decibels is not linear. 3 decibels would make a difference at 20+ yards
With all starting data points the same, draw length, weight, arrow weight, target distance and shot to mic distance the same, 3 to 3.5 decibel s doesn't seem that much, but in the field it should make a huge difference. The Mathews and Elite had the lower frequency of noise, like a thump, wheras the rest had a more high pitched twangy( lack of better word) sound. Like a sharper ting with less sustain. All being equal, its a great baseline test. And I also believe the importance will be determined by the type of hunt you do. Western hunters shoot farther therefore the animal could possibly hear that bow popping off, as an Eastern whitetail Hunter usually takes a shorter shot where even if the bow is a little louder 20 to 30 yards depending on the speed won't make too much of a difference. I know from my own experience of just trying out different things that a 427 grain arrow out of my 63 lb bow is more quiet than the 329 grain arrow i use for 3d. These are just my experiences, but I think what you guys are doing is great especially for those that are very interested in having the quietest setup has to be able to take those longer shots without being noticed especially in the woods where that sound is not normal. Thank you guys for doing what you do I think putting a sound test of some sort as long as it's obviously set up so that everything is the same which you guys do so well, would be a great addition to bow reviews. I figured the Matthew was going to be the quietest cuz it did seem to be through all the testing that I've seen of it online, but I was surprised at the elite especially when Tim first started shooting that and how it didn't make a lot of twangy sharp noises when fired.
There are a couple other comments like this, but I'll make a suggestion. I did see a video somewhere where the testers shot into an area surrounded by foam so that the arrow impact wasn't what was measured. Maybe a good test if safely done would be to shoot out a door or window with test equip indoors next to bow? Others comments and my brain as well feel as tho this is a.testbof arrow noise and impact noise. Yes, the bow noise is a part of the measurement, but it just seems like the impact dominates the sound we hear. Same as shooting at home!
The Mach had a room noise level of 59 and the second test was at 62.5. That’s nearly the same difference between the bows. Could you tell the difference in the room while testing? And the prime was one of the slowest and has some good weight to it so wonder how it would have stacked up. Would have been nice to see the draw weight of each too. We’ve all had some bows pull 72 lbs maxed and others 69 lbs. Awesome video though. We all like seeing numbers like this.
I wouldn't mind seeing some content going down another rabbit hole of archery information relevance aside it would be interesting to see the data on the products we use and their affect on it wouldn't mind see I ng a comparison to a target setup to see the real difference in sound just for curiosity
Can this test be done outside with the meter at 20-25 yards and the target at 40 yards or so? Since this test is indoors the meter might be picking up the impact of the target, not so much the sound of the bow. I'm imagining that the decibel meter is the deer's ear. In the video the meter is about 6 feet away and it's indoors. having the meter at 20-25 yards or farther would be a much better comparison to a hunting situation and what the deer might actually hear. Rustling leaves is about 20-30 db so anything significantly louder than that where the deer is standing will spook them.
There's a lot of tangibles to consider... Top of my head though, when testing all these bows, you should use some more constants. IE... Same Arrow Rest, Same Arrow (Length, Weight, & Fletching), w/ or w/o a stabilizer, same exact draw weight, any additions onto the string (Peep, Silencing, D-Loop, string or brass nocks), even consideration to the release aid used. Then if you want to even go further, consider not only the weight/mass of the bow itself, but what material is it made from (carbon, aluminum, etc.). Consider what any joint in the bow is constructed with (where the riser meets the limbs, or limbs meeting the cams). Anything else attached to the bow, such as limb dampeners. All this being said, there's a lot to break down. I do feel that a video taking more of these constants into consideration would be "interesting".
Now take any one of those bows and retest after one suppressor is added. Eg. Retest with monkey tails. Remove then add a stabiliser, remove then add a back bar, remove then add a loaded quiver! Finally Let’s see if a bow with the those 3 additional suppressors can better the readings you just got when it’s got a quiver fitted.
Interesting. I have a lift 33 and and elite omnia. The elite is quieter and much more dead in hand than the lift. From what I remember from shooting the ethos, it was quieter and more dead than my omnia🤔... I love my lift too but it doesn't seem that quiet and it has way more vibration so I'm a little confused with these results.
