Best Principal Trumpet Player of all time without a doubt...I heard Herseth and Phil play numerous times live and they are both legendary. I played next to Phil many times. Phil took what Herseth did to the next level with better pitch and a sound that was huge AND beautiful. Phil Smith's dynamic box was enormous. Go check out Ring without Words album with Mehta with NY Phil and you will hear how incredibly big he could play with an amazing sound...just phenomenal...
It's interesting to hear how different top notch trumpeters interpret the quarter note tripplet figure. In this recording Phil Smith plays it quite quickly (almost rushed) while Bud Herseth keeps to the meter. It's all great, but the differences are there.
Still one of my all time favorites of the Mahler 5 opening....with over 21 CDs and SACDs of this piece, the old Teldec CD with Mehta/NYPO and Phil Smith is tops!!!
@saltriverbrass I think they're both interpretive in different ways; smith's are rushed but given extremely regular equal duration, whereas I've seen videos where Herseth accelerates them during the climb so the first one feels more legato and is given more space. Plus both of them like to play with flattening some of the notes it would seem.
this was written when they typically used trumpets in the key of A, which low F natural was the lowest note you could play on it. So now they don't play it because pedal tones aren't really played in classical music anymore
What a standard! His tone is outstanding, his tonguing is clean and his slurs are impeccable. My question is, "If the piece is written in Bb and it's more difficult to play on a C trumpet, then why not play it on a Bb?"
That is a valid question. Certainly there is a nostalgia among all trumpet players towards Bb and the 'New York School' certainly would encourage that, including Phil Smith. At a certain point though the C trumpet provides an edge and brightness in this specific high range, and C# minor (4 sharps) is still mentally easier than Eb minor (5 flats). The last reason would be that with low C# you have tuning slides to control pitch since all three valves are pressed, with Eb you would only have a tuning slide to use on the third valve. There is a lot to it.
Excellent! I would have thought the tuning of the 1st phrase would be tricky on a C trumpet, but clearly not a problem for Mr Smith. I've got the sheet music for this and I always puzzled about the pedal note at the end - does anyone ever play it?
Hey, question: Do you have a link where I can hear the F whole note after the final 12 beat low Bflat in this? What's the deal with that last whole note? Does anyone actually play it? I mean how would a guy play an accented ff diminuendo on a figgin fake/pedal low F anyways? I can do the rest (at least I could learn to do the rest). Little help/advice? ~5000hrs practice/playing jazz trumpet, thinking about learning a bit of legit stuff PS - this sounds good.
hoffthehook I'm an idiot, I just realized that low F is meant to be played 1,2,3 with 3rd slide out! Duh. I must have been playing on one of my horns with either a sticky 3rd slide or a vintage fixed 3rd slide... never was a big fan of using the 1st/3rd slides. It just goes to show how long it's been since I tried reading music, and how little I ever did in the first place (since this is the first F under the staff I've ever tried to play from a score. lol. BTW I don't own a C horn. I've been thinking of getting an old king liberty for awhile since it is Bb/C but I just bought a Conn 20a Flugel like the one Charles Tolliver played in the 60/70s so that should feed the new horn beast for another year. I'll be sure to work on Carmen as well. Carmen was my jam back in the day.
No, this note is played by the horns. My teacher says no one ever plays that note when playing the excerpt. All the orchestral players play it on a C trumpet, which has less lower range.
I've played that lower F in different pieces on my C horn. It's exactly as you said. Just 1-2-3 and kick out the 3rd valve slide. Just use your ear for centering it. That method works with Bb horns as well.
I think the tempo is not evenly. The triols are too fast. Required is: "In gemessenem Schritt. Streng. Wie ein Kondukt". I think most players pay too little attention to this.
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Best Principal Trumpet Player of all time without a doubt...I heard Herseth and Phil play numerous times live and they are both legendary. I played next to Phil many times. Phil took what Herseth did to the next level with better pitch and a sound that was huge AND beautiful. Phil Smith's dynamic box was enormous. Go check out Ring without Words album with Mehta with NY Phil and you will hear how incredibly big he could play with an amazing sound...just phenomenal...
I saw Maestro Smith play Mahler 5 just last night...he sure knows how to make us say "wow" and mean it... bravo!
It's interesting to hear how different top notch trumpeters interpret the quarter note tripplet figure. In this recording Phil Smith plays it quite quickly (almost rushed) while Bud Herseth keeps to the meter. It's all great, but the differences are there.
Mahler wants it rushed as you say. Look at the German below that passage
Still one of my all time favorites of the Mahler 5 opening....with over 21 CDs and SACDs of this piece, the old Teldec CD with Mehta/NYPO and Phil Smith is tops!!!
