An Extraordinary Introduction to the Birth of Israel and the Arab-Israeli Conflict
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- Опубликовано: 17 дек 2023
- Israeli journalist Haviv Rettig Gur takes us on a deep dive into the origins of Israel--how European Jew-hatred gave birth to Zionism and the founding of the Jewish state in 1948. He then turns to the rise of Palestinian terrorism and explains why the Palestinian experience and the Israeli experience are so incompatible. Along the way, Gur places the Holocaust in a much broader European context. I learned an immense amount from this conversation and hope you do, too.
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Great conversation! I stand with Israel!
Most inspiring yet edifying dialogue I have heard since October 7 about Israel and their current struggle. Bless you and may Israel be forever strong and prosperous.
I've just listened to this for the third time because I want to memorise these facts, to argue them better with Israel's opponents. Thank you so much for such a well articulated discussion.
1897 Zionist Congress - read - Palestine ID as the land they would occupy -127 years ago.
Wow! The best history lesson of the plight of Jewish people and what brought about the state of Israel that I have ever heard! So much insight into the determination of self preservation of the Israeli people. What had been a fractured and politically divided nation only a few months ago is now united with one cause, to live and support one another.
I have a sticker I received while in Jerusalemin in 2017 that I promised I would display on my car, the star of David (blue and white) with the words "United We Stand". It is still on my window. I am a Christian American but I pray for and support Israel. God bless you and keep you!
💙
Nothing justifies stealing other people's land, nothing and nothing justifies blowing children up, starving people, apartheid or keep on expelling people off their land.
You should have visited Gaza or the West Bank.
Stop genocide
Free Palestine
You are a jew.
Do Jews believe in Jesus?
127 years ago and 44 years before the holocaust - 1897 The Zionist Congress.
This is one of the best, most insightful interviews you have done is some time.
He is incredible. gur is the smartest commentator I have found on I/P matters. He does a weekly hour on a podcast called call me back with Dan senor. I listen to every one multiple times.
@@Readinganddifference Thanks for the tip!
@@Readinganddifference It is not I/P it is I/A or more accurately I/J.
P was artificially invented in July 1964, for reversing the Goliath vs David image, part of the cold war.
@@ef2718 haha ok I get you. So, what do A or J stand for?
@@Readinganddifference Arabs, Jews.
That unusual thing - a talk on Israel which actually has something informative to say. Thank you
I 1st heard Haviv on Jack Carr and he is amazing. This podcast should be mandatory for everyone in the world today to listen. Haviv only started from 1881 but the history of persecution against the Jews goes back at least to when the Jews were in Egypt prior to the Torah at Mt Sinai and it's been on and on ever since. עם ישראל חי!
"If you don't follow the law, you'll get into a fight."
Exactly, Haviv is wrong..
The first leader to bring the Israelis back to independence in Israel was Prophet Moses AS, he was the first Zionist leader, some 3300 years ago.
The second (in importance) was Ezra the scribe 538 BC.
Yaron Brook referenced this interview on his show. I'm glad he did.
I am from East Asia, and I am struggling to understand why, why were there so much “bottom-up“ hatred for Jews in Europe?
The Christian attitude that jews not the roman are the cause of Jesus's death. Minorities everywhere have frequently been scape coated. Jews are given unpopular jobs and are unwelcome wherever they live for millenia whether Europe or the middle east. Pogroms vary in severity and number depending on where but the Islamic messianic vision includes the murder of all jews. Jews don't accept the majority religious attitudes. Basically they are hated for being Jews
Then you need to read my comments where I explain what happened in my country Romania while the Jewry was there at the beginning of the century. There are a lot of historians, articles, books, witnesses, documents in archives who talk about what Jews were actually doing.
@@Catalina-zu8xx can you link something? I don't see any other comment by you.
I do not know but I have heard others say it is because they crucified Jesus. Jesus is the son of God for billions of Christians. They broke their promise with God to prepare the world for Jesus’ coming so they are no longer the chosen people even though they still believe they are. Or perhaps jealously because they are successful business people. Maybe both combined.
they are very crafty at writing propaganda.