Appreciate the work you guys are doing! Great video, I think it’s a solid test-more info for us bow nerds. Tim, were the Mathews and Bowtech a little stiffer on the draw? It sounded like those two took a little more effort.
i think all my bows are quiter than that, but the most quiet biw i ever had was a 2004 bowtech extreeme vft at 73lb and 30" with a 480gr arrow and 125gr tip that thing was so quiet i be shooting by the deck and people on the deck sitting couldnt hear it except arrows hitting target -with this biw this happened on numerous times while shooting with people near by with back to me, would always go oh man did you just shoot i didnt even hear your bow just the arrow slaming the bag. still have the bow but havent used it almost 20 years -so many new ones since and all flag ship and can never have one come even close to that level , but i do get them pretty quiet especially older bowtechs
Would be interesting to see how these same bows would stack up decked out as a total hunting rig arrows stabilizers string stabilizer I'm sure between you Josh an some friends you could get this done
I think if a bow manufacturer advertises how quiet it is, then it’s merited to test claim that against the other bows. Most flagship bows are pretty dang quiet. I am curious to see the carbon bow version of this though!
The conditions for the test should probably be changed: Pick a range where the target is far away enough that the decibel meter doesn’t pick up that report and also the acoustics of the room you’re in: Shooting a bow inside is going to report much louder than when shooting outside. Also, place the meter closer to the bow, almost adjacent to the archer, because the sound of the arrow soaring through the air can also be read and might skew the results. Otherwise, this is a great idea and should be further improved upon for future product reviews
Based on the sound profile of the youtube video... I wonder if the peak sound you are picking up is actually the "thwack" of the arrow on the target. Can you give it a test run with the target closer or farther away to confirm? If the target noise outpaces the bow noise that would throw a wrench in the results.
We did do that prior. At a couple feet we were getting the sound of the target (two readings actually). So we moved it back as far as we could. With the distance of the decibel reader, the separation of the door frame, and the direction of the reader pointed away from the target I think it is highly unlikely.
Enjoyed the vid but why not use the evolve30? Even though weight and sound weren't truly reflective of eachother seeing that the 2nd lightest and heaviest bows were the quietest. But the carbon could be eliminated from the equation with the evolve30.
How much of that noise is the arrow hitting the target. Seems louder than the bow. you should try this outside so you can take the arrow sound out of the equsation,
I’m more curious how a heavy arrow build compares in sound to a light arrow build. Say a 550gr arrow compared to a 420gr arrow. I shot some Easton dangerous game arrows through my Hoyt and it seemed extremely quiet. They just drop like a rock after 60 yards.
Hey Tim, love the videos and I am always excited when a new one comes up. I have a question, why is it no one talks about the Bear Persist? I find it to be a great shooting bow. Just wanted to get your opinion on that. Thanks and keep up the great content!!
I definitely think MFJJ should do sound measurements in all bow reviews. Something that I think Tim could really nerd out about is what kind of sound the bow makes, low pitch, high pitch. I think that would be really interesting.
I think, what matters maybe more than peak dB is the frequency. The peak dB isn’t going to matter much if it’s in a frequency that a deer can’t even hear. In Australia I doubt it, but surely in the states with all the research done by wildlife mgnt, there must be papers on this. Food for thought anyway.
Man i wish you had the Bear Persist in that test. When MFJJ did the review it was quieter than most of the other bows. I have one and shoot beside Mathews guys and wven they acknowldge how quiet it is. Good twst just wish you had a Bear in their.
What a great idea. I can 500% see db #s advertised next to IBO #s in the near future. Especially since it feel like bows are kinda at the peak of most other things. Edit: Also, I wonder if Primes different aluminum makes a difference.
I think it would be great to see real world sound levels. No one hunts in your shop. Get in the open air with the target farther down range and see how much more quiet they are.