Tremendous tone and articulation quality. Some players would be more explosive; Smith is more majestic.
@TheCatholicBoat I saw that concerto too! It was awesome.
Thanks for posting.
Yes
As a violinist, I never thought a trumpet can sound so beautiful......
As a trumpeter, I absolutely agree
@saltriverbrass I think they're both interpretive in different ways; smith's are rushed but given extremely regular equal duration, whereas I've seen videos where Herseth accelerates them during the climb so the first one feels more legato and is given more space. Plus both of them like to play with flattening some of the notes it would seem.
phil smith is about as good as it gets
Perfect!
He's retiring, oh no!!!!!! (not to mention Dicterow and two other violinists...). What a legend.
Chris Vazan And now a conductor retiring. Lots of problems in the near future for the NY Phil. Such a shame since it is my current favorite.
Chris Vazan And now a conductor retiring. Lots of problems in the near future for the NY Phil. Such a shame since it is my current favorite.
And the last note?
Does it matter?
@@MrBilioner lmao
this was written when they typically used trumpets in the key of A, which low F natural was the lowest note you could play on it. So now they don't play it because pedal tones aren't really played in classical music anymore
What a standard! His tone is outstanding, his tonguing is clean and his slurs are impeccable. My question is, "If the piece is written in Bb and it's more difficult to play on a C trumpet, then why not play it on a Bb?"
That is a valid question. Certainly there is a nostalgia among all trumpet players towards Bb and the 'New York School' certainly would encourage that, including Phil Smith. At a certain point though the C trumpet provides an edge and brightness in this specific high range, and C# minor (4 sharps) is still mentally easier than Eb minor (5 flats). The last reason would be that with low C# you have tuning slides to control pitch since all three valves are pressed, with Eb you would only have a tuning slide to use on the third valve. There is a lot to it.
+hoffthehook I just play C trumpet because it's fun xD
c trumpet is brighter
Wow
Excellent! I would have thought the tuning of the 1st phrase would be tricky on a C trumpet, but clearly not a problem for Mr Smith. I've got the sheet music for this and I always puzzled about the pedal note at the end - does anyone ever play it?
Very rarely they will have the 4th trumpet play it on a Bb trumpet 3rd slide all the way out
@saltriverbrass er sorry, I was referring to the eighth note triplet figures, my mistake :P
@TeamMIAdrenaline he plays a stock Bach 229 C trumpet.
@stealthsniper002 check out imslp.org for public domain parts!
my favorite interpretation, I think. less lyrical and more... MAHLER
No literally a printable one of course, which I found the whole book in a PDF file, so never mind.
Hey, question:
Do you have a link where I can hear the F whole note after the final 12 beat low Bflat in this? What's the deal with that last whole note? Does anyone actually play it? I mean how would a guy play an accented ff diminuendo on a figgin fake/pedal low F anyways? I can do the rest (at least I could learn to do the rest). Little help/advice?
~5000hrs practice/playing jazz trumpet, thinking about learning a bit of legit stuff
PS - this sounds good.
dachanist Pedal tones for improving low range, you would probably want to use Bb instead of C. Carmen Bizet is the best excerpt for low range.
hoffthehook
I'm an idiot, I just realized that low F is meant to be played 1,2,3 with 3rd slide out! Duh. I must have been playing on one of my horns with either a sticky 3rd slide or a vintage fixed 3rd slide... never was a big fan of using the 1st/3rd slides. It just goes to show how long it's been since I tried reading music, and how little I ever did in the first place (since this is the first F under the staff I've ever tried to play from a score. lol. BTW I don't own a C horn. I've been thinking of getting an old king liberty for awhile since it is Bb/C but I just bought a Conn 20a Flugel like the one Charles Tolliver played in the 60/70s so that should feed the new horn beast for another year. I'll be sure to work on Carmen as well. Carmen was my jam back in the day.
No, this note is played by the horns. My teacher says no one ever plays that note when playing the excerpt.
All the orchestral players play it on a C trumpet, which has less lower range.
I've played that lower F in different pieces on my C horn. It's exactly as you said. Just 1-2-3 and kick out the 3rd valve slide. Just use your ear for centering it. That method works with Bb horns as well.
I found a PDF file of the entire book/music so thanks anyways.
i like this style a lot better than bud herseth's
Can someone point out to me where I can get the sheet music please?
do you have a recording of Bilger's?
What is the tempo to the solo?
62 or 63, I think.
I think the tempo is not evenly. The triols are too fast. Required is: "In gemessenem Schritt. Streng. Wie ein Kondukt". I think most players pay too little attention to this.
@TeamMIAdrenaline more than that
You haven't seen the half of it.
Right in front of you
@petzlmrz Bilger's version is better, I agree.
Seems rhythmically slack to me.