All true, well thought out and researched. Perspective is everything.
Haviv has a real talent for dispensing with academics and relating this story in a very human way. I really appreciate the insights about why maybe Palestinian Arabs just don't quite understand the motivations of Israeli Jews and how the Germans misunderstood the influx of Jews as intentional Russian political meddling, and all the other totally understandable and tragic misunderstandings by flawed humans in this history.
Genuine question - if the Israeli Jews are mostly Arab? Why do they speak of the “Arab” palestenians with so much distain. Why did Miko peled and other Israelis say that they grow up called palestenians “the Arabs of Israel” 🤔 it’s just interesting right, if ur Arab yourself why are you isolating a group amongst ur population as Arab Israelis…. Could it be this guy is talking nonsense and the truth is Israelis are not Arab at all and KNOW it. They’re all white Europeans
@@tjc4085 um, I guess id suggest you visit Israel. Or, less commitment, even watch an episode of Fauda. There's a hell of a lot of brown Jews. I mean this isn't an unknowable thing right? But if you just think the Israeli puppet masters are all white and kinda Bennetton ad-ed their way into this fantasy, I'd say that's, well, pretty bigoted. Which I'm sure isn't what you were going for, but sometimes we're the baddies.
@@tjc4085
Eastern European Supremacy. Ashkenazi Jews get a pass for being incredibly racist because they weaponize the holocaust.
@@tjc4085900,000 jews were expelled from the surrounding Arab nations from the 1940's through to the early 50s. That's why there are barely any jews in the surrounding Arab nations. Some of these jews came from African nations as well such as Ethiopia and are blacks. Moreover, the jews in Europe were never considered as indigenous to Europe. That's why there was so many discriminatory laws, pogroms, expulsions and finally the holocaust. So the jews in Europe decided it was time to return to their homeland that they were expelled from by the Romans. Perhaps you need to get off tik tok sound bites of nonsense and read history books.
Thank you for apposite post 👌
It was Alexander II, not Alexander I, who was assassinated in 1882. He was replaced by Alaxander III.
This is excellent and absolutely fascinating throughout.
I’m blown away by the quality and quantity of useful takeaways from this discussion. Thank you for truly surprising this Jew heavy with Weltschmerz.
❤
Amazing interview. Thank you Russ and Haviv.
This is incredible.
This was very interesting I really enjoyed the video. Thank you.
This is the most amazing podcast I have ever heard. It is almost 3:00 am and I’m debating whether to watch it again or try to sleep. I want to memorize every word spoken by both of you. There is so much history to learn about getting us to today.
Thank you. I am a Jewish American, but 10/7 has vicariously made me Israeli! A Zionist I have always been, but an Israeli, I dream of being. Thank you, Haviv and Russ for the best history lesson I could have ever imagined.
Haviv is made a mistake.
The first leader to bring the Israelis back to independence in Israel was Prophet Moses AS, he was the first Zionist leader, some 3300 years ago.
The second in importance was Ezra the scribe 538 BC.
I think it might be fairer to say that it isn't the Big Idea most American Jews could see...until October 7. Suddenly, most can see.
WOW!!! Thank you for your educational discussion in this show. I have been wondering for a long time, how the Jewish people ended up in the Holocaust! Thank you so much Russ and Haviv for your great show. I have learned so many interesting parts of the history. Well done! Keep up the good work! GOD bless 🙏 you both.
Amazing. Thank you for this.
Always, look forward to learning something new when Haviv shares what’s on his mind with us.
תודה! נהדר בכמה רמות. one of the most interesting chats of recent weeks.
Remarkable Interview
This is great stuff guys. I wish everyone involved in what is happening in Israel at the moment understood this and why it was seen as important to create a country where Jewish people could go and not face pugrums/persecution.
Thank you guys! This is an absolute must watch/hear !!!!
I agree. The most important discussion I’ve heard and I’ve heard many. Haviv - yasher koach
I get so emotional when I hear the history of the Jewish people. Especially when I watch the film of the Life is beautiful 😍 ( La Vita Bella).❤.
no justification to engage in genocide if Palestinian children & women. It is not a war.