It’s certainly relevant for hunting. Arrow hitting the target? Not sure from the video if that makes a difference or not. Keep up the great videos boys, follow each of ya.👍
![Digital Circus Episode 4 [TRAILER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/abZtsmMUbJo/mqdefault.jpg)
What did ya'll think of this? Expand on it, or close the file? Also got a pretty sweet road trip coming up, might have some slack time to meet some ppl across the west and shoot some bows! Go follow the instagram for more on that... Now go shoot your bow!
Cool, but I don’t think people realize how much louder a 3 decibel difference between some bows is. Every 10 decibels the loudness doubles.
I’d question whether the peak is the arrow hitting the target? Maybe run an experiment with one bow shooting into gel or something soft with one of the bows to ensure the readings are bow only.
Those are stock bows. Add a bunch or rubber on them snd see if it makes a difference?
Dampeners on risers, limbs, string stop, strings...etc. bunch you could expand on to see if it makes a real difference.
Nice video!
MFJJ should apply this data point
in the 2025 Bow reviews.
Entertaining as always! I would love to see a tinkering video with the goal being getting a bow as quiet as possible. You could go two ways - serious and educational and ridiculously overbuilt. Also I think string stops may be an underrated noise controlling component ripe for tinkering.
Mr Scientist here, Make sure you have thought about the following: The sound arrow of the arrowing hitting the target isn't getting measured ( I would move the target 40 yards away or more), each bow is at the same lbs/Drawlength, and use the same arrow for each bow. Microphone Location should be the same for each bow as well. As far as is this relevant content: IMO, I been killing deer for over 20 years, and old bows were loud. Thus, from hunting standpoint I don't think it matters much. I am more worried good yardage judgement and shot placement than sound. If I am spending 2000 dollars on a new bow, its nice to know all the details to help make a decision. I would include this in your future reviews. Love the content, Josh thanks for sending my Rhinehart insert replacement to North Carolina!
Was thinking the same thing
Very cool to see! I also do sound testing in an outdoor setting, and got much lower values (about 73-74 dB) for the LIFT 33, but pretty similar values around 79-81 dB for most other bows on test.
Notably, you have to be careful that your dB meter is picking up the sound of the bow itself, and not the sound of the arrow hitting the target and/or echoing of the shot. I've had cases where these values are similar despite the target being about 10-15 yards downfield. I usually double check this by checking the soundwave in the video recording with the timing of the readings on the dB meter to ensure that I'm getting the correct reading.
Love your content! Thanks for this video and testing.
That Ethos is a very underrated, rarely talked about sleeper this year. Lots of hype for other bows, but that thing just flat out shoots, quiet & nearly vibe free.
My entire family shoots wire except me. I want an ethos. The specs are perfect in my opinion for me anyways. And I already work on elites so it would just make my life easy.
The Kairos is even more underrated. It’s an absolute smoke-show for the speed you get out of it at 27-28in draw. I haven’t seen anyone give it a good review, but it holds like a rock! I tried it after I bought my Lift33 and between its string angle and hold, I wish I’d have shot it earlier.
Evolve 33 ds even more underrated. Amazing bow.Accurate very smooth and a pleasure to shoot. I tried Ethos Kayros and Alpha 33.. Bought the Evy ds. The most accurate at least in my hands
The Kairos is right there with the Ethos. I owned and shot the Lift 33, Alpha X 33 and Kairos at the same time. The Kairos was the fastest, quietest and has the least vibe of the 3. It's also the most efficient bow I've ever owned at my 28" DL.
*4 min time stamp*
“Now kith”
It's absolutely important don't want a loud bow. Great job.
Honestly, raw numbers are one thing. But like suppressors, Tone plays a HUGE factor. Sharper, higher pitched, etc.
yeah, i could definitely hear some change between the bows.. some sounded more dull, others more sharp.. but not to get too far into the weeds on this
👆 THIS. This is why some suppressors might sound quieter even though they’re a higher decibel. Hense the “woosh” vs “pop” tones.
Also key to note that as with suppressor testing, the average human ear won’t notice a decibel difference less than around 4 or 5 decibels.
Arrow weight is everything in bow noise that and accessories
True. Arrow weight makes a difference. But if all the arrows are identical spec, you can tell which bow is quietest.
