Why Does an Edit Feel Right? (According to Science)
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- Опубликовано: 14 май 2024
- In this Science of Editing episode we discuss 3 cognitive concepts that go beyond continuity.
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Do you want to learn how to start any edit like feature film and documentary editors do it? Please visit: www.secreteditinghacks.com
Check out the TGE Patreon Membership Rewards including Karen's academic paper on this topic: / worksheet-paper-31175525
The paper is free for patrons. Everyone else can purchase it here for $22: Editing and Cognition Beyond Continuity
by Karen Pearlman
in Projections: Journal of Movies and Mind
www.berghahnjournals.com/view...
"The Science of Editing" series is by @ThisGuyEdits and Dr. Karen Pearlman, based on her book "Cutting Rhythms - Intuitive Film Editing": amzn.to/2cqkz5J
Talks:
Karen’s Delivery of conference Paper in Zurich:
blog.zhdk.ch/zdok/2018/rhythm...
Note: the discussion of the materials in SoE5 starts at about 25 minutes & 30 seconds
Tim J. Smith - presenting his work at ZDOK in Zurich blog.zhdk.ch/zdok/2018/explor...
Noe: At 2 minutes and 30 seconds he shows the same Bladerunner clip as we are using and explains his theories about it
At 27 mins 30 secs and at 33 mins 30 seconds he shows a heat map of where gazes are while watching a film
Additional Research:
Tim J Smith
An Attentional Theory of Continuity Editing
www.researchgate.net/publicat...
Vittorio Gallese article on 'Embodied Simulation'
static1.1.sqspcdn.com/static/f...
Maarten Coëgnarts, Miklós Kiss, Peter Kravanja, and Steven Willemsen 'Seeing yourself in thePast'
www.kravanja.eu/pages/CKKW2016...
----------------------------
Dr. Karen Pearlman is a lecturer in screen production at Macquarie University and the author of 'Cutting Rhythms, Intuitive Film Editing' (Focal Press/Taylor & Francis, 2015). Her film 'Woman with an Editing Bench' won the national ATOM award for Best Short Fiction and the Australian Screen Editors Guild award for Best Editing in a short film.
THIS GUY EDITS (TGE) is a youtube channel by film editor Sven Pape, an A.C.E. award nominee, whose credits include work for directors James Cameron, Joseph Gordon-Levitt and James Franco.
-----------------------------------
The Science of Editing, Part 1: Skill or Instinct? - • The Science Behind Fil...
The Science of Editing, Part 2: 5 Things Editors Literally Do - • 5 Things Film Editors ...
The Science of Editing, Part 3: Why Action Movies Are Spectacular... And Boring - • Why Action Movies Are ...
The Science of Editing, Part 4: Top 5 Most Common Problems with Student Films - • Top 5 Most Common Prob...
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I feel so lucky to be part of this generation, we get precious things for free
agreed! :D
Very true.
I think this continuously.
Lucky and cursed? It seems a 2 sided coin. Computers democratise and give us power, but also give it to everyone else, so it's harder to make a living. We get professional tools, but work becomes de-professionalised. You can be anywhere to do anything, so you're always at home -- except the rare times you're in the Himalayas. The telephone lets you keep in touch a great distances, so you move great distances - and never phone. Your mobile phone will ring on top of the world, but it will be a marketing scam. Answering - how could you not - will cost £2. The internet means a client is never looking over your shoulder while you edit -- I don't see a down side to this :-)
That means we must do even more extraordinary things!
I'll come back to this video when I get smarter.
@Foul Productions Exactly what I was going to say before reading your comment. When you try to explain why the "feeling" works, it begins to get complicated. Just focus on what feels right and watch your edit over and over 100 times and you will eventually begin to hone in on what and where to cut, trip, splice, etc.
me same
Dude, I thought I'm the only one on that boat thanks for your comment! I didn't drown alone :D
Nah, there's a lot of highbrow language in this video making it inaccessible. The why's of editing aren't complicated and I don't think they should be difficult to explain. It also would have helped to show multiple examples of what they mean.
@@reanetsemoleleki8219 Well said. I came to here to learn something. Not to be told "you know to little to understand this".
This is a concept I've never really considered: in a sense you have to edit/construct a film to appeal to the viewer's body as well as their mind. cool video.
