The Cult of Hockey's "Rating Bear, Barrie, Larsson, Tipp & Holland for playoffs performance" podcast
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- Опубликовано: 26 май 2021
- Let's do this!
Digging into the playoff performances of Edmonton Oilers d-men, including Ethan Bear, Tyson Barrie, Slater Koekkoek and Kris Russell, as well as looking at what Dave Tippett and Ken Holland did right and wrong. Bruce McCurdy and David Staples of the Cult of Hockey weigh in, By the Faithful and For the Faithful.
Devin Shore was one of the Oilers best players in the final OT's
Tippet does a great job of building up a team all year, and then deciding to change everything right when the playoffs start.
What? All teams change over the course of a year, whether its injury or player slumps. Oilers were not exactly great over the regular season...good not great. But the playoffs are different. The Oilers lost 3 overtime games, and the Jets exposed the Oiler's vulnerabilities and lack of depth. They lost because of a lack of depth, player slumps, and very few power plays. Tippett was not to blame.
I agree with Jarvis. ... Tippet has to share the blame. He made some bonehead mistakes. Like failing to call a timeout when his team was reeling - with some pathetic excuse about waiting for a "T.V. timeout". ... He had the best line in hockey from the 2019-2020 season and broke them up and only put them back together sporadically and for short times. ... He did what no coach should do ... after his superstar blew up at Puljujaarvi, he moved Puljujaarvi to the 4th line. Who coaches the team? ... He put all of his major scoring on one line so that Winnipeg could check it more easily. ... He can be as good of a coach as you want, but if he pulls those kind of bonehead moves at crucial times, then please don't even try to argue that Tippet doesn't share the blame.
@@sublimemediocrity The oilers were a better team than the Jets all season. If you take away the first few weeks (essentially the training camp that didn't exist) the Oilers were anywhere from top 4 to top 7. The Jet's weren't even close.
Tippet changed the lineup for the playoffs. Took out players, put in others. Put Drai and McDavid on the same line. He didn't do that most of the season. He had a fairly stable lineup most of the season, but changed it up for the playoffs. He did the exact same thing last year. Both years it hasn't worked. Maybe it will next year, but 4 straight loses, overtime or not, doesn't cut it. Especially when you have the proverbial better hockey team, which the Oilers are.
We now have 2 years where the Oilers didn't 'get the bounces', or as you put it, "player slumps". So when that happens you have to start questioning why. There's a common denominator that needs to be explored, and that's Tippet, and his decision making. Everything I've said is objective, the lack of depth, and player slumps is subjective. I agree with you on the Power Plays, but for the PP's the Oilers did have they did very little.
To me the biggest weakness that the Jet's exploited was the Oilers strategy to the games. And ultimately I'm putting that on Tippet.
Love a 100-minute-podcast! It‘s like triple OT again. Hope I‘ll enjoy this one more though... Keep up the good work ❤️
I think Holland has done fairly well since coming in as GM. He's made a few gambles that haven't worked out but not every move always works out. The bottom 6 is a lot stronger than 2 years ago. Special teams went from one of the worst to one of the best. And the Oilers have climbed the leader board in many areas.
A lot of analysts thought the Oilers were one of the winners at trade deadline last year. And what he was able to do with the limited funds in the offseason last year was pretty damn good.
True, this deadline was a disappointment but I understand why he did what he did.
He's not perfect, but I've got time for him. But I agree Bruce, there was too much Detroit talk during yesterday's presser.
I think Tipp deserves a lot of credit for special teams, especially the PK.
@@y0utubedude96 agreed
Don’t forget penalty kill is improved as well
In game 4 OT, despite the insane number of minutes he had played, Nurse looked like he wasn’t as tired as most of the players on both teams were. It was really impressive the way he conserved his energy and was still very effectively playing his position after two overtime periods. I’d love to see more of that from him. He was a force out there.
Glad for Bruce's analysis of players, like Bear
Have to disagree. Kulikov was the problem. Poolman goal it was Kulikov that was puck watching.
What you saw was Larsson half the time having to cover for Kulikov.
Isn't Larssons job to cover the right side AND the left.
Agree on Kulikov, he made a number of Dainty Lady passes that resulted in the Jets gaining possession and ultimately scoring. Can't have that especially in the playoffs.
No- just look at the play.. Kulikov was playing the guy & puck ... on the Left side Larsson on the right.
The player cut to Larsons side... so Kuli held the Left side. trusting Larsson would take the man.. very basic for Larsson to just slow down the man... not even worry about the puck..