Quick search on line I found this about a 3 decibel difference: Although an increase of 3 dB represents a doubling of the sound pressure, an increase of about 10 dB is required before the sound subjectively appears to be twice as loud. The smallest change we can hear is about 3 dB. The subjective or perceived loudness of a sound is determined by several complex factors. Take from this what you will. That is based on what a human can hear, animals( I would assume) are a lot more sensitive - but does that equate to causing a buck/bull jump as the shot goes off?? Would love tests on different dampeners and stabilizers! Great Video!
Went from a Bear to an Xpedition to a Mathews and was truly shocked how quite the Mathews is.
I had a RX7U that I loved til I shot the Lift 33. The Lift shot better and was a noticeable difference in sound
I’m not sure the difference decibel level is considerable but the actual frequency of the noises might be? Last time I shot a Hoyt, the sound was like slapping a piece of paper. Not that it was loud or anything, just a sharper sound than the other bows I shot.
Yeah I can hear some of that too
Great video!
Appreciate the creatively in your videos. Always a please to watch!
Thank you my dude ✊
Tim just makes great videos no matter what the topic. He does all the little things that make his videos seem more professional and creative - while still maintaining a laid back vibe that lets you feel like you're opening RUclips to hang w a friend. Got a true talent for this stuff
Good info, i love everything archery, so any video pertaining to archery is valid!
This is important. The difference of 2.3 db between the highest and lowest represents a volume difference of an additional 70%. In other words the loudest is 70% louder than the quietest. 10^(2.3/10)
Correct! Most people don't realize that dB is a logarithmic scale.
Indeed, this is pretty insane as I was hoping the carbon would be pretty quiet. Bravo to mathews on doing that with the lift.
Great video! I think the noise of the bow does make a difference. Mostly in the enjoyment of shooting the bow. For me, a quiet and dead in the hand bow is much more fun to shoot. I think that deer “ jump “ the sound of the arrow in flight , more so than the sound of the bow itself. I like that all the bows were left bare to test this. I would like to see a test with the bow and the DB mic set up in door, with the target outside. Not sure if it would make a difference??? I wonder if part of the decibel reading is the noise that the arrow makes in flight and the sound of the arrow impacting the target? Each bow will hit the target with a bit more or less force. Hope I didn’t miss something on the video 😬. The noise level of a bow is a huge factor for me. All in all , great job. I can’t get enough of you, Josh, and Dan’s videos! Oh and pod casts!!!
Josh touched on it at the end of the video. I am very interested in seeing how to manipulate that sound output.
Exactly. For instance how much of the sound is from the string hitting the string stop? What effect does the string stop material and distance from the string have to do with sound?
I like the idea of shooting like a 450Gr arrow out of each bow. You guys are right about there is a lot that you could do to test.
I bought an elite Ethos about a month ago, my first time ever messing around with an elite and I had a feeling that it was very similar to the “quietness” of a Mathews. I gotta say elite is making some good stuff these days, hopefully next year they work on some type of integration of the accessories. Great video!
I think this test is awesome. I love seeing stuff like this, especially veins broadheads cuz they make a lot of different noises and that makes a difference
Awesome test. Please expand upon things like heavy arrow / light arrow, string silencers, quiver with arrows in it, stabilizer bars. Maybe rig out the two quietest bows the way they would be hunted with and redo it?
I have been waiting for this one! You should do this with all bows! I prefer quiet over speed. Compare flagship bows to midrange budget bows. How much a heavier arrow really quiets a bow. I'm interested!
I was at the archery shop and the new Bowtech SS was flying off the shelf. So tempting!!
Great idea. I would like to see thiss added to MFJJ's bow reviews. Id like to see the difference between ourdoor and indoor at longer rannges to eliminate the noise of the arrow hitting the target.
Another thing to note would be the difference in arrow speeds, limb dampeners and other variations between the bows. Thanks for another good video
Interesting topic. Two or three decibels separates all of them and how does that translate in the woods? I primarily hunt whitetail and they are wired tight at birth and I’ve seen them jump strings at ridiculously close ranges. Ultimately I believe that this is something that you should consider testing in your reviews. Not as much for how well it translates in the woods but to better inform the customers and assuming the manufacturers are watching, to make the products even better! Just my thoughts.