I was astounded when the interviewer wanted to make a point that the arabs were not the jews deported from Arab countries but actually Muslim Arabs as if the differences weren't clear.
It has to be stressed for people who do not live in the middle East, because most people don't know that Arab muslims kill other Arab muslims.
Correction: It was Tsar Alexander II who was assassinated, not Alexander I.
He was succeeded by Alexander III.
This is absolutely brilliant. Thank you.
Thank you for this great information. God Bless King David's Warriors and keep them safe. Love from New Zealand
Fantastic interview👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Hands down the most engaging and informative discussion on the subject as I have heard
Here I would quote the great Einstein:
"I should much rather see reasonable agreement with the Arabs on the basis of living together in peace than the creation of a Jewish state. My awareness of the essential nature of Judaism resists the idea of a Jewish state with borders, an army, and a measure of temporal power, no matter how modest."
Albert Einsten
And yet Einstein was a Zionist, and raised money for the state of Israel.😊
Ha! Tell it to the Arabs!
@@shainazion4073
Any proof of that???? Or is it again Israeli propaganda!
And then when the Moslems decide they don't want the Jews around anymore? And did Einstein really believe that the Moslems would share power with the Jews? Do you believe the Moslems would have? Just curious - would you cite the source please for the Einstein quote?
«Einstein’s support of the Zionist movement and his interest in the Hebrew University were lifelong. He quarreled with Weizmann more than once; he was highly critical of the Hebrew University and, in particular, of its first president; he deplored the shortcomings of Zionist policy toward the Arabs; but he never abandoned his belief in the central principles of Zionism. If young people (or others) today, whether Jews or gentiles, who, like the young Einstein, abhor nationalism and sectarianism and seek social justice and believe in universal human values-if such people wish to know why he, a child of assimilated Bavarian Jews, supported the return of the Jews to Palestine, Zionism, and the Jewish state, not uncritically nor without the anguish which any decent and sensitive man cannot but feel about acts done in the name of his people which seem to him wrong or unwise, but, nevertheless steadily, to the end of his life-if they wish to understand this, then they should read his writings on the subject. With his customary lucidity and gift for penetrating to the central core of any issue, whether in science or in life, Einstein said what had to be said with simplicity and truth. Let me remind you of some of the things he said and did, and in particular of the path which led toward them.…
www.nybooks.com/articles/1979/11/08/einstein-and-israel/
Brilliantly explained. Heartbreaking and compelling. Thank you.
Phenomenal talk! Thank you for enlightening us Haviv! 👏👏👏
It would be useful to put a note, that mr Gur meant Alexander ll and Alexander lll, not l and ll ;)
🙏🏼
Very clear thinker who has clearly accessed ideas and opinions from many opposing perspectives. Thank you
Fantastic, most informative, l now have a different understanding of the matters l have struggled with most of my life. At almost 77years I'll feel by a little happier.
127 years ago 1897Zionist Congress -44years before ho lo cáustica - they ID Palestine for invasion.
I am sincerely touched by the history of the Jews! And what makes me even sadder is how these people have been threatened from everywhere! Honestly it hurts my heart!
#Israel has the right to defend itself!
#BringThemAllHomeNow 💔🙏💔
right and duty.
Very insightful.
Thank you for this great informative content, learned some quite interesting keynotes
Could listen to him all day!
Terrific conversation 👌
❤ we pray for the peace of Jerusalem daily❣️
Beautiful and insightful to listen to Haviv.
This discussion actually presents facts & experiences.
Victimization at its best
Brilliant discussion. Thks
Excellent. This is my 2nd hearing.
Loved this, so fascinatingly and interesting, I've learnt so much. I've heard people say Zionisim is an evil man-made nationalist social construct. It never sat right with me. This talk has identified why that was. With historical perspective. And it is also very generous and compassnate to the Palestinians too.
