Squatch253 is a Master Mechanic, that teaches us how to respect mechanical devises and give us a logical approach how to bring back devises to a reasonable working condition. I am almost thru all his videos and am still amazed at his skill sets. Merry Christmas! To you and your Dad and your family’s. John
What a seemingly complicated removal, and I imagine could have been made so much simpler if only a mechanic/ repair man would have access to and read trough a service manual! In watching this, I was thinking of all the new swear words that would be 'invented' by an 'uneducated person' in this process. Thanks again, Squatch!
had the pleasure of working on a 38 d2, pony start problems. carb. rebuilt the carb. all day. pouring rain. boss trying to rush things. rope start. started right up. boss very quiet. priceless!
Very informative, thank you. It is amazing that all the people who abuse equipment and parts, seem to put their limited expertise into welding repairs, rather than the much easier method of using a good manual, and replacing worn or broken parts in a timely manner
Yes, just a few more bolts to remove. Stop be patient and first know how the thing is put together. The problem lies with efficiency and trying to rush a job so a mechanic can beat shop labor time and get on to the next job when in all reality he caused more work and downtime because he busted another part in the process. Nice video! Thanks for sharing!
Hey! Easy now, I was a sailor back in the day, and I did my best to control my cussing! 😂😂😂😂 Seriously though, I don't have a Cat D2, but I love how to videos like this with a lot of detail and pointers on what to do, and especially what NOT to do!! Thanks!!
Absolutely Brilliant videos. Problem with my d2 5u cant get the clutch and pinion out. I think the 4 little screws have dropped off. Cant engage to make smaller. Have taken the governor cover off. Ron.
Holy moly. !#! How many shop bays do you have. ???? I think it was a 5U was the last D-2 I worked on. That was 83 ????? A whole lifetime ago. Good how to to video. !!! 👍👍👍👍
Really good too seeing that. I totally agree with repairing the latch ears and fix properly. Just proves the point of how people just want to get by . Until things break off! cursing not thinking about the unit as whole working unit. Wondering why they didn't fixing right the first time. Then sell the machine for reasons to get rid it . But soo true
Hey Squatch, just yesterday I removed the pinion drive assembly from my 1941 5J. Try as did I could not compress and latch the pinion sleeve which is why its removal was needed. The pony motor was removed. No amount of twisting and turning the clutch end would clear the governor housing. Just too long not being latched. I had to remove the governor housing. The bad photo in the service manual shows the governor housing removed. Once out, the pinion sleeve was a rusted mess. Probably had never been out of the engine in over 50 years and never saw a drop of oil. No oil in the idler gear well either. It seems the pony motor and pinion drive all suffer much neglect. The pony motor is about as bad. All bearings need renewed. Bore and valves are good though. Great video. Now how about one where you can't compress the pinion sleeve and have it latched? Waddayadoo?
For all of the quality built into the D2 it seems that the starting system is the weakest from an engineering standpoint. Perhaps, back in the day when they finished the D3400 engine design they pondered "How are we going to start this thing?" Maybe it was handled by junior or apprentice engineers. A lot of drinking was done back then perhaps that is part of the story. The reality is lost to history.
Agreed. Viewed as a sacrificial or consumable system, the light construction makes more sense. There could also be a sprinkling of pre-world war II, depression era cost saving thoughts in the engineering as well.
Thanks. I'm positive I'll never be working on a D2, but it is interesting nonetheless. I wish you had spent an extra minute to also show how to remove the starting engine, since not every backyard mechanic is likely to have the manual.
@@squatch253 It would be great if you keep the camera rolling for all work that you are going to do on that starting engine. Your experience is most helpful, much appreciated. What's the trick to get that center inside bolt of the starting engine that threads into the bell housing? Also, if you can provide info on filter change out, priming, and checking pump, rack, injectors. Thanks again!