That is if you think about the two as a dichotomy. I would like to think though that the body is, to many extent, an 'embodiment' and extension of the mind. The memory of a movement is stored in the mind and the body at the same time: we know a movement intrinsically with both. It is fascinating. Same way that is fascinating to think where an emotion 'lives' and is it felt within the body. On a slightly different note is interesting to note that some says that a trauma can get 'stored' in your body and linked to a certain emotion. For example, if you fell from a horse and broke a leg, the feeling you felt in that moment gets 'locked' with the physical trauma. So it can happen that a similar emotional response but to a different event could trigger sensations of physical pain or discomfort in the same area.
Don't overdo it hombre. They are explaining in a very scientific way how edit works. But the editors when they edit they just trust their guts and their feelings. They are never thinking of: I must take the movement the time and the space into consideration.
Otherwise they'd all get bonkers. This Time Space Movement happens in our brains in a matter of miliseconds and then our feeling tells us if it is right or not. Never overthink it.
The editors are using their judgement, which comes from experience. Their gut gives them a good result because they've spent a lot of time editing film before this. I agree with you that they're not overthinking it in the moment, but they had to put in a lot of earlier thought over the years to get to the point where they can do that.
Excellent summary.
Blade Runner is one of my favorite films and I have never noticed that cut with the owl's movement matching Deckard's. Amazing study. Absolutely beautiful. I've never thought about the editing of that film, but obviously it was effective since it is among my favorites. Love these videos Sven!
Remembering there are FIVE versions of Blade Runner... which ‘answers’ (or at least speaks to the question, “Who is in control of editing? The director or the editor.” The answer here might be, BOTH or NEITHER. I typically prefer the original cut: because first impressions last and are the standard by which the following versions are measured.
The owl is looking out of the large window at the transporter flying towards and subsequently into the building - nothing to do with Deckard or his head.
Jeese... talk about fake intellectuals seeing what they want to see!
bruh that blade runner thing got me feeling inadequate but inspired
it just goes to show what real cinema editing is. It's not about this happens and then this happens and then this happens. Anyone can do that.
@@louisuniverse it isnt just editing though either, the whole point of that edit is to foreshadow. Edit's can foreshadow, juxtaposition, etc, but I completely agree with you, this real cinema editing is something you could say movies lack nowadays, as our short attention spans have become even shorter lol.
@@vlc-cosplayer I think you're basically on the money. A lot of times the human brain does a fine job of sticking subtext is anything we make anyway. (Though the occasional intelligent editing trick is extremely fascinating to me :) )
I wonder if you realize what you just did for editors everywhere.
free film school for thousands of editors lol.
Josh Williams yep
Knownledge shouldn't be a privilege. Just think about it, if people before the 20th century had internet: more smart people could have achieved awesome stuff. In the last 20 years, there were more technological breakthroughs than in the last 2000 years.
After watching this I feel like a better editor, but I don't know what I learned haha
I've learned that less is more. No need to put every god damn details to get your audience to understand what's going on. This might be why i hate vlog/vloggers so much. They all put way too much b-roll of unnecessary things because they think it add to the story while in fact it takes away from it.
@@DNdavidsonsnation thank you for this comment, I shall save this and keep that in mind when I will be editing my stuff. Cheers
@@DNdavidsonsnation This is incredibly case-dependent. Some stories require detail, some don’t.
Still one of the most underrated fillmaking channels around. Incredibly useful and in depth look into making better films
This video makes me proud to be an editor. I'm just a RUclipsr right now, but I'd very much LOVE to edit movies. My brain works like this. I love the science/art of editing.
This video was really nicely edited, showing the concepts of editing in a subtle and intuitive way while explaining it. Fantastic!
Credit goes to Krishna Sanchez who cut this episode, he's got great instincts
This goes way deeper than just edits...woven into the fabric of reality is a composition of ebbs and flows... the dream that we all exist in... that we are all part of... we are all connected in this seemingly simple "tension" and "release" and it's the story that will be told at the end and then beginning of time. Love...
Such a good channel. Keep up the good work!
I am more motivated to continue to achieve my true passion in filmmaking. Thank you for inspiring us man!
I have always had the ability to take a bunch of other peoples art (music, drawings, videos, graphics, 3d assets, Legos, pictures etc...) And piece them together in a way that others enjoy ironically I only recently found video editing as a viable business choice but it's thanks to channels like this that I truly appreciate the art of editing.
I'm a first year film student and really have fallen in love with editing. This vid is really awesome, thank you for the knowledge and insight.