To that point, I would dare anyone who believes that Palestinians suffered 74 years of compassion from the Zionist state of Israel, to convert to Islam and go live in Gaza or Hebron for two weeks in a Palestinian house. Only in this way you will get to know this compassion first hand. Bless ❤
@@Catalina-zu8xx
The old community of Jews that used to live in Gaza perished in Islamist riots of 1929, concurrent with dozens of other communities, the massacre in Hebron was documented, you can see the photos of that ISIS style massacre in archives of the NYT. Photos like the gut churning photos of the massacre of Oct. 7 only in black and white.
*In 1929 the massacres were committed mostly by mobs.
1929 is
19 years before the reinstitution of Israel,
38 years before Israel got into Gaza strip,
37 years before the process of appropriating the title Palestinians by Arabs has even started.
Best thinker in English on the seen
You clearly learn from comic books.
@@khubza8999he is not a good historian?
@@charlesedwards5333 If I remember your name correctly I asked you on another video where you had seen Hativ speak about this, managed to find it myself, thanks for the tip, was well worth it.
Re: time 40:00 . Earl G. Harrison conducted a survey of displaced persons (DPs) in Europe and reported recommendation to evacuate all non-repatriable Jews to Palestine. Could you please advise where is his survey of DP-s marking Palestine at 1st place described
Page 7 & 8 of the report mentions it.
Fantastic explanation ❤.
Quite extraordinary.
It is incredibly to listen your talk. I’m refugee from Ex-Soviet Union(Latvia). A lot Latvian Jews were killed in Riga Getto.
In late 60 and beginning 70. My family immigrated to US.
My family immigrated to US because we have relatives in US. My Grandfather, Grandmother my aunts and cousins all were killed in Ukraine by Nazi.
.
I am so sorry.
This is the most thorough yet concise education I've had on this topic. I took 2 college courses in Jewish history & literature and I've read a bit and listened to many YT on the topic. I never understood the anti colonial mindset, I thought it was just slogans and rallying cries by rabid anti-zionists.
Well said 👏👏👏
I just wish anti Israel prostesters would take the time to learn the history and the present ideologies of BOTH sides 🙏
Apparently that is too much to ask for. Appalling this blind slogan shouting going on.
Both sides:
Arabs against Jews
Muslims against Jews
21 Arab countries against Israel
56 Muslim countries against Israel
Islam vs. Judaism
Shia vs. Sunni
Iran vs. Turkey vs. KSA vs. Egypt
USSR/Russia vs. USA
East vs. West
Partial list of drivers of this conflict
The v world needs to watch this 👏👏👏
1:19:10 ........It's also in the Likud charter from 1977
The difference between the two is that Israel has >25% citizens that are not Jews while in Jordan, in Gaza and under the Palestinian authority there are no Jews and by law selling a property to a jew carries a death sentence.
Every person in the world wants to live in peace, however, for some tribal societies peace is what one's tribe achieves by eliminating rival tribes.
The news haven't learnt anything about humanity
It makes their travelling easy as an israeli passport need visas to many countries round the world that is why they hold a duel nationalities 😂😂
And the Hadids who claim to be Palestinians - but they are Americans !!
The majority of Israelis are descendants of refugees who fled to Israel from Arab countries, you can right away understand they can not get passports of countries that expelled their ancestors.
So it is true that when the ships with jews arrived in America were turned away 😢
MS St. Louis ship
Excellent🙏🏻
I appreciate this detailed history. I support the Jewish people and the nation of Israel. - Evangelical Christian, USA
Teach all the children......
Teach the children a bunch of BS? These guys are basically saying most of Israeli Jews are Arab and not European settlers 😂 do you know how funny that is. Just take a peak at Israelis.
Are y'all aware that many families were totally satisfied that their children would ultimately have a much better life here and this was enough.
I like your content..but would love it if you’d put the words you say on the screen in English.. thanks..