Very interesting and great videos! I have spent the last several days getting a pony motor running on a 3J 1939. After some carb work, I was able to get it running tonight. I engaged the pinion and then engaged the drive, which in turn spun over the diesel. After several minutes of trying to start the diesel (which didn't) the pinion disengaged and I haven't been able to get it to re-engage. it just grinds hard. So I quit for the night and found your page looking for solutions. Any advice would be appreciated. I really didn't want to get too far into this since I don't own it.
yup I agree they should have fixed it. sometimes when people see tie wire ( I don't know if there is or was any) they would rather die then to go into that area
Great video, I don't understand how the starter motor gears engage with the diesel engine to mesh in smoothly or is there a clutch in the starter unit,
I bought a D47U with this problem and the guy did get some of it out after jerking on it with a chain and front end loader. Destroyed the pinion and pony. I just pull start it for now until I can pull the engines out and repair it. I have some pictures that will break your heart of my poor cat.
I'm working on mine right now. I have the pony motor pulled out and all bolts removed. The pinion assembly wont come out. It keeps "springing" back into the flywheel housing like it's being held. And suggestions?
@@squatch253 thank you. It was the o ring. Hit it with some penetrating fluid and it came out with some fiddling. Thank you for your videos. They really have me wanting to get this thing going. It has the hyster d2n winch on it like in one of your other videos.
Amazing just how SMALL that starting engine is.... I would have thought even with the small diesels that it would be a small 2cyl gas engine up there... that must be one torquey little thing
@squatch253 thanks. That worked and the first time I hit the pony starter it fired right up. Had to let it run for about 30 minutes before the engine would fire up. Looks like the engine has some blow by coming out the oil fill port and the oil drain on the right side pony head leaks oil. A few hydraulic leaks. Other than that ran great. Thanks for the help again! Much appreciated.
Cat recommends using the same grade and weight of oil that you also use in the diesel engine, but another trick that has been proven to work well is filling that pinion clutch compartment with automatic transmission fluid because it lubricates everything just fine, plus it creates a lot less drag on the clutch discs and makes it easier to engage the pinion without gears grinding 👍
@@squatch253 thank you I used motor oil for now but will drain flush and use ATF . One last question I removed pony motor to remove the pinion assembly. I ordered the pony base gasket from CAT but can’t find the part # for upper coolant gasket the thick rubber one that is wedged between pony and diesel engine. Can you please share that # …. Thx
There are two different versions of that seal, depending on your top cover port and if it's been modified for the "new" version of that seal or not. Check out the video in the link below, in it I explained everything there is to know about those top cover mods and what type of seal you'll need, as well as part numbers - ruclips.net/video/9s1pv2qvVlY/видео.html
I suppose if they bought the machine with the latches broken and never new it should lock in automaticity, they thought holding the lever back manually was just the way the engine was supposed to be started?
I've been helping a guy with his 5J D2 and just learned that the pinion needs to be engaged. We have just been engaging the clutch and the main engine cranks. So the pinion is stuck in the engaged position. Of course we haven't got the main started yet, so maybe when it does, the pinion will disengage.
Hello im working on my grandfather's D4. The engine number is 7U16081. Im waiting on some manuals to come in the mail. Could you tell me if that is in fact the serial number and does it have the D315 engine
@@squatch253 rarely working midnights do I ever get to see somebody's video first so it was a real treat this morning! Keep up the great work on all the projects!
the old no 10 snaped off the arm to engage the pionion so someon cut a hole in the back of the housing and then put a bolt to the shaft and welded a second lever
Michael Spinello the bigger cat dozers you can get a electric start but these smaller d2’s you cannot get one because we had to rebuild our d2 pony and looked for electric motor but no luck
@@stearsfamilyfarms6264 it's a unit with a starter and the stand that replaces the complete pup motor. I talked to the guy on the phone and to ship it to Canada was expensive so I never got it. Auto LEC.com
Hey Squatch253, Geat video! im Jaden and im 15 from Australia but i have an old D4 7U and i am having problems with the pinion sleeve on the starting pinion Please message me if you can so i can ask you some questions!!! :D
You know you'll probably end up making a set of instructional videos, Pal. You';re just too blasted plain talking and knowledgeable not to. You and Pop be extra careful through this killer spell. It's supposed to hit here in a day or two but not nearly as bad as it is there. I've got the porch woodpile heaped up and plenty og gas for generators if need be. I really can't brag on the right-o-way crews here nearly enough. If it wasn't for them and the co-op crew we'd be watching You Tube by kerosene lamp! Thanks, Toby! Stay warm! I know Pop will!