80 decibels is twice as loud as 70 decibels. It doesn’t look like much, but it’s a logarithmic scale, so it is substantial
This great! Would love to see more like this!
Awesome! Very interesting. It would be relevant in purchasing a bow for hunting. Good work guys!
dB is a log function if I remember right. So the difference between the loudest and quietest is a lot more than what the raw numbers indicate. I liked the video.
I will also chime in that the SPL meter is reading the target report. The other issue that can gave an affect is the room dynamics. As long as you use the same room every time you have a consistent reading. Just remember sound is waves so don’t conduct the test outside. Do you wanna conduct it in a room so that it will contain those waves. As long as the room is the same and all of the items in the room stay the same you’re readings will be consistent.
If the same parameters are outdoors it makes no difference in regards to testing. If all quantifiable parameters are used.
@@boundlessobsession6266 ok so the answer to the question is try both you might find a difference.
I'd love to see the target noose fully isolated (placed outdoors). I'm also really interested in seeing you test bow noise differences with varying arrow weights. I also want to see target bows tested just for comparison purposes. Great video!! Revist this topic soon please!!!
My bad for commenting before I watched the end of the video lol. 😂😂😂
Great idea! I think this is totally relevant.
Bow noise is an important thing to consider. I bet the engineers for the manufacturers are all upset you guys just brought to light a new source of competition for them deal with. 😂😂
Thanks Tim and Josh. I thought the decibel difference on draw were very interesting. From a close in whitetail hunter.
Definitely should throw in the Darron consequence. The first time I ever heard that bow I immediately turned around to check it out and how quiet it was!
I think you guys have something here. I would like to see the test you were talking about at the end of this video. Testing: monkey tails, arrow weight, stabilizers, exc.... do they make a difference?
Yes I would love sound to be incorporated into the testing.
Definitely do a whole series on everything you mentioned and also throw some budget bows to compare as well
I always hear how quiet my Mathew’s is and it’s very important when hunting. I would think that sound is very important and it coincides with the vibration because the vibration is going to put off a sound. VERY IMPORTANT! Josh needs to add.
My own Alaskan XT, after I set it up with real speed nocks and cat whiskers, averaged 76 dB with a dB meter and a phone app from 18" away.
Do the same test outside. However, shoot 40 yards away. With audio devise next to the bow. Would that produce a different number?
Great video. I find it interesting the one bow that was really tuned to the arrow’s was quieter. Not taking anything away from the ethos because that bow is super smooth and quiet. Just curiosity if a bow is out of tune is it more loud?
I think the second sound of the arrow hitting the target is loudest?? Great info!! Would love to see a longer shot maybe shooting from indoors to a longer target outdoors for better results?? Love your vids!!
Nice Trail 100!!! I've got a 90 and a 100 myself here in WA State.
I think it's cool info and frankly, how loud a bow is ranks 2nd to me behind forgiveness. Thanks guys, I dig it!
Something everyone does need to remember is that the decibel scale is logarithmic. Which means for every 10db it goes up, the sound doubles. 80 is twice as loud as 70. So that 3 db spread is huge.
I’d love to see this in lieu of the vibration test on MFJJ’s bow reviews, with the addition of tone.
Plus I’d like to see what stabilizers and additional weight on stabilizers does. In my anecdotal experience, with a second bar, and tripling the weight on the stabs, I’ve removed the string silencers (18 grains apiece) which turns my 70 yard pin into about a 74 yard pin.
Edit: I was initially wrong, it goes up by factors of 10. So a 3db difference is almost a doubling of sound intensity. From 70 to 80 would be a 10x louder noise.
Yeah.
Does that mean 3 decibels is not always the same? Like the difference from 67-70 is not as drastic as 77-80? I’m just asking because I really don’t know how decibels work
@@bigz5262 right.
The difference between 79 and 80 is less than the difference between 80 and 81.