Very interesting discussion. Let's not forget that the much maligned and ridiculed Albania was the only nation which had more Jews at the end of WW2 than at the beginning. One can say that they were first occupied by the less psochiopathic Italians until the Nazi take-over after 1943 and also the comparatively small Jewish population. But the mostly Muslim and 'backwards' Albanians looked after and hid the Jews. The Bulgarians, including the Bulgarian King, did much to shield the Jews of Bulgaria (the state before it was enlarged during the War) - they wasted time, obstruced, gave Jews tip-offs etc.
It's interesting that these two nations which are ridiculed in the West and by 'big nations' like UK, Germany, France, Russia are the ones who shielded Jews.
I can confirm that the Romanian state had the same politics regarding Jews at the beginning of the century, despite The Nazi regime of Germany and the Horty regime of Hungary.
It's Tsar Alexander the 2 and 3 he is talking about in the begging, not Alexander the 1 and 2.
Part of the one failure of this is not confronting the fact that the Palestinian narrative is inherently colonial - "From the [water] to the [water], Palestine will be Arab" is part of the larger idea of the Caliphate and the idea that any land conquered by Muslims cannot be controlled by non-Muslims. Adding insult to injury, the Jews (a historically weak people for as long as Arabs have been on the world stage) were the ones to stopped the "Armies of Muhammad" and drove them back. If this weren't evidence enough, Kurds in the 1920s who were attempting to create a non-Arab state were called "Jews" or "Zionists" by the Arabs, the Turks, and the Iranian/Persians because the Kurds were defying imperial desires of the respective groups.
Haviv rightly points out the Russian/Soviet stories and bias against Jews for centuries and the PLO was nurtured by the KGB and they helped sell the idea of Palestinianism as anti-colonialism in spite of the facts to the contrary.
63BC Roman’s invaded Palestine - it is their ancestral land.
Very helpful details. The Jewish story is so amazing because it makes no sense that they would be a target of every country within which they lived for the last 2000 years. At the end, God will protect and save them in the final battle and establish them permanently as Ezekiel the prophet said.
Only if they will not betray and disobey Him by becoming hateful killer settlers in Israel.😅
The Jewish people have given to the world,some of the greatest Doctors. Scientists, Composers,Painters,Artists,Entrepreneurs.The mind boggles at the way they are treated.The world would. Because bereft without them.
But lets also not forget to mention Soros, Gates, Rothschild, Rochefeller, Epstein, Woody Allen, Scovel in the UK, that Hollywood pimp called Swine...or something similar, the warmonger in the US who died recently....and had dedicated his life to destroy other countries and to change regimes. Etc...
Fact!
Excellent history lesson, and very insightful about the Jewish experience until the 1940’s. However, as the historian you claim to be, I think it is very amiss of you to completely skip the Nakba and the violence and ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians in 1947-48 and to this day. You mentioned early on that it was good that the German people admit what they did to the Jews in the 1930s and 40s. And yet you evidently do not admit what the Jewish ‘immigrants’ did to the indigenous people of Palestine from 1945 onwards. That to me is a huge misrepresentation of history.
There are lots of so called facts and then beliefs. Mostly I'm just saddened that they want oppression and slaughter over peace for all. Convincing self that all palestians Wang to wipe israel off the map. River to the sea means lots of things depending of what u believe. I don't personally like the chant cos it's to much a hot potatoe
The Naqba means "catastrophe" in Arabic. This word had nothing to do with the Arabs that fled the land because of the war they started.
The Naqba (catastrophe) was that 5 Arab armies could not win against a ragtag group of Holocaust survivors all speaking different languages, with 1 gun for every three men.
The Naqba (catastrophe) was that the Jews bought malarial swamps and rocky deserts and made these lands bloom, when the Arabs could not.
What is called the Nakba today, didn't happen the way they pretend. *The Institute for Palestine Studies,* an Arab organization based in Beirut stated, *68% of Arabs left their villages without ever seeing a Jewish man with a gun or a soldier*
Search, *_"How we really became refugees, 13 Palestinians tell their personal stories"_* Mamoud Abbas and 12 others from all over Israel, tell the truth about why and how they left the villages and houses and it wasn't because of the Jews!