Really loved this episode Sven! Definitely going to need to give it another couple watches as you guys went into quite a bit there😅 but I love the direction this video takes. In terms of being less technical and more theoretical. The empathy and understanding of when and where to cut is often a difficult thing to explain to people when they ask me about it. This does so very nicely!
thank you for sharing/creating this. through your videos I was able to focus more on editing for story and emotion and feel than all the technical continuity stuff, It has really pushed me forward in my edits. thanks again.
i hate when people say "objectively better" almost like they are saying that it's mathmatically better movie but, this shows it in a much better way, in my opinion. through psychology. they are so many people that use the words "perfect" or "objective" so much that they completely lose their meaning. great job!
This is the kind of video that keeps me coming back to this channel. Wonderful.
Massive thanks for posting this. I did two years of cinema at uni ages ago, and back then I would think a lot about this kind of stuff. Then I got into print journalism and I kind of forgot about all of this. Now I am doing marketing for a UK arts organisation and doing a lot of video for them, and honestly seeing your video just now has left me very inspired and excited about being a better story-teller through video.
Amazing video, I will keep these in mind when working on stuff! Also, the way you can edit films and videos remind me of the use of panels in comics. The way you use their sizes, placement, and distances from each other help to appeal the reader's way of taking the story in.
Amazing video. I really appreciate all the effort you put into this. Keep it going! Greetings from Ecuador.
Excellent insight - exactly the kind of content I search for when exploring the deeper understanding of structure. Where was this when I was studying architecture!
"it's poetry"
thru years of experience in editing, i kinda figured out myself how to feed the eyes of the audience and navigate them thru the session. Its all however depends on what i feel right at that time of editing.
you in the other hand put them in words and explain things that I've been practising without knowing what it is. this encounter with your channel really opened my eyes and kinda explained things that i dont understand why
thanks and i did subscribed for more content from you
Thank you for sharing - I think rhythm is really important in editing still learning more what it looks like
4:38 was like, Holy shit! This is pure magic, a perfect way to subconsciously tell a story. You guys, right there made my Jaw drop. I know realize the vast ocean of possibilities this art form has!
I love Blade Runner and never got that owl as a reference. I felt the same.
However, it's about director's work in the first place not editor's.
What a brilliant channel - thank you
Your videos are beautifully put together and are fascinating. They are informative bordering on the revelatory.
Great explanation of editing to engage and evoke emotions
this is a really good one, and the bar is already high.. thanks for all the knowledge
Incredibly helpful! Thank you
Love your channel man!
brillant. Deconstruction such small subtle details, especially in Blade Runner, which I've seen roughly 15 times already, is amazing. subconsciousness is just amazing :) thank you for that episode!
Amazing video Sven! You looked epic in this visual effect shot ;)
Truly amazing video, thank you
Amazing! I watched Blade Runner over a dozen times and never picked up on that subtlety. This will help me.
Great video! Interesting concept and useful thoughts. Thanks, Sven for doing this awesome content!
This is brilliant!
Thanks for sharing :)
This video is amazing. Thank you for making such good content.
Sound must play a part in this as well. I noticed that when he was speaking over the clip from There Will Be Blood, I was almost never looking where the cluster of circles appeared. They would draw my eye, but my inclination was constantly to look elsewhere.
thank you so much for this amazing source
This opened my mind and is making me conscious of what I am watching and why certain stories feel right.
what ab absolute beautiful video. thank you so much
Wow, great inspiring video that encourages me in editing my documentary, thank you.
I expected this video to be informative. But i didn't expect it to be so inspiring. Great job!
I am so happy that someone recommended me to your channel on Reddit. As a beginner videographer (one day hoping to level up to cinematography) all of this is extremely useful information. I am more than happy to contribute on patreon (I watch a range of videos but you are the first Il sub to). A $3, $5 or even $10 a month is nothing for the education that we receive from this. Lengthy and informative, although the longer the better :D
Thanks!
To answer your question: what is the most important part of editing? The pacing of the cuts. Allowing the eye time to linger and 'process' what we're looking at on screen. (Or maybe making a deliberate choice to NOT allow the eye that time to process)
Fantastic! thank you for this!
Great examples of the thinking behind "the poetry" of scene construction in Mamet's "On Directing Film."
this is one of the best film video essays ive seen
Bless this channel.
I love the way they explain the concept
thank you for this great video ! i want to say that me for me, editing is postly time. longer we let the frame until the perfect moment, stronger the emotion will be
Thnx a LOT! And HAPPY NEW YEAR!