@@gavinatkins2671 interesting. Thank you
@@lgentry4832 oh shit, you’re right. My bad. So that means for every 10db it’s 10 louder and for every 3 ish it doubles in sound. So the quietest bows are half the volume of the loudest bows.
They’ll hear it, but the distance at which they’ll react changes, and with enough speed you can get to a point where their reaction simply isn’t fast enough.
broadhead choice to me has made a difference, just my .02, thank you doing the test- nice to see just how close they are
I think it was a great idea not necessarily going to change the bow i would choose because of sound but great idea and neat to see :)
Good stuff. It may be worth digging into the science from a sound point of view to determine what is a 'significant' difference in terms of dbs. Also, I like that you distanced yourself from the target. There are a few other archery channels that measure sound, but they are so close to the target its hard to tell if they are measuring the sound of the bow or the arrow hitting the target.
Great video , I'm sure many people talk about how loud a bow is , but do companies ever advertise the loudness of a bow ? thank guys MFJJ - Tim for your Chanel , I watch you guys all the time ... Peace from Germany Tim
Id be curious to see back to back tests indoors and outdoors just to see how they track. Though i know the airport being just down the road wont help ha
I think this interesting topic. I would think you are on the right track with heavier bow would be quieter for the fact that when the bow is shot and makes contact with the sting stop you essentially are ringing out the natural frequency of the bow. when an object has more mass, the natural frequency tends to be a lower frequency and lower frequency has a lower perceive sound intensity or sharpness. think of striking a tuning fork the difference would be the initial strike being the sound we hear, and the ring down would be vibration in the bow. Things like stabilizers and other dampening devices I would think play a role in the natural frequency's amplitude. I would think that draw weight would be a factor because the natural frequency or resonant frequency is equal to square root of k/m where is k is spring stiffness and m is mass. But if you are shooting identical arrows the impact would be larger in amplitude. These are things that just come to mind but I only pretend to understand physics to get through school.
Functionally, i don't see enough difference to really matter. Scientifically there is a decent difference. Decibels is not linear. 3 decibels would make a difference at 20+ yards
Very interesting, I wonder if you could do something similar with arrow fletching?
With all starting data points the same, draw length, weight, arrow weight, target distance and shot to mic distance the same, 3 to 3.5 decibel s doesn't seem that much, but in the field it should make a huge difference.
The Mathews and Elite had the lower frequency of noise, like a thump, wheras the rest had a more high pitched twangy( lack of better word) sound. Like a sharper ting with less sustain.
All being equal, its a great baseline test.
And I also believe the importance will be determined by the type of hunt you do. Western hunters shoot farther therefore the animal could possibly hear that bow popping off, as an Eastern whitetail Hunter usually takes a shorter shot where even if the bow is a little louder 20 to 30 yards depending on the speed won't make too much of a difference.
I know from my own experience of just trying out different things that a 427 grain arrow out of my 63 lb bow is more quiet than the 329 grain arrow i use for 3d.
These are just my experiences, but I think what you guys are doing is great especially for those that are very interested in having the quietest setup has to be able to take those longer shots without being noticed especially in the woods where that sound is not normal.
Thank you guys for doing what you do I think putting a sound test of some sort as long as it's obviously set up so that everything is the same which you guys do so well, would be a great addition to bow reviews.
I figured the Matthew was going to be the quietest cuz it did seem to be through all the testing that I've seen of it online, but I was surprised at the elite especially when Tim first started shooting that and how it didn't make a lot of twangy sharp noises when fired.
There are a couple other comments like this, but I'll make a suggestion. I did see a video somewhere where the testers shot into an area surrounded by foam so that the arrow impact wasn't what was measured. Maybe a good test if safely done would be to shoot out a door or window with test equip indoors next to bow? Others comments and my brain as well feel as tho this is a.testbof arrow noise and impact noise. Yes, the bow noise is a part of the measurement, but it just seems like the impact dominates the sound we hear. Same as shooting at home!
I wonder if you could also add the duration of the sound. Might show another aspect of how the bow vibrates.
Thanks Tim and Josh....also nice 110
Yes pls more of this.
noted!