The Indigenous people of the land are the Jews. The Jews are the descendants of the Israelites and Hebrews. All the diaspora Jewish communities still show 50% of ancient Canaanite DNA even after 2500 years of diaspora. The Jews speak the Only Canaanite language still in Use today. The Jews worship the Canaanite God YHWH and el.
The Palestinians do not have an indigenous language, Arabic is not indigenous to Canaan. The Palestinians are 98% Muslim, the Islamic religion is not indigenous to Israel/Canaan. The God of the Palestinians is Allah, the Pagan Moon God of Arabia, not of Canaan.
Firstly, "nakba" actually originally referred to the Arab failure to destroy the state of Israel in 1947. You need to read the Arabic press of the time to understand this. Secondly, some 700,000 Jews were ethnically cleansed from Turkey (Smyrna was a flourishing Jewish community!), Morocco, Iraq, Syria, Iran.. and came to Israel. These Jews, it has been calculated, left behind land and property some four times the size of the newly created state of Israel. Thirdly, atrocities were committed by both sides. Fourthly, The Arab Palestinians got the lion's share at Partition - Greater Palestine (that is, Jordan, Lebanon, Southern Syria). Read the words of Zuheir Mohsen who admits this : "The Palestinian people does not exist … there is no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians, and Lebanese", though Palestinian identity would be emphasised for political reasons. In a March 1977 interview with the Dutch newspaper Trouw he stated that "between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese there are no differences. We are all part of one people, the Arab nation [...] Just for political reasons we carefully underwrite our Palestinian identity. Because it is of national interest for the Arabs to advocate the existence of Palestinians to balance Zionism. Yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity exists only for tactical reasons...
Oooh God!!!!
An interesting two part article is available online in which it is very clear that ' 'Palestine' was appropriated by ethnic Arabs as their land and national identity in the very late Ottoman period. The place had no clear boundaries until the British Mandate. It was not self governing, nor a governing province, and is not on most Ottoman maps
Prior to all that, Palestine was just a Roman replacement name for the Holy Land ie the ancestral Jewish territories of Judah, Samaria and the Gallilee. It remained so in European literature and in Biblical maps used for historical and religious education.
"Shifting Ottoman Conceptions of Palestine: Parts 1 and 2. Online articles.
Jerusalem Quarterly
Part two is in Issue 48, 2011.
Published in Washington, Ramallah and Beirut.
Salim Tamari,
Institute for Palestine Studies.
From the camel's mouth, before these leaders understood that flapping their lips might come to bite them in the behind in future....
"There is no such country as Palestine. Palestine is a Zionist invention"... 1937 Awni Bey Abdul Hadi
"There is no such thing as 'Palestine' in history, absolutely not.”...Prof. Philip K. Hitti, distinguished Arab historian, author of the authoritative book "The Arabs", testifying at the 1946 Anglo-American Committee of Inquiry.
"Such a creature as Palestine does not exist at all...." Ahmad Shukeiri 1956
"The Palestinian people do not exist...". Zuheir Mohsen (31 March 1977 - interview: “Wij zijn alleen Palestijn om politieke reden,” James Dorsey, Trouw)
“A state named ‘Palestine’ has never existed.”...Hafez al-Assad, Syrian President, at a conference in Amman in 1987
"Brothers, half the Palestinians are Egyptians, the other half are Arabs...." Palestinian Minister Fathi Hammad - In a speech broadcast on Egyptian Al-Helma TV on 23 March 2012
"Jordanians and Palestinians are one people living in two states" .... "Mahmoud Abbas" - 20 Oct 2016
we were exiled in Iraq. The farhud could have escalated to another holocaust if it werent for Israel. Blessed to go back to our homeland. I only wish we had a profitable peace for everyone. We could be allies and bring eachother up, not needing to tear eachother down
Read Avi Shlaim's memoir. The Farhud was not all from Muslim Iraqis...
THAT IS NOT TRUE. JEWS IN IRAQ WERE NOT WILLING TO MOVE TO ISRAEL FOR THEY WERE CONTENT BUT LITERALLY THE ZIONIST FORCED THEM. JEWS WERE ALWAYS SAFE IN THE MUSLIM WORLD.