This is deep! Thanks for sharing.
Wow! FANTASTIC video. I worked for a company that did eye-tracking studies and heat maps, so I recognized that part of the video. Wish I could say more about it 'cause it's fascinating, but I'm pretty sure I'm still under NDA. In any case, this video is a like a mini-master class. Bravo.
Beautiful. Thank you!
Brilliant information, thanks!
This is really educational. An aspiring filmmaker could learn a thing or two from this. Thank you.
You made me fall in love with learning back again. I'm learning movie editing, I don't know if would I ever edit a damn movie but I'm f*ind learning it.
Love it. Thanks for sharing.
Through your videos, I always find new choices on how to edit a scene and tell the story in a better, more moving way. Almost immediately, I try to think of how I can apply these new ideas to the story I'm developing at the moment. Currently, I am working on a short sci-fi film, struggling with how to bring humanity to the story while keeping it engaging. Writing is tough. Editing is where the magic manifests.
can i read your script when it's done?
I've learnt so much from this video than i thought possible. Hopefully ill be able to implement the styles to my RUclips channel videos
Inspirational! Thank you
Absolutely Brilliant!!
Holy cow this is SO FREAKIN GOOD.
this talk is absolutely beautiful.
this is amazing!!
Brilliant video! Thanks
Thanks for this video. I found it very enlightening.
Man this is so inspiring!
The editing on this video is very well done 👍 😉
Oh man I just wanted to learn how to cut right lil quick, now I'm exploring the world of editing
May blessings shine upon you, just as you have blessed others. Have a wonderful Christmas!
This video inspires me. Thank you.
Very inspiring - thank you.
You guys opens my mind ❤️❤️❤️
amazing work.
What an awesome video Sven...it's a huge gift. I hope someday can afford your classes 👊😋
That’s good you talked about continuity. I get anxious if there is not enough information. But a professor told me that a persons mind will fill in the gaps and make out what could happen between then.
A short film I filmed, I literally had a person get up, brush his teeth, get ready, Walked out the stairs then the door, then sidewalk.
I cut it to just him waking up. Then walking and it really worked out and was not a drag.
Something I still work on today is character development. I seen some good movies develop those. I am assuming the script supports them, but an editor really excutes it well.
I think you missed the important movement in the shot of Ingrid Bergman. The important factor is not her movement forward (and stepping out of focus) but rather here eyes moving to the keys. The reason the editor didn't cut before she went out of focus, was that he was waiting for her eyes to lock onto the keys.
This was great!
Something that I have been working on recently is gaining an embodied understanding of the script. Once I feel like I understand the script not just in my head but in my body I tried to allow my gut feelings to help me shape the edit.
Such good content
!!!!!
Absolutely fantastic.
honestly, this video series is too good for a free site
Tim's video is amazing! I would highly recommend it. I would suggest you use headphones though, because the sound levels are VERY poor and make sure you watch it without distractions as you'll want to hear everything Tim shares. Cheers!
This is actually a core topic of the book, "Zen and The Art of Motorcycle Maintenance," the idea that everyone knows what quality is and yet, nobody can describe it... We "feel" when things are quality, we "feel" when things are right.
that makes sense
Wow. Mind blowing.
Love this video!
So good. I feel like its a never ending learning cycle.
I think the cut in Notorious is much simpler than discussed here... the editor simply waited for the eyes of the actress to shift to the keys. Waiting for those eye moments is essential when editing.
Here before the title and thumbnail change!
I was thinking that aswell 😄
no need to change it. it's got incredible CTR :)
lol
I have to add that all of the information in this video is STRICTLY at the mercy of Cinematography, Direction, staging and blocking. If the footage isn't flowing it makes it harder in varying degrees for the Editor to 'make it flow' in a way that's been discussed here - hence the necessity for re-shoots in certain instances. This is also why the 1 page of script = 1 minute of runtime rule is complete nonsense; a sentence in a script may be interpreted by the Director and Cinematographer as a two-minute long shot, and the Editor may equally use the footage at their disposal to lengthen or shorten shots based on the 'flow' described in this video. Love this channel!
I got that book.💯, (Bergman) also the focus problem brings to your mind focusing which is really is doing not moving.
I could listen to her talk for days.
Fantastic!
Every editor should see this.
Funny that I just knew the owl cut was bad.
and then...
Next level content @thisguyedits