@@Feedback4Utoday No look at the play again. Larsson was covering right side Poolman had the puck, Drop passes off to Wheeler who goes right Larsson Stays covering wheeler on the right side while Poolman curls left. And skates by Kulikov who is literally still staring at the puck on wheelers stick. Watching it on Poolmans, watching it on Wheelers. Wheeler shoots Smith has the puck in his chest and decides to drop it and try to play it. Larsson realizes Poolman is uncovered turns around and tries to stick check Poolman as he swipes it in.
Kulikov is still up at the hashmarks watching smith make the save and he stopped moving.
Thanks guy’s, great show really enjoyed it. I’m pretty much onboard with your assessments.
Once again, another excellent podcast from Bruce and David. However, there was one issue in particular that was not directly addressed and was crucial in deciding the outcome of the series between the Oilers and the Jets. So, simply stated, the Oilers were outcoached by the Jets. And to be more specific, Dave Tippet and his assistant coaches were unable to properly find a way to launch an effective counter-attack to the Jet's offensive and defensive strategies. In addition, if anything could be learned from this series, GM Ken Holland is going to have to find a way to obtain some solid secondary scoring which in turn would divert some of the attention by opposing teams to Edmonton's super-stars such as Leon Draisaitl and Connor McDavid.
I would buy out Koskinen before I bought out Neal. Sure, Neal isn't worth the money anymore, but even with 4th line minutes and injuries/illnesses this year he projected to be a 15 goal scorer. I wouldn't want to waste 2M for 4 years again, I'd wait one more year.
Neals first year he scored 19 goals then got injured he probably could have got 30 that year. This year he struggled with covid and was looking better towards the end of the season. His contract is ugly but he’s a good character guy and a vet good leader that dosnt ware any C or A. I’d buy out MK look Smith is Edmonton’s starter for one more year he’s already coming back maybe just find a kid in free agency or play Stalock and Skinner behind Smith and that why Skinner can get more NHL experience. MK is not a bad goalie but he’s no starter and his contract also not good not his fault that’s on PC but maybe another team will boosts his career again like we are seeing with Talbot but this is Edmonton’s best option I’d keep Neal over MK
@@ryans413 Where do you get that Neal's a good character guy. I have heard he is a jerk, and nobody likes him!
Neal ONLY produces when he has good linemates. MOST DO.
19 of his 24 goals as an oiler came in Oct/Nov/Dec 2019 when he was on the PP1 with McDavid and Draisaitl.
The second he was taken off that unit his production disappeared.
The points that you get from Neal could come out of Chiasson (or any other competent player) for a fraction of the price.
There’s a reason why he has been a playoff healthy scratch for back to back teams.
@@creepyrobsta5509 as per Eric Francis - Treliving was going to buy out Neal if he couldn’t trade him because he didn’t want him back in his dressing room.
Character issues galore.
@@thejollyrancher6713 that was last year. I agree with you that his production went down when he was taken off their line, but at least he produced while he was on their line. The Oilers have had a lot of players who couldn't.
Even playing on the 4th line this year, he produced at a pace that would equal almost 15 goals and 30 pts over an 82 game season. That's pretty good for a 4th liner. The Oilers are desperate for secondary scoring and everyone wants to get rid of the guys who have an ounce of scoring touch.
Normally I'd say get his overpaid ass outta here, but I'd hate to pay him $2mil a year for FOUR MORE years with a flat cap. Especially since they just got out of all these buyouts.
The Oilers already have money this year to make moves. Unless they need even more, I'd wait a year. They'll need his cap space next year when they resign Nurse.
But, that's just my thoughts. I wouldn't be all that disappointed if he was bought out.
Koshkinen seems to let in those goals at the beginning of the game that just change the momentum of the team.
excellent topic again .. these recaps are really helpful as it is so hard to understand how good the team is or isn't.. what they should or shouldn't be doing. NHL at this level seems to be highly a game of errors - who makes an error.. and Oilers seem to need to put more weight on errors in picking players, time, teaching etc .. as there are quite a few guys that 'break-down'... Bear, Larsson, Jones... are high on the list. Lets hope they can put some focus on it & cut down clear errors - could help the Wins?
Holland addressed scoring right at the beginning of the press conference. Someone asked is getting players to help spread out scoring was his number one priority in the off season and he said he felt it was.
When Talbot left Edmonton he was giving up one or two ridiculously soft goals per game. Then he was a bust in his next few teams before he finally realized he needed to listen to his goalie coaches or he was not going to stay in the NHL. Minnesota was either do or die as far as his NHL career was concerned. I think he needed to go through that trial by fire to become the keeper he is today. It wasn’t a mistake to trade him when Edmonton did. He wasn’t going to be any good for the Oilers or himself if he had stayed.