The Mach had a room noise level of 59 and the second test was at 62.5. That’s nearly the same difference between the bows. Could you tell the difference in the room while testing? And the prime was one of the slowest and has some good weight to it so wonder how it would have stacked up. Would have been nice to see the draw weight of each too. We’ve all had some bows pull 72 lbs maxed and others 69 lbs. Awesome video though. We all like seeing numbers like this.
I wouldn't mind seeing some content going down another rabbit hole of archery information relevance aside it would be interesting to see the data on the products we use and their affect on it wouldn't mind see I ng a comparison to a target setup to see the real difference in sound just for curiosity
Great Job!!!! I think MFJJ should include the noise test!!!! It’s another factor that definitely matters!!!!
Can this test be done outside with the meter at 20-25 yards and the target at 40 yards or so? Since this test is indoors the meter might be picking up the impact of the target, not so much the sound of the bow.
I'm imagining that the decibel meter is the deer's ear. In the video the meter is about 6 feet away and it's indoors. having the meter at 20-25 yards or farther would be a much better comparison to a hunting situation and what the deer might actually hear. Rustling leaves is about 20-30 db so anything significantly louder than that where the deer is standing will spook them.
There's a lot of tangibles to consider... Top of my head though, when testing all these bows, you should use some more constants. IE... Same Arrow Rest, Same Arrow (Length, Weight, & Fletching), w/ or w/o a stabilizer, same exact draw weight, any additions onto the string (Peep, Silencing, D-Loop, string or brass nocks), even consideration to the release aid used. Then if you want to even go further, consider not only the weight/mass of the bow itself, but what material is it made from (carbon, aluminum, etc.). Consider what any joint in the bow is constructed with (where the riser meets the limbs, or limbs meeting the cams). Anything else attached to the bow, such as limb dampeners. All this being said, there's a lot to break down. I do feel that a video taking more of these constants into consideration would be "interesting".
Would be interesting to see how my Bear BR33 would stack up. Its really quiet with double stops
Refrigerator as a backstop is a nice touch ~
Does using a limb driven rest make more noise than a whisker biscuit?
Now take any one of those bows and retest after one suppressor is added. Eg. Retest with monkey tails. Remove then add a stabiliser, remove then add a back bar, remove then add a loaded quiver! Finally Let’s see if a bow with the those 3 additional suppressors can better the readings you just got when it’s got a quiver fitted.
Yes...add it to your review
Interesting. I have a lift 33 and and elite omnia. The elite is quieter and much more dead in hand than the lift. From what I remember from shooting the ethos, it was quieter and more dead than my omnia🤔... I love my lift too but it doesn't seem that quiet and it has way more vibration so I'm a little confused with these results.
Interesting
Appreciate the work you guys are doing! Great video, I think it’s a solid test-more info for us bow nerds.
Tim, were the Mathews and Bowtech a little stiffer on the draw? It sounded like those two took a little more effort.
i think all my bows are quiter than that, but the most quiet biw i ever had was a 2004 bowtech extreeme vft at 73lb and 30" with a 480gr arrow and 125gr tip
that thing was so quiet i be shooting by the deck and people on the deck sitting couldnt hear it except arrows hitting target -with this biw this happened on numerous times while shooting with people near by with back to me, would always go oh man did you just shoot i didnt even hear your bow just the arrow slaming the bag.
still have the bow but havent used it almost 20 years -so many new ones since and all flag ship and can never have one come even close to that level , but i do get them pretty quiet especially older bowtechs
@TimConnor13 Do you set all your axis on your sight out in the field or is that something a pro shop should do?
Isn't the arrow hitting the target impacting the reading?
I wonder if the Decibel level reading would be quieter if this experiment was done outside due to the lack of echoes bouncing against the wall
Yes likely so, but it is all relevant to the environment. As long as tested in the same spot it’s a relative reading.
This is interesting to see, but you should also state what the speed difference is between them to see if the noise is comparable to the speed also
I’m assuming the same arrow, the rest needs to be the same and completely bare string or the same accessories.
Would be interesting to see how these same bows would stack up decked out as a total hunting rig arrows stabilizers string stabilizer I'm sure between you Josh an some friends you could get this done
I would be interested in a vidya that shows how effective string silencers, stabs and chit are at actually making a bow quieter.