Wasn't even looking for it but exactly as described at 4:50 being done on a D7. Thing was this guy was sprooking what a great low hour non abused machine it was, what a shame. ruclips.net/video/i-cBungm3uc/видео.html
I bet A lot of the ignorance towards that starter lever is the fact that most people have no clue on how it was originally designed to be used, and prob was taught to just simply hold it, never knowing something was wrong. some cases im sure the people are just to lazy and figure they can reweld it for free versus searching for replacement parts too.
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Squatch253 is a Master Mechanic, that teaches us how to respect mechanical devises and give us a logical approach how to bring back devises to a reasonable working condition. I am almost thru all his videos and am still amazed at his skill sets. Merry Christmas! To you and your Dad and your family’s. John
You could give Master Classes on this subject. Your knowledge of these is immense.
What a seemingly complicated removal, and I imagine could have been made so much simpler if only a mechanic/ repair man would have access to and read trough a service manual!
In watching this, I was thinking of all the new swear words that would be 'invented' by an 'uneducated person' in this process.
Thanks again, Squatch!
Having total command of your material is a thing of beauty!
had the pleasure of working on a 38 d2, pony start problems. carb. rebuilt the carb. all day. pouring rain. boss trying to rush things. rope start. started right up. boss very quiet. priceless!
and when i come around again in next life, i`ll know how to do the clutch.
Anybody else watch the entire video despite not owning a 3J or 5J series tractor?
Mmmyess Yep.
I don't own any tractors but I always watch this guys videos.
Yes, seems that it's very similar to my D4 7U, exception being the gov housing.
"Guilty!"
You bet, very interesting, even though I'll never do one!
Knowledge I will never use, but it sure is neat to see these old machines and the tricks and tips needed to keep them rolling being presented.
Very informative, thank you. It is amazing that all the people who abuse equipment and parts, seem to put their limited expertise into welding repairs, rather than the much easier method of using a good manual, and replacing worn or broken parts in a timely manner
Your methodology and attention to detail amazes me every week. Thankyou 👍
Another gem of a video from
Squatch253 :)
Yes, just a few more bolts to remove. Stop be patient and first know how the thing is put together. The problem lies with efficiency and trying to rush a job so a mechanic can beat shop labor time and get on to the next job when in all reality he caused more work and downtime because he busted another part in the process. Nice video! Thanks for sharing!
Hey! Easy now, I was a sailor back in the day, and I did my best to control my cussing! 😂😂😂😂
Seriously though, I don't have a Cat D2, but I love how to videos like this with a lot of detail and pointers on what to do, and especially what NOT to do!! Thanks!!
Great " how to " tutorial video ! Thanks for your time, effort & for sharing !
Another well explained vintage machinery tip & trick , thx.
THANKS Squatch. Thanks very much.
Another great D2 video thanks
Your audio is very nice, good mic setup
You know a lot about these engines.
You can’t start coffee break until until Toby finishes his torque sequence.
Great work as always thanks for sharing 👍
Absolutely Brilliant videos. Problem with my d2 5u cant get the clutch and pinion out. I think the 4 little screws have dropped off. Cant engage to make smaller. Have taken the governor cover off. Ron.
Holy moly. !#! How many shop bays do you have. ????
I think it was a 5U was the last D-2
I worked on. That was 83 ????? A whole lifetime ago. Good how to to video. !!! 👍👍👍👍
Great video. Been their, replaced that!!
Great video. Thanks
Really good too seeing that. I totally agree with repairing the latch ears and fix properly. Just proves the point of how people just want to get by . Until things break off! cursing not thinking about the unit as whole working unit. Wondering why they didn't fixing right the first time. Then sell the machine for reasons to get rid it . But soo true
very useful! thank you for posting.
Hey Squatch, just yesterday I removed the pinion drive assembly from my 1941 5J. Try as did I could not compress and latch the pinion sleeve which is why its removal was needed. The pony motor was removed. No amount of twisting and turning the clutch end would clear the governor housing. Just too long not being latched. I had to remove the governor housing. The bad photo in the service manual shows the governor housing removed. Once out, the pinion sleeve was a rusted mess. Probably had never been out of the engine in over 50 years and never saw a drop of oil. No oil in the idler gear well either. It seems the pony motor and pinion drive all suffer much neglect. The pony motor is about as bad. All bearings need renewed. Bore and valves are good though.