Can’t really judge Holland just yet his two years been doomed by covid now he has some cap space from the PC mess so now we can start judging how good he is. I do agree with Bruce it’s not Detroit anymore this is the oilers this is Edmonton Kenny boy gotta get over Detroit
What exactly in God's green earth impresses the ""BOTH"" of you gentleman about Bear??? PLEASE take a closer look....The season starts with the oilers playing below 500 in the first ten plus games. Then bear gets injured...oilers then ""GEL"" together...go on a 13-2 TEAR up, best record in the nhl in that period of time. ""Watch Those Games"" every goal..every penalty kill..power play,every post game,even the couple post game losses were POSITIVE....That was the BEST hockey the edmonton oilers have looked in many many years, in such a short time the chemistry was there,every single oiler truelly looked happy...as you see i could go on forever about that short TURNAROUND moment. Bear comes back...couple games in, Mike Smith explodes on bear...stop..eeeffffing...screening..meeeee......WITHOUT BEAR....WERE STILL PLAYING HOCKEY RIGHT NOW...END OF STORY.
As a fan and someone who played hockey for 40 yrs i am all for giving the boot to Tippet. Everything Bruce said and more so Davids comments on the coach are my same thoughts. Not to mention last years dismantling of the Dynamite line.
The biggest offseason acquisition is Kleffbom. Nurse/Behr Klefbom/Larson Coecoe/Bouchard looks way better then all the lefts moving up a spot, huge huge difference!
Bear reminds of the old Nurse, bad puck decisions in the D zone. However playoffs is a different beast, made very poor plays...But he will eventually be a GREAT D man in the future...just not right now.
There a big difference between the 2 tho. Nurse is a physical speciman that can skate like the wind and Bear is small and slow
I don’t see Bear ever being as good as Nurse. I don’t understand all the hype Bear gets. He makes so many 5 alarm mistakes.
@@garycroxton5843 With certain fans Ethan Bear can do no wrong. The guy lead the Oilers in turnovers the last 2 seasons and we all know how he played in the last 2 playoffs
They must protect Halloway and Bouchard.
That was really good guys, thank you. 👍❤️
I listened to Ken’s press conference twice. I don’t have a lot of confidence in him as GM right now. There was a lot of rambling and telling Oilers fans they need to be patient. I’m sorry but that line is a year too old now. It is now time to get McDavid real actual support in all the places needed. Not to mention the cups Ken won in Detroit were bought. Was that not during a time when you could just spend what you want and sign whoever you want if the owner had the money? No salary cap era. That general manager job was very different than the job he has in today’s NHL. He really needs to stop talking about winning in Detroit and figure out how to help Connor and Leon win now.
Edit.....Ken won one cup after the salary cap was implemented in the NHL.
Pistol Pete tried to do what you want Ken Holland to do. IT DOESNT WORK THAT WAY. When will you clowns begging to understand that you don’t build a winning team in one or 2 off seasons.
@@dwaynesbgb , Let’s go back to “Oil Change” ...remember that?? Never mind one or two seasons. Ya Ken just got to the Oilers. That doesn’t erase the last 10 years of this. Ken doesn’t have another 10 years to do another “Oil Change”. I get the building part, but this is year 6 of Connors contract? All I’m saying is that this really can’t happen next year like this. You have to be able to get out of the first round.....with Connor McDavid. Once in an 8 year contract would be very bad as an organization.
“Ken tried “.....try like the Leafs GM.
@@dwaynesbgb Tell that to the Avalanche!
100% I don't understand why so many people are giving Holland a free pass. When he was asked if he was thinking of doing any creative moves like other teams did at the trade deadline his answer was simply "no". That about sums up Holland right now as an old gm who has no creative way to fix this mess. Kulikov, Turris, Athansiou, Neal, Green, (and trying to get O.E.L.) none of these moves really worked out, so why should I trust the GM at this point? Not to mention going forward with a 38 year old Smith, who luckily didn't make Holland and Tippett look as bad as they should have looked.The fact that McDavid, Draisaitl, and Nurse play such an exorbitant amount of ice time is because the GM and Coach have no faith in anyone else. The team has far too many plugs, and if you disagree with that then please look at their secondary scoring. Great teams have four lines, and we can't even build two? If you can't see the flaws in your team then you are only setting yourself up for disappointment!
@@creepyrobsta5509 , I agree with you fully but I think Mike Smith played well for his contract and I think he’s got another year in the tank.
Are you guys ever going to try and get some players as guests or what? They can zoom too eh
If they pay Mike Smith even a penny more than $2 mil its a waste. His value (even based on this year) is extremely limited! 6 straight OT losses guys! And last I checked he was the guy in goal for the 4-1 meltdown. I know in Edmonton every goal that goes in is somehow miraculously not on the goaltender, but sometimes they are. Stop blaming defensemen all the time and find me a goalie who can steal a game when needed!