I am wondering why so many Israelis prefer to carry a dual citizenship?
And other peoples don't?
@@1234singer most Americans don’t.
Well , Maby Europeans do as well as ex refugees@@Hakeem357
@@1234singer
The majority of Israelis are descendants of refugees who fled to Israel from Arab countries, you can right away understand they can not get passports of countries that expelled their ancestors and define them as citizens of an enemy country.
This is 2024
And people are more ignorant than ever, unfortunately
@@lalalalalalalala709 Educated by 15 sec videos on social media.
investigate the presence of the fallacy of omission...
Alexander II was assassinated in 1881. He was succeeded by his son Alexander III.
Who created Hamas
The Muslim brotherhood
Obviously, Israel created Hamas, we all know Islamists do not have free will, incapable of creating terror groups and are easy to manipulate, especially by Jews they hate so much.
God Bless Holy Israel. Love from New Zealand
1:09:10 does that come before or after the "long conversation" with the descendents of the 700,000 Arabs kicked out in 1948 !
There was no 700,000 Arabs kicked out by anyone, the proof from Arabs show. *The Institute of Palestine Studies,* an Arab organization based in Beirut said, *68% of Arabs left their villages without seeing a Jewish man with a gun or a soldier.*
Search, *_"How we really became refugees, 13 Palestinians tell their personal stories"_* Mamoud Abbas and 12 others tell the truth about how and why the Arabs fled their houses and villages, and it wasn't because of the Jews.
1400 years conflict.
As I have very little knowledge of history and trying to understand something, at 1:12:47 you mentioned you have two passports, are they from Bagdad, Yemen or Morocco? How many people are in Israel have duel passport? Where were they born? Where were their father and grandfather born? How and when did they become Israeli? So if they have duel passport they have a place to go, no? What about those Palestinian whose lands are taken, do they have duel passport? Where would they go? Respectfully thank you.
It’s my understanding that quite a few Palestinians have dual passports and use them. Maybe you can ask the Palestinians who you know about that to find out more.
And your attempt at a gotcha wrapped in multiple versions of the same uneducated question, lacks the nuanced understanding of Jewish/middle eastern history to be able to cut into this topic any sharper than a butter knife. And it’s not respectful.
@@OffbeatsMusic Thank you for replying, I’m assuming you’re educated and knowledgeable and that’s the best you can answer?!?! I feel you’re just twisting my questions were for honorable speakers who claimed to have dual passport, and for your reference I would ask the same if the claim was from a Palestinian. If you don't know the answer, I have no appetite to have further conversation with you. Peace.
Greater Palestine is Jordan, Lebanon and Southern Syria. So the Palestinians already have their country. Israel itself is intrinsically the heartland of the Jewish people. There is archeological evidence to prove this, dating thousands of years ago. The Jews reluctantly accepted the portion given to them, the Arab Palestinians did not, wanting all or nothing, and as a result, they have nothing.
@@TMF78The reply to your question was in the interview itself. About 60 plus percent of the Jewish population of Israel are Middle Eastern Jews, who had to flee their original countries. They became refugees. Their lands and possessions were taken. None of them have passports of Yemen, Iraq, Iran, Syria and so on. NONE. And no one ever champions their “right of return”, for some weird reason. It’s only the special Palestinian flowers that deserve such special right I guess? Like they deserve the right to be the only hereditary refugees in the world, too? Because the Jewish refugees of same time period didn’t get to pass the refugee status to their children for some very weird reason - only Palestinians get that right. Very very interesting, wouldn’t you say?
And, if you repeatedly start wars against Israel and lose, sorry, but you don't get to have a dual passport...
God himself gathered the Jewish people from the ends of the earth to return to the land he promised them according to his prophetic word in the holy sriptures.. so the world may know that he is Lord..!!
All this is good history. But how do you explain the present Israeli government that frankly sounds sadistic and genocidal.