Great video. Now how about one where you can't compress the pinion sleeve and have it latched? Waddayadoo?
For all of the quality built into the D2 it seems that the starting system is the weakest from an engineering standpoint. Perhaps, back in the day when they finished the D3400 engine design they pondered "How are we going to start this thing?" Maybe it was handled by junior or apprentice engineers. A lot of drinking was done back then perhaps that is part of the story. The reality is lost to history.
Agreed. Viewed as a sacrificial or consumable system, the light construction makes more sense. There could also be a sprinkling of pre-world war II, depression era cost saving thoughts in the engineering as well.
Thanks. I'm positive I'll never be working on a D2, but it is interesting nonetheless. I wish you had spent an extra minute to also show how to remove the starting engine, since not every backyard mechanic is likely to have the manual.
@@squatch253 It would be great if you keep the camera rolling for all work that you are going to do on that starting engine. Your experience is most helpful, much appreciated. What's the trick to get that center inside bolt of the starting engine that threads into the bell housing? Also, if you can provide info on filter change out, priming, and checking pump, rack, injectors. Thanks again!
Hay there, I was wondering if you had a similar video removing the starter pinion on the D311?
As with most things is a lot easier when you know how to do it.
Brilliant. Very informatve
Very interesting and great videos! I have spent the last several days getting a pony motor running on a 3J 1939. After some carb work, I was able to get it running tonight. I engaged the pinion and then engaged the drive, which in turn spun over the diesel. After several minutes of trying to start the diesel (which didn't) the pinion disengaged and I haven't been able to get it to re-engage. it just grinds hard. So I quit for the night and found your page looking for solutions. Any advice would be appreciated. I really didn't want to get too far into this since I don't own it.
yup I agree they should have fixed it. sometimes when people see tie wire ( I don't know if there is or was any) they would rather die then to go into that area
Great video, I don't understand how the starter motor gears engage with the diesel engine to mesh in smoothly or is there a clutch in the starter unit,
@@squatch253 Thanks very much, your explanation is good, I just need to hear the the pinion shaft stop for the engagement to take place, thanks again
Do you happen to know where I can get the mounting gaskets and a pinion gear
Squatch, can you do a video on why they decided to use a pony motor?
Hey my dad is working on a 7J series cat and wants to know if you have to remove the starting motor to get to the bendix?
I bought a D47U with this problem and the guy did get some of it out after jerking on it with a chain and front end loader. Destroyed the pinion and pony. I just pull start it for now until I can pull the engines out and repair it. I have some pictures that will break your heart of my poor cat.
Nice
I'm working on mine right now. I have the pony motor pulled out and all bolts removed. The pinion assembly wont come out. It keeps "springing" back into the flywheel housing like it's being held. And suggestions?
@@squatch253 thank you. It was the o ring. Hit it with some penetrating fluid and it came out with some fiddling. Thank you for your videos. They really have me wanting to get this thing going. It has the hyster d2n winch on it like in one of your other videos.
Amazing just how SMALL that starting engine is.... I would have thought even with the small diesels that it would be a small 2cyl gas engine up there... that must be one torquey little thing
@@squatch253 ahhh, like a boxer setup? thats pretty neat. 10HP still is a small amt to spin the other engine over.
My pinion is engaged and I can't get the pony motor to start since it turns the engine over also. How do I disengage the pinion?
@@squatch253 No I'm an idiot and engaged it. Thanks for the help, I'll let you know how it goes.
@squatch253 thanks. That worked and the first time I hit the pony starter it fired right up. Had to let it run for about 30 minutes before the engine would fire up.
Looks like the engine has some blow by coming out the oil fill port and the oil drain on the right side pony head leaks oil. A few hydraulic leaks. Other than that ran great.
Thanks for the help again! Much appreciated.
have you ever done a video of rebuilding the starter pinion. My 318 will not lock in
can you send me and email address
Is there any way to make it "latch" on my d318 without removing the starting engine?
you can look me up on facebook. We are working on similar projects
didn't really want to join acmoc
How many years have you been working on the Cat. D2’s?