I noticed the Hoyt didn’t have a stubby on. I’m curious if this would’ve made a difference.
I would like seeing Mfjj sound testing new bows.
I think these tests are good, if manufactures know this is an important issue to their consumer, they will strive to make a quieter bow.
that'd be cool!
I think if a bow manufacturer advertises how quiet it is, then it’s merited to test claim that against the other bows. Most flagship bows are pretty dang quiet. I am curious to see the carbon bow version of this though!
The conditions for the test should probably be changed: Pick a range where the target is far away enough that the decibel meter doesn’t pick up that report and also the acoustics of the room you’re in: Shooting a bow inside is going to report much louder than when shooting outside. Also, place the meter closer to the bow, almost adjacent to the archer, because the sound of the arrow soaring through the air can also be read and might skew the results.
Otherwise, this is a great idea and should be further improved upon for future product reviews
Based on the sound profile of the youtube video... I wonder if the peak sound you are picking up is actually the "thwack" of the arrow on the target. Can you give it a test run with the target closer or farther away to confirm? If the target noise outpaces the bow noise that would throw a wrench in the results.
We did do that prior. At a couple feet we were getting the sound of the target (two readings actually). So we moved it back as far as we could. With the distance of the decibel reader, the separation of the door frame, and the direction of the reader pointed away from the target I think it is highly unlikely.
Enjoyed the vid but why not use the evolve30? Even though weight and sound weren't truly reflective of eachother seeing that the 2nd lightest and heaviest bows were the quietest. But the carbon could be eliminated from the equation with the evolve30.
How much of that noise is the arrow hitting the target. Seems louder than the bow. you should try this outside so you can take the arrow sound out of the equsation,
Ethos the quietest and Nirvana the loudest hands down. Though 2 days ago i listened AC/DC in Sevilla (Spain) and even loudest Yeah!!🎸💥
Is it measuring the sound of the bow or the impact of the arrow? Obviously the db ratings are different. Just throwing that out there. Thanks guys.
I’m more curious how a heavy arrow build compares in sound to a light arrow build. Say a 550gr arrow compared to a 420gr arrow. I shot some Easton dangerous game arrows through my Hoyt and it seemed extremely quiet. They just drop like a rock after 60 yards.
Hey Tim, love the videos and I am always excited when a new one comes up. I have a question, why is it no one talks about the Bear Persist? I find it to be a great shooting bow. Just wanted to get your opinion on that. Thanks and keep up the great content!!
When deer hunting bow noise is important but arrow noise is even more important.
I definitely think MFJJ should do sound measurements in all bow reviews. Something that I think Tim could really nerd out about is what kind of sound the bow makes, low pitch, high pitch. I think that would be really interesting.
What meter are you using and what is its sample rate?
I think, what matters maybe more than peak dB is the frequency. The peak dB isn’t going to matter much if it’s in a frequency that a deer can’t even hear. In Australia I doubt it, but surely in the states with all the research done by wildlife mgnt, there must be papers on this. Food for thought anyway.
I would be interested to see a comparison from last years bow to see how much they have changed
Man i wish you had the Bear Persist in that test. When MFJJ did the review it was quieter than most of the other bows. I have one and shoot beside Mathews guys and wven they acknowldge how quiet it is. Good twst just wish you had a Bear in their.
What about the rest? I would think a whisker biscuit would be louder than a drop away
Say, that target you got back there looks just like a beer fridge! Where can I get one of those?
What a great idea. I can 500% see db #s advertised next to IBO #s in the near future. Especially since it feel like bows are kinda at the peak of most other things.
Edit: Also, I wonder if Primes different aluminum makes a difference.
I think it would be great to see real world sound levels. No one hunts in your shop. Get in the open air with the target farther down range and see how much more quiet they are.
Josh should definitely add it to his reviews/tests
It’s certainly relevant for hunting. Arrow hitting the target? Not sure from the video if that makes a difference or not. Keep up the great videos boys, follow each of ya.👍
Josh always has the coolest trucks lol