At the 12:00 minute mark I quit. What Mr. Haviv R. Gur is asserting regarding Jewish history is NOT what I have learned from other scholars, particularly Thomas Sowell and I'll trust Thomas Sowell before I consider Mr. Gur. However, to be fair to Mr. Gur, I will revisit that piece on Jewish history presented by Thomas Sowell just to be sure that what I remember is accurate.
Hertzl is their George Washington
The first leader to bring the Israelis back to independence in Israel was Prophet Moses AS, he was the first Zionist leader, some 3300 years ago.
The second in importance was Ezra the Scriber 538 BC.
Right of return was given to all Jews when Israel 🇮🇱 was formed but the same was never give to the Palestinians refugees from the NAKBAR which was before 1948.
Isrealis have no place to go
Why is it many reservists returned to 🇮🇱, during this war, from the Diaspora where they love to live.
Why jews?
Why not belarusian , Moldovan, Georgians
Dagestani....
Why jews?
Envy and hatred. Other people couldn't be like Jews
Because of the Churches influence on the population! The Church taught hatred of the Jews Because they said the Jews killed their god, Jesus.
It all begins with the Christian hatred of Jews and the accusation that Jews killed God.
Haviv you are wrong.
The first leader to bring the Israelis back to independence in Israel was Prophet Moses AS, he was the first Zionist leader, some 3300 years ago.
The second in importance was Ezra the scribe 538 BC.
I’m an Israeli Jew who is disillusioned with Zionism. This talk was important for me to know better the Zionist mind. However, you can’t convince a person who is not already brainwashed with your ideology. You totally omit the violence of the Israeli state against Palestinians that I saw with my own eyes in East Jerusalem and the West Bank. I was terrified by this violence when I first encountered it in 2008-2011. Let alone the genocidal rhetoric and ideation that I am hearing from the Israeli mainstream for the last 30 years. What about Baruch Goldstein??? Look in the mirror. Modern Israelis have nothing to do with the European victims of the Holocaust. You are not victims. You must first learn how to behave to other people. I’m not saying Palestinians are saint, but neither are you. For Jews the Zionist Israel is the most unsafe state on earth. This is because Zionists learnt very wrong lessons from the European violence towards the Jews. The only correct lesson was: never impose violence on the Other who lives in your proximity, work hard to not become a nationalist or a bigot. Be universalist, do good for all rather than for your imagined community only. Had Zionists understood that there would be no so much misery in Israel today.
Thank you so much. I am a German ( a German who has been raised to remember the people we don't have with us and remind ourselves why we don't have them) and I am getting more and more desperate with the polarization and the impossibility to address faults on all sides.
I wish zionism had never been neccesary. I wish people were home and had never been given any reason to leave, I wish their countries had been their holy land.
I agree the current situation in Israel is very worrying, it is exactly what I feared would happen when my 17 year old self was crying over Rabin being killed. I have not forgotten Din Rodef and I know what kind of people are in the Israeli government.
People like you give me hope.
1. I am a strong zionist 2. as a refugee from arabmislim country, I at last, I enjoy living in my jewish state
And what of the ills of racism?
Which country has no racism. Which one? Israel is not perfect but its high time the Jewish people had their own country and they have had for thousands of years
@@makhorubhiyo4053why?
To me Israel 's Basic Law is based on ethnocracy, not true democracy.
@@Johnnigstompbecause they do a damn better job of it than you would do over there
😂 I won't fight for us 🙏please please let me fight for us
Israel is God's own chosen people. God is with you through it all. The civilized world is with you through it all.
What a racist comment!!! God is for all people because God does not discriminate! 😢🙏
God punished Jews for their wicked ways and told them they should wander the Earth in order to wash their sins until He would allow them to settle. The true Jews who follow GOD's word are the ones who did not listen to $4T4N who told them it is ok to steal land and opress and kill innocent indigenous people of the Palestinian land. And this was explained by a very well known Rabbi in a recent interview on RUclips.
"Most Zionists don't believe that God exists, but they do believe that he promised them Palestine" Ilan Pappe.
@@lenacohen8913
The fact that they don't believe in divine does not change history or the fact that their ancestors believed. Ilan Pappe is playing with words.