I bet if you had bleachers in your garage people would fill them up to watch you work on these machines.
Governor have to come off on a 5u with the 311 ?
Thank you
What oil viscosity is used in the pinion assembly?
Cat recommends using the same grade and weight of oil that you also use in the diesel engine, but another trick that has been proven to work well is filling that pinion clutch compartment with automatic transmission fluid because it lubricates everything just fine, plus it creates a lot less drag on the clutch discs and makes it easier to engage the pinion without gears grinding 👍
@@squatch253 thank you I used motor oil for now but will drain flush and use ATF . One last question I removed pony motor to remove the pinion assembly. I ordered the pony base gasket from CAT but can’t find the part # for upper coolant gasket the thick rubber one that is wedged between pony and diesel engine. Can you please share that # …. Thx
There are two different versions of that seal, depending on your top cover port and if it's been modified for the "new" version of that seal or not. Check out the video in the link below, in it I explained everything there is to know about those top cover mods and what type of seal you'll need, as well as part numbers - ruclips.net/video/9s1pv2qvVlY/видео.html
@@squatch253 ok thank you for your help .
@@squatch253 you wouldn’t happen to know where I could find the cap for the radiator on this RD4 1936 4G438 it’s a more like a cover with wing nut….
I suppose if they bought the machine with the latches broken and never new it should lock in automaticity, they thought holding the lever back manually was just the way the engine was supposed to be started?
I've been helping a guy with his 5J D2 and just learned that the pinion needs to be engaged. We have just been engaging the clutch and the main engine cranks. So the pinion is stuck in the engaged position. Of course we haven't got the main started yet, so maybe when it does, the pinion will disengage.
Hello im working on my grandfather's D4. The engine number is 7U16081. Im waiting on some manuals to come in the mail. Could you tell me if that is in fact the serial number and does it have the D315 engine
Is there an email I can send some questions to? Would you mind?
Uploading awful early today!
@@squatch253 rarely working midnights do I ever get to see somebody's video first so it was a real treat this morning! Keep up the great work on all the projects!
the old no 10 snaped off the arm to engage the pionion so someon cut a hole in the back of the housing and then put a bolt to the shaft and welded a second lever
what should i do it starts fine so should i leave it
@@squatch253 thank you for the advice also the brake lever/clutch is very wobblely what about that thank you
Have you ever converted one to electric start?
Michael Spinello the bigger cat dozers you can get a electric start but these smaller d2’s you cannot get one because we had to rebuild our d2 pony and looked for electric motor but no luck
@@stearsfamilyfarms6264 I've seen the electric starter for the D2 on the internet, brand new for $1500 us
Mighty Moe Excavating does it take the place of the pony or is that where you send your block in and they install a starter
@@stearsfamilyfarms6264 it's a unit with a starter and the stand that replaces the complete pup motor. I talked to the guy on the phone and to ship it to Canada was expensive so I never got it. Auto LEC.com
Hey Squatch253, Geat video! im Jaden and im 15 from Australia but i have an old D4 7U and i am having problems with the pinion sleeve on the starting pinion Please message me if you can so i can ask you some questions!!! :D
Hi; Starting an old D8 with gas starting engine, one had keep pressure on the engagement lever until the diesel started
NICE ONE
You know you'll probably end up making a set of instructional videos, Pal. You';re just too blasted plain talking and knowledgeable not to. You and Pop be extra careful through this killer spell. It's supposed to hit here in a day or two but not nearly as bad as it is there. I've got the porch woodpile heaped up and plenty og gas for generators if need be. I really can't brag on the right-o-way crews here nearly enough. If it wasn't for them and the co-op crew we'd be watching You Tube by kerosene lamp! Thanks, Toby! Stay warm! I know Pop will!
Wasn't even looking for it but exactly as described at 4:50 being done on a D7. Thing was this guy was sprooking what a great low hour non abused machine it was, what a shame. ruclips.net/video/i-cBungm3uc/видео.html
I bet A lot of the ignorance towards that starter lever is the fact that most people have no clue on how it was originally designed to be used, and prob was taught to just simply hold it, never knowing something was wrong. some cases im sure the people are just to lazy and figure they can reweld it for free versus searching for replacement parts too.