I'm not going to lie, I was SOOO excited about how well our offseason could go, (all the talent in the pipeline, opening up a lot of cap, shedding some bad contracts hopefully) then I heard Holland speak. I actually lost a lot of faith that we're really going to improve at all in the off season.
I REALLY hope I'm wrong.
Love the show boys! Keep it up. Not to add to your already busy schedules, but do you know if there is a plan to offer the podcast in audio form only? There are times I'd love to take you guys out on a walk, or even pop an ear bud in and listen at work.
He got payed 2 million first year took a pay cut this year came back with 1 million found that interesting
They need Smith as a 5th D. Otherwise we are incapable of getting the puck out of our zone.
34 minutes point. How can you NOT notice how many bad passes Bear makes. Not just the OT poor pass, but regularly. He also losses a lot of battles down low. He cannot make an outlet pass to save his soul. He also makes bad decisions and NEVER carries it out of the zone. It is a mystery to me why he is rated so highly
Oilers should maybe try to sign Linus Ullmark. Would love to see that.
Nurse, Bear, Larsson, Klefbom. That’ll be a fairly decent top four on blue line.
Bear as a top 4 give me a break and they had that top 4 before and they lost to Chicago in the play ins with it.
@@drogontargaryen3428 can tell what you've got for brains
@Drogon Targaryen Oilers got burned by playing against nearly 2 thousand playoff games experience last summer.
Last week? Jets have had their fair share of disappointment in recent years. Taken their lumps one might say.
Wait. Are you the type to just give up after the first try??
@@ianjackson3346 Speak English dummy
@@redddawggg So what your saying is an excuse for why they lost 2 years in a row in the 1st round because I dont know what your trying to get at
Kris Russell is not an offensive defensemen.He brings value that no other D brings.You needs guts to block shot and that’s what his identity is which he does on a daily basis.
Who is Philip Broburry?? Think you mean Broburg
I agree about Holland. He's really great at doing a lot of talking but not saying much.
Maybe Laine can solve that winger problem
I actually can see him signing here on a short term deal in hopes that he has a bounce back season similar to Barrie.
Hmmmmm I'm not sure about Laine...he is totally a one dimensional player...not very well rounded
Tippett lost this series for us with his McDrai decision.
I think Bear didn't play with enough focus and poise. I still love him though and the racism towards him is shameful.
In the playoffs that is.
Put THE REAL DEAL James Neal on defence.
He might score 60 next year.
Given Oilers secured a playoff spot LONG ago... & locked up 2nd long ago.. 9 pts ahead of WPG... was it not obvious that it was more important to develop Bouchard... give him more NHL level playing time.. than max Barrie stats so he could demand more money than EDM could afford? Barrie over & over to no benefit? Now Bouchard has to use a lot of '21/22 to learn.
Seems Barrie will be too expensive... for the amt of errors and that was known long ago... W due respect, don't understand your loyal/excess support of Bear & Jones - TONS of mistakes/turnovers & just 2 goals, 6 assists.. -that is why coach has to play Nurse so much... not so sure team can expect Bear/Jones to be superior/win tough battles vs fill time?
Bouchard should have played all season
Bear will always be a cheaper contract let Barrie go. He's good but not for money and term.
Would you call Peter Forsburg, " Peter Forsberry lmao. If so get out of my stinkn house
Nah, you get out of my house
@@dwaynesbgb No! It's my house bud. 🏠
That is how Swedes pronounce it.
@@staystong8692 Who is in your house and why does it stink?
So tired of you getting down on Ethan Bear. Makes me wonder about your hockey knowledge
Oh why don't you enlighten us with all your vast hockey knowledge then bud? David Staples is one of the smarter guys out there
@@drogontargaryen3428 Bear deserves alot of the hockey criticism he gets but the other bs he gets is just cruel.
@@robertchristie5672 Im against racism, it's uncalled for but for me I only judge players for their on ice play only I don't care what their ethnic background is. Bear has been brutal all year that turnover in game 4 was just a microcosm of how his season went
@@drogontargaryen3428 I 100% agree with you. Bear has been aweful this year along with Jones. Hopefully they get replaced in the summer because we can't have another season with those 2 on defence. too bad because I was hoping Bear would work out on the right side.
@@robertchristie5672 If we wanna be a successful team we cant have neither of them on the roster next year. This team is in win now mode cant have players that keep screwing up
Sports are scripted theatre. Don't give these actors any of your time or emotions. Get woke go broker NHL